Missions Monday Witnessing to the Lost

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Good afternoon and welcome to Truth Talk Live. We are in for a treat today. We have a guest. Her name is Cindy. And Cindy's going to share about her Coming out of the Mormon Church.

She has a heart for the Mormons. We have a heart for the Mormons. And we are just excited, Cindy, to have you share with us Are you there with us now, Cindy? Yes, sir, I am here.

Okay, excellent.

So Cindy Would you want to begin? the program just by sharing a little bit about what it was like for you being a member of the Mormon church. You were born into it, I take it? Yes, my family goes back to almost the daughters of the Utah pioneers. family settled in Emory County, which most people, even Utah, don't know where that is, but it's south of Price about thirty miles, maybe a little bit more.

And he had, my grandfather had a coal mine and a large ranch there. And that's where I grew up. up until my teenage years. in a little town that only had a Mormon church. And even the towns around us, Huntington, Orangeville, all of them only had a Mormon church.

You either went to the Mormon church or the local bar. There was no in-between, no other denominations around. And then being involved in Southern California, very committed as a Mormon. would end up becoming a seminary and institute teacher. Totally believed it, never thought I would ever leave.

Okay, okay. And so your mom and dad, the the were they married in the temple? No, no. In fact, that was probably one of the big embarrassments of life 'cause my mother got pregnant out of wedlock or wedlock.

So it was kept a big secret to me. I never found out I didn't find out the truth until I was. twenty nine, thirty years old, just before I Just as I was going through the whole thing of finding Jesus. She was the oldest of six daughters. Do you remember something called the patriarchal blessing?

What do you want to share with our listeners about that? Tell us about that.

Well, there's somebody that's anointed or called to be the patriarch in your stake, actually. And at least that's how it was when I was in the Mormon Church. And that you would set up an appointment with him for him to get a blessing that was supposed to be effective for the rest of your life. It would also declare what tribe of Israel you were from because the Mormons believe that if you aren't a Of the tribes at baptism, you literally have a transfusion and you become a member of one of the tribes. Myself, I was the descendant of Joseph through the tribe of Ephraim.

It also gives different other things that might stand out. The one that I just remember now is that I would be called to be a missionary, and this was back before. Kind of before there was really girls going on missions. And I've been on a longer mission than any Mormon that I know. I've been on a mission now for.

Almost 46 years as a missionary here to the South Pacific and Throughout the world, into Asia, and just returned from Central America, Honduras, and Belize. Missions are my life and um has lived this way.

Now more of my life than I actually lived as a Mormon. Wow, wow.

So when you received that patriarchal blessing, You really counted that as something sacred, something very meaningful to you. Um I'm trying to think of different milestones. in your life as a member of the Mormon Church. Could you share with me, like, maybe other things just to help our listeners? kind of maintained that burden for the Mormons.

uh the things that maybe you experienced As a Mormon that would. Um You know, just define your identity. Like, how was Jesus presented to you? in the Mormon Church. What was his identity?

Little or nothing. Uh even when people Would share their testimony or bear their testimony as they would say every Week, of course, I see things much more clearly now that I'm a believer, but one of the big questions that I had. When I was coming out, do they even care about Jesus? And so I went to a ward other than my own. And I just kept record of what people were thankful for, what they were sharing their testimony.

I can still remember the exact count. There were 33 people that shared their testimony, not making exception for age. Everybody was thankful for the church. They were thankful for Joseph Smith. They were thankful for the Book of Mormon.

No one was thankful for the Bible, and only three said that they knew that Jesus was the Christ, which is kind of a clutch saying that you say as a Mormon. And that was one of the biggest shockers to me to really see that. Probably one of the things that People ask me, is how did you come out of the Mormon church? You were so committed, you were so locked in. I can remember, um.

The prophet, I'm trying to remember who was prophet when I left. There's been so many. But anyway, he said to dig a we you needed to plant a garden. And even as a single woman, I went out and drug up my mother's front yard to plant a garden. Whatever they said to do, I didn't question it, I would just do it.

But I The main thing that brought me out of the church was meeting Jesus, the true and living Jesus, which is not. the Jesus of Mormonism. And that's always an interesting thing for me because whenever I get to talk to a Mormon, I say, I'll be wrong, and you can be right. But if you just compare our Jesuses, you can see that they're completely two different people, two different representations of the supernatural, two different representations of who God is. And they will never let me do it.

I have never let one come to where we would put down this plus this. And here's the difference. Because there's a radically, completely different situation.

So Jesus was not really a center. of anything that I did, even teaching seminary. And every day going in there, it was never centered on Jesus. It was centered more on the doctrines of the Mormon Church. Were were you ever taught, Cindy, that?

Yes, I'm here. Yeah, um Andy, w were you ever taught that sorry, were you ever taught that That Heavenly Father. Had a w a wife. Oh, all the time. I knew this scripture.

I used to think it was a scripture, but it's actually not a scripture-ship scripture. But this is my work and my glory to bring to pass the eternal life the immortality and eternal life of man. That is scripture out of the pearl of great price. But the Saying that God was once man, and as God, and as man is, God can become. That was something I quoted all the time.

I heard constantly in church that I was a God in embryo. I can even remember with my girlfriend sitting and planning how we would make our earth when we would do it. You know, we would eliminate cockroaches and mosquitoes, and we just had fun dreaming about how. not really dreaming, but just sharing how we were going to create our earth, removing anything that was a least bit of a challenge.

So definitely understood that there was a mother God. I can remember another friend talking about the mother God and saying that she thought that, well, God had at least three wives to represent the three races.

So it was common knowledge, common talked about that there was a mother in heaven as much as there was a father in heaven and that God lived in a polygamous situation in heaven, and that there was more than one mother.

So It was very, very common and very accepted. And this is not just Seminary, this is with my peer group. And so, let me just put this out to our listeners today. you have an interest to talk with Cindy. Let me give you a phone number that you can call right now and you can You can ask Cindy a question, ask me a question.

We want to let you know that we want you to have Peace with God, and that that peace is only found In Christ alone. And so that number is 866. Three four eight. 7884. That's 866.

Three, four, eight. 7884. I'm gonna say one more time. Stay on the line with us, call us in, call us that number, we'll put you on hold, and then after the break. We'll continue with Truth Talk Live with our friend Sidney Bauer.

That number again is 866-348-7884. We'll be right back. Truth Talk Live. Welcome back to Truth Talk Live. This is your host, Russ East.

I want to welcome all of our listeners in Dayton, Ohio, Toledo, Ohio. In the Carolinas and Utah. That's where I am right now. I'm in Ogden, Utah. And I'd like to invite you to come by and visit our new studio.

It's at 2417 Grant Avenue. Come by and get a cup of coffee at the coffee compound. And I've got a little office right inside there.

So I'm talking with Cindy Bauer, and Cindy's been sharing her heart. As to growing up Mormon, I have a question. If you'd like to call us, that number is 866-348-7884. Uh but Cindy, I want to just dive a little bit more into Um what it was like. being Mormon growing up.

We talked about the patriarchal blessing.

Now, did you do baptisms for the dead for fellow not fellow peers, but for Your peers would go to the temple, I take it, and you'd get baptized for people that had died in your family, and you'd do genealogy and get the names of people. Did you were you were you involved in that? Yes, I definitely was involved in that. And before I left the church, I was teaching a three-hour genealogy lesson every Sunday. I did tons of genealogy over and over and over again, and was completely committed to all that for to have work done for the dead.

So one of the big differences from with Mormonism is they think that there's people in spirit prison that they're sending missionaries down to.

So it's just kind of one of those rabbit holes that we could go down. That's another one of the things that set them so separate from Christians. I was on the break, I was thinking about it. It was Spencer W. Kimball that was the prophet when I came out in 77.

And the interesting thing you asked me about Jesus, he wrote the book. miracle of forgiveness and in that book he even states that Jesus didn't die for all sins.

So that gives you an idea of where where the whole presence of Jesus was. He's not the almighty everlasting God that was today, the same yesterday, today and forever.

So you hooked that to trying to do all this work for the dead. It really is dead works. But we would go in, have to dress and wipe, pin the person's name on us and go through. I can remember one of a grandma-like figure in my life. She had this And she had kept all the names of everybody that she had done work for the dead for, and she felt that she had been their savior.

So that gives you an idea of where the more and I didn't think that was a funny thing to say. I totally understood it. And I can still remember seeing the names and the dates on a little piece of paper that you pin on yourself because nobody can remember the name all the way through. And that's who the people that are officiating look at is that thing that you are standing in proxy for. It's a it's a giant rabbit hole, just a whole temple ceremony and et cetera, et cetera.

And I think a lot of that is one of the big reasons why Mormons are now trying to talk more about Jesus than they ever did when I was growing up in the church. The church changes with culture. When I left the Mormon Church, In 77, the blacks weren't allowed to hold any priesthood or anything. In 78, all of a sudden they had this revelation that the blacks could now come in and hold the priesthood. But the temple was threatened to be bombed, and the culture just didn't allow them to be so segregated as they were then.

So that gives you another thing there, a very evolving. They had very, very evolving Called. to keep up with what's going in, to try going on, to try to look as much like Christian as they possibly can. And it was really interesting. I was witnessing two Mormon missionaries down in Belize where I was just on the mission, on a mission with our mission organization.

And I just looked at him and I mean, I just, with everything in my heart, I said, you're not Christian. And they didn't even argue with me. They just said, well, go to the church of your choice. And I I I pray to them all the time because I just see their faces. They they didn't even know how to battle that, you know.

They I just said, You're not Christian, so don't tell people that you are. Yeah. It's a big thing. And I know they don't want to be called Mormons. That's how I grew up being known as a Mormon all my life in my school, et cetera, et cetera.

But they'll eventually make that culture of change. They want to be called LDS.

Well, that sounds just as ridiculous. To me, it sounds just as ridiculous as Mormon. It still shows that you're not. Why can't you call yourself a Christian? Because they're not.

I hope that answered your question. I think it does. It helps us. Who have a heart for Mormons or that have Mormon missionaries come to our doors, and we're not quite sure. You know what to say to them and everything.

So, to hear from you, Cindy, as to the kinds of things that you've experienced growing up in the Mormon church. It helps us deepen our compassion for the lost, for those who are in this Mormon church. Um you know but if we were to talk a little bit just about the temple We see these temples in Washington DC. We see them in Oakland, California, Southern California. There's so many.

In the state of Utah where my family lives, There's around 15 temples, 15. You know, and can you share with us Did you go through that first? uh l uh s part of the ceremonies where You know, maybe you weren't married in the temple, but you were getting prepared maybe for a mission, or did you ever go through any parts of the temple ceremony? Just a baptism for the dead. But here's an interesting part of my testimony that.

Was kind of the one of the final breaks of allowing me to move out of Mormonism besides hearing the audible voice of God. Yeah. a whole the whole and the interesting fact to know too, is the Mormons just sent sixty million dollars to purchase a piece of land here on Oahu in Hawaii to build another temple when there's already a temple maybe half an hour away. maybe an hour, hour to a half hour and a half. I mean, half an hour to an hour away.

So it's been one of these big shocking things for us to just go not another temple here. And they try to put them on every island here, too. It's kind of crazy. But so I was meeting Jesus, falling in love with Jesus, was hearing the gospel message over and over again. Because if you know that Jesus Revolution or the Jesus movement that happened in the 70s, it was pretty radical.

And one of the things that it did is it brought Christian music into being contemporary music, and there were concerts going on all the time.

So at every concert, you heard the gospel message. There was just so much happening everywhere. It was just the spirit was just radically alive. But I just couldn't let go of Mormonism. Even as many times as I saw Jesus and I felt a radical relationship with him, I saw a whole difference in my prayer life.

In fact, that's kind of a s Interesting story because the elders would hang out at my house all the time. And one elder I had known really well was there at the beginning of his mission. And at the end of the mission, he comes. He comes back to our area. And he asked me to come and speak at a um mission training uh for their zone.

The zone Training that they were having for the missionaries, and he asked me to come speak on the subject of how to win non-believers, non-Mormons, to Mormonism by using the Book of Mormon.

So it gives you some idea of. how committed I was to everything that was Mormonism. And as we were getting ready to leave my house, I said, let's pray first. I prayed. And then I, when I at the end of this conference, I didn't have to speak about my subject.

I could just share, quote unquote, bear my testimony. And I was so in love with Jesus, that's all I talked about. And afterwards, he pulls me aside and he says, well, I know the church is true and I know that Joseph Smith is a prophet, the typical things that they say. But he said to me, but I don't know the Savior like you do. And that was such a witness of the Holy Spirit in my life that Mormonism and Christianity, Mormonism and Jesus just don't fit together.

They don't. Here's a guy that had been on a mission for two and a half years, or probably two years because it was English speaking. And he could see a difference in me. It was just powerful. And then the other kind of radical, two more things that happens that are really powerful.

Number one is... I'm at a friend's house and he has um The Book out Mormonism Shadow of Reality by the Tanners. And I'm just flipping through it. It wasn't even most of the stuff I could just write off as ridiculous, ridiculous, ridiculous. But in that, they have a section that shows you the whole temple ceremony.

And this was somebody that was witnessing to me, and I didn't want them to know what I was reading. I Don't send me that music. Yeah, okay. Hold our butt because we have to take a break. And so stay with us here on Truth Talk Live.

You're listening to Cindy Bauer, our guest today. We'll be right back. If you'd like to be in on the conversation, you can call us right now at 866-348-7884. We'll be right back. Welcome back to Truth Talk Live.

This is Ruff East, your host on with you here from Ogden, Utah. Starting The Lord with in the bounds of the state of Utah. And so if you're listening anywhere, Sound of my voice, we'd love to hear from you. The number to call in is at 866-348-7884. Do you have a question for Cindy Bauer?

who was a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. And she was saved out of it. And you're dying to call right now. You want to get some help. You have a question as to how you can be better equipped to reach Mormons for Christ.

Cindy, continue on with where you left off before the break, please. All right, Russ.

So this particular friend was had been witnessing to me about Mormonism. And so that everybody understands too, it was a year and a half battle. I just didn't wake up one morning, but I had to battle through it to get to where I could see the truth of who Jesus was. I was so committed, so locked in. But the one thing I had not done is gone through the temple.

My bishop had come up to me and said, We'd be happy to send you through the temple, because remember, they didn't send girls on missions. I probably would have been sent on a mission if people were you weren't allowed to go on a mission until you were 21. And if you went on a mission back then, it was figuring that you were going to be an old maid type of thing.

So no girl really wanted to, whereas now they've added girls and have increased their mission fold by cabillions. And but the the The whole thing was a very difficult struggle. would lose my family, would be put on a plane, sent to Salik. City to talk to the general authorities and list goes on and on and on. I literally lost everything free.

pre-temple. I'm sorry, pre the cross.

So The temple was the one thing that I had not really been able to participate in. It was kind of that big carrot hanging out in front of me that, oof, I just went through that.

Well At this house that day, I started reading through the Temple ceremony, and I go, This is ridiculous. Secret name, pass, and then handshakes and passwords to get into. different to give to different angels, a veil that wasn't really a veil, and they had a picture in the book of what people looked like when they were dressed up and it had to be all white. And then back then they still had the washing and anointing where you took off all your clothes and had to be washed by somebody in every area of your body. And I was just reading, reading, reading, reading.

And they turned around to me and they said, what are you reading? And I just shut the book and said, oh, nothing. But then I went home and I shortly after that, and there had been one Mormon missionary who was a full-time missionary at the time that I had been, everything I was learning, I was sharing with him. And so I called him up. And I said This is back when the phones were still hooked to the wall, which some people may remember.

I stretched it as far as I could to get into my mother's laundry room. And I said, you have to tell me the truth. And he says, what are you calling? What about? What is it?

I said, no, you have to promise to tell the truth before I tell you. before I asked the question.

So after a little bit of coercing, he agreed to tell me the truth. And so I went through the temple ceremony and I said, is this true? And he's silent for a while, because back then you still had your death oath. If you reveal it to anybody, your neck would be slit open, your chest would be slit open, or your gut would be slit open. And he said yes.

And he told me that when he walked out of the temple for the first time, getting ready to go on his mission, he was asked if he still had a testimony. And so it was like this freeing thing when I found out how ridiculous. the temple ceremony was, and then to wear underwear the rest of your life next to your body. Of course, now that's something they're modernizing as well, too.

So you've I don't know if you've seen all the big back and forth with everybody on the internet of, oh, now we can go sleeveless. And those You know, everybody's been joking, oh, your shoulder's so sexy. You know, it's just been funny. But anyway, the whole thing is, again, it's a culturally moving cult that keeps up with what's going on. But the most radical thing that took me out of the Mormon church was I just I had met Jesus.

I think I know that I was saved before this experience, but I just could not let go of Mormonism. And so I was at a friend's house and I just felt God speak to me. I'd learned how to, I'd been well discipled in this whole time of year and a half of learning how to hear God's voice, going deeper and deeper in the word, everything about it, but could not, could not let go of Mormonism. I wanted to take the Jesus I had fallen in love with and somehow put him into Mormonism. And I'd do all kinds of crazy things.

I was still teaching seminary and I would make the room a little bit dark and put up a picture of Jesus and play a song and expect them to enter into worship like I was experiencing. But it was, you know, airplanes are flying and they're going, when is this going to be over?

So I had to, I could see that it wasn't going to work just talking to all of them. But this one particular day when I had just I just heard God's voice that say to get up and go home, and I remember getting in my car and just weeping and weeping and weeping. And as I was driving down the street, I was going from Long Beach to Bellflower in Southern California, if any of you know where that is, and I was at the corner of Cherry and Market. And I'm weeping so hard. I'm stopped at a stoplight.

I can hardly see the drive. And as I was waiting there at the stop signal, I heard the audible voice of God, yes. God spoke to me. People always redrill me with that. And all he said to me in this most beautiful voice is Mormonism is false.

And I can remember grabbing hold of my steering wheel and just screaming at the top of my lungs, it can't be, it just can't be. And again, God spoke exactly the same, repeated Mormonism is false.

So I went home that night. Went into prayer in the morning, spent hours in prayer the next morning, and I had this whole plan of how my day was going to work. I could finally let go of Mormonism. I was going to go. I had been taught that if I wanted Jesus to confess me before the Father, I need to be willing to confess him before others.

All kinds of things that you can imagine that had been fed to me as becoming a believer. And as I Hours, and we had to drive about 20 minutes to church. Didn't tell anybody in the car what was going on. We get into church. Um I just think this is going to be just everything that's amazing for me.

Finally, the altar call comes up. And I mean, I don't know, you probably weren't around in the Jesus movement, but you can't even imagine what it was like. It wouldn't be one or two. You couldn't count the amount of people that would go forward. Literally, hundreds would just run forward.

It was just the most amazing thing to even experience or be a part of or see. And so that morning the pastor began to give the altar call, and he goes, There's five more. There's just five more that I know God is calling. And I remember thinking to myself, because I didn't want to go up then. I'd planned to go up in the night just so I wouldn't be in front of all my friends and be embarrassed.

You know how silly we are thinking that we're going to. That we can set a plan and miss what God wants to do. Anyway, so. When you said five more, I remember thinking, oh good, I only have to wait for five more. And then he said something about some experience that God, something he had with God.

And he says, And one of you, God spoke to you in your car.

Now, it didn't matter if the whole world saw me humiliated, you know, just humbled by the power of God. I didn't care who was there. You know, I'd been crying through the whole service. I felt like everything was disheveled. Anything that I would want to be in front of people, but all of a sudden, the call of Jesus was so much more powerful than anything that was going on in the room.

And You know, I made a decision that changed my life radically. Lost everything prior to that day. friends, family, everything. And yet I wouldn't change it for the money. Cindy, let me ask you an experience.

Yes, yes, absolutely. I can see that for sure. I want to talk with you after the next break about what it's like being a Christian on the island of Oahu, where you and your husband live. and how you have the Polynesian Cultural Center. that's owned by the Mormon Church and the Mormon Temple there on the North Shore.

A little bit about that, but In front of me, I have a picture that I use when I've gone to train mission teams. And it's Jesus praying in the Garden of Gethsemane. Can you share with our listeners? I'll kind of just share briefly about this. And then you I want you to please, if you would, just fill in But Mormonism teaches that that what happened in the Garden of Gethsemane.

was critical to being able to become a god. Like if Jesus didn't. didn't sweat, as it were, drops of blood in the garden. That was like part of the redemptive. Work of Christ.

It wasn't the way the Bible puts it that he was in anguish, yes. For what he's going to do on the cross. But Mormonism twists all this, sadly, right? Can you share some thoughts on that? Sadly.

Yes, and it was interesting.

Now that I've been out of the church for almost 50 years. I've tried to keep in touch with my Mormon friends that would have nothing to do with me. But slowly they're starting to allow me to talk to them, but I just am not supposed to talk about Jesus at all. And one of them gave me this whole book that was put out in the Mormon Church about what happened in the garden.

So, what they don't understand is that they were angels there ministering to him during that time. It was an interaction of him understanding. The But he there isn't anything that we've gone through that he can't say he understands. He understands everything.

So that anguish of choice, of having to make a difficult choice, that's what happens in the garden. But the decision that he made was to go to the cross.

So the difficulty of making a decision, yes, it's tough, but once you make it, it really doesn't affect what happens, what you decide to do. And so when he went to the cross, that's when he had to suffer what the cost of his decision was, and that was a separation from God the Father and the Holy Spirit because of our sin. He doesn't even ask for forgiveness of sin or anything in the garden. They don't understand that Jesus died for our sins. According to 2 Corinthians...

I'm sorry, 1 Corinthians 15, 3 and 4, it says the most important, the number one thing, depending on your translation, that you need to understand is that Jesus died for our sins and rose again on the third day according to the scriptures. That's what Paul says is the most important. You don't have to get a PhD in anything. That's what you have to know to walk into eternal life. And see, Jesus was born to die.

We were born, we were created. to walk into eternity with him. And people have it all come, Mormonism completely turns it around and tries to make that his death wasn't that important. In fact, I just ran into a lady the other day in Macy's here in Hawaii, and I had my cross on. She said, Oh, your cross is lovely.

And I said, Oh, thank you. I believe in Jesus and him crucified. And she says, Oh, well, I'm a Mormon. And do you know about that, how big that door opened up right there? And so I accept all religions.

And I said, Oh, but Jesus said there's only one way. And I said, Hi, I love it that you like my cross because as a Mormon, you're not even allowed to wear a cross. You're not even, you don't even have crosses on your buildings. You don't even want to recognize the cross. You make up these silly ideas that you want to remember him off the cross.

when one of the things that he said to remember often was that he died for our sins. And the most the scripture, the thing that Jesus calls us to remember the most is that he died for our sins and rose again the next day, the third day, sorry.

So it was a fun witness to her. I'm sure she didn't know what she was going to do. I remember my daughter was standing with me and she goes, she just kind of goes, open door. And so I just watch God open doors for me all the time to be able to share the truth of who Jesus is. with the people wherever I go, whether it's a foreign country or this one.

Well, Cindy, we have one more segment here left on TikTok Live. It's been flying by. I really appreciate you taking time out of your day to be on the program.

So stay with us if you would, Cindy. Come on back. It's a blessing everyone listening. Yes, it's gonna be great. Um we're gonna talk a little bit more about How to share the gospel with Mormons.

So stay with us here. Call us at 866-348-7884. We'll be right back. Welcome back to Truth Talk Live. Welcome back.

Talking with Cindy Bauer. Cindy is a former member of the Mormon Church, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. We've been talking about how that, you know, in Second Corinthians, Paul's concern about the people there and he says I'm kind of concerned about you guys. You might fall after a different spirit, a different gospel, and a different Jesus.

So, you see, we're not angry. We're not upset towards the Mormon people in kind of a personal way. There's none of that. There's no mockery. There's no anger.

There's no like. Oh, it's the spirit of contention that sometimes Mormons might say to us. When we Are sharing something with them that disagrees with the Bible, the spirit of contention. You can tell your Mormon friends: I have no spirit of contention, okay? That will help to bring down the walls.

It's a unique kind of a statement that many Mormons understand. And there's also another phrase called. Putting things on a shelf. If you ever hear a a Mormon say, well, I need to just put that on a shelf. Right now, that's a long-standing concept that you can really, you know.

When you hear a Mormon say that, You can know that maybe there's something in their mind that they're really wrestling with. And it's going to be tough to reconcile what that is on the shelf with reality, with what the Bible says about sin, about salvation, about all these very important questions about eternity. But we've been talking about that here on Truth Talk Live today on Missions Monday. And so, Cindy, would you just wanna share with us a little bit about? maybe when a Mormon missionary comes to your door of what might be one or two things That you might want to remember when you're talking to the Mormon missionaries, and then share with us a little bit too about ministry in Hawaii.

To reach Mormons there, because there's a lot of Mormons in Hawaii. We do want to start sharing about reaching those Mormon missionaries at your doorstep. I would love to. It's one of the most common-asked questions for me, and people are always asking me that. And the first thing that I take them to is to understand what it says in Revelation: that the way you defeat the enemy is by the blood of the Lamb, the word of your testimony, and the love not of your own life unto death.

And so, the power of our individual testimony and our individual walk with Jesus will blow the Mormons' mind. They don't understand that. They don't have a concept of that. They don't know what it means to walk in this deep relationship with Jesus. It's no relationship.

It has to do with being disciplined and learning how to work hard and to be committed to an organization versus committed to a relationship. And so I always encourage them, if they see Mormon missionaries are coming up, don't pull the blinds like they used to do historically and say they're back on the block again and call the neighbors, but rather greet them at the door.

Now, the word says very clearly not to bring them into your house, both in 1 John and 2 John, that not to bring them into your house. And so grab a cook some cookies so they can't talk and you can. And you simply don't try to argue with them about it or anything, but just simply begin to share your personal testimony of your walk with Jesus. I don't care if it's financial supply, the fact that Jesus has done something supernatural for you from healing to just answering a scripture to seeing him in personal relationship. And then ask them if you can pray for them.

I would tell them, never let the Mormon pray for you because they're praying to a false God. And so for you to pray for them. And it's interesting, I can remember missionaries coming and telling me the story back when I was in the church of how they went to this one place and this crazy little old lady came out and just began to start praying for them. And then both of those missionaries ended up getting saved and coming out of the Mormon church.

So I just can give you supernatural story after supernatural story of God working in my life and doing just amazing things, not only with my family. Just I'd love to share with people how I had four amazing daughters. And they all made really amazing men of God. And now I have 15 grandchildren. In fact, it's Bower, he's the fifth born grandson.

It's his birthday today, so happy birthday, Bower. And just the amazing adventures and the answers to prayer that they have been. I did this. I was asked to speak at a church and I just spoke on the things that my children have taught me. And how radical it is that they've known God, prayed to God, believed in God, and we have this strong family unit.

So, Mormons try to make you think that they've got the only strong family units around. It's a lie. I'm sure they do, but I can tell you I can show just as many messed up Mormon families as I can any other area of messed up families. But they're smart in what they push. They're smart in the amount of missionaries.

Right now, they've got 80. 84,000 missionaries out, and they're really concentrating on Africa, which just breaks my heart. And just everything that they're doing.

So if you know Whether you've ever used your testimony to witness to people, I would challenge you all to be to have that so that you can answer people. When the lady hit me up on the cross, you know, about sharing with her in the bathroom at Macy's, I just told her about what the cross meant to me and what God had done in my life and how Jesus had saved me out of Mormonism. And it was that just flowed right out because I knew how powerful my testimony. I'm not talking about somebody else's experience, but my experience.

So to me, that's the greatest way you can witness to a Mormon. Most of us most people are trained to To answer back to them all the questions that they ask because they know how to pull these off-the-wall thing. You know, I used to say, Oh, you're wearing a cross. I suppose as your mother killed your brother, you would hang you would wear a gun around your neck. And Christians would look at me like, What are you saying?

So, they have these clever little ways, and two, they change the definition of words. They believe that everybody's saved, that what Jesus did, the cross is just part of his responsibility as being the Christ. It wasn't personal, there was nothing personal in it at all. Where those of us that really know Jesus know a radical personal relationship with him and see the cross as very personal? I mean, I know our time is running out.

I could go on for days, but just the way we're going to. Cindy, Cindy, let me jump in. If you're listening out there and you'd like to have Cindy come speak at, say, like a women's conference or something, wouldn't that be great?

So, Cindy, if there's people that are out there that want to invite you out to their church or ministry or something, I'll say just contact Truth Talk Live and ask for Russ East. Station manager out here in Utah, and we'll get you in touch with Cindy. We'll make that real simple. Just go to Truth Talk Live, or excuse me, go to truthnetwork.com. And send us an email, and we'll get you in touch with Cindy.

Because I know just having her in person at your church would be an amazing thing. You know, let me ask you this too, Cindy. If people were to come to Hawaii, come to Oahu for a vacation. They might go to a place called the Polynesian Cultural Center that might lead them to a A Mormon temple. Tell us about that.

What is the Polynesian Cultural Center on the island of Oahu on the North Shore?

Well, on the way to the Polynesian culture channel, you have to go through Wahiwa, which is where we live. It's where our ministry is headquartered. We have a coffee shop called Surfers Coffee and a whole Uh Um a whole shopping center, little shopping center, little Strip shopping center here that we would love to host them, treat them to a cup of coffee. If you don't drink coffee, you can have some any other drink that we have available there. And please just say that you heard us on this program and we'll make sure that you're hosted.

The Temple Bend is about another. How 13 button. Little over an hour, right around an hour. It's up on the part of the island where nothing else is happening. You w it's a destination.

I guess you could be wanting to drive around the island. And It's so funny if you stand in front of the Uh U R E, you're standing in front of a cult. A cult center.

So it's kind of Polynesian cult center. But anyway, that's one of the pictures that we have that we just think is funny. But it is a thing. It's one of the biggest money makers. They finally forced them to pay sales tax on it because they were trying to get away with it not being a tax thing, that it was just a church thing.

But they make billions off of it and they do an excellent job. Of telling the story of the Polynesian islands. Of course, trying to tell you that's the story of the people of the Book of Mormon, which is also a lie. But that it is very well presented, very well done. You can also visit the the Visitor Center.

I remember when Donnie and Maria Osmonds. Parents were the Missionaries working at the visitor center there.

So obviously, it's one of the most visited. Mission uh one of the most visited visitor centers visited probably in the world just because of where it's located. And it's so hooked to this. the Polynesian Cultural Center. And when you're there, they offer to give you a free ride to go over to the Vindicators Center.

They will they drive you over in a little trolley car, like at Disneyland, and take you there so you can go through the whole kit and caboodle.

So it is definitely an outreach of their an outreach that they do, but they do it well. And Yeah, we just encourage people not to go at all. Red. I hope that answered your question. But would you say that there might be opportunity to share the gospel at these places?

Maybe even. Uh there's BYU Hawaii. And there might be opportunities as the Lord might lead you to go there as well. We just sent a team out there.

So there's all kinds of places to share. Probably in the cultural center would not be, they're just going to push you aside because they want to make money there. But definitely when you get over to the visitor center, that's always a good time. And on the campus at BYU, it's just catching some of the students there. And it's also, again, really fun thing.

And I just ran in when I was in the store again. Uh here in Hawaii, I ran into a girl that had graduated from BYU out here and had the most Exciting witness with her, and she's already slipping away from Mormonism as it is.

So there are, you just have to live a lifestyle of sharing the gospel, whether it's to a Mormon or you to the neighbor. We're into building a fence high and not talking to the person that lives right next door. And we missed so many opportunities. A neighbor of ours just died unexpectedly, but we know that he'd heard the gospel. And before we got here, as a recluse and wouldn't talk to anybody, but now we know that we're going to rejoice with him in heaven because we took the time to not let him push us away.

Well, Cindy, it has been a pleasure. It's been so great to hear the passion that God has put into your heart. To reach Mormons for Christ. And I just want to thank you and your husband just for taking time out of your day just to be with us. And we'll be praying for you.

And if you'd like to get more information about What Cindy and her husband are doing, get in contact with us at truthnetwork.com. Mm-hmm.