How Much Do YOU Trust The Media?

This is Logan Sekulow with ratings on the decline.

How much do you trust the media? Keeping you informed and engaged, now more than ever, this is Sekulow. We want to hear from you.

Share and post your comments or call 1-800-684-3110. And now your host, Logan Sekulow. Welcome to Sekulow.

That is right. I'm Logan Sekulow. I'm here to join my Wil Haynes in the studio and we are talking about something that's near and dear to our heart, which is the media and your consumption of that media. And it has been an interesting year to say the least. Obviously, you're coming off of a historic election year in 2020, but 2021 showed that a lot of people decided to detox from media.

I know a lot of people have, including, I'll be honest, I'm part of this show. I go home and it's not part of my daily routine unless there's something big happening to flip on a lot of the evening news anymore. You get a lot of your content from other places. If there's a breaking news story, like with the passing of John Madden last night, guess how many push notifications came to my phone for that? About a dozen. So I think people are taking in content different ways.

And to set up this conversation, let's just go down the list. Weekday primetime viewership of cable news, CNN down 38%, Fox News down 34%, and MSNBC down 25%. So again, they've maybe held on to a little bit more of their audience. For broadcast news, you have ABC World News Tonight down 12%, CBS Evening News down 12%, and NBC Nightly News down 14.

It's kind of in the margin of error there. So all about the same. They've all lost about 10 to 15% on average of their normal viewership. And look, for broadcast, we know that broadcast TV and cable, or not cable, broadcast TV, it doesn't even matter when and where you're on.

You're always going to be out drawing often cable. Still, still you think in 2021, almost 2022, that wouldn't be the case, but it's just true. We had the New York Times, which is down 34% of unique visitors compared to last November. Again, a little skewed that it's to November because of it being obviously very historic election time. And then 44% of November to November for the Washington Post.

And I think this is one of the more interesting one, folks. A lot of you are watching online, 14 million political articles. 2020 found they had an average of 924 engagements on social media, about the same amount of articles, now down to 321 engagements on social media on average.

So a big difference when it comes to the media landscape. And we have a bunch of lines open. I want to know, give us a call right now. We are live. How you're consuming your media, how you're consuming your news media particularly. Because we obviously are live on Facebook, we're live on YouTube, on Rumble and so many other places that people can get content now. Is it becoming less and less relevant to have your content available and exclusively on one of these top level networks, top level television? I'm sure radio is the same. Radio, we know we had a big decline because of people being home, not commuting. We know there's a big drop in that, but we also saw a surge in podcast numbers. So I want to hear from you.

How are you consuming your media? Have you changed? Did you take a year off? Did you decide to detox from news media because you just couldn't take it anymore? Maybe it was a detriment to your life. I know a lot of people, that happened.

It hurt a lot of families, hurt a lot of marriages just because it is such a split time. And I think you'll see the rise in a lot of, it feels like TV is putting out a lot of silly content right now. Because sometimes that's what people want, especially right now when the world seems like in crisis, entertainment can be there to really help people out.

So bingeable entertainment is something that's very much taken over society. Give us a call 1-800-684-3110. Look, last year we launched ACLJ more than ever, which was our campaign. Now we were trying to figure out in 2022, what's that going to look like? We didn't need us more than ever in 2021 because things were crazy. Things are still crazy.

2022 will continue the more than ever campaign, but we're going to continue on also seeing how we can adjust, how we can change, how we provide the content that you want in the way that you receive it. And I'm very curious, are you no longer watching these networks? Are you those people? Are you the people who are saying, no, I'm always going to be there? And maybe you've lost trust.

I think for a lot of people, it's that you've lost trust in what you're hearing is the truth. Give us a call 1-800-684-3110. As always support the work of the ACLJ at ACLJ.org. And for every donation, I want to thank we had a big day yesterday and for every donation that's made, check your receipt. You will get an exclusive link to our brand new 10 part four hour series Revenge of the Taliban available right now.

We'll be right back. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad, whether it's defending religious freedom, protecting those who are persecuted for their faith. I'm covering corruption in the Washington bureaucracy and fighting to protect life in the courts and in Congress. The ACLJ would not be able to do any of this without your support.

For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's Matching Challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20.

A $50 gift becomes $100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ. The work we do simply would not occur without your generous support.

Take part in our Matching Challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases. How we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists. The ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later. Play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry. And what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life.

Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. Welcome back to Psychula. We'll be taking your calls about the current landscape of media. How you've been consuming media the last year as we see a pretty significant massive drop off. Now, a lot of this has to do with people consuming media in different ways.

It may be that you're consuming the same or more amount of media. It's just on your phone instead of on television or radio or maybe you're not paying for the New York Times subscription. You're behind the paywall after you get that.

You know, you've read the second article for free. Sorry. Now you got to pay up. You pay, Will. You know, not me.

Not me. Just to track it. See what they're doing over there. Yeah.

They can have your money. That's fine. Let's take some phone calls. Let's go to Pat, who's calling in Texas on Line 1. Pat, welcome.

Thank you so much for taking my call. So basically, I think the majority of the people like myself just watch the news for the weather. I don't. I don't. There's not a bit of truth in them, which is sad. Ever since Trump said what he said way back when about fake news, I just stopped watching it. It's just a waste.

It's a waste of time. Most air space. You guys have a blessed one. Thanks, Pat. I mean, look, we're part of that landscape. So I don't want to be like bashing the media in the sense of saying, well, don't listen to us. Of course, there are exceptions to the rule. But I do think, Will, there's a lot of people who have that feeling and look in our packet. We went through all the different stories that were true and then were not true and that were censored and then switched in the last 24 months.

Even if not even longer than that. But let's say even the last year, that does give you a certain distrust on what you're hearing because you know everyone, even the ones that promote we're not coming at you with an angle on both the right and the left are coming at you with an angle. Well, and if you look at what's happened over the last 24 months is we've had very big stories, probably some of the biggest stories in our lifetime because there was a global pandemic and there was a very largely watched election in the United States.

Afghanistan. You know, the Afghanistan withdrawal. But if you look at all of these things and the way that it was reported, the way the 2020 election was reported, the way that things were reported as truth and you better not question it when it comes to the way that the pandemic occurred and began. There were so many things where the media, it wasn't even biased media anymore. It became activist media. And if you were not believing or you were questioning what the media narrative was, you all of a sudden were a conspiracy theorist, a liar.

You were evil. It became very aggressive, the rhetoric towards people, when the entire purpose of journalism is to question the prevailing narrative. That's that's the basis of it. And when all of a sudden the media landscape changes from questioning those in power, questioning authority to if you do question, you're some sort of wacko out there, conspiracy theorist, then you no longer have media and journalism. You have propaganda and activism.

Yeah. And I think even for people like our caller who just called it, I only watch it for the weather. You know, what's crazy is that Fox just recently launched their own weather channel because the weather channel was becoming too politicized for conservative audiences.

And that's just the truth. It is my wife is a certified weather forecaster. It's largely debated how politicized the weather channel is.

And go to the website. Look, if you went to the weather channels website, you'd probably like, oh, there is actually a lot of what you'd consider political hot topics that are covered on their website and covered on their broadcast. So even the weather, something we should all be, you know, pretty uniformly decided.

I mean, yes, I'm sure one's got the Doppler 4000, one has the 10,000. Who's got the better models? We see all those ads. But in general, we should be all like, OK with it. It's not something that's become ubiquitous, clean cut. There's no political angle to it.

There is. And that's really a sad state that we are in when it comes to media. It becomes hard to be a producer of media, whether that's entertainment media that we produce or whether it is this kind of media, which would be for a lot of you in the news talk category.

It is difficult because you want to appeal to your audience who want to give them what they want. But when you see numbers like CNN, Fox, MSNBC down, so it means down conservative, liberal, moderate. It's just down. People just have said enough.

They throw their hands in the air. Now we'll see what happens 2022. We know it's an election season and really the litmus test will be in 2024.

You always see a surge. But during the Trump administration, also, well, you brought this up in our meeting during the Trump administration. It felt like we talked about this, that we never left a election year right in terms of the way we broadcast the terms that everyone broadcast. Typically, there's a heated 18 months of primaries to the election. Then the President comes in and not unlike Joe Biden. It would be different if it wasn't a pandemic, but not like Joe Biden.

It's not someone who's in your face every day. And I don't know if we've learned to live with a President that isn't in your face every day, creating a media story that either the left hates and the right loves every day. So we are kind of reverting back to maybe where people go, yeah, that wasn't necessarily the healthy thing to do.

Right. And when you look at the even the subscriptions to The New York Times and to these outlets that were opposed to President Trump, they got a big boost in revenue, in subscribers, in eyeballs, in listeners across the board throughout the Trump presidency. Now, a lot of it was because there were media manufactured crises happening left and right all the time to keep those numbers artificially inflated. But a lot of that does go to the fact that the media wasn't allowing themselves to get out of the election cycle. What did we hear about for four years? 2016 election.

They never got away from 2016. And then when you couple that with the pandemic that happened last year in the middle of an election season, these stories were not typical. It wasn't a typical news cycle.

It was on red alert all the time. And now that it is coming down off of the election season throughout this year, while you still have the pandemic, there is a fatigue in that type of news. People aren't looking every single day to see the latest numbers on that. But I mean, it is very newsworthy.

It is a global pandemic. So it's hard for the reporters to necessarily get away from that. All that being said, it is going to be curious what happens next year in just a few days when we see an election year really ramp up where the spending from candidates is going to happen. The spending from the parties is going to happen.

And you're going to see big debates about big policy issues and really a rebuke of the first year and a half, two years of the Biden administration. It'll be very interesting where they put their money, the advertisers. Are they putting their money in the big networks? Are they finding alternative sources? Are they putting it in rumble? Are they putting it in more different social media platforms that will take their money?

Some won't do politics, but the ones that will. It will be interesting to see. That's maybe where the landscape, you know, the money goes. So maybe you can find that a little bit more detail based on where advertising money is even going to be spent. Let's go back to the phones, though, because we've got a full bank.

We're going to try to get as many as we can on during this show. Because I want to say while we're talking about this, I also want to know if you're just saying, because a lot of you are going, I don't watch them anymore. Well, what do you do? What have you done? What have you replaced that time slot in your life with?

Spend time with your family. You're watching reality TV. You're watching Dancing with the Stars. What are you doing?

I'm just curious. I mean, I know what I'm doing and I'm watching. Yeah, pretty much that mindless television before I go to bed after my kids have already gone to sleep. So let's go to Bill in Wyoming on Line 5. Bill, one second. You're on the air.

Hi, thanks for taking my call. I really don't watch mainstream news anymore. I'm down like about 99.99% of the time. The only time I've ever really watched it is like, for example, when they have a disaster like what happened in Kentucky.

But here's something for you to consider. I would watch, the other day I watched a weather forecaster concerning Christmas and he forecasted that there will have a brown Christmas this year. Woke up that morning and guess what?

It was white all over the place. Well, you know, at least I could say this to defend weather forecasters, as again, there's one of my family, that the weather prediction at the end of the day is just really, really good educated guesses. You know, there's still, you never know what's going to happen.

But Bill, I understand that you don't feel like there's really a place you can turn. I think a lot of people do. I find myself, obviously, if there is a, like you said, a natural disaster or if there is a big breaking news story, sure.

And we have it on here at the office, you know, at studios 24 seven. But when I'm at home, unless it's something that is important enough to take me away from time with my family, I don't find myself doing it. I don't, I don't put that stress on my life. And I'm getting, cause like you said, with like the passing of John Madden, it's a very sad story.

It's sad. You know, he's a legend, but I was told it 25 times before I could even reach for a remote because the way I'm getting media on my phone now, it's different. You know, everything is coming directly to you as you need it.

So, uh, or even when you don't need it, it's still, still coming for you. All right. Let's, uh, we only got a minute here, so I'm not gonna take any more calls in this segment, but we're going to reset, talk a little bit more about this. Even go through some of the stories and look, it was the year 2020 and then 2021 was also the year of the different media news outlets launching or not launching, but maybe having a bit more of steak.

Uh, in the game, whether that was in your conservative side, your Newsmax news nation, OAN or news nation, I put sort of in the middle or OAN. And then you had, uh, on the other side, obviously the rise of podcasts and much more extreme, uh, in 2020 and 2021 than ever before. And Joe Rogan's making his deals with Spotify and everything that's sort of happening, changing the way that you get information. We will make sure that we're obviously on the front end of anything that's happening. Make sure we're on the cutting edge of whatever's happening in media. Make sure we are there and the ACLJ could do that only with your support. So support the work of the ACLJ. Go to ACLJ.org right now.

We'll be right back. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected, is there any hope for that culture to survive? And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, Planned Parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad. Whether it's defending religious freedom, protecting those who are persecuted for their faith, uncovering corruption in the Washington bureaucracy, and fighting to protect life in the courts and in Congress, the ACLJ would not be able to do any of this without your support.

For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's Matching Challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20.

A $50 gift becomes $100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ. The work we do simply would not occur without your generous support. Take part in our Matching Challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family.

Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Welcome back to Secular. We are taking a lot of your phone calls today. We're kind of at the end of the year here. We're wrapping up our year, and numbers are coming through about the media changes and the change of viewership and listenership and readership, some of your top names in media like Fox, CNN, MSNBC, New York Times, The Nightly News. And we know at the ACLJ, and what we've done with this broadcast, is always try to be on the cutting edge of what's happening. We were one of the first shows to go full-length live when it was back in Periscope days. Then we were one of the first people launching Facebook Live broadcast every day. We've had podcasts for years. We've been on radio for 25-plus years. We want to make sure we are where you are, and we are getting the voice and the messaging out in different and unique ways.

We've done that with our social media team, with our broadcast team. We all kind of work together, videos, films. We just launched that new series, Revenge of the Taliban, which is available now, again, with just any donation on our website. You get a link to watch it. It's a 10-part, 4-hour series.

Not a lot of people are creating content like we are, but we want to make sure we're there, wherever you are, at the cutting edge of all media, in terms of media consumption. So let's go ahead and take some more phone calls, and we'll keep this conversation going. Let's go to Mike, who's calling in Texas on Line 6.

Mike, go ahead. Hi, how are you doing? I'm doing well. How are you?

Good, good. Yeah, I don't watch. Like on Sundays, I look forward to Face the Nation and the one on ABC, but they're so tilted now and commercialized, too. They break for commercials when there could be, you know, events. You know, the topic that you're on, they really need to talk more about it. But yeah, it's such fake news and tilted.

On the more Democratic side, it's so sickening, really. I do listen to you guys on 100.7 FM. The word, you come on twice.

Yeah, and Mike, see, that's good. So you're still, I mean, see, this is the thing. There are certain broadcasts, and we're seeing those people, you know, in the comments, listing who they do still listen to. Well, it seems like a lot of the turnoff is, is the news. People can get over people's opinion because we understand that Hannity, Tucker, Maddow, even someone like an Anderson Cooper or Don Lemon or, you know, what was Chris Cuomo. You kind of understand when you turn those on, you know, you're getting that person's opinion. So I think we've been okay with that, that we've seen the numbers drop. Where I think people have really lost their trust is the people who show themselves as the straight newsman who's going to give it to you exactly how it is.

It doesn't really exist anymore. Well, and to our caller Mike's point that he's so tired of them pushing an agenda when they're purporting to be a news source. And we always have fun when you and I host to bring up our favorite commentator on the media. This is Brian Stelter, who's ironically titled show Reliable Sources comes on on Sundays on CNN. But they were having this kind of similar conversation about the news getting things right and when it's not right. And he had a guest on they were talking about, you know, their intents to get it right. But I think his response to his guests intent to get it right. And when we get it wrong, it's embarrassing shows how blinded people in these elite media sources actually are to what they're doing and the way people view them.

Let's go ahead and play by three because I think it's a really interesting take on what he sees as them doing. Our intent is to get it right and to get it first. And when mistakes are made, that's actually very embarrassing.

Yeah, but it's almost always innocent, right? So especially these days with the pandemic and people working in different places, you know, you might have four editors in four different places and then a typo ends up in a story. And it's just because of the crazy workflow. So he thinks what people are upset about is a typo at the end of a story because of the workflow issues. Not, I don't know, calling people crazy conspiracy theorists for thinking potentially this virus leaked out of a lab.

And then, oh, years later, well, you know, maybe it did. And these people were no longer going to label this as fake news on Facebook because it could. That's where he doesn't get what people are upset about and what they should be embarrassed about.

He absolutely knows this is not a unintelligent person. This is someone who understands the media landscape and that, sure, that may not be why people are tuning in to watch you. But if you look at that from a straight point of view, people are not complaining.

Yes, if there was a lot of typos, I'd probably be one of the people, you know, on Yelp reviews saying CNN. What the hell? But we're not talking about that. It's almost always innocent, Logan. Almost always innocent.

Edits, glitches, cutting people off, changing the narrative, almost always innocent. Look, again, I'm not pointing a good or bad at a CNN or a Fox at this point. I think there are people I know who work on both sides of that who are great people who are doing great production. You know, you've got to give it up for their production. They're doing it nightly. And it's not this is not, you know, an easy look, I give up our crew here doing a daily show is way different, especially news than any other kind of broadcast media that you've ever seen or been a part of. So you can't deny the talents of a lot of these people. I'm more interested in why people are turning off. I think that's and where are they going? You know, for a while you saw entertainment shift a lot of different places and entertainment audiences largely started going to news.

So now are we seeing, like you said, almost the correction in that? And we have to make sure that we're always there and creating content for you that maybe is more entertaining. Maybe you want that entertainment content that maybe comes from the ACLJ's point of view. Maybe you don't necessarily just want daily commentary and news and talking about the work we're doing. We're doing amazing work around the world, by the way. If you don't check out our website, aclj.org, you need to because the amount of daily incredible content is being posted and written by some of the most brilliant minds in the country, in the world even.

It's all there at aclj.org. And again, we've tons of video series. Make sure you're subscribing on YouTube, subscribing on Rumble. There's just great content that's being produced by our team. And sometimes some of it gets seen by a lot of people. Sometimes, well, you know, it's YouTube, it's Facebook.

They can kind of, they can kind of scrunch it down when they don't necessarily want you to hear it. So make sure that you are constantly checking our content on all our social media platforms, Instagram, wherever we are. And when you're watching, sharing it as well. Yeah, always share. Because it does help get that into your friends' feeds that may not be seeing it specifically because, you know, the algorithm.

Let's talk about this. Yesterday, Will and I were on, we're on Facebook Live right now. There's over a thousand people watching live right now, just on Facebook, obviously. You can add the million or so plus that are listening on radio. Yesterday when we went live, there was 4,000 people watching. It's not like there was all that much more breaking news.

It just depends on how it gets served to you. So we have to be a little bit more careful, a little bit more creative, a little bit more curious on how to reach people differently. Now, there are more calls and more comments than there were when they had 4,000 people watching. So this is where it's a totally different world.

And as soon as we all accept that, the sooner we can move on to bigger and better things. We only have a minute and a half, it's going to take more calls. What I'm going to say is we have another half hour coming up. If you are the try and true listening on Terrestrial Radio, a lot of you lose this at the end of the first half hour. Well, we do another half hour of the show and there's a lot of different ways you can get that live right now. If you're watching live or listening live, you can get us right now on Facebook, on YouTube, on Rumble. Also, if you aren't listening live and you're just getting the first half hour, sometimes it's delayed in certain markets.

Subscribe to our podcast. Watch it on YouTube later on. It's on Facebook.

We're all over. If you can't find this show, I will be shocked because it is on every platform that you could possibly imagine. Maybe not that you could possibly imagine, but it is on every platform that you find your content. So again, we're on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, we post on Instagram, everywhere.

Make sure you're following, liking, sharing, doing all that good work. And of course, we couldn't do it without the work of the people who, not just people here, people at home. We also do the work and support the work of the ACLJ. That's at ACLJ.org.

Again, it's the end of December. Very important month, the most important month for all organizations like ours. And we appreciate all the support you can give at ACLJ.org. And for any support, you can go throw in a $5 donation. You will get access to the brand new series, Revenge of the Taliban, 10-part series, some of the top names in the world discussing Afghanistan. We'll be right back with more on secular.

Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Keeping you informed and engaged. Now, more than ever, this is Sekulow. And now your host, Logan Sekulow. Welcome to Sekulow.

Again, this is Logan Sekulow joined by Will Haines in the studio. And we are talking about the massive changing media landscape and the drop in the ratings. And maybe that's due to trust. Maybe it's due to media fatigue. But again, let's just roll down the CNN down.

This is for 2021. Down 38%. Fox down 34%. MSNBC down 25%. Code of broadcast news.

ABC World News Tonight down 12%. Really all of those down 12 to 14% when it comes to NBC, CBS, ABC. And honestly, I can say I don't know that many people who watch those.

I don't know if I do. Of the big three, which is your favorite? I don't watch any of them.

And no offense to them. You've got to have a favorite. Historically. Historically? I think I'm a CBS news person. Okay. I think so. I think I'm an NBC like today show first. Yeah. You know, it depends on what it is. I think I'm a fourth hour today.

I think that's about when I wake up. What's going on? Hoda. That's what I'm trying to see. But no, those shows. And then New York Times and Washington Post taking massive hits. 34 and 44% down. Now, again, compared to last November, it's a little bit different because look, we could say that by ourselves in terms of viewership engagement, because I don't know if you remember last November. Uh, it was pretty chaotic, uh, and then engagement even down that this one is one of the more interesting ones because like we've been discussing this well here, like we have a thousand comments, 300 shares, whatever it is on our Facebook feed right now of just this show. Uh, but they've seen within the 14 million political articles that they surveyed in 2020, they had an average of about 924 engagements on social media about the same number the next year only had about 321 engagements on average. We've obviously outpaced that significantly even today.

So I think that's a little different. We're not necessarily a straight political news site though, or page that we're talking about what's going on in the world in general, but we do have a lot of calls and a lot of you have a lot to say. We do have one line open, 1-800-684-3110 we've got about two minutes left in this segment. Let's take a quick call. I guess I know some of you have been waiting a long time, Wendy in Florida on line four. Thanks for holding about a half hour. I appreciate it.

Wendy. Yes. Go ahead. I, I watch, um, trustworthy news on the beginning portion of the 700 club program and I get a little bit of news usually for weather type on the ABC world news. And then I also, when I have issues close to my heart, I check in with the ACLJ and I've been listening to the radio on and off over the last 25 years. Well, when the number one, I appreciate you listening over the last 25 years. Uh, it has been a honor to create this content and be part of creating this content every day for the last 25 years.

So thank you. Uh, 700 club. Again, they have their own news service. CBN news. They provide great content. TBN's got a news service there.

A lot of people are trying this out and then a lot of people are turning to alternatives, whether that's the daily wire, the daily caller, all the different websites and blogs and drudge and they're, they are consuming content differently. But it's interesting that even amongst that, she's like, Hey, I still turn onto ABC to get my weather. Right. I think that that's important. I think there is a place for local news. I think there's a place for what's, I've, I've said this with elections, even, uh, we always talk about Presidential elections. Obviously they'd have the greater world impact, but getting involved in what's actually going on in your hometown, your home city and knowing what's going on in community. Now look, some of those news, the local news gets very sensationalized.

We all know this, whether it's the silliest stories or whether it's a so drab that you can't watch it with your family. We know that that's what sells, but it is good to get involved in your local community and maybe make sure you join those Facebook groups that are for your neighborhood. Make sure you're, you're engaged in that because that's really what's important to you and your family right now is what's happening in your neighborhood.

So I always encourage that. I mean, there's a lot of people out there and look, sometimes it'd be pretty entertaining. I mean, how many times do you get a next door notification? That's like, I think I saw a wolf, but it might've been a coyote. Maybe it was coyote or maybe it was just a dog that was thin dog dog. I get those a lot. We have coyotes in my neighborhood.

Me too. Yeah. And a wild Turkey. So it's wild out there. The next door app gets, goes crazy. What's that noise? I think it's turkeys. Let's have fireworks.

I think so. All right, we'll be back with another segment of secular. Give us a call 1-800-684-3110 support the work of the ACLJ, ACLJ.org. Throw in those comments. If you're on Facebook right now, one shirt, dude, tell me where you're receiving your news. What's your favorite source.

Maybe what's your least favorite source at the American center for law and justice. We're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad, whether it's defending religious freedom, protecting those who are persecuted for their faith. I'm covering corruption in the Washington bureaucracy and fighting to protect life in the courts and in Congress, the ACLJ would not be able to do any of this without your support.

For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's matching challenge for every dollar you donate.

It will be matched a $10 gift becomes $20 a $50 gift becomes 100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ. The work we do simply would not occur without your generous support.

Take part in our matching challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected.

Is there any hope for that culture to survive? And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, Planned Parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift.

Welcome back to Secular. Let's go ahead and take some phone calls. Let's go to Bobby who's calling in New York on line three. A lot of calls from New York today.

New York and Texas. Bobby, you're on the air. Hi, Logan. Hi, Will.

Niagara Falls, New York. I don't think you're going to agree with this, but I don't watch straight news anymore. There's a lot of good stuff out there. I listen to you guys five days a week if I'm home on terrestrial radio. I won't watch the mainstream networks, ABC, CBS, and NBC. I like Fox and Friends very much, but I'm also big on I have to record every night. Without fail, I have to record Tucker Carlson because I think he's so packed with information and I think he's so smart. I'm also a big fan of Clay Travis and Buck Sexton who took over for Rush Limbaugh. You're in a lot of markets, yeah.

I met Clay a few months ago. Bobby, you're like a news junkie. You're into this, man.

You are the key. I mean, you just listed off some great people, some amazing people, some people on both sides. I think you're consuming media how a lot of people do. I know a lot of people listen to this show every day are people that are still the hardcore that are watching every day. So maybe what you're seeing, and thank you, Bobby, by the way, that 38%, that 34%, these are the people who in 2020 were very engaged. Maybe they got burnt out, but also it may just be cyclical where they just go, I tuned in only during things that I feel like, well, last caller said before that, are important to the world and the election was that. Was the viewership so inflated because of the continued Presidential news cycle from 2016 for four years that it was a more drastic drop-off when we kind of transitioned out of that phase. But another thing that he brought up was that he doesn't listen to straight news anymore. He listens to conservative opinion news. And I think a lot of people are more open to opinion-based news going forward and they're tired of the quote-unquote hard-hitting journalism straight news because it's no longer even the facade of non-bias and what's going on right now that is, okay, the facts that people would be reporting are the Senate didn't vote today, numbers go up here. It's all dire and it's all just facts you can get quickly from a bullet point sheet on a website that's like, here's the news you need to know, something like that. You don't need elongated pieces with people giving their reporting and having this journalist get a quote here because you really want to know people's opinions that share your ideology to some degree.

And that's where I think a lot of people have moved because they're like, what's my need for this anymore? Yeah, I think the closest thing you could have maybe had to what became straight news coverage and it did eventually turn, it's obviously was a political topic, but it did at least felt like it was being covered pretty fairly by both sides was the Afghanistan withdrawal and that being chaos. That was like one of those few moments in time where I felt like, oh, this is what the news was supposed to be.

You're reporting on what's happening, what went wrong, what we did wrong, what we did right, everything that's happening on the ground, in the minute, it felt very old school CNN, CNN International almost feeling, which I do like that kind of broadcast. I think that that has changed to where people do want more opinion-based, obviously they do the ratings show that, I don't know if that's a good thing or not, but I think you're right that the straight news doesn't really exist. And I think that's maybe the problem and you've got to have that from Brian Williams. I mean, Brian Williams went on a whole rant on his farewell speech about that, about how essentially he's not a Democrat and not a Republican and that's not where it was supposed to be his role. Now, we obviously know Brian Williams had his own problem and part of his problem was leading to the mistrust of quote, unquote, unbiased news because of the scandal in his reporting background where things were not the way he was portraying them. And I think that's where- I feel like such a little scandal now compared to everything that's happened. Yes, comparatively, but when you think about it laying the framework for someone who, sure, he was a mainstream media journalist on a nightly news, so that's going to skew left. Probably the last of that crew of, even if you knew they were politically probably one way or the other, still felt like it was a script they were reading that was, here's the news, Brian Williams, Peter Jennings, and then in the old crew, Tom Brokaw, you knew where they were coming from, but you didn't feel like you were getting, it shoved down your throat. But then when his scandal came out, which was stories he had reported on that were embellished or elements that he used to tell the story that were just made up, frankly, it really started to break down kind of the last vestige of trust in that style of broadcast, I believe. And I think that a lot of people are paying the consequences of mistakes like that when it's such a high profile figure doing that. Yeah. And speaking of not trusting the media, let's go to Jane in Texas again. Jane, you've been holding for 33 minutes. I appreciate it.

Thank you. I listed, no, I don't trust the mainstream media and a lot of people, nobody I know does, because they don't really report what is, it's what they're not reporting that is alarming. To me, I think one of the number one things in the country, in the world, is the infiltration at the border. There are some bad elements coming through, some third world diseases coming through, and we won't have fair elections, we won't have anything if we get shut down because of these other diseases coming in. I'm shocked at the whole, that everybody's not talking about it, I'm totally shocked. The other thing is, if I do listen to it, even if it's a commercial, it is all propaganda for fear. It's fear, fear, fear, fear, fear, fear, fear, it's going to get worse, everybody's going to get sick.

And, you know, we don't need that, and that's just propaganda for fear, and that's a whole other thing. The only person I absolutely adore, because he says what I'm thinking, is Mark Levin. He's not a reporter, but he's spot on, and I love him.

Alright, well good, I'm glad you enjoy Mark Levin, I mean certainly a commentary show, we know his points of view, he's not exactly a quiet guy, but I get that. People have their local markets and what they listen to and what they watch, but I do think there's a lot of people who found an obsession with news media to be detrimental to their lives, detrimental to their personal lives, and you saw a massive change. I would say a good percentage of those people who tuned off are those people who maybe got so obsessed and so wrapped up in it in 2020, that when 2021 rolled around, and the election happened, and the riots happened, and COVID happened, that they got to a breaking point, where they couldn't, and now you saw a rise in entertainment. Now, you obviously have infiltration from the same people who are creating the news in your entertainment, so you have to make sure that there are some checks and balances there as well, and we've looked at various different ways we can expand even our entertainment portfolio in terms of how we create content here, because we know there's also places that people want to go and have different points of view.

You're not just getting a force-fed view. I think that's why we've seen the rise of stand-up comedy, because sometimes the last year, stand-up comedy has been a place where people could at least go to hear various opinions and honestly weird trust, whether you had a Rogan or a Chappelle, or whether you had all of these other names that have risen in the last few years in stand-up, some silly, some more hard-hitting, and look, providing you a diverse... I believe if you're watching all of this media, if you're watching the one guy who called in, who I appreciate, listened to us for 25 years, watches Tucker and reads this and does all this conservative-based media, maybe watch someone else for half an hour. Maybe check out what they're saying on the other side. Once you have a point you can argue, but also so you can at least keep your own brain in balance and in check, because both sides take it to the extreme, and we have to accept that too.

Sure, I think there are people who do it better. There are people who I think are more genuine and sincere on both sides even, and at least are telling you what they believe. We did an interview on The Revenge of the Taliban where we talked to Tulsi Gabbard, someone who ran against President Trump, someone who now shows up on Fox News all the time. One of her big talking points in that documentary is we are now just going to be looking for people that not necessarily we agree with, but at least we say we trust that what you're saying is what you believe, and you're not just being force-fed aligned or you're not just telling us a party platform. You're not just sticking up for what your party has forced you to do, because that's what we've seen now even in the Biden administration, which is a guy who the President of the United States, Joe Biden, disagreeing with his own policy offhandedly, at least with President Trump. There were many times, even to the point where you disagreed with him against what you consider the Republican National Convention's typical platform, because at least he was saying what he thought. And you know with the Biden administration, you're getting sort of the opposite.

You are getting the fringe having control over a guy who was largely a moderate Democrat for 40 years, and just in the last 10 or even less has flipped so hardcore. That is media influence. Well, and to the caller's point as well, that people don't trust the media because what they aren't reporting on many times, and even the border story, when you've hit something that is record-breaking and the left is blaming the prior President for the failures of this President, that should be on the evening news, the world news tonight, the nightly news, and it's just not getting the attention, so people will turn it off because it is record-breaking, all-time highs at the border. That should be a story that's being reported because it's a national story, but it's not.

And again, because it's not fitting the narrative, it's not getting reported on. We'll be back with the last segment of Sekulow for the day. We got a couple lines open.

1-800-684-3110. I'll try to get to as many calls as I can in this final segment. Thanks for joining us for this conversation. I've really enjoyed it. It's been interesting.

I love hearing your takes. I love hearing where you're coming from, and I appreciate all your support of the ACLJ at ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad, whether it's defending religious freedom, protecting those who are persecuted for their faith, uncovering corruption in the Washington bureaucracy, and fighting to protect life in the courts and in Congress, the ACLJ would not be able to do any of this without your support.

For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's Matching Challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched.

A $10 gift becomes $20, a $50 gift becomes $100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ. The work we do simply would not occur without your generous support. Take part in our Matching Challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Welcome back to Sekulow. Let's wrap up today's show by taking your calls, 1-800-684-3110. Couple lines open at 1-800-684-3110. Let's start with Johnny, who's calling in New York on line two. You're on the air.

Thank you. We talk about news content. Let's talk about lack of content. There's been no coverage whatsoever by any of the media about Russia and Ukraine, China and Taiwan, North Korea has disappeared from the map, and Iran, again, no coverage whatsoever. I understand Vladimir Putin has made threats to NATO and to the United States. I get that from other sources, but not from the news media. Why are we not being made aware of what's happening in the world? Well, and Johnny, we cover that here on this program.

We have experts like Rick Grenell, who is the former director of national intelligence and ambassador to Germany, and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, who was also the director of the Central Intelligence Agency. They both will be on tomorrow to talk about issues like that. You get that kind of analysis and coverage here because of the support of the ACLJ that you're not getting in the mainstream media. And many times, because those topics don't garner the interest of people, they see Taiwan and China. It's a really big story. It's a big deal. They see it as another part of the world and not a big deal.

But they're like, it doesn't matter. But we have those experts that can come on and break down why that's a national security issue for us in a way that they're not doing in the mainstream media and even in cable media. They're not breaking it down that way. But if you listen to Sekulow, if you follow our content on the website, on our social media platforms, and if you support the ACLJ, especially in the matching challenge, you're helping bring that content to the world. And frankly, the work that is being done here is not being done by the mainstream media.

Yeah. And look, we use the term mainstream media, but here's just the honest truth about it. One, if you think these numbers are clear, obviously there is a drop in ratings.

We know that. But even the way they obtain those ratings is a flawed old system that is, you're talking about, they take a small sample of people and they extrapolate that by the millions. And that's how we know the rating system.

And it's been that way forever. You know, what's not flawed? A lot of the numbers we get here on social media, we can actually see and give you exact numbers of how many people are watching and listening. So a lot of people, especially in media right now, have said, who cares? Our show went from 5 million people to 2 million people because look at our social media numbers. There's real numbers there. There's real data that people can all see.

And guess what? Our show here on Sekulow, not exactly what you consider mainstream media in the sense that we're not on every night on Fox, CNN, MSNBC, or on your broadcast television often is doing more or very similar than a lot of the major broadcasts that are on, certainly that are on some of the more second tier networks. I don't think that's, I'm not trying to be offensive to them. It's just true. If you have the big three, then you have your Newsmax and OANs and I'd say are doing more, if not, or doing similar, if not more on many days, then your top mainstream media news journalists, whether that's your Don Lemon or whether that's your, any of these other shows. Now, some of them, your Hannity's, these are doing 3, 4 million people a night, 2, 3, 5 million.

That's a different world. But if you come into impressions, very similar come to impressions on the amount of content we share, it may not be in the broadcast, the one hour broadcast, but the amount of content that we're creating and you're seeing often has a much bigger impact. And look, I know a lot of you right now are watching on your phones and you're like this, you're watching it on your phone. And I appreciate that because you know what?

A thousand people watching like this is way more impactful than 30,000 of you casually turning it on for five minutes and turning it off. I know you're engaged and I appreciate that. Let's take some phone calls to wrap it up. I'm gonna try to get to all these really quick. Israel's calling in Connecticut line four. Go ahead. Hey, thank you for having my, having me on there and to receive my call. Now I do have a statement to say, first of all, I listened to ACLJ, the ACLJ only.

Past that maybe Newsmax, but there's a reason why. Not only do you guys speak the truth and I want to thank you for that. You actually do something about it.

I mean everybody else might say, go ahead and vote, change who's in power, but you physically do something about. I want to thank you. I appreciate you guys for what, for your work and I do have one comment with all the millions of coming in through the border now and now that they're coming in, they only see one thing because of the mainstream media. They speak Spanish. They speak different language. Hey, I speak Spanish very well, but every time I speak to someone in Spanish and tell them what the ACLJ is saying, they look, they look at me as if I had two heads. How can we help them understand what's going on? They don't understand the English language. I think that is a very interesting point there, Israel, and maybe that is somewhere we need to expand.

I'm not saying that that's something that, that's a, a very reasonable, a very reasonable request is how can we provide it in Spanish, obviously is spoken by a lot of people in our country. How can we reach you better? How can we reach your family, your communities better? I think that's an excellent point and I will take that into consideration if we head into 2022.

I really will. Yeah, you know, we've worked with a lot of different groups. We're available. We're all over Europe. We're all over that. Maybe you're right. And you know what?

I haven't thought about it. That's a great comment. Also, when you say we do the work, I do appreciate that as well because not only do we do the work, we have an incredible team here doing the production. You see the TV and radio show every day or every week, however you consume it, but we also have the legal staff.

We have the lawyers, we have everyone administratively going out there and doing the work, right? We're not just opinion news. We're maybe lumped in a political news talk radio station, if you will, or into a podcast feed, but when it comes to us actually doing the work, and that's because of you supporting the work of the ACLJ. Let's... Oh, go ahead. Yeah, and I just want to piggyback off that really quickly that if you get the emails of the ACLJ, which I encourage everyone, go to ACLJ.org and sign up for one from your brother Jordan went out this morning about persecution of Christians in Nigeria. And we're going to have Secretary of State Mike Pompeo on the show tomorrow to talk about it, but it even talks about action that Jordan took at the UN demanding protection for the Christians in Nigeria from persecution.

So that's one of the ways we're engaged in things that isn't really getting widely reported, so you should check that out. All right, let's go to Lori in Arizona. And Bernadette, I am sorry, we're not going to be able to get to you today. Thanks for holding, but unfortunately we can't get to you. Lori in Arizona, you're on the air. Hi. Thanks for taking my call.

One thing is fun. I watch you guys of course every day when you're on and if I miss part of it, I'll rewatch it. I watch it on rumble.

Awesome. And another thing is I think streaming, the capabilities of streaming has changed how we watch TV with the networks and that, because one thing is I can watch the news media like Fox, and they'll have somebody on there and then by the time limits, they're cut off. So I look up their podcast and if I want to hear their information, I can watch their podcast anytime. And it may be six hours long, you know, I think that you're right, Lori. I think streaming has changed everything and look, we're wrapping up, we've got a minute left.

I appreciate your, and look what you're going to say. My son is nine years old, he doesn't show any difference in terms of what a legitimate sources for media from a YouTuber and from someone that's on NBC. And I think that's a good thing. By the way, a lot of people kind of will say, Oh, no, remove the gatekeepers.

It's not necessary anymore. They find entertainment and what they want. I feel that same way with news media. You'll be able to find your way to get the media and the content and the news that you need from your sources. You don't need to be told this is who you have to listen to. And that's why we're here as well. You know, there's no one above us than telling us what to say, and that is fantastic. And that's a fantastic place for media to be at. So there is a silver lining to these ratings droppings and that's not a lot of you are tuning into alternative sources like us.

And listen, we only got 10 seconds left last week of the year. Support the work of the ACLJ. Keep this show going and everything else going into the new year. Visit ACLJ.org and we will talk to you tomorrow. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's Matching Challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20, a $50 gift becomes $100. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org.