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Okay. Mentoring often sounds like the perfect way to steward your time in retirement until you try it and realize it's not as intuitive as you hoped. I am Rob West. For many retirees, mentoring seems like a meaningful way to invest in the next generation, a way to put their life experience to work. But what if we've misunderstood how mentoring fits into God's design for this season of life?
Jeff Hainan joins us with practical stories and spiritual insight to help us reframe it. And then it's onto your calls at 800-525-7000. This is Faith in Finance, biblical wisdom for your financial journey. My friend Jeff Hainan is an accomplished entrepreneur and the founder of the Denver Institute for Faith and Work. He's also the author of the insightful book, An Uncommon Guide to Retirement: Finding God's Purpose for the Next Season of Life.
It's my go-to book for this topic, and we give away a ton of them. Jeff, great to have you back on the program. Yeah, great to be back. Thanks, Rob. Jeff, I know mentoring has become a key way you think about stewarding this season of life.
What is it that makes it so meaningful to you? Yeah, it's a great question. I think if we believe that retirement is something less like an ongoing vacation and more like elders stewarding this season of life to bless and to lift up a coming generation, we have to talk about mentoring. And mentoring is that opportunity that we have to pour into somebody's life. And yet, as you said in the intro, it can be trickier than I thought.
I've actually had great experiences with mentoring, as well as some very difficult experiences where they did not go as planned.
Well, let's talk about some of those best practices then.
So, as you've evaluated various mentoring relationships, yours and others, what key elements make a mentoring relationship truly thrive? Yeah, you know, I think of a story of somebody who mentored me. His name was John. And after an event that I put on once, he came up to me and said, You know, that was the best event that I have ever seen. And I kind of was humbled and didn't know actually what to say.
He then both affirmed what I was doing as well as challenged and said, How come nobody's ever heard of you guys? I think there's something interesting in that combination in mentoring of affirming a coming generation because people doubt whether they have the skills. They really have what it takes in the world, right? Young people, as well as maybe everybody, as well as challenging. There are opportunities before you to grow.
And I think that combination is really golden. I love that he had his antenna up for that and his natural follow-on to seeing God at work was to invite you into that type of relationship. I'm wondering how many in our listening audience today, Jeff, might be in that same position. And this is a call to them to step out and invite somebody into a relationship like that. Would you agree?
Yeah, I absolutely would agree. And I think one of the things that we think about with mentoring is oftentimes they come in the structure of these very formal programs: you sit together once a month, you have coffee, and you know, the Yoda-like insight will pass to the young Padawan at the end of an hour. And it very rarely actually works like that. And so, in the book, one of the things I advocate for is thinking about it maybe less than less like mentoring and more like intergenerational friendship, where there's genuine mutuality, where we're giving and receiving, and we really enjoy being around each other. I think that structure of intergenerational friendship has the power to do what mentoring promises.
Yeah, that's powerful.
So, let's unpack that a bit more. What does that actually look like in practice? Yeah, I think intergenerational friendship really looks like mutuality.
So I think when we're thinking about developing a friendship, it's something like the combination of self-disclosure, I will share something about my life, and then potentially reciprocity where somebody else shares about their life. And if you do both of those things, we're on the pathway to growing in a relationship.
So I think the intergenerational friendship, one of the things that that intergenerational piece that's very challenging is we actually have to be around people from a very different background. They may think about life or tech or culture or relationships very differently. But I think finding context to be in organic relationships with people from a different generation from you is the first context. And those can be in programs, those can be in local churches, it could be at local clubs. There could be a lot of different ways to do that.
But I think they best actually happen organically rather than a highly structured process. Yeah, interesting. And this is quite a bit different than perhaps the cultural view of many. And so, when we come back after this break, we'll talk about what this perhaps healthier, more effective model looks like. We'll also talk about how you can get started.
What does this look like for you, and what's your next step? We're talking with Jeff Heinen today, he's the author of the book, An Uncommon Guide to Retirement: Finding God's Purpose for the Next Season of Life. And we're talking mentoring today. Perhaps it can become your greatest investment in retirement. Much more on that just around the corner.
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So, you're in retirement and you're thinking about how to take the wisdom and experience to be that elder to invest in a coming generation. Perhaps mentoring is the way to do that. I am Rob West. With me today, my friend Jeff Hainan. Jeff is the author of the insightful book, An Uncommon Guide to Retirement: Finding God's Purpose for the Next Season of Life.
And, Jeff, before the break, you were talking about really a different vision for mentoring. Perhaps it's more like an intergenerational friendship. And I know in the book, you talk about how there are some biblical models for this that we can draw from. I'd love for you to share some of those. Yeah, so I think as we think about this idea of mentoring as intergenerational friendship, it finds a natural home in the Bible.
Jesus once said, I no longer call you servants. Instead, I've called you friends.
So we do have models, Paul mentoring Timothy, Samuel mentored Saul and David. Elijah mentored Elisha. But what was interesting is that their hearts were both, they were not focused so much on the stage as they were focused on God himself. And I think one of the interesting things for Christians entering into this relationship, this mentoring relationship, is blessing not only flows from wise to the naive, but from the foolish back to the wise again. It says in 1 Corinthians 1 that that's the nature of God's upside-down kingdom is that we become strong through weakness, we gain riches through giving them away, the first, the last, and the servants are greatest.
So I do think there's a real humility and a posture of older, of course, giving to the younger, but potentially learning from the younger as well, and younger giving to the older and vice versa.
So I think there's a lot of opportunity. For Christians to think, I have something to receive in this relationship, and I have something to give, real mutuality. Yeah.
Well, let's uh talk about what this looks like then practically, because I know you've said our cultural view of mentoring can actually get in the way of this.
So what does that more effective model look like to you? Yeah, I think there's a handful of things to think about if you're considering mentoring in retirement. One, you know, skilled mentors really find genuine delight in a coming generation. They develop friendships based on common interests.
So find something that you can do or that you just really enjoy doing with somebody from another generation. I think that's just the foundation. Second, Skilled mentors, they really bless and they affirm a younger generation. I do think that there's people that wonder if they're going to make it in the world, young people as well as older. And I think that blessing and affirmation, it doesn't first start with advice.
It first starts to saying, you have something valuable to give to the world. I also believe skilled mentors, they share their stories and they're genuinely vulnerable with their mentees. You don't have to think, I've got it all together and this is what you need to learn, right? We learn from people's successes, but I would say having done a whole bunch of events on stage, people genuinely learn the most from your vulnerability and your failures.
So be willing to share your failures and so your mentee doesn't necessarily have to go through those same failures. And I also say there's nothing magical about one hour or two hours. Skilled mentors, they're patient. They commit to long-term relationships. Those long-term relationships with a mentor can open doors and really walk alongside a mentee for a long time, makes a big difference.
And then the last thing I would say is mentors that are really good, they just Ask the right questions. Jesus himself, right at the beginning of his ministry, says, What do you want me to do for you? He was always asking his disciples the right question that allowed his mentees, disciples, right, to say, huh, what is the right answer here? And when they come to the answer themselves, the mentees, they own that answer much more so than if you just give it to them. Boy, that is so well said.
All right.
So, somebody in our listening audience today, Jeff, is saying, Yes, I'm in. Where do they start? What does that look like?
Well, I got to think that the local church is genuinely the best place to start. Local churches, majority of them ought to be at least intergenerational. And there's opportunities there. And so there could be opportunities for you get to know and to care about a young adult in a young adults group and you just being showing up.
So I just think there's a part of showing up in a context that you may be less comfortable with, like the young adults group, and saying, I'm here to learn or I'm here to serve in some way. That could be one opportunity. There could be opportunities mentoring in work. A lot of people that are retired or going into retirement have a ton of professional ability and skill left to give. And so still staying connected in some ways to younger people in your profession or in your work, it could be in a relational way, but it could be through consulting.
But there's a lot of opportunity as well right there. Yeah.
Jeff, you've talked about elements of these meetings for intergenerational friendship, but I think folks often think. That there needs to be a more formal plan with some structure.
So, talk about whether that's right or whether this more organic approach is better. They can both be right. Let's take advantage of the opportunities that we have. And so, for instance, I'm working on a project at my church right now, training up future pastors.
So, we have a program for interns, apprentices, and pastoral residents to get experience in church ministry and to do some of the interior work. And we pull in mentors, right? And so, we do actually create some of that context and that structure.
However, if it's only around that structure and you check off the boxes and you've met the four times during the year, it probably won't be very fruitful for the mentee or the mentor. It really will have to go to the process of, huh, this is a valuable friendship. This is really something that is life-giving to me. And I think in that respect, there can be just as much blessing comes to the mentor as the mentee when it's a life-giving friendship and a relationship. Because even when I'm around younger people, say in their earlier or their mid-20s, their hopefulness, their future-looking perspective on the world is incredibly.
Life-giving to me.
So, I think those are all pieces of mentoring that can be helpful. Yeah.
So, what would you say to someone who's in our audience today, they're nearing retirement, and they want to invest their time wisely by mentoring someone younger? What would be your next bit of advice? Yep, find where the people are that are in a different generation and go hang out and build friendships. I would just say start there. Excellent.
What role has prayer played in these relationships where you've seen it be effective? That's great. Yeah, I think prayer actually has to be central, whether it's in those actual meeting times or outside of it. But I think prayer is absolutely central because whenever there's two people in a Christian relationship, of course, there is a third person that you need to bring in. I would also say there's a type of prayer that I do in my meetings that it's almost listening prayer in the context of not only is what this person is saying to me, but God, what do you want me to be saying to this person in this context?
And so, if Paul says pray without ceasing, there does need to be some of this context of being sensitive to the direction of the Holy Spirit in the meeting as well.
So, both for their future, for their relationships, for their work, all of those things, but also for the moment. What does it mean for us to be responsive to the Spirit and to really say just as what God would want us to say? Yeah, very good. Jeff, we have just about a minute left. You know, I love the uncommon retirement because it really challenges this cultural view of retirement.
So, for somebody who's perhaps a couple of years out, what would you leave them with in terms of preparation for this season other than picking up a copy of the book, which I completely affirm? What should they be thinking about as they plan for this next chapter?
Well, in this next chapter, as we think about what will life look like, and assuming you've been listening to Faith Phi and your finances are, you know, squared and in place, you got to think about what your life will look like and how you will fill your time.
So, this could be work. This could be volunteering, but mentoring, I think, is absolutely central to this. And it is something for your listeners to think about. What if, you know, the 87% of boomers and now Gen Xers move into, you know, retirement, like, what if they spent their time mentoring young people through their church? They swapped.
Retirement villages for impact. What could that look like for our country and for our world? It would change everything, Jeff.
So appreciate your time today, my friend. Thanks for being here. Thank you. Folks, pick up a copy of this book. It's called An Uncommon Guide to Retirement: Finding God's Purpose for the Next Season of Life with Jeff Hainan.
A quick break and then back with your questions after this: 800-525-7000. We'll be right back. We're grateful for support from Movement Mortgage, who provides residential home loans in all 50 states. Guided by a mission to love and value people and a goal to redefine the mortgage process, Movement seeks to help others achieve their financial goals. You can find out more at movement.com/slash faith.
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The number 800-525-7000. That's 800-525-7000 to St. Louis. I'm Michael. Go ahead.
Thanks for taking my call, longtime listener. Great.
So I had a question about finding mortgage rates.
So I looked at bankrate.com and I only had one mortgage company that popped back out to me.
So I was looking for others. I checked the website of the mortgage company you guys have been talking about. with the charitable background, but I didn't on their website, I didn't find anything for Saint Louis. And so I was Looking for resources for more options to try and find a quality mortgage lender. And then also you know, narrowing it down to three based on points.
and the rates about trying to get a quality Answer on what their interest rate would be without them pulling a hard credit, and you know, I got multiple hard credit pulls, and then it's gonna affect my. credit score and then possibly affect my rate.
Okay. Did you say that's already happened? Where the hard inquiries? It hasn't happened. No, it hasn't happened.
I just want to make sure what to say to them to keep that from happening. Yeah, got it. Yeah.
I mean, you would have to give them permission to pull your credit for the purpose of evaluating whether or not they would extend you a loan and what the terms are. And you would have to authorize that.
So, you know, I think you can basically do some initial fact finding just based on what you might share with them as your credit score.
Now, eventually, they're going to need to pull a lender's report, which has a different score and a different scoring algorithm, and they're going to use that for their ultimate determination. But just as you're checking around, you can absolutely avoid having them pull the report until you nail down perhaps the two or three lenders you want to receive good faith estimates from. In terms of the period in which you do that, all the hard inquiries you authorize. Within a two-week window, they are considered one by most credit scoring algorithms.
So I wouldn't worry about that, but I would kind of do your homework and be ready to proceed. Let's say you pick three, I'd probably do that in a fairly short window of time. I will say Movement Mortgage, who is the underwriter here and we have a lot of faith in, does work in all 50 states, including Missouri. And so that would be one you could check with movement.com/slash faith, and they could give you a callback and give you all the details. But I think you're on the right track here.
Definitely, you know, this is often the biggest transaction most of us will have. And therefore, you should get two or three bids. Right. Anybody else besides bank rate that would have the mortgage rates You could go to like, you know, Lending Tree or one of those online that would do a search for you and kind of look at all the low-cost providers in the space. But I would make sure you go with somebody who's reputable, which is why we recommend Movement, because there's a lot more to it than just the rate and the term in terms of getting you from the initial inquiry all the way through the closing table.
But certainly worth checking and having some things to compare it to. And I think that's where some of these online tools can be really helpful. I'd probably check Lending Tree in addition to Bankrate. All right, thank you very much. Thanks for being on the program today.
Lord bless you. Pennsylvania is where we're headed next. Hi, Ellen. Go ahead. Hi.
I we were thinking of giving to our nephew, either now while we're living or after we pass away. And so I wanted to tell my brother About like a special needs trust versus an ABLE account, what the difference is? Yes, very good. It's a great, great question. You know, they can work very closely together.
Essentially, the special needs trust would let you leave money for your nephew without hurting his government benefits, like Medicaid or SSI. It can hold larger amounts and be used for many expenses. It's managed by a trustee. It's often used for an inheritance. But the key is that qualification for Medicaid or SSI, even with those assets that could, you know, go a long way toward helping him maintain his lifestyle throughout his life.
The ABLE account is a tax advantage savings account for disability-related expenses. You can have up to $100,000 in it without affecting SSI, and it can be spent on qualified disability expenses. It's better for smaller gifts while you're living.
So, I think both of them can work very. Closely together, kind of in tandem to one another, and serve a great purpose. You know, I think the key is the special needs trust is going to be a little more costly. You'll have to have an attorney set it up, but it can hold a lot more. And, you know, I think the key would be that it really comes down to how much you're looking to put away over time.
And, you know, for most people, if we're talking about putting away certainly more than $100,000, you're going to need that special needs trust. The question is, do you also want the able alongside it? Does that make sense? Yes. Thank you.
Okay, yeah. I would think about the ABLE account being for daily living expenses and the special needs trust for an inheritance or big ticket items. The ABLE account is better for housing and food and basic expenses without hurting the SSI. The special needs trust is for larger funds and broader expenses. But you have to be careful with the basic living costs because if you use it for basic living, it can affect the SSI.
And that's where the ABLE account, you know, working together can be really helpful.
So what I would do, Ellen, is get with an attorney who specializes in this type of trust. And, you know, they can talk through all the mechanics of getting it set up and then decide what goes into the special needs trust versus what goes into the ABLE account. But sounds like you're a wonderful aunt. And I love that you're thinking in advance about how you could bless this nephew of yours throughout his life. Thanks for calling today.
Let's go to Nashville. Jennifer, go right ahead. Hi, thanks for grabbing my call. My husband left a year ago. I had $150,000 in cash.
I have spent $100,000. I spent money when we were married and I only have $50,000 left. I have stopped all of that and I think I've worked through the shame and embarrassment of it all. And I really don't know where to go from here. I have a GED and I had a traumatic brain injury and so I don't have the energy and the stuff I used to have to be able to go out and sell and make a decent amount of money.
it's gonna be a different life. Where do I start?
Well, Jennifer, first of all, I appreciate your call and your transparency. And it sounds like you've been through it. And I'm delighted you're reaching out for some help. And I'd love to provide that. What I would recommend is that we get you connected with a certified Christian financial counselor.
We have a team of counselors that have been trained to do just that, to come alongside God's people and help you create a plan, look at your assets and liabilities, help you put a spending plan in place and see if we can come up with a budget that allows you to preserve what's left of your savings, live within your means. And I realize that's easier said than done, but they can help you at least understand where you are and where you go from here. And we'd love to cover the cost of that person meeting with you several times to put all that in place.
So let's do this. I'm at the end of the program. You stay on the line. We'll finish up off the air and I'll get a counselor in touch with you. Hang right there.
Hey, big thanks to my team today. Devin, Sandy, Jim, everybody here at Faith Five. You'd like to become a partner, that's how you can support our work. Just head to faithfight.com and click give. We'll see you tomorrow.
Bye-bye. Faith in Finance is provided by FaithFi and listeners like you.
