For more than 25 years, Monica suffered from an addiction to drugs and alcohol, fueled in part by her painful and shameful past. The thought would come to my mind that I had had these abortions.
I would not want to think about it because the pain was just too real. Thankfully, God healed Monica's heart and today she supports Focus on the Family's pro-life ministry. I want to support a ministry that can help change the trajectory of people's lives that are contemplating abortion. I can't go back in time and change my life and change my decisions, but I can support a ministry that can help possibly change someone else's.
I'm Jim Daly. Let's save babies and give families hope today. Donate and your gift will be doubled.
Call 800-AFAMILY or visit FocusOnTheFamily.com slash gift. Hello. Hey, Mom. Peyton, I was wondering when you'd call. Are you going to come home for the weekend?
Yeah, I was getting homesick. All right. Well, what's the earliest I can expect you?
I figured I would probably sleep in Saturday morning, so like whenever I wake up. It's a three hour drive, Peyton. I'll also be bringing some laundry. I'm all out of clean underwear.
Really? Anyway, so I'll head over at some point Saturday, then I'll be out with the guys in town. We can catch up, hang out. Well, how long do you expect that to be? I don't know, Mom.
I never get to see my friends when I'm back home. Well, we want to see you too. Oh, I almost forgot. My girlfriend will be stopping by at some point too. Hold on, girlfriend. Speaking of her, that's her on the other line now. Peyton.
Peyton, are you there? Oh, my. That phone call sounds a little too familiar probably. Maybe you have an adult child and you're trying to understand and work through the dynamics of that relationship.
It can be tricky. Well, we've got lots of practical insight, advice and encouragement for you today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I'm John Fuller. John, it's always fun when our guest is hitting something we're living, and you and I are both living this, right?
We are indeed. We've got an adult, 20-something kids, and you've got some a little older than that. But, you know, we talk about the boomerang kids and some of those kids that are needing in some cases to come back, and then how do we manage that, or maybe they've not left yet.
I think I've got boom and rang. I've got one out and one that's not ready yet to get out. So, you know, this is just part of the parenting experience.
You've got something similar. They've all had a tour at home, some welcome and some less so. Well, this is the reality of where a lot of us are living, and I hope if that's your spot right now, you'll lean into this discussion with our great guest. He is, man, one of the most formidable Christian authors and a wonderful guest here at Focus on the Family.
And we want to leverage his insights. He's written a great book, Your New Life with Adult Children. I'm laughing because it just hit me, Your New Life, right? It's a change. It is a change.
And I can't wait to get into the content. Richard Chapman is a pastor, author, speaker, counselor, radio host. He's been here a number of times.
He's written more than 25 books. And as you said, Jim, the book we're leaning into today is called Your New Life with Adult Children, a practical guide to what helps, what hurts, and what heals. Great title. Get a copy of the book from us.
We've got details in the show notes. Hey, Gary, welcome back to Focus. Well, thank you. It's great to be here. I'm just laughing thinking, what am I going to say next? I'm like, we're so glad you're here today, Gary.
I mean, it's funny when you're living it, right? And, you know, so many parents, even with that subtitle, a practical guide to what helps, what hurts, and what heals. I'm hearing, you know, cleanup on aisle seven, all those things that we did that weren't that productive as teens.
And now we're getting probably some of that back now. But let me say, so many parents contact us with that anxiety about adult children because they're making the choices that we as parents hoped when they were little, they would never make. When they were teens, we were on our knees praying, Lord, help them with their decision-making. Anybody pray like that? You know, help them with his friends, Lord, all those kinds of things. But you say parents should avoid blaming their child and to first consider their own mistakes, pointing the mirror right back at us, right? Well, that's based on what Jesus said. Okay, okay, let's add that weight. Why are you trying to straighten them up?
Behold, there's a plank in your own eye. And that doesn't mean that we're responsible for all of our adult children's decisions. No, no, no, no. But it does mean that we ought to at least reflect upon our past and what we did or did not do that might be contributing to something that our adult children are now doing. And there is a place for us to apologize to them if we realize there are some places where we failed them. Do we?
Should we? I think it'd be a good exercise, but so often we use that statement that the fruit doesn't fall far from the tree. When we see these behaviors in our kids, we should really look first and say, okay, did they learn that from me, right? Yeah, one of the most sobering questions I ever asked myself when our children were growing up is what if my children turned out to be like me? What if they turn out to drive like I drive to treat their spouse the way I treat my spouse, you know, and on down the line?
And some of the significant changes I made along the way were when I answered that question for myself, you know. Yeah, the other aspect of it, and I think this is what's so hard for us as parents, you know, you are nurturing these children when they're little. You're taking them to school, in elementary school, the carpool. These are all affectionate things in my memory, you know, dropping them off or having them jump in the car very excited to see dad in the pickup line. And then it's junior high and maybe you're not as excited to see them in high school, et cetera. But you talk about the most common mistakes parents can make with adult children. And, for example, overprotection or micromanaging, that's probably cutting really close to a lot of listeners and viewers right now. That 21, 23-year-old, we can tend to continue to micromanage them and not let go.
I guess the question is, A, why is that so hard? It seems right when you read it in a book, but it's hard to do. Yeah, well, you know, I think by nature, as you said earlier, we want our children to have the best possible life. As Christians, we're going to make it happen for you. Yeah, and we're going to make it happen.
And there's no question about it. When the children are little, we have to do that because they can't do anything by themselves. But we want to be thinking in terms of this child is going to have to be independent.
At 18, chances are they're going to go to college, join the military, or hopefully get a job or something, you know. And so here they are now, 20 years old, and we're still jumping in to whatever situation they are and telling them what they're supposed to do. And we build a wall between us. They resist that. They push away from that. And consequently, we're not having a positive influence on them when we do that. But we do need to have a positive influence. We can't change our adult children in their decisions. We can't control them. When we do, we lose the opportunity to influence them.
So I think if parents realize, yes, I want to have a positive influence on my adult children, but I can't control them, we have to give them the same freedom God gives us to make our own decisions. And let's face it, God's first two children made a poor decision, and we still suffer from it. Right.
I mean, right. He was not, you know, he's perfect. But in that context, you know, his kids chose unwisely. And that wasn't under his control. It was their control.
But it's so hard to process as a parent. That's true. But he had to let them suffer the consequences. Correct.
Took them out of the garden. And we have to allow our adult children to suffer the consequences. You have an example of a couple, I'm sure you've changed their name, Steve and Linda in the book, who had a daughter who struggled. Describe what she, the daughter, was going through, and then what them, as the parents, had to go through. Yeah, well, what they did, once you went off to college, they paid all of her bills in college, and they gave her a credit card or whatever she wanted to, during the college years, okay? Well, she finished college, she gets a job, and she has a roommate, and they are renting a place together, a friend of hers. And one day, the parents get a call from her roommate saying, I know you all care deeply for your daughter, and I just think you need to be aware of this, that she's, for two months now, she hasn't paid her share of the rent. And I loaned her some money, and she hasn't paid me back.
And I just think you all need to be aware of that. So the parents thanked her, which they should have, and then they had the conversation with their daughter, and just kind of shared what they'd been told. And then also, not only did they hear that, but the gal would come home every two weeks and bring her laundry for her mother to do her laundry.
And then she'd have dinner with them that night. And so they shared with her what they had heard, and they said, you know, we're beginning to realize that we really failed you in some ways. Here you are at this age, and you don't even know how to do laundry. And you don't know how to cook.
And you don't know how to manage money. And in the conversation, she said, I just feel like you all are very disappointed in me. And they said, no, we're disappointed in ourselves, because we realize that we did not teach you these things. And these are things, just skills, that everybody needs to have.
And so if you're open, we'd like to try to make up for that now. We try to learn how to do that now. So rather than your bringing your laundry here for us to do, it's okay if you want to bring it here if you don't have any machines where you're living. Yeah, but you do it.
But you do it, you know. And while you're here, we want to teach you some skills about cooking, because it's going to help you in your life. And then we want to talk to you about some money management things and money management skills.
In fact, we might even find a class that we could all take on money management together, maybe at the local college or something. Yeah, that's good. You know, Gary, that reminds me, I can't remember his name specifically, but that former Navy SEAL admiral who gave that commencement speech and talked about make your bed. Remember, and he said, you know, one of the things that we look at with people who can't succeed is when they can do these, what most people would consider mostly mundane tasks, but get up in the morning and make your bed. And this isn't about the not scripture, about godliness, cleanliness is next to godliness, because it ain't in there. But the point being, these little routines that we can sometimes overlook, because we're looking at the big picture.
Where's the character? Are we doing devotions together? Do they love the Lord? And those are the things we aim for. But sometimes we forget to teach the little things that take a young adult in the right direction, like make your bed, like do the laundry, those things. Do you find that in your counseling?
Absolutely, absolutely. And you know, here's an interesting story, the end of that story. The young gal gets married eventually, and her husband feels like he's got a treasure. This girl can cook. This girl can do laundry.
This girl can manage money. And he says to her parents, I hope that if we ever have children, I can raise them to be like your daughter. Wow. And they thanked him, and they got in the car, and they said, ooh, isn't that wonderful?
I wonder what that conversation for the young couple was on the way home. Honey, there's something I gotta tell you. That's so encouraging, though, because it's never too late. Never too late.
Absolutely, yeah. You know, Gary, the other side of this, so you know, we're kind of stressing this idea that the parents have missed some things, et cetera, et cetera. But there's also, and I think I can tend to lean into this, you know, okay, my kids are over 18, my job's done, everything they do is on them, and I'm gonna wash my hands, and oh, that's too bad, oh, that's too bad. So how do you not become so disengaged that you're not being a helpful parent in that 20, 30-something space where you should be? I mean, we kind of, you know, adults, we have this weird thing about living on a switch where we're either all on or we're all off. And the Christian faith draws you into kind of a dimmer switch, you know. And so speak to that parent that's done. I'm done, Gary.
Yeah. I think basically we have to realize that we are going to have an influence on our adult children, either positive or negative. And what we want to do is have a positive influence on our adult children. So I think rather than telling them what they ought to do, to say to them, look, anytime I can help you, I'm happy to help you. Anytime you want my advice, I'm happy to give it to you. But I'm not going to tell you what to do. I'm not going to control your life, because at this age, you're, you know, I want you to be independent. But I'm available if you ever want my advice on anything.
Yeah, that's so good. And chances are they will ask your advice on things, and you can have a positive influence. I would think the healthier the relationship is, the more of that interaction you're going to get, because the kids trust they can come to you with something that is a deficit in their life. Yeah, and a lot of that depends on what kind of relationship you had before they became adults, you know. There's another account I told in the book of a father who had two adult young 20s boys, Josh and Brad, and he realized that when they did come home, they talked a lot with their mother, but they seldom ever engaged him in conversation. And he began to wonder what the problem was, and he talked to his wife about it. And he decided, you know, looking back on it, I didn't spend a whole lot of time with my kids when they were growing up, these two boys. Didn't develop a relationship.
Yeah, I was working, working, working, you know. And so he just sat down with his boys and told them, he said, I'm feeling uncomfortable because I'm realizing, you know, you all feel really comfortable with your mother and you talk with her freely, but you don't talk much with me, and I think it's my fault, because I didn't spend a lot of time in conversations with you all growing up. And the boys are kind of uncomfortable with that conversation, but he said, but you know, if you guys are open, I'd like to spend more time with you as adults, and I'd like to, you know, have more conversations with you. So they started having breakfast every other Saturday morning, and they started going to, he started going to sporting events with them, and they started having conversations, and before long, several months into it, they started asking him questions, you know, about, Dad, I'm thinking about buying a car, I'd like your advice on this.
Yeah, that's good. So, Gary, in this book, you've got a story about Barbara and her son Tyson, and he kind of was flailing around and not getting anywhere after high school. Graduation, what can you tell us about that scenario? Well, let's face it, there are a lot of parents who can identify with this. You know, the child is trying to decide, do I go to college, do I go to some other type school, do I join the military, but then sometimes they're not doing anything. And sometimes they go to college and come back, and it's the same thing, you know, and so that's the situation with this couple.
And so he's, you know, living at home, he's spending time with his friends every night and staying up late with them, he's sleeping late in the morning, but he's not motivated to get a job at all. And so there comes a juncture at which the parent has to say, you know, honey, I don't know exactly all that's going on in your life and all or what your plans are for the future, but I want you to be able to enjoy life, and eventually if you want to get married, to get married and have children and all that. So maybe we need to discuss some of these things together, you know. Communication is what happened in that family. When they started communicating with that and finding out where he was and what was going on, then he could begin to take some steps, you know. And we can help them do that, but if we just accept it and don't have any communication with them, they could be there for 30 years. I have found a lot of parents struggle with having that initial conversation because, like, well, I didn't expect that a year after you moved in or you never left that you'd still be here, so it feels like I can't even really broach the subject. It kind of goes back to what Jim was saying earlier.
How do you get into that? That's good. Hey, Gary, could you help me by explaining why it's critical for parents to acknowledge that adult children have the freedom to choose their own path, even if we disagree with some of those dangerous consequences? I mean, that's probably the toughest place for us as parents, especially Christian parents. Yeah, I think it's absolutely the toughest place because when they make certain decisions that in our hearts we know it's a wrong decision, we know it's going to have detrimental consequences in their lives, it's very painful for parents. But I think at the same time we have to recognize that we have to give them, and we said this earlier, the same freedom that God gives his children to make decisions and make poor, and all of us have made poor decisions.
Let's face it, none of us are perfect. And God allows us to do that, and if we look back on our own lives, some of our biggest lessons we learn by our failures. And so our children may have to learn some hard lessons by their failures as well.
So if they make poor decisions, we have to allow them to suffer the consequences of those poor decisions. For example, if your adult child gets stopped for driving under the influence, and he's in jail, and he calls you, or they call you and tell you that he's in jail, I wouldn't go down and bail him out tonight. Let him spend the night in jail.
Let him go down tomorrow and talk to him and try to decide where we go from here. If you bail him out, then he didn't suffer the consequences. Right, he didn't feel that.
She didn't feel that. God lets us suffer the consequences. You offer some specific guidelines about how parents and young adults should negotiate expectations and responsibilities at home. What does that guideline discussion look like? Well, I think if the young adult comes home and is moving back in, that is the time to have a conversation about, okay, we're happy for you to be here. Let's talk about how we can make this work best for all of us. And so we're going to share some of our concerns and thoughts. You share some of yours, and let's make some decisions here on how we can make this beneficial for all of us, because that's what we want.
And starting it early rather than waiting three months before you bring up a conversation like this, in which you're really frustrated by what they're doing or not doing, it's far better to have that conversation early on. I like that. I mean, I like that.
I'm just trying to think, how does that play through? Well, we had a rental agreement that I drafted for each of the kids when they bounced back, and I just changed the names every time somebody moved back in. Did you get that in a file under rental agreement?
Well, it was a regular lease agreement, because they were going to have to have that or already had experience. So it's like, these are the expectations, this is when rent is due, and this is how you'll operate in the family. Gary, I wanted to ask you, you mentioned temperament a little while ago, and I want to kind of bring that around, because in the book, you talk about planners and strugglers as temperaments, I think, in part with our children. Describe the planner and the struggler. Yeah, well, you know, when adults' children either come back home or they stay home, the planner is one who has ideas of where they want to go. They can't afford maybe to be out by themselves now in an apartment somewhere. So they're planning, if I can stay here for the year, and I'm going to get a job and do this and save my money because I want to go to college or I want to do this or the other, whatever else, they have ideas on where they're going. And this is great, because this is the easiest thing for the parent, because they realize this child is going somewhere. One foot out the door at high school graduation, basically. Right. The struggler is the one who comes back home after they've had a failure and they've lost their job or they've dropped out of college or they're having problems with alcohol and drugs or whatever.
They come back. They're struggling with life, and that's totally different, and it's a totally different situation. Well, in fact, you mentioned the distinction between loving and challenging, and that to me rang of art, the art of parenting, and it's not a scientific methodology, a formulaic approach. You kind of have to know what to apply when. That idea between love and challenging, man, that is tough, especially, and I'll lay this backdrop to it, with a rise in anxiety, depression, loneliness within 15 to 25-year-olds.
Let's just say that. And the CDC, the Center for Disease Control, has talked about this, and their survey work is it's gone off the charts, the level of anxiety particularly within that age group. So speak to all of that as a parent, because this is all, especially if we're fairly well-informed parents, we know all of that is occurring, and kind of in the wash of this effort to apply the art of parenting, helping our kids when they may have high anxiety or depression or they've been bullied or all the other things where it's outside normal. And that's when our child desperately needs our love.
I mean, that's the first step. We're not going to get anywhere if the child doesn't feel loved by us. And that's where the love languages actually can help them at that point, hoping they've already learned that love language concept and they know that adult child's language.
If not, they ought to discover it. And then communicating love to that child in a meaningful way to them so that what I call their love tank is full and they're coming back broken, and they know they're broken. They know they're struggling. It's just that they don't know how to handle it on their own, and they need you desperately.
And if they feel your love, then they're far more open to your suggestions. For example, if we recognize that they're feeling depressed and all of that, to say, you know, honey, this is something that's common with a lot of people your age, but there is help. And let's find out a counselor in our area that's a Christian that can really help us in this area. And we can go with you if we need to. You can go by yourself.
We'll ask the advice of the counselor on that. But we want to help you because we love you so much. And there's a life beyond this, you know. So it's communicating that kind of love and that there's hope for them because some of them don't have a lot of hope at that juncture depending on what they've been through.
Yeah, that is so good. And, Gary, again, with young adults, the knowledge between how we negotiate our expectations and responsibilities in the home, can you make a distinction between it? Again, we don't feel like we need to negotiate as a parent of a late teen.
Hey, this is my house, and I'm not saying that's how you do it, but we kind of all understand those rules, right? But now it's negotiation time, and we, again, as parents, may not have that art form of good negotiation skills, especially in the context of if they're coming back into the home, the responsibilities that you have, how we see it now is different. Let's just wrap up with that conversation for a bit of hope for that parent that's in there right now with their 23-year-old who doesn't know where to go and is coming home this weekend.
Yeah. I think to say to that 23-year-old, you know we love you. You know we want the best for you. And so while you're here, we want to make this a learning time and a growth time for us and you, because it's different now. You're an adult now, and we're still your parents.
We care about you, but you're an adult. But you're living with us, and so we want you to experience some of the things that you're going to experience in the real world when you get out there. And one of them is having some things to do here at home, because if you're living out there, somebody's going to have to clean the toilet and going to have to cook, and somebody's going to have to just list all these things, and we want you to learn how to do some of those things.
Are there some of those that you would really like to learn yourself that we might ought to focus on? So you let them have a chance, but they're going to be doing something. You're getting the idea. And so then you negotiate what we're going to do, what we're going to be trying to help you with in this particular time of your life. And I think the other thing is to say to them, if they have a job, they may or may not have a job if they move back, but if they have a job, just say, you know, if you had your own apartment out there, you'd be paying $2,000 a month for an apartment now. Now, we're not going to charge you $2,000, but we do want you to be paying something so that you have the sense that there's a monthly rent that has to be paid. And if you are doing it with us, then we're getting you ready for doing it out there.
Kind of life's normal rhythm. That's right. Yeah, that's a good idea. Gary, this has been so good, and we've run out of time, but like I said, let's come back and keep hitting it because it really provides you with the resources and tools you need to do the job of parenting well even after they're out of the home or maybe have boomeranged back into the home. We want to get this into your hands, Gary's book, Your New Life with Adult Children. And as often we do this, if you can make a gift of any amount monthly, which is ideal, or a one-time gift, we'll send you the book as our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry and helping even more families. You get great content, and FOCUS uses the proceeds of that to help other families in need. So try it that way.
It's a win-win, and if you can do that monthly, that really helps us. Contribute as you can when you call 800, the letter A in the word family. That's 800-232-6459. Or you can find out more about donating and getting a copy of Gary's book and also our counseling team. You can access them through the website.
We've got all the links in the show notes. Well, thanks for joining us today for FOCUS on the Family with Jim Daly. I'm John Fuller, inviting you back next time as we continue the conversation with Dr. Gary Chapman and once again help you and your family thrive in Christ. You want your teenager to become a successful adult, right?
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