Mike Zwick and Jesse Klaffae

Hello, this is Will Hardy with ManTalk Radio. We are all about breaking down the walls of race and denomination. Your chosen Truth Network Podcast is starting in just a few minutes. Enjoy it, share it, but most of all, thank you for listening to the Truth Podcast Network. Kingdom Pursuits, where you hear from ordinary people instilled with an extraordinary passion. Together, we explore the stories of men and women who take what they love and let God turn their passion into Kingdom Pursuits.

Now, live from the Truth Booth, your host, Robbie Dilmore. Well, we are on top of the world today on Kingdom Pursuits because we have got some roofers with us. So yeah, we've got my friend Jesse Clafey actually back with Smith Rock Roofing, one of our wonderful sponsors here on the Truth Network. And Smith Rock Roofing, you guys have been doing that for a while.

So tell us a little bit about Smith Rock Roofing, just for those people who aren't familiar with it. Well, yeah, we're a local company here out of Winston-Salem. And all the guys that work for this company have been here. And we know a lot of people locally.

That's probably one reason why we're still around. It's because almost all of our business is referral-based and repeat business. So we're not a fly-by-night company. So when it says roofing, like you do shingles? Yeah, we do your typical asphalt roofing, asphalt shingles, and then also metal as well.

We also do siding, roofing, gutters, windows, that kind of thing. So we have a pretty broad spectrum of experience. I want to give our listeners that background.

But then to know Jesse is to know a wonderful disciple of God and to see why their heart was to support the Truth Network. And we're going to get into a lot of that today. So it's going to be a very fun show, because I love people that take their faith out into the market.

How does that play out? For many years, you may know I was a car dealer. And so that's the whole idea of the Christian car guy, which is an oxymoron.

Of course, how could that be going on? But anyway, speaking of oxymorons, we have the other one here, the insurance salesman that also is a Christian. You might know if you listen to the Truth Network a lot is that the show If Not For God is hosted by Mike Zwick. What you may not know about Mike is he's a life insurance salesman, okay?

Yeah. And thank God, we have some sponsors who are some of the insurance companies that I represent, like Liberty Bankers and PRCUA, the Polish Roman Catholic Union of America. And they help us to stay on the air.

And we're grateful for them. But it's interesting that people think that when you're out there doing your job, that you just, okay, I just do my job, and then I leave everything else out of it. But you can take the gospel to wherever you are. And so I'm in a unique situation where I'm able to go to people's homes, and I sit down with them, and I talk business with them and insurance, but I'm also able to pray for them and ask them, do you need prayer and then share the gospel?

Right. So you can see this is gonna be a cool show, you're gonna get to see a side of Mike you may not usually get to see on, if not for God. But also you're gonna get to see a side of Jesse you don't normally get to see on your roof. So speaking of roofs, right? Speaking of roofs, yeah.

I just don't feel the same as my music's behind me. So we're, you know, Jesse's boss is Jordan Smith. I don't know if you knew that. But if we're dedicating this show to Jordan, the roofer. So Jordan, if you're up there. Come on, Sean. It's a little bit funny. Jordan, if you're up there, right?

Sean doesn't know what to do. Smith Rock Roofing, you know, they're having a great promotion, too. We wanted to talk about that today. You know, right now, if you buy a roof, Mike, it's on the house. Such a deal, right, Sean? That was a good one. Yeah, I bet you.

And John will tell you the most expensive, you know, or Jesse or Jordan, any of those people will tell you the most expensive part of building a roof. Have you thought about that, Sean? No, I'm so bad at this. No. I feel like I'm, like, 0 for something. It's coming together.

Jesse, you got any ideas? No, no. Enlighten me, please. The most expensive part of, you know, building a roof?

It's the overhead. It'll kill you. So you knew at the end of that, you know, torture that I would put you through. I do actually have a riddle, a Bible riddle.

So we got that for you today. Which town in the Bible did they raise the roof? Where was the town that they raised the roof? 866-348-7884 is the number to call if you know what town in the Bible they raised the roof. And if they can do that, Sean, tell them what they'll win. All right, whoever can answer that question correctly will win a t-shirt, I believe, or any prize that we have from the Christian card guy in Kingdom Pursuit's treasure vault.

We have loads of books, t-shirts, all sorts of stuff. You tell Sean what you want, and all you got to do is call us and tell us which town. It could be a city, you know, and it might even have been a village, okay?

I'm okay with any of those. In the Bible, where they raised the roof. Pretty famous story, I would think. Raised the roof. And I would imagine that Jesse, you'd just kind of cringe when you ever read that story. I don't know if insurance would have covered that.

866-348-7884. So again, to me, you know, it's kind of a neat thing, just being a disciple. And if anybody ever asked me, you know, Robbie, how did you end up with a radio show on a Christian? I mean, you are, after all, a car salesman.

Right, right. Which I'm not anymore, and I'm full-time in radio. But I, you know, made my living for 40 years selling cars. And all that really happened was the really happened was I kept falling more in love with God. And I kept reading the Bible. And every single morning as I read the Bible, as I was just, like, intrigued and thought this was absolutely beautiful stuff, I would read something and I would go, man, that is just too cool. That is just unbelievable.

I had no idea about that. So I would walk into work and grab up the first person that I saw, and have you seen this in the Bible? And, you know, then they were like, Robbie, you know, you ought to do a Bible study. So we started a Bible study at the dealership. Yeah. Got in a lot of trouble for that, got fired. I did. Started my own dealership where we had a Bible study.

Still got in more trouble. Yep, yep, yep. But nonetheless, all I ever seemed to do was just find something I thought was really, really cool. And then just tell what I saw or what God did in my life, you know, and that is how it goes. And so a lot of times you are on the roof with your buddies, Jesse. It works like that. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Well, and, you know, I do not know. I see little things. Like, take, for instance, our contract. I brought one of our contracts. Oh, did you? I will hand it over here so you can see it.

I will give you one too, Mike. But, you know, on our contracts, and I see little things like this. It is so crazy. You know, on the contract, you know, if we do your roof, Robbie, you pay us a little bit of money up front, and then we do your roof as it is specified on the contract, and then you pay us the rest, right? And it is all contingent on performance. You do what you are supposed to do, and then I do what I am supposed to do. You know, and that is a contract business relationship. And, you know, I realized one day, looking at these contracts with a customer, I realized I am approaching God like it is a contract, and I feel so bad when I do not uphold what I am supposed to do.

If I get mad at my kids or if I, you know, miss my reading or my Bible time or something, I feel so bad. And I realized reading through the Old Testament, and I also heard a sermon on this, which was fantastic, but God wants a covenant. It is a covenant relationship that God wants with me, not a contract. And he fulfilled it. He came. He came to earth, and Jesus lived the perfect life. He knew that I could not fulfill my end of the covenant, and he fulfilled that. He lived that perfect life. He did my part for me, and then he died on the cross.

He took the curse for me not upholding my end of the covenant relationship that he wants with me, and it just showed me to what extent God did everything. He did everything, and out of that… Darrell Bock And he did it for Mike, too, which is what's really surprising. Mike L We got Scott is calling with his answer to what town in the Bible they raised the roof. We could use your call, 866-348-7884. We got so much more. We're Raising the Roof today on a Kingdom Pursuit stage. Announcer You're listening to the Truth Network and truthnetwork.com Darrell Bock Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion and uses it to build the kingdom, whether that's roofing today or life insurance.

We've got Jordan Smith and Mike Zwick. Again, Jordan Smith rock roofing here in Winston-Salem. Mike Zwick's radio show, which I get to co-host with him often, is called If Not For God. It comes on Saturday mornings, and we sure enjoy having Mike, but when we left our heroes, we talked about roofing.

We talked about life insurance. Well, I guess we should get to this caller, because we've got Scott in Winston-Salem, and he thinks he knows which town in the Bible that raised the roof. What do you think, Scott? Scott I believe it's Capernaum, isn't it, Robbie? Darrell Bock Yeah.

You're exactly right. Do you think it was a village? Scott I think Capernaum was a little bigger than a village.

Darrell Bock I don't know. The interesting thing, there's a lot of interesting facts about Capernaum, okay, that one of the things that you may not have known is it was named after Nahum. You hear the Nahum in the Capernaum, right? The prophet Nahum, right?

So you can make that connection to Capernaum. And then Mary Magdalene, she was a native, and actually a very wealthy, and she gave all sorts of money to help support Jesus. And later on, she, from what I understood, helped financially to send out the apostles into the different countries. And so there's a stone called the Magdalena Stone that is really quite marvelous. If you Google that, yeah, and it's actually the Magdalena Stone, which has to do with Mary Magdalene, but because of the town that it's in, Magdalena is right there next to Capernaum. And that stone shows an imprint of what the original temple veil looked like. And it will literally blow your mind, you know, because to them, that was a really, really holy deal.

So they had, this was, what they have is the earliest rendition of what that veil looked like that got ripped in two the day that Jesus was raised from the dead. So you learned all that stuff just from them raising the roof, right? Now, the fact that they lowered him, there's two main reasons for that, right? Yeah. Like, first of all, he was a big, big, big, big overweight guy, wasn't he? And number two, there was the crowds that couldn't get through the door, right? Right.

So I think, you know, it would have been such an obstacle to even attempt to roll him in. I love the whole story. I actually, I wrote a whole four episodes of Christian Carguy Theater were called Nahum's Matt. Okay, and the reason why I called it Nahum's, so I named the main character, it's lowered on the Matt Nahum because that was the problem, you know, that's where the city of Capernaum came. So if you go back to the archives of Christian Carguy Theater, Scott, at the podcast, you can listen to Nahum's Matt, and there's four episodes that give all my suppositions on why they lowered the guy and it's really fun stuff.

But thank you, Scott. Wow, what's it called again? I would love to look that up. It's Christian Carguy Theater, it's on my podcast, and it's called Nahum's Matt. Nahum's. Okay.

Because they lowered the guy on a mat. So there you go. Thank you.

Wow. God bless. You're quite welcome. Great show, by the way. Awesome show today. Oh, and I so appreciate what you do.

Christian Carguy was great too. Very important. Thank you, Scott. God bless. God bless.

Have a wonderful weekend. So when we left our heroes, Mike and Jesse, we were talking about contracts and covenants. Okay. All right.

So we got to hear from Jesse, which was absolutely beautiful, and the fact that, you know, we think we're in a contract, but God thinks we're in a covenant. Right. Yeah. And so what's your take on that, Mr. Zwickip? I refer to Mike as the Zwickopedia. The Zwickopedia. Oh, man. That's a...

If you're looking for some Bible verses, like, man, the guy's a Zwickopedia, you don't have to go to... That's a good one. Yeah. You know, what's interesting is that, you know, I've had the show, If Not For God with Mike Zwick, and it's been, gosh, man, it'll be two years in January. I mean, it's flown by. But, you know, it's interesting. I've had so many people, and I've had people before, and they said, Mike, I really like your show, but I really like that Robbie Dilmore guy. You know, so it really should be If Not For God with Mike Zwick and Robbie Dilmore, because, Robbie, you've been a huge, huge part of the show. And, you know, one of the things that I've learned from the show, and I've really gotten this from you, Robbie, is just how important it is to spend time with God. And we were actually just recently talking about this in the book of Revelation Chapter 2. He says for us not to leave our first love. And we've talked about that. And I think what the, and maybe that's our contract with God, is not to leave our first love.

That's one of them. But, you know, I know, Robbie, that you spend so much time with Jesus. You wake up at 4, 4.30 every morning and spend time with Jesus in prayer. And it's interesting because we can do these radio shows. We can do these podcasts. We can go out and preach to people. We can go out and we can feed the poor and do all these other things. But if we're not spending quality time with God, and we were just talking about marriage in our last podcast, which aired today, and we said we can do all these other things, but if we're not spending quality time with our spouse, then we're really missing out. And we can do all of these works for the Lord.

But if we're not spending quality time by reading our Bible, and praying, and spending time with the Holy Spirit, and spending time with Jesus, I really think that we're missing out. And, Robbie, you're really good at that. You do that every morning, right? Well, I love the word covenant. I just do. And it's a beautiful point because... And I was so honored, honestly, to be able to do a lot of different interviews with different people. I wrote...

I've interviewed a man a couple, three times, wrote whole books on the subject. And what he describes in a covenant is it changes your identity, that if you're married, right, then you're no longer Robbie, you're now Tammy's husband. And that's part of that covenant, so to speak. So if you're in a covenant with God, you're no longer Robbie, right? You're now the bride of Christ. Yep.

And that changes things. And in Hebrew, the word is brit. And you might have heard the name bris, like if you're getting circumcised, they're similar in that something's getting cut here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And they used to say, we're gonna cut you a deal, you know, on the carpet, I'm gonna cut you a deal. Cut you a deal, man.

I'm gonna cut you a deal. Well, you know, this has to do with... Your actual DNA is changing, okay? Because it's like blood brothers. Even when you're a kid, right? And you wanted to be really close to somebody, you became blood brothers, because you wanted them to be part of you and you part of them, and wanting to change your identity. And so to me, it's not a matter of...

I'd hate for anybody to think, well, Robbie, I'm gonna do like you and get up every morning at 4.30 and spend... I don't want that to be on anybody's checklist, you know? What I want is for them to go, what is God calling me?

Right? These were things that were pretty specific. God asked me to do certain things, and I was just being obedient. And then he's blessed them along the way in so many different ways. But one thing's for certain, Mike, that the more I study it, the more I realize the Word is God and God is the Word, okay? So when you open up that book, you're literally opening Jesus's mouth and letting him speak to you. Yes. It couldn't be more literal.

And the more you do that, the more you change the story that you're telling yourself. Okay. It's fascinating, and the word weak in Hebrew has to do with listening to yourself. Yes. Yes. And your little soul is... In one of the Psalms, David says, how long will I take counsel in my soul?

Having sorrows daily because he's not hearing from God. Well, as you read your word, you're changing the story that you're telling yourself. Yes. And as you get excited about things like that contract, right? You heard that story, or you get excited about revelations like leaving your first love. Right.

Your story of what's going on in your mind as you begin to talk about how you said you're to meditate them on them day and night and put them on the door in your house and all that stuff. Yeah. Well, if you take all that stuff literally, you're going into a contract. Yeah. Yeah.

And in order for me to be good, I gotta have a mezuzah on my door. Yeah. Right. Well, that's not your soul.

That's not your heart. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So, and I see that it's a beautiful thing. Mike, what do you just turn 40?

Yes. And I just turned 40 this past week, and I don't feel 40. We actually have friends of ours, Tiger and Elena, and they came over for my birthday party. And I think Elena's six months older than me. And she said, Mike, she said, my daughter came to me today. And she said, we're going to Mike's party. And Elena said, yeah, Mike is 40. And she said, mama, Mike doesn't look 40, but you do. Well, the point is, is that I don't know about you, but I'm phenomenally encouraged that there's a disciple like Mike.

I mean, you talk about somebody who hungers for God's word is Mike. And then Jesse, how old are you? 32. 32. His kids are older than my kids. Well, nonetheless, if you know Jesse, which this is the second time that I've had him on the radio, but we actually attended the same church at some point in time.

And but I mean, how encouraged are you that there were God's sending people out all the time and they just fell in love with him and then he keeps growing them. And there's not real a magic formula anywhere other than love somewhere in there, right? Right. Right.

All right. So we got Mike Zwick and Smith Rock roofing, if not for God and Jesse Clafey. We're going to get all this stuff back when we come back. And welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion and uses it to build the kingdom.

We're so blessed, really, we are today to have with us Jesse Clafey. He's with Smith Rock roofing roofers here in Winston-Salem, big supporters of the Truth Network. We're so thankful for all of them, as well as Mike Zwick, also a big supporter of the Truth Network through his sponsors and his radio show, if not for God. And those are the PRCUL, it's the public.

PRCUL, Polish Roman Catholic Union of America and Liberty Bankers. And we've had several others as well. We've had Todd Harris and Angela Pierce and Hal Cooper, my mom, she's been a sponsor.

And I'm sure there's others. My mom was my sponsor in the early days. In the early days, she helped out too, man, big time.

So thanks, mom. So speaking of moms, we have Amy Cabo, who's with The Cure. And that's another radio show we've got coming on today at one o'clock.

It's live. And Amy and Boris, if you've never listened to the show, oh my goodness, so much fun with my friends. And so Amy, you really have a very hot topic today, right? A very interesting guest, one of the world's leading authorities in burnout, recovery, and prevention. Michael is a neuro-linguistic programmer, certified, I don't know what that is, but I guess we'll find out. He's also a cognitive behavioral therapist. Interestingly enough, he was twice the top 20 global thought leaders on Culture and Thinker 360.

Seems like a clever guy, but he was also a former health care executive, CIO and CFO, overseeing 2 billion budgets. So he's just about seen it and done it all. So as I said, burnout is a hot topic, I'm just saying. Yes. He certainly knows how to help with that, in that way.

Yeah. And you can call in with your burnout, whatever you got, and Boris is going to be there. It's going to be awesome, right, Amy? It's going to be super exciting.

I've had a lot of people interested in watching the show because so many people are experiencing burnout. There you go. Today at one o'clock on The Truth Network. Thank you, Amy. God bless.

Thank you and God bless you too. Okay. Bye-bye.

All right. Well, also on the phones, we have Sharon is in Burlington, North Carolina. So Sharon Hungerford, right? Hi, Sharon. How are you? Good. How are you, Robbie?

I am so wonderful. Sharon did so much work in Israel in the past. And she's a big supporter of If Not For God with Mike. So Mike, it's kind of cool to have Sharon on because she's been on your show a couple of times.

It is. And actually, we just recorded two shows this week. So she's coming up again soon.

I think you were out sick one day, Robbie. But Sharon is awesome. And she's part of it. Is it Shepherd Staff Ministry, Sharon? Shepherd Staff Ministry.

Shepherd Staff Ministry. Yeah. And you're part of something called Aliyah. Could you tell quickly, briefly about that?

Yes. And we believe that God is calling the Jewish people back to Israel. I believe in fulfillment of assessing the land that's going to open up a whole big topic that God promised Abraham back in the day. But it's basically Jewish immigration. So it sounds kind of like all y'all.

All y'all. God is calling all y'all back to the land. But it's Aliyah? Aliyah, which means in Hebrew to go up because Jerusalem is on Mount Zion. So all the Jews have to go up to Jerusalem to return. And so in the modern Hebrew, it's basically Jewish immigration. It's the return of his people. And there's 64 verses that talks about the people returning back to the land of Israel. And so there's a lot of people from around the world, different agencies, Operation Exodus and Ebeneezer, and just different ministries that are involved in helping the Jews get back to Israel. And Sharon actually, she comes to the Bible study. She's doing a baby shower later on today for us. Mike's Bible study that's in Ebeneezer.

That's most world famous. Oh, funny guy. No, but Sharon was actually introduced. I was introduced to Sharon by a guy named Jeff. And Jeff is here with us as well. Hey, Jeff. Hey, Jeff.

Hey, Sharon. And we've had Jeff on the show several times as well. But I wanted Jeff to tell a quick story, if you don't mind. There was a story about Russia where people were lining up and they were jumping in a lake.

Is that right, Jeff? The soldiers were lining them up. They brought Christians to the river to kill them. And so they told them that if they recanted Christ, that they would bring them out of the river and then they put them in some kind of oven to try to heat their body back up and to save their life. So they cut holes in the ice that was over the river and they had to jump into the river.

And then what the cool thing was, was there was a soldier who was up in a tower whose job was to shoot people if they ran away. So he was watching them all be pushed in or into these holes in the river, these holes in the ice into the river. And he saw crowns come down from heaven over each hole. And then he saw one crown come down part of the way from heaven and then it went right back up. And the guy came up and recanted Christ and they tried to save his life and he died anyway. But the cool thing was the soldier saw that, he put down his rifle, came down from his tower, accepted Jesus and jumped into the hole where the other guy was.

Isn't that an awesome story, Robbie? Oh, it is. It is. And you know, unforgettable obviously that like, wow, we don't want that crown coming down, do we, Jesse?

It's kind of like a roof. We don't want that stuff going back up if it's on its way down. It's kind of in that way, it's sort of a telling story of like, this isn't something that you can let go of. You've got to keep at it, right? Right.

Yeah, exactly. And so with Smith Rock, can you kind of give us an idea of how you see God working there at Smith Rock? Well, we have the opportunity. We've done a lot of roofs for local church members and people in the body of Christ locally. And so that's always, I would say probably the number one thing is just the encouragement we get from working with local Christians.

And that's, for me, that's probably the number one thing for me. Right, because it obviously feeds your family, and you've got how many kids? In our faith. Two, but they're young and hungry. So they had a big breakfast, so not at the moment, but they will be here shortly. But yeah, it feeds our family and it feeds our faith, too, to be working with local Christians. And so really, for those of us who have roofs, like most of us, they have a roof over their head. If you don't, give me a call.

If you don't, give me a call. You know, the average asphalt roof, how long do they usually last? Usually about 25, 30 years. But they're usually about 30 years. 25, 30 years.

Really? If you get the, yeah, they make an architectural shingle, which is a little more, it lasts a little bit longer than the older ones. The older ones were like a three tab, and they're a little thinner.

They didn't last quite as long. But yeah, you can get 25 or 30 years out of an architectural asphalt shingle. So the good news is, let's see, I'm 65. One more roof and I'm done. Just saying, you know, I'm just doing the math quick. We can offer you a lifetime warranty, Robby. I don't know if you thought about that.

Anybody over the age of 65 will give you a lifetime warranty. Bingo. Robby's living to 120, so you know. So we got one more segment coming up. We got Pastor Marty on the phone for Mike, as well as Jordan, excuse me, Jesse with Smith Rock Roofie and Roofing, Mike Zwick with If Not For God. So much more coming up. Stay tuned. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion and uses that to build a kingdom, whether that's roofing, life insurance, radio shows, or sharing the gospel at all.

It all ends up being kind of the same thing for his glory, and how can he be the hero of our stories? So it's really a beautiful thing to share this with my friends that I've had a chance to spend time with on the radio before. We have Jesse Clafey with Smith Rock Roofing and Mike Zwick with If Not For God. And Mike, we have another one of your friends. Pastor Marty is on the phone with us. So, Pastor Marty, good to have you.

Hello, how are you today? Wow, we are awesome. And Pastor Marty, you are the lead pastor of the First Christian Church of Boone, correct?

That is correct. And you preach every Sunday at what time? Eleven o'clock. We have our service and Sunday school at 10 a.m. And I would highly, highly recommend if you're up in the Boone area, to go check out that church. It is awesome. So I got to ask, it's the First Christian Church in Boone.

How did you guys do that? I mean, were you there for Daniel? I knew that the holidays came up because I've only been the pastor for six months.

Okay, I was just checking. I had to go there. Sorry, Mike.

I had to go there. Sorry, Mike. That's awesome, Pastor Marty. I have been listening to the Wikipedia for quite a while now. This is the first time I've listened to your broadcast, and I really find it very fascinating and enjoying it. I really like the segment that the gentleman was talking about, the contract versus the covenant. And I've always, I guess, thought of it like a contract, but I also think of it as, I don't have to do this, but I get to praise and worship God every day. I get to go out and spread his word to the people. Amen. That's awesome. Thank you, Pastor. God bless. I'm so glad you called in today. I'm really glad. And his second story was beautiful about the soldiers. Oh, yeah.

Yes, Jeff Hoover's story. That's amazing stuff right there. So God bless you, Marty. Thank you, sir. All right.

God bless you. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. So, Mike. Yeah. Yeah.

I'm sure... I've had a chance to see a lot of folks growing in discipleship and whatever, but I imagine there's people younger that are in their 20s or whatever. I mean, clearly, what turned the tide for you? When did you go from like, okay, I show up at church on Sunday, to like, oh my gosh, I've got to find out about this stuff?

Well, my good friend, brother Tony Jackson, who comes on every Saturday morning at 8.30, he's on our sister station, The Light, and I think it's lightthetriad.com, but every Saturday morning at 8.30, they have a show and it's called Now Try Jesus Ministries. And so one day I was actually sort of preaching to him over the phone and he said, Mike, Mike, stop. I said, oh, okay, sorry. He said, why don't you come on the radio tomorrow morning? And I said, okay.

And then from there, I felt the Lord leading me to have my own show. And then I called the Truth Network and I spoke to you and you said to me, Mike, what do you want your show to be about? And I said, I don't know.

This is a true story, folks. What do you want to talk about on the show? And I said, I don't know. There's a beautiful thing about that when you think about it, Jesse, that David in Psalm 119 makes reference in the gimel section where he talks about I'm a stranger, right? Like, I don't know my way. I don't have a map. I don't know where I'm going.

There's a huge advantage in that, okay? Because if the Holy Spirit is taking you where you need to go, you're a whole lot better off. And I want to do a radio show and this is what I want to do and this is what I want to call it. But I remember specifically asking Mike, I said, so we need a good title. Would you pray about that? And he said, yeah, I'll go pray.

And 20 minutes later, I get this call, Robbie, I got a great title. And you could tell, as soon as he said, if not for God, and he explained it to me, it was clear that it had come from the Holy Spirit. So how about you, Jesse? When did it go from just being a roofer to like, oh man, I got to find out more about this God stuff?

Oh, it was a couple of years ago. You know, I grew up in the church. You know, I grew up in Sunday school and it was just, and there's a special challenge there, you know, because you know exactly how your life is supposed to look and you know exactly how you're supposed to act and I'm supposed to, you know, and a lot of it looks good. I know how to pray and sound like I know what I'm talking about.

I know a lot of the Bible and a lot of the hymns, but if it's not, if it's still like a contract, if I'm still doing it because it's what I'm supposed to do, then it's not, you're missing out on a piece of it. So, you know, a couple of years ago, you know, I went through some tough stuff a couple of years ago. There were a couple of surgeries, I think last time we talked, there were some illnesses and surgeries in my past and that, you know, you start thinking about your frailty as a human, your mortality and, you know, things, and God's been working on me ever since. I don't know that there's any one particular light switch moment, but it's, you know, over the course of the last probably two or three years, you know, God's, you know, really been working in my heart to make this real to me and, you know.

And away you go, you keep growing and growing and, you know, it's a gorgeous thing. So, you know, without our listeners, you know, we've got no, and we're so grateful for you listening today. And we're so grateful for all the supporters like Smith Walk Roofing and PRCULA, you know, all those people that obviously make all this possible because for me personally, like, Christian radio was a huge impact in my early discipleship and, you know, that those of you who get, you know, truth from the network, we're so grateful for you. You got so much coming at you. You got encouraging prayer coming on, then followed by the Mastin Journey starts here now at 12 o'clock. They came to call off at 1230 man up so much more coming up. This is the truth network.