Matt Slick Live

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Listen to Matt Slick live if you want to give me a call. And put a subject line radio comment, radio question, and we can get to, we'll get to it usually, usually do. All right, let's see, we'll do this and there we go. Hey, let's just jump on the air and let's get with Porter from Raleigh, North Carolina.

Porter, welcome, you're on the air. How are you doing today? Oh, I'm hanging in there, man, hanging in there, man.

So what do you got? I had a chance to read Romans 9 that you told me about on Thursday about. Yeah, uh-huh, uh-huh.

And you do have me, you do have me thinking a lot. Good, that's good. I'm still not 100% there though. Well, that's all right, that's all right. I forgot what the whole context was though, but so did you read it in such a way that you understood it because, you know, you're going, wait a minute, is that what it's actually teaching, that kind of stuff, did that happen? Yeah, like, do you think it's possible to agree with some points of Calvinism and to disagree with some parts of it?

Of course. Yeah, we don't care. I mean, you know, a lot of Calvinists get uppity and say, oh, you don't believe in Calvinism, you're not, you know, they get all over you.

I don't do that. My concern is that you serve the Lord Jesus Christ, you want to serve him. But the question is, what does the Bible say? And if you go through Romans 9, 9 through 23, you'll see in there the sovereignty of God is absolutely promoted, and that's one of the things that all Christians should believe.

Would you agree? I would, just the problem I have with it is, if God's already predestined, who will be saved or not, then why is there any need to share the gospel at all if he is already predestined? Well, the Bible says he's predestined them. Do you agree with that, Ephesians 1.4? It says, he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we be holy and blameless before him, and love he predestined us to adopt from his sons. So the ones who are chosen are the ones predestined, would you agree?

Yes. Okay, so now we know that, well, God did predestined them. Okay, chosen and predestined, that's what the Bible says. Alright, so why do we evangelize?

Well, there could be a couple, three, four reasons. One is, it glorifies God. Two, the gospel is the means by which God brings the elect into salvation.

Three, we're in sales, not production, four, we may not understand how it all works. See, the Bible teaches election predestination. Most people react negatively to it because they're humanists and their philosophy of salvation, in that salvation depend on their ability, their wisdom, their goodness to be able to choose God. And that it's not fair, they'll say, if God chooses one and not another, it should be up to the people. And what they'll do is they assign to God what should be fair. And I ask them, I say, well, you got any universal moral standard by what you're judging God on this?

That's the crux. That's why it says it does not depend upon the man who wills or the man who works upon God who has mercy. So, in Romans 9. So, what it says, and plus, there could be some stuff going on that we're not aware of. For example, you know, you're saved, you pray for the salvation of somebody. God has ordained that you would pray for the salvation of that person.

And so, the praise of a righteous man availed much with God, James 5 talks about. So, maybe there's some interaction there that we're not privy to. But, so there you go, you know, that's why we do it. Okay? That makes sense.

Yeah. But it is what it says, you know. And, you know, because it says, Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated. Well, what should we say then? There's no injustice with God, is there?

It may never be. Because what Paul is saying there, it had nothing to do with their works. You know, verse 11, you know. It says that God's purpose according to his choice would stand not because of works, but because of him who calls. So, Paul is just wiping out this idea of works.

He's just getting rid of it. It's not based on works, but because of him who calls. And that's hard for people. And that's why it says it was said the older will serve the younger just as written Jacob.

I loved, but Esau I hated. Well, people don't like that. When I teach it to them, they object. If I say, well, God's choice or salvation doesn't depend on you and your goodness or anything in you. It depends on God. Well, that's not fair. We should have a choice in it. Well, you do. You know, you choose God, but when he grants it, you do that.

Well, that's not right. Well, then you're just agreeing with what the objection is in Romans 9, verse 14. What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there?

May it never be. See, that's the thing about this in Romans 9. Those objections that he raises, he raises for the things he's teaching. And if you don't have a way of looking at it to go, well, wait, that's not right, wait, what's going on? Then you don't understand. But what people do is they will say what this is about is nations.

Jacob and Esau were nations. Well, then what's the big deal? Because in the nations, people make their own choices, right? So he just kind of, you know, chose this one guy to be this nation and another guy to be this. Well, he can do that.

That's okay. Well, then how is it there's no injustice with God? Why is that objection raised then? And then he goes on and he says, he says, I'll have mercy on whom I have mercy. I'll have compassion on whom I have compassion. The word whom in Greek is in the singular, you know, I'll have mercy on whom I want to have mercy. And so, and he says, it does not depend upon the man who wills or the man who runs, but upon God who has mercy. What they'll generally do, the other side will say, it has nothing to do with how God chooses to do with people and nations and groups.

That's what he's talking about. If that's the case, it doesn't make any sense because the next thing Paul says is to Pharaoh I raised you up to the individual Pharaoh to demonstrate his power. And then he says, he hardens whom he desires. He, he, uh, has mercy on whom he desires and he's on the individuals and I can go on and on. I've done this so many times with people, and this is what people have, uh, Christians in particular have to, uh, agree to. They have to agree to this part of scripture, but if they don't, then they're rebelling against God's word.

Okay. Um, so like you don't believe like people have free will to choose God is what you're saying. Yes, they do have free will. People have free will, but free will is the ability to make a choice that's consistent with your nature. So God has free will, but he can't choose to sin. Jesus has free will because he's God in flesh. In John 5 19, John 5 30, he says he could do nothing of his own initiative, but only what he saw the father do. So free will is the ability to make a choice consistent with your nature.

That's not forced on you. So what we teach, I believe is, as you say, is that regeneration, God regenerates you and then you freely believe, okay? Okay. Yeah. He changes us.

He makes us born again and with a new heart. Now we can believe and we freely do. Okay. Okay. Make sense?

It does. So basically what you're saying is we can't choose God without him opening our eyes first to be even be able to choose him. That's right. Because it says, Jesus said in John 6 65, you cannot come to me unless it's granted you from the father. Jesus says, you cannot come to me unless the father draws you cannot, it says in John one 12 and 13, as many as received him to them, he gave the right to be called or become the children of God. Even to those who believe in his name, who were born, not of the blood, nor the will of flesh nor the will of man, but of God. In 1 Peter 1 3 it says God chooses us, excuse me, causes us to be born again. Yeah, that makes sense.

Yeah. That's what it says. This is why I had to change my theology away from Armenianism to Reformed theology because I kept studying the Bible in depth and I kept going, well that's what it says, you know. In 2 Thessalonians 2 13, for example, another one which says, but we should always give thanks to God for you, brother, beloved by the Lord, because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation. That's what it says, you know, or Acts 13 48, you know, it's like I'm reading these and going, man, man, you know, when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord in as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed. Yeah, that makes sense.

Yeah. But once we're saved, hey, now we have a new freedom. Now our freedom includes, because our nature is, you know, reborn again, we're no longer slave of sin and haters of God. Now we can ask God to save others and he hears us because our prayers are sanctified through Christ. Now, how all that works out in the long run, that I don't know, but you see, that's why I spent so much time evangelizing. Last night I was actually online and gave the Gospel to a bunch of heretic, Easter Orthodox people who deny the Gospel and give the Gospel to them. That's what's the power of God is salvation, Romans 1 16. And that's why you take calls like even Patrick's call, right?

Absolutely. Here's the three verses I teach people about all this. One is Romans 1 16, the Gospel's the power of God is salvation for everyone who would believe. Isaiah 55 11 says, the word of God will not come back empty without accomplishing what God desires. And Jesus says in John 12 32, if I be lifted up from the earth, I'll draw all men to myself. So we lift up Christ, we preach that Gospel, we speak his word. God draws, God grants that they have faith, Romans 1 29. He grants that they come to Christ, John 6 65. So what I do when I'm after I'm done witnessing or before witnessing, I say, Lord, I think of these verses in my head, I think, Lord, and I say this, Lord, if they're not elect from the foundation of the world, could you please elect them from the foundation of the world? Because I don't know how it works, you know, and I'll say, please open their hearts and their minds. Because as it says in Acts 16 14, God opened Lydia's heart to believe the things spoken of by Paul and Jesus in Luke 24 44, I believe it is, or 45, he opened their eyes, opened their minds to understand the scriptures. So I say, would you please, if they're not elect, please elect them. That's my confession of incredible ignorance. Grant that they come to you, John six five, grant that they have repentance, second Timothy two 25, granted they have faith, Philippians one 29, and please call them to yourself.

Draw them. John six 44 and by the gospel, Romans one 16, that's what, how I pray. Okay. Okay. Oh, there's, there's a break man, all right, does that help?

Yeah, that helps. All right, brother. We'll call back anytime. Okay, man.

Anytime brother. Okay. Thank you. Okay. God bless.

All right. Hey, let's get to the break and then we'll get back with some callers waiting. Please give me a call at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six, Matt slick live taking your calls at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six here's Matt slick.

Everybody. Welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, all you got to do is dial eight seven eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six to get to Jermaine Jermaine. Welcome brother, you're on the air. Hello, Matt.

Hey, how are you today? I had a question about Revelation chapter 21, specifically the new heaven and the new earth. All right. And, you know, what brings that to mind is I saw a couple of indoctrination rituals by the Jones witnesses about who the 144,000 are and that to me has been refuted. One thing that piqued my interest is, does the Bible actually elaborate on what is going to go on on the new heaven and new earth and do we get to go between both places like who gets to go where? Well, um, let me just tell you that I've studied it over the years and I don't have what I consider definitive answer. It certainly seems to be the place there's going to be a new heavens and new earth. The elements will be destroyed with intense heat. And so that's in second Peter three nine, I believe it is for 10 and so, uh, that's going to happen.

All right. That's what seems to be the case. And so then the new earth is going to be made and earth is going to be restored to what it was supposed to be. So from what I've gathered, it seems to be that we're going to be able to be here on earth and also go to heaven. And I don't know how that's going to be. I don't know if that's completely accurate. Uh, the new heavens, the dueling place of God and Jesus says that we're going to be with him.

Well, that's where he is. So there's just been discussions and debates about the particulars and, um, it's been tough to, uh, kind of figure it out. That's all I can tell you. I just don't know.

Yeah, I think that's fair. To me, that's more realistic than people pretend to know every detail that God told them personally and no one else. But I do wonder as far as like how we see Christ and this relates as far as, so I, I, and I really can't stand some of the images that have been ingrained where I keep imagining a man in a robe walking around, but in reality, I mean, it would seem like he'd be much greater than that because you have thousands or multiple millions of people simultaneously wanting to worship and be with them. So, you know, it just makes me wonder what that would actually look like. Good question. I'm sure there are people who know what the truth is and just happen to have studied it properly and God's given them wisdom.

I wouldn't claim to be one of those, not on that topic. So all I can tell you is it seems to be a new physical, spiritual reality that's going to come and we're going to be here on earth at least part, probably in heaven as well, be with God. I'm hoping, like I said, I frequently mentioned when we talked about this on the air is I want to be able to go to galaxies, you know, at the speed of thought, that kind of thing. You just never know.

You just never know. But that's it. All we can do is try. Okay. Well, one final question.

Sure. So I just wonder the way the old tabernacle was set up and just how, you know, it was a place of reverence and worship. Do you think heaven can kind of be considered a form of that type of knuckle and maybe the earth is, the earth in its true form is as we're supposed to experience it now with all this pollution and weird stuff going on, but you know, you think it's possible maybe that would be our kind of dwelling place that we can go into the presence of God freely, which would be kind of the new heaven?

Maybe. I've heard people discuss that as well, or read about discussions of the tabernacle, the temple that will be on that new earth. And there's going to be something there, no sacrifices, but a progression of holiness that was to go into the presence of God.

I've heard so many different, or read I should say, so many different views on it that, to be honest, I just don't know which one's true. And then when I read the scriptures, the best I can come up with is for sure it seems to be new heavens, new earth, spiritual, physical thing, we'll be able to go to both, and that'll be good. I'm looking forward to it, not having to sleep, not having to fight any more cultists, that's going to be wonderful, because I'm always trying to work myself out of a job anyway, so it'll be nice when I'm in the presence of the Lord and hopefully he'll say, well done! And I'll look behind me and go, who's that?

Oh, that's Jermaine, there he is. I always thought I had one of the best answers on this, not to my own horn, but it'll really make sense when someone tries to ask what heaven be like, they say really, really good, and that's good enough for me. Yeah, they're going to have to keep me on the outskirts, because, you know, it's what we have. So I'm going to be on the outskirts, because I'm not worried of anything.

He'll just hear a sloshing sound, a guy with a mop cleaning up, and that's me, I'll be fine with that. That's right. I don't care. All right. All right, brother. Thanks a lot, man. I appreciate you as usual, and Lord willing, we'll get to talk tomorrow.

That's right, man. God bless, buddy. God bless. God bless. All right.

All right, I always enjoy talking to him, he's a good guy. Let's get to, next longest waiting, oh, let's go over here, was Steven from Scotland. Hey, Steven, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Mark, can you hear me okay? Yes, I can.

Yes, I can. How you doing, brother? Very good. How are you doing? Oh, I'm tired, melancholy, a little obstreperous, recalcitrant, occupied, and have snot to do. That's how. Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh.

I'm a little bit tired as well, it's half past 11 p.m. here, so bedtime for me soon. But I thought I would call with a question. I was listening to a gentleman debating on TikTok Live a day or two ago, and he was talking with a Christian, and one of the things that he said to this Christian was that John the Baptist was sinless. And so that is my question that I present to you, was John the Baptist sinless? No.

He was not. Okay, that's it. There's nothing in the scripture that says sinless. I thought so, because, yeah, I mean, when I heard that, I thought, well, as far as I'm aware, the only person who lived a sinless life was our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Yeah. And the Bible says in Romans 3, 23, all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God, Mary included, and the only one who did not sin was Jesus.

And so that's it. So, yeah, Joseph, I mean, he was a sinner. He sinned.

Yep. He was a good man, though. But he sinned. I was, yeah, I wish that these Christians, when they're talking online, that they would be talking, you know, truthfully to other Christians and stuff.

I didn't think it was true what he said, so that's why I called him. Yeah. So let's just say that there's a lot of Christians who try and say what they think is true, but it's not. And a lot of people are just mistaken by a lot of things. That's all.

There's just a lot of mistakes and a lot of stuff like that, you know. Was John the Baptist a sinner? Yes.

And, no, he wasn't. Okay. All right. All right, brother. Thank you very much. Thanks for taking my call. God bless.

Okay. Hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Bottom of the hour. Why don't you give me a call? 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Everybody, welcome back to the show if you want to give me a call.

The number is easy. 877-207-2276. Let's get to... Hello?

Ebenezer. Welcome, brother. You're on the air. Hello?

Yes, you're on the air. Hey. Hey, Matt. Uh-huh. Can you hear me? Yes, I can hear you.

Hello? Yeah, yeah. So I have a question.

So, you know how Orthodox and Catholics would use that passage about Jesus raising from the dead and giving power to the apostles to forgive sins and stuff? Yeah, uh-huh. Yeah, so I was wondering, like, do you, last time you broke it down in Greek, but I didn't quite understand, I didn't understand it fully what you were saying, I guess because time ran out. Huh? That's okay.

And what were you talking about before? You broke it down in Greek, but it was... What's the et? What's the et? What's the et? I broke it down in Greek. What's the et?

What is the et? That passage in particular. Which passage? The, you know, it forgives the sins I'll be forgiving you or something like that. Oh, oh, oh, oh, gotcha. Oh, okay.

John 2023, for example. Yeah. If you forget the sins of any other sins that have been forgiven, yes. Mm-hmm.

Yeah, right. I was wondering, because, you know, how would you, because you said that wasn't a particular verse, I guess. It's a verse that EO and RC use to try and authenticate their particular church and priesthood as being the true one. And they go to these verses. So for example, all right, Jesus was among his disciples in John 20, it was in the evening, first day of the week, and the disciples were there. And he said, peace be with you.

Right? This is after the resurrection. And when he said this, he showed them his hands and his side, and they rejoiced, there he is. And he said, peace be with you, as the father has sent me, I send you.

Who's he talking to? His disciples. What EO and RC do is say, well, that means the whole church authority that we have, that's not what it says.

It's just not what it says. In verse 22, when he had said this, he breathed on them and said, receive the Holy Spirit. He says, if you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them. If you retain the sins of any, their sins have been retained. So what the EO and RC do, Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholics do, I've heard this verse used a thousand times, that this proves that their priesthood, their priesthood, has the authority to forgive sins, because they have the authority of Christ. But this doesn't teach that, it doesn't teach that the authority was for anyone else other than the apostles.

That's point one. It doesn't say, it's therefore passed down. Because if it's for any of his disciples, then anyone who's a disciple of Christ would have that authority. And that's not what they teach. What they say is, it's not just about disciples. It just means they're apostles. It doesn't say that, it says disciples. We know it means they're apostles, too. So that's another point.

Another issue is, they will often quote this that says, if you forgive the sins of any, their sins are forgiven. But that's not what it says. Because in the Greek, it is a perfect passive, indicative.

So let me explain what's going on. It says, if you forgive, it's an aorist, active, subjunctive. Aorist is past tense, past tense, action, aorist, that's what it means.

Active voice. How do you spell that? How do you spell that?

How do you spell that? Aorist, passive. Aorist, A-O-R-I-S-T. Okay, hold on, I'm going to write that down. Aorist, active, subjunctive.

If you forgive the sins of any. Aorist means past tense. Active voice means they're performing the action. Subjunctive deals with possibility, okay? It's subjunctive. It deals with possibility, alright? You with me?

Yeah, yeah. So if you forgive the sins of any, that's how it's translated into the English and the NASB. So it says, if you forgive the sins of any, it literally doesn't agree. If you forgive the sins of any, they have been forgiven, as we were saying. Now the first words, if you forgive, that's why it's a subjunctive if. You forgive the sins, aorist, active, subjunctive, past tense, they're performing the action.

It's dealing with possibility, hypotheticals. Their sins have been forgiven. Now we switch into what's called the perfect tense, and instead of aorist, now it's perfect tense. Now I have to explain what perfect tense is. So in English, I have eaten. That's perfect tense. I had eaten.

That is pluperfect. Perfect tense, and the pluperfect are both in the past, both in the past. However, the perfect tense, the action of the past is continuing to the present.

In pluperfect, the action of the past is stopped in the past. I had eaten. I'm no longer eaten. Or I have eaten, you know, I've eaten this.

It means I still do that. So Jesus switches from the aorist to the passive, I mean the perfect tense, excuse me, from the aorist to the perfect tense, all right? Then he switches from the active voice to the passive voice.

So this is really interesting. It's like saying this, if you forgave, if you did the forgiven, the sins, the sins have been forgiven. They've already been done. Because have been is dealing with past tense action. The aorist is also dealing with past tense action, except the aorist does not have the time duration that a perfect tense does. So it's just, it's like saying I ate, okay? But not I have eaten in English, it's the same in English. I ate is an action that's past tense. Doesn't say if it's continuing or stopped in the past. But the perfect tells us past tense action that's continuing.

With a pluperfect. So pretty much he's saying continue to forgive then, right? No, it's like saying if you do this, it's been done already.

If you do this, it's been done already, it has been done. Now here's a question. I've asked the Catholics and the Eastern Orthodox, do the apostles, do your apostles, your people, do they have the authority to forgive sins? They say yes, they do. So I've got a question then, are they doing the forgiving? And they'll say, no, they're doing the forgiving as Christ forgives.

They're pronouncing it. I say, well, that's Protestantism. And as we teach that we can pronounce a forgiveness on somebody, but we're not doing the action. Now the caveat here is that it seems to be that they're performing the action of forgiving.

But that's a theologically difficult thing to assert because I asked them, if the priest that you're having is doing the action of forgiving, then is God obligated to forgive whoever the priest forgives? That's the question. And that's where we need to start talking because they will say, well, no, it's already been done. The guy's not obligated to do it. He just already did it. I didn't ask that.

I said, think about it. If they're doing this, then it has to have been done, right? But God does the ultimate forgiving. Are you saying then that he ultimately, God will forgive whatever they forgive? And this confuses them, okay?

So this is what's going on. All right? And if you've retained the sins of any, their sins have been retained. And this is almost identical to Roman, I mean, Matthew 6, 8, 619, to Peter, I give you the keys of the kingdom, whatever you bind in earth shall have been bound. Whatever you bind, okay, whatever you bind, that's the aorist act of subjunctive again.

Okay? Shall have been bound. Now we switch a little bit. Now it's actually the same. It's a participle this time, but perfect passive.

And it's like saying, the perfect tense, it has been done. Okay? I'm going slowly.

I hope that helps. I have another question. I have another question. We've got a break. All right. Hold on. We'll be right back after the break. Okay? But these are... Hey folks, you're right back.

A little Greek lesson there for you. And hope you enjoy the show. Please stay tuned. We'll be right back after these messages. Welcome back to the show. Hope you're enjoying it. Let's get back on with Ebenezer.

Welcome, brother. You're back on. Hello? Yes.

You're back on. Hello? Can you hear me? Yes.

Hello? Yeah. Yeah.

So I have another question, right? I was talking to a oneness guy and oddly enough, well, not that, but it was kind of weird because he said he wasn't discounting that Jesus was God or something like that, which is weird. But he was like, he brought up passages like, I think it was like Daniel, it was like Daniel 18 and Isaiah when he saw the, when he saw, when he saw the Lord, he was like, well, but his main point was, you know, the Holy Spirit can't have a throne. And I was trying to tell him that, you know, the Holy Spirit was seen in the, in the Old Testament. And I brought up how, how the passage in Genesis where it's like, let us power of Babel in Genesis where, you know, Abraham, was it the Christophany, right? Okay.

You, you kind of switched and blended a different set of different topics. So with God, the father's never seen, but God almighty is seen as a pre-incarnate Christ. The Holy Spirit, when he appears, uh, does so in flame and in fire, wind, things like that. Okay.

Oh, okay. So, I mean, cause he would tell me that he would tell you, you would tell me that, um, how can the Holy Spirit have a throne, you know, cause I'm trying to equate that. It's just, okay, uh, God has a throne, but God is spirit. So you know, what's going on when God has a throne is that we don't understand how it all works, but oneness people, um, they often, because they're so confused about the Trinity and who God really is, that they will often ask these kinds of questions, uh, to try and confuse others because they're confused.

They don't understand. So the Holy Spirit and the father's son, Holy Spirit was one God, God sits on a throne. It says, uh, in Isaiah 6, 1, in the year of King Uzziah's death, I saw the Lord sitting on a throne lofty and exalted with the train of his robe filling the temple. And so, well, how literal is that?

It's a vision. So is it, does it mean that God's literally has a throne he's sitting on? A Mormons would like that because he's got a body of flesh and bones, so he can sit on the throne, but they fail to understand that God is incomprehensible and he fills the heavens. So how can you have a throne he'd sit on? So there's language that is spoken of here to show the majesty and the greatness of who God is and that there is a, some sort of sitting on a throne representation of his greatness. And his authority and his Kingship. And that's what is represented by that. That's all that's going on. So to ask, does the Holy Spirit have a throne is the wrong question.

It means he doesn't understand biblical theology. Okay. Okay.

All right. Sounds good. Okay. Sounds good.

Thank you, Matt. Okay. All right.

Sounds good. Okay. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Bless what? Okay.

All right. Now let's get to, let's see, David from California. Dave, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Matt. You're talking to somebody about the new creation and end time stuff.

So I thought I'd call in on this question. Have you ever heard of the theory about how in Revelation, when it talks about no nation stood with Israel at the end was an indirect reference to America because America had fallen and that's why there was no allies for Israel? Yeah, I've heard different theories like this. America's fallen or what could happen is the leftist whack-a-moron people take over through deception and lies as the left, that's how it works. And then our nation becomes so pagan that it turns against Israel. And you see the left, they're already hating Israel. So maybe that's what's going to happen.

It looks like it. In Zechariah, it talks about it. In Zechariah 14, where God says, so gather all the nations against Jerusalem to battle. But how literal is that to be understood eschatologically or is it later, I mean earlier? So that there is a train of thought within Christian theology in some end times views that all the nations have been gathered against Israel and that would include America.

And so that would mean America would have to go apostate. Yep. Okay. I just thought I'd ask about that and that was it. Yeah, in Revelation 20, it says when the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released and gather the nations against Israel. So there's that. And so nations were gathered in Revelation 19 also.

So I don't know what to tell you. It does look like it's going to get bad. And we're having a reprieve right now with Trump in office. So that's because a lot of Christians have prayed, but the enemy is going to work hard. And like I say, I wrote an article last year, which political party, American political party, would the anti-Christ belong to and it's definitely, the democratic party is certainly a candidate for that one, unless he creates his own. Because it's such a, I think, yeah, I have no respect for the left. I'm telling you. I think it's taken to a terrorist organization.

They work hard at undermining our country, destroying it from the inside. Anyway, so who knows what's going to happen with the Israelites in America? Okay. Okay. Well, that was it.

Bet you got them with somebody else. That's okay. Thanks a lot, buddy. Appreciate it. All right. Thank you. Okay.

All right. Anthony from Kansas. Welcome Anthony. You're on the air. How are you doing, Matt? Doing all right. Doing all right. Hanging in there.

Yeah. I didn't think I'd get through, you know, but, um, I saw you live on YouTube, so I give it a try. Anyway, my question is, uh, should a Christian listen to secular music? I heard some person say, no, no secular music, you know, and blah, blah, blah. But, um, I've been a, maybe you should hate rock and roll. I don't hate rock and roll.

That's the truth. There's some songs. There's some songs. I don't care.

There's some rock and roll songs I don't care to listen to, but I don't, I don't hate rock and roll. Am I supposed to, um, no, uh, the things that are ungodly, you're supposed to dislike. All right. Yeah. Uh, right.

So Paul the apostle, what he did was he quoted Epimenides, Menander, Erastus, pagan philosophers, which meant he was reading them. Now we need to be careful what kind of music we listen to. Uh, we can't just have any old thing, but you know, it's like I was cleaning up yesterday and I was listening to Smashing Pumpkins, you know, I like Smashing Pumpkins, you know, so it's no big deal. Uh, you know, so whatever, it's, I don't, you know, it's, oh, whatever. Okay.

All right. If you listen to it, just don't let it be your, just don't let it take you over, that's all. Yeah. Um, what about when they say rock and roll is the devil's music? Well, which part of rock and roll?

You know, um, for example, uh, Stryper back in the eighties and nineties, uh, Stryper was a heavy metal band and they were Christian. Yeah. I remember that.

Now what do you do? I was in Christian media at the time. It was so controversial at the time.

I was in Christian media. Well, yeah, I know. And, uh, you know, it was stupid that people say, oh, they can't do that. Yes, yes they can. You know, I guess they can. They can just be all things to all people yet without sin. And there's nothing inherently wrong about a bass chord or something like that. Uh, you know, or the beat, it's just people who, you know, I'd say, just show it to me in scripture, you know, show it to me in scripture, but we have to be careful.

We need to focus on those things that are good and holy. So there's a band called Undercover. You ever heard of them? Yeah, they were, I think that's a long, long time ago. Yes it is. Yeah. A long time.

Or 3D, there's another one. And, uh, back in the day, you know, Undercover, um, the lead singer used to go to my church back in Southern California. And, uh, you know, he was a good guy, you know, and now he's a pastor, he's still around.

So, uh, you know, whatever. They were good rock and roll bands, they were kind of like a punk new wave. They were great. They're all over Southern California.

They travel all over the world. So I don't have any problem with that kind of thing. I don't have any problem with it. So there are, there's some pretty good rock out there too, you know. Okay. Well, I used to think that when I became a Christian, no second music, but I, I pretty much deconstructed from that. I just kind of say, it depends on the song, you know? Yes. That's what I would say.

It just depends. I'm not going to listen to some stuff that's ungodly, I don't want to hear it. But sometimes, you know, um, sometimes it's just good stuff, sometimes it's just good stuff out there and I listen to it, I go, that's good. Like Starluff.

I like Starluff from Smashing Pumpkins, it's mellow, mellow rock. And what about reggae? Can we listen to reggae? You know? Yeah. I have some reggae.

I have some Bob Marley. Have you ever heard of a stick figure? Try stick figure.

No, I haven't heard of a stick figure. Yeah, a bunch of white guys and they do reggae and they're awesome. I'm middle-aged, Madam, 65, okay, so I'm looking at the stuff from the 70s, you're middle-aged too. Yeah, I'm up there. Oh yeah. Zeppelin and Sabbath and Deep Pearl back in the day, Fog Hat.

Mostly 70s, 70s, 80s, mostly, you know. Mm-hmm. Uh-huh. Oh yeah. Okay, well.

I guess. You know, we are free as Christians, but we need to use our freedom with wisdom, that's all. We're free.

But if these things start controlling us and influencing us negatively, then we need to get rid of it. So that's all. Okay. Okay, Matt.

Well, thanks a lot for your insight. All right, man. God bless.

You too. Bye-bye. All right.

Okay. Now, I know a lot of people out there may not like what I just said, but hey, that's it. I know that there's people who only listen to Christian music, praise God. My wife listens to a lot more Christian music than I do, and she likes salsa and stuff from Latin America. She likes a lot of that kind of stuff.

There's some good stuff. And what, you're not supposed to do that? So I don't believe that. James Taylor's claiming to be an atheist now? Well, you know, God's gifted people with different abilities and what they do and how they use it for God is up to them. They should, and they'll face their judgment. But just as we can eat meat sacrificed to idols, as long as it doesn't stumble ourselves or others, then we're free. Christhead is free, not for bondage. We don't want to be bound by all these sanctification laws that our churches are giving us. We have to obey whatever the church says in order to be saved.

That's not how it works. But don't use our freedom as an excuse to sin, and we need to use our freedom wisely. But partake in the things that are godly out of Ephesians 4, 6, 7, and 8. That's what you should say. Whatever's good, let your mind dwell on those things. All right? Okay.

There's the music. I've got to go. I've got to go. And by His grace, we'll be back on there tomorrow. We'll talk to you then. So have a good one, everybody. God bless. We'll see you next time.