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Good afternoon, everybody. Welcome into the Winklerverse. Oh, welcome into the Winkler verse. I'm Bart Winkler. This is our weekly mm-hmm mm-mm.
And before I begin. I do have some more content available this week. I think I'm going to do a. Packers Giants preview. With Carlos Ortiz.
The debut, right? He was. I did an episode where I did like an episode during my national show, and I was, so he popped on there. But yeah, and he might join us for the post on Sunday after Packards. Giants, which is suddenly a must-win game.
Grant Bills is here. Paul Limmig is here. Again, our weekly mm-hmm. Um I did shift just for the Dan Shaney podcast viewers. I shifted back to the non Depth perception background because I am doing a channel 12 hit today, and I don't know if they're ready.
For the DP. Hmm. I'm just going to give them. The SP, the short perception. Standard.
Yeah, I'm just giving them.
So, catch me for three minutes. on the four o'clock news if uh i even post this by then okay Packers lose to the Eagles 10-7. Horrible game. Um Let me just say a couple of things if I may. And I want to give a couple of stats.
First of all, I want to respond to one single tweet. That I got that I don't even know that anybody saw it. But it's just one single tweet. I had shit on LaFleur, of course. You?
Yeah, and a guy named John said, Yes. LaFleur should stop calling those drop pass plays Those batted ball plays. and the illegal formation.
So It can never be. Coach is bad. Players are also bad. Right. It's always got to be one or the other.
Because how many times have I said something about LaFleur? And then it's followed up with But Jordan Love. You're saying two things cannot be true? I was lit, I mean, words out of my mouth, Grant. Is that what we're.
I'm just saying, if I say something, if I say the coach sucks. You saying No, the player sucks. That's not a defense of the coach.
So I'm saying two things can be true. But Why are these plays happening? That is what we need to dig into. Why are the balls being dropped? Why are the passes being batted down?
Why are so many things happening? Poorly. on the uh offensive line. And I had a thought last night that I thought was very smart. If it's understandable, because he responded to the play or to the tweet.
That I had. Where I said, Matt LaFleur needs Jordan Love to play at a certain level for his play calling to work. But Jordan Love can't play at that level because the play calling doesn't work.
So, what Mad LaFleur is doing. And there were a couple of different people that Um I think Warren Sharp was a guy who had noticed. Through the third quarter, the Packers were averaging third and nine. On their third downs, third and nine. Constantly rushing on first.
You can look through, and they average like two and a half yards more per pass on first down instead of run. But we're constantly running, running, pass. Or running short pass pass. We're setting Jordan Love up to fail, essentially, is what we're doing. Marilyn Fleur is not setting Jordan Lup up to succeed.
He is maybe. Setting prime Aaron Rodgers up to succeed. Which he's used to. And Jordan Love is not Prime Aaron Rodgers. Nor will he be, nor should he be.
Also, Aaron would have checked out of the majority of these LaFleur calls Right, so And we'll get to that. But I just think that Matt LaFleur Is such a Bad coach. and a horrendous play caller. And when I said last week, and I put a reel up, and a lot of people are saying podcasts are expensive. Podcast equipment should be more expensive.
Because, and I said this last night on my. Current radio show. How many more hints can I give? I'm getting hired. I said this last night.
Um On my radio show. That I'm trying to make reels because reels play. Correct. The shorts just do They bounce on it big time, big numbers. But I am so much better understood.
In longer form. Long for I see. I am much better like I am you don't get nuance from shorts. Correct. So if I have a sh Five minutes into the podcast, this is news to me.
if i this is a this is a bart winkler short five minutes and 22 seconds if if i say LaFleur would rather have Malik Willis be the starting quarterback. I'm not saying Malik Willis is better than Jordan Love. I'm saying when they had Malik Willis, we all thought, oh, the The offense is running more smoothly. That's because Matt LaFleur was calling what he wanted to call. He wants to call conservatively.
He wants to call, run, run. And the quarterback, you still need the quarterback. But we only need you for like six or seven throws. You got to make a few, and if you and Malik did well at that, there were some plays that he made where it was like, wow, he made this throw.
So that's the kind of offense that LaFleur has really always been calling. And I do need to give more credit to Aaron Rodgers for kind of saying. Not entirely, sir. I mean, I'm going to I'm going to I know a lot more than you, which I don't think I've ever run from saying that. I mean, the.
Roger's been playing this a long time. But Jordan Love needs a little bit more of that. He needs to check out when it's fourth and one and they're screaming inside zone. And they know which way it's coming. He needs to call a timeout or check out on that.
Jordan Love was not good last night, Jordan Love was not good. I don't like when people say He's not the guy. He's not a franchise quarterback. If you don't think he's. Good, you can say that, but I don't like those phrasings.
Because what is a franchise quarterback? Mahomes and Josh Allen and Lamar, and even they suck sometimes.
So, short story long, as I like to say, Matt LaFleur. Last night. Um what everybody saw. With Matt LaFleur in the Eagles game.
Okay. I've been seeing.
Okay. So yeah. Am I mad they lost? Absolutely. Am I happy that people see what I see now?
1,000 magillion bajillion percent. Yeah, this is a Bart Winkler victory lap. It already was after the Panthers came. It is now My first question, we're going to do a revisiting. We're going to take this.
The picture of him trying to figure out his play sheet in the second quarter will haunt him forever. Two things I want to talk about. One is We are going to revisit a week later. The MatlaFloor approval rating Question because you guys both felt different than me that there was nothing LeFleur could do until the day he's no longer the Packers coach in which his Packers fan approval rating would be less than 50%. I think he's testing the fuck out of that.
Um Right, like for sure. The other thing I would say is, I was trying to connect the dots and I decided not to do research on it, instead, just try to piece it together while we're talking. There was a game in the McCarthy era. Right before he gave up play calling, or before he seriously explored it for the first time. Maybe you guys can help me.
He did not know that Clay Matthews was not on the field. Does this ring anymore? It was the NFC Championship game.
So it was the NFC Championship game. He didn't know Clay Matthews wasn't on the field because he was too consumed by the offense. And that was what first led to the serious line of questioning about McCarthy giving up play calling.
Now, he ended up giving it up. 10, 9, 11 months later, at the end of the next regular season. But it was because he didn't know that. When you are the head coach, Who's calling whether it be offense or defense, in this case, offense? And you're back.
is turned. To the only good function of your team, the defense. And you are so not important to that function that your back is turned while you. You know, look at your... Your tablet device, and you know, all the memes that have come of it.
I'm telling you, I think this was LeFleur's McCarthy version of not knowing Clay Matthews was not on the field. It's such a... Break from a head coach being, even if you're the offensive play caller, needing to be responsible or at least aware of what is happening on the field. Like, I always find it strange when a quarterback sits on the bench. What was he doing anyway?
I mean, again, we. What is he doing? Why did he need if you have your play sheet? Why do you need to go to the equipment? I'll tell you because he proved so many of our points.
And again, maybe for some people listening, they would say, I don't find this to be a negative trait. I very much do. He was emotional. You saw him throw the one thing the one time, and then the next time he just had to get in his like little. back area and like rigorously because he's too emotional.
It's all consuming for him. He can't stay composed. He's a non-composed individual in the heat of a battle. That's what he is. And probably not a good person.
I'm hoping. I'm hoping. So I, you know, Grant, I think you and I probably had the biggest difference of opinion last week about if, well, if you give a play calling, you're done. if you're and i don't disagree i don't like coaches play calling to begin with first of all It is strange that you would be so. In theory, so great, like Ben Johnson, let's say, such a great offensive coordinator that you elevate to head coach, and then you pretty much are just still the offensive coordinator, albeit like the guy who gives the speeches also.
Like, it's a strange concept. Anyway, I think this was LaFleur's McCarthy NFC Championship Clay Matthews moment where he's going to have to realize. What a bad look that was. You can't. Because, I mean, what percent of the credit for the defense being great?
I'm going to ask you this. McCarthy. LaFleur gets. 20% or less of the credit for the Packers' defense being as great as it is, or mm-hmm, that LaFleur gets 20% or less. Of the credit for the Packers' defense being as great as it is.
My answer is unequivocally: it's. Less than 20%. I don't think it's less than 2%. He gets whatever the equivalent of an NFL finder's fee is for hiring the coordinator, which is good, but then that's where your contribution ends. I think Parsons might have him Parsons dropped off at his doorstep.
The point is, the only good thing of this team is the thing that LaFleur has the least. Zero oversight. And then everyone's still trying to say that Micah Parsons isn't good against the run, the first pass rusher in history that we're saying that about. They were good against the run. They have been very good against the run.
Barkley added, he had 2.3 yards of carry.
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So I would say I think that moment for LaFleur, and I'm glad that it was on national TV. I'm glad that it became the meme that it already has. Because A, he deserves it. And be It's a I'm watching the game. I was going to say live, but that's a lie, you know, 30 minutes on delay, but live for me.
I didn't know what had happened. And I said that that's that's done. done. Like if I'm policy, if I'm Goudakins, like I have, I've had several like I'm done with this guy moments. That's one where you just can't.
The optics are too poor, you just can't do it. Um Whether he gives up, there you go. I would like to do a new segment, and then we'll get to Grant. Anatomy of a Tweet Yeah.
Okay. So I tweeted This is the football equivalent of doing scratch-offs on the gas station counter, which Kurt Benkert liked. Oh wow. Yeah, I retweeted it.
Well, Kirk Benkert would be a starting quarterback in the NFL if Matt LaFleur hadn't derailed his career.
So I would understand that. Do you know who I give credit to coming up with this tweet? My Mom. Yeah. My brother sent this screenshot in our family group chat.
And then my mom said, it looks like he's doing lottery tickets. And then I took it one step further. And 100,000 people have seen it.
So thanks to my mom. Get that engagement money now. That boy. Oh, I know. I still need more.
That blue check mark really does go Also, my tweets are no good. And Twitter can tell I'm thirsty. Yeah. I do think so. Let's do the Packers.
Let's do the anything, Grant, you want to say before we do the approval rating check-in? No, I don't think so. The iPad thing's been, sorry, the Surface Pro thing, the Microsoft Surface Pro thing, has been going on for a while. Bill and Clemens have been bringing it up for like a month. Like, well, yeah, when the Packers' offense isn't on the field, the fleur is like back at the bench, futzing around with his ticket.
Oh, good for them. Like, that's something that they've talked about.
So, I don't know. I assume he does it close to every game. I don't know if he does it every drive or if it's like, all right, in the second quarter, I'm going to go back and. Get in my lab. I don't know.
Um But it's not something that was unique to last night because I've heard Mike and Bill talk about it for. I don't know. Managing timeouts or challenges, or that's what I'm saying. You can't, you just can't, you just can. Not Do what he did.
Can't do it. He should give up play calling to be better at the. I don't want, I want him less involved with the. I think he should, I think he should just not be the head coach. Yeah.
Well, you two have made that abundantly clear, but it's November 11th. What do you want to do? Do you want to be shit canned today and Adam still? No, no, no, that's not going to happen. But that's not going to happen.
That's not what he's asking. Is that what you actually, actually want to be? And I'll give you my reasons why after you say your thing, but like. A thousand percent done today, gone. I want to never see Matt LaFleur again, like, even in like back video.
Like, I don't even want to see archives, I don't want to see his face, I want to see his picture. I don't want any part of them.
So, Grant, my answer is a little bit more reasoned than that. Is that too harsh? I'll be that way about me. It's your truth. Tell you.
Um I'm going to keep speaking my truth. Look how far it's got. Here's my introduction, Grant, to answering your question. Jeff Hafley is somebody's NFL head coach next year. I don't know, I Oh No, I would bet against it.
No, I don't want him to be our head coach. I would thoroughly bet that he is a head coach in the NFL next year. I will take your wager. Look, the Giants. That'll be a home run.
I can see that working out beautifully. La floor is already to the point of the back being turned and all the things that we've already talked about. I think if If you are Brian Gotekinst. And we talked about the whole Ed policy thing last week and the lame duck status, and how they're essentially in a contract year now because policy won't let them, et cetera. Brian Gudekinst has a decision to make.
He is going to have to bet on his own future. At his dream job, the thing that he worked his way up. Way up the ladder to become the GM of the Green Bay Packers. He's going to have to say: is it worth? My future to pin it that I think this will get turned around in the next two months.
And if he thinks it can, that's either blind faith. Or he's seeing something or having some conversations that are obviously not for public consumption. LeFleur did turn things around two years ago when they were three and six and not five and three.
So it sounds like we have no precedent that a season can't turn around in the middle. The difference is the breathing room upon which not just LeFleur's future is pinned on, But Goudekinst. Sure.
Okay. So even if, even in that season, where if LeFleur doesn't turn things around, Goudekinst is not. Asking for a contract extension in March. I'm just saying there's precedent. We've seen it before.
So he has some reason to think that that could happen. Don't cast it off like there's not a chance in the world.
So if you want to take issue with saying, like, blind faith, okay. I mean, that's a fair counter. I got one for you. All I would say is: if it was me, again, not privy to all the stuff behind the scenes and the conversation that they're having. I'm not pinning my ability to stay Packers GM.
on what's currently happening. Sure.
I would pivot. I would also want to be able to say. As Brian Gudekinst. I think there's a good chance our next head coach. Is our current defensive coordinator?
There's a chance of that. I think there's a chance. No, this is like Jim Bates all over again. No, but if you're, but if you, I don't agree with that. If you're.
If your question Where is he? Is he down here? Yeah, well they go. Yeah. Like oh gosh, the D P.
Where's Jim? When you say, like, the question is often, okay, so who are you going to replace LeFleur with? And I think if you even have like a 40% chance that. A soon-to-be NFL head coach is already in your building. If this season goes sideways to the extent that it's currently going.
LeFleur doesn't get extended, right? Right, obviously. Halfly Is either retained by a new head coach, which is really unlikely, the new head coach would ask to bring in his people. And even then, halfly might say, Well, LeFleur is my guy.
So, even if Halfley, so So if even if Halfley can only get another defensive coordinator position. Is it with the Packers? Is he good enough that you would Sacrifice whatever to say, hey, we want to give this guy a chance. Didn't the Tampa Bay Buccaneers this past offseason? when Liam Cohn was going to go to Jacksonville, didn't there Didn't their owner try to like fire?
I've got all the minutiae of it, but he was like, oh no, what if we actually hire you to be head coach and then we'll fire and then we'll move these pieces around? Um, I mean, like, was Liam Cohen worth that as a coordinator? We talked about the Lions doing that. Should they have just let Ben Johnson be the head coach and partner with Dan Campbell? Obviously, no, Glassis Campbell is calling those plays pretty good.
Anyway, all of it to say. Pretty well. Good against. Today, tomorrow.
Next week. His future with the Packers hinges on this season turning around, or he, like LaFleur, I don't think, and maybe you guys can disagree. I don't think one of them is going to be brought back and the other not. Oh, okay.
Well A giant style? Right. No, I'm saying the opposite of that. I'm saying I think Considering they're both up for an extension at the exact same time. No, goodies, goodies, fine.
I don't agree with you. I That's fine. You you think Goody is like safe, safe, safe? Pretty safe. Grant, do you agree that?
I I see these two guys as being like, they each get extended or neither get extended. I know I know. Why are they together? I don't know the Packers' corporate strategy on that. Goody didn't hire LaFleur.
Mark Murphy did.
Okay. Did he? I don't know. This whole life and Timber, we've got to call Jim Caldwell again. This O-line kind of sucks, and they've put two premium picks into it the last two years and signed a big free agent and moved a guy over, and it sucks.
And both of their free agents this year suck. Mm-hmm. They're wider.
So so then ultimately again, I'm I want to make the roster and the better one doesn't play and takes up a roster spot. Very stupid, which we should also get into.
So Matt LeFlore only kicked the field goal because of the first initial kick, by the way, also. I mean, that wouldn't. He said, well, it was short, but then they didn't go for the 50-some-yard field goal earlier in the game. They punted. Of all the things in this game to bitch about, that's at the bottom of my list.
Let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me, let me. Lugo, please. Let me Um as we all do. Uh we have different group chats. I had a friend today.
Send me the message. Um Regarding your approval rating. He said. I think I underestimated how angry the fan base would be over last night. LaFleur is in deep shit.
So let me throw out this scenario for you because Matt Look, your boy at Pro Football Talk at a national level is now.
Well, they're bringing, like, they're shining, but that's only because Schneidman asked the question. That was just aggregating Schneidman's. There was nothing to that. I popped that open, and like, there's nothing. The point is, it is now a national conference from a local conversation.
Well, hey, let me give Infrastructure Week props to Schneidman for asking the question about his job security. Yes. Also, on Schneidman. Love his work. He tweeted earlier on in the day: I can't wait to either be ready to fire LaFleur or crown him the best coach ever tonight.
And then they lose, and he fucking writes a story about how he should be fired.
So, like, Oh, sorry. Go ahead. I'm going to mute. And then someone was like, oh, the beat writers suck. And then they all pitch forked.
We did it. No, Schneidman asked the question. You guys don't get other credit for Schneidman asking the question. Correct. Here's what I will say: because Matt LaFleur is not, there is no emergency pod this week for Matt LaFleur being fired.
He is not going to be fired today, he is not going to be fired tomorrow. He is not going to be fired at all this season unless they lose to the Giants.
Okay, I was going to say. They lose to the Giants on Sunday. There is no conceivable way he can coach again, right? You can't. No, let's Grant, who's, I think, the staunchest against this whole idea.
Big blue, baby! Big blue, big blue! Grant, regardless of the circumstances, regardless of the score, Packers lose to the Giants. LaFleur is coached next to him. He's out!
First of all, I would just like to say, I'm not the staunchest LaFleur defender. I just don't abide blaming Matt LaFleur for everything that's wrong with this team.
So you guys can't play with the money. Oh, those Haggers are in first place. Oh, but they're 5-2 and 1. What are you fucking saying now? I told you.
I told you. What are you fucking saying now? Oh, they have a winning record. Oh, suck my nipples. They don't have shit.
They suck. The coach sucks. And guess what?
Soon the coach is going to get fired, and then I'm going to have to face a harsh truth. Jordan Love isn't as good as I thought. There you go. You guys suck on your fire mat LaFleur binkies just to feel better about how maybe Jordan Love isn't that good and how this team has. It's the definition of the word good.
Is he Aaron Rodgers? No. Does he need to be no? Did they do the right thing? Yes.
Did they do it too soon? Maybe. Also. Also. And this is where I would answer your question, Grant, or even just your general statement.
Has Jordan Lev had an opportunity to show whether he's good, bad, average? I don't think he has. Yes. Yes. No, no.
And even, and now I mentioned last night is not Jordan.
Now, I wish you would have called the timeout, and he wished, I wish we would have led Watson the other way. But Jordan Love is also throwing on third and nine all the time. With a shitty offensive line to cornerbacks who can't catch the fucking football. Sure.
But to say he hasn't had a chance. I'm saying he's had in those circumstances, better quarterbacks do get a victory. I'm, well, a top three quarterback. Perhaps. Sure.
So where's the line? What's acceptable? What I think about acting with chance is, again, I mentioned him last week. Like, I enjoy Orlofsky's QB analysis, right? He said this morning, I was watching the clip about something that we have said.
Which is that Jordan Love is playing with. you know Uh, handcuffs or whatever, the right, like, he's not. B's not being allowed to quarterback the team. It's it's an extremely I mean, to the conservative approach to the point that Can you Truly? Analyze the level that he's good, bad, average.
And I don't think we know that answer. With clarity. I think we have hints. And he's got his ups and he's got his downs, but I think we're still missing. A definitive answer because of the way in which he's being game managed or whatever you want play called.
Yeah. Let's you want to do you want to do the LaFleur approval rating? Sure.
Let me first tell you the Happy Place Emp approval rating, which is 100. Wow, you're so good at those segues. I am. The Celtics, by the way. Primo Look, I've been taking the gummies a long time.
I've been using them to help me sleep. And I'll be straight up. I'm replacing Seltzer's. for alcohol. That is what I'm doing.
And I'm very happy about that. One I'm not an asshole. Two, doesn't make me tweet at people that I hate, even though I might need them in the future in this business. Three, I'm just looking at Grant the whole time. Three.
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Is Bart. All right. God, I always do this. Mm-hmm. Do we like this better?
No, God no. I feel like I'm on a round the horn. How about this? This is a good idea. There we go.
With my graphic design as my passion background. I'm going to answer. Let's do the approval question, but first, Grant, you didn't answer it. Packers lose to the Giants regardless of the circumstance. LaFleur is the coach next Wednesday.
Probably not.
So, this is a job on the line. Yeah. CNFL. I I love your answer. I support your answer.
Let me give you my answer on the Mat LaFleur approval rating, if I may. If the population of the town is more than 1,000 people, Mad LaFleur's approval rating is in the twenties, maybe thirties. Nice. If the population of the town is less than 1,000 people. Mad LaFleur's approval rating is in the 70s or 80s, and they all hate Jordan Love.
Let me tell you why only the first of those two matter. A sample size has to be at least a thousand for it to be relevant.
So, therefore, his approval rating is in the 20s and 30s. Go ahead. You need enough sample size for it to be statistically relevant, but continue. What if it's 999? I would argue that 999 is 1,000 just the same way that 99 is actually 100.
Sure.
Continue with your point. That's a math forum. I like math. I like numbers. Until I got the trigonometry and they made us measure the track outside, and I couldn't figure it out.
Yeah, that's a tough one. That's how I got Mr. Ken Laced. Ken Lace to Goodrich High School. That's how I got into a lot of the music I got, including, but not limited to, Bob Seeger.
He'd be like, all right. And he also said closeness only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades. Slow dancing and nuclear weapons. Anyway, Ken waste. I think he passed away though.
Um so you're saying the smaller the town, the more blind The Packers fandom? Yeah. Maybe he didn't. Um yeah. People see, and this is not a knock.
This is not whatever you're reading into it. I would almost argue it's the opposite. I just feel like. In smaller communities. They gather For Packer games.
and go to the bar and there's ham sandwiches and a potluck. That sounds awesome.
So, yeah, it does. I don't know what's coming next, but it better make your point because that just sounds like I want to be there. In bigger communities, We're more isolated and into our screens. You know, actually, the more people there are around us, the more lonely I feel. We can We've been more connected than ever, but we've never been this lonely as a human race.
And You're monetized to be alone and on your screens. You, the American worker, is monetized to be alone, even us three right now. The proletariat. Um But when you're in a smaller community, there's more of a desire to want. the Packers to be good.
Because of your personality. is more hopeful. Enjoy us. when you're in a bigger community like me living in Milwaukee proper. Cap.
Sure, continue. I have a Milwaukee address. Yes, well, I don't care. If you send the house to my address, Milwaukee, it'll get here. It will get here.
You can't say the same about you guys. Losers Yeah. Anyway, I don't know. That's not even. I don't know what I'm saying.
I just the idea that the farmer in Chilton looks at Matt LaFleur and is like. Sharp guy, leader of men. Love that man. Like, I just, I don't know. See the thing that the thing that part about what you're saying.
No, no, no, no, no, that they just I'm just telling you.
Okay. Yeah. There's less of, they don't like people criticizing the Packers. Sure.
Meanwhile, And maybe it's not all, it's not all like maybe the town cutoff is the bad example. And somebody asked me, why do I hate small towns? I absolutely do not. I absolutely do not. I absolutely do not.
Milwaukee elitist. If I could do my life over. and pick any like okay you can't live the life you just did Where do you want to grow up? What do you want to grow up in? I would say, without question, A small town in Texas of about 800 people.
And I want to marry the farm girl next door and play high school football. And take over my dad's oil company.
Well, that's the glory days right there at Texas High School Football. Or be a chef like Bobby Hill. I want to be Bobby Hill. Essentially is what I want to do. I'm going to be Bobby Hill.
From King of the Hill? I know who you meant. Have you seen the new updated King of the Hill got renewed, by the way? I have not. Yeah.
Yeah. Bill's a Bill's a he lives in his home now. He's like nine hundred pounds. I only watch the pilot. Network TV.
Your cadence is unbelievable. Paul, what's on your mind? No one's talking. I was trying to fill in the gap and then you kept going with Bobby Hill. Extra value meals are back.
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Visit lifelock.com slash special offer. Terms apply. Um And I might have lost the train of thought, but I think that the. I think what you were saying that resonated with me is like, we all have different ways. What?
to root for a team. And it's about how we get there.
So you like you always want to cheer for the Packers. You always want to cheer for the Bucs. He's um He's pointing to his mute button. How we get there.
So it's like, if I was saying a year or two ago, like, I think the best thing for the Bucks is to trade Giannis. It's like, how, you know, why would you think that way? Because I think the best path to them, whatever, whatever.
So it's like, You're not less of a, I mean, I know people think this way. What Bart's saying is accurate with some people. I think what should be understood is: like, if you were standing at, you know, and pounding the table for firing LaFleur today. You are not less of a Packers fan. If you wanted to trade Giannis two years ago or now, you're not less of a Bucks fan.
That's fair. If you want the long-term best for the future, and if you are just done. with a coach. or you think that the window for an NBA franchise is closed. I'm not saying I do anymore.
I'm pretty excited about where they're at.
So maybe I'll regret that thought. Still don't know if they're. an NBA championship team, but it's like with the LaFloor thing. I think what Bart's saying is true. I would just remind people.
Some people don't want if you fight, if you want to fire the floor, they think you don't like the Packers. And I think there are people that because I love the Packers, I don't want to see this guy ever again on that sideline. And that's how I am. If you want what's best for them, sometimes you go through. the difficult decisions to help you get to where you want to be.
Like sometimes people get in a breakup and then all of a sudden they lose 30 pounds and they've never been happier. Yeah, and LaFleur would be hired in three seconds. The Matt LaFleur approval rating grant is what. Do you know that there are scouts for other teams that just like. They bought one of those homes across Lambeau.
I think the Panthers coach or somebody's, one of the Panthers executives is there, a Dolphins executive. They're just like bunking, and they're going to run to Lambo. The moment that LaFleur's key card doesn't work, they're going to sprint to Lambeau to see who can get LaFleur first to be the coach of their team. It's wild. I mean, he would be fired so quick.
They actually have to. Malafour is the only coach. That has SEC style. Um troopers, state troopers, walk with him off the field after games. Because of how much he's in demand from these from these other teams.
Under 50%. Which is why nobody ever heard of him until the Packers hired him. Bart interrupted a great thing. Go ahead, Grant, say more. 150%.
After Sunday? Yeah. I think a lot of it is Angry Packers fans. Our team is losing, and our quarterback might not be as good as we thought. And Maybe we don't have the talent, but it starts at the top with Matt LaFleur, and he hasn't been good enough.
And I would say, yeah, under 50%. No, remember when I rooted against the Packers, against the Dolphins on Christmas because I wanted Aaron Rodgers out of here? Mm-hmm. Do you think I'm rooting for the Giants this week? Oh, that's better.
No, no, hold on, though. Is Bart Winkler rooting for the Giants? He can't do this stuff. Grant is being dismissive. I Yeah.
We just got done saying You can be a fan and root for a bad result to get you to a bad result. Remember, I was going to go to this game, and now I'm mysteriously not. The hints don't stop. One step. Grant.
When something gets you to a better outcome. Do you take the pain in the moment? You are a bad fan if you cheer against your team when they're five, three, and one and have Micah Parsons. Are we willing to nuance this, though, Grant, and to say there's a difference between rooting for the loss and then when the loss happens, being perfectly fine with it? Is there enough nuance there?
Of course, there's a difference there.
Okay. So can you root for them and when they lose being like, oh, this is the fucking this is it? Maybe. Yeah, that's different. You don't cheer against your team, your NFL team.
That's so lame. Do that in the NBA. Play with your mock draft simulator and go look at, you know. European 17-year-olds. Bart, to be clear, that.
That dolphin game that you mentioned with Rogers. Did you cheer against them or were you just happy with the outcome when it happened? Oh no, I cheered against them. I talked about it all week. He said, I want them to lose.
I want them out of here. It's pathetic. I was at my in-laws, and they're like, What are you doing? Remind me, was anything there was-there was no postseason on the line, right? That was already done.
At that point. It was still season on the line. No, I think that's when then they played the Lions. Oh, right. Because then I rooted for the Packers again because now they had not, and I'm like, okay, and I went to the game.
And then remember, you know, the I was in the nice seat. Yes, yes, yes, yes. This, this part basically, basically, when you're in the box seats at Lambo, you're sitting here and Wayne's screaming in your ear, and Larry's actually like on your lap screaming. They're like, because that thing is so loud. I did talk to somebody in the Packers about that.
I wonder if they changed it. Do we want to say anything? I'm not rooting for the Giants, Paul. I'm not either. But even grant degrees.
Upon a loss, if there's a one wearing big blue. Oh, he doesn't want my team to fire their coach. I'm wearing pink because that's the color of the slip. I want to see in Matt LaFleur's locker. It's like in the big short when Brad Pitt yells at the kids.
He's like, We just bet against the U.S. economy. I don't want, I don't, I want my team to win. You a-holes. I want them to win.
And you can. You should want them to win a Super Bowl. Not week 12 against the Giants. Yeah, I want them to win a Super Bowl this year, not in four years when all of your little dynasty draft picks line up and you hire the nerdy offensive. They would not be out of the playoffs losing this game.
The season is not over if they lost this game. It's getting pretty dicey. Mm, yeah. I mean, they have five division games remaining. Five.
It is getting pretty dicey. They control their own destiny. That Bears win did not help. That was Hilarious. Uh to watch unfold.
Um do we do we do we This has been obviously extremely. anti-lefloor which now Approval rating-wise, we are in the muddy race. We're not talking enough about love. No, no, I do. That's great.
What do you mean he's being held back? I mean, he's he is. Everyone's letting him down. What do you want him to do? Doesn't even give it a chance.
The only thing I'm going to push past this and just say. Do we need to address the quarterback? I think we've said the thing within the LaFleur thing. The kicking thing and the This is a Gross mismanagement of resources as it relates to the kicker. Why are they so like for the listeners?
That was Grant saying on the mismanagement of resources. McManus owes them. He was Not Picked up by anybody. And then the Packers were so desperate for a kicker, they're like, I guess we'll take this guy. It's not his fault, McManus' fault.
He's literally trying to tell people through the media, I'm not healthy. He talks to Troy Aikman, I'm not healthy. And then LaFleur's like, Yeah, I mean, I think he's a kid, you know, he's a kicker. He's fine.
So, is that on Goody or is that on Matt? That's on LaFleur. He's making the 53 decision. Where's Goody with his impact? Why isn't Goody like.
So all Goudakins can do is put another kicker on the roster and be like I hope Matt picks him today. This is literally money ball, where, like, then the Brad Pitt character has to come down and be like, I'm literally going to trade my first baseman then because you won't play the correct first baseman. Yes, that is the case here.
Well, that's stupid. Is he deferring to Rich Basaccia on this? Which would be even worse. I agree. You're the head coach, Matthew.
You're the head coach. Packers are currently 5-3 and 1. Correct. Uh the 49ers are six and four. and the eighth seed.
Missing all of their good players, including their quarterback. The Bears at six and three. Um I'm actually not that worried about the bears. No, but no, but they're there and we got to play them.
So it's not, nothing's, you know, we get to play them. Look at it that way. They have all of their division games in front of them still. They have so much opportunity to. to still make hay.
Yeah, and I'm looking at these other teams like Cardinals, Falcons, Commanders, none of them are going to make a run. What the hell happened to it? Why is Atlanta bad? 'Cause they lose by like a point or two every game. Um Here's the part I said.
It said there was a. I mean, I hate to say this, but thank God the Panthers lost to the Saints. Jesus Christ. Your boy shock. Bart, I said I had a Bartometer idea for you that we could play out in real time, and you're hitting on it perfectly.
So let's go to that. Long form or real time or both. All of the above.
Okay. How many How many teams deep? Would you have to go if I said, You get to in order. I think I did this one like a month ago. Mm-hmm.
You think you know where I'm going with this? I've not told you yet. I'll finish. Maybe we'll find out. Yeah.
If there were eight, they're getting spicier. Travis Hunter's out for the year, if anyone has him. Correct. I saw that. The.
If you could like You gotta pick one team who's gonna win the Super Bowl and you get the field or this one team. Who's that one team? Who's the most likely team to win the Super Bowl? Oh, Super Bowl. No, I'll do that one.
That's a good one. No, but it is a good one. And we're going to go down the list. I think we should get our one through eight. But what I want to also then get to is what number would the Packers be?
Like, how you go to, okay, they're clearly not the most, you wouldn't pick them. Like, if I get the Packers of the Field. Oh, would you get that email? I do not. Uh Elton Jenkins is on IR.
Oof. I mean not expected after being carted off, but Good.
Now we've catered to everyone who listens to this podcast for their breaking news. This pre-recorded podcast. Non-live.
So, you're saying how much? That's going to be news to somebody. I don't give a shit. I don't care. I don't care.
Yes, Grant. That's what I'm saying.
So, should we go through one through blank until we get to the Packers of the most likely team to win the Super Bowl?
So, we're just doing power rankings. I don't want to think of it in the present-day tense as much as I want to think of it as what they could actually do in a playoff game, in an AFC or NFC championship game, to actually win a Super Bowl matchup, which I do think is a different exercise.
Okay, who's won? Chiefs. Chiefs. Okay. I don't have my list ready, but I think that's totally fair.
So I think we can move on. Who's second? I'll give you some contenders to consider. Equals two? Is that just because like there's really No one else in the NFC that you would seriously.
What do you say three? I might wager Seattle. Rams. Reds or Seattle? Uh Detroit?
I'm I'm I'm I don't trust them in the playoffs. I don't trust anyone after the Rams in the playoffs. We're constantly told we can't trust Jordan Love.
Well, then we can only trust Mahomes, Stafford, and Hertz, and nobody else, because nobody else has ever done it either. The teams for consideration. Seahawks, Rams, Buccaneers, Lions. Eagles I mean, it's funny we say the Chiefs as number one. They are third in their division.
Broncos, Chargers ahead of them. Colts at eight and two. No one from the AFC North, unless you want to say the four and five Ravens. Patriots, Bills. Is every team I just named a more likely Super Bowl winning team than the Packers?
I'd take the Patriots over the Bills and the Ravens right now. Yeah, I'm not taking the I'm not taking the cheese on the bills. Oh, this is either the Josh Hannah will do it. Sure.
Well, not after this past weekend. Then that's a much tougher sell. How about I do... Eight teams currently in the playoffs that will not win the Super Bowl. Hit us.
Go for it. I was trying to do your work for you, but if you want to take a different route, that's okay.
Well, am I just doing teams already in the playoffs?
Well, I just think you would say, again, like the eight or ten. Most likely teams to win the Super Bowl. Irrespective of odds, like not trying to be like, oh, the odds. Chiefs, Eagles. Seahawks.
Rams. Rams. Rams. should be higher. Patriots?
Yeah. Colts? No. Chargers? No.
Why not the Colts? Broncos? Fuck no. Who who's the Broncos was the fucking yeah. I'm just either eight and two.
Why not the Colts? Yeah, why not the Colts, honestly? They haven't played anybody. Daniel Jones has more playoff wins than Justin Herbert. I do believe the Colts have the best differential in the NFL by a lot.
Yes, they do. Plus 115 the Colts are. Good coaching staff. Lots of talent. It's really hard.
This is why I don't understand why you guys want to fire the coach and punt the season. There's like I don't think firing the coach punts the season. We're trying to save the season. That's exactly correct. Six To save the friendship.
Grant, your number two NFC team, would you go, Grant, in the NFC specifically? Would you say most likely team to win the Super Bowl from the NFC is Eagles one, Rams two? Rams won Eagles 2. Rams won Eagles 2. Yeah, Grant will not give up his Ram Ram it.
And by the way, I think Grant's Rams. Why would I? They look incredible right now. At this point, all of his Ram stock is paying dividends. We are Ramily.
I'm a little bit off on the bucks. They're banged up, but I could. hype that back up and the and the buccaneers will still be fine to win their division.
So they're in the playoffs. If they can get healthy by then. I think Rams, Eagles, Lions Rams, Eagles, Lions. Who's the second AFC team? I mean, even Chiefs is obviously debatable at one.
I'm going to say. I'm going to say Chargers. Cold. I like the Colts too. I fully support your Colts take.
You would like the Chargers, all potential, all names, never proven anything on the actual field of battle. Yeah, it's excuse me. Excuse me, their head coach just won't be a national national national. Kimani Vidal is basically LaDanian Tomlinson. Their head coach just won a national championship three years ago.
Their head coach is good. Their head coach is good. He was good last year, too. Didn't really help him in the playoffs. I just.
I don't know if he's gonna be able to play. If Herbert played for the Cowboys, would everyone think he's Dak Prescott just differently? No, they would think he's Mahomes, Josh Allen. With no playoff wins to his name? Including a 27-point lead blown to Trevor Lawrence, who sucks ass.
Yeah, he's not good. He escapes so much heat because he plays the Chargers. They're fun, they're wacky. And when they lose, no one cares. But when they win, ooh, look, Harbaugh, Herbert.
I don't know. Do you know who I haven't heard one single Criticism or like What's the opposite of criticism? Praise Yeah.
Well done. Has anyone talked about Cam Ward at all this season? He was the number one pick. He plays for the Titans. No one gives a shit about him.
I mean, the good news is, like, unlike Caleb Williams, right, back-to-back years of a number one pick. That guy's good.
Sorry. He also has my boy Ben Johnson running his offense now. And tons of receiving talent. Caleb John Caleb Williams has tons of receiving talent. All right.
Well, I'll think that over. I'm going to. Alec Io Manor. Chimera Dike Good player. It's good at Wisconsin.
Did he leave the last year to go to Florida with Mertz? Yeah, that sounds right. You notice all the Steelers players, TJ Watts says Piwaki in a Sunday Night Football intro, and Keanu Benton says Racine. They don't say UW anymore, they don't say Madison. Why would you?
Hey, they gotta win. That's so lame. Oh, we're so ashamed of our program, we won't even say it on our Sunday Night Football NBC intro. Like, okay. You should be ashamed.
I would say Bart Winkler. Roseno Elementary. Actually, yeah, Grant, what would you do? Grant Bill's St. Joseph's Catholic.
I don't know. I would say something stupid. Like charter communications. Yeah, I grew up in Sheboygan. I'd say something else too, Paul.
Like your elementary school or like, yeah. Yeah. Paul, Paul and McColler Blue Bombers. Tam, let's put that up as a show poll question. We'll ask the pros and then we'll read the best responses later.
What would you say? What would you say if you were a Sunday Night Football intro? What would you say? 888-797979. 888-79999-779.
That'll be fun. That'll be, we'll get a lot of engagement and then never bring this up the rest of the show. All right. Coming up next, Beat Writer from a blog that's trying to make it. And we think he's good.
So we're going to give him some hits just in case he does make it. We won't have to pay him when he writes for the paper. That's coming up next on the Bart Winkler Show. To be fair, you always do a great job, and I support you most times pushing back against like radio stereotypes. This would be a good one.
I'd be interested in this one.
So you're dumping on one that I actually would like to hear. I did a Twitter poll last week. You did. What sounds weirder? Indianapolis Pacers or Indiana Colts?
That was a good one. I heard you talk about it. I didn't see the poll. It was like 50-50. Really?
Yeah. Indianapolis Pacers. I think my way it was 50, 50. Holy shit. Fuck, that's amazing.
It's incredible. The correct answer is that the... Arizona, Arizona, Indiana Colts sound stranger. About the Phoenix Cardinals. Oh, Asante Samuel?
Signed. With the Steelers. The Steelers. Steelers practice squad.
Well, they can do that and then you can bring them up for like a few weeks. That's called a little roster manipulation. I think it's a Bye. Perfect! Thanks for stabbing into the Winklerverse.
Extra value meals are back. That means ten tender juicy McNuggets and medium fries and a drink are just $8. Only at McDonald's. For limited time only, prices and participation may vary. Prices may be higher in Hawaii, Alaska and California and for delivery.
