Are the Detroit Pistons really that bad?

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Find out how to bring your ideas to life at dell.com slash welcome to now. And now, sitting in for Rich, it's Dan Schwartzman. It is our number two of the Rich Eisen Show on a Thursday. Dan Schwartzman in for Rich. Always love sitting in the big boy chair here for Rich. He gets a little time off.

Much deserved by the way. Talked a lot of Russell Wilson in hour one. The question for you, is he still after these two miserable failures of seasons in Denver? A surefire Hall of Famer in your book and looking back at that trade from March of 2022 from the Seahawks to the Broncos. Is that one of the worst deals in the history of football?

In fact, it might be in the history of sports. American sports, one of the worst deals. 8 4 4 2 0 4 Rich.

That's 8 4 4 2 0 4 7 4 2 4. The deal was Seahawks trading Russell Wilson in a fourth round pick for quarterback Drew Locke, tight end Noah Fant, defensive tackle Shelby Harris, two first round picks, two second round picks, and a fifth round pick. And then giving him a five year $242.6 million contract that actually starts next year. $39 million is guaranteed regardless of if he's on the team or not next season.

So that's what it is. My book, since the Herschel Walker trade, off the top of my head, I cannot think of a worse deal than that trade. For Denver, obviously. Not for Seattle. For Denver, it's a terrible deal.

And it's going to put him back a few years, right? You give him that much draft capital, four marquee draft picks, it's going to cost you. And then they gave him a first round pick for Sean Payton, so they've lost three first round picks in two seconds for so far what? This is my reaction as a Raider fan. I think that's everybody's reaction as a non-Broncos fan. Twelve wins in two years from Russell Wilson, so far seven wins for Sean Payton without any sort of an answer at quarterback. Jared Stidham is the guy that they're going with the last two games of the season, and that's obviously because they don't want Russell Wilson to get hurt.

Because if he gets hurt and fails the physical in early March, they've got to pay him $37 million more guaranteed dollars. No one wants to do that, especially considering they're going to let him go. He's done. He's gone.

This is it. This is over. But also, I want to get into what's happening with the Kansas City Chiefs.

You know, you told me something insane today that you don't even think about until you actually look it up. But the Raiders, for instance, who have won two games in a row, they're sitting now at seven and eight, the Raiders can actually win the division as crazy as that sounds. I mean, whoever thought that would be the scenario, but they can. They have to win at the Colts and they have to beat the Broncos with maybe Mia quarterback at that point. Which is very possible.

Very possible. Well, not Mia quarterback, but you have to be winning those two games. Meanwhile, the Chiefs have the Bengals and they have the Chargers. They can lose to the Bengals, sure. And they have the Chargers. Now, unfortunately, both those teams are not playing with their starting quarterbacks, right?

So that's a problem. Eric Stick? Is that Eric Stick? He's pretty good. He looked pretty good, right? I don't trust him, but still, he looked half-decently.

He looked half-decent. Better than anybody would have thought. Look, I hate to burst your bubble here, okay? No, no. Don't burst my bubble. Don't burst my bubble.

I'm going to burst your bubble. The chances of the Raiders winning the division by having the Chiefs lose the next two games are probably fairly slim. I don't think that's going to happen.

I think they can turn it up for one game. Take that back. Take that back. You know I'm right.

Take off your Raider glasses and the ridiculous shoulder pads and however you dress to go to a game looking like, you know, a vigilante from Mad Max. But the reality is, you know, the Chiefs probably are not going to blow this division. Hate to tell you, Art. I know. I know. I probably owe you a beer for that at some point.

But still, you probably, when you live in reality, those rare occasions, do realize the Chiefs are probably going to still win this division. Okay? Had to get that out of the way.

I wonder how much of it truly is boredom. Really. And what I mean by that is this. This offense has been, frankly, not good this year. They've only scored 333 points in 15 games. To put that in perspective, the Dolphins have scored 130 more points than them this year. 130 more.

Right? The Cowboys have scored 120 more than them this year. That's a lot. Patrick Mahomes is having, far and away, the worst season of his career. This is a guy who throws for 5,000 yards routinely. And when I mean routinely, he's done it twice already in his career.

Excuse me. He's come close on two other occasions. This year, he's going to throw, unless he throws for 1,100 yards in the next two games, which isn't going to happen.

He's not getting to 5,000 yards. Patrick Mahomes first down. He snaps it off far side. It is intercepted going the other way. And a pick six for the Raiders. That's Kirsty Westwood won. There you go.

You love playing that, right? The highlight of your season. We stole Christmas. You stole Christmas.

The Raiders stole Christmas. You're the lump of coal in Patrick Mahomes' sock. Actually, Taylor Swift is probably the... I know his wife, Brittany, and Taylor Swift are fast besties, but that's been kind of detrimental to the team. And I like Taylor Swift. She seems to, you know, she makes good music. My 13-year-old plays it a lot. I kind of enjoy it.

I don't mind it. And she seems to be a good role model. Doesn't get in any trouble. Always kind of dates the wrong person, but still doesn't get in any trouble. There's no drugs, DUIs, things like that, right? Doesn't seem to be clubbing every night and, you know, and waking up past, you know, passed out drunk somewhere in a corner.

It doesn't happen. So I think she's actually a decent role model. But ever since she showed up in Kansas City, it hasn't exactly worked out well for that team. They're not playing well. Travis Kelce hasn't played well, and Patrick Mahomes hasn't played well. He has thrown more interceptions this year than in any other year of his career. His quarterback rating is the worst quarterback rating he's had ever in his NFL career. His QBR is the worst QBR he's had. He's thrown 26 touchdowns, which will be his second lowest total when the season is over, barring some crazy stretch of touchdowns. He threw 26 back in 2019 in only 14 games. His worst total besides that is throwing 37 touchdowns. And at this point, he's not going to throw 11 touchdowns the next two games.

I don't play fantasy football, but if you drafted Patrick Mahomes, you've got to be saying to yourself, this guy has cost me my league. Dan, I just want to play you a clip from Rocky. Okay. Mick said it well. You lay off that pet shop game.

Women weaken legs. Oh, I love it. I love Rocky. I love Rocky. You know what the best is?

I'll tell you what the best is. You know, I worked in Philly for four and a half years and they were great stories of when they were filming Rocky 6, which I think just called Rocky Balboa, right? Yeah. Or was that Rocky 5? No, Rocky 5 was Tommy Morrison. Tommy Morrison.

Right. Rocky 4 was Dolph Lundgren. So Rocky 6, which is Rocky Balboa. You heard stories about old ladies coming up to Sylvester Stallone during filming going, Rocky, it's so great to have you back in the neighborhood, as if he was really a guy. You know, like Rocky is a real dude, not Sylvester Stallone, but actually Rocky had to throw that out there. You brought up Rocky, you played Mick.

That's what it was. It's funny how he's kind of become the character. Like if you saw Sylvester Stallone today, there's a chance you just call out Rocky, right? No. Like, hey, Rock. To me, he's Rambo. John Jay? John Jay, yes. John Jay Rambo, right?

Green Beret. One of the great lines of Rambo, and I know we're on some ridiculous tangent here, but why not? It's a three hour show. We got time to talk about nonsense. But the greatest line, and I am a big Rambo fan. I even like the trashy ones in Afghanistan and stuff.

Those are great, as dumb as they were. But is when his colonel's talking to Brian Dennehy, the great actor in the original Rambo, and he says, I'm not here to get him. What did he say? Remember? I'm not here to protect him from you. I'm here to save you from him.

Yep. Oh, that was a great line, wasn't it? That was a great line. And David Caruso's like, aw, shucks.

Young sheriff's deputy. That was great, man. I like all of them. As dumb as some of the Rambo's were, they're still very good viewing movies. All the action, the storylines, you could watch them all. And he's going after Russians, so some people like that, right?

It kind of makes sense. You can always have those villains. I like him. I like Rambo. Do you find yourself, or when you're watching TV and there's a Rambo movie on, it could be like one o'clock in the morning, and it's like, ah, and I go to bed, and I keep watching Rambo, right? Watch Rambo. You're like, I'm going to watch Rambo.

I agree 100%. I'll watch Rambo until I fall asleep watching it. I don't care. You want to be entertained, right? That's what it is.

It's like the line gladiator from Russell Crowe. Are you entertained? Yeah. You're darn right I'm entertained. I watch Rambo, I'm entertained. Absolutely. Guy never runs out of ammunition.

It's fantastic. I even like the last one where he's like, where did he go? Remember, he's like the missionaries in like Southeast Asia. Remember that one? No, no, the new one is one of the battles of the Mexican cartels. Oh, no, yeah, that's right. With his daughter, I think, or granddaughter, or whatever it is? His daughter-in-law. Yeah, she goes missing in Mexico.

He goes to find her. Yes, that's right. That was pretty good, too. But the one before that where he like helps the missionaries up the river. When he takes over the truck-mounted machine gun.

The.50 cal. I mean, and he's just, I mean, like heads are popping off. I mean, literally heads are popping off. How are you not entertained by that?

It's like Jason Statham movies. I'm not watching for an Academy Award nomination here, right? I'm just watching because I want to be entertained.

The older I get, all I want is entertainment for two hours. That's what it comes down to. I didn't come here to rescue Rambo from you. I came here to rescue you from him. What a line.

What a colonel. Are you a Jason Statham guy, Art? Oh, yeah.

I love him, too. Yeah. So me and you can hang out at the movies.

The Expendables are awesome. Yeah, like me and you can hang out at the movies. We have the similar garbage taste, I would say. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Right?

It's complete garbage taste. But you know what? Like I got, you know, I have two daughters and a wife and it's like movie night for them is Love Actually.

Stuff like that. And I'm like, come on. Can we watch something violent? It's better than watching the Barbie movie.

Yeah, but you know what it is? I like sit there and have to like, grip my teeth through watching these girly movies they watch. And then they wonder why I go to bed late. I'm like, well, because I guess you guys are asleep. I can watch whatever I want. I can watch violence. Again, heads popping off in Rambo getting shot by a 50 cal. I mean, come on.

It's entertainment. Where were we, by the way? What were we talking about? I got my mind's completely gone now. We talked to Rambo and Jason Statham. Women wicking legs and chiefs. That's right. Are the chiefs just bored?

Maybe they need to watch Rambo or Jason Statham movie to wake them up a little bit. All right. Let's quickly get back on that. All right. We're going to get to some NBA talk. Bleach reports that Eric Pinkus is going to join us next segment.

But I got to tell you, though, I do believe some of this is boredom. I really do. Patrick Mahomes is great. He is great. Is he just not having a good season? Because, well, his wide receivers can't catch. Kadarius Toney is atrocious.

Absolutely atrocious. That guy's got hands of steel. How he was a first-round pick of the Giants, I have no idea. That guy's going to be out of the league possibly as early as next year. At this point, somebody is looking at his athletic ability, thinking they can fix him. You can't fix a guy whose hands are that bad. You can't. You either can catch a pass or you can't catch a pass.

I don't think it can be that tall. You know, I don't think you can teach that. He's just not good. And maybe that's what it is. Maybe that's what's going on at the Chiefs is they just haven't had much luck. The wide receiver quarter hasn't been very good.

Blah, blah, blah. Travis Kelce is occupied with Taylor Swift and then it's showing on the field. I do believe when you have been that successful and you've won that many games and you've won multiple Super Bowls, to then try to get up and be motivated for 17 regular season games when you kind of can make the playoffs in your sleep and that's what's happening. They're going to make the playoffs. They're going to win their division. And they're sleepwalking through the entire season. I do believe, as Mike Pritchard said, that what's going to happen is they will clinch and at that point they realize they've made the playoffs. They're going to wake up. They're going to wake up and they're going to be good. Maybe even great. And maybe roll through the AFC.

There's a good possibility. First down. He snaps it off far side. It is intercepted going the other way. And a pick six for the Raiders.

Oh man, you're never going to get over that. When they don't make the playoffs, you can keep playing that. And by not making the playoffs, I'm not talking about the Chiefs, my friend.

I'm talking about the other team in that equation on that Westwood One broadcast you just played. You're Raiders, my friend. But that's what's happening. I'm telling you right now. It's great for the NFL if the Raiders make the playoffs.

Why? Because everybody hates the Raiders. Yeah, I got to tell you something here. You know, I still can't get used to this Vegas thing. And what I mean by that is this. When I think of the Raiders, and they're now so corporate playing in Vegas in that brand new spanking stadium.

With a bunch of fake fans showing up because it's people, you know, high rollers gambling every Sunday in Vegas and they get tickets wherever that get is. To me, they just don't have the same muster. The whole character of that Raiders team is gone. Yeah, it's all Hollywood now, pretty much.

Right, you agree, right? You've been a lifelong Raider fan. It just doesn't feel the same, them being in Vegas, that they've become this Hollywood team. The Raiders have always been that lunch pail, blue collar team and fan base.

It's like the Cleveland Browns fan base put on the West Coast and now it's completely different. Playing in a crappy stadium in Oakland, right? I mean, even in LA they didn't play in a great stadium. They played at the Coliseum, yeah. Right, they played in trashy places.

That's what they are. That's how you view the rugged Raiders. That's why when I look at the Raiders team, I'm like, man, I don't know. It's not the same team.

It's not. It doesn't have the same feel. You pan to the crowd, it does not have that same feel of what a Raider fan base is. Although the Violator still goes.

The Violator is still in the system. They do, but it's, you know, bigger stadium and corporate seating and luxury boxes, this and that. It's a different feel and you know it, Art. It's not the same.

It's clearly not the same. Alright, I want to get into some NBA talk. The season rolls on. They had the nice little holiday time. Ratings were not great on Christmas. The NFL dominated. No surprise there. I saw an incredible statistic. The NFL averages like 9.2 million viewers a game. The NBA is like 711,000.

No surprise. The NFL is the most dominating sport in terms of media share we've ever seen. Revenue wise, it's far and away the highest earning sport we've ever seen. And in the world, it's number one by a mile.

Billions and billions of dollars. We're going to get into some NBA talk, though. Our buddy Eric Pincus from Bleach Report is going to join us. That is coming up next, alright? Got to talk about what's happening in this league. The Detroit Pistons, are they ever going to win another game?

27 straight losses. You cannot make that up. How much of it is on Monty Williams, though? That's what I'm wondering. It is a Thursday edition. The Rich Eisen Show.

Dan Schwartzman on this Thursday in for Rich. You know, in today's world, it seems that best treatment is reserved only for a few. Well, Discover wants to change that by making everyone feel special. That's why with your Discover card, you have access to 24-7 live customer service as well as zero dollar fraud liability, which means you're never held responsible for unauthorized purchases. Finally, no matter who you are or where you are in life, you'll feel special with Discover.

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That's 844-204-7424. The NBA season rolls along and sadly one of the biggest storylines right now is the fate of the Detroit Pistons. They were actually 2-1 at one point and they have lost 27 straight games. That is the longest losing streak within one season in NBA history. I think the Sixers had a 28 game losing streak, but that encompassed two separate years. How do you lose 27 straight games? Their winning percentage is 067.

And what that's done is it's masked how bad the Spurs have been. They've only won four games. Washington's only won five games. Combined, Washington, San Antonio, and Detroit have won a whopping 11 games.

Do you know how many teams have more wins by themselves than the Spurs, Pistons, and Wizards combined? It is incredible. Let's bring on our buddy Eric Pincus with Sports BizClass and Bleacher Report as well. Eric, happy holidays and happy New Year to you and the family. How are things, my friends? Oh, things are great.

Hey, thanks for having me on. I'm enjoying the NBA and looking forward to an exciting fun next year, 2024. I'll tell you who's not enjoying this season or things to come in the NBA. That is if you are a Detroit Pistons fan. 27 straight losses. I'm going to tell you, I don't watch a lot of Pistons games, okay? Why would I watch a team that bad?

Are they that bad? Is it coaching? How the heck do you lose? Sometimes you fall into a win, Eric. How do you lose 27 straight? What's going on there?

Is there talent outside of Cade Cunningham? It's rough. Well, I mean, for one, they did have injuries, but I don't think that's really the excuse. It's just a mess. I don't have an answer.

If they had an answer, they would do it. I mean, Cade's been going crazy. I'm impressed. And I guess the best you could say is that they're forging a really incredible player out of it. I mean, he was supposed to be something really special, missed a year with injury and is really starting to step into that role as a do-everything guy. He's a big, almost a forward, but he's a point guard. He's a combo player.

He could do pretty much anything. So it's exciting from that point of view, but I'm really stretching. I mean, it's just the young players aren't coming on as well as they'd like.

The injuries are real. They don't quite have it exactly who they want. But I feel like if you put any five NBA players together in a starting lineup, at some point you're going to win a game. It's just going to happen.

Just a random chance of playing basketball. The worst team in the league can beat the best team in the league on a given day. That's just going to happen. Why it hasn't happened, I don't know. Well, this is a test case, I guess, right, Eric? In terms of how is it this doesn't happen, you're right. If there's one team that can't fall into a win, it's this one.

But I'll tell you what's happened, though, Eric. Because of the futility of Detroit, it's masking the futility of other teams. Greg Popovich is an all-time great coach.

And Victor, you know, Juan, whatever, I can't pronounce his name, but you know what I'm talking about. He's a tremendous talent. He's dealt with some injuries as well, but they've only won four games.

What's going on in San Antonio? And at some point, is this Bill Belichick-esque, where you're going to have to cut the cord with a legend? Well, I mean, there's a lot of great coaches that have sort of symbolically died on his bench as the heir to the Spurs. I mean, Becky Hammon is doing an incredible job in the WNBA.

Tori Messina was lined up as his top assistant. Mike Budenholzer was supposed to be the next guy at some point. I mean, they've gone through a lot of folks who are high-level coaches who just are waiting for Pop to move on. But, you know, the guy is a legend. And to be as bad as they could possibly be to get Victor Wemenyama means that they still have a long way to go. They have some really nice young players, but they don't have a team yet.

They don't have the full capability. And then also Wemenyama, I think that's semi-correct. The idea there is, he's a baby. I mean, he really is. And the style of play that he played overseas wasn't necessarily how he was going to be able to play in the NBA. They brought him in slowly as a power forward. They're playing him summit center. They're trying to figure out how quickly to push to develop him because he does have, you know, those body types. When you're that tall, you really want to make sure that he can handle the rigors of the NBA. So this year is not about winning.

It's just about development. And so I think as long as Pop wants to be there, he's going to be there. I think the Spurs are fine with that. I think he's teaching and these players are learning. The question is how many of these players need to be on the team in two, three years.

So who is he teaching? But if it's just Wemenyama, then so be it because he has that potential to be a top player in this league. And if Pop is going to give him a few years to sort of learn the legendary stuff, then so be it. And maybe Pop won't be the guy who gets him to a championship, but I still think this time is valuable.

Chan with Bleacher Reports, Eric Pincus here on The Rich Eisen Show, Dan Schwartzman in for Rich on this Thursday. Look, I can understand where Pop feels rejuvenated, re-energized by having another, you know, soon to be great big man. I think Wemenyama is going to be a superstar. There's no question about the talent is there.

He is a unicorn if we want to use that term. But, you know, if Pop was 50, I can understand waiting around for the rebuild and he would be successful doing so. But he's not 50 years old anymore.

He's getting up there in age. You know, you're not going to fire him, I guess, but it's just weird to watch a team that had so much success over all those years. They were just right in 50 plus wins every year to see them struggle the way they have has been kind of crazy. Now, I want to get to Draymond Green here and the Golden State Warriors.

They also have struggled this year. What happens here? You know what? There's a microscope around him, obviously, and rightfully so. Whatever he does, people are going to notice. If you're the Warriors, at what point do you just tire of this antics and say, all right, enough is enough, we just can't deal with this anymore? Well, that time was this summer and they paid him to stay.

So, you know, it's like if you felt that way, because what's happening now isn't new, right? It's not like he just started punching and kicking guys in the crotch. I mean, let's be honest, I love Draymond for what he does, like as far as the positives. I mean, he's every bit as valuable as everyone else. You know, the step, the clay, all the Wiggins, all the Katie's back in the day, like he is every much a part of why they've had success. He's been the captain of their defense and really their primary playmaker. So I don't want to diminish how great Draymond is, but also, you know, whatever.

Don't punch guys in the face is probably good advice and all that kind of stuff. So they are still committed for now to this recapturing the glory, which is only two years old. Like it wasn't that long ago. They just won, right? Like it's not like they won and Katie left and they never won again. They just won again.

So staying with this group until it just can't do anything anymore, I get it. And so that's what the decision was. And so I think the bigger question now becomes Clay, because Clay Thompson is due a contract after the season and he started the season pretty poorly to his own admission. He was very vocal about it. And I think he's brought it on lately and is starting to show like, OK, yeah, he's still the same guy, but we age, you know, it's a part of life, unfortunately. And he's had two major injuries. So they're going to continue. How long?

I don't know. The rules are really designed to punish teams that spend at the level that the Warriors are spending. So I think the shelf life may be a year, but also like if they wanted to get out of Draymond, I don't know that there's a huge market for what he does because he is very specific. He isn't young and he does have some of these issues. And you need a team that has the kind of shooters around him that offset what he doesn't do. So it's a tough one. But I do think that I mean, I hope that he learns from this.

It sounds like he's saying the right things, you know, but really the proof is, is what he does moving forward. Eric, no surprise, Mark, Lauren, Alex Rodriguez are expected to exercise the option to acquire the controlling interest in the Minnesota Timberwolves, especially the way they're playing this year and they're playing really good basketball. You know, there's a lot of young talent there. Are you a believer in the team that right now has the best record in the Western Conference?

This is a tough one. I want to, you know, for Minnesota fans, I want to jump on the bandwagon and say, you know, it just needed some time. And Kat wasn't really healthy for a lot of last year. It was coming off injury.

So now this is what they were always going to be. And last year was more of an aberration and etc. But, you know, there are concerns. Number one, we've seen Rudy Gobert have great success in the regular season and not translate to the playoffs. That that may be because when he was with Utah, he had two guards. I think it was Conley and Mitchell are six one ish, six two ish at best, six three. But, you know, they're small guards, probably six one.

So maybe that was the problem. And they don't have the same side. You still have Conley, but you have Anthony Edwards. He is greater size. And you have McDaniel's and Kat are both along as heck.

And Kat has never been known for being a defender, but that's OK. McDaniel's defends and just the size alone and then figuring out, you know, Gobert is a defensive player of the year. So I don't know the answer what they'll be in the playoffs. The track record is for me, I'm a big you can't do it until you've shown me you've done it kind of guy. So I don't believe that they can do it yet. And I want to be proven wrong because that's just like I like being proven wrong. I didn't know that Denver was going to be that good.

I thought they had an upside limitation based on who they were. And they proved me wrong. So congrats. And that's great.

And I'm happy for what they've done on on the other end of it. That's one is one issue. The bigger issue is the finances. This is not a huge market team. They don't bring in the kind of earnings like the Warriors do.

So, you know, there's some questions about how deep pockets go for the ownership. Are they willing to pay the kind of taxes and face the kind of penalties that they would face keeping this team together? Because for one, you're you're basically maxed out with two guys right now in Kat and Gobert and then a cheaper max.

But Max, nonetheless, is Edwards. And then they're paying McDaniel's a big price. But those money, those extensions don't kick in till next year. You have other players that like Nas Reed and then you have to pay Conley potentially. Or if you're not paying him, you're replacing him. But you don't have the means to replace him because all you'll basically have is minimums at that point.

Or maybe at most like about five million, depending on the exact numbers. So the point is they are sort of boxed in with who they are. They don't have draft picks because they've traded most of them to build who they are. So it's got to work.

And then do you double down and stay with it? I mean, I think it would have been a lot easier if it didn't work and then they could trade Kat and start going in a given direction. Maybe look at at some point trading Gobert and building around the younger guys. But now they're successful. That almost makes it harder as far as what they do now because it's working.

But is it working? And we don't really know until we get to the playoffs. Let's see what happens in the series. Right. Eric Pincus from Bleacher Report joining us here on the Rich Eisen Show. You mentioned Becky Hammond earlier.

She had a comment recently that irked the New York Knicks. And that was that, you know, as good as Jalen Brunson has been and he's been tremendous for them, you know, he doesn't have the size to be a true 1A. Do you agree with that?

Yes and no. I mean, like, you know, Allen Iverson was tiny. I mean, I remember my father bumped into an elevator. My father is like 5'11 and three quarters. He's not even six feet. And he's like, I'm the same height as Iverson. He was so excited.

You know, you can win. Now, Iverson never want to chip. But I mean, he's he goes down as one of my faves and got a team to the finals.

And if it wasn't for Shaq and Colby and all that, maybe he has a ring. So I don't think that's like a defining characteristic. I will say that it's harder to win with a smaller guard. The league is very switchy.

There's a lot of pick and roll. And I mean, you watch a guy like LeBron, he'll find the weakest link on defense and they'll run switches. And that's that. They would attack Steph Curry. Of course, LeBron didn't always beat the Warriors. So, you know, Steph's a little bigger, but he's and he's strong for his height.

But Jalen is shorter and he's actually pretty strong for his size. But again, you know, it is potentially problematic. I'll give them I'll give Becky that.

I'll give anyone who claims that. And there was some talk at some point about them going after Donovan Mitchell back when he was available. And some theory, someone they could still go after if Cleveland decided to make a change. And that's where if you're doubling down and you're going with Brunson and Mitchell now, I think you really limit your upside. But I think you can hide one. It makes it harder. But I don't think it's something that is fundamentally crippling because he is a tough guy to stop.

When he gets going on offense, if you put enough defenders and size around him, I think you can offset some of that issue. But it always puts you in a slight disadvantage. But that's that's OK. It's just there's there's no single way where you're not disadvantaged. There's no team that doesn't have some disadvantage in some way. And so that would be their main disadvantage. You have to build around that. I watch a lot of Knicks basketball here, Eric, and you look at Jalen Brunson and he's not built per se.

Right. He doesn't have definition. He doesn't seem like he can jump out of a gym, doesn't seem to be the biggest guy out there. But somehow he's put up twenty four, twenty five points a game. He's just energized the crowd. He's turned around the Knicks fortune. He's been the best free agent in the NBA over the last two years when they brought him in from Dallas. It's incredible to me.

Like you watch Nicola Jokic and it's a guy that has no definition as well. He's kind of roly poly out there. And before you know, he's got 30 points, 15 rebounds and 12 assists.

Brunson to me is very similar, right? And when you look at him, he doesn't stand out to you as a wow, he's got the build to be a great basketball player. But then in the end, he really is. He's been just a dominating presence and really turned around the Knicks. Randall couldn't do it by himself.

R.J. Barrett's kind of a number two, probably more number three. You know, Leon Rose lucked out, didn't he, with this? Well, I mean, it helped to you know, there were some connections through CAA, through hiring his father. You know, like they went and did everything. The Mavericks fundamentally kind of messed up.

Well, not kind of. They messed up that first contract, didn't have any real way to retain him as far as restricted rights. And the rules have since changed. So it's harder to lose a player like that. But it's not a game the NBA where like when Katie came into the league and he was going through draft workouts, he couldn't do one one one press of a bench press with like an empty bar, something crazy like that or or not an empty bar, but like with like whatever the lightest weight was that they test. But again, if you have like incredibly long arms like the physics make that clear. So it's not always about strength.

There's some guys who come out of college who are just like, you know, completely like Jack. I mean, like Stanley Johnson, just an absolute monster when it comes to physicality. And he's a solid player.

He's not in league right now. And I still think there's a role for him somewhere as a defender. But it's just a different kind of game. And it's not all about just physical definition. LeBron is LeBron. I mean, come on. Like he is what he is.

He's afraid. But yeah. But I mean, LeBron aside, there's most players are slender and it's about craftiness. And you could just solid as can be. But, you know, Brunson Brunson is stronger than you would think. I don't know how much he could bench or all this nonsense or whatever. But the point is, you know, he is strong and he uses it that physicality. But there's height issues that the height matters in basketball. And it could you know, it could be a problem and it may ultimately be crippling. But I'm not going to say it is.

I think that it's something with a lot of size. You have a good defensive coach in Thibodeau that you can find ways to offset what you don't have. And the best example that was that Iverson team was like Iverson and a bunch of defenders and guys who didn't. And they just let Iverson score. Yep.

They made a final one game, one two. Well, I'm sure Jalen Brunson can bench more than you and me, Pincus. But that's not saying much, I think. I think that's probably the case. Right now, in my day, I probably could get him.

But right now, absolutely not. Eric Pincus, sports biz class, Bleacher Report as well. Eric, again, happy new year to you and the family coming up. And always appreciate you hopping on. All right. Anytime. Thanks for having me and happy new year. Thank you, Eric.

Awesome stuff, Eric Pincus. Yeah, Pistons, 27 straight losses. Like, it's the NBA.

You got Cade Cunningham. You got to fall into a win somewhere. Catch a team on an off night.

Nope. They caught Brooklyn a couple nights ago. Looked like they were going to end that streak and Brooklyn pulled that one out. But still, unbelievable how things have gotten bad in Detroit. All right. Things in Golden State not great.

San Francisco to be exact. Draymond Green. I mean, come on. We got to get into that next.

All right. It's the Rich Eisen Show on a Thursday. It's that nice week between Christmas and New Year's.

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Eleven. Get inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum, wherever you listen. Dan Schwartzman in for Rich Eisen, the Rich Eisen show on a Thursday. Appreciate Eric Pincus from Bleacher Report hopping on talking some NBA. We brought up Draymond Green and, you know, there's report says making progress toward coming back from the coming back to the team from that suspension.

But no formal time frame, I believe, has been released yet. It's just an indefinite suspension. He's apparently attending virtual meetings with team officials, reps from the players union, the NBA as well.

Here's what's funny about this. It's like they're working to rehab Draymond Green right to like change him. But you can't change Draymond Green at this point.

This is who he is. He's not some young player who's got an attitude problem or he's not a young player that you feel you can adjust as he matures age wise. He's just going to be a smarter player. He's 33 years old by basketball standards. He's old. He didn't just come into the league this year or last year. Draymond Green's been around, what is this, year 12?

I mean, that's a long time. He is who he is. He's somewhat of a, you know, he's a loose cannon.

Doesn't use his head too often, sadly, on the court. He's a dirty player. He's not a likable player unless he plays for your team.

I've never understood, I get he's kind of a pest out there and people kind of like that and, you know, he fits that role. He's not a guy who's going to score much. You wonder if he sacrificed some scoring in his career because he's played on teams with Steph Curry, Klay Thompson, Kevin Durant, other great talent around him. Sure, there was no need for him to score. There was a need for him to rebound, to facilitate, he's always been a good passer, plays really good defense, I get it. But you're indefinitely suspending a guy for yet another dirty play in a history of dirty plays to where what? You think these league meetings or maybe he's meeting with a shrink or whatever is going to change his style of play?

It's not going to happen. This is who he is. Like, I'm 45 years old, as Mike Gundy would say, I'm a man. I'm 40. I like that.

There you are, Martinez. I'm set in my ways. You know, my wife knows how I am.

You know, she's what, 38? You can't change her. She's got her faults. I got my faults.

And somehow it works, right? That's the way relationships work. Vermont Green's had a relationship with the Golden State Warriors, had a relationship with the NBA, it's a 12-year long relationship. That's a long time. It's like the spouse saying, well, I love him because I can change him. No, you can't.

You married who you married. They're not going to change. And it's so dumb to think that an indefinite suspension is going to change his style of play. You have to say to yourself, maybe that's what makes him the player he is.

The fact that he's going to hit some guy in the crotch or he's going to elbow a guy there, whatever it is, he's a dirty player, period. So what do you do? You ban him from the league?

What do you do? No, you just keep making penalties harsher and harsher. I hate indefinite penalties, right?

Just give me a length of game. Do you want to suspend him for 50 games? Suspend him 50 games. I know the Players Association gets involved and they're going to fight you, whatever it is. But maybe you let people know exactly what's going to happen.

Let Draymond know you're coming back on this day after this many games. And if it happens again, you're going to be banned for a season. If it happens again after that, you're going to be banned for two seasons. You have to kind of have some sort of a time frame so that he knows what happens for every infraction. When you have a kid, you set ground rules, right? If you do this wrong, you get ground.

I don't because I'm a pushover. But parents out there will be like, if you do this or you don't do that, you're going to get the iPad taken away. Or you can't watch TV.

You've got to go to bed this time. You're grounded. You can't hang out with your friends. Or if you have dogs, you put them outside for like 10 minutes. You put them outside. Exactly. And then you bring them back in. Right, because they'll learn from that. Maybe they do.

I don't know. Maybe your dogs learn from that, Art. But you know what I'm saying, Art? You're not going to change Draymond Green.

Oh, I'm going to slap you on the wrist with an indefinite suspension and you're going to lose that on $5 million. It doesn't matter. This is how he plays. This is the only way he knows how to play. Maybe Draymond Green second-guessing himself on a court is not going to be an effective player.

You know what I mean? That's what it comes down to. Do you want a Draymond Green who's going to try to be in control of his actions on the court? I guarantee you he's not going to be an effective player if he's out there inside his own head trying to figure out should he do this or should he not do it. He's a reactionary player and sadly a lot of times a reaction is not a good one.

But that's one of his strengths. So what do you do? Okay, you tell him you're coming back January, whatever it is, your indefinite suspension is over. The next time it happens, you're going to get 50 games. Next time it happens, you get 100 games. Whatever it is, you can set that. Adam Silver can set whatever he wants to set, okay? Talk to the Players Association if you want. There's enough there for Draymond Green to get severe suspensions if this happens again.

And when I say if, you know what will happen again. It's in his nature. He can't help himself. He's like an addict, right? He's like an addict for dirty plays.

You know, Art, I think that's a good way to put it. He's addicted to dirty plays. He can't help himself.

Wow, that's pretty deep. Right? Because if he could, he would stop. You would think. When you're getting hit in your wallet where you're losing like 200 and some odd thousand dollars for every game you miss, you would think that would wake you up.

But it doesn't. So it's kind of like an addict. Like you know that taking drugs or drinking too much is self-destructive and it's going to hurt your relationships, it's going to hurt you at work. You're probably going to get fired.

You're probably going to have to break up with your spouse because they don't want to be around you when you're on drugs or whatever it might be. It's the same thing here. But unfortunately, it's not easy for somebody to just stop doing their destructive behavior. It's addictive.

And they have to go to meetings, whatever it is. For Draymond Green, it's the same way. How many years have we talked about Draymond Green and his antics on the court?

And it doesn't change. He continues to get himself in trouble. This isn't the first time he's hit somebody in the crotch. And I guarantee you it's not going to be the last time he hit somebody in the crotch.

So what kind of rehab does he have to go to? Timeout. You've got to treat him like a little kid.

I hate to say it, you've got to treat him like a little kid. It's a timeout, right? Like Draymond, your timeout is 30 games and that's going to cost you, oh, 6 million bucks, 5 million bucks, 3 million bucks, whatever it is.

Okay? That's the timeout. But you have to know that the next time he has to go in for a timeout, it's going to be more severe and more ramifications.

And he's got to know that too. But I can guarantee you there's going to be another instance where he's got to go in the corner for a timeout. Listen, we've had dirty players in every aspect of sports, okay? We've seen dirty players in football. We've seen dirty players in baseball, whatever it is. It's not like they ever change who they are and maybe being a dirty player is how they're effective. A lot of times dirty players are pretty good, right? I think that's the only way you can kind of gauge how it is. That's just who Draymond Green is and him playing the way he plays probably has been beneficial to the Golden State Warriors dynasty success.

And if he played a different style, maybe it wouldn't be that way. That's the only way to look at it. We have hour three coming up. College football talk USC. They win their bowl game. Their quarterback apparently doesn't want to go to some teams out there, as crazy as that sounds. All right. Insane. Dan Schwartzman for Rich Eisen on The Rich Eisen Show here on a Thursday. Watch what Lala is talking about on YouTube or search for Give Them Lala wherever you listen.