Don’t Leave Your Spouse Out of the Money Conversation with Shaunti Feldhahn

We chase money thinking it'll bring security. We seek success hoping it'll satisfy. But Ecclesiastes exposes the truth. Wealth alone never delivers. Lasting contentment isn't found in what we own, but in a personal relationship with wisdom himself.

Jesus. FaithFi study wisdom over wealth will help you break free from empty pursuits and discover what truly lasts. Purchase your copy today or place a bulk order at faithfy.com/slash shop. What if being great with money doesn't guarantee you're doing great with your spouse? Hi, I'm Rob West.

If you're the money person in your marriage, you may think you're doing everything right, but what if your spouse feels shut out of the process? It happens more than you think. Shanti Feldhan joins us today to talk about how you can avoid that disconnect or fix it if need be. And then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7,000.

This is Faith in Finance: biblical wisdom for your financial journey.

Well, it's always a joy to welcome back relationship expert and researcher Shanti Feldhan. She's the best-selling author of numerous books on marriage and relationships, including Thriving in Love and Money, co-authored with her husband, Jeff. Shanti, great to have you back on the program. It's always great to be with you. We look forward to it.

And boy, this is a topic that I'm excited about covering because I think it happens much more often than we might imagine. As you well know, you have a new article in our Faithful Steward magazine. It's titled A Penny for Your Thoughts. If you are money-minded, don't silence your spouse.

So let's begin with that. What's the key takeaway, Shanti, you hope readers remember after reading this?

Well, here's the main thing is that I think that a lot of money people, who sort of by definition is anybody listening to your program, that they don't realize how often they might be signaling to their spouse this message that, you know, I'm kind of right, you're kind of necessarily wrong, and your opinions may not matter. And we spend a lot of time and we spend a lot of energy trying to, you know, figure out what the sort of the financial plan is and all that kind of stuff, which is fantastic. But what happens to your marriage if one person doesn't feel like what they value is honored? Yes.

Well, there's no question about it. And I know the issue of honoring what each person values is so key. And that was a big realization, obviously, in the work you did for thriving in love and money. What did you and Jeff discover about how spouses perceive each other's financial judgment in marriage?

Well, it was actually really interesting to notice that we asked it multiple different ways on the survey, and it always came out to being about two-thirds of people kind of thought their way was right. Interesting. And that they knew more than what their spouse did about, okay, I know more about how to manage for our well-being and maybe the long-term well-being rather than the short-term. And so, what that means is kind of like the we're all above average drivers, we all have that kind of that mindset. And that's fine, again, like everybody has their opinion.

But here's the problem is that where the money person, again, probably the person listening to this. Where the money person feels like, well, of course we need to handle things this way. The person who may be less interested in listening to the money radio programs or reading the money books, they may feel completely that their opinion is dismissed. Yes.

And that is just not good for the long term. And I honestly don't think, based again on the statistics, that most money people realize they're even doing that. Yeah.

Now we can acknowledge this radio show is the exception. Everybody wants to listen to it, but most financial shows. Yeah, just absolutely. Yes, absolutely.

Now, this can lead, of course, to tension. And really, Shanti, it comes down to this or that, right?

So the vacation or the college fund. And depending on what you value and how you've, you know, grown up and what your environment was and your temperament, that can lead to valuing different things for one spouse versus the other, right? Oh, of course. And this is one of the things that we found was depending on the survey question, depending on how we asked it, this happened in more than 80% of couples where you just value different things and you don't realize that you're thinking, for example, well, of course, it's just awesome. Obvious that we need to save for, for example, our kids' college fund, or maybe it's the grandkids' college fund.

Where the other spouse is thinking, of course, it's just obvious that now is the time while they're young to go to Disney World and enjoy it while they're young. And that neither is wrong or right. You're just different. Yeah, that's exactly right. And if you're not careful, this can spill out in the marriage well beyond the finances.

So, what's the solution?

Well, we'll give you some steps to be more intentional about involving each other in financial decisions. With us today, Shanti Feldhahn, author of Thriving in Love and Money. Back with much more after this. Don't go anywhere. We're grateful for support from Movement Mortgage, who provides residential home loans in all 50 states.

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So, are you the money person in your marriage? Do you think you're getting everything right? But perhaps your spouse feels shut out of the process.

Well, we've got help for you today. Shanti Feldhan is here. She's a regular contributor on the program. She's the author with her husband Jeff of Thriving in Love and Money, an incredible book. It's a must-read on money and marriage.

It can be a game changer in your life. She's also the author of the article in our recent edition of Faithful Stewart, our magazine, of a penny for your thoughts. If you're money-minded, don't silence your spouse. And if you want to receive four issues of Faithful Stewart each year, plus our new studies and devotionals, become a FaithFi partner when you go to faith5.com. Just click give at the top of the page.

Well, Shanti, before the break, we were talking about how so often that spouse that is not money-inclined don't get excited about the The spending plan, and they don't necessarily like paying the bills, but that doesn't mean they don't have things that they value. We all do, but they may be different, and perhaps we're unintentionally communicating or practically leaving one spouse out completely of the conversation. And that can go beyond even the finances, can't it?

Well, it often does go beyond the finances because, I mean, think about it. How would you feel if you felt like your spouse just completely didn't? care about what You're trying to say. You know, what is it that is the most dangerous here? Is it the risk to the budget?

or the risk to the marriage. And I think that that's what a lot of folks on all sides of this equation, by the way. I'm not just trying to hammer the money people out there. Sure. But I think that's a lot of what people don't recognize.

We ended up doing a pretty extensive analysis of. what some of the biggest risks were in these situations. And it we found out that the biggest thing by far that can cause issues is resentment. Hmm. And that if one spouse starts to feel one spouse, okay, not necessarily both, it can happen if just one spouse feels this way.

If one spouse starts to feel resentment and starts to feel like you just seem to think that your way is the only way and that therefore my way doesn't matter, that starts this domino effect of all these other issues that never had to happen. And so that's what I'm trying to sound the alarm about is just for people to be aware of the need to listen to things that maybe they didn't think kind of subconsciously, maybe weren't, they didn't think they were worth listening to because, well, my spouse isn't a money person and I'm the planner and so they need to listen to me. Treat that very carefully. Yeah.

Now, Shanti, one thing, and this won't be a surprise to you. I know you've heard it yourself, but we hear a lot from the certified kingdom advisors is this can happen in your advisor's office where your advisor is talking to one spouse and not the other, right? Yes.

And that was actually an example that we heard because, as you, I think, know, we ended up doing some conversations at one of the Kingdom Advisors conference and doing some interviews. And when I was speaking there, one or two of the times I was speaking there. And that was something that we heard frequently from the kingdom advisors was that there is a tendency that they have to fight. To talk to both the spouses. And frankly, many of them said to get both the spouses in the room.

Because often, you know, one will say, well, I'll just let the money person, they'll just go, which is fine sometimes, right? Nothing wrong with that. And yet, that means by definition, if you're not touching base with both of them purposefully, you are only hearing what one person values. And over time, again, may not be a big deal, you know, in the short term, but over time, you know, that analogy of a 2% degree off in a plane that's flying leads to a different continent. That could cause an issue.

The vector principle. That is a powerful idea. All right, well, let's help our listeners break through then today, Shanti.

So, for couples who want to be more intentional about involving each other in financial decisions, what advice do you have?

Okay, so in the article that you've mentioned a couple times, I suggest three steps. There's many different ways you could do this, but this is sort of an easy way. The first one is to sit down at some non-emotional time, and you know, you're having coffee in the morning, say, and say, okay. On a scale of one to five. How heard and how valued do you feel?

In our financial decisions.

So, whoever the money person is that's listening to this, ask your spouse that, and then, you know, trade off and ask each other, right? And here is the key, this is step two that comes from it. If You hear anything less than a five. Like if your spouse says, well, kind of a three, like take that as. Honestly, a bit of a red flashing warning light.

Like, that's something that it should be a five. Like, every person, every marriage, whether everybody agrees with one another, everyone should say, you know what? I know we don't always have the same opinions, but yeah, I totally feel heard. I feel like what I care about is incorporated. If it's not, then you need to have a really honest conversation about why that is.

Yeah, that is so good because that opens up the conversation and that's obviously the key to making progress.

Now, I know there's a particular chapter in Thriving in Love and Money that could be really helpful here as we try to uncover each other's money values, right? Yes, and that is actually step three that I mentioned in the article, because it's the chapter that we put together based on seeing all these different types. of money values.

Now that might sound funny. But there are a bunch of different ways that people view money. And it could be like you value, I mean, this is silly, but do you value things versus experiences? Like you think, you know, it makes perfect sense to spend $1,000 on the big, you know, beautiful monitors that you use for your computer, but $1,000 for a weekend away, yeah, you know, you might think that that's wasted money.

So everybody has these different kinds of perceptions. Of money values. And so, what we did in chapter three of Thriving in Love and Money was we actually outlined what all of those are so that you can read it together. The whole point behind the way that we designed the book was so that you could read it together. And even sometimes people read it out loud to each other and take notes, or maybe if it's uncomfortable to do that, read it separately and write notes on what you value in the margin.

So that when your spouse reads what you've said, you so you when you read what each other have said, you're actually reading a personalized copy. You're saying, Oh my goodness, yes, you know, I value time over money. Like, I will spend, this is a personal example. What Jeff and I found out when we started doing, we actually did this was that I totally value the ability to pay for like a movie ticket ahead of time, even though it adds $1.50 to each ticket to, you know, for the convenience. fee so I don't have to get to the theater.

you know, half an hour early. To get a good seat. Like, that is completely, of course, I'm going to do that. Where Jeff is like, are you kidding? Get there half an hour early.

Yeah, exactly. And we would never have figured that out. If we hadn't actually gone through that process, oh, Shanti, this is so good. And we've just scratched the surface.

So, folks, pick up a copy of her book. It can be a game changer in your relationship. It's called Thriving in Love and Money: Five Game Changing Insights About Your Relationship, Your Money, and Yourself. You can also check out Shanti's article in Faithful Steward, Faith Phi's new quarterly magazine, designed to help you connect your faith with your finances for the glory of God. Just go to faithfi.com and click give.

We'll be back with your questions after this: 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7,000. I'm Rob West, and this is Faith and Finance. We'll be right back. Managing money doesn't have to feel overwhelming.

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Let's head to, we'll see. Tom is in Maryland waiting patiently. Go ahead, Tom.

Well, Rob, your expertise overwhelms me, but a couple weeks ago, you talked to a gentleman.

Sounds like he and I are in the same boat. Uh he was a ve he's a veteran and pulling in $1,800 a month. I'm a veteran pulling in $1,900 a month. without getting into a bunch of weeds. Negligence on my part, I ended up paying a penalty on my Social Security premium.

A question is, can I is there any way that this penalty can be weighed because of hardship? Yeah, so you're talking about the premium related to Medicare Part B, is that right? Right. And why did you have that? Was that because you enrolled late or something else?

Exactly.

Okay. Yeah.

So, yeah, I mean, with when with regard to that late enrollment penalty, there are some cases where that can be waived, but it really depends on the situation. You know, essentially, if you enrolled late because of incorrect advice from a federal government source, you can request a waiver called equitable relief. It could be reduced or waived if there was a delay due to unusual circumstances like an illness or a family member's death or kind of a local disaster or something like that. But you would need to provide a written explanation. Apart from that, you know, there's not a whole lot you can do about it that I'm aware of, just because, you know, they give you that window of time to get in.

And if you don't, they assess the penalty and there's boy a lot of people paying it, unfortunately, which is why we try to make as many people aware of that window as possible. But it does take a pretty significant extenuating circumstance that you would need to document. and request the waiver to see if they would approve it.

Okay. Gotcha. Thank you much, Rob. All right, sir. God bless you, and we appreciate your kind remarks about the program.

Call anytime to Wisconsin. Hi, Joanne. How can I help?

Okay, we have some stock that we want to sell. but we want it to go to a charity So we don't have to pay taxes. And we're just wondering how to do that. Yeah, it's a great question, Joanne. And I love that you're thinking about this now before you sell those stocks because there is a way to do that.

And it involves using, well, there's two ways. One is you could transfer the stock directly to the charity, and then they would sell it, and then they'd be able to take the full amount. The other is to put it into what's called a donor-advised fund. And this is basically like a charitable checking account. You could open it with a donor-advised fund sponsor.

I'd recommend the National Christian Foundation. It's very easy to do. You can do it over the phone or over the internet if you're comfortable with that. And basically, once you open the account, which would just take five or six minutes, then you would essentially get the instructions on how you transfer the stock from your brokerage firm to your donor-advised fund at the National Christian Foundation. When it arrived there, it could be sold.

And then by selling it after you've given it to your donor advised fund, you don't generate any capital gains. And then you could decide which charities or ministries you wanted to gift it out to at that point. And that could be done again over the phone or the internet.

So that's one way to do it. The other is just to give it directly to the ministry or charity. And if you did that, you just want to call them first and let them know that that's what you intend to do. They could give you the instructions on the account that they have to receive those stocks. And by doing that before the sale, you would get the deduction equivalent to the full value of the appreciated stock.

And the charity or ministry could then sell it at the market price once they receive it. And they'd have the full amount to use for their purposes. And there's no tax paid, which I think was your objective. Does that make sense?

Well, sort of. We do have a buyer. We have somebody that who knows that wants to buy it.

Okay, so that helped me with that a little bit. When you say, so you have a stock, like a security and a stock that's publicly traded, is that right? Oh, it's a telephone company.

Okay. And is that inside a brokerage account, sir, right now? No You have the certificates? Mm-hmm.

Okay. Yeah.

So what I would typically do is open a brokerage account like at a Fidelity or a Charles Schwab where there's very little fees, if any. And then you could mail through the certified mail the stock certificates to Fidelity or Schwab to be deposited in your account. That would probably be a joint account with you and your wife. And once those... the stock was then appears in the account, then you could gift it to the charity or ministry because am I correct?

And that's what you want to do? You want to give the stock away before you sell it?

Okay. Yeah.

And so that would make it a little simpler. I mean, you could call them and see if you could mail them the certificate. They're probably not going to want it that way. They're probably going to want you to open a brokerage account at Schwab or Fidelity, mail it in, get it deposited, and then you would call the charity and they would give you the instructions on what you need to give to Fidelity or Schwab to transfer the shares of stock to the charity so that they can sell it. And by doing it that way, nobody generates any tax because you're gifting the full amount of the value of the stock.

They're selling it after they receive it. Therefore, they don't pay any capital gains. You don't either. And you get the tax deduction on the full value of the marketable securities, in this case, the telephone company, upon the transfer.

Okay, sounds good. All right. Listen, if you need further help with this, don't hesitate to reach back out to us. It sounds complicated. There's a few steps involved, but it shouldn't be that difficult.

Are you comfortable operating on the Internet? Not very.

Okay, and that's fine. What I'd probably do, okay, no problem.

So, what I would do, Joanne, is I'd probably look up the local Charles Schwab office there in Wisconsin, and I'd go in there and I'd tell them exactly what you want to do. Listen, I want to open a brokerage account in the name of me and my husband, and I want it's for the sole purpose of depositing these shares of stock. Here's the certificates, and I want you to open the account, deposit the shares, and then I'm going to give you instructions from my favorite charity or ministry or my church on where I need you to transfer this. uh after I deposit it. and they'll take care of it for you.

Okay. Thank you very much. You're very welcome, sir. God bless you both. And thank you for being on the program today.

I hope that was helpful. What a delight. They're wanting to give generously. And I love that they're thinking about doing it in a tax-efficient manner. Folks, that's going to do it for us.

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