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If the only mom they knew was the helicopter mom that hovers over the breakfast bar while they're doing their homework, and now they do want to be independent, now they do want to mature on their own, this is how life is supposed to happen, they don't think you can parent any differently. But you can, if you choose to, back off, give them the space and the place where they discover why they are, the who they are. and actually find out that you did a good job as a mom.
Well, that's Dr. Kathy Cook describing how it's possible to have a respectful, healthy, loving relationship with your adult child. Dr. Kathy is back with us today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I'm John Fuller, and we're so glad you've joined us as well.
You know, we're talking to so many of you. When I travel, I'm meeting so many parents of adult children now, the 25-year-old, 30-year-old. And it's a whole bouquet of what's happening out there, and a lot of frustration. and a lot of good things are happening too. Not to paint it all in a bad picture.
It's just, you know, the whole array I'm able to hear about. But we do want to help you as a parent particularly do the best job you can do in being a parent and an influencer of that adult child. And guess what? Here's the neon sign. They're going to do things that you disagree with.
And the question is, what are you going to do with that? Are you going to treat them as a 15-year-old or as a 25-year-old? And believe me. There's a difference. And if you missed any of the conversation last time with Dr.
Kathy, get our focus on the family app so you can listen on the go anytime. And check the website for audio and video as well. And we're talking about Dr. Kathy's book, Resolve Conflict and Find Peace and Hope with Adult Children: Strategies and Conversations That Work. And we're so glad to have her back.
Kathy, it's great to have you back. Thanks for being with us. I'm glad to be here. Thank you. All right.
So, we pummeled the parents last time. Let me just say, we had lots of examples of where we're blowing it, you know, the over-control, the things that we do that alienate our adult children. And it's easy to do because we have the best intention. You were very kind to defend a parent's lack of maturity in parenting their adult children. But it's time to get on the horse and go, right?
We've got to have a better relationship. If you're in a bad relationship or not as adequate a relationship with your adult children, this is what we want to do: equip you.
So, what's on the adult child side of the responsibility ledger? Because you're going to, and I know you know this, you hear from parents, well, it's not me. It's him. It's that son or it's that daughter. Right.
Or the daughter-in-law or the son-in-law.
So, the question in all that is: yeah, what's on their side of the lodger? What are they responsible for? Yeah, I actually love that we're starting with that. You know, love your parents. Good heavens, they sacrificed for you, they've gone out of their way for you.
Amen, sister. Yeah, you didn't even tell me to say that. But, you know, we're all imperfectly perfect, right?
So, the parents have been imperfectly perfect. I want to say to the adult children: your parents' parents did the best that they knew how to do in the moment that they did it. And you're now judging based on things that you know, things that you think are true. You're watching culture, like, why didn't my parents do that or say that? Or why are they the way they are?
Well, they are the way they are. Can you love them in that anyway? And can you walk toward them? You know, and can you say yes more often than no? Like, they want 15 minutes.
That should start like at age seven. Come on, no, it's not say yes more than no. Yes, that's a good piece of advice. I mean, I appreciate that, Jim. We are a family, and what we know here at Focus on the Family and at Celebrate Kids is that God ordains the family before He ordains the church.
Yeah, we are supposed to be a family, we're imperfect for each other. Isn't that even interesting that the Lord, I think, saw fit to put in scripture that train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old. He will not depart from it. Yeah. I mean, isn't it?
It's interesting that that little. description got in there. Not when they're 25. You know, it it's saying when when they're mature in their head. They'll remember these things, like desperation, whatever that might be.
But I just find it interesting that even that little nuance, because again, I meet so many parents of adult children now that are freaking out, rightfully so, that their adult children aren't engaged in church, et cetera. But then I meet with many of them that say, you know, my son's 45 now and he's back at church. Yes. And they say it with such. relief and you know you've got to have that hope that that is still in front of them, that they can get there.
And that's critical. We'll call today the tough question day because now I want to talk about when the adult kids get married. Oh, yeah. And I'll put it in this context because it's funny. I was playing golf with somebody and he missed the green on what they call an approach shot.
That's when your last shot into the green. And he missed it off to one side. And he said, oh, that's a son-in-law shot. Whoa. I said, what do you mean?
He goes, it was close, but not what I was hoping for. Oh, ouch. I thought, oh, wow. I hope he doesn't have a son-in-law. But you know the point is It's humorous, but I get it.
I mean, it's not what you were hoping for for your daughter, or it's not what you were hoping for for your son. How do you navigate? All of that, you know, this new family that you're now part of, and how do you let yourself go a little bit to be less selfish about all that and be encouraging to? That new family member. That was a great point.
So, how do we navigate that very carefully and often silently? You know, I think, you know, when our kids are, you know, in our home and they're beginning to date or they're of that age, we pray, I think we pray more for our children to be ready for marriage than we pray for the spouse. I think that's something I say all the time. Most parents I meet pray for their children's spouses. Have you prayed for your child?
To be ready for that step of life. And then, yes, you pray for the spouse and you hopefully have taught your kids how to discern. Do they know their values? Do they know family values? Do they know who they're becoming and who they would love to be and the kind of life they'd like to live?
And if they know those things, they're going to seek a spouse who will support those things.
Now, if they do fall in love with somebody who has a different faith or a different work ethic or a different family structure and you're concerned, then speak up before they marry, before they marry, speak up. and be truth and be wisdom and be love in those moments. If they've married somebody who you think is not great, pray, pray, and pray again for the spouse to mature, for the relationship to be healthy. I would pray that you would want them married and that it would be good for your daughter, your son, to be married to that person. And I think, again, we support, we love, we pray, and we say things like, how can I help you?
Like, if you notice that your daughter is struggling, let's say your daughter's become critical and she didn't used to be a critical person. You can say to your daughter, you know, Samantha, I've noticed just a critical spirit in you. You're quick to judge and quick to be angry. And you weren't that way. You don't have to say you weren't raised that way.
You don't have to make it about you. You can say, man, that just hasn't been a part of your character.
So I'm naturally concerned because you used to be a woman of great joy. I think you've lost your joy. How can I help you? Yeah. Now, you know, can I help?
No. But how can I help?
Well, you can help by being quiet about it. You know, you can help by praying. You can help by, you know, can we go out for coffee? Or you could help by, could you answer a question? Like, how have you dealt with it?
Like, was dad ever mean-spirited? Was dad critical? And how did you handle his criticism?
So ideally, you're available to be a blessing of, again, consultant role, not again, parenting in the way that you would control or force them to agree with you. And I think another thing that's really complicated about family, you guys, is that when somebody marries, they marry a person, but that person comes with family. Oh, yeah. Right. So there's in-laws and there's siblings and there's aunts and there's uncles and there's, yeah.
So we, and we don't, we don't know them, so it's hard to love them. But you can love without knowing them because that's what we are lovers, right? We love because God loves us. And I don't, I haven't found a Bible verse that says, you know, because you know them well, you should love them well. No, you'd love because your daughter's married into that family.
And now you go to a family dinner, Mother's Day, Father's Day, Christmas, Thanksgiving, and you choose to sit next to somebody you haven't gotten to know well yet. And you say, oh, so you're the Aunt Kathy. You're my son-in-law's sister. I'd love to get to know you. Tell me about yourself.
No, that's really good. You know, that introduction of the holidays. You know, now these become. I hate to say it this way, but it can be true. Battlegrounds.
It can happen. You know, where the boys aren't going to be there because they're with their wives' family. There are constructive ways. I've heard of really good resolution to that, that they flip every other year, you know, and they come to our house for Christmas and the in-law's house for next year's Christmas, you know, and the same with Thanksgiving or whatever. How do you go into that environment with an open mind about the fact that you have to share?
Come on. I mean, we're like little kids again. I'm not sharing my son with you. Yes, open mind, absolutely. Like, know that this is going to happen.
Like, let's not be clueless about this. And let's be grateful for what we have. more than angry for what we don't have. I say that, and I don't say that like it's an easy flip a switch, but it's a choice that we have. Both the adult children need to be grateful because they're going to miss siblings and they're going to miss parents and grandparents, and the adult parents need to be grateful as well, or the parents need to be grateful as well.
Friends of mine got remarried after both spouses passed away, so they now have eight children among them, and I think 19 grandkids, if I remember right. And they don't get together with any of their family on Thanksgiving or Christmas. They decided to not be the problem, and they've said to their children, go with the in-laws. And they do that. And so my friends are, quote unquote, alone every Thanksgiving and every Christmas.
So they serve. Which is beautiful. And the entire family gets together one day in usually November and one day usually in January. But what's really cool about that, you guys, is that every one of the children and the stepchildren are there.
So now all the cousins meet and get to know each other, and the children get to know the stepchildren better than they ever would have before if they would have split every other year. And that's a choice that my friends have made to honor their children. And the children then honor the parents and the siblings by absolutely cementing that one day in January is the family day. And what I'm hearing you say is just get creative, find ways to meet the needs without disrupting too many people, right? Because it's not supposed to be about us.
Yeah, we're supposed to be other-centered. Which is good. You mentioned in the book about prioritize the future over the past. What do you mean by that? We have a tendency to look back and we look back with regret, or we look back and we assume because we did this, this will happen in the future.
You know, the past is done. That was one of the reasons that the book was challenging to write, to be honest with you, because I know you can't go back and reparent.
So we're going to look forward with hope, hope in God. Not hope in our kids, not hope even in us, but hope in God. We're going to look forward.
Now, we keep the past alive in the right way, Jim. Like, memories are important to keep alive. Remember when we went to the zoo, like you're with your grandkids and they're six and seven or six and eight? Hey, do you remember when we went to the zoo and you were about seven and you got to feed the giraffe for the first time? You know, I think memories are really important to look back on and keep alive.
But I think parents have a tendency to look back and wish for so much that can never be. Oh, interesting. And then the past becomes less than it could be because we see it with that red pen critical spirit, which doesn't do anybody any good.
Well, that's good. The red pen critical spirit. And Kathy, we haven't directly talked much about grandparenting, but that's a sacred calling. Yes. And it comes with some challenges sometimes.
So how do we... come alongside and help our child and ultimately spend time with our grandkids. There can be some friction points there. Yes, so one of the things that I heard about over and over again as I interview people was the disrespect that our adult children feel. In their parenting realm, because the grandparents come in and, oh, you're letting her eat sugar at her age?
Like, we didn't introduce you to sugar until you were at least six or seven.
Well, isn't it bedtime? It's 8 o'clock. And so the parent wants to parent. Yes, exactly.
So the adult parent, the grandparent, wants to be involved and is judging the children. In the way that they're raising the grandchildren, in the way that they raise the children. If you can follow that line of reasoning, and it becomes complex. You're the grandparent, you're not the parent. And so you need to learn to be quiet.
I would love for our adult children to be affirmed. I would love for the grandparent to say, I love how much you love Bethany. Or, I love that you've enrolled Peter in soccer. I think he's going to thrive. He's so body smart.
Or to say, Man, your bedtime routine with Alice is so calming. I imagine she sleeps really well because you just usher her down the hall and there's just this peace about it. Like, look for the things that you can affirm and keep your mouth shut about lots of the things that you think are maybe concerns. Maybe you ask questions when the kids aren't in the room. Like, I've noticed that you allow for more sugar in their diet.
I'm just curious about that. Like, you don't eat much. And then let them talk with you if they're willing to talk with you. But again, I want to say to our listeners that a number one thing I heard over and over again is my parents think that they're. The parents, but they're the grandparents.
And I want them to be partners in what we're doing, but they're not parents.
So, again, do you know your grandkids? Like, celebrate the grandkids. Like, do you know which ones are the wiggles? You know, do you know which ones would want to go to the zoo with you? Do you know which ones would love to go to a bookstore and hang out with you?
Because they absolutely love books. Do you know who you should take to a craft store? Because if they had their way, they'd spend a hundred dollars in a moment, you know, in a craft store. Do you know who they are? And then do you celebrate that and hang out with them?
Do you send them snail mail? You know, do you do Marco Polo videos? Do you do FaceTime when you can? Again, do what you can, whether they're living near or far, and to relate to them, not as parents, because you're not a parent. I'm smiling because of my humor here, because another great colloquialism I've come across is.
Grandparents and grandchildren have a common enemy. The adult children. Yes, yes. And again, it's it can be hard. It's just funny in that way.
It's casting humor into the situation. But there is it's you know, the one thing about grandparenting that seems so different, and I haven't experienced that yet, but Um you're at far more peace. Which should be an indication for adult parents. How do we be more like mom and dad who are kind of chill when the kids are over at their house? Hopefully.
Yes, hopefully. And you know, the little things don't get corrected, like the spills and the, eh, that's okay. It happens. But I kind of love that concept. There's something different about the way, and grandchildren respond to that.
They feel really deeply loved by their. by their grandparents because they're not on a behavioral tick list. Right, in my opinion, when it's healthy. Right, no, that's a really good point. I think one of the things that can be awkward is, especially if you don't live close to the grandchildren, they might not know you all that well.
You know, one of the things I've sometimes spoken about is this reality that we are family, but it doesn't necessarily mean that they're gonna love you like they love their parents. They hardly know you. Like they might not even understand that you are the mom and dad of my dad.
So my knees as an example, my knees. It has a beautiful wall of family portraits, and she has three young children. She regularly points out to the young children who all of us are. I only see my great nieces and nephew every other year, but they know I'm Aunt Kathy, and they know that I'm their grandpa's sister, like Peanut is the sister of JD, right? They know that family relationship, and that has really helped me relate with them.
And so I think the adult children can do a good job of helping their children understand who Grand and Grandpa are, and why Graham and Grandpa want to spend time with you, and why grandpa wants to come to your soccer game. Yeah, Dr. Kathy, we have that declaration of release that we talked about last time. It's a free download online. Stressors involved when you release and the child comes back become a boomerang.
So, I've experienced that with all of our kids. All six have bounced back at one time or another. There are things that went well and other things that were unanticipated. What are some of the stressors related to a child moving back in? Oh, I appreciate your vulnerability so much, John.
Could I answer a different question first? Could I just say to our parents that it's not necessarily true that they've done anything wrong? It might actually be the highest compliment an adult child could ever pay you is to come back home. Our economy is terrible right now. It's possible that your adult child has a good college degree, had or still has a great job, but can't afford to live in an apartment by himself because it, and that's true.
I'm not making this up the $3,000 a month. Yes. And so they need to go somewhere. Would you rather have them in a dive with four guys where they're hardly living? Or would you rather open up the old bedroom or the guest room or the basement and say to your son, hey, you know, come establish some life here and get yourself out of debt, and then we'll help you launch again.
So again, we haven't necessarily done anything wrong that they've bounced back. It's possible that they are immature. It's possible that they weren't discerning and they've, you know, had a relationship that wasn't healthy. And again, they're coming back home.
Now, I do write about the benefit of having some type of a contract in place. You know, how long will you be here? And are you expected to share chores? Are you expected to contribute to the finances? Like, will you buy any groceries?
I know of some families that don't do that. They just welcome them back home and they trust that there'll be a rhythm that's appropriate. And to God be the glory, that has happened. Other families, because they know the adult child is maybe takes and doesn't give, and they're concerned about that, that they do establish some kind of policy first. But I think, again, if you have space.
What a glorious thing, but still, John, this must be so challenging, right? They've been independent for a season, they're coming back home, and they don't want the parent. They want the guide consultant, they might want the cash bag, you know, but they don't necessarily want the parent. And maybe this is why you have to have that conversation. What are your expectations if we say yes, you can move back in?
Yeah, you know, so much of this sounds like conversations to make sure you have. Yes, sir. I think we can underestimate that, especially if you haven't developed that pattern when they were teens. And so, you know, getting into that groove as you've talked today, I've thought of those conversations that are important to have, even in the grandparenting space, for example. What expectation do you have of your mom and I as grandparents?
What do we need to know so we don't offend you? We want to be in this together with you.
So, what do you want to tell us that we need to be mindful of, whether it's sugar or movies or whatever they want? And then you need to abide by that. I love that. Yes, have the conversation. Show them that you want to be really good team players and then abide by that.
Oh, that's the challenge, right? Yeah. Because you sneak little candy into your pocket. No, and this is where the the parents need to understand, I don't have to buy my grandkids' love. I don't have to buy them a cell phone, especially if the parents have said no.
And I don't have to bring candy, and I don't have to let them stay up late because I want to be popular with them. No, those are inappropriate decisions that we make out of some desperate need to be loved, but we don't manipulate and we don't buy love. Ideally, that's not what's happening here. And if somebody's listening, saying, Oh, Kathy, I just did that last week, you know, it's okay. Because again, you didn't know it last week, but you know it now.
So I would love for you to stand strong in your relationship and speak well of your kids and your grandkids. You know, Kathy, one of the things that we hear from parents of adult children here at Focus can be any kind of addictions that are occurring. We haven't talked about any of that, but adult children that are really struggling, not just launch failure, but they're addicted to drugs or addicted to some other thing that is hampering their ability to function as a healthy adult. What kind of parameters do you suggest parents look at in that regard because we've talked about, you know, leaving them to God and this could be their valley that needs to be addressed and they need to find their way. But I think the Lord's good with Providing a rope to help them climb out of the hole.
But what does that look like so that it's not. Um detrimental. But helpful. No, thanks for bringing that up, and I love the way you worded the question. Again, this is pretty individualized, so it's a little bit challenging here, even in writing the book.
But again, Do you know enough to know what would be helpful? What have they tried? What haven't they tried? How motivated are they? Are they concerned?
Are they angry? Do they feel manipulated by the system? You know, what's going on there? But you have a right as the parent to have a standard and a boundary. Like you're not allowed in our home as a user.
You know, we can't, maybe you have younger siblings, right?
So if you're parenting kids in the home and you have an adult child who's addicted and unhealthy, maybe not even addicted, but depressed in a dangerous way, anxious in a way that would not be healthy to be around the younger kids, you have a right to say, you know, sorry, you can come for dinner, but we can't have you stay the night because you're just not a healthy example to our family of how to live an abundant life in Christ. You have a right to do that. You have to decide if that's the best thing to do. And then you say to your kids, you know, how can we help? Can we help?
How can we help? What do you need? Help me understand what's going on here. You know, why did you can ask if you have permission to do so? Why did you make the decisions you made?
You know, what are you lacking? I guarantee you. And Jim, you know this as the president here of Focus, that they're trying to meet a need. in an unhealthy way. Yeah.
They have a need for something. They have a need for belonging. And they've chosen to belong to the community of addicted people because they're welcomed there. No, you can teach them that they can be welcomed elsewhere. That you can abstain from liquor or drugs or pharmaceuticals or whatever it might be.
And we can be your belonging. You know, and we'll welcome you home. And let's go out to dinner every Tuesday night, et cetera, et cetera. I also want to say to the parents who are listening in its hard moment, your son is more than addicted. He still is creative.
He still is your firstborn? He still is a brother. He still is a grandson. He still is a sound engineer. You know, he still is a guy with a heart of gold.
Addiction robbed him and is controlling him, but he's more than that. And when we just like an appearance, is more than appearance. which is a helpful reminder that you can't rely just on your children to have all your needs met. It's inappropriate. And so I think that might be something that we would think about.
That's really good. And Jim, what if I would also say that we start by being sad? You know, when you're a parent of a young child, you get to be the problem solver.
Now you're the Parents of an adult kid. And you might have permission from a child to be part of the solution, but you might not.
So can we love anyway? And can we be sad before we're mad? Yeah. Compassion for the mess that our son or daughter is in. Could that be our motivation to pray more and to love differently and to introduce them to mentors, et cetera?
You have a right to your sadness. You have a right to your disappointment. And please don't look back assuming you did something wrong. This is where the what-if and the if-only parenting can kill you. It's possible that you did everything right.
And I know what I know. You did what you knew how to do. I write in the book: don't look back with today's wisdom. Since you raised these children, you have read more parenting books, prayed more prayers, memorized more scripture, listened to more sermons, and listened to more broadcasts that focus on the family. And now that you know what you know, you look back and you think, How could I have been so stupid?
You weren't stupid back then. You did what you knew how to do. So we look forward with hope. Yeah. Kathy, I love the conversation.
And again, the book content is very good. And it's right on point for these parents of adult children that are struggling. We've covered a lot of the content, but nowhere near all of it.
So people need to get a copy of the book and start reading it for themselves and dig in and be a student of life about what is true and what can be. And how you need to behave in all of it as the adult, the more adult adult, right? Yeah, the mature one, hopefully. But thank you so much for being with us. And again, this is really, really good.
And who doesn't want to resolve conflict and find peace and hope with your adult children? The title of your book, which is right on. Thank you. Get a copy from us here at Focus on the Family. And if you can make a gift of any amount, we'll send you the book as a gift and our way of saying thank you for being part of the ministry and helping other families to do well.
And we're so thankful for friends like you who support this ministry. Our research shows that over the past 12 months, our joint efforts have helped more than 80,000 parents work through a significant crisis in their parenting. And I'm proud of that. In fact, I have a story from one such parent that said, Focus on the Family has greatly impacted us over the years. Thank you for helping us raise our family, strengthen our marriage, and For supporting and encouraging us in everyday life, we recently became monthly supporters and are so grateful to be part of this wonderful ministry.
Well, thank you, Tracy, for sending us that note. And that's it. Doing it together is how this gets done.
So thank you for supporting the ministry. Yeah, be part of the team when you call 800, the letter A in the word family, or stop by the show notes to make a donation. And if your family is traveling this summer, we hope you make plans to include focus on the family. Stop by. We have a wonderful welcome center with a self-guided tour through the history of our ministry, along with a great play place for kids based on our popular Adventures in Odyssey programs and a world-class bookstore as well.
Thanks for listening to Focus on the Family with Jim Daly. I'm John Fuller inviting you back as we once again help you and your family thrive in Christ. Hey parents, for almost 40 years, Adventures in Odyssey has been helping kids like yours form relationships with Christ.
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