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Now, on to the podcast. We often think of generosity as a sacrifice, but what if it's actually one of the smartest ways to live? I am Rob West. When we live with open hands, God not only blesses others through us, He transforms us in the process. Chip Ingram joins us to talk about the genius of generosity and why giving God's way doesn't lead to loss, but to gain.
Then it's on to your calls at 800-525-7000. This is Faith and Finance, biblical wisdom for your financial decisions.
Well, it is an absolute joy to welcome Chip Ingram to the program. He's the founder, teaching pastor, and CEO of Living on the Edge, a discipleship ministry dedicated to helping Christians live like Christians. Chip is also the author of The Genius of Generosity and numerous other books on Christian living and discipleship. Chip, great to have you with us today. Great to be with you, Rob.
Thanks so much. Chip, your book, The Genius of Generosity, opens with this great story about your friend John and what you describe as a secret pact. I'd love for you to share how that experience influenced and ultimately transformed your understanding of generosity and stewardship. Absolutely. John, in my mind, of course, back then, he was like this really, really older guy.
He was like 70. I'm in my late 20s, brand new pastor, don't know what I'm doing. He watches me for a couple of years, invites me down. I would learn later he was the owner of Savile Dodge accounting firm, big class building.
So he has me come down and we have a lunch in this place that makes me uncomfortable, very high class. And, you know, I come from very sort of middle-class roots to say the least. And then he, after lunch, he has a little white box. And he says, I'd like you to open it. I open the white box and has a checkbook in it.
He goes, turn to the back. I turn to the back, and it says, Pastor's discretionary fund. Then he looks at me and says, Chip, you don't have to do this, but here's what I'd like you to do. I came to Christ late. God's given me money.
I don't have a lot of time. I go into the prisons once a month. But I want you to take this checkbook, put it in your back pocket every single day, and anytime you see a need that Jesus wants to meet, Um, or you think as we get to know each other, I would want to help. I just want you to write him a check. This is back in the day when everyone used checks, yeah.
And so, you know, I'm feeling a little overwhelmed. And gosh, am I going to do that? And then, about three times a year, he would invite me down and we would open the checkbook. And, you know, he's an accountant, right?
So, yeah, I was pretty in my finances. If the bank said we were within about 20 bucks, that's good for me. I'm not going to spend three hours trying to figure out where that 20 bucks is. But when I'm going to give it to an accountant and it's his money, it was like I made sure all the numbers really balanced. And I guess what I would say, it was the most unusual experience I've ever had.
I can still remember the first time I did it in a grocery store of a woman who was abandoned by her husband, two kids in a cart crying. Filled her car with gas. We gave her food. Another family whose electricity was turned off. And I would share these stories with John.
And he was bold, cared not what anyone thought. Exclusive, top of the, think of Dallas, high-rise, 34th floor restaurant. And we would, I'd tell him this story. He would lean back, and I mean, so embarrassing, praise the Lord. I mean, really loud.
I want it to hide under the table. And yet what I realized was, uh, John was not cool. But what I realized over time was, I started sharing my life with John. I took care of his finances better than my finances. It got to be really fun every day wondering who's God going to bring in my life today.
And I mean, I got to be the giver and joyful, amazing. I mean, meeting all kinds of needs and then go to these lavish lunches. And uh John and I we had nothing in common. I'm a Young 29, 30-something, very athletic guy. He's a really old, nerdy accounting type, real, you know, bookkeeping type mentality.
And I got to where John became one of the best friends, almost like a father figure to me. And the day came, it was about 10 years later. This is how slow I am. Rob, I remember preparing to do a message and thinking, gosh, I think we're so off on generosity and guilt and oughts and shoulds. And God brought that relationship back, and it was like, oh.
So God does for everyone what John did for me, and the genius of generosity was born out of that relationship. Incredible. I'm confident there's some people in our listening audience today that the light bulb just went off and they said, I get it. I now understand stewardship. Folks, when we come back, we're going to continue to unpack this.
What if God blesses you to increase your standard of giving, not your standard of living? Back with Chip Ingram with much more just around the corner. Stick around. Uh Faith Phi is grateful for support from One Ascent. One Ascent believes that your values inspire why you invest and how they can inspire how you invest.
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So glad to have you with us today on Faith and Finance. What if generosity could be an adventure? We're talking about the genius of generosity today with my friend Chip Ingram. Chip's the founder, teaching pastor, and CEO of Living on the Edge. You probably listened to it on your local radio station, or maybe you've read one of his books, including the genius of generosity that we're discussing today.
And Chip, before the break, you told this incredible story of you as a pastor in your 20s understanding what it means to be a steward as you had the opportunity to give away someone else's money. And that, I'm sure, was a game changer for you as you approached managing the resources of John completely different than you would have your own. And we all sit in that posture today, right? We manage money for the King of Kings. Yeah, we really do.
And then, you know, the illustration kept growing because what I realized was: one, It was in spending his money his way that John and I became close friends. And now, what I've learned over these years, it's when I do that with the Lord. That generosity is the gateway to intimacy with God. And it's just really an amazing experience to realize He's entrusted me and everyone listening with. Various levels, but money and time and resources and energy.
And it went from obligation to really what you said, it was an adventure, and there was such joy. And I began to practice that in my personal life and teach it through this little book and some others. And it has changed the whole. In fact, I started doing a little study, and you know, there's a lot of these going on right now. They're called virtue studies.
You know, what's the medical issues of being grateful or what's forgiving someone? Yes. When people are generous, if the Bible did not exist, The root word means it's creative, it's life-giving, it produces. People that are generous are happier. People that are generous, they live longer.
People that are generous have better friends. People that are generous have a life of joy that others don't. God created us to depend on Him and be stewards instead of owners with an abundance mentality, not a scarcity. If I give this away, who will take care of me? And at the end of the day, Rob, I really think one of the very first tests of the children of Israel was trusting God.
There's no better way to see Him show up. than when we say, you know, my time is yours, my money is yours, I will give the first and the best. but not like writing a bill. And something I do. And, you know, in my early years, I did it with five and $20 bills.
And, you know, as I've gotten older and all my kids are out, and I would encourage people, I always carry cash now. And now, even when I go on a trip, I'll put maybe $200 or $300 bills. And I just ask God, there's going to be some desperate people, I mean, really, really hurting. And, you know, maybe they're cleaning the bathroom at an airport or you see someone tearing up. But as you sit, I'm at a lot of airports.
Yes. And you go and ask a few questions. And all I can tell you is when we begin to make generosity a habit, it just becomes such a joyful part of our life. That is so powerful. I love what my friend Todd Harper says.
He says, I've never met an unhappy, generous person. And that's just so true. And then, you know, our friend Chip Ron Blue, you know, he says, My favorite way to give is cash, just because you find the person that feels. Feels unseen, and just what a way to make them feel seen and to be blessed by God. And what that does as it wells up inside you is just incredible.
Now, it's so much more than a moral virtue, Chip. You call it genius in this little book. Talk about how generosity uniquely connects us to others. There's something that happens Think of all the patterns. Number one, every time I make a financial decision, it's a spiritual decision, according to Jesus.
Because wherever my money goes, that's really, that's where my heart will follow.
So the moment I give, something happened between me and God. I recognize it's his. Second, when you give to another person, it builds a bond. It might be a short bond. It could be a long one.
I remember many, many years ago, just again, it's been a journey for me. And I would get up super early with, you know, had kids at the time and pastoring a large church and a lot of demands. And so I would get at this sort of bagel donut shop about 4:30 or 5 in the morning. We became friends. They would have coffee ready and they were going to be baking.
And I would sit in a corner and a homeless guy would come in who just looked like he'd been on drugs for 30 years and just stared. And I'd say hi, no response, no response. I mean, months like this. And you know, just one day I just thought, well, I'm not getting through. And I ordered mine.
And then I said, hey, do you want something? No response. I decided I got him a coffee and a bagel. Put it in front of him, no response. I sit behind him over in the corner where I did my study.
I was working on sermons. And then it was about five minutes. and you know there was a window, it was still dark. and I hear him say Do you realize that Venus only looks like that one or two times in the whole year? Mm.
I said, what? He said, yeah, look out the window. And you know, we think we know where homeless people have come from. I mean, he opened up and shared his story. We became friends.
I watched God just transform his life. It all began with the cost of a cup of coffee and a bagel that he didn't want. And I have just seen that can happen. God has that all around us if we get our antenna up. our eyes off our phone.
And saying, Lord. What would you like to? Who do you want to love today through me? And I think it's those little moments that then lead to bigger moments when he taps you on the shoulder and And I remember not all that long ago, and he just said, Hey, Chip, you know, I know your financial planner thinks you're going to live till you're 100, and they've got all these things planned out. Take this in a good way, Rob.
I know you're the financial planner guy. But I got news. Most people are not going to live to be 100. And I just, I start meeting people like all my retirement or what's set aside for retirement that can only be used for. If I live to 100 or take, now we have to plan.
But God's tapped me on the shoulder now and then and said, You know what, Chip? This is an opportunity and a need, and I want to test you so your security's not there. I want you to give a six-figure gift. I said, Well, Lord, I don't have six-figures. And He says, Well, over here in your retirement, Do you think I could fill that in?
Well, of course you could, Lord. And so I think it's those moments where it might be. $20 cash one day, and it might be thousands of dollars where God just keeps reminding us. I want you to know I've got plenty. The story with John, I have to tell you, is, you know, I would get my bank statements.
And it was like miraculous. You know, I'd go meet for lunch and then I'd get my bank statement. I had $5,000 in it again. Then I'd give it all away and I'd go for lunch and then I'd have $5,000. It didn't matter how much I spent or what I did, it always got filled up.
And it just reminded me that when God can find people that are generous, And we give away our money and our time, and we do it with a heart not to earn or prove or compare, but just, oh, Lord, you love people. He just has an amazing way to keep refilling up because he can't find all that many people who recognize it's all his and are open-handed with it. And when he does, he longs to bless. Boy, he sure does. We've got just about 30 seconds left.
For someone out there today who perhaps is at the other end of the spectrum, they feel like they don't have much to give and they want to honor God. What would you say to that person? Start small. It's your view of God that needs to change, not your circumstances. I thought honestly that once I get rich someday, if I ever did, or if I was more holy, then I'll start to give.
You need to practice generosity today. Do what you can where you're at and watch God grow your heart. and often will take care of a lot of other needs as well. The genius of generosity is that when we give, we don't lose. We actually gain.
God designed generosity to free our hearts, deepen our faith, and multiply joy. Chip, what a treat. Thanks for being with us. My joy. Bye-bye.
That's Chip Ingram, founder, teaching pastor, and CEO of Living on the Edge. Learn more at livingonthege.org. Back with your questions after this. Stick around. You can do more than make a year-end gift.
You can become a FaithFi partner. Hi, I'm Rob West. When you give a one-time gift of $400 or more, or $35 a month, you'll receive our quarterly Faithful Steward magazine, two devotionals a year, including my brand new devotional, Our Ultimate Treasure, and access premium tools in the FaithFi app. But most of all, you help others to live as Faithful Stewards. Become a FaithFi partner before December 31st at faith5.com slash partner.
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I'm Rob West. Looks like we have one line open today: 800-525-7000. You can call right now. Let's head to Alabama. Annie, go right ahead.
You know, I have a will and already made up. And so this company that came to our church and was telling us about we needed a trust also.
So and they were going to charge me three thousand dollars to, you know, do all my insurance, my my everything, you know, capital that I had, finance that I had. And so I thought that it was a little bit steep But uh the question for you is Uh do I need a trust? You do not need a trust.
So, a simple will is enough. If your estate is fairly simple, if all of your major assets have named beneficiaries, so if you have investment accounts or an IRA or life insurance policy, you'll want a named beneficiary. And then on your home, if your estate allows, I'd have to look it up, but you could have a TOD deed transfer on death. And if you don't mind going through probate for everything left, meaning the will would name an executor, the executor would work through the probate court. There would be some time and expense to get everything settled.
But as long as you're willing to work through the probate court or your executor is, then a will will be just fine. The reason a trust is sometimes added, and you're right, it is more expensive by a good bit from a basic will. Is people want to avoid probate.
So with a revocable living trust, your anything inside the trust will not go through probate.
So therefore, the court is not involved. There's not the time and the expense. It's not a part of the public record.
So, you have a little bit more control over how and when heirs receive assets. It creates a bit more of an efficient transfer. And it can go into effect prior to your death if you became incapacitated.
So, it would allow someone, the trustee, to easily manage your finances if you become incapacitated. That is not the case with a will. It doesn't go into effect until you die.
So, you would need other mechanisms like a durable power of attorney or something like that. Um so is a will or excuse me is a trust necessary? No. Does it have some added benefits? Yes.
And then it's just a function of: you know, are those things things I'm looking for? And if not, then you're fine with your will. Yeah, and so they were saying that I would be in probe, my children and whoever else maybe would be in probate court for years or months fighting over everything because my will would just not be enough. And that kind of made me a little skittish. And so I thought I said, maybe I do need to get a trust in.
Yeah, I mean, I don't love the sound of what you're describing here. It sounds like they're trying to create, you know, a sale. In what they're describing, because with a simple will that's valid and uncontested with one home and a few bank accounts, and all the beneficiaries agree and cooperate, you know, probate can wrap up in four to six months from the initial filing to the final distribution.
So, you know, unless there's something that's really complicated or there's a disagreement, you know, slow asset transfers or court backlogs or, you know, you've got a dispute between beneficiaries, that's where it can drag on. But if it's fairly simple and uncontested, three to six months, I would say, is probably realistic. Ah, okay.
So I will have to go into probate court anyway, huh, with the wheel. They will have to. They will with the will. The trust would avoid avoid probate. Yes.
Okay.
Okay.
Got it. All right. Thank you for your call, Annie. Lord bless you. Rochelle, you've been very patient today there in Louisiana.
How can I help you?
So I've heard you talk about capital gain a lot. with the fact that you purchase a home for a particular price. But how does the capital gain work when you build your own home? and you have a spa HELOC one. Yeah.
It's a great question. The HELOC itself doesn't create capital gains because borrowing money is not a taxable event.
So when someone takes out a home equity line of credit, they're borrowing against the equity in their home. The funds they receive are not income and not subject to capital gains. The capital gains occur when you sell the property.
So, capital gains taxes only come into play when the property is sold for more than the cost basis. Which in your case would be what you paid for the land plus the improvements. And so the amount you owe on the HELOC doesn't affect whether or not you owe capital gains. It only affects how much cash you walk away with after the sale. The capital gains only come into play upon the sale of the property.
And that would be based on: is the selling price of the property greater than the cost basis, which again would be the purchase of the land and then the improvements and construction and all of the things that make up what the original value was? Does that make sense? It does, but.
So if my house is worth around 400,000. then and if that's what I sold it for.
Well, that's what it's worth today. The question is: what is your cost basis?
So, you know, a cost basis on a home that you built. Uh you know, you bought the land at some point, right? Um no, I did not have to buy the land to put it on there. All right, how did you receive it? Uh, through a divorce.
Okay.
So you received it, the land only, and then you built on top of it, or the home was already built when you received it? I built the home after Hurricane Laura.
Okay.
So you would have to determine what your true cost basis is, and a CPA could help you do that.
So when you received the land through the divorce, it was land only. There was no improvements. No improvements now.
Okay, yeah, so it was just raw land. Yeah. So you would have to basically go back and reconstruct your original cost basis based on the cost of construction. And then that would determine: okay, what do I have in this property? The total amount invested in this property, that's my cost basis.
And then you'll take the selling price when you actually sell it someday, subtract that cost basis, and then that's the amount that would be subject to capital gains. But keep in mind: if this is your primary residence, you can set aside, if you're single, filing a single status, you can set aside up to $250,000 in capital gains. without paying any tax on it if it's your primary residence.
Okay, all right. I forgot about that part. Yeah. So as long as you haven't taken advantage of that in the last two years and you've lived in this home as your primary residence for two out of the last five years prior to the sale, then the first $250,000 in gain is gone. There is no capital gains tax whatsoever.
All right. Thank you very much, sir.
Okay, thanks for your call today. Folks, that's going to do it for us.
So thankful to have you along with us today. Let me say a big thanks to my team today, working really hard. Amy and Taylor and Dan and Gabby T on our phones today, plus everybody here at FaithFi. We'll see you next time. Bye-bye.
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