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Analyzing the 2,000 Mules Movie and New Claims of Major Election Tampering in 2020

The Line of Fire / Dr. Michael Brown
The Truth Network Radio
May 2, 2022 5:00 pm

Analyzing the 2,000 Mules Movie and New Claims of Major Election Tampering in 2020

The Line of Fire / Dr. Michael Brown

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Well, there is a new controversial documentary by Dinesh D'Souza claiming massive election fraud in 2020. I've got a special guest who will analyze the data with us. It's time for The Line of Fire with your host, biblical scholar and cultural commentator, Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice for moral sanity and spiritual clarity. Call 866-34-TRUTH to get on the line of fire.

And now, here's your host, Dr. Michael Brown. You know, it's an interesting thing. When you read the Bible and you read the words of the prophets, many times they're speaking about things in the future. But quite often they are addressing their people in terms of what's happening in their day.

The same way when you read the letters in the New Testament, they're often addressing contemporary issues that the churches were dealing with. Right now, there is going to be a new wave of discussion about election fraud because of the 2000 Mules documentary just released by Dinesh D'Souza. Is this much to do about nothing? Is this yet another divisive distraction in our culture? Or is this a matter of truth?

Was there really election fraud? Hey friends, welcome to the broadcast. This is Michael Brown here to infuse you with faith and truth and courage, helping you stand strong in the Lord. Want to give a shout out, first day on our brand new station in Lynchburg, Virginia. So everyone joining us today, so glad you're here with us. We may talk theology one day, politics another day, Israel another.

We always have our phone lines open. So here's the number to call 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. You get to weigh in on today's topic. You get to ask my special guest questions.

So when you want to weigh in as we get into the show, that's the number to call. I'm joined again by a good friend, Professor James Beverly. He has written many books. He has been a professor for 40 plus years, and he's known for meticulous research. In other words, he'll just dig and dig and dig and follow the evidence where it leads. Sometimes it leads to places that he doesn't like, but he's going to follow the evidence.

He was able to see 2,000 mules in advance. So we're going to unpack that for you today. Jim, welcome back to the line of fire. Thanks, Mike.

It's great to be with you. For those who don't know you, tell us about your teaching background, your professorial background. Okay, I've been a professor for 42 years, 10 years in Moncton, New Brunswick on the east coast of Canada, and then 32 years in Toronto at the largest Christian university in Canada, Tyndale University.

And you've done a lot of research as a research professor, as someone, as I said, following the evidence. Tell us about the Illustrated God's World Religions that you put out. Okay, I started that book somewhere in the 1990s, and it took...

I said I'd be done it in a year, but it's hard to write an 800-page book in a year, so it came out many years later, and in 2008, I believe. Anyway, it covers the major world religions, the major Christian denominations, and it covers groups that I call cult groups that claim to be Christian but they're so bad that you better give them a word that warrants people. Those three categories. All right, and you've also interviewed or interacted with some really interesting people, cult leaders or other religious leaders. Tell us about that. Yeah, one of my high points of that kind of study was I got a personal invitation to go to Korea to visit leaders in the Unification Church, so I met one of Reverend Moon's sons. I got invited to hear him once in New York State, and so there's one example. I did my PhD thesis on the Unification Church, commonly called the Moonies. And then, let's see, I had a personal interview with the Dalai Lama, a private interview in India, courtesy of Christianity Today magazine, so that was fun.

They said that I'd be allowed, you know, maybe 20 minutes or 25, and then I think that's the way they protect themselves if the guest is boring or whatever. Anyway, at the 25-minute mark, I said, I know we need to wrap up, and the Dalai Lama said, well, this isn't New York or Washington, so we'll keep talking. Anyway, I had a chance to ask him tons of questions and also witness to him about the Gospel. What about Scientology?

Yeah, go ahead. Scientology, I actually know top leaders in the Church, and also I'm personal friends with Hubbard's son, Arthur, who still believes his dad is the greatest. He doesn't like the Church of Scientology, but he likes his father's teaching. And then I'm friends with his son, Leif, who became a Christian.

Really? So Scientology is one of the groups I've focused on for a long time. And I don't want to bring up specific situations, Jim, but have there been times when you've done research or uncovered things, and you really didn't like where it led, but you had to follow the facts?

Well, when you said that, I thought, when I get weighed in the morning, I sometimes don't like the evidence that shows up on weight scales. Let's see. Oh yeah, listen, of course, wouldn't it be nice if I was raised in a church where everything I was told was true and accurate, and it was the best interpretation of the Bible, the best principles? But I still remember a night where my father told my brother and me that some things that we were taught at church were a little overboard, and we need to be a bit more relaxed.

Let's see. Well, you know, here's where life would be simple, Mike. Say you're studying a cult group, and then you... so it would be nice, wouldn't it, that the Christian Church is the great Church, and everything in it is wonderful, and then everything in a cult group is terrible. So I've had to learn that people that believe terrible things or false ideas can be really nice people.

I met once the two leaders in the, what used to be called the Children of God, then became the Family International, so I met the modern leaders of that group, and you know, they were as nice as anyone I've met. So yeah, but if you care about truth, then you got to follow the truth, even if you don't like it. Right. All right, so I wanted to give that intro first, because you've had a fascinating life and career, and it's just good for those that don't know you to find out more about this background. But as we've interacted in the couple of years that we've been interacting a lot, I've watched you do this very thing.

I've watched you say, Mike, I've been studying something, and we're concerned about X, Y, Z, and then the more you dig into it, the more you say, Mike, there's really something to this, and some of it's been disturbing, but you've been committed to follow the truth. Now, one other thing I want to lay out, would you consider yourself, I know you're a Canadian, but would you consider yourself an ardent supporter of Donald Trump? No, I'm a mixed supporter. That is, where I find his principles great, and I agree with his policies, or I admire his courage to stand up against unrelenting hate. Well, that's where I respect him. But you know, in all my years, I've studied about Trump for six years. I've written four books related to him and read thousands of articles and talked to a lot of people. Some of my friends know Mr. President Trump personally. I've only ever met one person who thinks that he's basically faultless. Everybody else knows that he has weaknesses. So what I urge people to do is carefully separate what's great from what isn't great, or what's in the middle, you know, and then, like, there's, there's some statistics out that he would win again, if he runs in the next election. What I would wish for is that he would moderate some of his extremes.

And, and then he would win, he would win so easily, but he creates his own stumbling block. Right. So there's a mixed view. And I believe that's what reality is. And the reason I put that out is just, and I don't know, I don't know what James Beverly is about to tell us. I know he's seen the 2000 News documentary and it's, it's got a lot to say, but we haven't discussed in detail what his views are after seeing it.

But I'm setting this up so that you understand who it is that I'm speaking to. If I was speaking to someone who is absolutely militantly against Donald Trump and think he's the worst thing that ever happened, that would likely color views. If it was the opposite side, Donald Trump alone can save America. He's the best thing God ever created for our nation.

Well, that would color things, but, but that's not where James is coming from. One other thing before you saw 2000 News, without going into detail, just an overview, what were your thoughts about the reality of election fraud? Is this something that you thought, wow, this is real, or maybe it's real or definitely not real? Where were you before you saw this documentary? Well, I've studied it even since, since before November 3rd, I've studied the topic and I don't want to say I've looked at it every day, but I've spent enormous time on it.

I would say as the time went on, I realized that some of the claims about election fraud are totally false, but others are very, very reasonable. And I urge readers or listeners, I guess, I urge listeners to follow a guy named Patrick Byrne, go to the American Project. He's one of the best people in America to give you data about the election. And he's perfectly free and willing to say that some theory isn't true. But then he'll also present evidence that there's been real fraud. I have an agreement with one of my best friends. He is so convinced that the Republicans in America are basically losers. And he's so convinced that Trump lost, that he said if he ever even starts to think that the election might have been fraudulent, he'll buy me a steak dinner at the best restaurant in our city.

Anyway, I'm in the, I'm not, well, I could say before I saw Dinesh's documentary, that I was in, I was a bit in the middle, but leaning towards, yes, there was election fraud. All right. So what about this movie?

2000 Yules. What do we make of it? Where does Professor Beverly stand today?

You'll find out as soon as we come back. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the line of fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

Welcome friends to the line of fire broadcast, Michael Brown, your voice for moral sanity and spiritual clarity coming to you from our studio at CFNI in Dallas. Before I get back to Jim Beverly, Professor Beverly, and I'm eager to hear what he has to say about this 2000 Yules movie because we have not discussed the details of it or his findings. Before we do that, we've got a special resource offer for you this month. I believe it's really going to bless you, encourage you, strengthen you, build health into your life or the life of someone you love. So let me just share a bit more with you about this resource and we'll come right back to Professor Beverly. Are you struggling in your faith? Do you have doubts and questions and you really don't know where to go with them? Or maybe you have a friend or a loved one that's completely fallen away from the Lord?

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Okay, now for the eagerly awaited moment back to Professor James Beverley. So Jim, first give us an overview of the thesis of Dennis D'Souza's new documentary, 2,000 Mules. It's a long argument, very well done, the film, to say that various operatives in the swing states paid people to drop ballots off in ballot boxes.

And they call the people who do that mules. And they have evidence based on cell phone tracking, which is legal to collect, you're going to pay for it. So they got evidence from cell phone tracking. Plus, they got access to the video cameras on ballot boxes. And they captured way over 2,000 people doing this illegal activity. And you can tell that something's going on, because people do this in the middle of the night. They look around sheepishly before they put the ballots in the box, and then they take a cell phone picture of themselves at the ballot box, because they got to go to their next stop.

Or after they're done stuffing ballot boxes, they got to go to a stop and get paid for it. So I sort of instinctively thought that the documentary would be really well done, because Dinesh is a famous filmmaker, and his documentaries are in the top 10 bestsellers in America, or most widely viewed. But let me tell you, even with that positive view, I was blown away by the film. It is really well done.

And it is really convincing. Thanks mainly to a guy named Greg Phillips and a woman named Katherine Engelbrecht. Those two are the brains behind the operation to find out if there was voter fraud. They're both based in Texas. Katherine's connected to a group called True the Vote. And Greg runs an organization that deals with election integrity. And so I've come to know both of them.

I've talked to Dinesh on the phone, talked to Greg on the phone, and I've mainly done email and text messages with Katherine. So let me say this, the film is astounding. And what I'm saying to people is the film is going to change American politics. It will no longer be possible for anybody to reasonably say there was no fraud. In fact, Greg and Katherine just wrote me in a text message, I asked them, is what these people are doing in the film criminal? And they both said yes, with Greg saying that in some states it might be legal, but basically it's criminal behavior. People who have been caught doing this get charged with felonies.

This is not minor crime stuff. So there's the gist of it. One thing about it, some of the stuff about election fraud is so complicated. Hardly anybody can understand it. Like, when you get into debates about how polynomials in math prove there was fraud, you have to have a degree in mathematics to know what that's about. Or some of the details on computer fraud involve being a specialist in computer technology. This doesn't need that.

You just watch the video and or the or the film, and you'll see, you'll see clear evidence that something really shady has went on in America at the last big election. All right, so let's say I play the devil's advocate here, right? Yep.

Yeah. When I when I'm presenting an argument, I'm always thinking of a counter argument. Even when I'm preaching, I'm thinking, what could be an objection to this? You know, I'm a debater. And I think in those ways, and we all know that video evidence can be doctored, we all know that things can be presented in a misleading way through editing, etc. So there's obviously going to be a lot of pushback here. So I'm going to start raising, I'm going to start raising questions as someone who's only seen the trailer. Okay.

Right, go ahead. Right. So the first thing, how do we know, even if these people were actually mules, and they were actually getting ballots, large numbers of ballots and dropping them, you know, one in the morning in mailboxes, etc? How do we know that they were for Joe Biden? Maybe they were for Donald Trump? Or maybe there's another explanation?

What would you say to that? Okay, with rare exception, the people who are who, who are dropping off the ballots, go to democratic organizations after to pick up their money. So it's not like they're heading to Mara Lager to get money from Trump. These are, they're going to democratic organizations. The other thing, the documentary is always creating, is already creating waves in the Justice Department in Washington.

And why would that happen? I think because there's recognition that this documentary and the data collected by Greg, mainly and his team, that there's worries that this is going to shake America up. But I believe that America does need shaken up because of the sad state of affairs with the republican-democrat divide, with all the problems in America. I think both democrats, republicans and independents need to face the reality of America and do what it takes to get better. And one of the ways for things to get better in America is to have free and fair elections. All right, so so what if, again, playing the devil's advocate here?

Yeah, go ahead. Okay, what if these people legitimately were working for the Democrats? Let's say that's true.

All right. Let's say that what they were doing was exactly what it looks like. They were dropping off large numbers of ballots and in mailboxes at all odd times. What if they went to nursing homes where the there are places where the demographics would be?

These people can't get out and vote and they're going to largely vote Democrat. And they were just gathering legal ballots and doing the service for the people by dropping them off at whatever odd times there were. Those are just the ones they're showing. The documentary didn't show the ones that were in broad daylight at different times of the day. Maybe they were just doing that.

Well, some people do this in broad daylight, but then people around them know something funny is happening and they call it in. Catherine has a toll free number, I believe, to call in concerns about election. The other thing, the documentary does show interviews with relatives of people in the nursing home. And it's obvious in the documentary, the person there wouldn't, they don't even know it's daylight.

And yet they voted. So there's there's been fraud even in that way. You know, I'm not saying, by the way, that I know absolutely what the truth is, because, like you, I want to think about, you know, what what are critiques of this movie? Could it possibly be wrong?

But but I think anybody who sees it will realize this isn't just trivial, minor nitpicking. This this is serious behavior that both Greg and Catherine and they both testified in, in Senate hearings, etc. Greg flies all over the world doing election integrity analysis for various countries. And they spent, they spent, I think, $2 million collecting the data on all this from all the cell phones that they tracked near ballot boxes.

All right, we come back. I'm going to talk about the implications of this. If you have a question for Professor Beverly, if you want to challenge this narrative, if you want to reinforce it, 866-34-TRUTH. Yeah, election fraud. Talking about that again, you know, my position has been that I did not have the time to investigate the massive claims and counterclaims about election fraud, that I did not feel personally called to stop everything else I was doing and really focus on that. And that number one, after massive prayer, that God answered prayer by putting Joe Biden in the office, whether by hook or crook, whether it's to bless us or to curse us. Either way, I accepted Joe Biden as president, just as I accepted Donald Trump as president. And my position has been, if there is fraud, it will come out through the courts or perhaps through other means.

Is it coming out now? That's the topic under discussion. Before I get back to my guest, Professor James Beverly, we'll take calls to 866-348-7884. I was speaking at a leadership conference in New York this past weekend, talking to a younger man attending there, I think with his dad. And he's very much a tech guy. And as we were talking, every point he was making, I would say, yeah, I've written that, talked about that.

He goes, how is it? I haven't seen the stuff. I said, well, it gets suppressed now. What used to reach hundreds of thousands or even millions that we'd share on Facebook may reach instead 2,000 or 10,000 today. So the best way that you can stay in touch, the best way that you can know, here are my latest articles that are there to equip you and answer the tough questions. Here are my latest videos you could share with others. Boom, let us be your voice.

We've tackled the difficult issues. You can share that video with people. Here are our latest resources we have available for you. The best way that we can do that is if you sign up for our email updates. So go to Don't rely on social media to share it because it may not reach you, all right?

And things may get blocked or censored. So Sign up for our emails. And this is what we'd love to pour into. When you do, we've got a really neat mini book and ebook we want to give you, Seven Ways to Pray for America. If you're going to order Has God Failed You? with our special offer, go to

Just click on Store. Okay, so back to Professor James Beverley, who was tremendously impacted by the Dennis D'Souza movie, 2000 Mules. What's the worst case scenario, Jim? What are the implications of this? And let's look at it in terms of the worst case scenario. If all the charges are true, and this was somehow done in a systematic, national way, because it's anything but haphazard, if true, what would the implications be?

Well, if these are felonies that are being committed, then the Justice Department or police should get involved and people should be arrested and tried. So that's one level. Another level is, I believe that the film will make, well, I think if I had to guess, but it's only a guess, I think politicians, even on the left, will see it and realize things better get changed on the way elections are held. And then I believe that there's a chance that some states will decertify the 2020 election.

So those are possibilities. But based on knowing the way things often work, there is a chance that the worst, that what will happen is the left will avoid the film. They will use cheap arguments against it. And America will still be divided because you'll have millions of people who've seen the documentary who believe that it proves election fraud. And they're still bitter because they don't think the elite on the left will listen to the evidence.

All right. Well, let's dig deeper, though. Who's ultimately behind this? Does the movie indicate that or is there speculations of just different, allegedly, democratic groups in different areas hired these people to stack the ballots in a certain direction or does it go to the National Democratic Party? Does it go to the Biden campaign?

Yeah, they don't say that. What they say is all you need to steal an election is you don't need to do some massive conspiracy everywhere. You just need to pick the swing states and do them there. So if what looks like happened, then it means that at least Democrats at the local level engaged in this fraud.

Philadelphia is the worst city involved. There's more people taking ballots around than any other city that Greg has tracked. So I doubt if I'm sure that this is not known at the upper echelon or that it was planned there. I think local operatives did it. And Larry Elder, the conservative Christian leader, he says in the film, and another guest says it as well, if you thought that Donald Trump was the next thing to Hitler, or even worse, what's the big deal about dropping off some ballots to make sure he never wins?

He never wins. So I bet that a lot of the people who organized this did it on that basis. And then I think a lot of people who actually got the ballots and put it in the ballot boxes, a lot of them just did it for the money.

In fact, they have won a couple people on the video saying they did it mainly because they needed money. Got it, got it. All right, let's grab some calls. And again, we're getting Professor Beverly's reflections after watching the 2000 Mules movie, which he says is massively well done, convincing and powerfully documented.

We go to the phones. Jose in Northern Utah, what's your comment or question? Yeah, I just had a statement. It didn't take a movie or anything. If you don't believe that there was election fraud, you're either in denial or just have no common sense. There's so much evidence out there that it's undeniable.

But like I said, this show should show everybody. And if you don't want to listen to it, you're just absolutely against the truth. So thanks for taking my call. Can I just ask a question of you, Jose? I know that's your conviction, right?

But since my position has been up until now, I'm not sure. I've read very, very strong arguments for very, very strong arguments against. So I know you didn't mean to insult me personally, and I don't take it as a personal insult because you feel so sure about this.

But are you saying that I must be ultimately in denial or refusing to believe the truth? I just want to flesh that out. I'm not offended in the least. I just want to flesh out your statement. No, no, it's okay.

It's okay, yes. I mean, there was a guy that testified under oath that he hauled 24,000 or 24 gay lords full of ballot boxes across three states. There was a lot of evidence the Supreme Court wouldn't even hear it. And just the evidence that they was brought up to them for the Supreme Court not to hear it, that should scare everybody because there was at least enough to hear it. So yeah, honestly, anybody, and I don't mean to offend.

No, got it. I just wish people would stop denying the truth and listen to everybody that's trying to be quieted. Yeah, our caller is Jose. Okay, Jose, here's something to think about. The case for election fraud has been deeply hurt by people telling theories that they say proves election fraud absolutely.

And then those various items, not all of them by far, those various items, they melt away. Upon further study, they turn out not to be true. I think, for example, Mike Lindell was fooled by a guy when Mike announced that he had computer evidence of massive fraud from China and other countries.

Now, I agree with you. If someone says there's no election fraud and there's no evidence of it, I believe they've not studied the topic enough to know the key evidence that's presented, say, by Patrick Byrne. He's the best person, B-Y-R-N-E. Here's what he's about. He didn't vote for Trump.

There's ways he didn't like Trump. But he thought, based on his own independent, expensive analysis, that there was fraud. And so you can now just type in Patrick Byrne, B-Y-R-N-E, and go to his local's channel, or go to the American Project, and he presents a long list of cases that should make anybody go, yes, there is evidence of fraud.

Now, maybe in the end, it won't change things. But like you, if someone says there's no evidence of fraud, I mean, some of my contacts, I've asked them if there was election fraud, and they said not at all, there's no evidence. And then I say to them, have you heard of Patrick Byrne? And if they say no, then I know they've not studied it, because he has been the most influential person in America to shape concerns about election fraud. And he's an equal opportunity guy. If he hears theories that aren't true, he tells his audience, no, that's not true. But then he'll also tell, as he did to National Public Radio and reporters reporters from the Washington Post, he'll tell them, hey, here's the cases of real concern. Got it.

And by the way, Jose, thank you for calling in. I wish that the Supreme Court had looked at the Pennsylvania case. I think it would have been very positive if they did. And Justice Thomas wanted it to happen. Now, interestingly, he said it wouldn't have affected the overall election. That was his view. Even if the charges were true, it wouldn't have affected the overall election. But I wish they had reviewed it, because the more we bring everything into the light, the more both sides can be satisfied. All right, let's go back to the phones, 866-344-TRUTH.

We go to Paula in Snow Camp, North Carolina. Welcome to the Line of Fire. Hi, thank you. I'm going to say, even without the mules, what happened. There was so much evidence. First of all, why do you have state illegally changing voting laws right up before election time? How about the people that were judges and poll watchers being escorted out, never in history has that ever happened, being asked to leave, and then the windows boarded up so nobody could see inside the room. What about the video cameras that caught them pulling out suitcases from under the desk after 11 o'clock at night?

That never been done before. What about watching the wave across America by 11 at night? We usually 11, 12, you could sit up and you knew the outcome of the voting all my life since 1972. That's what I counted on. Well, they stopped it before the last West Coast states were counted, and then shut down everything. And it was already like an 80% leader or something. I'm being exaggerating, don't know the facts.

But I know it was so much that even if eight California and Western states voted, you would not make up that gap. All right. Hey, I've got to jump in. We've got a break here. We'll be right back with my guest, Professor Jim Beverly and your calls. Stay right here. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the line of fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks, friends, for joining us on the line of fire. I want to emphasize that with or without election fraud, Jesus is Lord. That regardless of who is in the White House, Jesus is Lord. That whether human beings are honest or dishonest, Jesus is Lord.

And we are all looking to Him, those of us who know Him and follow Him, we are looking to Him, putting our trust in Him. And at the same time, every one of us, regardless of what political party you identify with, what your ideology is, whatever your values are, if you are a person of conscience on any level, then you should agree, we should all agree, that what we want most is free and fair elections in America. In terms of the elections, that's what we want. Free and fair elections where there is equal access for people to be able to vote, where one group is not discriminated against, where there is no fraud, where everything works properly. We should all want that, right? This is a democratic republic. And then let the outcome be the outcome.

If we like it or not, we have to accept it, but let us all be sure that the elections are freely and fairly conducted. That is our desire. Okay, we've got a few more minutes left with our guest, Jim Beverly. Let's go over to William in Canton, Georgia.

You're on the line of fire with me and with Jim Beverly. Thank you. Thank you. Hello, can you hear me?

Yes, I can. Okay, great. I'd like to ask Dr. Beverly about the Trump recount in Arizona, which went against him. Does that indicate that, at least in Arizona, it was perfectly right?

No, I don't think so. The mainstream media used a fact that was true, but it's misleading. If I hand you 200 counterfeit bills, and then someone says those are counterfeit, if you just count the bills, you're going to find out there's 200, and you're going to say, oh no, the numbers add up. So if you superficially count the ballots and put it that way, then you can say Joe Biden won. But the main people who did the audit, Doug Logan, Ben Cotton, they believe there was fraud. And then this data has been analyzed by a genius named Joe Van Pulitzer, and he says the same thing.

And the Attorney General of Arizona has just written publicly to say that there is evidence of election fraud, and he will be pressing charges. Now, in the end, again, it's very complicated. Joe Van Pulitzer is a genius, and so he doesn't realize how complicated are some of the things he talks about.

But it's not as simple. Like, one thing I've learned studying Trump stuff for over six years, I no longer trust mainstream media when it's anything to do with Trump. It's not like they're totally wrong. But I just read today, I read a critique of 2,000 Mules, and the critique is written by someone who hasn't seen the documentary yet. But what it does is it contains, it's a useful analysis, it has some good stuff in it, but you can't trust him because he uses loaded language. You know, it's like, where did you say you were from?

He's from Canton, Georgia. Okay, so if I'm talking to you, and I don't like what you're saying, if I disagree with you, here's what I can do. I can say, now, are you a Southern hillbilly?

Are you out there making moonshine? Can you come up with such ridiculous arguments? Now that in philosophy is called an argument ad hominem.

And I see that all the time. So I don't I don't trust the mainstream media reporting that the audit showed that Joe Biden won. You know, one minute they say the audit was terrible, and it was done by a bunch of losers, etc. And then the next minute, they say the audit audit proved that that Biden won. Well, which is it? Is the audit reliable or not?

I think there's still more, there's still more to look at on the Arizona thing. All right, William, thank you very much for the call and Jim for the detailed answer. As I said, Jim's a research professor and he digs and he seeks to learn and follow the evidence.

And he is not an ardent, sold out Trump supporter, nor is he one that came in with a presupposition of election fraud either way. And again, if you say, well, Dr. Brown, why don't you study this more? One, God hasn't called me to do it.

Two, my life is absolutely filled with the things that God has called me to do. And thirdly, others are doing it and we'll do our best to learn from them. And here, how about we all pray this. God, when it comes to the 2020 elections, let the truth come to light. When it comes to the 2020 elections, let the truth come to light. And then, Lord, give us the courage and the heart, the integrity to follow the truth wherever it leads, personally and as a nation. How can we go wrong doing that? How can we go wrong? All right.

Got time for one last call. We go to Mauler. Oh, we don't.

We don't go to Northern California. Okay. So Jim, as a follower of Jesus above all, right? As someone who believes in the power and lordship of the God that we serve, let's say this is all true. Let's say the fraud is as bad as President Trump has alleged. Let's say the election really was stolen. As a believer, where does that leave you?

Where does it leave you in terms of your mental, emotional state? If you're an American citizen and you voted, let's say you voted for Trump, felt he was better than Joe Biden, how did you process that as a believer? Well, I know that I have to trust in the sovereignty of God in difficult times.

And of course, it's even more so now that the Ukraine war has happened. But you trust in God, and then you pray for the powers that be, that they will that they will do the right thing to respond. I mean, if it came to, if America woke up to the fact, and this is an F, if there's election fraud, we would ask God to give wisdom to the Supreme Court and to Congress to deal the proper way and to all the leaders in the separate, in the given states, etc.

You pray. But in the end, you know, we realize that our only ultimate bottom line is that we trust and anchor in the gospel of Jesus. And that's our foundation, no matter what happens.

Yeah, and that's the bottom line. And that's why after massive prayer, before the elections, and after the elections, I said, all right, whoever's inaugurated, that's what God has determined. Now, whether it came about through hook or crook, we shall see. If there's more evidence that comes to light, if there's more going on, again, let the truth come to light. Was President Biden brought in as further judgment on America? Is it to shake things up further?

Would we have done even worse with Trump in office? God knows all that. But I'm not unsettled in my own spirit because my faith is always based on the truth of God. Hey, Jim, later tonight, or this afternoon or tonight, I'm going to be posting on social media a really neat link. We don't have time to talk about it now, but it's a Bible guide in one page, a key doctoral points with links.

It's just really neat, put out very inexpensively as an e-book online. So I'm going to be linking to that later. Thanks for taking the time to do all this research, to watch the movie, and to join us again.

Much appreciated. Yeah. Mike, can I tell the audience, tonight is the first night where the public can go to theaters and watch the movie, and then Thursday night's another night, and then on the next weekend, it goes streaming on the internet. Okay, great.

That's why we wanted to get Jim Beverly on, right as the news was happening. Thanks so much for joining us. God bless. Thanks, Mike.

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Whisper: medium.en / 2023-04-23 23:12:40 / 2023-04-23 23:29:53 / 17

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