Golf With Jay Delsing - - (Fed) Ex Men and Sunday With The Skipper

25 years on the PGA Tour and a lifetime member of the PGA Tour and PGA of America, Jay Delsing brings you his perspective on one of the world's greatest games as a professional golfer and network broadcaster. It's the game that connects the pros and the average Joes brought to you by Whitmore Country Club. Golf with Jay Delsing is now on 101 ESPN. Good morning, St. Louis. This is Golf with Jay Delsing. I am your host, Jay Delsing, and with me is my buddy, longtime friend, Caddy.

John Perlis. Perli, good morning. Good to be here with you, Jay. I've had a great week. Actually, we got to play a little golf together and ready to go with the show.

Okay, so let's just get this out. You had a great experience this week. Yeah, I did. Tell us about the first, we talk, when we have guests on the show, we ask them about golf and their life and golf and their career and things like that. Their first golf experience and you had a tremendous input on someone's first golf experience this week.

Yeah, my grandson, little William, six years old. Never really had a club in his hand before. Went on the driving range.

He's like, Grandpa, I want to learn how to play a little golf. And was it fun. Of course, took videos of him, took pictures of him, everything else.

You know, and again, six years old and this is a creative kid. Loves all kinds of sports. Big time into soccer because his older brother's into soccer.

His older brother's a very good player. So he's always trying to keep up. So I thought golf might be something where he can kind of do his own thing.

He doesn't have to compete nonstop. So we went out just a little driving range near the house and it was so much fun to hit balls with him. And I get up there, I'm thinking, I haven't given a lesson in a long time. And I'm watching this thinking, how am I going to get this creative, energetic little kid to focus for more than just generally in the right direction in case he hits it, which might not happen. But I'll tell you what, the second day, he actually hit it eight times in a row, which was thrilling. And every time you get it up in the air, he would turn around, look at me like, what the heck was that? And you could tell he just loved the way it felt and kind of the power and stuff behind it. And he missed it a lot of times and he had 45 different excuses why I missed it. That's wonderful. But, and then you're giving me a hard time because as is my way, I gave him some structure. Oh yeah, military.

All right, left foot, right foot. Grandpa, don't talk to me, son. You're good.

No, I'm just kidding. It was really good. I did good because he would say, I don't want to do it that way.

Okay, here's the deal. You do it your way three times, then we'll do it the way I'm suggesting three times. And whether he whiffed it or hit it great for him, which was about 18 or 19 yards, but in the air, he had the best time. And I complimented him if it was a complete whiff, if he fell down, didn't fall down.

We just really had a good time. I buy a little bucket of balls. So I'm going to guess there's 25 balls there. And I'm thinking there's no way he's going to get through all those balls.

And both times we went out there, he hit them all and wanted some more. That's awesome. It was great. I love it. Speaking of great, how about this show that we got today? We're going to see Justin Hogan visit Justin down at GOLFTEC.

We got a new edition of Whack and Chase, which is really becoming popular. It's hard to not laugh when we say that, right? And talk a little bit about the FedExCup, but I've got a great interview with Tony La Russa.

Yeah, maybe, I don't know, you've had some really good interviews, but maybe the best so far. You know, the guy's just Hall of Famer anyway. So we hope you folks will enjoy that.

Let's get down to Justin Hogan. He is the city manager and fellow PGA professional at GOLFTEC. And don't forget the August sale at GOLFTEC, up to 20% off lesson plans and programs. It is the time for their lowest prices on lessons throughout the year.

Thanks for having me again, Jay. I want to talk about what's going on in August here at GOLFTEC. Believe it or not, this is our biggest month of the year at GOLFTEC. And the reason for that is that our students are already prepping for the off season and getting the game ready for next year and by practicing here and taking lessons. And I mentioned in my prior talks about practice last week about how at GOLFTEC we allow our members to take both lessons and are able to practice in our temperature controlled bays and with the practice and the video feedback, able to review their swings in slow motion frame by frame. This kind of practice is so important for improving one's game.

And that's the big reason why people improve so fast at GOLFTEC. Now, the big reason why August is so important for us and so active for us is because this month is our biggest sale of the year. For anyone that calls us from your radio show, they're going to be eligible for up to 20% discount on lesson programs and plans for the entire month of August. So you've got till the end of the month. So we start you off with a swing evaluation and a customized plan for your game.

Get your improvement on track really fast and over the course of weeks. Again, this is our biggest month of the year at GOLFTEC in Clayton, De Pere, and Chesterfield locations. Your folks can give us a call at 314-721-GOLFT.

That's 314-721-4653, extension 1, 2, or 3. All types of golfers. We welcome novice and advanced to beginner to tournament and seasoned players. We're ready to help anyone that wants to give us a call and that are serious about your game. It's a great time to get involved with GOLFTEC with our lesson plans.

Again, up to 20% off. Make sure to mention the Jay Delsing radio show to get in on the deal. And we're, we look ready to help anyone who wants to give us a show. Thanks for having me again, Jay. Appreciate it.

Great stuff, Justin. Thanks so much for supporting the show and helping people with their game. Okay. So we have the last full field event before the playoffs. Okay. And whether you like the playoffs or not, I'm still trying to get comfortable with the playoffs.

Really? I love them. I love them. I know you're a gigantic golf fan in terms of you watch more than I do. But I want to see the players be in different situations than they're accustomed for. I like to see them.

That's why I like Ryder Cup, President's Cup, the places where it's just not the same, which I still love the robotic regular tournaments. These guys have a different level of heat. There's different things going on. We've got points. And I remember when it first came out, I thought there was no chance for this whole concept, but I think it's taken off big time. Well, and we talked about it last week.

You only get $15 million for winning. Yeah. So what else do we need to talk about? Even these guys are excited about that.

Yeah, that's right. So I looked at the list on the bubble. Really not anybody interesting.

I hate to say that. My fellow professionals down there, I know it's interesting to them. They want to get in this thing to make a hell of a lot of more money, but I'm not going to even bring any of that up because it's not... Jason Duffner was the only kind of recognizable name that was on the outside looking in.

And I mean, he's okay. But this is also, you mentioned this is one of the last shows about different opportunities guys have to kind of get to that next level in their careers and maybe start getting noticed, or more importantly, started getting more confidence in themselves. And this is one of those with one of these guys can kind of pop it and kind of get in there. Guys that maybe weren't normally in it, let alone have a good tournament the next time and stay in there. It changes their career, Jay, because it builds their confidence. Well, you know how golf is too.

One of the hardest things was ever to be prepared and playing well when you need it the most. And I sucked at it. Let's be honest.

I never knew. I couldn't disagree more with you. I could not. You and I used to talk about when your back was up against the wall, whether it was to make a cut to keep your card.

I was okay then. You played some... Don't sell yourself short. How about Tremendous Slouch?

Don't sell yourself short. You're a Tremendous Slouch. Okay. Something like that. Well, thank you. That's going to do it for the On the Range segment.

The On the Range segment, by the way, was sponsored by Golf Discount, where St. Louis shops for all of its golf needs. Oh, I didn't even... I got to do this because this is kind of fun. Look us up on all of our social media stuff because this is really important and we care a lot about this. Well, we do care about it.

We do care about this. I'm just kidding. On my Twitter feed is at Jay Delsing. My Facebook is Golf with Jay Delsing and Jay Delsing Golf and my LinkedIn is just Jay Delsing. That's just too many Jay Delsing for me to say in one sentence. The worldwide web is flooded with Jay Delsing. I know.

And then we have our Instagram account, which... What? Huh? Okay. Blah.

Okay. That's going to do it for the On the Range segment. Come back for that Tony La Russa interview. This is Golf with Jay Delsing on one on one ESPN. Doster Olam and Boyle LLC are a proud sponsor of golf with Jay Delsing here on one on one ESPN. The firm was started in January 2015 by Mike Doster, Jess Olam and John Boyle, three veterans of the St. Louis real estate banking, commercial and corporate legal landscape. The firm was founded on the shared view that success should be measured by client and community satisfaction, not profits for partner. The firm's focus is on business, real estate, corporate finance and restructuring and succession planning. Since its founding in 2015, Doster Olam and Boyle have been involved in real estate, business and corporate transactions with a combined value in excess of over $1 billion. For decades, Doster Olam and Boyle lawyers have been recognized as leaders in their practice areas by their peers. Doster Olam and Boyle LLC, extraordinary talent, ordinary people.

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Jay and John are here to bring you this segment we call the front nine. I had the privilege and the honor to sit down with Tony La Russa. So I hope you enjoy this this conversation with Hall of Fame manager, Tony La Russa.

Tony, man, you know, I'm a baseball geek. I just I just love the game and I had so much fun watching you manage even, you know, I remember when you were at the White Sox and then with with Oakland and then had the great privilege of coming down and watching you here at the Cardinals. One of the things that I wanted some of the folks to know to me that that I'd like to hear you talk about is you always seemed so prepared. Was that something that you learned as a player coming up through the ranks?

Well, I was raised in the at that time the Kansas City A's organization, you know, I signed in the early 60s and when they went to Oakland in 68 soon thereafter, they won three championships in a row. So those are real good development system there and and you know, the preparation of them that you had to learn the basics and the way that you made them yours, you know that they became part of your skills were that you just pounded, pounded, pounded. So, you know, I had a nice understanding that to take talent and make it a skill you had to learn and and prepare it. But they took out a whole new face as a manager today because, you know, I was not a good player.

I had managed very long and I got the White Sox situation and I realized that what I provided our club as a leader was way short compared to, you know, they had legends of the American League when I started, you know, Sparky Billy or Whitey Jean, you know, he goes on and on. So, preparation became some way to close the gap. And, you know, we always prepared man that the one thing that bothered me a little bit was talk about us preparing, but I think that you got to distinguish that preparing is just studying for the test.

The most important thing you do is taking a test. So we would take that preparation and then try to compete as hard and as well as we could. Well, it really showed. I think, man, when you start thinking about the the icons of a game that you, you know, when you were with that White Sox club, when when you were actually on the field and managing the White Sox, how much did you learn from those other managers and watching them manage against you and watching some of the strategies that they employed? Well, that's the one best lesson I've ever heard and learned it from George Kissel, the great mentor and coach with the St. Louis Cardinals. My last year that I was kind of a player, I was a player coach with the Cardinals system. And so there in spring training, I learned from George that every game you play is the best learning experience.

Just review afterwards what you learned about other teams, your team, yourself and the game, how it should be played. So learning has always been something that's been critical and still is. So one of the nice things when I got into the big leagues as a young manager, there are guys like Sparky Anderson and Chuck Tanner and Billy Martin, John McNerney, that really Dick Williams were really open to me. And I was clueless, man. I was coming from nowhere. And they gave me the ABCs. And then over time, I realized how lucky I was. And then I realized that that learning process continues. You know, Tony, one of the things that when when I play golf and I come right off the golf course and and you're talking about learning and reviewing what happened, man, there was this this I needed a down period of almost an hour or so to just decompress and try to figure out what the hell I just did.

Sometimes really good, oftentimes really bad. And I watch you guys have to go right in front of the media right after the game. That's got to be brutally hard.

Well, I think it's it's probably unfair. And and what happens is that everybody suffers. Just like you say, you know, you come off the golf course and you've been competing. I mean, your emotions are raging, you know, your heads flat all over the place and you need a chance to back off.

So same thing. When you when you manage, you know, you're competing out there against another team, you get the responsibility to put players in a position to succeed. So the decompression is it's not going to happen in 10 minutes.

So you're forced to go there no more than 10 minutes. So sure enough, what happens is it sometimes, you know, you give answers that are kind of curt. You know, you're very fighting to say something that isn't, you know, taken the wrong way by your team or by the other team.

And it's just a real struggle. So I agree, man, take a wait an hour. I think that your answers would be better. The fans would enjoy it more.

The media would enjoy it more. Yeah, I can just remember sometimes coming off the golf course and have my head just swimming. Because I'm like, I you'd have given me a million bucks, I could have never hit the ball over there, you know, and I just did it when I didn't want to and or when I wanted to, you know, and yeah, that's a tough part of what you guys do.

Tony. Amazing when I sit there, look at your career, look at your stats, you're the third most winning manager in baseball. I, I grew up in a baseball family. And I learned the, you know, the book and I learned to the box scores I learned, you know, just as a as a fan would, did you ever in your wildest dreams? I mean 2728 wins, you won three World Championships, you were four time manager of the year, five times you're a runner up manager of the year.

I mean, how the hell did this evolve for you? Because like you said, you you weren't a great player, but you turn into such a great manager. I mean, it has to be a love for the game in there. Well, I think I was introduced to the game. I lived in Tampa, Florida, and that's a hotbed of baseball. Al Lopez, you know, the legendary catcher manager was a was a hero in our area.

My my, all my dad's mom's side, you know, they love the game. So I was raised in baseball and then I had some ability and I played in high school and signed the night I graduated. So you know, I had the dreams of being a star player.

I just didn't make it. But I did play, you know, I lasted 16 years and had a lot of injuries early and thinking back later, you know, I really had some toughness I didn't know I had. But I persevered a lot because I love the game so much. I didn't want to as long as I was, you know, making a decent living and playing respectably. I didn't want to just give it up. So that when I realized I wasn't going to make it I started going to law school and I got a degree I was gonna be a lawyer. I started managing just to get the bug off my back and my wife and I didn't have kids at the time to think that soon thereafter I got a big league job and lasted all those years was never ever in the plan.

Even when I first got that job, I knew I was definitely not qualified experience wise. And fortunately, I worked for great people, Bill Beck and then Jerry Reister if I had rolling him as a GM, and throughout my career at that was the key always said great owner had great front office. And then we always got players and I survived. Oh, man and players. Tony, did you have some players in throughout your career?

Holy smokes. I don't even know where to start on the list. And don't want to be disrespectful to anyone. But man, you unbelievable players. You know what I do sometimes I mean, I did it for years and then I still do it from time to time is like I get my lineup card out. And and I make out I always start with a starting lineup, right? Or right away when you make out a starting lineup, you realize you got to you got to make out the roster of 25 because you know, I had as a as a young manager at Carlton Fisk the Great Hall of Famer. Well, you know later on in St. Louis at Yachty Molina and then we had two other really good catchers Mike Bethany and Terry Steinbeck was in in Oakland. So I've gone to first base is at Albert is it McGuire?

I mean, this is ridiculous. We start looking at it, you know, the the outfielders and it is really it to make the point, you know, if I put that roster out there of you know, we're two or three deep at every position. I'm talking about with great players. You see how fortunate and and you get to the pictures the same thing, you know, there's we've had Cy Young winners. We've had some really good reliever.

You had a great reliever like Eckersley. So it's a I mentioned embarrassment of riches and I say I bet I'm so lucky. It's I never take it for granted. I just I just embrace it. What a roster that would be and what a fun exercise.

I would love to to to read that. So Tony, what would you say amongst those great players? What is the single biggest trait that you noticed that you could say all those great players have? Well, the ones that are great. At some point, they realize that that everybody, literally everybody at science has talent. Now, some are more talented than others, but they realize that talent is just like just would get you sign that you've got to develop skills. And the key to that is understanding the basics, really hammering and working on them so that you become more skillful as a whatever it is, as a pitcher, defender, baseman or hitter. But you really embrace the knowledge of how to pitch or play the game. You know, the great ones, they understand, you know, when you cut it back down, it's really simple.

It can act. I mean, I'm here in Boston Yankees against Boston. I mean, with all of the other distractions or it really is our team against their team is a score. So if you want to be a great pitcher or player, you've got to know that the priority is the competition, what you can contribute to it. And then you break down that. You know, if you're a position player, man, you know, you've got to defend and run bases.

You've got to take that badge based on whether you start a rally or finish one. If you're a pitcher, you know, you've got to do this. So it's it's it. To me, it's it's getting really smart, dedicating yourself to learning your craft, you know, becoming a real craftsman. And what your bottom line is, you will see guys with less talent become much better player, more productive players have more championships and guys with more talent that never, ever get clueless about how hard they had to work and how much they had to learn. Yeah, it's about heart and grit, isn't it? Well, I think in the end, mentally and physically toughness, mental and physical physical toughness is more important than the talent. You know what's interesting, Tony Tiger Woods, I'm a competitive guy.

I really am. I can't even hold a candle to this dude in just a competitive nature. He is a guy that doesn't give up on any play.

He might have a three wood into a par four for par after it went out of bounds or something in his he's got every ounce of focus and attention. Is there anybody through the years that that sticks out to you like that? Well, I mean, I actually because of you know, how I managed as you said, get 33 years and was around not just our teammates, but watched guys on the other side. I've seen that greatness, you know, you know, often enough, you know, golf is a one person sport, but you're playing against some great golfers, you know, in baseball, you got a team sports, you've got greatness on both sides that are either, you know, pitchers or position players. So what Tiger has done, you know, I mean, Ricky Henderson is a base stealer, Albert pools, you know, the Eckersley's as a closer, you know, you talk about the great starters that we've had, you know, that Dave Stewart, Bob Welsh, Chris Carpenter, Darryl Kyle, Adam Wainwright.

I mean, these guys have that same kind of intensity. But in the end, I think, you know, when I watch Tiger, he's trying to win the tournament. And I know that, you know, the more successful you are, and you don't have to worry about, can you win enough to keep your card, you know, is a certain luxury of that. But I my point is, what we try to teach each guy is if you want to be the most successful, you want to be the most selfish you can be, then you better hope you plan a team that wins. And you better hope you contribute to it. So I think sometimes my dad always said, you know, the more distracted, complicated, confusing, simply keep it.

It's what can you do to help win the game today? Whatever your responsibility is be accountable for it. Some of the things that I've learned for all the years, Tony, are some of the things that I want to teach my children and teach anybody that wants to listen. Because that accountability and being responsible and, you know, working hard, those are things that, you know, were hammered into my head when I was a kid. I can't agree to worry, you know, and I think that that is the importance of sports. I mean, I know it's an entertainment, and it helps you get away from real life. But if you really study what's going on team wise or with individuals, you know, there are personal quality values that that you can take into your life, you know, as a parent, as a, whether you're a father, mother, whether you're a child that's trying to be responsible, you know, support people that are productive and successful in sports, you know, they're there, that's their vocation. And especially when you play a team, you know, you're really right. You try to create this brotherhood, this family.

So it's, you know, you want to be a member of that family, there's certain respect and trust and caring that you have to demonstrate that that carries over into real life. Don't go anywhere. That's going to wrap up the front nine. There's more of this Tony La Russa interview coming to you. This is golfer Jay Delsing on 101 ESPN. Quick note, we just got a call from our friend Joe Scieser at USA Mortgage.

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Or you can go see them at S-A-E-T-T-E-L-E dot com. After 25 years on the PGA Tour, Jay Delsing takes you behind the scenes from the eyes of a pro. Now back to more golf with Jay Delsing on 101 ESPN. Welcome back to Golf with Jay Delsing.

I'm your host, Jay. I've got my favorite caddy buddy John Perlis here with me, and we are headed to the back nine. But before we get back to the Tony La Russa interview, I've got to thank and talk about my friends at Whitmore Country Club. There's 90 holes of golf at Whitmore Country Club. If you join at Whitmore, you get access to the links to Dardeen, Missouri Bluffs, and the Golf Club of Wentzville, and the cart fees are included in that membership. There are no food or beverage minimums.

There are no assessments ever. They have a 24-hour fitness center and a large pool complex. There's three tennis courts, year-round social calendar rocks out there. The holiday parties are legendary. There's picnics, date nights, live music, kids clubs, and much, much more for your children. Junior golf, junior tennis.

There's a swim team that's available. We're talking about a family-friendly, family-centric atmosphere with a wonderful staff and you got to go and stop in the golf shop and see Bummer Berry, who's a friend of the Golf with Jay Delsing show. He's been on the show. We will have him on again. He will help you with anything you need. He's a terrific guy. So reach out to Whitmore at 636-926-9622. All right, St. Louis, we've got part two of the Tony La Russa interview. I hope you enjoy it. Tony, tell everybody how important Dave Duncan was to you and your success.

How much time do we have, right? Well, I mean, I'm laughing because I just talked to him this morning for half an hour. And I tell everybody, I brag on him so much that people, I know that they don't grasp his greatness because you had to watch it every day. You know, the night, you know, the real neat irony coincidence is that, you know, I signed in 1962 with the A's as a teenager, Dave signed in 1963.

So we've known each other, you know, for all these years. Dave had a very successful 10-year career as a catcher. You know, I was not a good player, but we were to get 29 years as pitching coach manager and he was the perfect pitching coach. I don't, you know, I don't want to disrespect anybody else because I didn't work on anybody else like that, but there wasn't one box that Dave didn't check as a pitching coach. Everything that you wanted a pitching coach to do, Dave could do it and he did it totally to benefit the pitchers and contribute to the team.

It was, you know, he never had an ego about it and he was innovative, brilliant, a lot of stuff that you see now, even some of the stuff that the formulas point out, Dave had figured out and was using to get hitters out years ago. And it's funny, I just talked to him this morning and we were talking about, you know, some of the mistakes are being made today. You know, you can pitch up too much. There's a lot of outs up. You keep stay up there. There's a lot of home runs are hit because you've got the ball up now with where you want supposed to be.

And there is something still to get the ball down the zone with movement and then mixing in some up. So he's a genius. And if I tell him that if I said that to him too many times, you know, he would hang up on me. That's a humble is he was one of those guys. And I just had the opportunity of meeting him a couple of times, but Tony, he was one of those guys when he spoke, you almost hung on every one of his words. You know, he just had that sort of respect. I don't, I don't know any other way to say it.

Well, there's a couple of things to that, man. He's like he, if I remember the old commercial, if they started speaking, I mean, but he doesn't, you know, he doesn't talk a lot. I mean, he's not a guy that walks around BS and people, you know, just chat chattering, you know, he's pretty quiet, but he's very opinionated. You know, if you, you know, he, he pays attention. He's very smart.

So when he says something, he's going to select what he says and it's me. Well thought of as we well articulated. So that was part of his greatness as a coach. I mean, his ability to, uh, you know, have pitchers respect and trust him. And he knew how much he cared for them. He definitely had their back. I'm actually surprised Tony, that more pitchers, even today, don't go.

Maybe they are. And that we just don't hear about them. I try to read anything I can about the game, but more pitchers that are struggling, don't go see him or, or even call you because how many times did you bring guys that were kind of thought to be on the, their last leg or on the scrap heap. And they came to St. Louis, you think of Woody Williams, you think a Weaver, you think of those guys and they, he just absolutely invigorated their career.

Yeah. It's, it's, it's, you know, somebody ought to write a book about him because what he does and he's done is just amazing. Uh, uh, I think some of it, you know, when you're out of, out of the limelight, you're not, you know, you don't get as much attention, you know, still Dave 2011, when I quit, he quit. And then he, now he stays, he's been an advisor to the Diamondbacks.

Now he advises the Chicago White Sox and he'll study pitching and make, make his contribution. But if you're not down there active, you know, people kind of forget you. And, uh, one of the problems now, the specific problems that there's, there's so much emphasis on the formulas and, and, and, uh, using analytics and Dave was one of the master of that, but he's a master of combining and balancing traditional, uh, analysis, you know, observational analysis with some of the new, uh, pieces of information percentages that you get. But there is a tendency nowadays to, you know, I think, I guess it is carefully confused.

I mean, I think the mathematics, the, the analytics are very important, but they must be balanced with traditional. If you give them, if you exaggerate their importance that you won't be as good as you could be. It's so interesting, Tony, because situationally the way that I was brought up in the game and the way I learned the game, I see these guys come up to the plate, you know, the last of the ninth inning and they got the shift on and they're one more than one run down in the entire left side of the infield is open. And I see him just ripping line, you know, two hoppers out into right center where the whole infield is when you're a one down. I mean, my dad would have said, if you don't lay down a bunt and get something down the left side of the field, you're not put a play.

Well, I mean, you know, we talk about that. I mean, I'm not coming back. I'm past that baton, but I think that's one rate in one place where managers need to take charge because, you know, a single to start a rally that's hit to the open spot in the shift.

It's just like hitting a line drive single and to allow teams to take that part of the field away from you. It's just not smart. But here's the problem. More and more owners are hiring executives who believe more in the numbers and don't have the background and strategy and adjusting, you know, part of what you learn over the years, you learn how to teach, how to coach, how to tweak, how to adjust to, you know, if one day, you know, Jay's not hitting, you know, he's drawn the ball, you know, and if you're a spectator, you know, you better be better watch his poolside.

You know, I'm gonna go the other side of the course. So you know, that's lost. It's almost totally lost, but it's just frowned upon a lot of the young managers and I can't blame them.

Because if I had an opportunity to go, maybe I do blame them a little bit. They're getting their jobs because they're gonna take the information and use it. And it's unfortunately, it's really not good for baseball because the game is so dynamic down the field that front office should understand that the managers and the coach and the coaching staff have to be able to adjust whatever information, you know, what the expectation was, the reality is going to be different quite often. Well, Tony, it's happening in golf. Now, you know, because Tigers come out and because the money has exploded in our sport, all of these we have analytics now. And I'd say every one of these tour players travels around with a little small, it looks like a laptop, it's called a flight scope or a track man.

But I watch these guys go out and play. And it's like, this is a stick in a ballgame still, how the hell do you analyze something like that? No, no, it doesn't just, again, the best thing is, whether it's golfer, but you know, what, what's your swing speed, you know what, or what's the speed of the ball coming out the club? What's the speed of the ball coming off the bat? Well, you have a high speed, yours is not so high. Okay, so you tell the guy, hey, your speeds are high. Okay, that's I got that. But how do how do I get it faster? You know, that's coaching, you know, what am I doing?

That can increase my bat speed. And I that's, that's the part that is in many cases missing today. Because there, when you have a number that reflects a player, because maybe it's his defensive metroid that isn't necessarily who he is.

That says who he is right now, but you can improve, he's not going to his left, you can coach him to go better to his left. See, so it's a balance. And if you exaggerate one over the other, then you know, if you're if you ignore the analytics, and you just rely on the traditional, you know, you're you're missing an asset.

But there's a lot of great stuff with tradition, man. It's, you know, we call it observational analytics. Yeah, right. And you see and you analyze, we got Paul Goldschmidt. Now, who is a exceptional player, I loved watching him play when he was in the D backs. And how much better him at first base makes our overall infield defense is just ridiculous.

And it never gets mentioned. It's one of those places, you know, I mean, traditionally, if first base you want, you want to have somebody produce a lot of runs. And if he just plays, okay, defense, and that, yeah, I don't, I don't doubt that, you know, every, every lineup needs run producers. So maybe you play them in the first base of left field or something. But if you have a first baseman, that's a defensive plus the confidence in the guys throwing the ball that way, it makes them throw it away less, because they just let it go, you know, go, he's gonna catch it in the way maneuvers, especially nationally with their butts, you know, he can come in and make plays to the advanced base. He's a great defender, he's a great base runner.

He's a great person. And I'm so pleased that, you know, he's, he's got hot lately, and he's helped that team get back in contention. There's so many analogies, Tony with with baseball and golf and talk about all these analytics, but then at the bottom line, you mentioned this earlier, it goes back to score. It goes back to I shot 73, you shot 72, you beat me. Yeah, I mean, one guy's more fairways and the other guy beats of us cork is the guy lost strokes around the green, you know, and I mean, same thing you can one team gets 12 hits and scores two runs because you know, they never put the hits back to back. You know, they they're basically just swinging for their butts.

The other team got eight hits and scores for because they start a rally move the guy around got him in, you know, so there's there's a place for everything. What you don't want to do is neglect anything you want. They make make sure everything is part of your the way you compete. Man, this is fun. I could talk to you all day.

I just want to ask you one last thing. What would you say the best thing a manager can do for a team? And then also for a player?

Well, that's a great question. Well, I would say I pick best because that's the one most important but you if this is all you can do, then you're limited because you know the managers a lot of responsibilities and it takes a lot of thing but the number one thing I believe nowadays is is you have to have the ability to get through to each player may bring them together as a team and motivate them to practice so that they learn their crafts and play the game to win competitively as a team, you know sacrificing each other for the total good and bring them together as the true brotherhood. I think and that starts with winning the frame of mind game. I think the number one your number one chore is to get into the minds of the guys get them excited excited for the right reason doing the right things but as I mentioned beginning if all you can do is get them excited to play and then you don't know what to do with them. Once they're excited then you know, you're not going to be good enough either.

But if you've got a great mind about strategy and nobody wants to play for they nobody hustles. Oh, you don't get beat more often. And that's awesome. Well, I really can't thank you enough for taking the time.

It's a thrill for me. I can sit here and talk baseball with you all day long. I still hear the fire in your voice and I know you're 74 years old and you got to miss the game.

But I know you're doing stuff with Boston right now. I just wish you all the best. Well, I enjoyed it man. Thanks for the opportunity, man. I just I could have got I could have talked not to Tony could have talked to me that long but I could have talked to him for hours. It was a great interview. It's part of your other passion baseball and I know you're a huge Tony La Russa fan.

It was a lot of fun. Okay, so so bro, the thing I'm so excited to talk about this the thing that jumps out to me about him. The very first thing is the passion. Here's a guy 74 years old. He's working for his second team since he left the Cardinals start with the D backs. Now he's up in doing a special assignments for the Red Sox. But the guy is still plugged in and still so passionate about this game. You can just tell I loved the early part to when he talked about his passion how we got his law degree and he was kind of looking to be out of baseball but there was there was just a tug and he just had to kind of jump in there and take that opportunity to be a coach even though he said he wasn't ready Etc Etc. And to your point all the way to today.

He's still out there after everything's he's accomplished. And what did he say about creating lineups in his spare time? Oh, my was that was one of my favorite parts because he's I I said man Tony what about these great rosters of players that that played on, you know clubs that you managed and he said yeah Jay sometimes I get a lineup card out and you know, I have to fill out the full 24-man roster.

I mean who does that but that's crazy passionate. So I mean he pointed out from the beginning of his career. Yeah middle of his career, obviously he had it because he was there all the time and he just talked about that dedication that preparation on and on and then towards the end of his career and who knows how many more years this guy can go with all the energy he's got but he's still doing those kind of things and and the other part that shows me the passion of the game.

Look at all the changes in the game. He talked about the stats Etc, but he's still in there before we go to that. How about how Frankie was when he said I got this job. I was young.

I shouldn't have got it my first job. That's the White Sox and how he basically got his ass kicked by these legends of the game Sparky Anderson, Dick Williams, John McNamara. Well, I got kicked by him, but he's also saying he learned from them and if there was consistency with which there was and things he was saying is being prepared preparing yourself for the test the game but also learning all along the way from these people. So yeah while he's getting his butt kicked he was smart enough to learn from it.

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so let's get back to your point that you were making about he made a huge comment about analytics and your gut and I swear today, you know, when I see these players come up to the to the plate their team is down by more than a run the defense has a shift on and so the entire left side or right side of the infield is open and if you look if I'd sign off if you could hit a two-run home run with nobody on but you can't and so the fact that you're swinging way into the defense the way they're playing you thinking I mean, it makes no sense at all and Tony said that's why the manager needs to step in. I love that and you're the baseball wonk guy, but what about the analogy because we've got our golf show here.

What about the analogy between all the stats nowadays, which there weren't near as many when you play especially early right towards the end of your career. They would give you the sheets which is kind of cool about sometimes you got to talk about that because there's a ton of information that you could have from the tour. But man, you still have to play the game.

You still have to have that feel that that gut innate build on the game. We talked about that in the interview. I said these guys are every guy on tour now is traveling around Pearl with these flight scopes and these launch monitors, you know these oh gosh, I'm forgetting the name. Anyway, you know how we are in this show somewhere close somewhere with the spin rates.

Yeah, but that's what that's my point. You click the screen and we're talking about launch angle dispersion spin ball speed club speed all of this stuff and it's it's at the end of the day. It's about your score.

What'd you shoot? You know, so there's it's appears got a big blend. Yep. There's got to be a blend and talked really eloquently about that blend and you can see again the passion there. If you're just going to go off the stats in baseball and I would say if you're just going to go off the stats in golf, you're missing a big big part of the game and probably the part that puts you up amongst the top top people.

Okay, and my favorite part. How about his talks about what I asked him what were the characteristics of the folks that played great that were the greatest players and he talked about knowing your craft and working your craft and understanding what to do and understanding situation situational baseball all the sort of things in golf where you know we talked about this with my career. I was extremely marginal early in my career with my short game.

It was either really good or really bad. My dad used to say it was either penthouse or outhouse which I really appreciate it. Thanks dad for pointing that out. I made it clear. What are you trying to say when you're actually on the golf course and you wait till you're done.

Oh, he might have said it on the course and the other thing is those were not the exact words to use. I think we know that. Okay.

All right, so we're clear on that. But until I identified that weakness and that need how do you know and unfortunately for me it was 10 years and you know, five ten years into my career instead of being something I learned in college where you could have helped me in college. I think there again the analogy and you know me I like to kind of relate things back to business as well. Every business guy I asked when I said what's the difference when did you make it what happened?

I kind of asked the question how important are the idiosyncrasies the finer points that kind of underneath information that you can really only get when you've been in the game for a while. Every single time I ask that question of a guy or a lady they come back with the same thing. It's imperative. It's everything. It's the distinguishing thing between the quote obvious things that are out there. Yeah, we all want to hit a 300 yards right. But what do we do under these conditions.

What do we do under these pressures. So I think I loved that he had that answer. It's those little finer points. That's why he kept saying know their craft. The people that really know their craft know all the idiosyncrasies and I think that transcends baseball golf business across the board. And it's hard work. It's hard work. It's working on the small things. One of the things that I learned about golf was I was really pretty damn good at the bigger things.

And I sucked at some of the smaller stuff. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if you could have disagreed with me because you could have absolutely disagreed with me. Well I'm not sure if any point would have been made if I disagree with you.

Any of you guys do radio out there? Yeah. I know bro.

I know it is so true. I mean and once those became apparent it was so glaring. But to that point they're not always apparent because you want to go back to something else.

You want to try to hang on to something else. But I think when he says learn your craft who has the courage and the awareness to dig into those little specific things to say how am I going to do it? Because some of you are thinking especially out on tour how are you going to hit some of those chips?

How are you going to handle some of that? It's tough. It's another whole part of the game. It is and man it's everything and those little you know Vince Lombardi had the coolest line when he was talking to his players when he was coaching the Green Bay Packers. He said the outcome of a football game is going to hinge on one or two plays every single game.

John could not agree more. But he goes fellas the problem is we don't know if it's the opening kickoff or if it's the last Hail Mary. So we have to be present and we have to be there for every single play from the opening kickoff to the end of the game because we don't know when that plays coming. And man I took some plays off. But knowing your craft wouldn't you say ladder in your career in particular? Do you say ladder? Ladder.

Ladder. Later. Later. Later in your career.

I got a ladder in the car. Late in your career. God dang it I'm trying to make a point here. Late in your career couldn't you sometimes identify when that shot was when that time was in the round in the tournament? Without question.

No question. There was no and it ran me over a little bit. I know you liked it but you weren't hitting it I was like this was pretty important. I'm saying I had some of that too.

I know I'm just kidding. But the fun part was it was kind of neat to say this is it. Yep. This is it. And there might be another shot but this shot if this doesn't get pulled off it ain't gonna happen. No it doesn't matter. You know it's kind of cool because at least for me it took a long time to really develop what that was.

And it gives you a different sense of planning it and executing. You know that's gonna do it for the back nine. Stick around we're going to the 19th hole this is golf. What are we doing in the 19th hole Jay?

We got a little whacking chase coming up. That's called in the radio business pro because we are in the radio business. Foreshadowing? No. Meat?

What is that called? That's a tease right there. Can Burley call it foreshadowing and we get over you?

That's more literary I'm sorry I got ahead of myself. Come back this is 101 ESPN and golf with Jay Delsing. Urban Chestnut Brewing Company is proud to be an official sponsor of 101 ESPN's newest show.

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Mike Duffy's Pub and Grill the best burgers in town since 1986. Hey thanks for staying with us we just finished 18 holes and we are headed to our favorite part of the day the 19th hole. This is Golf with Jay Delsing. Jay Delsing is here. My buddy Pearly is with me and Pearly Mike Duffy's a great partner of the show our official 19th hole August 23rd from 5 to 7 or later. Yes we've been known to stay a little later. We got a happy hour at the Richmond Heights store. We're gonna have some games.

You showed me the one game tonight. What do you think about it? I think it's a lot of fun. You got a little chippy? How far is the chip gonna be? I'm thinking 10 12 feet 12 yeah. And we'll move in as we go.

Yeah exactly good maybe one foot. Yeah so we're gonna have games we're gonna have beer prizes we're gonna yeah so guys come come visit us at Mike Duffy's on the 23rd of August from 5 to 7 at the Richmond Heights store. All right. Whack and chase. Pearly why don't you take us into this Whack a Jay segment.

Well it's just it's my favorite segment. Who do we have meet? The phones will not stop ringing guys Diane is our latest on Whack and Chase. Hey Diane thank you for calling us here at Whack and Chase. How you doing tonight? Hi how are you this evening? How you doing Diane?

I'm doing good. Where are you from? I'm from Cabery Illinois. You're from where?

Wow. What's the name? Cabery. Where's that where's that relation to what Chicago everybody knows where Chicago is where is it from Chicago? It's a couple hours south it's between 10p and Pontiac. So small farming community?

Very small farming community. All right all right well perfect perfect. How long have you well actually the first question is what do you want Jay to help you with in your golf game? That's where we got to start. I cannot cut worth a darn so I need a lot of help in my putting.

Okay we we can take a look at that. What sort of handicap do you have Diane? Diane what sort of handicap do you have? She's asking somebody what her handicap is. I'm sorry.

First handicap is she doesn't know where the handicap is. Because I don't golf enough. I have seven grandkids that's where I spend my time.

Oh good for you. And golf a little bit and you know if I could improve a little bit I'd probably golf more. What are the ages give us the age range on your on your grandkids?

Eight years old to eight months old. Wow good for you that keeps you busy I bet. Get those kids out on the golf course Diane it'll be a cluster but it'll be a lot of fun. And when you're when you're playing golf who you playing with? Usually my husband. There's the handicap right there. That is your handicap.

But if you told us that whomever that man is we would have said we're sorry. I don't care what the number is I don't care what the number is eight grandkids not a handicap a cool thing but clearly a deterrent to great golf. Yeah. And a husband is she playing with all the time which is a deterrent to great golf and is a handicap. I don't know if we can put that on the kids I mean Diane can we say eight kids is a deterrent to play great golf?

Yeah it's a distraction. No. No. It's just like there's that grandma that's not gonna say anything bad no matter what about the kids. No Ken what a what a great concept grandkids I don't have any yet but I can't wait because you can just return them.

Yes. You know it's almost like a rental it's like this is awesome. I got I got I got a bunch of them myself and they are a ton of fun I've got a little one with us right this week and just he's just so much fun it's unbelievable. As a matter of fact he said for the first time he said grandpa we're passing a driving range on the way to the house he says grandpa can we go hit some golf balls I about melted right on the spot I'm like absolutely.

You can buy him a set of clothes right on the spot. I know you are I know you are that's great that's great. So you want some help with the putter so give us a little bit of feedback so you're out there putting you're playing with your husband is it is it just little putts long putts all putts give us a little bit of kind of feedback what happens and how you feeling in your gut when you're putting. Yeah all putts problem anything I can't keep my wrist from breaking I don't think I read a green very well either. Well the one thing is you know you don't get to play a lot those things the stuff you're talking about Diane it's not like the most normal motion to make a stroke or to try to put a ball and reading a green is a nuance you know it comes with a little more time I mean do you like the idea of playing golf do you like being outside you like you know is that something that appeals to you so if you if you could put a little better you might you might want to play more. I think we would go out and play more. Well Jay just talk to her a little bit you've got a great thing you help people with and it's just like the bucket of water this concept to help Diane be able to have a sense of reading putts. Right so Diane basically you want to try to find the high point on the green and sometimes that's easier said than done with the way they design some of these damn greens now there's there's bumps and mounds and things like that everywhere but if you're in a quadrant you know sometimes you'll have these these crazy sloping greens that go all over the place if you're in a quadrant where the flag stick is you want to look someone told me when I was a kid I've always remembered this if I had a bucket of water and I poured it on the ground which way with the water trail which way would the water run out and that always helped me to find the low point so generally speaking that ball's going towards that low point you know some way or another now depending on where the the hole is you know some you might you might be underneath the hole and you're going to be going straight up the the hill that's going to make that putt a lot slower right and then going down the hill you know it's going to make it much faster and then the side you know depending on how far on the left or the right of it are you know it's going to make it break that way it's so funny you just explained that to Diane I'm playing in a Canadian tour event I don't know 30 years ago or something up in Saskatoon Saskatchewan Canada our our buddy Bernie from Saskatchewan exactly exactly and I'm playing I'm playing very well and I'm playing with this guy who's playing well and he gets up on this hole Diane he's kind of ran into what you ran into all of a sudden he couldn't read the green so his first putt was uphill and he got it like halfway there then he hit it really hard the next time I got it like three feet by and then the next one it's like somehow he didn't know it was downhill and he hit it and went like eight feet by and he just yells out this is how much pressure and kind of golf can make you go crazy he yells out the fast ones are downhill and the slow ones are uphill and we all look at him like well that's true well yeah that's a good place to start why don't you think about that yeah but yeah it can it can drive you a little bit crazy but the buckets so just wherever you see that water if you could in your mind's eye see that water flow that's going to get a sense of whether you got an uphill a downhill a side hill that type of thing but it's a really good visual and kind of give you a feel for it here's what something else people do all the time Diane they'll hit their first putt and let's say it'll be downhill and be really really fast okay and they'll knock it past hole 99 times out of 100 the next one comes back is halfway but hell of course it is because it's back up the hill you know it's one of those things it's all situational but a couple of tips on your putting don't worry as much about breaking your wrist you do want to kind of keep them together you do want to feel like you rock a triangle that starts with your right and your left shoulder and the fulcrum point is down where your hands are holding the putter but the bigger thing is don't move your body from the waist down diane that'll take out a huge amount of hit that you have in the putt you want to rock and use those hips as you're hitting your driver and your your irons and things like that but with your putter you don't want that you just want it to be kept still and be fair and be fair my husband tells me that and i just don't get it but with you telling me i think i got it oh man i might have to get your husband's number and give him a little trouble about that even though we don't know i like that i like that i did but if there's any possible way to the next couple times respectfully tune him out don't really listen to him oh i gotta tell you i gotta tell you so diane i grew up as a caddy up in north north st louis and the worst days of working at the shop was the husband wife tournaments because there were fights you could tell people are coming in the ones that played well or happy you know maybe they had a glass of wine the other ones were like one gets out of the hard side of the cart he gets out of his side of the cart and they're walking separate ways we were laughing you know we were we were teenagers but it's just a not it's not an easy mix to have your husband try to coach you especially yeah and i don't know if this is the case for you but half the husbands aren't worth a damn either yeah yeah you know they don't necessarily putt well yeah there she is she's so nice he kind of is well that's perfect that's nice you say that that's why you're happily married and playing golf together so it's a good start right off the bat well hopefully that helped you uh diana it was an awful lot of fun talking to you i appreciate it thanks for calling it and enjoy those grandkids thanks so much bye bye uh diane what a cool lady our grandkids she kind of snuck that into the story and playing with your husband and that dance uh she handles it very very well i think her whole game gets better the more she can kind of separate some of that side coaching yeah yep uh it's great stuff the whacking chase is becoming popular uh diane again thanks for um calling in and you know man the show flew by probably that's gonna wrap up the 19th hole we uh we made it through another show love it absolutely love it it was fun me thanks so much for working the board for us and trying to keep us on track that is not an easy job um this is golf with j delsing on 101 espn and hit him straight st louis that was golf with j delsing brought to you by whitmore country club tune in next sunday for more from j jon and the other pros and experts from the golf world in the meantime you can find all of j shows at 101 espn.com as well as at j delsing golf.com science proves quality sleep is vital to your mental emotional and physical health the sleep number 360 smart bed senses your movements and automatically adjusts to help keep you both effortlessly comfortable and it's 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