Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at Carm.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers, taking your calls, and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick.

Everybody, hey, everybody, welcome to the show. It's me, Matt Slick, and you're listening to Matt Slick Live. As usual, if you want to give me a call, you can. It's easy. Just dial eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

And we can talk. We got one person coming in. And uh let's see, let's see, let's see. I'm actually working on Uh for me. An interesting article.

And I want to describe it. And uh I generally like to write very quick articles, very to the point. But every now and then I need to write one that I think. is more useful on a lengthy basis. And because it has several things in it.

And this is this one, I'm thinking about calling it, it has to do with the Orthodox Church. Instead of calling it the orthodox, calling it the orthodox, you know, the quack, quack. And the reason is because a lot of their answers are quackery, and they're quacks a lot of times, some of the stuff they say. And so I was thinking about uh using that that uh that That title, you know, the Orthodox. But I don't think so.

Um. maybe something like uh some of the bad arguments used by Eastern Orthodox believers. I think that might be a little bit better, even though Orthodox just is more fun, and then make a graphic where a bunch of Orth Eastern Orthodox guys or ducks are dressed up as we can Orthodox guys. Maybe I'll do that out of for fun. But um just 'cause it's fun and it works.

But some of the issues I'm addressing here are these things that they say. Such as, you can't use the Bible unless you can justify how you know what books belong in it. It's a very bad argument. But this is what they use, and they try and do that. And then another one is: our church is true because we have apostolic succession and authority.

I'm just poking holes in these. Another one is, and I use this a lot with EO and the RC, you know, Eastern Orthodox or with Catholics. Romans 4.5 says to the one who does not work but believes in him who justifies the ungodly. His faith is credited as righteousness, and I'll ask him. is Paul negating works here when he is talking about justification?

And they say no. Even though he says to the one who does not work but believes. But he's not justifying work, negating works, just stuff like this, because they're so blind they can't even see. And uh another one is uh working on is uh Using verses about uh yeah, I mean Double. I may sew this one up, but anyway, that's a works of the law are not the same as good works.

And this one's going to be interesting when I tackle this segment. And then another one: I'm not earning salvation because it is God working through me. Oh, I love that when people say that. I love that. I'm not earning salvation because God's doing me the good works in me.

I say, you know, I ask him and I say, well, are you doing any good works? Because if you say it's only God doing it in you and you're not doing it, then you can't get any credit for anything that you're doing. Right.

So how can then you get salvation by faith in works? It's real simple. You know, you can if you listen closely, you can hear the wheels just pop off their cart and then scraping. And then another one I'm going to work on is this one was said Monday night. By one of the Orthobros Orthodox.

Um Was I'm keeping the commandments. I repent when I break them. Repentance is a command, so I'm keeping the commandments. Yeah. For real.

A guy said that and he was supposed to be a lawyer. One of the Orthodox guys said that. I'm keeping the commandments. But when I break the commandments, then I repent, 'cause that's a command.

So therefore I'm keeping the commandments. For real? This guy actually said that. The logic is so atrociously bad. And this guy was a lawyer that that I couldn't trust to to represent me.

Man, a court of law was thinking like that.

So these are the ortho. The ortho Okay. Man, they got orthos, just call them orthos. For those of you who are my age, you'll know what that means. You're a bit more north, though.

So, at any rate, there you go, there you go, there you go. Let's get back on. Oh, but here we go. Let's get to Cole from Georgia. Cole, welcome.

You're on the air. Oh yeah, how you doing, Max? I'm doing all right. Hanging in there, man. What do you got?

Well, this this is I won't take too much time. Um Now, this was back in Revelations again.

Now, I gotta find out two questions. Um What's the only book in the Bible that you're promised to be blessed If you read it and then the ears. Revelation. Yeah. Okay, now that's my first one.

Now here's the second one. I'm going to listen to you respond.

Okay. Why isn't that priority on most of the teachers? And guys like you, why aren't you guys, if it's a promise to the people and the teachers, why aren't you guys? teaching on it more, it seems like that would be a priority.

Well, if you were to teach the book of Revelation, I think that would be part of what would come out naturally in the book of Revelation. It says, Blessed he who heeds the prophecy of this Revelation. It does not say you'll be blessed if you read it.

Okay, did you know that? Oh, yeah, it does say that. I just I just I just read that this morning. It says blessed are the ones that read it, and it also blessed is the one that hears it. That's right in the first chapter.

Yeah, it says, you know, uh It says in Revelation 22:7, Coming quickly, blessed is he who heeds the words of the prophecy of this book, right? You could say the whole book's a prophecy. Yeah. Um No, no, it actually says in Revelation chapter one 'Cause blessed is the one that reads it and blessed is the one that kills it.

Okay, good. All right. Go, go. You gotta go to it. Why don't you go to it?

You won't even go for it. It's verse 3, Revelation 1:3.

Okay, blessed are you who reads and and who hears the words of the prophecy. Yeah?

Okay. And that gets back to my point. Why aren't you guys teaching on this? You guys know way more than I do, average guys like me, you know. You know, you got all the education and scholars and all that.

But you guys don't really, you know, you guys should be pushing that book. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, I think that's wise. I also think that people, in light of what it says, blessed is this, they ought to also be pushing people to pursue spiritual gifts, as it says to do in 1 Corinthians 14:1. I think that's true too.

So they should do all of what the scriptures admonish, right? It just says, blessed is the one who reads it.

So I said people, Hey, when you read this, you're blessed.

Okay. Well, you know, Matt, guys like me and the average guys, you know, we don't know as much as you guys. And if you would you know, I think a guy like you with all your experience and knowledge. you should prioritize teaching and more in the book of Revelations because it's very, very important.

Well, all right. And it's it's a reason why that's the only book that is is that am I wrong? I could be wrong. Is that the only book that the Bible says, oh, you're blessed if you read it and you're blessed if you hear it? I think Deuteronomy says that too.

I'm not sure. Or is it don't add from the book? I think that's what it is. Uh So let me do a little research and see. I can do it really quickly here.

Books that say that you're blessed. Uh if you read if you read them.

Okay. Yeah, in the Bible that is. Yeah. So uh I don't know. You know, I have to check it out, but there's nothing wrong with.

Read the book of Revelation, you'll be blessed.

So I'd say to people, Hey, you'll be blessed if you read it.

Okay. Well, I mean, you know, it's it's it's mad. Got the message for eternal uh life. You know what I'm saying? It's got the message for eternal life.

But in that case, it also boils down to, uh, you know, everything that me and you was talking about last week. With the millennial reign and Satan being, you think Satan's already been blocked up and chained up. I said, no way, no way, no way in this earth history has Satan been chained up in the bottomless pit. Never has there been peace on this earth, man. And you know it.

Hold on, hold on, hold on. You're conflating issues, which is done by a lot of people. Him being bound doesn't mean it necessitates peace on earth. Nothing in the Bible says that. It's just a mistake you make in your circuit.

Oh my goodness, Matt, it clearly says that Satan will trouble the nations no more. There'll be peace on the earth because the kids will be able to play with the logic. You are not thinking logically. You're thinking emotionally.

Okay, it says in Revelation 20, verse 3: sealed him up so he would not deceive the nations any longer. It doesn't mean he can't do other things. It just says to not deceive the nations any longer.

Well what has your brain? When has there been a time where Satan has never had to stop deceiving the nation? Which?

Well, we have to first of all, this is an example of you not thinking critically. What does it mean to deceive the nations? You have to ask the question. See, you have to ask these questions. Yes, you do.

I think you're overthinking it. You don't think you put too much education into it. No. It's plain and simple. Coal.

Coal. Get all calorie on it. Coal, coal. It's what it says. to see the nations.

So, you won't do that. It's what it says. You can say, okay, what does it mean by that? You can ask the question. It's what you should ask.

Do you know what it means? Damn. Yes, it's got. Um Well, if he's in a public pit, he can't deceive people. The first thing he did is leave Adam and the Eve.

It doesn't say deceive people. It says deceived nations. That's everybody, Matt. It could be, it could be. It's all groups of people.

It could be that. You're not understanding. When you do exegesis, when you look at the text, you ask questions. What does it mean? It could have a range of possibilities.

The word nation means every individual. The nations means political groups. It can mean national ethnic groups. That's what it could. These things are all possibilities.

So which one is the one most likely used in the Scripture? And what you can then do is say, well, if it's this, what are the ramifications to it? If it's number two, what are the ramifications? If it's number three, what are the ramifications?

Now you see, this isn't an issue of having degrees in education. It's an issue of reading the text and asking questions. No, but I'm that's what I'm doing right now.

Okay, listen. This is my point. You don't want to let somebody else get on.

Now, Adam and Eve had all the nations within the two of them. Am I right or wrong? It depends what you mean by nations. He deceived the nation from the very beginning, the nations, because those two people came all ages and races. Am I wrong?

So then, what you're saying is nations is defined as two individuals, and that what is not. Hold hold up call. You're saying the nations is defined as two individuals and or the people who are in them later on. You're saying that's what nations mean. Then what you'd have to do Then what you'd have to do is go through starting at Genesis chapter 1.

Verse 1. Type in the word nation. And see how God uses the word nation in the Bible. That's what you do. You make mistakes.

People make mistakes all the time. They assume something means something. Like he bound him for a thousand years. They assume the thousand is the literal thousand. How does God use the word thousand?

He uses it figuratively all over the place. A day is but a thousand years, a thousand years but a day. God owns that cattle on a thousand hills. He uses the term thousand figuratively. And if you knew this when it comes to, it says for a thousand years, you can understand that the term, single term thousand, not 22,000, but the word thousand is used figuratively.

Is all of a sudden now it's literally?

Now it's literal and the whole Bible uses it triggerly. Can I respond? Yeah, after the break, after the break, after the break, after the break, hold on. We both be right back after these messages, please. Stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick Live, taking a call at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hello, Robin. Welcome back to the show. Let's get back on with Cole here for another minute or two.

Cole, are you there? Yeah, I'm here. Uh, no, I was thinking, I almost lost my uh train of thought.

Now, uh The thousand years.

Okay. Okay, listen, I'm gonna make this simple.

Now You can um Oh. Methuselah was nine hundred and sixty-nine years old.

Okay, now he was what thirty-one years from a thousand, okay, now. You're gonna tell me that wasn't a literal thousand Yes, I'm not sure.

Well, hold on, let me finish. You're not going to be able to do that. Yeah, not a thousand. It doesn't mean ninety-six, okay? No.

Yeah, that's right now. In that same sense, Matt. Cole, Cole, Cole, Cole, Cole. You're wasting time. Cole, you're wasting time.

Trying to say that. Yes, you are, Cole. Listen up. The word thousand in Revelation 20, you've got to understand the book of Revelation refers to the Old Testament. There's so many things in it.

It's to think of Revelation as an index to the stuff that came before it. When you come up to, for example, in Revelation 20, verse 3, when you come up to the word thousand, thousand years, how does God use the term thousand? God. I'm not buying it, man. I'm not buying it.

You know what?

Okay. We're moving along, we're moving along. Let me make the point, folks. Um When you study, when you do apologetics, when you do hermeneutics, when you interpret scripture. You want to see how God uses terms, not how you think they're to be used.

It's just that simple.

So in the g for example, in Revelation 20. He says, Satan will not deceive the nations any longer until the thousand years were completed.

Okay. It's legitimate to say, what does this mean, thousand years? Is there's really two possibilities. It's a literal one thousand years or it's not a literal one thousand years. Both of those are logistically possible.

Which one is the right one?

Well, you could assert one or the other, and people do. How do you know which is correct? There's nothing wrong with asking these questions, and Christians need to think like this. If they're just buying in to what's been told them, like two men in the field, one is taken, one is left. Oh, that's the rapture.

It absolutely is not the rapture when you read the context. People just too often listen, assert a value. Insert a value also, and then believe it, but they haven't demonstrated it's true. And this is a common mistake made by Christians all over the place.

So, for example, the word thousand, what does it mean? Does it mean a literal one thousand or If we were to go and see how God uses the term thousand years, for example. uh or just the word thousand will see things like In Ecclesiastes 6:6, even if the other man lives a thousand years twice, does not enjoy good things, does not all go to one place. He no, he could be saying that's a literal thousand, but two times, but he's exaggerating to make the point. Or Psalm 90, verse 4, for a thousand years in your sight is like yesterday.

And uh Psalm fifty verse ten, God owns the cattle on a thousand hills. Psalm 84.10, Your day for day in your court is better than a thousand elsewhere. Deuteronomy 7:9. He says, God's covenantal faithfulness is to a thousand generations. 2 Peter 3:8, the Lord.

With the Lord, one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like a day. We can see that the term thousand, not the count of you know, fifty thousand men were walking, but the term thousand. by itself. is used repeatedly figuratively. If you look at Revelation and you understand that what Revelation is doing is referring to so many things before, like the four creatures, the four creatures, lion, ox, eagle, and man.

in Revelation uh five. What are those four groups?

Well, you can find them in Daniel. You can find them in the Old Testament references. And so by going back to those four faces, those four things, you recognize things because those four lion, ox, eagle, and man were around the, were represented as the twelve tribes of Israel. in four groups of three. I'm just saying People need to do studies and they need to stop just believing something really fast.

It's all it's thousands mean thousands that's all it is.

Well, how do you know? 'Cause it does.

Well, how do you know? Like the word nations. How do you know what the word nations means? Me, if I were studying this, I'd say, I'm going to go see how the word nations is used by God. I'm just going to see what he does with it.

See if I can learn something. That's all. And maybe I will learn something, maybe I won't learn something. But this is how you study. Don't make the mistake of asserting certain values are true, just believing them because someone told you.

You need to do your study. That's all I'm saying. Let's get to the next longest waiting is Charlie from North Carolina. Charlie, welcome. You're on the air.

Hey, brother Matt, how are you doing today? Doing all right, man. Hanging in, everybody. What do you got?

So I've got two questions, if that's okay. But my first one is like so like you know, I've spoke to you briefly on the air about like I There's a certain sin that I'm really struggling to overcome. And, like, Growing up, I was always told that repentance is like turning away from sin, like turning to God, turning away from sin. And I've heard other teachings that are like, yes, it does mean that, but it really means it's a change of mind, like a change of your thought and attitude towards end.

So my question is, like, if my repentance is real or is my repentance real if I keep wrestling with the same thing and I'm just like not Disciplining my walk with the Lord and spending time in prayer the way I want to, and stuff like that.

Okay. Um Repentance doesn't mean perfection. or never struggling with something that you've repented of. Repentance comes from the Greek word metanoeo. Meta change na'as mind.

It's an attitudinal change where you don't want to do these things anymore. You recognize that God has said don't do these things, you recognize this, and so you stop doing whatever it is that the issue is. We know, though, that we Fall into our sins repeatedly.

Sometimes our repentance means we never have to do it again.

Sometimes our repentance means we repent a thousand times in our entire lifetime. And it's not perfection that is necessary because we can't establish it. We cannot establish perfection. Could you mute yourself a little bit? Because you get a lot of noise in the background there, and it's just very noisy.

A lot of noise, a lot of clanking.

Okay, good. And so repented, thank you. Repentance. is a change of of attitude.

Now when I talk to people and I counsel people about this, particularly those who have a a p a propensity in a certain area or areas, a few areas, where they they want to repent, they want to stop, and that they continually fail in it. Does it mean they're not saved? No, it doesn't mean they're not saved. Only those who are alive in Christ are struggling and struggle against their sin. are the ones who are alive in Christ.

Now God desires that we never sin again. But he also knows that we are not perfect. We're going to sin. 1 John 1.9 says, If we confess our sins, He's faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Now that's an interesting verse in 1 John 1.9.

So, what does it mean? Does it mean that we confess one sin once, we never do it again? Or does it mean that we confess the same sins over again? Or does it mean we're confessed sin generically, we're going through? These are the kinds of questions we have to ask.

I ask all these kinds of questions. I do teaching and thinking and analysis and we have a break. We'll be right back after these messages.

So please stay tuned, folks. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick Live, taking a call at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hello everybody, welcome back to the show.

Let's get it all back up with Charlie. Are you still there, brother?

Okay. Yeah, I'm still here.

Okay. So what I was going to say, and I'll just condense it, is 1 John 1, 8 and 9. If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. But if we confess our sins, He's faithful and just to forgive us our sins and cleanse us from unrighteousness.

So 1 John 1:8 and 9 is clearly saying that we have sin, we struggle. And we confess it. And this is what you better do. And I don't want to say to people, don't worry about not sending or sending, don't worry about it. No, no, we always want to be concerned.

The point is that. uh your repentance is the continual Practice. of trusting Christ and seeking His righteousness. and his sanctifying work in you. And that's why repentance is part and process of the daily life of believers.

And If you repent of a little thing, And you don't do it except every three, four years versus something you struggle with on a daily basis or weekly basis. It does not mean that you're not saved. It doesn't mean you're abusing the grace of God. It means you're a man who understands his failures. and is dealing with them and trying to go to the cross constantly, and by doing that.

I go to the cross constantly. and your confession and your repentance, even when you blow it again with the same thing. When you go to the cross constantly, you're glorifying the Lord Jesus.

Okay. Um My other question was So I know that you're I was just wondering, so like Justin Martyr, Irenaeus, All the earliest church fathers, and like, you know, like you know, they were taught by the apostles. And they held to a historic premillennialism.

So do you think that's something that they were like they were disciples of them, so they were probably taught that by the apostles. And then the idea of amillennialism didn't really come in till August uh dude from Hippo, what's his name, Augustine? Augustine. Yeah, but uh Also, Clement of Alexandria, Origen, Augustine didn't hold to premal. But here's the thing, just because the church fathers taught something doesn't mean it's true.

And I have this basic battle with the Eastern Orthodox. all the time. Because and they were the Catholics, they always want to say their church fathers blah blah blah. But the church fathers are not authoritative. And the Church Fathers I say to them, how do you know which church fathers teaching the truth?

Because if you say, well, premillennialism is true, these guys taught premillennialism, therefore we can trust them. Then you're saying that.

Well, no, I think I see it in scripture. I just think that it's a. I just thought that it's. was I don't know, kind of like it corroborates or supports it, maybe. You see it in Scripture.

Let me let me write something by you. It says in premillennialism, isn't it true that before the millennial reign, the rapture occurs, right?

Well, no, I I'm I'm post I'm post trib. Yeah, I believe that's the one that's the all one and I said no, I said before the millennium. The rapture occurs before the millennial thousand years begins, right? Uh Yeah, I believe that the rapture would happen like the rapture would happen when Christ returns, the judgment, new heavens and new earth, and then the millennial reign where the earth is made new. Christ reigns on a throne in Jerusalem for a thousand years, and there's peace.

Here during that time. Oh, okay.

So the new heavens and new earth are made when Jesus returns at the rapture?

Well, no, that I believe the earth isn't the earth. Like Made new like it was before the curse, or something like that. Yeah, that's the all-millennial position you're actually espousing, believe it or not. Not the premillennial. The premillennial position says that the rapture, a return rapture of Christ, is separated by the new heavens and new earth by a thousand years.

Okay. Okay, maybe I need to do some more studying. Yes.

So you're espousing that the return of Christ and new heavens and new earth are made, and the rapture occurs basically the same day or whatever, which is the amillennial position.

Okay. It's alright.

Okay. So Well, thank you, man. I appreciate you always taking my calls, man. I know you probably get tired of it. No, no, no, no, not at all, man.

I enjoy it.

So no problem. Always feel free calling back.

Okay, brother? All right, man, you have a blessed day.

Okay, you too. All right, next we're going to get to Scott, then Jermaine, and then we're going to get to Alex. We'll talk about Eastern Orthodoxy. I love talking about Eastern Orthodoxy, but first let's get to Scott from Washington. Come everybody, you're on the air.

Hey, good day to you, Matt. I have to say. And I love when Cole calls in, he always brings a smile to my face. I have a quick question for you.

So I used, I guess, deductive reasoning here with this. If there was giants in the earth in Joshua's time, obviously, that's after the flood, and the only survivors of the flood were the eight of Noah's family. How then did giants get back on the earth if they were all extinguished in the flood? The same way they did the first time. Oh really?

Interesting. Yeah. The intrusion of the angelic realm into the earthly thing. through uh procreation But nothing in the Bible says that, if that position is correct, nothing in the Bible would say that it couldn't happen again after the flood, right? Very true.

Okay. Interesting. Yeah. Um Okay, well, yeah, that's pretty much all I had. I had another question, but then this study Bible I have actually answered it pretty well.

Okay. But yeah, that's all I got, man. I've just now I turned on your the thing you did last night with the EO guys. I'm getting ready to watch it.

So yeah, I'll watch that and I'll talk to you soon.

Sounds good. All right, brother.

Sounds good. All right, man. All right. All right, Alex. Talk to you later.

God bless.

Alright. All right, next longest waiting is Jermaine from California, Millet and 20 Minutes. Jermaine, welcome, brother. You're on the air. Okay, now that I um Yeah, I'd get right in so you can get some other calls in.

But We brought up before divorce amongst Christians, and I brought a relative up, a cousin of mine. He's going through severe trauma and he has biblical grounds for divorce. He's He's caught the intrusions, I will say, for the sake of children, on camera by accident. And it's basically an affair going on for five years. Is sinning by not pulling the trigger at this point just 'Cause he wants things to work out, but it's obvious that, um His uh wife wants nothing to do with him.

So we have different levels of what he ought to do.

So He's free to divorce if his wife is committing adultery. And I anyway, committing adultery, he's free to re he's free to divorce her. but he's not obligated to. He can, and if he does, he's free. And She has broken her covenant vows and she's functionally abandoning him.

So Uh that there's two reasons right there that he's justified in it. He doesn't have to. If he wants to work it out and he's seeking her repentance, he's acting like Hosea. And God says Mary the Harlot and He's working with her and everything. And so that's okay if you want to do that.

On the other hand, what if there's children involved? And the children are witnessing this and they're being harmed. And I'm going to use that word harmed in a very broad way because it can mean several different things. We won't get into specifics. And he wants to guard their safety in various levels.

then is he obligated to protect them by divorcing? And then that would be another question to ask at that time. Because if we talk about obligation, Then that means you ought to do something. When ought you divorce?

Well, God in Jeremiah 3:8 issued a certificate of divorce against Israel for their spiritual adultery.

So God did this, so divorce is not automatically. Uh j um sinful.

So When it comes down to situations like this, we have to look at the individual cases in particulars. He needs to be talking to his elders and the whole bit. And if it's the case that she's committing adultery, he's unrepentant, he's tried to work, and she won't do it. He's free to divorce. And at some point, he might ought to, might ought to, he might want to or ought to do it because of how do I say this when adultery is occurring, diseases can spread.

And so there's that issue of self-protection as well.

So there gets to be a lot of stuff, and the elders of the church need to then step in and say. At this point we think ABCD. records need to be kept so that if he wants to join another church, maybe get married again later, that is well documented what happened, what he tried to do, et cetera, and reconciliation was impossible, and that he's free.

Okay. Okay, just one little caveat. What if the person refuses to? let the divorce happen for financial reasons. I know he's at the point where he wants it with the the um spouse is making it very difficult while also refusing to stop the affair and yes, there are children involved and families are harmed.

Yeah, it sounded like an evil woman actually. Um And so at that point, I don't know because different states have different law requirements and lawyers have to be involved, etc. That's all I can tell you at that point. or it can be forced to occur rather than not. I think there's rule rules for that to every country, I mean states, okay?

Alright buddy.

Alright. Thanks man.

Alright man, God bless. Hey, folks, be right back after the break. We'll talk to Alex from Florida on Eastern Orthodoxy. Be right back, please. Stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, we have two open lines: 877-207-2276. Alex from Florida.

You're on the air, buddy. What's up? What's going on? Mandu and Radio. Maybe you didn't pick up on that.

I don't know. But, you know. Oh. Hey hey everyone, we're friends. You gotta give a disclaimer there.

Disclaimer, they were friends. Disclaimer, you're on the right track. Keep going.

Okay, yeah, I walked into that one.

Okay, man. What do you got, buddy? Um. Yeah, well first before the EO stuff, you know, that guy who calls in, I've heard him call in a couple of times, he's struggling with drugs and stuff. I hope he's still listening, but I was a drug ag for years.

And God um healed me of that. He delivered me from that. And so if he is in Christ, you know, he has the power. Through Christ to overcome that. The Bible also, I agree with what you're saying with grace, and it's a struggle, and it's good that he acknowledges that.

But you know, the Bible also says to cut off your hand, cut off your eye, you know, it's symbolism. To just get that stuff out of your life, and you just put your foot down. And you move on.

Okay. And then when you fail, if or if you fail, you go to the cross again. That's right. Yeah, yeah, of course yeah, of course. And I and I struggled a few times After I got saved.

So I'm not here sitting like I was perfect for 12 years straight. But yeah, you go to the cross even if you slip up again. Yeah. That's right. I've known you for a while.

I've known you for a while. I know, man, you've got some major mental struggles, that's for sure. Man. Have you been talking to my wife? She texts me information, so I got a I got a book.

Yeah, it's it's really good. Yeah, I that sounds about right. That sounds about right.

Okay. No, so the so the EO stuff.

So, yeah, I was actually watching the beginning. of your EO discussion because I missed I jumped on later and I missed the beginning. But, you know, one thing that, you know, just like you, I come across these guys, and they want to say that they have the authority. They have the real Bible. They have the ones that have extra books.

I mean, the authority, they are the authorities. And um Actually. Yeah, I would like it if you could go to some passage, the passage and values, that might be good for the listeners. To where we are, we have the scriptures illuminated to us. You know, we have the mind of Christ.

Our eyes are open. We can go to the Bible on our own. We don't need a church. to do it for us, I think it'd be helpful if you could go to some of those passages. Um Yeah, he opens the mind to understand the scriptures.

That's Jesus in Luke 24, 30, no, 44, I think it is, 45. Then there's Acts 16, 14, where God opens the mind of Lydia. To uh understand the word of God. Uh so yeah, there's those are the top uh off of my head. And maybe there's more.

Yeah, well, and the illumination, I think it's 1 or 2 Corinthians, where it's like the scriptures are illuminated to you. Um you know they're Yeah, what verse of that Well, let's see well let's see trying to find it. Uh No. It's the doctrine of illumination, but yeah, go on. Yeah, different words are used in different contexts.

Um Uh let's see Uh I'm looking through some research here and I don't see it.

So in 1 Corinthians I'll just see if I can find the verse. Because it's a good thing. The verse about. Illumination. Elimination.

Yeah. Let's see what it says.

Alright. Yeah, I have lots of tools. I can use tools and get a lot of good answers pretty quickly.

So uh You did watch that, right? How bad they were. Yeah, yeah, I'm I'm watching the beginning. I I caught the like second half when you were talking with them, but now I'm watching the beginning when you first got on.

Okay. Yeah. Nice model. Yeah, they were exceedingly rude. They're arrogant.

I find typically the Eastern Orthodox people. to be very prideful, very, very prideful. Yep.

Okay, I think it's 1 Corinthians 2.10. Let's see. Uh got revealed. For God has revealed them through the Spirit. The se spirit searches all things, yeah.

That's a bad. I'll have to look for that to see. Anyway, but this hit was continuing.

Well, that one's one. No, I know a verse. That's a good verse, too. Yeah, that's on the same line. Um Of that, but um Yeah, I mean we When you're born again, you know, before I was born again, I'm sure you can attest this too.

The scriptures were dead to me. They were boring. I couldn't understand them. I read them in youth group, but they didn't make much sense to me. It wasn't like in me.

But then, once you're born again, your mind is open. You have the mind of Christ, your eyes are open. And you know that every word on that page is inspired by God. Right.

And and and so these guys that say Yeah, and these EO guys who say, well, we need the church to interpret it for us, and the fathers, and the lineage, and the false apostolic succession that they quote. It's just insane. It doesn't make any sense. It denies the clear teaching of what the scriptures say. And I know we're going to our experience when we're born again, but still the scriptures back up our experience.

Oh yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Um Yeah, and I like it. You know, you're right. They do say we need the church to interpret the Bible for us.

And whenever I test them on that, they don't want to play games. You know, play with me in this easy game to defeat them because I'll go to John 11:35 and it says, Jesus wept. I say, I'm going to interpret it, guys. I think what it means is he. Wept, he cried.

Am I right? If they say yes, I didn't need a church to interpret it. And if they say no, well, then they're missing what the scripture says. And I tell people: God is able to communicate his word to his people. He's a good communicator.

And what they want to say is: God fails to accurately represent His Word to us. We need a church to tell us what it really means. It's the air and it's their church. It's just arrogance. It's so well, well, yeah, and along those lines, it's like we serve Christ.

What do we do? When we talk to these guys, we go to the scriptures, the scriptures, the scriptures. They serve Satan, they go to men's words, men's words, the church fathers, the councils. They continue to go to, they go to infallible or fallible men who are sinners who just wrote stuff down because weren't inspired. We go to the inspired text that was inspired by the Holy Spirit by God through the apostles.

That's the big difference when it comes to the EO or the Roman Catholics or whatever cult, you know? That's right. Then they'll say, though, but that's your private interpretation. The Bible says don't do that in Timothy. And I say, I mean, Peter, I say, oh, but it says there are no, you know, private interpretations of prophecy.

Not just certain God. And I say, how do you know that these church fathers are the right ones? What authority do you have? Where's their lineage that you can say that they're true? How do you know?

They don't have good answers. They're just parrots repeating various things that their church teaches them. It's a gigantic cult. And it it's just bad news. You know, and I said when I was on that show, I said their their church is false because, one, it teaches a false gospel, two, has a false uh does not have apostolic authority, three, has a false priesthood, I think I mentioned has a false Eucharist, and five, promotes idolatry.

I said, man, I hit hard. And they didn't want to go through all those. They only wanted to go to this one. Is that one guy, just an arrogant. Erogen ortho bro who just tries to, you know, if you don't.

Yeah, or how about Peter? He preaches a sermon in Acts chapter 3. 3,000 people get saved.

Well, how could any of those people trust anything he said? He's just up there talking. That's right. Well, sometimes when people tell me it's just a matter of interpretation, when they say that I say to them things like, No, I'm not that good looking, but thanks for the compliment. And they go, What?

And I just keep quiet. They just say something else. Whatever they say, I interpret whatever I want it to be. And then I like I did it one time, and I go, What did you say about my wife? Like his kids, what are you talking about?

And when he asked the question I was talking about, and I say, no, I like pizza better than broccoli. Why? And they go, you're an idiot. I said, no, I'm just interpreting things like you said. It's just up for interpretation.

Or are you saying, though, that we can communicate, and it's not just ideas of interpretation? He says, you're being inconsistent. You know, yeah.

Well, yeah, and our foundation's built on the rock of Christ. Their foundation is built on the sand of the church fathers, you know? Yeah, I wonder if you could say mushy clay, mushy clay, mushy clay of tradition. The mushy of tradition. That's better.

Yeah, I like that. That's better. You know, it's like because we're confident in the Word of God. They're not, they can never know if they're right. In out?

That's right. On mushy clay. I like that mushy clay. Yeah. On tradition.

And how do you know which tradition is right? Our church tells you. How do you know the church is right? The Bible tells you it's our church. How do you know you're interpreting the Bible right?

Because the church tells us that we are. What? Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah.

Well, we keep sharing the truth. We keep spreading the truth and trying to rescue people from that cult of Eastern Orthodoxy. You get that right. It's a cult. It's a gigantic false religious cult.

Oh yeah, and they act, they behave like cultists too. And one of the things I here's the thing I'm going to ask you: do they show any patience, any love, any fruit of the Spirit? Generally, no. No no, they constantly interrupted you. They wouldn't let you talk.

They laughed. They mocked. They scoffed. They did what a lot of people do when I share the gospel with them on the streets. Roll their eyes.

You have not you don't know what you're talking about. And they had the most they had just so much arrogance. Like you say, they have a lot of arrogance. Like they know what's right, but they don't. Yeah.

Yep.

That's right, brother. You are highly intelligent. Don't tell your wife I said that. Yeah, wait, really quick, but Matt, who's making videos about who? Are you making videos where you're clipping them together, or are they making videos?

They are.

Well, I know Jay Dyer did it, a guy named Jay Dyer, and he took things out of context and put things together to make me look bad. And that's bearing false witness. Yeah, there's tons of after that video, they made a ton of them, you know, but you're not doing that because you serve Christ. That would dishonor the Lord. That's right.

And I'm sure what they did was they extracted only those areas where I wasn't pristinely perfect. And then they say, see how bad? And they ignore, I'm sure, the other areas where those guys blew it.

So that's just their hypocrisy. And it's something I've been dealing with. Yeah, 100%. Oh, yeah, they're hypocrisy. Like, I'm in Discord a lot, and I'll be talking with the guests, the EO and the RC, having good discussions usually, and they will interrupt constantly, and I'll say, please don't do that, you know.

And then, if I interrupt, because I get excited and interrupt, while the witnesses go, Matt, you just interrupted. I say, why don't you ever call them on those other guys? They never do. They never do because they're hypocrites. Yeah.

Lie in wait to devour. That's what the EO does. Yeah, they love it. Absolutely. That's right, buddy.

Yeah. Yes.

Alright, brother. I'll catch you later.

Alright man, sounds good.

Sounds good. Um That's it. All right, now we've got Jordan from New Mexico. We only have about a minute in the show, buddy. Let's go.

What do you got?

Okay. I just had a quick question. I had a question before, but I don't want to change my question. With the Eastern Orthodox, I heard your debate, and I know you talk to them more than I do, but I was just wondering if maybe this is something that I'm catching Even though they're in they go to the church fathers, even though the church fathers interpret it the same way that we do, but apparently that's not a problem. But The thing that I'm wondering is like they say that our identification of what the church is is heresy, but I don't see them using another way to identify the church.

They say it's the historical body of Christ. But when they're saying it's the historical body of Christ, it has to be able to speak apart from the people because the people are infallible, but the church isn't.

So the church has to be distinct from the people. Am I looking at this incorrectly, or do you follow the same example? You're in the right track. You're seeing their inconsistencies. Uh-huh.

Yeah, I just thought I'd bring that up to you. And I haven't heard an answer for it, but I didn't know if you could. Yeah, we can, and we don't have time because the music is starting about five or ten seconds. Call back tomorrow, and let's talk about that, okay? Let's do it.

Sound good, buddy?

Alright. All right. Hey folks, we'll be back tomorrow by God's grace and hope you enjoyed the show. May the Lord bless you. This EO thing is becoming more predominant and it's a necessity to address and refute because they're teaching false doctrines.

May the Lord bless you by His grace. Back on you tomorrow. We'll talk to you then. Have a great evening, everyone. God bless.

Another program powered by the Truth Network.