From the War on Police to Apologetics

So is there a war by the police in certain communities or is there a war on the police stage for the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown is the director of the coalition of conscience and president of the fire school of ministry get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I was just sent a link disturbing video it's on Facebook. It's been viewed millions of times will posted a little bit later today on the aspect Brown Facebook page and its video test was done where a white man in a state where you can openly carry a weapon is walking down the street and he's got a gun of over shoulder and a white police officer comes up to him and asked him why is carrying is supplied by Canon legal, licensed and open carry is there any particular reason you're carrying now just of the right to do it now and that's that's a whole other question terms of that that's an area of what he's allowed to go on his wife identical scenario with a black man carrying the gun exact same scenario except this time you end up he's on his face.

For minutes he surrounded by other officers.

He ends and other vehicles pull up.

He has to put his hands behind his back.

The gun is taken from him.

No differences. One man was white. The other man was black. Is there something wrong in our communities is there targeting of black young men or is there a reason that police are acting like this and it's wise and it's cautious. This is an important subject and we're gonna take it up today right here in the line of fire. This is Michael Brown number to call 866-34-TRUTH it's 866-348-7884. Obviously, these issues are in the news before us on a continual basis. There was a black man shot and killed in San Diego yesterday. Turns out he was unarmed. Apparently his sister is sitting there weeping and sobbing and saying why didn't you just tase him what exactly was going on probably walking erratically through traffic, hands in pockets what was going on. Why wasn't he tased these. These are fairly important questions to ask at the same time I was reading earlier today, a very touching account about a white cop drove 100 miles to assisted grieving 15-year-old black young man and afterwards he he.

The young man said. Everybody knows how much I dislike cops but I'm truly grateful for this guy.

He gave me hope, or the cops getting a bad rap. I'm gonna speak with Jeff Florida.

He has a new book coming out the war on police to talk about organ talk about the issues and will take your calls as well.

As always, our goal is to be constructive. Our goal is to be redemptive. Our goal is to not just have heat but also light so will be doing that with my guest shortly and old.

Let's just see if there any other news items yeah yeah what looked like some clips for you to Charlotte, North Carolina. There is a young girl in her plea to the Charlotte city Council where black people and we shouldn't have to feel like this, so why are Blacks in Charlotte feeling unsafe feeling that the lies could be threatened is a good reason for what happens when police pulled back the so-called Ferguson affect where they don't engage as much were they are not as aggressive in their tactics and then the crime rates spiral murder rates spiral then ends up hurting people even more. These are difficult issues, but women talk to them in a constructive way. As always number to call if you'd like to speak to my guest.

866-3487 84 I'm coming away live in Dallas Texas speaking at Gateway Church of the main campus tonight on moral and cultural issues we need parts of compassion with backbones steel for cleansing by the Expo line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown) delighted to be with you. 866487884 jury grip clip number eight this is Siana Oliphant. She is speaking to the Charlotte city Council bundle is very essential to the Council. The cause of the trouble in North Carolina bypassing a radical bill that effectively rendered public bathrooms and locker rooms gender neutral and then HP to buy North Carolina was put in motion to set things back after that.

But putting that aside, that's no reflection on the young lady speaking a lesson to what Siana has to say we have actually I that is a young black girl in the city of Charlotte talking about how she feels she feels she's treated differently.

Many Americans are yet, it seems to be the case. Unfair treatment by the police. Is there another side to the story that we need to be sensitive to, as well.

How can we pursue justice together. My guest Jeff water has a brand-new book, the war on police a Jeff welcome to the line of fire reorder your book speaks about the war on police as opposed to the war by police what your perspective what you think were missing in the narrative today. While white youth were narrative because I think that what we have years of narrative and I'm here in St. Louis that we live through the writing and in Ferguson and Lewis following the shooting death of Michael Brown by police officer Darren Wilson and we saw there was open warfare and street against police officer shot being fired at them. Everything all night Molotov cocktails being thrown at them rioting and looting. Other social people and it always result of the lie. Hands up don't shoot men and again I think it that that lie was sufficient to perpetuate a narrative against law enforcement that were still staying in place the day just what your own background in terms of how you come to write this book was a cop for 17 years, five years and undercover narcotics detective finish my careers. The police chief. The in the suburbs that I was elected to the Missouri House of Representatives serve their light-years take a lot of time, but your logic serve because of term for almost the entire time I was there the ranking member of the, Public Safety committee worked briefly for the Department of Public Safety here in Missouri. After he left office and I now am the spokesman representative for about 1700 unionized police officer in the city and County alright so from your own experience.

Just what did you see intensive motivation of police officers you see in terms of the fairness of police officers.

Jeff concerns about what you saw in terms of some some bad apples from experience, it will. We certainly were not a perfect profession profession every profession have people who are just not cut out to the job, but I would posit that you know all the all the professions in the in the country having law enforcement is one of the most scrutinized professions and we look at the numbers in about three quarters of a million police officers across the country. Each of them having dozens of interactions every day with witnesses and victims and suspects and other citizens and which amounts to millions of contacts every day and affected that the mainstream media can only find a couple of month to keep criticism along for over and that in those cases almost invariably even Eric Holder's Justice Department finds that the officers acted properly. So I might, I think that we can do better and we try every day to do better. We we take all of these shootings and another event that have bad outcomes and we look at them and constantly reevaluate our tactics in our methods and try to have happy article but I mean I died. I don't think that there's profession and in the nation that works harder to hold their duties. I suggest why do you think sent that so many black Americans have a different perceptions of police. I've I've had many callers to my show, God-fearing Christians, people who respect authority people who have no criminal record and in their entire lives talk about being pulled over for no good reason being, talk to certain ways a certain fundamental mistrust. There seems to be in the inner city across the board with color but in the inner-city and often especially in black America towards the police where he think that comes from where I think come from our leaders apart from Pres. Obama down telling people that they are you mad about what happening across the country and distrustful on by me if you think about coming out you know that I've ever gotten pulled over and gotten a ticket or are warning from law enforcement went about their guilty mean the courts are for people who think that they weren't going 12 miles an hour speed limit, but they didn't have a burnt out taillight or whatever the case may be, and you went when it what person assumed that they got unjustly charged, or that whatever the case to be, but dispersed the color the infant assumption is that that it was based on race when we know from what we know from sort of the blind study to have them on the street every day which is when you look at the numbers of police stopped where law enforcement can't detect the color of the person quickly stop that there is no racial profiling going on the third that they stop people at the same rate whether they can either their skin color before stop art are not home so I don't think that the touch of something else going on. Maybe we ought to have a conversation about I and his friends. If you're listening and you take exception to what this former policeman 17 years of experience to say moments give us a call 866-34-TRUTH 7884. Our goal is to advance trees. Our goal is to stand together for justice goes to do what's right, Jeff. The Ferguson affect what is that but I think it is not just happening at birth and I think it happened across the country and it is the combination of lease officers being more reluctant to do their job but we called the policing and criminal being emboldened by the current climate to commit crimes of opportunity or crimes of mayhem and you know it at least two phenomena collide because of what we seen in Ferguson Baltimore, Milwaukee, Chicago and elsewhere. You see this and I don't like cops are crossed her arms hold the breath in an academic outing or think it's just human nature that when you're under attack that you pull back and that there is a natural reluctance to maybe be as proactive enforcement crime is as you normally would be.

And then you know when you do see this air of lawlessness that allows for this behavior which, seen in cities where the violent murder is out-of-control. Sort of a gang and Yang. And it's not a good and I'll point out that while blacklight matters say they care about people of color their approach to completing America as caused more African-Americans lose allies because not as successful as word a couple years ago at disrupting violent crime and inner-city got so very desire to protect life. The protest against perceived police brutality and something more lives being taken just what I wanted to just live for years now, cultivated, honest discussion with my listeners and I've learned a lot from them as we interact so I will only give them direct opportunity to interact with you police officer was 17 years experience. So here's what we do.

What I will start with Leon in Richmond. We got a bunch of other callers. I want to get to Jeff water has written a book, the war on police. He talks about was called the Ferguson affect and wants to talk about how to make America safe again and were going to get were going to get a wide range of opinions here. So again the book Jeff order or 00R DA war on police. Your calls interact with my guest. We come back in the light a fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the line of fire now by calling 866. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Those lyrics reflect hostility towards police some parts of America is merited. Is there an unfair war on police is the one police causing America to be less safe as my guest Jeff water says that there is a war on police his book by that very title, Jeff was 17 years and police experience to Jeff. Let's interact with some callers and this will be constructive interesting will start in Richmond, Virginia Leon, welcome to the line of fire. Hello Dr. Brown hello Sir, yes loud and clear our character. My question for you Jack now yogurt going out why we bring up Obama, but because of what's going on. I actually think they'll fold now but you know everybody out built all the pictures and I would be honored if you read them about the about that. You know by like that so you know to be like that and that the main problem with take-out, the guy in Chicago. Religious role on the job them and without they show what happened but then they read the write up all the background there and they all live, reported to have the never came up and I think you just put in the recruitment and it is not fair at all is a lot.

I suggest you heard what Leah had to say if you had said hey look, you got some bad cops out there just like every segment is that of the society you got some bad apples. And now that were catching some of that on cell phone. Things like that it's it's causing rage across the country. Then Leon would have had an issue with Leon today we been expenses for your sect.

How do you blame it on Obama so he takes issue with that so unjustly on some funk.

Go ahead. I Leon hey I don't disagree with you that will batten with the same percentages.

The report you your right. Every profession has a bad apples and I never went police shooting happened, or when when somebody loses their life at the Tampa police officer.

I never say that the officers actually guilty or not guilty what I say until we know more back that we seen everything out there that there is the sea is first to see that as quickly as possible, and second, that what we we shouldn't judgment until we see it and that where I do fault the president. I think that you rush judgment on police officers and the Michael Brown case in person with a really good example. I think that present Obama and other black leaders are uniquely situated to wade into the crowd, people who were demanding after justifiable and say I guarantee you that justice will be done in this case, but I asked you your freedom. Protester created speak your mind. The man answered, but don't don't burned on your own city don't smash one of don't loot the store serving your own community or burn them down. Let's wait together for all the information and then of the country will make an assessment and hope that the court systems do what they're supposed to hear all about all that's good. There might drive down the Charleston South Carolina shop. Those people when the police picked them up working a shot fired by it took him to somewhere to get something to eat and kill nonblack people in a church and guard arbitrary that put out the bomb right man were prepared but a black guy with a broken tail light in South Carolina can get on a ride in the garage back did note that her car Karen brought them frustrated like like with a Jeopardy you See that it was going out there and dust with jet and Walter Scott case and I in no way excuses that all through the first thing that I so when I thought that he was no way to reconcile what he said. With that video and no way to justify what he did with it.

So you get the perfect example of of a case worded that seems pretty dial everything cortical but pretty clear that the he acted improperly and cops to get Robert remember.

Cops also are under more oversight than I of the profession with the Possible� The nurses and barges who were drawing in to show people that should be under more school. They Best Way, Gary Bender curing them felt that Ricardo and placement.

They have authority to know a lot about how I the and I dented my argument is that they they are held to a higher authority because you're in St. Louis have a Civil Service Commission civilian review board internal affairs division of force investigative unit and every case is sent over to the city circuit attorney review. Even when they think the officer acted justifiably and very often the case or sent the FBI, the US attorney review and so I think that I think that where they're doing it right. Cops have got a lot of scrutiny and a lot of oversight and what we find is that a lot of the cases, the cop acted properly again and that when they didn't. The courts get the justice I want to get to some other callers course.

I appreciate you weighing and see. These are discussions we must have and we will continue to have success. Thank you for raising these important questions to my guest Jeff Warda begin his book the war on police. I want you to bunch more callers for my guest. So if you can stay on the line that would be great because I want to give the opportunity to interact with Jeff you have in the book a exclusive interview with Darren Wilson who was the shooter of my namesake Michael Brown in in Ferguson it will without getting into the details of the entry that's that's in the book of very quickly.

Where is his life right now is is he able to live a normal life. I wouldn't call normal. I call it a service, rightly life values under threat, but you trying to get his life together.

Life also police officer person should try to get her life together both moving forward. But you know the interview was one of only three interviews Darren is.I think it is best, showing the size of their right that's different order the book.

One police, it's the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution get into the line of fire now by calling 66343 here again is Dr. Michael Brown and black person, and you will and the lady is saying he called them for help, not to kill her brother and they shot her bread right that was from San Diego. You hear the perception they did it again. If you run back to the OJ trial. The mistrust of the police was much higher in the African-American community in the broader white community's efficacy being manipulated by outside forces is that because they've seen bad things and then mistreated the questions we have to ask phone lines are jammed want to get to your calls momentarily, but we just get a few more minutes with my guest, Jeff Warda.

His book the war on police Jeff two questions. One, if you think back to the OJ trial. Why do you think there was more suspicion of police and into another officer.

I my son-in-law serving as chaplain now and spending time with officers and a police chaplain, but I'm not an officer. I don't claim to have any idea about what actually goes on with two questions one what you think is more mistrust for the police system law enforcement system in the African-American community than in the white you just broadly speaking, and into cases like San Diego, why not just tase the guy turns that he was unarmed, so please your responses.

I don't know much about the fandango shooting yet actually talk back and forth good cops are out there that want to give me some more insight on that one, but I don't know that it's so much about race as it is economic position. I think that Victor more distrust of the police by folks who are in economically challenged neighborhood and I'll expect got comp the problem the country. Black, Arctic, portly, born into poverty and live in poverty and and there's more. Please note neighborhood more volatile police citizen interaction neighborhoods so maybe it is not right but I don't I don't get completely about race and second in large part about economic and social economic situation is as far as the larger question about teasing is the reason Satan say the shooting in Tulsa. One. One of the officers went to tase that the men who was killed and the other officer shone in is charged with manslaughter at the moment. Of course she'll have her day in court. But how does it work with tasting versus shooting what you don't be. A regression. A continuum that goes from the officer's mere presence, which is a short force to using the deadly weapon and there are our steps between their intermediate and nonlethal means of bringing a person to compliance, but it is no that is what they will examine closely in the Tulsa case is whether were weathered deadly force was justified. Whether a less than lethal option was available and should have been used, the less elite options not always appropriate based on what suspect doing and based on other things like proximity and environmental committee people standing on a Web server to Apple if the wind blowing at you. You can't make somebody very small, confined space like a car or small room became base for those those are considerations that the cops are are barred going through in her head and split second night in full-spectrum and split-second. What what weapon system drive for employee what is appropriate situation. That's what we trained so intensely is to make that sort of automatic what what what height we are out of time and the segment friends, we come back straight to your phone calls. My guest today, Jeff Florida are all O RDA's new book, the war on police.

The line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown hi my my guest. Jeff was able to stand for a few more minutes but that was the limit of his time. So I wanted to get the extra time with him but want to go straight back to your callers. Please understand, Jeff won't be here interact with you, but I want you to be able to get out your side of the story. What you wanted to be heard so we go to Teaneck, New Jersey market, welcome to the modifier Lamarck I Brown well thank you I am a young black male and I live in the New York area and my only I can read everything that met Supreme Court said that black men have a reason to fear complete interaction that their disproportionately targeted and bought where to buy population. I believe that there more guy just for second you not understand how it does end my point where in my own personal interaction with believe that there is deftly a bias like Weatherby, Rachel or not like you deftly have a reason to be angry with lethal and I think it's a growth overstatement to say that the warm police when they have so much power. What they had like 100 years ago and is like. I hate to remind people that, but we just had a civil right movement in a 60 like all that disgusting stuff that took place that hatred didn't disappear like it might be like like like like years ago but had it and they can't take it an inbred hatred and systematic like people think like years like Kumbaya. We all sat down at back at old. I don't expect lethal to be 100% but I people to be noted that there think they only note you can get Best Buy while you are still falling and being so somewhat let let me ask this because what you're saying is, is levelheaded and Christ centered is hatred a right response to hatred, no not yet understand that like years and years and years of persecution like wind on one of my love. One of the nothing of what we don't align at work is not in a light yes it will I you I would I would say this Mark listen. The fact that the moment I open the phones on this. I'm getting a sled. It was calls who disagree with my guest means my listeners know I been fair in these areas noticing of the West.

Otherwise you wouldn't be listening. Others would be listening to the broadcast. If I was racist or if I was coming across in an unbiased way. These are honest discussions we've had, as we've learned from each other. My concern and everything. Is that what we do does not make the problem worse. In other words, we all agree that if there is a shooting where the police officer reacts wrongly takes an innocent life reacts based on stereotyping or whatever. Then we want to stand against that and work against that we all agreed that when someone responds with violence and looting that that's wrong. My concern, though, is that there are people Mark on both sides of this be they right-wing black X is a right wing right-leaning or left-wing black cleaning or however you want to put it that are using these tensions and problems and issues to stir up more unrest to rather than to help in a constructive way like a Dr. King did to call for right response who are just cultivating and anger. That's only going to create more unrest, which is then to create more tension with police. So I'm just looking to get fax out to get truth out to get both sides out that's why open the phone lines for this very reason, so people could interact with with my guest and then to be redemptive in whatever we do that, that's my concern.

Mark your very caring about. I got milk all your approach that the black person like I believe interaction anger make the coming I don't really meet young black male. I don't do again volatile time of development make a good thought like mine about black lives matter. Leo Holcomb black on black crime as a matter of black on black crime really in a 50 you got systemically against that filling out raping women with no definite all that is. Like all you know about the battle back.

No big deal yeah Mark that that's a listen I understand there is certainly parts of America that that have strong racist attitudes.

The problem is I want to address it on all sides, and I appreciate you recognize my my friends and in approaches and secondly perfectly balanced on none of us can be, but I wanted do the best I can to to be just and to be right regardless of which side is something I font and what concerns me when I see for example a radical activist mentality in black lives matter and some of their goals are to disrupt the nuclear family.

A queer activism, transgender activists and their words when their Israel bashers and things like that. I see a whole bunch of other social things and I love the things we did there that are totally destructive that I can do more harm than good.

I want to stand with those who were standing for justice in a holistic way and there plenty parts of America that are not marked by racism, but I know that the answer to racism is not racist. I know that that hatred of of Blacks does not, then get overcome by hatred of whites, which then gets overcome by hatred of Asian know it doesn't work like that. Those with Dr. King said that that hatred can drive out hatred. Darkness can't drive out darkness so let's stand with the forces of light which of course bring everything into the light and expose the darkness rivers more.

Thank you for calling and sharing your heart. I appreciate it.

Let's go to Denise in DC. Thanks much for holding and welcome to the line of fire Denise.

It's a little hard to hear you yes hello I can't say what stay right there. Stay right there. Howard is going to get you in a moment, and will try to figure out what is happening with your with your phone there right, let's go to another Denise in Boston. Welcome to the line of fire. Yes, I can okay I'm calling the gentleman, but I feel that objective embarrassed him by and I will read the however I really think about it is you that going through a red light went with the car that whipped around me pain, but different lethal walk. Don't let me and I looked down at my car because my leg was boy now it was that being allergic to anything that I a medical fan on which completely ignored me, now quite often the only medical condition activate against me going. But what that became the book. Federalist, but my EpiPen temperature out there waiting for him that the medical faith in your car and go back. I felt my band don't need medical attention. He ignored me and got in the car and I'm waiting a long black in my back and get my yell at me and if you don't move back.

I'll give you another island. I was devastated that night. Let me just let me just throw this out okay. First, I'm sorry that you went through. I'm glad that you you didn't have a more serious incident medically came out of it put Haiti went through that obviously if there was an issue of a young black man who fit a certain description in a certain area and you fit that description.

So they pulled you over. But it wasn't you that the one thing but that's not obviously who you are. You're a woman and I imagine you're not. You're not 18 years old so you wouldn't fit a particular description.

So, in your mind you were treated like this exclusively because of the color of your skin, but I like hearing Bob and I am driving for application for any get pulled over and often no note like family and they would wanted him to get out of the car and minute.

I am a minute if you would allow me to pull my I'm not talking you.

Yeah, that no citizen for Elisabeth Emma talking to my wife and I had that went when pulled over. One time I think I'm a speeding ticket when I was driving to Texas I will my wife went to say something. He made very clear he wasn't talking to her, but Denise, your call is on record, you are absolutely not the first to share these things.

That's why we are opening the phone lines.

Thank you for calling the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice is more cultural and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown and I mean that I that's the voice of Siana Oliphant speaking to the Charlotte city Council about police violence. Some might say hang on. The reason for the absence of mothers and fathers are others being killed is not police its violent crime in the community. The reason for the absence of fathers its breakdown of the family. Why make this a big deal when it's one case of one officers case a black officer shooting a black man and who was apparently armed, and whose wife would what your to really take that restraining order against him and talk to and carry a gun, but when we look at the larger issue. Some would say that is this girl being wrongly inflamed in her inner attitudes. Those are questions you have to ask when you agree never justify wrong actions by police officer. That's not the Senate but as my previous guess said if you've got millions of interactions with the public every day, 750,000+ police officers interacting justice ties with the public over the course of the day to get multiplied millions of interactions then the fact that here and there you have a problem cop gets wrong and let's address it the subtle that a proportion that's not the big issue. These are things to be discussed at an and we are taking your call so that we can address these very issues in a holistic way. Let's go back to the phones in Chelsea, Massachusetts. Jeff welcome to the modifier like the name of the game � hopefully for Obama. Obama what everyone was implemented with work will will will fade out. All local police, and when that happened we become building.

We become incurably pretty much because local police are accountable to the people.

Local undoubtably for the good, the government and the beginning of Obama Obama administration.

Obama said he wanted a national security force people to about the US military people don't really report it. If any kind of country that they have undoubtably very effective because they have undoubtably for all the other hand of the national police work that were coming. Is Basil writing� Have a national police board template that� Just yeah I think I think for sure that we all agree with that.

When I say we all. I don't know anyone among us. That's advocating for that or something where the government and that since you just take over.

But thank you for raising a concern Jeff. I appreciated let's try again to go to DC and AC. There I Howard doesn't look likely to be able to make that call. Please let our caller know we go there for the Lawrence in Clinton Maryland, thanks for calling the modifier. This low hello yes Your Honor Brown yes sir you today.

I'm blessed. Thank you.

Good.

Enjoy your show. I want to comment on the gentleman who had the book pretty much through to the advantage of the police officers yes or and and, Senior, and I've been having issues with police to repent that with the NT in my team not really something new, but I do want to say that he seemed to be saying that the did it coincidental when they pulled him over. Well officer and those that would rank tell me directly that there are police officer that do racial profile and pull people over because of their black is I want to make sure that that's cleared and also there so many many killings mandated that, predicted people say that that racism is gone but it is not gonna racism is alive and well and is very clear and and if you have racism in our community, and all you and all the other area. Why couldn't be on the police report also fourth in their discriminating Indian people. According to color and so therefore what he saying is an honest anybody with a doctor for quite a while and you want to the supportive organization and I have no problem with that. We had to face the truth until we can face the truth of what happened will never solve the problem.

We continue to make and avoid the truth.

The problem will continue and that's why continued because we have not accepted the truth that the racism is alive and well and we need to stop it out and not call it something else. When I try to avoid the real truth about it. I so soon. Thank you for calling again, these are the very voices that I want to hear and interact with him on the air. So let me throw two things and some if you agree with these okay okay one. Yes, you said it so I agree with you course, there's the racism that means there's this can be racism on the police force as well and I think I guess said yeah there are problems. He just thinks it's it's it's the bad apples are few, not the majority here. So the question if you have a particular area. Let Sam one area you have some Asian American gangs right and these Asian kids are getting is there there responsible for a lot of the crime in the area so when you are looking for criminal and you see a car with Asian American young person driving by that kids got a better chance of being stopped just based on criminal profiling. So okay RA is that the Kate there's no excuse for mistreatment. Ever. Or speaking to another human being in a demeaning way ever, ever, and I don't doubt your expenses, especially the further back you golf course could been even worse before but could you understand the cops and yeah I I do if I see a young black man and I'm looking for young black men in the silicon vehicle personnel pull him over his eyes from looking for something to it could just as well been a Hispanic American, or Asian or Jew understand there is that element as well.

And yes, I have been pulled over because of that element but it would become a car that looked got right out of the client in endocrine and I guess what I'm saying is that I'm not trying to say that there isn't any of that but I don't think we need to put the emphasis on that because with all the killing that are going on and income people on on on video. It seemed to be pretty often if you're getting all without charges or without convictions, and it's just that because we are where we are avoiding the truth with skipping it with acting like it's not there. And � just with the problem. It ended long as you do that people are going to be angry and angry going to build and build and sooner or later you about the pipe and the people at the pipe going to bricked me out of control. At that point � what happening. We got a series about this is the truth about Jesus, we are out of time you get in the last word today. My bottom line, we will pursue truth and righteousness, and will do it together side-by-side right here when you talk apologetics with Dr. Norman Geisler it's time for the line of fire with your host activist and author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown is the director of the coalition of conscience and president of fire school of ministry get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I just spent a very productive hour with a 4 inch officer with my callers as we continue to talk about the cultural issues with police with violence with race with riots in America.

We switch subjects. Now, this is Michael Brown coming we live from Dallas Texas. Did I mention first hours live in Dallas YM live in Dallas Texas getting ready to speak at Gateway church tonight on moral and cultural issues, but more about that later we were switching gears and were talking again about apologetics about defense of the faith with the upcoming annual apologetics conference right in Charlotte, North Carolina from October 13-15. We've had a number of special guests on Richard land Lee Strobel others on today we have Dr. Norman Geisler so we have a great discussion. If you have a question for Norman Geisler if you have any type of question apologetics question biblical theological question of any kind whatsoever.

The phone lines are open 866-348-7884 that is 86634. The number to call and out will will talk about a wide range of things importance of Scripture the importance of the reliability of Scripture, the place of the defense of the faith in the church and in the world and and let me throw this out for you. I don't know many people that came to face exclusively through apologetics. In other words, they became convinced that the claims of Christianity/the Bible were true based on which they then said okay I will not give the rest of my life to Jesus there was normally one of the major step which is coming to faith in him putting one's trust in the living God turning from sin and asking for forgiveness.

In that sense. Apologetics is often pre-evangelist Lewis. It is part of proclaiming the gospel, but it is leading to the proclamation of the gospel is overcoming obstacles it is removing barriers it is answering questions so that someone will be willing to hear the rest of the gospel message. At the same time apologetics serves a very important purpose, and that is not only for pre-evangelism but also for the strengthening of the faith of believers. I first got involved in Jewish apologetics with the motivation of helping fellow believers helping fellow Jewish believers who were bombarded with objections and arguments and rabbis raising valid questions and they didn't always have good answers. So my first reason for getting into apologetics was to answer the questions for the believers and then secondly, to reach the nonbelievers, and that remains my heart to this date, so many people get picked off, they lose their faith because of evolution, they lose their faith because they have a hostile college professor who attacks the Bible the alleged contradictions of the Bible and on and on it goes in many many different ways.

So if I can help the believer's a strong if I can help a believer stay firm in the faith.

If I can help a believer. Be confident that the word is true.

Be confident that God is faithful, be confident that we are not living in denial that we are not closing our minds to science and facts that we have integrity that believer staying strong is just as important as a lost person coming to faith and in fact, that believer staying strong can now help others stay strong, so there is that healthy ripple effect back with Dr. Norman Geisler and your questions for Dr. it's the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

Thanks so much for joining us on the broadcast today 866-34-TRUTH them to call this is Michael Brown and my special guest Dr. Norman Geisler, the author or editor of scores and scores and scores of books major apologetics works world leader in the world of apologetics, founder of several schools teaching the word teaching apologetics teaching theology.

One of the speakers at the annual Southern Evangelical seminary conference. The Apologetics Conference Taking Pl., October 13 through 15th. I got a bunch questions for Dr. Geisler, but if you'd like to ask Dr. Geisler a question yourself 866-34-TRUTH the number to call recognize the welcome back to the line of fire. Great. How did you get involved in apologetics yourself.

I was with them in the ghetto in Detroit in the drug staggered of. And pick a Bible in my hand and that that I regretted about in the Bible to that you should be doing that. They pointed to a verse you should read that in the red letter edition Jesus said, go and tell no man could not get out of here in the how to answer that and other people are typing up and not orange witnesses. I decided either. I gather your answers that would now imagine that was quite a few years ago. Your your past 80 now do you feel satisfied with all of the challenges that you have taken on you have whole, but no massive encyclopedia of apologetics. Things like that. So the arguments from science arguments from history from archaeology from theology from culture and other religions attacks on the Scripture you feel intellectually and spiritually satisfied that their answers for every question. Six. Doing it at I question minutes from hundreds to a handful.

But their answers for those interested in that also speaks of an intellectual integrity to see a their handful of issues questions that remain. Just we keep learning and growing, with answers to some of the ones in your own journey that took the most time to really form solid intellectually sound answers. Probably the problem of evil and God felt powerful. It could destroy it is all good he would destroy the spirits every and all of it are far from the end and in short how did you or in long your call. How did you end up addressing that the word to. Make it valid yet, if God is all-powerful.

Could this reveal a series of goods he would defeat evil that he was not yet created, so it doesn't follow. Note that this fellow that have defeated them. They will the food in the future because it is all-powerful. He can do it. It is all good it will do it if it's not done this and and it's going to happen so that one word yet changes everything doesn't are things different today in terms of the tax on the face than they were when you were young man basically the same by Apollo little book in basic arguments both people that they they are articulated differently and there no books on them. The same old arguments to just get recycled and different different closing words sale. What about the atmosphere young people go off to college. There's a lot of hostility there. Let's say there is a taking a class that University of North Carolina, taught by Prof. Biederman. I debated him action on the problem of suffering. A few years ago and have a big class New Testament intro class and a lot of Christian young people come in their and determines it great textual scholars. The New Testament is respected social bone agnostic and will begin to stroll around would appear to be contradictions in the Gospels and suddenly faith is undermined. We help people like that because people come into that secular environment.

Suddenly their faith is undermined in late they don't how to respond well to always read a book, big book of Bible difficulties Genesis to Revelation 800 of those contradictions after 60 years of study and the 800 of them I found 00 contradictions in the Bible. Secondly, they need to know about Bart Ehrman himself electability violence. In trying to collect the one student asked him you miss your relationship with Jesus and his cause. No, I missed the sum of the Christian friends. I have a cat that love fire my wife being married to her for 60 years. The P guide to US media materially in your life. I synonymous the family reunion again for Mr. you know one thing for sure I didn't have one.

If I had one myself) need to get faith appreciate that that perspective would even be speaking on at the apologetics conference or not. I was so I came up with the name and I'm speaking on the family defense never rest. I was going to write a book out of another stolen like title so I had to put the it's a good title because the defense never rest of that arrest because of the effects. And though there continues to the rafters so we will run out of them got it right. Let's let's take some calls. I guess if you want to find out about the apologetics conference go to SES.ED you. You can actually live stream from anywhere in the world. You can register to live stream. Let's let's take some questions for Dr. Geisler will start in Raleigh, North Carolina been welcome to the line of fire. Thank you for having me.

I've been welcome. So I am personally interested in pursuing apologetics and I became interested after being up bunch of videos on YouTube of a guy named Cliff metal goes to college Engages the students there and does it in a very gentle loving kind of way.

In a way that I hadn't been done at thought been pursuing it on my own time a few things that stop me right now. One thing in particular is the idea of natural disasters being under God's sovereignty and one thing in particular about that would be earthquake if if these incidents that occur because God is actually causing them what was his original purpose in creating the tectonic plates. I know that sounds like a question posed by an atheist, or somebody trying to attack the love they blessed that I have answer right in my head, however, became humanity's only improbable planet like you used in astrophysics. John five apologists in the field in the country of restricting their art conference, meaning that personally and in this book he shows how all of these things included earthquake are necessary for this kind of world. For example, earthquakes bring up minerals which are necessary for life without them life and the possible so there's a overfull of answers and then I recommend you give it just came out improbable planet by Hugh Ross so Dr. Goss is just more broadly if this someone refers to any natural disaster is an active God says it would be an insurance policy. Should we assume that hurricanes, earthquakes, tornadoes, or acts of God, and somehow God's judgment on ascending world is that Satan trying to destroy us, happen in the book of Job, as it certainly isn't something a category if we don't know if it's a good active good good action figure that make life possible. People realize in the garage so brilliant minds that I have been privileged to know the right in this book. It shows how this whole world was set up by God and how these things we call natural disasters part of his plan of preparing the earth for man of her life and ultimately for our own redemption. I think we we assume that these things that are inconvenient to and that we don't like are bad, but you soon. Less than units assume that all the discipline of the Lord, the Lord loveth the Jason is a bad thing. You know it's good. No suffering. Shame good for the U of this perfect reward Geisler thank you for this loss become more time for your questions will be discussing with my guest, Dr. Norman Geisler don't have a least a few of his books is written 80+ we get the exact number the other side rake apologetics confiscated SES the file line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the minor fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown and my guest, Dr. Geisler found it seminary which hosts a massive annual apologetics conference 13 October is all for women than the 14/15 for everyone to find out more go to SES.ED you Dr. Geiser. I'm looking at a quote of yours it says one should never tie his face to how old the earth is to explain that while your other two major views held by Christians today. Older millions of years old and younger thousand years of nowhere does the Bible commit itself to how old are so we should never commit herself something irrevocably that the Bible doesn't commit itself to that in the beginning God created heaven tells us there was a beginning that were committed to tell the guard that created everything that were committed to.

But it doesn't tell us all their affairs and for us to place our faith on something the Bible doesn't immerse do you go to first geology class and the teacher convinces you that the earth is older than you are. Tonya Terrio faith that that's really silly to their faith because somebody told you I showed you that there is older than you thought it was you hold to the inerrancy of Scripture. What if someone young earth creationist pressed you and said that if you look at the genealogies in Genesis. If you look at the historical records the earth can't be more than 10,000 years old. So you're denying Scripture if you posit that there could be an old earth. How do you respond there are gaps in the genealogy Matthew wanted for Joram to get the highest first Chronicles 311 the 14th of three generations that I know there are gaps in the genealogist so it could be older than 4004 gave me. Secondly, there's a difference between a young earth and a whole universe. Universe could be old here could be young by that I mean. Could we just thousands of years. The human race will universe could be much older than that both leaders are possible and just how many books have you written or edited some something over 100 hundred and two. All right okay I knew was over 80, but I had to check back to the last feature set must of must've missed a few.

I let's get another caller Allen in Kernersville, thanks for calling the line of fire for sure thing you hold the biblical view of the flood being global. Where do you think that happened and what do you fear the best evidence that we have today what occurred but actually we found the attic trailer God put it on) to look at my website. Do you can to the pictures of it. I know personally fixed movement inside of the theology of this people and normally used for the glacial period is really what happened during the flood the glacial.

It is not true and is clearly excited of believing that in you have to get back to the you tell them of their lives. Five. And what what is your website if our apology.com a RK arc apology.com yet we we have a mutual friend was one of those who did the investigation and went into what they believe was the ark of Caesar more test to be done but could you feel confident about this. Are you want to buy into a lot of conspiracy theories are no I don't I don't hold any excess satanic. The devil is supposed everything.yet the ultimate conspiracy there. So you haven't been one that's endorsed lots of different art discoveries or things like that are flat.

I was skeptical of all of them for 30 years now.

Sunlight best friends and colleagues have built those it is and I pooh-pooh them for years, but the Beatitudes found where the Bible says it landed, and there they wooden structure ancient wooden structure. The size of the new apartment 33 stories are fed up on top the modern era is no way a coven growth of 30 there floated in as the Bible says there was no fair, impossible is under a glacier. Now it has credible evidence inside the ark, as well as outside of the world civilizations haven't traced back to that the location of the Bible so so I am very very testing things now that I actually found the things on the ark pottery the dates back to that time. What time. With that being that there would be about the same time, the Bible says the third third millennium middle of the third millennium BC and Dr. Geisler's leave her face with God said in his word and then we have experienced the reality forgiveness of sins a new life in Jesus. And we don't need the discovery of an arc to believe that the flood actually happened.

But let's say there can be verification of this and and scientific documentation that this in fact fits the description of the ark. What impact you think that would have on skeptics or on the world in general become more skeptical of the caloric area and everyone but it would be a wonderful support of our faith. I think it is true I believe it is.

It would be the greatest archaeological discovery in the history of mankind is worth looking at the evidence we have all list of the evidence of why that they are another list of why it could not be a hoax. The people of the fifth of that could not be there worth looking at you and also this when I saw the footage from the folks that had been there. One of the first investigations I was stunned and again I'm just looking at from a distance. I haven't researched it as you have simply looking at it. And even though I I've been a believer for decades and not question this actually seeing it brought home the reality of what happened, but it was the original the real arc are not suddenly looking at this I thought oh my God there really was a flood level is believed it either requested that but there was something that hit with greater impact because of it right so encourage it.

It's like America.

This covering of it if they have discovered that things about the life of Christ thing about living things that relate to his tomb and other things in the velvet event to the land of Israel and start digging around you think of it is extraordinary. Find out more about the apologetics conference SES.edu.

My guest Dr. Norman Geisler, it's the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution get into the line of fire now by calling 66343 here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

I want to take five more minutes with Dr. Norman Geisler, who has joined me on the broadcast today. I know Dr. Geisler, you've got to go with dots of brand-new listeners coming in and I want to take advantage of these last few minutes that we have with you. So Dr. Geisler scrub another call, this is Michael and Clemens North Carolina. Your question for Dr. Geisler hello where are all in our current hell of a lot like some of the following. I know the same good comes from the Greek word apologia which is in first Peter 315.

This is in part the Lord got a new paradigm.

He always figured answer of the reason both attended and were forgiving the defense for your faith is yeah and and Michael.

If you look in the New Testament if you're able to to check out that word apology a. If you look through you'll see it's used in different contexts. Paul for example in Philippians 120 method defense of the faith.

When the book of acts in a legal trial armed and offer my defense. So this is our answer. This is our response.

This is our defense. Michael, thank you for asking.

Many of asked the same thing. I'm not a pot of need to apologize for my faith. The work without apologizing.

I've never never taught you about this.

Dr. Geisler, but what you think of the shroud of Turin skeptical because I live in Sony France. Sony 60 reconstructed things into the Catholic relic thing and more would from the cross, but need to fill the Cathedral more milk buried in a gated effort that surrenders. I mean, I've just been skeptical of and there's a list of arriving at 11 we don't need it. If not part of the evidence of Christianity.

It doesn't have a thing to only have the I just know one of plaintiff in a treatment center than that is run cottage last question for you.

There are people today the talk about bibliology.

We don't worship the block and Paul said the letter kills, what are they getting wrong and what's so dangerous about that mindset. Well, you know, for all of the getting right there any right that we don't worship and that it would be idolatry to going of people think the thinking Bible� Element string and on the Metropolitan Opera. We certainly want to devote all of that. On the other hand. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater because what I will worship the Bible. The Bible is God's word. Jesus said the Scriptures cannot be broken. Their unbreakable Johnson 3435 and Matthew Mr. Monica is imperishable heaven and earth pass away, so that is the word of God forever settled in the heavens and the him unbreakable and inerrant, and even though we don't worship the we do honor and respect God's infallible word and what you think of people will gain by attending the apologetics conference. I think of and for sure is inspiration to defend the Christian faith that game courage in their own ability to do the game. The motivation to vote witness for Christ because a lot of it will dollar the they don't know what to say.

People asked them questions. There are answers, and give them amen there are answers come and get them SES.edu to sign up for the conference is just to restart you guys and thanks much for joining us today. Thank you plan by the Expo line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown voice and more cultural and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown God, Satan and angels and demons, but is there more to the unseen realm than that Scripture alludes to a defined counsel, sons of God. What is the unseen realm good understanding of green light to confusing passages help us understand Jesus's mission better questions 15 year journey into researching what the ancient Israelites believed about the unseen realm yeah that is quite a trailer quite a promo for the book by Dr. Michael Heiser, the unseen realm you'll find it a fascinating read.

Urinary unit challenge appointer Scripture you will find a fascinating eye opening read when you get it you get it with the exclusive one hour interview that we did on Monday. Plus a 12 hour teaching series I did on angels, demons and deliverance.

You can order by going to ask Dr. Brown a SK DR Brown.org ask Dr. Brown.org I believe you will be richly blessed by this resource offer. Okay I want to take advantage of some extra time that I have just in my own notes when I was looking at Dr. Geisler being with us. I thought it was with us for a bit more of this hour. Actually he said he gave us five more minutes than was planned which I appreciate. But that gives me a little extra time here on the broadcast silt first full month you can stay open 866-34-TRUTH 784 any question you want to ask me any question under the sun as well as its fit for Christian radio biblical, theological, moral, cultural, whatever.

I'll take some calls.

As I have opportunity 866-34-TRUTH 7884 but tonight at Gateway church.

The main campus in Southlake. This is one of the fastest growing churches in the nation. I believe the most giving churches church the most missions supporting church in the nation press in the world� Done very gracious things here with pastor Robert Morris, a friend of mine in the ministry year.

They've asked me to speak tonight at their special equipment service on Wednesday nights they'll have all many many different classes taking place in different areas that have different groups of people get plugged into because with any mega church you want to do your best to disciple people and help them grow beyond the the weekend service so they do that in many many different ways at Gateway but then they have everyone come together for the clipping service and that's gonna take place tonight and I've been asked to talk about the moral and cultural issues. Specifically, issue 70 with with LGBT activism on the one hand you have issues right issues that affect your kids in school issues that are facing us in the courts issues that are affecting us in the workplace and the other hundred dealing with people, people skills, move loved by God.

People for whom Jesus died.

So how do we address the issues and care for the people to be talking tonight about the need to have hearts of compassion and backbones of steel hearts of compassion and backbones of steel. I believe you'll find it to be really eye-opening really practical will ask the hard questions. What is the Bible really say about some of these key issues with the hard questions and in terms of how are we to respond to personal difficult situations in the home and the church will do it with a way that you'll be equipped.

So join me at Gateway tonight will be a short time of worship and then teaching. I believe you'll be done by about 830 in the evening, so plenty of time to get on with your evening. That will be at the main campus, 700 Blessed Way in Southlake against 7 to 830 tonight and then tomorrow night tomorrow night. This will be my first time doing this in the greater DFW area. You have an intimate meet and greet one have thousands of people were going to have a smaller group of people to give a short inspirational that I can have any worship to give a short inspirational words a minute take your live Q&A and then get to hang out little bit when take a picture. Having signed a book will have some resources there as well.

So it's going to be a really special night and that is all the me just get the address. Your I know speaking folks all around the country, but an indulge me for a moment while I speak to folks in the greater DFW area. Even if you have to drive an hour to get there half of come down from North Carolina to be with you silt that's tomorrow night at seven at Gateway's North Richland Hills campus 7501 Davis Blvd. N., Richland Hills, 7 o'clock tomorrow night and tonight at Gateway 7 PM. It should be a really special time together. Looking forward to it. I don't. I may be able to meet folks after the service tonight. I'm not sure he may have to to run right out but if I'm able to meet you tonight. Great certainly.

Tomorrow night will be able to wipe 866-34-TRUTH to the phones with Chris in Arlington, Texas. Welcome to the line of fire. Hello Barbara hello okay good.

I looked on the gun?

Or have a question about Josh and 12 through 13. Were talking about you made a little more about that because having a hard time with rentable for Arctic for the heart, you can kind of explain. I explained that out appreciated Sue and Joshua 10 you talking specifically about the command for the sun to stand still right so first let me say this, I I heard many years ago that NASA scientists had been able to go back through through history and somehow could trace back through the centuries and the millennia and discovered that there was a day missing and they couldn't figure it out and then someone civil look. This happened in the Bible and this it all while that was the the day missing as far as I know that is 100% myth okay according to everything I know there is there is no such scientific evidence for that. So the question is an end like Chris, I just want to warn you I got a really really simple answer for you okay I mean really, really, really simple.

I'm not a scientist.

Maybe I'll get you, Ross on and and ask him this this very question and then we'll get a scientific educated answer, but what if it can't tell you it's really simple. Chris, the question would be how could the sun stand still in the sky so that the daytime was extended so Joshua could defeat these enemies of Israel and these enemies of God and bring judgment on them. How could that happen without the whole universe going into chaos with without everything spinning off the globe and complete chaos on the earth that would be the obvious question right.

It is a scientifically it's impossible.

Some I really simple answer is that Almighty God has the ability that whatever the repercussions were to do this through the entire universe he could do it. He could also give the appearance of the sun standing still, so that there was light because that's the big thing that the sun stood still, there was light all that he could give that appearance and allow the light to stay on the earth for those extra hours whatever the extra time was for Joshua to fight and defeat the enemies you have the same kind of question with the sundial going back to shallow going back 15� or going back with with that with Hezekiah when he's healed and he asked for us of you for that to be the sign of a single backwards with universe going to complete chaos in my simple answers that Almighty God has the ability to delete certain things to get the results that he wants to get so beyond that, Chris.

I'm not a scientist. Yes, Dr. Geisler, he was on would have a more scientific answer, but he's on the air with us so that's the best I can answer you. But honestly, it's never troubled because another scientist and an II just figure God has the ability to do these kinds of things that seem impossible to us, but from his perspective he could, so I just did this this and this and would say all that makes sense. We just don't have that knowledge or information so I apologize for my overly simplistic answer very elegant but it is a world of power that out. I get about one of Lorinda I greatly look at it is, God has you will follow Dan and Chris, there's absolutely nothing wrong with looking for more information and a scientist like Ross and astronomer could probably give us the combination of the faith answer in size, I'll ask him about. Thank you friends this is Michael Brown. I would encourage you to join our support team today, torchbearer one of our regular monthly support as it enables us to broadcast the line of fire in America and around the world and all.

Every month we sold back into any many different ways join our team become a torch and start run a SK crown.org, click on donate. The line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the line of fire now by calling 8663 here again is Dr. Michael Brown welcome welcome to the line of fire, 866487884 yet there are questions you could ask me and I'll have to remind myself, okay, I'm on radio. We've got out wide diverse listening audience. People from many many different backgrounds and was only so much time we can use to answer a question and I don't want to lose people along the way. Saw this event so much information and I've done somewhat study on the issue and the things could be so technical that will do my best to break them down simply and to present them in the clearest and most concise way. And then there are other things you ask when after I just got a real real simple faith answer like the question about the sun standing still in Joshua 10. How can that possibly be from a scientific perspective. What I find interesting and I just wanted to talk to you in the straight lead straight, honest way that I can. What I find interesting is often how little that we do know, and that when we find out more, but we thought was such a big problem or a big issue was simply a matter of our own ignorance, a matter of our own limited perspective have have you ever wanted to give someone the benefit of the doubt and something that you thought how polite seems to be a lot of evidence against them in my sticking my head in the sand and then someone just comes up with one specific piece of information that we didn't have before and suddenly all all that explains everything you ever had that happen to begin with your kids, you could be dealing with a spouse can be dealt with a coworker to be dealing with an issue your your your addressing in another setting. You get one little piece of information. All okay now know that explains it. Everything totally clear.

I was trying to get something set up with my radio equipment I can broadcast studio quality from anywhere in the world with an ethernet cable and units about a $4000 unit that I travel with. So it's a high-tech unit and it enables me to do a studio quality broadcast. I got my Mike's hook up my computer is insight that, but it's very portable I can do it anywhere in the world is also having ethernet cables better than wife licensing cable connection to the Internet to plug into my unit and it happened recently that I could not get the unit to connect F you hotel if you've ever used Wi-Fi in a hotel use a computer and hotel.

Often a screen page will come up the splash pages is called and it will ask for your name and a list for your room number now.

Sometimes the people booking me when I'm speaking will book me and under the name of the person sitting at the reservation and they do that also, so that people wouldn't be able to call the hotel and find me and take all Dr. Branson this hotel or that hotel on a call and and and want to talk to him in his room so I just answer.

Sometimes I go to get online and I'll plug in that information I have to do that. I'm a radio unit as well. Okay me to get on Monica my little screen there and get a sale come in this room and it's this name and some working so I know my name and I know the room is not working and that is all. I was checked in and to somebody else as it happened, it happened overseas and it was an Asian names like Otto Avenue not install them.

I heard of that spell it CF to call the front desk is excuse me but who am I have. What's the name of my room while I'm on the road a lot and I can be in one hotel one day and another another. The next and another next and I can get the room number wrong. I got confused. I thousand four.

31. That was 431 yesterday.

I'm at 438 today in a different hotel and and I call tech support and we can figure out what's the problem on putting the right name and I'm putting the right room number entered tech support our tri-workouts like Al Hayat skews me put the wrong room number and sorry that happened.

It happened recently. In point of fact, like a few hours ago, but it is only a couple minutes we took the cell that felt that for sure. Here's the point. It seemed to me from my perspective that I was doing everything right, but I was missing something. Maybe you're a chemist.

Maybe you're a mathematician, maybe, or someone else where there is a logical system that you have to progress through and you can't. Something is not checking out and summonses you left the step out. I know I didn't realize I had to put that step in this process. What I'm saying is a lot of times with the Bible with our faith. Something is not lining up is not right.

I don't understand it thought I believe the right. What's what's missing. This seems to be a strong objection. A lot of times it's just were lacking in information a lot of times and archaeological discovery will bring clarity or a new textual discovery or new understanding of the word in question, and suddenly the light goes on. Realize all okay was not big of a deal at all. You know it's like Ira. I remember I remember decades ago void to the people in this memory aren't even walking with the Lord. I have many many years but your close friends guy and his girlfriend friended up Libby to the Lord. This was his girlfriend she helped lead him to the Lord and they had a surprise party surprise birthday party and he didn't want to let on at all. And over the course of the night think we going to church service in regard surprise party. She got upset with him because she felt he was acting in a cold way and all he was trying to do was not let on with the fact that there is to be the surprise party and not talk about issues like how can your time on my birthday. How can I make a big about my birthday and then when she found out if you felt miserable accusing, over and over. Did neglecting the birthday since you have the bigger surprise was the opposite of what she thought she thought he had before. Hadn't remembered the birthday to the contrary, he had not just remembered it.

That made these elaborate surprise plans to make it a special birthday for she misinterpreted his actions.

My point is that can happen with us and the Lord we can misinterpret his actions. We can misinterpret what he's doing and we don't realize that the reason for this was totally different than we were thinking or expecting. So hang in there answers do come questions to get resolved objections to get answers there all their sometimes the problem is we know so little guy can even give us the information and help voices to be given to us.

We would understand it, or current state of science would be so ignorant that the right exclamation would make sense because we haven't learned enough yet to understand this way as we continue to grow in our faith and in our knowledge, it all comes together all right one last reminder what is it just four hours from now Gateway church. The Southlake campus join us for a very special equipped service and I can't wait to see you there. My bottom line today. Love God with all your heart and your mind to go hand-in-hand