This is the Truth Network. This is the Truth Network. Kingdom Pursuits, where you hear from ordinary people instilled with an extraordinary passion. Together we explore the stories of men and women who take what they love and let God turn their passion into kingdom pursuits.
Now, live from the Truth Booth, your host, Robbie Dilmore. Welcome to Kingdom Pursuits. I'm not Robbie Dilmore. I guess you realize that by now, but Robbie is on a men's retreat for masculine journey. Hope he's having a great time this weekend.
And I'm looking forward to hearing how God has worked this weekend with that group of men because there's always some great stories that come back from that. Um I'm filling in. Uh been here first hour with uh Christian Carga Radio, and whenever Robbie's away, I kind of step in here and help him out. This morning, I tell you what, I'm excited about the show because I've got. Two people that I know very well, one that I don't know as well, but I'm interested in learning more about him.
And that is Dan and Mary K. Wrath with Wrath Realty or the I guess that am I did I say it right, I know it's Close enough. Close enough. Close enough. It's Howard, Hannah, Alan Tate, Realty, and we're the Dan Rath team.
Okay. Our family serving your family. All right. And Wade Arnold, who is. Wade, give me a little bit of background with you.
I know you're an author and also a. Coach. I am a coach. That's right.
Well, Dr. Wade Arnold, I call myself the marriage mentor for Christian couples, and I'm glad to be here.
So, thanks for having me. All right, like I said, it's going to be an exciting show because I think what we're going to also want to dive into is. Just how we you know Kingdom Pursuit is taking your passion and serving God with it and where God uses it. And I think a lot of times in business, And also in our personal life, either in being ministers, if it's being realtors, being guy that runs a body shop, a tow-in service. we have opportunities and sometimes we think that Even as a minister, sometimes we forget That it's a calling And that God wants us to use us in a special way.
Sometimes we can get wrapped up into being just about us. And so this morning, I want to kind of dive into that, just how God is using you in the area that He's placed you in. And to start with is a sat down with Dan and Mary Kay. I know I know him pretty well. And I said, I don't know that I've ever asked this on air.
What brought you to Christ? And I said, you've got to do it quick. And I know when I looked over here at Mary Kay, I knew this was not going to be an easy task.
Okay. Thanks. Um I can get to the point. Unfortunately, my mother passed away when I was only nineteen years old, and I floundered. For three or four years, I would say I call those my wild child years.
I got a little out of control. I don't know if I felt like I was trying to make up for lost time or what. But anyway, in that process, on a blind date Um Pete Miller's family. introduced me To the difference between just knowing about God. and knowing God, and that there was a real difference.
and they took me under their wings and really um began to teach me and led me to a deep deep relationship with Christ's teacher, he really changed me quickly. Hmm. Cool. Dangerous up to bat.
Well, first, I have to say, it's not lost on me that you have a Christian marriage counselor here with married real estate agents. We certainly have our battles as well. Mine goes back to college, grew up in the Midwest, and went to school in Wisconsin. And uh the old uh Fellowship of Christian Athletes and Campus Crusade for Christ. was was my entry level, just with the people that I was with and something that sounded very interesting and exciting.
And I went to that and went to a lot of the different conferences that they held over the Christmas period at those times. And so I got converted at that time. That was I guess I always grew up close to the Armenian church was, you know, as a child. And so you got a good feel for what religion was about. But like Mary Kay said, this was more about a personal relationship.
All right. Well, I came to know Christ at a backyard Bible club in Nacogdoches, Texas. And that was fourth grade.
So I didn't, you know, I knew I had a fourth grade faith. And then when I got to high school, I had a wonderful youth minister, Jeff Powell.
So shout out to Jeff. He just moved to Charlotte, by the way. I can't wait to go see him. And he started discipling me, getting into scripture, memorizing scripture, and my faith just kind of grew.
Now, I had my wandering period as well in college or just after college. But the Lord brought me back, and it was, it's, I've been pursuing. Christ, pursuing ministry, pursuing helping others ever since. Cool. I know y'all didn't want that question, but I think it sort of gives the foundation of where we're going to move from next.
And also, this is a call-in show. Let me give you that. Uh number again is Eight six six three four eight seven eight eight four. Um When we are doing our discussion, if a question comes up, and one of the questions I want to take opportunity to have time to. Bands.
If you have a question on selling a house or buying a house or just things to do to prep and everything, now's the time to call in and I I've got two experts in front of me who can help you out in that. Also, if there's a, you know, Question where is where can I get in touch with weight about coming to my church or coming to my organization to speak. I mean, or you have a question, marriage stuff and everything. And I think one thing when I was sitting here and and decided I was going to have both of y'all All three of you in here. Because I thought about one thing.
Talking about marriage struggles and stuff, and I look back on Wade's website and talks about some of the things that made me think a little bit about how that relates to. the realty end of it, 'cause I think so many times from my experience, and this is kind of from the outside looking in, Where, because of some of my employees, I have a lot of younger employees, and I see so many struggles they have when they get early on in their marriage. dumb financial moves. And the biggest financial dumb move I see them making is two things. They buy a car they can't afford.
They buy a house they can't afford. And it seems like. Their marriage is on the rocks. As soon as the first month comes, they realize I can't. We can't function.
It just isn't going to work. And then all of a sudden, it becomes that inner fighting going on. Because, I mean, I've talked to multiple. Times of my employees and people that are in the industry, that I'm connected with a lot of the towers and body shop stuff, and somehow they'll always show up at my Shop and want to talk when they're struggling, and which is good. I mean, I'm glad they do that.
The simple things that you would think was simple. Because I know when I was growing up, and I'm going to ask. Dan and Mary Kay, how if if this is a term that's even used anymore. starter home. I don't know that people buy starter homes anymore, young couples.
I think they're looking for that dream house. I Think that, well, first of all, starter home is still a term that's used. But I do agree with your analysis that young people want instantly what their parents have. and they don't think about the journey it took their parents to get what they have. I was talking to a young couple on the way over here by phone and the exact thing you're talking about.
And I said, you know, I'm not an accountant. but I can set up a simple budget for you, make a list of your expenses, and a list of your income. and the income has to be greater than the out go. And you don't want to be house poor, where all of your money and all of your thought process is going on. How can I pay my mortgage payment?
How can I pay for this house? It's not just buying the house, it's the upkeep of the house and everything that comes after that. Starter homes used to relate to a price range, and it seemed more affordable. In the real estate business, mortgage business, they'll generally counsel you to spend no more than about a third of your income. on a house payment, rent, whichever it is.
Because of the market, because of the economy, it's getting harder and harder to do.
So even when people have an intent, we'd like to start small or at least least expensive, it's difficult to do. Our daughter is buying a house in Asheville right now, and it took quite a while to find something that was affordable and livable.
So it's tough. It can be done, but as Mary Kay said, it's all about budget. And that's all about getting the right people to work with you. Again, this is a calling show. Give us a call if anything interests you, and we'll be right back in just a moment.
You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits. I'm Jerry Mathis, Raised Body Shop from Records Service here in the studio with The rats and Wade Arnold. We're going to. Let me see.
I've got a caller I'm going to go ahead and take care of before I turn the mic over to Wade to get a little bit of. talk about his book and also a little bit about what is Coach counseling.
Okay. Carrie from Clemens, what can we help you with? Hello. I own a home in Clemens that I'm interested in selling, and I'd like to buy something else. I'm wondering how do I get a hold of Dan and Mary Kay.
Well, thank you for asking, Carrie. We can tell you how to get a hold of us. I think whatever your preference is. Um Dan's phone number is three three six. 577-1121.
If you prefer to communicate regarding, I mean, through email, I would say the best part. Or easiest way is dan.rath. And Wrath is R-A-T-H. Don't put a W on it. at allentate dot com.
So it's dan dot wrath at allentate dot com and his number is three three six five seven seven eleven twenty one. Or you can call me if you prefer to talk to a female, three three six six two four one three seven five. We like to meet at our office and have a session with people to find out what their needs are. And from there we can go and plug them into mortgage counselors or different people, learn more about them.
So it's really a step-by-step process. And if you're familiar with Winston-Salem, our office is in that Krispy Krem building that's located just off the highway near Thruway.
Okay, perfect. Thank you so much for this information. I'm going to give you a call one day this week. Thank you. Thanks.
Thank you. All right, Wade. Oh, go ahead, Carrie. Do you have something else? Nope, that's it.
Bye-bye.
Well, hey, tell me a little bit about us. You got a book, and I've heard it is on the bestseller list.
Well, it's not on the bestseller list anymore, but it was. It was. I'm very proud of that. Yeah, the name of the book is Flourishing in Christian Marriage. And really what it is, is a description of um Four different attachment styles that we have.
And so there's 10 combinations of those. And it just goes through how I would relate to the different types.
So the most common type is what I call distance keepers who frequently marry closeness seekers. And so, when people seek safety or connection, they do it in different ways. And often they're misaligned. And that's what causes a lot of the conflicts. Like we were talking earlier about.
Getting in over your head with a car or a house, it's often because they're miscommunicating based on a really predictable pattern. I would love to talk more with early marriage or premarriage folks so that they know what these patterns are and they can choose to act differently about it. Yeah, so that's what that book is about. I have another one coming out here pretty quickly. And maybe we'll talk about that another time, but it's called Should We Stay Together?
So after Infidelity, what do you do? What's the next steps after that? Oh, hot button topics. I'll tell you that, that's for sure.
Well, uh What would okay, I was interested when you just said you'd like to talk to him before marriage. I think that's key. What would be a path to be able to do that? And the thing is, there's a lot of And I think the church is really important on this because there's plenty of people that say they're counselors, they're not going to give you. Biblical truths in that.
And also, there's probably because this was mentioned. Earlier, when we talked before went on air, there's people that hang the placard on the wall that says Christian Council and that. has forsaken the Christian part of it. Yeah.
So it's very when I was younger in the field, and I've been doing this for about well 15 years, and I would refer to who I thought was a good Therapist. And I've stopped doing that if they're not Christians. I don't refer to non-Christians anymore simply because they do not understand the Christian worldview. Our goal as believers is to become like Christ, and therapy is a part of that process or coaching, which is what I do mostly now. And so, what I want to make sure is the people that I work with and that I refer my clients to are going to help them become more like Christ.
And there are a lot of people that. who are Christians. I don't question their faith at all. But by and large, we are trained in secular training programs, and they have never made the connection between their practice and their faith. and how to integrate that.
And so I'm very grateful to have gone to seminary prior to getting my doctoral degree.
So that I was able to make all of the, well, I say all. I was able to make connections between my faith and my practice when I help people. It's very important, it's critical that we as believers go to people who truly are pursuing Christ and can help others, not only with their mental and emotional health and develop their relationships, but do that in a Christlike biblical way. Yeah, absolutely. I think and probably one of the biggest downfalls for people doing that is the availability of the media.
Counseling, getting advice on marriage and anything like that. And also, same thing, I mean, every business is affected by that. I think there's a harm in that because I think you'd even agree in realty. There it is. You get a lot of misinformation because people count on devices instead of Experts and also experts that have a Christian worldview.
And Kick back over to Dan and Mary Kay because part of what I Well When When I say, you know, you need to make sure that I think we should, as followers of Christ, make sure that everything we do, and that includes our businesses, that includes all relationships we have, is generated by our relationship with Christ and sort of the platform for that. And I'm going to throw some praise on these two for one reason. I mean, my daughter. Um just has gone through within the last year of buying and selling And Getting married and finding out what she's expecting, and a lot of things going on, but One of the things that I felt so much comfort in was the fact that during the selling her home and then buying one was that she was getting good advice. And people were, because I don't know that everybody would sit down with somebody and go over a budget.
I think it's if I can make a sale, I'm gonna make the sale, and then after that, you're kind of on your own because I see that in my business also. Is you know, I just want to speak into that is is what when somebody comes to you And they're looking to either sell or buy. I mean, what's the process that you go through? Because I think you go a lot of steps that other people don't do. I mean, I know even to the point of selling somewhere, I mean I Staging and just the little things that most of the time, if you want us to sell it, we're going to put a sign in the yard and put it on the listings.
We'll try to sell it. But there's a lot of steps that can go in there above and beyond.
Well, like all of us are talking about today, it really is a personal relationship. And so we sometimes look at ourselves more as relationship managers than than real estate agents. Obviously, we do real estate and We've got twenty-five years of experience doing that, but You know, as the caller before asked about how do we get a hold of you, we like to sit down and find out: you know, what are your goals? What are your motivations? Why are you moving?
Where do you need to move? Is this just a whim? Is it something that is really necessary?
So you find out a lot about people and. To our credit or discredit, sometimes we get overly involved with people and their lives and try to help them. But I think that's where our ministry part comes in, where we almost separate ourselves from being real estate agents. And well, we want to be your friend. We want to be someone that's helpful when it comes to your money, your finances, what you're expecting to come out of this whole thing.
So a lot of it just really has to do with, how can we best help you? And I don't want to say we talk ourselves out of sales, but there are times we'll tell people you're really not ready to buy. You know, for whatever reasons, credit, job instability, relationship instability.
So there is a matter of. We want to find out if we should work together more so than I just want to sell you a house. And then we do go, like you said, Jerry, kind of above and beyond.
So if contractors are needed to get a property ready for sale, will help them line up contractors that suit them the best and their budget, what they can afford to do. And then, yes, when everything is ready, I do go in and stage. And that is a free service we offer our clients is staging a property because it is proven it will sell better. Yeah, and if they Initially, you could probably say from having to look for Wade's phone number for counseling, and afterwards, if I'm not. Oh, so true.
Yeah.
As a big It's probably their biggest financial decision of their lives. And so you want to go into it wisely. We are all called to steward everything well, right? It overlaps everything. Yeah.
There's always a joke with realtors that not only are we realtors, we're money managers, we're counselors, marriage counselors, this and that, you go through all of it because you get to know people pretty well over a two, three, four month period of time. And you can see it play out when it just comes down to what do you think of this? And you can see the spouses look at each other like they are not on board. And so a lot of times we'll say, need a little pillow talk before you come back to us and let's go from there. All right, we'll be back in just a moment.
Again, it is a calling show 866-348-7884. Love to hear from you. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits. I'm going to throw the mic over to Wade just real quick.
As we were talking about this, and as a matter of fact, he just said something before we went on air. What did you just say about parents and children and stuff? And then I also want to follow that up with the question of. You also mentioned when we went off the air about how important it is to do coaching for. Early marriage, couples that just got married, and then At some point I want to make sure we touch the base on what the difference is, coaching and counseling.
And then how to also get in touch with you. I'll show you. Oh yeah.
So yeah, one of the trends that I've been seeing a lot in the work that I do, especially with parents that have adult children, is a phenomenon that's been labeled parental estrangement. where children are cutting their parents off relationally And a lot of it, in my experience, that's not the only reason, but in my experience, it has to do with politics.
So, this is one way that our divided culture right now is showing up in families is There's a, you know, not only do we often think that people who disagree with us are, well, they just disagree with us like we did 30, 40, 50 years ago. But you disagree with me, you're a bad person. And if a child thinks that about their parent, then. They just cut their relationship off. And so it's um I see it a lot, and it is extremely painful to parents who have invested so much.
in so many ways and their children. And then They're child just says, I'm not going to relate to you at all. You can't see your grandchildren. You can't i relate to us in any way. It's it's very sad.
It's it's overwhelming to parents who Um Uh like I said, invest so much into their Children. Yeah, and and and when you said that it resonated with me 'cause I know Pondale Christian Church, we have families in there of parents that I've talked to that are in tears just talking about that exact situation where, and you're right.
So many times it's this political divide. Which is in my mind crazy to even think about. But I guess it goes back to, and I go back to the media again, where you're able to, that stuff just feeds and fuels that. And I'm no expert on it. Why did you market tell me I'm completely wrong on that, but it seems like it just Pause g Gas on the fire.
Yeah, I think that just the divided culture that we live in today really has. Not only with parents and children, but in our culture more broadly, the divisions are. Um pretty you know, pretty stark. I I we don't I don't want to go down that road with all the p political stuff, but it uh relationally it has a very difficult uh to manage Because probably all of us in this room have lost friends because of politics. Or, whatever other division there might be, even within marriages, which is what I focus on.
it uh it can be quite the dividing line. Yeah.
if uh I'm thinking about getting getting married And I'm not since I'm already married, but I was going to say if I were and I was a young adult, I mean. was coaching or counseling important. I think it's very important because, for a variety of reasons, one is, I think.
someone goes into marriage and they don't understand Their relational patterns and their partners, their husband or wife's new husband or wife's relational patterns. We're all going to assume, probably all of us in this room, that our husband or wife is going to relate just like we do. And that's almost never the case.
So our expectations are off from the very beginning. Whenever you seek comfort, um you're going to seek it the same way that I do. But that's often not the case. When I want to connect with you, then I uh or you want to connect with me, you're going to do it the same way that I do. And when it's not that way, it's a real violation of expectations.
And that's where a lot of conflict comes in because of those misalignment of expectations. And part of the reason I'm passionate about what I do is I love the church. Let me say this, but I'm going to be critical of the church a little bit. As a church with a capital C, not Pinedale, but as a capital C church, we don't do a very good job of preparing people. To for the work that's required in marriage.
Now, marriage is wonderful and it's great, but for a lot of couples, it just doesn't come naturally. There's a learning curve to it. And when the expectations are so wide and so different. it's hard to overcome those.
So I was looking y'all may have seen in the news this week or last week there was a big church in Texas where the pastor preached on cohabitation and fifty two couples came back the next week and got married in a mass wedding. And so my question is, okay, great. I'm all for that. But what are you doing for them to actually help them be married well and to honor Christ in their marriage? And I actually, every post that comes up, I'm writing, well, what are you doing to help them?
What are you doing to contact me? I'll be happy to help. They haven't reached out yet, but here's hope. Wade, what's the difference between you're talking counseling and coaching? Yes, that's a great question.
And so, I am a licensed psychologist in the state of Florida, so I do counseling for residents remotely through Zoom. on for individuals and couples. The difference with coaching is that as a coach, which is what I do everywhere else, I cannot assess, diagnose, or treat mental health disorders.
So, if someone comes in and they're depressed, like major depressive disorder or generalized anxiety disorder or anything like that, I cannot work with them. outside of the state of Florida. But here's the thing: most people that present for counseling. are not actually diagnosable or do not have a diagnosis.
So coaching kind of fits the bill. Are they maybe they're depressed? Like we all say, oh, I'm depressed today, I'm a little blue. Coaching steps into that. or I'm I'm a little anxious, like getting ready for a radio program that I've never done before produced a little anxiety in me.
So I I work on that, right? And so coaching steps into that. Coaching is much more forward focused Future focused, whereas counseling focuses back. Let's, let's. Let's focus back on maybe some difficult times, some trauma, and fix that air quotes Whereas coaching says, let's look at what's happening.
How can you be prepared for the future the best?
So like with your daughter, another example would be A good thing for coaching is all those transitions that you described. No, I don't know your daughter, I haven't met her, but getting married. Uh Selling a house, buying a house. Getting ready to have a baby, getting pregnant, right all within the first year of marriage. Those are all huge transitions.
If there were just one, let alone all four of those in one year.
So, coaching comes alongside those folks and says, All right, how can you manage the emotions of it? How can you. Um Plan for the future. And so that coaching focuses forward, counseling focuses backward, and on mental health disorders. Coaching doesn't focus on that.
Cool. Hmm. What would be uh We talked I like that thing, looking forward, helping everything. I think the same thing would relate back to buying a home and selling a home is kind of projecting I think that's part of what you do when you set up and do a budget and everything, so you're not having to call for coaching or counseling and stuff. How important is it to just be proactive?
And I'm going to say that for both. Both of you. All three of you. Because I think part of what you do is being proactive. You may not realize that it's being proactive, especially in the real estate industry.
I mean, it's basically your somebody comes to you and says, I want to sell a house, buy a house. But I think also when you look at that, You're being proactive. because you want to want them to succeed. I think that's where the relationship thing comes in. I think for us, again, it goes back to a consultation with them.
So if someone's going to sell a house to be proactive, we want that house in the best possible condition. Situation, time of year, in order for it to sell.
So, when Mary Kay talks about staging, that may make the presentation best. We may send in professionals to evaluate a roof or a foundation, all those kinds of things to get a house ready to sell. When they're going to buy something, we might say, consider the costs going forward. Five years you're going to need a roof, an HVAC system.
So there is a lot that goes on just other than the present time. All right, be back in just a moment. If you have a question for Wade or Dan or Mary Kay, just give us a call, 866-348-7884. We'll be coming up on our last segment.
So if you want to get in that question. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits. And before we go in, I've got to bring in another question, but before we do, because I'm going to try to, this last segment hit twice at least, how do I get in touch with Wade Arnold? Yes.
So the easiest way is to go to drwaidarnold.com, dr. WadeArnold.com, and you can contact me through that or my telephone number is 336-496-2930. Uh that's the easiest way. And um Uh I mean, I'm not hard to find. I'm on Facebook, Instagram, you name it.
So you can find all of my social media all over. And I think on every social media uh platform, it's at dr wade arnold.
So I'm pretty easy to find.
Alright. To get in touch with you. I mean, that would be where you can get in touch with you if you want to get the coaching. Absolutely. Or if you want to, I'm especially this year, I'm emphasizing reaching out to pastors who want to do retreats or workshops or pulpit supply to talk about marriage.
I'm really interested in partnering with churches and pastors who can. Who recognize that when it comes to a lot of their marriage counseling, they're maybe out of their depth. I can help with that. And I love doing retreats and workshops for churches. All right.
Dan Mary Kay.
Now, you gave it earlier, but how do I get text?
Well, I'm trying to think of a way we could partner with the doctor here and bring him in when we have an attorney, when we have a mortgage person. Really is an element. And I'm not joking, it's a very important element. Easiest way, you can just Google Dan Rath, Mary Kay Rath. You're going to find us online.
Otherwise, again, the phone number, 336-336. five seven seven eight. 1121. All right. When I sat there and was Thinking as I'm going through my mind, just the connections here and stuff.
Part of it is, I mean, looking at what you do professionally, but also I'm looking at two people that also give back to the community in a lot of ways and stuff. And I know that. Wade does some Sunday school classes at Pinedale Christian Church, so if you want to come and hear him speak, it'd be a great opportunity to do that. I'm gonna get you to speak on that. And then Mary Kay and Dan are been plugged into Pinedale for Uh well, as long as I have me, which is a lot of years.
Thirty-eight years. Hmm. Hmm. Wow. But I do um coordinate the women's ministry at Pinedale, and we have a phenomenal ministry.
Well, all of the areas, all the different departments are phenomenal, I think. And Mary Kay also doesn't Say much about it, but is really instrumental into a lot of these young ladies' lives over the past. Uh 20-some years by organizing and heading up the girls' retreat that Pine Dale does once a year. January. And Dan is Bob with a One thing is, if you come, there's a good chance that Dan's going to get you to the front door.
Driving the golf cart. Yeah, we like to motor people from one end of the parking lot up to the church, and we joke about it. You know, all the guys that I know that play golf, we know how to drive a golf cart, so it's a pretty easy ministry. But it really is sometimes the first face that they see at Pinedale.
So they may have some questions, they may want to know about a Sunday school class, or what are some of the things that you all believe in, or back to how's your day.
Well, it's more than just fine sometimes, and you can see the burden coming in, you know, into the golf cart.
So it's kind of a multifaceted ministry. And we just happen to be in your Sunday school class, Jerry.
Well, I'm blessed for that, that's for sure. But we sit there and you think about it, and then what would be, Dan and Mary Kay, what would be the one thing somebody. buying a house or selling a house, what would be the one piece of advice you would give him. If somebody said just one thing, what would it be? Um wisdom.
Go into it with your eyes wide open and surround yourself. With great people to help with the process. You need a lot of people for each. each step of the way. It comes back to the why.
Why are you doing this? What's your motivation? to try to see if we can fit in what they want to do. They may want to sell and make a gigantic profit because somewhere they heard how much real estate is appreciating. And sometimes it's true, it's not always true.
So finding out really what their goals are, that's the biggest thing for us. help most helpful for us. Yeah.
White I'm needing. I don't know if I need any. I don't know if I need help or not. What? What are you gonna tell me?
If you're not sure. uh that's the a hard person to work with. But if They have an identifiable issue, like maybe they're having trouble communicating. That's the thing that comes up. Uh and what I hit on mostly when I talk with people is There's a cyclical pattern to their conflict.
Maybe the same argument comes up, or it's not the same topic, but you can almost predict the way the argument is gonna go. That's the person that I talk to the most. And if I was thinking you were going to ask me the same question you asked the wraths, what is it about when it comes down to it? To me, it is about Philippians 2, 3, and 4. Do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility of mind regard one another as more important than yourselves.
Don't look after your own personal interest, but after the interest of the others. If you can apply that to your marriage, you will do well. All right, Dan and Mary Kay, what's that phone number? 336-577-1121. Wife?
336-496-2930. All right, it's been a great morning. Thank you for being here. And I hope something that you've heard this morning Will encourage you and get you moving in the right direction. Again, thank you.
Thank you, Karen. Thank you.
