Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at carn.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick.

All right, buddy, welcome to the show. It's me, Match Slick. You're listening to Match Slick Live. If you want to give me a call, it's easy. Just dial 8772-072276.

Let's just jump right on the phone here. Let's get to Cameron from Idaho. Cameron, how you doing, buddy? Hey, Matt. I just wanted to call with something I've observed over the last year or so.

It seems as though many young men today are seeing the faulty insanity of leftist thoughts and how the hedonism is leading to the degradation of Western culture. Right. It seems in reaction to that, the same men are being ensnared from the opposite direction by organizations like Eastern Orthodoxy, And unfortunately, they don't seem to realize that they are being drawn in by a whitewashed sepulchre gilded with cultural conservative structure and pharisaical moralism.

So why would it be foolish and eternally dangerous to to join with Eastern Orthodoxy.

Okay, now are you saying this 'cause you listened to me yesterday? Yeah. Yeah. So, everybody, this is Cameron. He's a friend of mine.

I've known him. How long have we known each other? 10, 15 years now, I guess? I don't know. since late twenty fifteen.

Okay, so 10 years. And so, anyway, we did one of the Bible tours together. That was fun in Turkey, wasn't it? A lot of fun. Yeah.

In fact, we on that tour, we got to know a guy named Stavros that would kind of apply to this conversation. Yes, that's right. Why don't you go? We'll talk about this stuff, but go ahead. Tell us about Stavros and who he was.

Well, Stavros was our tour guide through Greece. And he has a really cool name because I think Stavros, what does that mean? Cross in Greek? Right. Stavros means cross, but yes, that's right.

Okay.

Well, that hi that was his name and um One of the most interesting parts that I remember about him was actually watching his face while you were giving devotion. A um While you were speaking out in front of a Greek Orthodox church, that he had just showed up. Yeah, and which city were you in? Remember that. I don't remember the name of the video.

Thessaloniki, but I know that that's where I got my video. Yeah. Thessalonite Niki. That's where I have my video of the grandparents and their grandchild. Right.

lifting them up to kiss the Yeah. I can't. Was it Mary? It was the coffin. Yeah.

Yeah, because we went into that church and smells and bells, gold and silver, and there were icons, candles, sepulchre. It was just super high church. And then there was a courtyard outside, and it was my turn to give a devotion.

So I spoke for 15 minutes or so. He's a great guy. His English is perfect. And he did not like what I was saying. That's what his face was saying.

That's right. Mm-hmm. That is right.

Well, man.

Okay.

Yeah, so I'm with you and uh the East Orthodox Church is a false church, teaches a false gospel, has a false priesthood and um and promotes idolatry. And so uh nobody should be going to it who's a true Christian. Right. What business has light to do with darkness? That's right.

So what are some examples of why they're a false church?

Well, because they tea pe teach a gospel of works that you have to uh Basically, you don't earn salvation. At one point, they'll teach salvation is by grace alone. But by faith alone, what they really mean is the faith that does works, and that you must participate in your sacramental system in order to have grace upon you. This is how you're saved by grace, saved by faith, by the things that you do, that God gives you to do, that you do them. And this is what makes you right with God.

And stuff like this. And then their priesthood is just not found in the New Testament. And this is a point that I'll be working on more and more as I get into discussing this with them. Here's from the Confession of Decithius from 1672, Decree 13. It's an official document from the Eastern Orthodox.

We believe a man to be not simply justified through faith alone, but through faith which works through love, that is to say, through faith and works. And we rather believe that it is not the correlative of faith, but the faith which is in us justified through works. And then decree 3 says, For thus scripture would be opposed to itself, since it promises the believer salvation through works.

So, I mean, that's just I can go on. But uh and Mogilla uh the the uh Confession of Megilla says, This is done in 1642. If we preserve or persevere with constancy in faith and good works, we shall finally become partakers of salvation and eternal life.

So you have to persevere with your faith and your good works in order to have eternal life.

So it's teaching a false gospel. Right there. Yeah. That's just one of the things. What are, I know you talked to a lot of those guys online, especially recently.

What are some of the most common responses that they have for you for a tax? They have on Christianity and how you respond to that.

Well, they say it's like all the false groups. You know, we're the true church. Salvation is found through us. We have the true prophet or the true prophetess, or we have a pedigree that goes back to the originals. And therefore, we, our church, gave you the Bible.

Our church authenticated the Bible. Our church has all the authority.

So you need to come in our doors to be saved. And this is the common attitude that Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Roman Catholics have, and the variations of those groups. And it extends over into cults as well, these kinds of techniques. But that's what they do. And they redefine the gospel.

They redefine the priesthood. Why don't I say they redefine it? They just don't believe in a New Testament priesthood. It's just their priesthood is not found in the Bible, in the New Testament covenant. It's just not there.

And then they promote idolatry. And when you know, when we were, you know, we went to Thessaloniki, we went to Corinth, we went to other places. I don't remember if you remember, we stopped, the bus stopped at one place, a side of the road, a little shop, and in the back they were doing an auction on icons. Do you remember that? You remember that at all?

Yeah, I I was standing there. Yeah. I have film of that. And well, they were just doing just bidding on icons of Mary and saints and things like this. And they're spending money on it.

It just Just so pagan. It was just so pagan. I wanted to say something, but you know, it wasn't a time or place. But it was a time, but that. No, it was a place, but not the time.

So, anyway, yeah, they. I'm working hard to expose the false gospel, the false priesthood, and the false. Idolatry that is promoted in both the Eastern Orthodox and the Roman Catholic churches.

So that's what I'm doing. I'm working it. Hey, by the way, you coming over tonight for the Bible study? 'Cause your dad and mom are coming over. If you make it great, if you don't, you don't have to do it.

I might be. It depends on when I get off work, and I might. I got a text from my wife about having to go pick up I like that play set. Possibly, but I don't know.

Okay, no sweat. And there you go.

So if you make it, you make it, you don't, you don't. But Ron's going to get tacos. I'm going to split the cost with them.

So we might have two new people coming.

Well, then I guess I'll go if it's for the tacos and not just giving them to you. That makes it worth it. All right, buddy. All right, Cameron. God bless, man.

Okay.

I'll talk to you later, hopefully today.

Okay.

So that's Cameron. I've known him for a long time. We did this tour together. Just would give a little kudos for him. I had an episode in Turkey where I had to go to an emergency, and my blood pressure was 191 over something like 132.

And he went with the tour guide. This is back in Turkey. We had a woman tour guide. And so he was there. We got three hours sleep that night when I got home.

So, and he was out witnessing using a phone translator and things like that. He's a great help. He's a great guy. He really is a good guy. He really is.

So there you go. Hey, let's get to Steve from Missouri. Steve, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, what's up?

Uh, just doing radio. You there? Yeah, just, you know, hanging in there, man. What do you got, buddy?

Well, I'm calling back because yesterday you told me to call back. to prove you wrong that I don't understand the true gospel. That's what you said.

Okay, well, let's get to what the gospel is. Let's make sure we're on the same track. What is the gospel? God became a man.

Okay.

prophesied in the Old Testament. Told to by Eve Incarnation, lived a sinless life, died on a cross, Rose again. Sits at the right hand of the Father. waiting for his physical return.

Okay, that's what it's defined as in 1 Corinthians 15.

Well, it's a good start.

Now, okay, well, if you asked me, so you asked me what I believed. I told you what the gospel is. I can go to First Commission. But you don't have to be concerned. You have to be combative?

No. I just said you came off about it to me yesterday. Dude, dude, stop, stop. What is with you? What is with you?

You insulted me. I'm a Christian. I'm born again.

Okay, hold on, hold on. Own your words, brother.

Okay, I'm gonna mute you.

So I have to get control of the conversation. The guy's being obstreperous, and I had to mute him, and he's being difficult, and it's not how we're supposed to be.

So I'm trying to talk with him, but you can tell he's being difficult.

Okay, okay.

Now. What's up? Is that a rule? Would you what is Seriously? Are you okay?

Yeah. Yeah. Go ahead. All right, so So the gospel. Is defined as the message of salvation through the life, death, and resurrection of Jesus.

And central to that message is the doctrine of justification by faith. That sinners are declared righteous before God solely and completely on their faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, what He did on the cross. Do you agree with that? You agree with that?

Now Listen. I'm yes, I'm a Protestant, Matt. I agree with this. I agree with substitutionary aton of it. I just asked if you agree.

The answer is yes. All right. Do you want to know why I was asking you about going and seeing if it was what your opinion was? I wasn't saying joining. I'm studying history.

I'm studying history, and as a Christian, I was interested.

Okay.

In the history.

Okay.

You talked about attending there. There you go. You talked about going there. Yes, you did. Yeah, just to yes, to the building, Matt.

To the building. Is it a sin to go to the building? Inside. Is it a sin? What is I don't believe what they believe.

I'm still a Christian. I'm not going to change myself. Would you calm down? If you can't calm down, I'm going to drop you. If you can't calm down and just talk normally, I'm going to drop you.

Okay, well, maybe you should re-listen to what you said yesterday. Look. I'm starting to lose patience.

Okay, I'd warned him. I just dropped him. He's being difficult and he's not cooperative. And so we just have to move on. And he forfeited that opportunity to be able to have a polite conversation about things.

He was accusatory in his tone, his attitude, and we're just not going to put up with it. Let's get to Jermaine from California. Jermaine, welcome. You're on the air. Mm-hmm.

Hey, Matt, um I don't know if my question will be as exciting as the previous call, but I uh Yeah, I want to discuss Second Kings. Chapter 2, 8 to 14, where hold on a sec, we got a break. 2 Kings, what? 2 Kings 2. True through eighty.

2, 2, 3, 18. All right, I'll look at it during the break. Hold on, okay, man. We'll be right back, everybody. All right, hey, folks, please stay tuned.

You're right back after. At least messages. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey, everybody, welcome back to the show.

If you want to give me a call, you can. 877-2-07-2276. Let's get back on with Postman. Polite Jermaine. Hey, Jermaine, welcome, man.

You're back on. Oh my god, it's dog. Yeah, um just wanted to discuss Second Kings, uh, and that birth eight through fourteen. Uh the reason that was uh The reason this came up was I have a relative who's a little bit on the charismatic side. He he has a good heart, but he He seems to think that there's still such thing as a mantle of authority like Elijah Simbancoly did when he he passed the uh mantle on to Elisha, but I had to counter it in the New Testament.

I don't see any mantles, and I see there's an order, it's a leadership. I just kind of wanted to hear you develop some thought on this because I see actually, he's not alone. A lot of believers believe. in taking some of those Old Testament stories and and they duplicate them in their ministry.

Okay.

Yes. Ah, this is a tough one. There are principles in the Old Testament if you follow, there's blessings that come with them. But they're not it's not because necessarily that God promises you to do something that you do ABC and you get the results D E F. Mm-hmm.

And a lot of times, the positive confession people use it as a Um If you do it, this is the guaranteed result. And this is a form of sorcery. And we've got to be careful not to say that all of what they do is sorcery, but sorcery is saying a formula in the and doing something in a certain pattern here, and you get a guaranteed spiritual result. That's sorcery.

So they have to be careful of that.

Now, it doesn't mean all of them are doing that, but they do very frequently take things out of their context in the Old Testament. And so when Elijah gave to Elisha the mantle. And you know, when Elijah struck the water with it, it parted. When Elisha struck the pot the water with the river, it parted as well, signifying that the authority and anointing had been transferred to him. Mm-hmm.

Well, this was in the context of Elijah and Elisha. There is nothing in there that says We have a passed down mantle of authority. That is to stretch the context beyond its intention, beyond its description. And they take what's called a descriptive area and they make it prescriptive. Descriptive means it's describing what happens, and what they'll do is they'll say, that from now on means it's how it's always supposed to be happening.

And not so.

So You know, we could say Peter walked on water. That means we could all walk on water.

So we have these problems, and the positive confession movement, what they'll do. very often, is take verses out of context, Misapply them. twist them. And then use them to tickle the ears of people so that those people then. Yeah.

want to follow them more. And this is just simply one of the issues, the areas here. In fact, I got to put a note in because. I'll tell you why. They will oh yeah, tickle the ears.

I'm gonna put this note. The reason I'm Stopping here for a second is because literally I have on my computer in an article I'm working on what are some similarities to cult techniques and secular leaders. Yeah. And One of them is just tickling the ears. And so I have other things, you know, charismatic persons, psychological, social manipulation, things like this.

But anyway, so a lot of the positive confession people will employ some of these tactics. I'm not saying they're all maliciously intending to. A lot of them are just good at what they do. And I remember, I have done a lot of public speaking in front of groups. And what's really interesting in the dynamic.

Is that you can influence the group because a group mentality is different than an individual mentality. And if they're all focusing on you and you're standing up there, you can manipulate them depending on what you want to do.

Now, I never do that, of course, unless it's to make them laugh. You know, and I said something stupid on purpose. But it's a very serious thing. There are people who are very aware of this, and they will do certain things in certain ways to get certain responses.

Now, some of it can be bad and some can be good. You know, like I love the black community when they do that and they say, Can I get an amen? And the congregation goes and goes, Amen. I love that. That's fine.

But there are people who will do things manipulatively. And they don't let people know they're doing this.

So, this is kind of the stuff that the positive confession people can do. And one of the ways to justify it, for example, is: well, you go to 2 Kings, and what you find here in 2 Kings is Elijah and Elijah and Elisha. And notice the mantle of authority was passed down. We are of the King Jesus. He has the authority, and we have His authority on earth, just like that mantle from Elijah.

It sounds good. Can I get an amen for that? You know, amen, that's right, the authority. And so, this is a kind of exegetical manipulation that people do. And so.

People are s they are susceptible to this kind of thing. And the way to beat this, to get out of it, is to have your friend look at the context. is the context justifying applying it to us today? It's a question. And he has to justify that it is.

Because if it says, if God says this is to you and your people and all who follow the true God, now you've got some to work with. But if it just says from Elisha, or excuse me, Elijah to Elisha, then that's who it's for. And you can't apply it to us. You see? Right.

You know, I think the problem is a lot of these people they have good parts, but they're not. As biblically sound as they are kind of making people think they are. Right. The whole mantle thing was obviously. it was symbolic and it it happened there.

I don't see it Most anywhere else in scripture so But he just as you said, he's a good person, but he actually believes that there's a suspect as a mantle of authority. He asked where we disagreed as he believed it existed within families. and would pass down from person to person like a secession and That's another topic.

Well, you know, it's it it kind of lends Credibility of what you're saying, or not, kind of, it does, because I've seen this occur when. when families own churches or own the church building. And then they have a revelation to pass it on to the their uh spouse or their children who may not even be prepared, but then it starts to look more like a business at that point.

So that's we have to be careful.

Well, you know, I I like to say that if you want to mess something up, you just need two things. people and time. And it's going to happen. Even among us, Calvinists believe it. I hope the Calvinists didn't hear me say that, but it's true.

Yeah. And so, you know, we've just got to be careful, but the solution to this is just good exegesis. And it's something I like to teach: exegetical principles. It doesn't mean I have it all down perfectly, but I can teach the principles for proper understanding of Scripture and contextual examination. Our discussions reminded me of a conversation I had with a friend of mine who was also name it and claim it, blab it and grab it guy.

And in Exodus, let's see, I think it's Exodus 4:11. It's been a long time since I cop I've referenced this. Let's see if I remember the verse right. Yep. Moses is talking.

Oh, we'll have a good break. He's talking to God, and I'll tell you the conversation afterwards and then we'll move on. But it's relative, it's related to this. Anyway, hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned.

If you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your call at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everybody, welcome back to the show.

Let's get back on with Jermaine from Elijah from California. Still there, buddy? Eight.

Well yes I am.

Alright. Yeah, the idea of brainwashing, here's an example of it, uh that the these guys will do to people and the manipulators. And so I had this friend and and uh he believed that you were never supposed to be uh sick. And I said, Well, would God ever make anybody sick in any way? And he said, Of course not.

She would never do that.

So I took him to Exodus 4:11, where God is talking to Moses. Moses was saying, Look, I can't go talk to Pharaoh, I'm not a good speaker. The LORD said to him, Who has made man's mouth, or who makes him mute, or deaf, or singing, or blind? Is it not I, the LORD? And I Had this guy read this verse, then I can still see him sitting on his couch in his living room.

for a full minute. just sitting there staring at it, and he finally said to me, I don't know what it means, but it doesn't mean what it says. Never forgot that.

So it's an example of those who will not submit their ideas to Scripture. And so you sound like your friend has the same kind of a problem. Because if I were talking on the radio and he were to bring the mantle of Elijah thing, I'd say, where does it say it's passed down to anybody else? You know, and and they won't build a deal with it. Doesn't say it.

So, you know Well, it's like you were in our room. Actually, that we discussed that very Chapter or verse because he had believed that people who were you know, who our special deeds were blind or whoever was a form of generational curse. And I actually took him to that same verse and And I said, No, no, that's you know, you're going against the words of Christ, and I have to believe him over you. Yeah. Don't try to figure God out.

Just just read the text for what it says. Right. And did he believe what it says when God says he's what he does? He did virtually what you said, where he said, well, maybe that was for that guy, but.

Okay.

You know, that doesn't mean there's no generational curse.

Well, then he's got to find generational curses because God does talk about them. in Exodus twenty. All right, he says you'll not worship them or serve them, but he says he will visit the iniquity of the fathers on the children of the third and fourth generations, those who hate me.

So the curse of God is on a federal headship relationship there to the third and fourth generation, but those who hate them.

So you ask them: these people hate God? And who was the third or fourth generation? If anyone go to Exodus 20 and use that, who's the one in the third or fourth generation that did this? That's the best he's got. And there's some merit to it, but we've got to be very careful how it's applied.

All right. Okay.

All right. Yeah, thank thank you, Messie. I I I know he would do well with a good dose of uh domestic wide. It's actually long, but No, we'll just keep crying for it. Yeah, that's right.

Keep praying, buddy. That's right. All right, man. All right, well, thank you very much, man. Appreciate your judgment.

God bless you, man. You too, brother. God bless. All right, now let's get to Anthony from Kansas. Anthony, welcome.

You are on air.

Well, how are you doing, Matt? Oh, hanging in there. Hanging in there, man. What do you got? Yeah, me too.

First of all, I wondered what your thoughts were on. open theism. The reason I'm asking is that There was a guy online. I was watching his podcast. He was talking about open deism, and I put in the comments section.

Um I hope I'm describing open theism correctly. Open theism is the idea that God doesn't know the future exhaustively. Correct. And um and I said If God does not know everything in advance, as or And I put in the comment section: if God does not, God does not know the future. everything in advance or it's is a limited guide.

Right. And the person and the person went back and said Your your limit you're It says that I appreciate your comment, but you're putting limits on God.

Okay.

And this is what he said pretty much. to see that a guy that Doesn't know everything in advance of a limited God. actually limits God. You see what I'm saying? Yeah, it's a it's a play on words is all it is.

It's he's not being logical. Right. So here's Rumpig, he's not being logical. Right, he's failing miserably.

So you're right, it limits God because classic omniscience of God, known in the Bible, is that He knows all things, He does not learn. And that's one of the things I'll ask an open theist: does God learn?

Well, they have to say yes, because in open theism, God doesn't know the future exhaustively because he can't know free will choices. Because if he knows free will choices, then you can't be free to make a different choice. It's faulty logic on their part. They're not good thinkers. I'm sorry, but they're not.

They're not good critical thinkers.

So God does not have exhaustive knowledge, and God can learn. And one of the things, in one of my debates with the open thesis, I say, can God make mistakes? In your view. Because if he will expect one thing, something else happens, and he made a mistake, didn't he?

So now you have your view of God. God's learning. He makes mistakes. And I have a list of things. What does the God of open theism say when something doesn't go right?

Don't Oops. Oh, let's go to plan B. Oh, let's go to plan C. You know, yeah, we don't cuss.

Okay.

So, uh,. And it also makes God reactionary.

So that God learns what happens, and then he makes a. A decision based on what occurs. In human free will choices that are then actualized. And this means then that God is reactionary.

Now here's a question.

Okay.

How would God know what Things not to know because some open theists they say that God knows your free will choices that you maybe can't know them. How would God knows that you can't make, or that He, how is it that God can know which areas of knowledge there are based on your free will choices that you're going to make? He has to know when you can make a free will choice in order not to know it. And this is a conundrum because he has to know enough to know not to know something.

Now, if they say he's incapable of knowing something. Then we have another problem that comes up. And I asked them, Did Jesus bear our sins and his body on the cross? 1 Peter 2:24? And they say, Yes.

Say, okay. Said, how did he know which sins to impute to to Jesus two thousand years ago, when free willed creatures hadn't yet been born. What specific sins is God imputing to these know what their free will choices are going to be? And this is a humongous problem. for them.

So there's several uh there's several problems, okay?

Okay.

Nec another question. I've talked to you about this before, but I'm a I was a DJ for many years. I love music and a very eclectic musical taste, ranging from pop and jazz and soul, R and D, gospel, even a little bit of classical and Um I'm developing tastes for jazz and rock and roll and roll. I don't hate rock and roll. I like a big Beatles song, not all of them, but It's always there.

What about Akrisha enjoying secular music. Should they listen only to gospel or Christian music or? I listen to secular music a lot. And uh I love Zeppelin and I love corn, believe it or not. And part of it's because I'm autistic and I have tinnitus, 80 decibel ringing in both ears, and a heavy bass.

Is calming because I'm constantly for thirty years now, more than thirty years, maybe. About 35 years, I've had 80 decibel ringing in both ears. And I have $6,000 hearing aids that try and help that. And it's really a problem I have all the time.

So I listen to heavy metal or just bass sounds, like some of the stuff from corn coming undone. It's soothing. And I'll listen to it for that reason.

So for me, it helps. And some people, you know, they want to just condemn, you can't listen to it.

Well, why not? You know, as long as it's not influencing you. And if something's going to influence you, you can get rid of it. And that's what I do. If there's something negative in it, that I'm thinking, okay, I'm not there.

But.

So, you know, music is something that we need to be careful about because it can profoundly influence you. But this idea that a Christian can't listen to secular music is simply not. good because secular music includes um Mozart. Uh and and Brahms.

So you can't listen to that? Uh you know so It doesn't make any sense. It would also It would also include the national anthems. That's right. The trial or um Or um It would include the national anthem.

Happy birthday to you. How about a land is your land? Or how about a phone ring tone? Phone ring. People have tones.

Not a ring, it's a tone. It's a music. Hey, sorry.

So, where do they draw the line? You got to be careful of what you listen to. Be careful what you listen to. That's what I say. But people are are surprised when I tell them what I like to listen to.

So uh but it's okay, it doesn't affect me. And uh then sometimes I'll just put on praise music and oh. Ah, just bathed in the presence of a beauty, you know. Yeah, I do. In my years in Christian radio, I was in Christian radio for 19 years, you know.

So I had quite a collection of Christian music, you know, everything. Oh, yeah, I used to listen to Keith Green all the time. Oh, yeah. We gotta go though, okay, buddy? Try undercover.

If you ever heard of them, undercover was good. Like a punk band. They're Christian punk undercover. Hey, gotta go, buddy. Talk to you later, man.

Okay, okay.

Hey, folks, be right back after these messages. It's Matt Slick Live, taking a call at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everybody, welcome back to the show. Let's get on with Mike from Ohio.

Hey, Mike, welcome. You're on the air. Hey, Matt, we spoke about a year prior to the election, and I was concerned with your endorsement of Trump at the time. And you did continue, in my opinion, to campaign for him for the better part of that year. on your show.

I was curious in light of all of the recent events, things that have been disappointing to, I believe, everybody. Uh do you Do you have any regrets for campaigning for him or what I believe might be misleading or dare say justify it the wicked?

So then, you mean the bad things like the borders closed and tariffs are working and prices are coming down, the stock market's up, employment's the lowest in 50 years, 6 million jobs have been added, wages are increasing. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. I wasn't done talking. Tax reform has occurred. Energy independence is on the rise.

Wages are increasing. The interest rate is going to come down. I'm sorry, so w are those the things that were bad? That you're talking about?

Well, I believe that a lot of his campaign and a lot of his promises were to release the list. And you know what I'm talking about. And for him to try to dismiss it and his campaign to try to. Don't say you know what I'm talking about. What are you talking about?

Oh, okay.

Well, I'm so is your intention here to try to pick a part that there was never any promise that we would get to the bottom of the Epstein list and he was going to hold them accountable and he was going to release it? I don't know if there was or wasn't. Was that not something that was. I don't know if there was or wasn't. I don't know.

I don't know if that's the case or not.

Well, I would like to remind you that he that justifieth the wicked. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. Focus.

Okay.

I said I don't know if he made the promise or not made the promise.

So, okay. I feel like as hard as you've campaigned for him, this is something that you should. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. You sound to me like a cultist because you're not reacting to what I'm saying. You seem to just have an agenda, and it doesn't matter what I say, you ignore it and go on to your agenda.

Now, I'm not saying Trump's perfect. I'm not saying that Trump is perfect. And yeah, and God raised up Cyrus, who was an evil man, to do what God wanted.

So you might be fighting against God. Who knows? But the thing I'm saying is: look, I listed to you several things that are much better since he's been in office.

Now you didn't comment about anything there. You went to the Epstein files and I said, I don't know what he promised. And honestly, I don't. I don't know if he did or didn't promise anything. If he did, he needs to fulfill his promise.

If he didn't, well then you're just blowing smoke. But I don't know what the actual case is.

So let me ask you. I mean, he's not a perfect guy. Have you personally gone through or poured through any of the information about this? About have you personally or you haven't read anything about what Pam Bondi has claimed in the last So you've had you haven't watched any news media. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

Look, you make a lot of mistakes. You said, have you read what Pam Bondi said? And I said, no. Oh, you haven't heard anything? It's not the same thing.

You keep switching things in one big, long question. Fair enough. That's fair. What's wrong with you? Are you aware of the question?

Why do you hate Trump so much? I mean, just curious. Why do you hate him so much? No, that the thing is, I don't hate him so much. My criticism of you at that time was that I felt like you had gone all in on a Christian platform as if Trump was one of us.

And you actually accused me on that call of being ma. I'm not done talking, sir. Uh they I I stopped for you. You would accuse me of being MAMBY PAMBY because I had suggested praying. And you said we can't just be all Mamby-Pamby pray about Christians.

And then you first did. I promise that that's what was said. Whatever. Government censors, we have to vote. And you do call people Mamby Pamby when you feel threatened, and you say that we sound like oh my goodness.

I'm muting the guy because now he's just going on a tirade. He can come back on here in a second. He calls a Mamby Pamby when they're cornering me or stuff like that. That's not true. And I think he's just got TDS, you know, Trump derangement syndrome.

I've asked him what's so bad about him. I mean, he's not a perfect guy. He's not. But I'm going to put him back on. I'm going to ask him, what's he done that so bad?

I can't verify or not verify the Epstein files. I'm sorry. I haven't read all this stuff. And I don't know what's going on with Pam Bondi. I just don't.

I'm taking care of a sick wife. I'm trying to manage a business. I'm trying to manage ministry. I'm trying to manage household affairs. We've got to try and get it selling our house.

I've had to do all kinds of stuff. I'm sorry. And I spend time watching news, but not like I watch other stuff when I finally get down to have time to relax.

So. Mike, um Why don't you Tell me uh why you d dislike him so much. Can I say first that I do continue to pray for you, your wife, her healing, your ministry, and your work? I do respect very much what you do. Thank you.

Which is why I took such an issue with your support of this man. What okay. I'm going to ask you again, what is it that's so bad about him? List it out one thing at a time. The last time I attempted to do that, I was shut down, and I don't feel like I should do that.

Dude, I'm giving you an opportunity when I say I was shut down. I'm not giving excuses, Matt. There are certain things that were taken off the air. I was said there are things you can and cannot say on the radio.

Well, you've got to be careful. That's what you said to me after. Oh, I was. Hold on, hold on, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. Stop.

Look, just try and say things in a polite way. Assume that a 12-year-old is listening. And then just, you know, you can say things.

Okay.

Are you not going to back it up? Sure. I believe that there were many promises made in the first campaign. That were, I was a supporter of Trump in 15 and 16.

Okay, you're not listening. I fell out and I fell out in 17 and a half or 18. Look, look, look, I've asked you to listen to. I was trying to get back and list.

Okay, I'm done with him.

So I just hung up on him. And so here's the thing: I gave him several chances. Just give me a list. And then he goes on to something else. I just want a list.

I'm not saying Trump's perfect, folks.

Okay, just whatever. He makes his mistakes. But we're a lot better off than we would have been under that moron Kamala. or Kamala, however it was to pronounce her name. The laughing fit of a a waste of air, in my opinion.

She's a commie socialist and Ask my opinion. If you don't like it, that's okay. You know, I'm not I don't answer to you. Answer to God. And I'm just voting for the least of all the bad ones.

So if you don't like it, turn the channel. I don't care. But if this guy's going to come on and he wants to argue, then fine. Give me a list. And he couldn't give me a list.

Shit. Ugh. They're quite, yeah, whanny. Let's go to Alberto. Hey, Alberto, welcome.

You're on the air. Oh, that was easy, but I thought that pain there. Alberto. You there? Hello, okay.

Yes, okay, yes, yes, I'm here, sir.

Okay, you don't have some that verse where they say, if indeed you continue in the faith.

Some preachers said that's an affirmation, it's not a threat. I heard Charles Dennis say that other preachers don't agree with that. That's an affirmation. Yeah, it could be, yeah, there's some that are descriptive. If you're doing this, you're continuing to faith, then you'll be saved.

It doesn't mean that you, the corollary is not necessarily the opposite in the sense that it means that if you don't continue, you're going to be damned because it's up to you to keep yourself right with God. We've got to be careful. And so, yeah, some things are descriptive, not prescriptive. Right. What does it mean for scripted script?

What do you mean by terminology? What do you mean by the position of them to?

So for example, Judas sold Jesus for 30 pieces of silver. That's descriptive. God is not prescribing that as a good action. It's just described as something that happened. He's not prescribing anybody else do that.

Some people could then say, like, we're talking to this guy about Elijah and Elijah and Elisha, and the mantle. It's descriptive. He gave the mantle to Elisha. It's not prescriptive that we now have the mantle of authority passed down for all children of God.

Okay.

The difference of descriptive versus prescriptive. All right. Mhm. Yeah, the same thing I also I heard else also too in the book of Revelation also. And say it's uh uh uh uh that's about to the same The wor uh verse they're referring to also is not a it's an affirmation, it's not a threat.

I read it a while back. Yeah, you can do it in the faith. Yeah. Some people will take that and interpret it. It's like saying, for example, your name will not be blotted out of the book of life.

And it could be descriptive, not prescriptive.

Well, that means your name can be blotted out. Not necessarily. It says it will not be blotted out. It means it can't. It will not be.

So people can interpret things in different ways depending on their perspective to begin with. Yes, I hear preachers, they say it could be blotted out. He says that. Are that everybody's the comprehension teach that the everybody's names in the already in the book of life.

some pictures, photo pictures that tease that. We we think about that. If the book of life is defined as that which is written from the foundation of the world, then names cannot be removed from it. If the book of life is referenced to those who are physically alive and have died, and names are removed, because that's one of the things that was in the cities at the elders of the city would sometimes bring the book of life or census record of people who were there. And they would have trials, they'd have legal questions answered, and they would open up these books.

And if someone died, it crossed their name out. It doesn't mean the person didn't exist anymore. It had to do with the relationship of life in that community.

So these are just different options that this stuff can be in.

Okay.

Yeah, but what about the Lamb's book of life? Not just the book of life, the Lamb's book of life. Everybody, everything within the land book of life told us. Yeah, and that would seem to be the same way. That would seem to be that it's the eternal book of life, and that the Lamb's Book of Life is that book that has to do with Jesus and the election of opposing Christ, and you'll not be blotted out.

If you continue in the faith, you'll not be blotted out.

Well, that's true. You'll never be blotted out if you continue in the faith. But you continue in the faith because God is the one who perfects it in you. Philippians 1:6 and Philippians 2:12 and 13. He will never leave you or forsake you.

Hebrews 13:5.

So, you see? Yeah, but but when you say it it when you say what you mean when you say if you continue, it's like a work base. Salvation, in a sense. You know what I'm saying? If you continue in the faith, what about you don't continue in the faith?

Yeah, and some people will say, therefore, it's completely up to you and your wisdom and your ability. And that's what I ask them. I say, Are you then saying that you keep yourself right with the infinitely holy God by your goodness? That's when I start asking those questions. And then, you know, I'm talking recently, believe it or not, I talked, this reminds me of a guy who's a sinless perfectionist.

He said he hasn't sinned in two years. In two years, you know, and I'm like, wow. I said, well, that's a sin of pride.

So I'm a young guy in my job. He said he told me he seemed to resilient sin all day. He didn't sin all day. He talked years ago, I was working my job. He said, He hasn't sinned all day.

The Bible says he who has no sin is a liar. Make that a liar, right? Yeah, but you know, first John 1:7 through 8. But we've got to be careful how we apply that. But still, yeah, we kind of shift topics a little bit, but it's what you said was reminding me of this kind of attitude and issues.

But yeah, and I said to him, I said, so let me get this straight. You keep the law, because the law, the moral aspect of the law, not committing adultery, not being angry, loving God with all your heart, soul, mind, and body, all of this. You do this on the same level as Jesus because He's the standard of perfection, not you. And he said, Yes. Woohoo!

I mean, what do you do at that point? Wow, man, let me get some water. I want to see you walk on it. Oh, there's the music.

Sorry, we're out of time, Alberto. All right, butter. God bless, man.

All right. Hey folks, we're out of time tomorrow, tomorrow, yeah, tomorrow's Friday, and by God's grace, we'll be back on the air then.

Well talk to you then have a great evening. I hope you enjoyed the show And uh God bless them. Talk to you tomorrow. Another program powered by the Truth Network.