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Welcome into the Winklerverse. I'm Bart Winkler. It is Wednesday, March 4th. Justin Garcia is here from the Bucks Radio Network. Justin, welcome into the Winklerverse once again.
How are you? Yeah, it is always an honor to be here. I'd imagine y we're on to talk about the Bucks playoff push in the strong play of late. Sure.
Well, the thing about talking about talking bucks right now is. Um It's incredibly time sensitive.
So This is Wednesday. March 4th. And if you are like. Cause some people listen every day, some people like catch up on the week. Um, whatever happened with the Bucks and the Hawks, I mean, choose your own adventure.
If you're in the eight hours before the game, because it's an 8:30 tip for some reason, then good for you. But I say that because I've been doing some Bucks posts and the, the, The thought process has been different in the last week where they won a couple of games. I'll take it back to I took my kid to that heat game. And they won. And then they beat the Cavs barely when they didn't play anybody.
And then you're thinking, okay. And I'm looking at the standings, and I think they were like a game and a half back of the 10 seed, which is already gross to watch in the first place for me. Um, and then okay, they lose to the Knicks, fine. Giannis comes back. I didn't know when he was coming back.
He comes back. And then, or they lost to Toronto in there, right? A little before the heat. That was before. You can't even keep track.
And then they lose to the Celtics. And I see Giannis comes back, and I'm like, all right. And then I see Jalen Brown's out, and I'm like, okay, they're going to lose. I don't know. Glossed over the loss by 23 to the Bulls, where they gave up a 27-inch run.
I'd like to forget that one, too. Yeah, that I conflated with the Raptors.
So, yes, that.
So it's been another 20-point loss.
So it's easy, easy to confuse. It's been weird because, depending on the day you talk Bucks, is depending on what kind of conversation. You're going to have this one. It's do or die tonight. They are now, if I'm.
Right four games back. Of the ten seed. Yeah, I don't know what it is. They're three back in the loss column, and they're in the tricky part of.
So I don't think. It's changed all that much on a nightly basis. Um, I mean, I get it's kind of drifted further and further away from the 10 seed, but they're still kind of stuck in the middle. Because, look, they can still get into the play-in tournament, whether or not that's what fans want. It's what the organization wants.
I want it. I want it. Yeah, and I'm with you because, like, I'm not trying to project that. This team should be viewed as very, very dangerous getting in the postseason. There is a danger if you have a healthy Giannis, but also, I mean, I just don't.
The whole tanking notion we can get into in a second, but Uh Shouldn't you want to win games? And, like, shouldn't you want to? If we've continued to hear, we got these young guys, and we got to see what we have in them. Shouldn't you want to get them meaningful postseason experience? Like Ryan Rollins played last year.
It wasn't to the level that we're seeing now.
So, yeah, let's get that for him and for Kevin Porter Jr. and for. Everyone save your Usman Jang.
So I would like to see that. I also just hate the mindset and the culture that. You can start to build of, like, no, let's just lose and let's play to increase our draft chances, opposed to let's try to win and be competitive. In this sport, because it's not a car that you're turning around when that starts to set in. It's like an oil tanker that it's not an immediate, all right, now we just got rid of this, and now we've changed everything, and that culture's gone, and we're good to go here.
You've seen how long it took to build that culture in the first place from 20. back end of twenty seventeen all the way through However, you want to say it ended a year ago, this year, two years ago, whenever it was, but. That was a process.
So you see how easily it can slip back to the opposite.
So that's why I. I'm with you in that. Look, just play for the play-in tournament. And, you know, the other thing why I don't think. It really changes nightly is I hear all of this just tank from a pretty large portion of the fan base.
And like I mean, number one, it's not going to happen. The organization doesn't want to do it. If Giannis wants to play, he's going to play. And like, I get saying, yeah, let's continue to get him minutes with some of these guys. And if he wants to play, and we think that's going to help us convince him, here is where we can turn it around.
Let's do it. But also, there is no tank. Right. Because you have the tenth worst record in the league right now. Realistically, if you said, We're going to try, we are going to actively try to lose our final 22 games.
And you go, let's say, four and eighteen in that stretch. Where are you actually dropping to in the standings? All of those teams that are in the bottom six, they're pretty firmly behind you, and they're going to lose a lot of those games. Yeah, the math. It's too late.
It's too late to do that.
So you could move down two spots realistically and have the eighth-worst record in the league.
So then you have. Instead of whatever it is, a 4% chance of getting the number one, which you can't even get, pick. It goes up to 7%, something like that. The other thing is. It's just the percentage for that slot.
You have a pick swap that factors in there as well. And I mean, the risk of you tanking is it's going to probably come at the expense of the Pelicans because all those teams that are behind you. Those are teams that have nothing to play for, that have incentive to lose. New Orleans is not in that mix.
So I'm not saying they're going to peel off, you know, like, oh, New Orleans goes 15 and 5 to close the season, but they're probably going to win more games than the rest of that group.
So, what happens if you then start to tank? And you finish with the sixth worst record somehow. But New Orleans then drops down to the ninth worst. And now all of a sudden, you're looking at taking like the 11th pick this summer. The other thing with tanking, um I think there's a disconnect between like Yeah, a fan can want, and this is for any sport at any time, at any place.
Because this happens a lot in football in the final couple of weeks, where the team wants to lose, or the fans want the team to lose. But the team, you can't like. The players don't tank. Yeah. Yeah.
You can't play your whole life and get to a point where you're like, we're going to try, but not try good enough. And also, When you tank. You put yourself in a better spot. to get a better talent, right? That would then take the job of the player.
That's like the player, the player's not invested in your team. The player's invested in his livelihood. And he's not going to. This guy takes my spot, and I'm probably not here next year. Yeah, let's.
Yeah, so I don't know that that. Has ever like made sense to? I don't think that we can grasp, like, oh, I'm gonna miss a bat, you're gonna lose your job. If you go four and eighteen, they're gonna get rid of a bunch of you. It's one of the big problems the league has, and I don't.
I don't like he's not going to hear this, but I haven't been the biggest fan of our commissioner. I think, for as much good as he has done, I think he's missed the boat on a lot of things, and he's been very reactive instead of proactive on some things. Like the play-in tournament. It's worked. The NBA Cup.
It's at least given you something to look for at that point in the season.
So, like, I get it, it's added interest and it's added money to their TV deal. But like this type of thing. That tanking becomes part of the vernacular. And now everybody's looking forward to, why don't you just try to lose in a competitive sport that now that's. The conversation.
Like football, sure, it happens in the NFL, but it's what, the last two weeks of the season where teams are like, we should probably lose these two games. Here we're talking about January and February in your league, where it's. Just continue to lose and try to get an even better pick here.
So, not figuring out. Not even how to incentivize like teams that are trying to win, but how do you punish teams? We've seen the monetary fines come in, but how do you punish teams and looking at things that I think are going to happen of like you can't finish in the bottom four two years in a row or get the top four pick two years in a row? That it's dragged on this long, I think is a big problem. That he's made the league.
Confusing for fans. Like, if you want to get into the fans, Justin, I'm sorry to interrupt, but I was trying to explain to my kid because he's playing 2K. He got into 2K. And of course I had to adjust the settings so he always wins. Yeah.
But he's playing 2K and The bracket came out for the playoffs. And I'm trying to explain to him. The playing tournament and how it works. I feel like his little brain might have gotten it. I don't know.
He's a smart kid. But it's like, if it's, if it's. It's there's a lot of things that are going to be hard to explain in life to my kid, daddy. What are these pictures I'm seeing on the TV? Daddy, how was I made?
It shouldn't be, Daddy, how do you qualify for the NBA postseason? I mean, well, remember how it was the first year, too, where it was like, well, it's only eight versus nine, and you have to be within, what, like four games of the eighth seed or whatever it was. But like they sent their sons to the bubble with no chance to get in. You've made it confusing for your fans to follow the league. Yeah.
Uh, the plane tournament takes away the there's no because of this playing tournament. I don't feel like there's a pennant race type Part of the NBA season. Because teams are going to jockey to get at six and seven, but nobody's getting groined up about that. Um the really the only team that's like In the Pennant race, so to speak, I think is the Bucs. And and they're they're they're they're bad and not gonna be in.
I mean, look at the West. Like, the 10 teams know they're in, basically. It's just, where are we going to finish? Because there's five teams that. They're just in Portland and they stink.
Could not. Yeah. I mean, the Clippers are in there, and it's five teams that could not care any less and are asking you. To take it, but like those things to me, too, the stuff where when I hear The whole tanking conversation. And, um, My favorite uh hobby or one of them is just sampling local radio and hearing the The groups that don't really talk about the Bucs or the Brewers now decide it's time for us to really launch in on our Bucs takes based on the three games that we've seen this year and what we've heard from others.
And just hearing everything that's wrong, too, about confusion over the pick swap. And again, that's a problem the league has that. pick swaps. Like what what what are we doing here? And the protections of it's one through four and then it's ten through like you're giving up the pick or you're not.
So let's simplify that and let's just make this easy and palatable for our fan base. Justin Garcia, I don't need to reset as a podcast, but I did want to say we are brought to you by, as you can see, Carl's Place with the golf simulators, Dan Shaney Insurance on the YouTube stream, and happyplaceemp.com, promo code BART. 25% off again promo code. Bart. Big thanks to our sponsor, BetterHelp, for partnering with us for this important conversation about mental health.
This is Steve Smith here, former NFL wide receiver and host of the 89 Show on YouTube.
So, having a counselor and working with BetterHelp gives you an opportunity to really start to unpack, but people don't understand when you unpack things, you also open up a box that you're not always sure what's inside.
So, I think that's why seeing a professional is extremely important. If you need someone to open up to, visit better help that's betterhelp.com/slash 89 to get started. Oh no, my coffee, Bronny. Here, new Branny 3 ply is now more absorbent. Wow.
Got a clean shirt? Do you wear plaid? Ron.
Some of the strongest. The um Interesting, I found a nail. The interesting thing about the season. There were expectations of like. You know, at least.
Maybe not. I don't know. Expectations might be the wrong word, but I think that What are your hopes? You know, what do you want? Where would you think they'd be coming into the season?
Six. I think I had like five, six. Yeah. And then there were those expectations. First five games, you were like, okay.
Yeah. Maybe it's four. Maybe it's three. Yeah. Yeah.
And then. That got blown apart. Giannis is hurt. Team's getting blown out. They're losing to the Wizards.
It's not happening.
So the bar is gone. But then like a new bar emerges. Like, okay, the season's a waste. Or is it? Because if you make the play, and Giannis comes back, and it's like, okay, okay, and that's where we were last week.
With the two midweek wins. And then they've lost every game since, and Giannis has come back. But now it's like.
Well, now we lowered the bar for you incredibly. And you're not even gonna, you're not gonna make that. I know Lori Nicol had her. Article about don't even think about the playoffs. It's fool's gold.
I'm not there yet, dude. There's still a month. I'm still mine. But I totally get the concept. I mean, I'll be there.
You know, if they do lose tonight, I will be there in 12 hours. If they lose tonight. It's incredibly tough because, like, what they have in their advantage right now is. Um They have what, I think the seventh easiest schedule left in the league. The Hawks or the Hornets have the eighth most difficult.
They already have the tiebreaker with Charlotte. That may not matter with the way that they're playing. Atlanta's back to 500-2. If they win tonight, they have the tiebreaker with Atlanta, and you have two games left against Atlanta.
So it's really going to come down to those two games. And for the love of God, can you at least beat the jazz twice in the teams that are tanking? Because. You do those things. I think at this point it's if you go.
15 and 7, which Outside of that, eight wins in 10 games, that's a stretch that we've seen from this group. But if you close the season 15 and 7 with a pretty easy schedule, And one or both of Charlotte and Atlanta go 10 and 10. And again, you win one of those two games against Atlanta. You have the tiebreaker against both those teams.
So you will be in one of those spots. I get the notion too, and I would agree. Fool's gold, if you're going to compare it to what our expectations were, maybe not even last year, because I think by then there were some people that were starting to see, like, feels like we're kind of watching the same script here. But from where we've traditionally been with the Bucks going to the playoffs, Yes, it's a fool's gold approach there, but like, what is the downside of this team getting the 10 seed and into the play-in tournament? Versus finishing with the eighth or ninth worst record in the league and having a one percentage chance better of moving up in the draft lottery from where they are.
Yeah. I think um if they do lose tonight. Then you're going to be talking about, okay, well, now, what are you playing for in the tank conversation? Will intensify, but I do think that there is a future. That's what was getting me excited last week.
You can start to maybe see parts of this team. That could be like this next era of Giannis and whatever the team's going to look like. And obviously, Giannis is the big factor. What's his future going to be, of course? I I thought the other night.
And I thought now for the comparison I made was right now, Giannis to me feels like. Paul Rudd on the last season of Friends. Where he's like there, but he's not a part of the group. Because he's like been, he's been all over the place. He has one day, he was at the Super Bowl.
I didn't know that. He's been not on the court. And so the other. Guys are like figuring out, you know, how to play around each other and stuff. And then, yeah, well, you throw Giannis in there, it should be an improvement.
But sometimes it still looks like maybe they had one idea of what they're doing and now they got to relearn a chemistry and. I just wonder: should they lose, even should they win? This next month, like what Is there I don't need to know what it is. But do you think there's like A line that exists, like if they play a certain way, Giannis will want to come back, or if they don't, or is this next month? More irrelevant.
Is it more possible that it's relevant or more possible that it's irrelevant how they play with the future of Giannis? I finally got there. Yeah, I I'm I'm not gonna I don't. I wouldn't say, like, oh, I think Giannis feels this. I think there's only one person in this market that has somewhat.
Of a pulse on that because Giannis keeps it so close. But I think the value too is just seeing, you know, the young guys. And I've heard, like, oh, well, you've played young guys all year. Like, Yeah, but let's see an 82-game sample of it, and let's see those moments of Ryan Rollins. With Giannis and with Kevin Porter Jr., Ryan Rollins with Usman Jang.
Like, can Giannis play with Jericho Sims?
Well, we have this 15-game sample size that shows this.
So, like, I think that's the starting point. And I think you have to assume there is going to be.
Some big changes this summer, you know, even like taking Giannis out of the equation, even. They have three draft picks that they can trade. They haven't, and again, this is one of the problems with the league making it confusing for their fans. Is they have three draft picks they can trade. They have exceptions that they can use, which I know everybody follows the CBA closely, but they had to renounce those last year when they became a caps based team.
They have those to use this year.
So you can use a mid level where you can pay someone fifteen million dollars. And Because of the way, again, that the league and their players association, for some reason, signed off on the CBA. There's no middle class.
So when you say, like, well, who are you going to get with this?
Well, you can actually get someone now because all the contracts are basically minimums or guys that are taking like the mid-level. And you look at, like, well, they could probably get more, but. We're not giving out those contracts anymore because it's all minimum deals, the mid-level, and then max contracts.
Okay. Here's how I'm gonna do it. Ready? Ready? You mentioned there could be some changes with the roster.
Could there Should there Be could there be any other changes to the theme? Are you saying could or should? Because that's. An important question.
However you want to answer, whichever question you want to answer. I mean, I look, I I think. I've gotten the question enough. I feel pretty confident in tap dancing out of anything here, Bart. I think.
It is fair to say everything is on the table if you finish, even if you get in the playing tournament, finish 10th. Um don't make the playoffs Everything is on the table in terms of what this team is going to look like top to bottom, the players that are on the roster. all of it is up for a change if that's where this team finishes. Here's a question for you. Let's play this.
Let's do this exercise. It is July, what was it, 20th? Is that when they want? July 20th? 21st?
21st. They should know it, but yeah.
Okay. It's July 21st. You're celebrating the NBA championship. You want to be able to do it? of 2021.
Okay. You're watching Bobby and Drew and Chris and. Hanging out with PJ at the Harp. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're doing it all.
Tragedy befalls you. You are struck. Into a coma. You wake up. You're like.
Oh shit, what the fuck? Oh, okay. Bucks play tonight? Great, I'll watch. You turn on the Bucs game.
You see Giannis. You see a lot of faces you're not familiar with. You see a coach, you thought he was in TV. And then, and then at that point, wasn't he coaching the Sixers?
So I thought he was coaching elsewhere.
So. But you're you're with this buddy and he calls you up and he says Justin What happened? He's still, when he's asking you that question, he doesn't know. about Adrian Griffin. He doesn't know about Damian Lillard.
How do you describe what happened in the last five years? of Bucks basketball.
Well, I would first start by telling him: so let's actually start things. A little bit after 2021, and let's go to 2024 in the fall of 2024.
So, this happened. Here's what happened with eggs. Here's what, like, there's other things to get into. Um, before I update you on the bucks, why don't you turn it on your TV? Might be helpful if I just sent you a fact.
I'll just send you an email and I'll send you a note here month by month. Here's what we've seen happen. Make sure you pick up on everything you missed in the last five years because aliens may be on their way. I mean, to your point, though, it is. It is quite remarkable that It doesn't seem like any change has.
Has worked out. Like they've tried things, and that's kind of been the, you know, what we've said under John Horse that they're willing to try. And he's made moves that none of us thought they could do. Like Drew Holiday, I didn't think they had the assets to get him. It was still a A good trade to give up Eric Bledsoe and George Hill.
And the draft picks for Drew Holiday, Damian Lillard, same story of like, really?
Okay, all right. Even smaller ones like PJ Tucker, everybody linked him to the Bucks, but you're like, they don't really have anything other than like a handful of second-round picks. DJ Wilson and DJ Augustine, and second rounders for a guy that helped you win the championship.
So, like, all these worked. And depending on How Spiritual and faithful a person, you are. Like, it's been brought up before of what? Do you feel like. Was there some deal in 2021 where there was some negotiation of?
Literally everything that happens. Kevin Durant's foot size, Giannis, we thought blew out his knee. He's back in a week. Oh, yeah. You come back, look like left for dead.
That's the one thing. It's not just Kevin Durant's foot. But you remember what the vibes were after the first two games of that net series where game two everyone but me, Justin. Everyone but me. I don't remember if they lost by fifty, but they were down by more than fifty late in that game.
Series two one, two, one. It was 2-0 at that point. And then it got to three. We were down three. And then they won the next two in Milwaukee.
And then the other plot twist in that was they outplayed the Nets in game five. And that was the Jeff Green game, where all of a sudden the Nets stole that one back, and you're like, man, that was it. And now you gotta win two in a row. Never won a game seven on the road in franchise history.
So, like, all these things happened. and you win the championship. And it's hard not to overlook that everything else that has been a fork in the road since then. has gone the way you wouldn't have chosen.
Well, the the the thing I find very interesting about Now with hindsight being As I say, 2010, because that's my eye vision is superior than the common man. I say it's 2016. We should have known better. Uh look at us. Look at us.
So like the Packers.
Okay. The Packers this year were playing well. And then Tucker Kraft got hurt, and then Micah Parsons got hurt.
So. No changes need to be made because you have injuries. I was going to say: do you have any thoughts on the Packers coaching situation? I don't know if I've heard about this. I'll answer that one, and you can talk about the Bucs coach.
Yeah, so it's it's I think it's what's keeping me off the air in this town. Among many other things. But Injuries like the Bucs every year could have used. Gosh, injuries. All right, let's run it back.
But they're not. And they're going out and they're saying. We're not going to let injuries deter us. We're trying to get better. I think like.
So obviously the type of moves that John Horse can make. He's kind of like backed into a corner, and he's just trying to like. What do I do? What do I do? I can MacGyver this dame stretch and then get Miles Turner.
You know, and I appreciate that. Like, and I think Bucks fans should, this guy's trying to. I don't know if he's trying to win as much as he's trying to keep Giannis here. I think that's actually his primary objective. But you know, you want to do both.
And I think for what the position is. One helps you with the other. Yeah. But the positions they've been in. Yeah.
I don't know as a Bucs fan. I mean, they tried.
Sometimes you've tried. What would you have rather had to just have? And like I Drew gets old, Brooke gets old, Middleton gets old, you run up the string, you wonder why didn't we trade these guys? They went and traded for Damien Lillard. Right.
It didn't work. What would you rather have? The former Packers approach and even some of the current of like, let's just sit on our hands. We know, like, we're j we're it's gonna work with this group or Let's unturn every stone to see. This could make us better.
This is going to keep him happy. And ultimately, it just didn't work for this team for the last three years. And sometimes that's just the unfairness of It sports life. You might you might you might make all the quote-unquote right moves, but They just don't work.
So I think. Wherever we got to, whatever point we're at. Um I think that we should be more. Appreciative of the 2021 title. I think we can also like.
I've talked to people about, oh, you don't want Giannis to be Rogers, just one title and. In 13 years. We might be looking at different situations there but I don't know. I guess with the Packers, I would be more critical of a 1 in 15 than I would be with the Bucs. Maybe that's maybe I'm just hypocritical, but I don't.
But I think I'm like okay to be. Does that make sense? Yeah, I mean, I think, too, it's just the expectations. historically around the teams that change it too. And like But even since 21, like what what more could I have asked for?
They tried. I could have asked, oh, maybe you didn't need to buy your bug, maybe not, maybe. Right. But health is what you could have asked for because I will still die in the hill. They win back-to-back titles in 2022.
Of course, Middleton doesn't slip on a wet spot. And then, like. Obviously, if there's not COVID. I still, I'm in the minority there. Like, there was just.
That team wasn't quite there. And the same thing I was talking with Ben Goliver, which everybody loved, that's the thing that I love the most. Not to. I should be careful here of bagging on certain. sects of Bucks fans, but We can speak down to the team and talk about how much they suck, and this team is going nowhere.
when someone else does it. I don't want to hear this. Only bring positivity and optimism. Like, okay. Yeah, like me.
I can, I can say I got fired. You have to say I got laid off. We I had, and I've known Ben for a while, and we had that conversation on one of the recent shows, and it was very. Down on the box, and like Gianna should look to leave because of this, which certainly awkward for me with my standing with the team, but all right, I'll let him say it. And all the feedback was like, This is terrible.
This is a national perspective. He doesn't get it. And then you watch the team lose five out of six games by 20 points. And this team's going nowhere. Shut it down.
Giannis, you should ask to leave. Blah, blah, blah. Like, okay. So it's. It's good for thee, but not for me.
I get it. It just seems so Personal. With some of these people. Yeah. That the Bucs don't do what they think they should do.
and they will not rest. Until they do so. And I don't understand. At all. It's like, leave us alone.
But they won't. Anyway, Ben Galliver wrote a book that I have. It's called Bubble Ball, and I was going to sell it and get $8 for it. But I thought when my kid grows up, I should. I want to have him read the book about the COVID bubble, which I still cannot believe even happened.
It is. Yeah, ma I mean, like I can only imagine being in the bubble, but like my experience. of working on those games in our own Bubble at the arena was something else and then you see the setup that they have like I This is like, imagine explaining that to somebody that was in a coma of like, oh, here's what you missed in 2020. Like, not even the science and medicine behind it, but we brought back sports. But we had cardboard fans.
We just turned gymnasiums into basketball arenas, and we had this set up here. Uh, this is what the court looked like. This is what we had behind the court. These are the tests that you had to go through years. Yeah.
Yeah, it was.
Well, and then the Christmas Day game the following year, because to me, The year after COVID, where the Bucs won the title, was even stranger. And thankfully, that started to dissipate. This isn't a real title either. Fine, whatever. But, like that year, where it started out pretty similar, because I think there were no fans for the first couple weeks.
Then it was like 250 people, but it was team personnel. Yeah, I went to one of those games. It was awesome. You got all the room you wanted. You could go wherever you wanted, yeah.
And like how they had everything blocked off on the court, where it just felt like you were watching a practice, basically. Yeah. And that was every single day. The fans are way up high. All right.
That's enough bucks. Thank you. Wrestling. Your thoughts. Hey, neighbor, celebrate all things spring with Birch Lane.
Our timeless furniture and decor are delivered for free in days, not weeks. It's classic style for joyful living. Shop Birch Lane, a Wayfair specialty brand at birchlane.com. You know what I read the other day? I read I read this.
I thought this was a great thing. One of the issues with WWE right now. Is they're so like focused. On this outsmarting thing. Yeah.
They're so focused on like. Like when our truth got fired, and then Triple H is like, You enjoying the show? It's all part of the show. It was not. Part of the show.
You just, you, you know, they're trying to like blur this line of Kfabe everything. Which I get, you know, Kayfei, whatever, but it's not. Mm-hmm.
So I feel like they're producing raw and SmackDown. And these PLEs for story for their unreal show. Yeah, yeah. Do you watch that show? No.
How have you watched it? I've seen enough clips to understand the show. Yeah. I watched like parts of the first season because I'm like, all right, let's. See what this is all about.
And then you got a sense of what it is, so it became background noise, and now it's just laughable of like.
Okay, here we go. Oh, this is all part of the show to keep them entertained and like all the stuff that's going on now. Injury angle, or any kind of thing. Anytime somebody's injured and unmasked, like, okay, so we're doing this. Oh, sets back early.
I wonder if this is going to be a part of your stupid show that you're doing. The Rhea Ripley and Jade Cargill stuff. Like, is this more drama for WWE Unreal? Like. That is their problem that I think I mean, we could get really philosophical in like, it's not just the WWE, our society as a whole is living online, and everything is for that.
And the gotcha, like, see? Oh, didn't see that coming, did you? And just like. The only Maybe the only good thing you could say about the previous owner of that company. Is he understood, you know how we continue to grow the business?
We hook in families. We Are just the parents will tolerate it. Kids get hooked into it and they want to stay. And you know, one of the reasons or one of the ways we do that is we keep this affordable, too, which is just. Completely gone.
Like the last time. I've only gotten tickets. Once, I think, from the team. And even then, I'm not going to complain they were free. But I've been told since, like, Don't even bother because those are premium, and we don't get as many to begin with.
I've gotten tickets to AEW when they've been in town from a former intern I worked with that worked for Turner. Were you there when Giannis slipped on the thing? Yeah. That was their first time in Milwaukee. I got him like two times.
And it was like right next to the hard cam or second row. And then here it's like, man, we can't, we can give you these that are way up there at the top of the arena because we're charging $500 for basically like your average seat because we found an algorithm that says that's what we can make. AEW, I'm one of the 1,200 people they follow on Twitter from those early. Wow. Yeah, I feel pretty good about that.
I think too uh company or Tony AEW company.
Okay. Does Stony follow you? No, he does not, but. He follows one person that I work with, and I thought at first, is there any? Do you know him and asked him too?
Like, can you? Kind of greased the wheels for me. And he said, like, no, I don't even know why he follows me. I didn't even know who that guy was. Who do you think are my...
My kid's six. Who do you think are his three favorite wrestlers?
Well, I mean, I've heard you mention one of them before. We may have talked about it, but I would automatically guess. Any kid that's like under 10 loves Jey Uso. Mm-hmm.
Jay's number one. He recently got passed up. Oh. Um By a more recent call-up. Actually, both guys are more recent.
More recent call-ups, um Does he like Bron? Braun Breaker? Even more recent than that. Even more, what am I missing here? The NXT guys.
Oh, um Javon Evans. Oh, he does like Javon Evans too, but it's Trick. Trick's his favorite. Really? Likes the heels.
Oba family.
Okay. Okay. We were in bed one night. And I let him watch, you know. put him to bed and i let him watch wrestling fall asleep don't put him to sleep for real But Obafemi's music started.
And he got out of bed. Did you do the walk? He got out of bed. He got out of bed. I'm like, what are you doing?
He just looked at me with like a, I don't know what you mean, daddy. And then it goes doon, doon, and he starts doing the walk around the house.
So I'm I'm enjoying wrestling through his eyes. Right now. I think You know, they're gonna does he like does he like Does he like Cody, or is he like the rest of us? You're like, I used to like him, but now I don't know what it is. It's just, yeah.
Cody was his first favorite. He likes pretty much everybody. He's turned on Joe Hendry for some reason. Who else doesn't he like? Like, I'm just over it, Dad.
We get it. We say your name, he shows up, and then he turns around to the camera: do something else, find a new moveset. I'm just um you know I think I think the TKO involvement Has he gone to an event? Yeah, we went um I guess the last time SmackDown was here. Like a year ago?
Maybe two times ago. The bloodline was still together. And um, Sami Zayn was with them. Wow. So we saw the bloodline.
LA Night, we still have it on T V. LA Knight, I think, was the US champ at the time. Yeah. And on T V you can see where we're sitting when he talks and So those are his three guys? He's not an LA Knight kid?
He likes them all. He likes LA Night. Dad, I liked L.A. Night a lot better when he was called The Rock. Yeah.
He basically is not getting the same push though. He basically likes them all. I think. Who doesn't he like? Does he like the women's side?
He likes the women. And um You know, sometimes we'll skip the matches though. But he likes uh But then he always goes, um, he always goes to me. When Tiffany Stratton's on. I don't know what I said or what I did, but he always turns and goes.
Daddy and Tiffany sitting in a tree. Yeah. Like you wish buddy I got him in there. I mean, he knows about AEW. We haven't like.
Watched it. It's probably the best he doesn't watch it yet. Yeah, but then it's like a whole new group of characters I have to tell them about. Oh, the uh yeah, I mean, who's even come well, I suppose, like. Yeah, the thing about what is his name even?
But like, he used to be Powerhouse Hobbs, and now he's this person. And like, trying to explain that to your kid. Yeah. Who's just yeah, he did Steph's podcast and then they buried him and catered and then nothing since uh Dan Hausen explaining to him who that is? Do you have to go through that?
I was trying to tell him about he cursed Dom Mysterio, and he's like, What's a curse? He's asked me seven times what a curse is. I can't explain. What's a curse? Look at the last whatever years I'm on watching.
Yeah. Speaking of the last, whatever, 10 years of our lives, where are you at with Chris Jericho? Because. Uh I always liked him, but it started to grow. Like, all right, we've seen this.
And yeah, he reinvents himself, but I think I'm just ready for you to go away and then. Everything outside of the ring didn't really help either the past six or so years for Jericho. But then it reached the point when he seems like he's eventually leaving. I think the contract is still in that injury time or whatever. Where I've strangely become like All right, I think I do actually kind of want to see him back in WWE now.
I've always been a big Jericho guy. to begin with and then I did have him on my old show with frames. I just he was on a tour or he was doing his cruise. I was like, hey, can you come on? And he's like, yes, here's my number.
Mm. It's like the easiest.
Okay. So we talked to Jericho. Uh, that was, I think, at the time he was doing you s you just made the list.
Okay, yeah.
So I've liked them. I I do in AEW I thought he had a run. Maybe he tried a little too much. Started to get a little rough towards the end. The inner circle was all good.
Yeah. The learning tree was kinda dumb. There you go. It just became offshoots of the same thing, it felt like. And then not to mention the rumble.
So, but like, what's the deal? Is he going to open Brock's open challenge? You get killed. There's so many people that are enthralled right now, too, listening to us talking about Chris Jericho. But, like, isn't he.
Didn't they tack on months because of the time that he missed with injury? Is basically the rumor now.
So he is not technically a free agent. I would assume he shows up at some point, whether it's. Spring, summer, it would have made a whole lot of sense for him to show up at the Rumble at Wrestle or in Saudi if that were the case. But I would assume he shows up at some point and gets the retirement tour in WWE, which I'd be fine with. The one thing.
I used to d did you ever watch the Hall of Fame ceremonies? Again, I've seen clips. I don't like sit down and watch it. It's long. I guess I'm a bigger dwarf than you.
I used to. Not all of them. It depended on who it was. A lot of these guys, I did not watch wrestling growing up. See, I did.
I didn't watch it until I was 25. Wow. Okay. I got you because I watched all through, except for. When I was like 25, and after I left lacrosse and was living in Madison for.
a couple of years. I stopped watching around then. Like 2000, right around Chris Benoit. Not because of that, I wasn't so outraged. But like right around that time is when I kinda.
gave it up for like five or so years and then eventually got back in around Maybe more than five. The NXT black and gold era is basically what brought me back in. But I, I mean, I would watch the, it wasn't like, can't do it, canceling plans Friday night, this guy's going into the Hall of Fame, but I would watch it in the past if it was like when Stone Cold went in and stuff like that, or guys that I remembered. Um and now it's just reached the point of like, who is paying? To go to these events when they would do them separately.
And who's staying up to watch this and like this one of. We're putting in Stephanie McMahon and AJ Styles literally just retired, but we're going to throw him in there too, which. Kind of feels like it's also, please don't go to AEW. We're going to put you in the Hall of Fame.
So here you go, and you're honored. He was like crying tears of sadness when he got his doctor.
Son of a bitch. That he couldn't uh Leave.
Well, you want to do a WrestleMania post game with me? I think I might be open those things. Yeah, it's mid-April now. Uh Season might be over. Maybe it's the last WrestleMania 2 because who knows what's going to happen with that?
Because next year's is in Saudi, right? It is scheduled to be in Saudi Arabia. Yeah, that is where it is scheduled to be. Great time before we do go. I had one other question for you.
I don't remember if I talked to you about this before, but. Are you just basically becoming the show version of Bruce City Radio now? Like, I've seen you got all the big names on, you just had my guy Armin on. I talked to you. I never really listened to Wicked's show, but I really enjoyed that show.
So. Now you're starting to get all these names on to just talk about. Remember when we did this and what's the beef behind the scenes? Because I got some we can get into at some point. I want to um be, I want the Winkler verse.
to be the gathering spot for all talents across this town.
Now I have a lot of work to do if that's going to happen. I can give you some numbers and put you in touch with a couple. people Um And I can do my best to I have this long going infrastructure week. Where the goal is to bring on people and rebuild the bridges I have burned. Um I think if I if I was somebody That I was an antagonist to.
And then Not a whole lot to choose from there. I got this invite that was like, hey, come on, my pod. I just want to talk and explain and give you your props for what you've done. I'm not going to attack you. You can say stuff at me, but this is totally.
I just want to bury the hatchet that I've. I still think people would be like, he's fucking lying. He's going to have me on and fucking snake attack me. I get it. I wouldn't.
That's not my goal, but I get it.
So we'll see. How many have you had on so far? I mean, obviously Wicked is and Chuck and everyone else is not in that group, but how many of the local media had an infrastructure week yet? I I don't know that I've had a real one. I don't know that anybody's really come on.
To bury anything. Is there anyone from the cross that won that wronged you that you could Bring on here. Yeah, my old boss who told me, I don't see you as a sports guy. And did not let me, did not let me fill it like. They had no one to fill in sports for a weekend, and I was sitting right there.
I'm like, I will do it. And then she's like. No, we'll just have the person in Madison tape it and send it to us. Was that KOW? KBT.
KBT. Oh. Well, I don't have any from the cross just because our group was basically four people that worked at the radio station I was at. It was a really, really. Tight ship where I was a college student that was working about 45 to 50 hours a week.
Do you remember KQEG? Yeah. There's a T V station. I worked there. It was like a UPN.
God, it was in the building. It was in the Fifth and State building or Fifth and King, Fifth and King. Fifty, yeah. It was like across from WKBT, across from a parking lot. And it was like just like an office suite.
And so It's the year 2005 or 6 and In this building, it was the year 1987. Because what I What I had to do was Every show that we played was on a V. HS that I would either put into one of five. Things that would schedule the play. And then I had to like, we would get like animal adventures or something.
We'd get it on the satellite, then I'd have to have this machine where I'd like do some things to manually edit in the commercials. And we were running shit like Moesha and the Parkers and Judge Mathis and Judge Joe Brown. Actually, I did watch some SmackDown then at the time. The DPN version of SmackDown? Yeah, on Friday nights.
Uh But there I would like to play a tape and I would call my buddies. And I'd say, hey, turn on channel 10 or whatever. And he turned it on. I'd go. Like, bet your friend that you could, like, I'd make him.
I would pause the actual broadcast feed while my friend at home would fake pause the TV. It was just it was just a hoot, Justin. I mean Did you give an answer?
Now I'm giving myself away as a Bart Super fan. When Mike asked you what was the time you missed the most, what do you look back most fondly in radio? I think I might have settled on Fond du Lac because I was in control. I basically ran a station. Yeah, I mean, mine.
I'm not going to doubt. Like, obviously, what I do now and getting to fill in. Play my play for the Milwaukee Bucks, Justin. Come true. But honestly, it's when I worked in Radio and La Cross.
And like, our group was. The entire staff was me. John Odias, who does women's Badger women's volleyball and basketball play by play now. Bill Dawson, who for a while basically had my job with the Badgers and now lives in Japan and started the Great Dane in Japan. And then Ben Larson was the fourth guy there.
That was our whole staff. And all four of us worked together basically daily. We had to do everything like the. The track side shows of the local fairgrounds raceway that we had in the cross, doing board opping from there, your high school games. The night train, were they still around when you were there?
The lacrosse night trainer. The Obert was. Yeah, we would. Yeah, we would do those games.
So, like. That and like just the camaraderie that you had, and the community itself, and just. How like welcoming and embracing that group was to people that knew nothing about La Crosse. Like, we had some crazy caller that was a Pizza Hut delivery driver who every single day, Would drop off free pizza for us because our radio station, it was a ranch house. We were technically in Onalaska.
And so, like, one of the bedrooms was where the ESPN station was from. And this guy would just come into the parking lot. Park, walk right up to the window, and you'd see a box of pizza. And he'd just, here you go, guys! Like, oh, wow, great!
Thank you! That type of stuff was honestly like that's I mean, all of us have those stories of this is what I started with, and this is what I live the most. But it's also like, man, if you stick through that. You really want to be in this business of making. I think I made.
5.15 an hour when I worked there, and when we would get to call high school and The turbo and the cross games, you got bumped up to like, you'll get $25 if you do play-by-play for this basketball game, which you're like, holy. Holy shit, $25. Wow, which. You know, the cross with the conversion rate, too. That's like, man, I can, that's like a quarter of my rent, incredible.
Yeah. I think my last rent I was paying about one ninety. On Miller Street. We would do it or death. thirty five, I think, on Vine Street.
Yeah. Good times. What a time.
Well, uh someday we'll look back fondly on this. I miss season specifically. Memories, what are they? But But moments captured in time, Justin. All right.
Thank you. For stopping. Into The Winkler Verse. Yeah. Oh no, my coffee, Branny!
Here, new Branny 3 ply is now more absorbent. Wow. Got a clean shirt? Do you wear plaid? Ron.
Summon the strongest.
