Overturning the Roe v. Wade decision and wiping out constitutional desire to reproductive health. You've heard the headlines.
Now it's time to take action. Nearly 80% of Americans agree that we should have the power to make our own decisions about our bodies and futures, not lawmakers. Planned Parenthood is here to ensure that everyone has access to essential, high-quality health care, and they are here for the long haul. Patients count on Planned Parenthood. Planned Parenthood counts on you.
Donate at plannedparenthood.org slash defend. Mint is still $15 a month for premium wireless. And if you haven't made the switch yet, here are 15 reasons why you should. One. It's $15 a month.
Two. Seriously, it's $15 a month. Three, no big contracts. Four, I use it. Five, my mom uses it.
Are you playing me off? That's what's happening, right?
Okay. Give it a try at mintmobile.com/slash switch. Upfront payment of $45 per three month plan, $15 per month equivalent required. New customer offer first three months only, then full price plan options available. Taxes and fees extra.
See mintmobile.com. You might know her as J-Lo or Jenny from the Block, and you're probably familiar with her music, her movies, and her many romances. This is Jane Pauley. Jennifer Lopez talks about her latest starring role in Kiss of the Spider-Woman with Sunday morning's Lee Cowan. I'm excited.
I'm excited to. For people to see the movie. the message of it I really am into and believe in. that people should see each other for their humanity, not for who they are on the outside. But You should be able to love.
who you want to love and Yeah, I think it's a beautiful message. Were you nervous about how it would be received? You know, Kiss of the Spider-Woman has had many iterations, from the book, Manuel Puig's novel, to the movie in the 80s with Raul Julia and Bill Hurt, and then in the 90s, the musical with Cheetah Rivera, and now this iteration. And, you know, I think for every generation, it's a little, it stirs things up, but I think that. It's what it was meant to do.
That piece of work that he wrote back then, it's not done. The message is not done yet. People need to keep hearing it. And so it doesn't surprise me that it came back around again. Especially now.
Similar message, but it's interpreted differently by different. in times of hate, uh Love is the is the answer. Right? And that's really what the movie's about. Was it a risk, you think?
At all. A risk to take to do the movie? Yeah. No, when I read it, I thought, I. You know It's funny, I I'm not one of those people who look at something and think Oh, what could go wrong here?
I always think what could go right, all the things that could go right. Maybe that's a you know Being too optimistic, but that is how I approach things. And when I read it, I was in bed reading the script that had been sent to me, and I. I just loved it. I loved the interaction between the two main characters, Molina and Valentin.
I loved how they introduced Aurora. And what she was like, and how Molina is Aurora in a way. And that I got to sing, and I got to dance, and I got to act, and I got to be an old Hollywood movie star. When I came up in the world, that's all I wanted to do with my life was to do movies and musicals. When I read it, I just thought, yes.
I had no, maybe I should have, but I had no, no trepidations at all. This is what I've been waiting for my whole life. I've been waiting for this movie my whole life. Because that's how you saw yourself as a little girl? No.
you know Kind of old Hollywood glam. the glam of it, but also just like the movies, the the optimism of it. There was a lot about it that I loved. And I grew up in, yeah, the fantasy of it. I grew up on musicals.
My mom loved musicals, and so I saw every musical you could think of. She was a fanatic and a film fanatic as well, but really loved musicals because she loved dancing and singing around the living room, and so did I. And we would, me and my two sisters would do it with her. And so it was something that I always, you know, kind of wanted to do. To that point, Bilkondon said that each of you had to have like a certain quality quality and for Valentin, it was strength, and for Melina, it was vulnerability, but for you, You just have to be Magnetic, you just had magnetism.
Okay, yeah. I think also the thing with Aurora. and the Spider-Woman and Inguad Ludan what they all have in common. is that They're looking for love in a way. in different ways.
One through as a performer, the other one in the movie, Spider-Woman, all she wants is a kiss. And Aurora just feels cursed like she can't find the right love. And I think That's why Molina's character Really identifies with her so much because he wants the same thing. And I think that's true for all human beings. Bill Condon also said that if you hadn't been interested in it, he might not have done it.
Like you had it. You had to do it or he didn't know what he was going to do. Yeah. Obviously that's very flattering. Um He he told me some of the reasons.
He was like, you know, I know that you can Do the numbers from top to bottom without cutting. I won't have to do coverage. And I was like, he goes, because I want to shoot it like the real old 50s musicals, but they used to do it in the long, long takes. And I was like, But we'll do some coverage, right? He was like, No, no coverage on this one.
I was like, a little closer. No, no. And so that was scary for me. That part of it was scary 'cause when you came on, it was like doing a performance in front of everybody from top to bottom. Whereas when you're shooting a film, there's a little bit of a comfort where you go, okay, I could do another take, I could do that better, or you know what, I'll do this.
You can use the second half of this and the first half of this, and it's like, no. You're gonna start from the beginning, and you're gonna go all the way through, all the way through to the end, where you're in a nightmare. What? Yeah, it's it's crazy. How many numbers would you do?
A wheat. I mean It was a tight schedule. It was an independent film. And we had like I think it was three and a half weeks to do the musical part, and three and a half weeks to do the prison, or four weeks to do the prison. It was a close schedule, yeah.
So, how many different numbers in all? I didn't count, but I think there's like. Ten or eleven? Wow. Musical numbers?
Yeah. So every day you were doing a musical number. every day and sometimes in six hours. And it was like Please, can I do it again? We got it.
It's fine. I was like, oh my god But I would have liked I would have had the I would have love the luxury of having more time to do the whole thing. But Because you're a perfectionist or yes. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, I I do. I I want things to be as great as they can be always. And you knew there were a couple of things that Could have done that one thing better. But he didn't. I don't think I would ever, it's funny, and Bill knows this, like, I would ever be satisfied.
So he had to call it. You know what I mean? Otherwise, you'd be there forever. Yes, or otherwise, he'd just be there forever. Yeah.
Sounds like there were a lot of discussions about how the film was going to be different from. stage productions and one of those was it was Finally, a Latin story told by Latin people, which it had never been before. Right. And that was really important to Bill, which I loved. and important to me as well as a producer on the film.
Um it is a It is a love letter in a way to the Latin community and to the queer community, this movie, because in a time like this, where those communities are being demonized and marginalized. Right. This is a Big movie with three Latin stars in it, with the lead being from the queer community as well. Again, I feel like this story, as many times as it's been told, needed to be told again. in this way.
And yeah, it's different than the musical. in that way. Yeah. But it's also a different time. And it's time for that.
Talk a little bit about the wardrobe, because the clothes you wore were kind of critical to keeping the glamour part. Yes. But they had to be functional too.
Well, they were not always functional. You know, Colleen is a master and It was funny, I it was different working with her than any other costume designer I've worked with. And we We had a great collaboration. She was very specific about each moment in the movie. You'll be wearing a suit for this, you'll be wearing a travel suit for that, you'll be wearing a gown, a gold gown here, is what I'm thinking.
And she let me pick shapes and let me input and input on colors and things like that. But she was very specific, and it really. helped me. I I loved it actually because usually because usually I'm in I'm very into fashion, I always have been. I'm very into clothes and how my characters are gonna look.
And when she was so specific about it, it put me right into an idea right away. Instead of me trying to like, craft it, find it. It was like, this is what this is going to be. And I go, oh, okay. Oh, I know who I am in that moment.
I know what this section should be, what it feels like. How Aurora is in that moment, or how the Spider-Woman is in that moment. And those costumes were, again, What helped bring it to life? But they really They had to move with you though. They had to move, some of them.
Um but there was always a corset. That was like, and she was like, pull it tighter, tighter, smaller waist. I was like, Jesus Christ, I have to dance in this. But I was like, yeah, pull it tighter. You know, like the gold dress was 50 pounds.
It felt like it was 50. It was so heavy. And so when they would lift me up and I would try to move my leg and do the, you know, attitude, it was just. It was a nightmare, but you know. It worked.
And when you took a look, it was because the way the dress moved and the lines of the dress, she really is a master at that. And it and it was perfect. And we'd see it on the monitor and I'd be like, Oh, I didn't even realize it would be that the costume would be that good. You know what I mean? Yeah, because you put it on and you're like, okay.
We'll see. Do I look like I'm cumbersome? And it wasn't. It really flowed just in the right way. The split was just enough to give it a flounce when I went this way.
It was. Hmm. Chef's kiss. You really had to do Two voices, too, right? There was Aurora, and then there was the Spider Woman.
Yeah. Out of all the songs, do you have one that you particularly liked? I, you know, there's one new song in the movie. It's called Never You. It's never gone anywhere.
It's never been in any of, you know, Kender and Ev had it. John wanted to put it in this movie. And when I, you know, I had all the regular songs and I had been rehearsing them, and then this song comes in, and they're like, this is a new song, nobody's ever sang it. You'll be the first one to sing it or even try it. Were you happy with it?
That's your favorite one, though? It is. It's my favorite because it's that thing of like the hopeless. belief in your the person you love. Like others might deceive me, but never you.
lead me on and leave me, but never you.
Some one else might take my trust, break my trust to two. things you'd find impossible to do. You know, and I just feel like there's a hopefulness in it that is so aurora. and everything that she's ever wanted and everything she's ever believed in. And The melody of it is not a typical melody, it's beautiful.
It feels old Hollywood, but it also feels like something. It's just gorgeous. It's very candor and ebb. dark and light. Where You Are is great because it's Ingrid Luna's song.
So that's the actual actress that he loves that is playing these two parts. And it's the one time that you get to see the actual actress and who she is and how she interacts with her fan, her biggest fan, Molina. in the movie and says you know and and how Again, how when times are awful. We turn to art and beauty and movies and music to save us. Yeah.
And um that relationship that you have, 'cause I can't tell you how many times I've been out in the world and someone has come up to me and says you know that song Helped me through the worst time in my life, or that album, you know, when my mom died, you know, got me through. Like, there's so many things that you don't. You don't even understand, and when you have that with people, and they tell you something like that, you instantly have a bond with them, yeah. That transcends knowing them personally. It's a very special relationship.
your fans with with you and you what your fans do for you. 'Cause they keep you alive and they don't even know it. you know, in your rough times. It's a really touching thing and that's what where you are is really about. You know, it's like, come with me.
Come, be a movie star with me. Come on, let's go play in the fantasy world and we'll be okay. Everything's okay there. It's beautiful. And that's what the movie's about too.
How physically demanding was it? I mean, people have seen you do all kinds of things on stage, but this was like back to back to back to back. Yeah, it drained me. It drained me, but it was one of the most exhilarating things I've ever done. Again, because I had dreamt of doing it for so long.
Yeah. And I really sometimes couldn't believe it was happening. Were there some pinch-me moments? Yes, many. Yeah.
Many. Singing Kiss of the Spider-Woman in the studio with. uh with John Kandor there. And then doing it on the set, singing a visit when he was there on the set. Those were like.
Am I working with Kandor and Eb score, me original s like what? What is happening right now? And there were so. Powerful the songs and Knowing that I was bringing that to the movies for the first time. was in stepping into the shoes of the great Cheetah Rivera and and Sonia Braga, i i it was It's a legacy.
Yeah. given the responsibility of. And so Yeah. In the back of my mind, I think it was always there. You know, but also I I kind of let it go and understood that I had to make it my own.
I had to do it in my way, and this was a different interpretation than the musical or the original movie or even. The novel. Like you said, you idolized Tita Rivera since you were a little bit more. I did, and Rita Moreno booked. And Reader Moreno.
Yeah, those were my girls. The dancer, singer, actresses. Yep. And what was it about them? Did your mom introduce you to them?
Latinas really made a big difference. You know, that's why I kind of. You saw yourself. Yes, 100%. One hundred percent.
And that was a big deal for me. I think representation in media, movies is so huge. I know it changed my life. If it wasn't for Rita Mirando and West Side Story, I would not be doing what I did with my life. and what I'm doing.
How many times do you think you saw a West Side story? I honestly couldn't count. Really? Yeah. So many.
Originally. It wasn't like, oh, I've seen it about five times. No, I've seen it hundreds of times. I feel like so much. Yeah.
You'd said that growing up in the Bronx, it was. that sort of I think you described the Bronx as kind of brown, but like escaping in the technicolor. And gray. Right. That's my phrase for, yeah.
But the technicolor of movie musicals is what you escaped from. 100%. Yeah. Yeah, the musicals made me. Feel like there was more to the world out there.
Because when you grew up in New York, it's like your block. You know, it's like a very jenny from the block. It's like you're a block, a little radius, you know everybody. You get on the train to go to Manhattan, it's a whole big deal. You know what I mean?
Like, it's. But there's another world out there, and we didn't do that often. You know, we didn't go into the city. We just lived in, I went to school across the street. We went shopping down the block.
You know what I mean? It was just like, it was all right. My grandmother lived a couple of blocks away. We visited her. You know, it was just.
A small thing. And when I saw these musicals, and I saw there was like a bright, colorful world out there. And it made me kind of want to reach for that Did you guys go to the movies or were you watching them at home? We did go to the movies. We did go to the movies.
But a lot of the musicals I saw at home, my mom looked for them. Oh, the music man is playing on Thanksgiving. We'll watch it, you know, that day, or WhatsApp Story or any of those things. We'll have more from our Sunday morning extended interview. after this break.
It's the Smuckers Uncrustables podcast with your host, Uncrustables.
Okay, today's guest is Rough Around the Edges. Please welcome Crust. Thanks for having me. Today's topic, he's round with soft pillowy bread. Hey, filled with delicious PBJ.
Are you talking about yourself? And you can take him anywhere. Why do you invite him? And we are out of time. Are you really cutting me off?
Uncrustables are the best part of the sandwich.
Sorry, Crust. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game?
Well, with the name Your Price tool from Progressive? you can find options that fit your budget and potentially lower your bills. Try it at progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law.
Not available in all states. You use the same. choreographer, right, that Chita Rivera did? Yes, Sergio was actually in the production in the 90s musical. He was a dancer with her there.
And so he remembered dancing with her and performing with her. And um It was I'm just thinking of Sergio right now because he's such a beautiful man. He's such a Kind man and such a dancer, choreographer at heart, and he was like. The first day, you know, I'm kind of used to moving at my own pace, and people, you know, sometimes can come in and they just kind of feel me out or whatever.
Sometimes, when you've been doing things a long time, they're like, okay, let's see how this goes. He wasn't like that at all. He was like, come on. Let's dance. And I was like, what?
I was like, I'm not ready. And he was like, come on, you know it. You've been practicing it for a couple days. I know you know it. And we danced and later on um In the week he said to me you know, I almost cried when we Dance the first time.
because it was the closest that I've ever felt. when I dance with Cheetah. Wow. And I said, Oh god, thank you. He goes, It just felt the same.
That's pretty high praise. It was amazing. And um We had so much fun. We had so much fun doing it. and he was such a A great champion of making sure I was like, Is my hand in the right place?
Is this in the right place? He was like, It looks great. You're doing great. Everyone said they were surprised that you were always so prepared. You never came to sell it.
You know, that's, I think for me, it's the only way I feel confident. Is when I've rehearsed. And I'm like, I know it. No matter what happens, I know it. It's not that you're not going to make mistakes, it's not that you might not.
do something perfectly, but at least I know it. If I made a mistake, it's it's fine. Yeah. But there's nothing worse than Feeling like you don't have it mastered or under your belt, and going out there and performing. That for me is like the worst feeling in the world.
How long were you prepping? Um, I would say we started shooting in March. I was prepping the songs right after January first. I started like every single day. Nailing the songs, every single note, making sure I knew all the changes and the chords and everything.
I mean, it was just really getting there. And I was started even before we started rehearsal, I started doing dance rehearsal and brushing up on my like Broadway jazz, which I hadn't done in years. Yeah. And kind of getting myself back into that. version of myself, which I haven't done forever.
Does it feel like it's kind of your Selena moment. It's funny, I feel like this is This is Tone Donatio's Selena moment. Yeah. And I told him that. It's funny you bring that up.
'Cause we were sitting in the ballroom one day Where I'm in the black and gold dress and with the fringes and I do the whole dance. And we were sitting there, and he's passing me the cigarette, and we're sitting there, you know, being our characters in character. And I was like, you know, this is When I look at you, and he was doing so great. I said, This reminds me when I did Selena. You get this part given to you at at a young age.
And he was a lot like me. Like, I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna hearse, I wanna do this. He was very full of life. like understood the assignment. Yeah.
And I thought that that was great. And I go, I just saw myself in him. And I said, this is your Selena moment. I was like, make sure that you remember it. This is Going to go fast.
And he was like, Yeah. Did anyone give you that advice for you? Until we get it. to take it slow and remember it, savor it. Eddie almost gave me tons of advice.
It's funny because we just finished the movie together for the first time again in years since Selena. Oh, wow. And he played My Dad again in the the film I just did called Office Romance. Yeah. Yeah, he was fantastic.
And Um He gave me tons of advice. I remember on the day that we were shooting the big stadium scene for Selena. at the Astrodome, which was her last concert. and I came out in the purple jump suit and the whole thing. And I had rehearsed and rehearsed and rehearsed.
I was so prepared. And I came out, and he was like, I don't know if I was a little stiff or I was just doing all of the steps and whatever. And he comes over to me, he goes, you know it. Let it go. Yeah.
let it go. Just ha just have fun up there. Just be Selena. you know how much she loved to perform. You've done all the research, you've heard all the stories.
Just do it. And it was the best advice because I just went up there and I just listened to the roar of the crowd and smiled. and thought about How much of a big deal that must have been to her at that point in her career to sell out the Astrodome in that way and 70,000 people. And how she smiled walking up to the stage and I just let it rip and it was the best advice I ever got. Did you do the same thing?
For this? Let it rip. I just let it rip. I totally let it rip. And I had to.
I didn't have a lot of time. I guess that's true. When you were growing up though, you weren't really the singer in the family, you were the dancer in the family. I was the dancer. Right?
Yeah, 'cause my sister w wanted to sing opera. And yeah, and do musical theater and stuff like that. And I kind of like, you know, the pop radio hits.
So she was known as the singer in our family. And you were the dancer? I was the dancer and like the pop girl, you know. When did you want to do the singer-actor combination. I've always wanted to do it because I loved musicals.
That's where it started. I wanted to do it. and I think I just had to build up confidence. to step out of the role that I was given in my family. Mm.
To Say, I am also a singer, and I am also a dancer, and I am also an actor, and I am. I can do all of these things and Yeah, I'm gonna do them. Yeah, yeah, I think I am. Was it hard getting your first agent because they sort of saw you more as a Dancer than an actor? No, um oh gosh, my first agent.
Well, I was at a dance agency and then I got called in to do A Pilot. And they wouldn't represent me because they were like, oh no, you're a dancer. You're not a real actor. And I was like, no, I am. I'm an actor.
and I have been studying acting. People, when they see you first is one thing, it's hard for them to see you as something else. And you just have to show them. You can't let that discourage you. I understood that they didn't know or understand that I was an actor or that I had been working on that.
But then I went out and got the job. From one of their clients. Oh, yeah. We were both up for it. Yeah.
And then I got it. And then they were like, we'll represent you. It was that easy. Um did you It's not easy. Not easy.
Not easy at all. Did you struggle, you think, to be taken seriously? At first. At first, At first then maybe N always? I don't know.
A little bit. A little bit. And maybe it's just me and my own head. I don't know. I've always felt a bit of the underdog.
Yeah. definitely misunderstood. But it comes with the territory of being I think in the public eye. Yeah. People are not going to really know who you are.
Know your heart, and then they see it, and then they go, Oh, yeah, that's who she is. And then they hear something, and they go, Oh, no, that's not who she is. You know, they get confused, and I get it, I understand, but I stay steady. Yeah. I stay steady and that's the most important thing I think.
I don't change. I grow, but I don't change. When it comes to acting, I mean you've been with Robert Redford and George Clooney and Robin Williams and Jane Fonda and everybody else, how could you not be taken seriously? Yeah. I know.
I don't know. I mean, I guess if you had an answer for that, you'd No, why, but yeah. I I don't know.
Some of the more serious roles, like Hustler and Selena, those were roles that you really hoped. Would Have people take you more seriously, right? Yeah. Because they're more serious. Yeah.
You know, not rom-com kind of thing. And I think they did. I think they were both received in a way. Where people were very kind about those roles for me. You know, they really liked them and There was good notices on them.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, did you feel like you had moved into a different Place with Selena? Yeah, and. Yeah.
People more seeing you as the. Yeah, well, Selena and Hustlers were so far apart, right? Like, so Selena was a different part of my career. And yeah, when I did that, That's when I realized I wanted to, you know, be a recording artist as well. And I wanted to go for that.
So there were different moments in my life where I was like, okay, I know I'm an actress, I know I can do movies, and I also want to do this. Can I also do that? Yeah, other people have done it. Barbara Streisand did it, my for my favorite musical funny girl. I could do it too, you know, and find my own way to do that and fulfill my own dreams and then with hustlers at that point in my career, it was just Nice to get that.
You know, to have the biggest film of my career at that time, at that age, it was amazing.
So, why Kiss with the Spider-Woman now, specifically? I mean Because it's the thing I honestly have been waiting for forever. Yeah. And I hope to do much more of. And I don't know like where This will take me.
But I know that that's what I want to do. Which is what I've always wanted to do, I guess, just to sing and dance and act. That's always been my thing. Yeah. I mean, musicals give you a little bit of a message.
Musicals give you that opportunity. Right, that's what I was going to say. You never really. were given that opportunity before to do all three. No.
No. I did Selena, but that was her voice, yeah. This movie is very personal for me. Um I have people in my family who are part of the queer community and When I understand the representation and seeing Rita Moreno and what that did for my life, I know how important it is for them to see characters like that. and characters that are strong and Resilient and beautiful and full of love, and we're another character.
who Diego plays. Who is a straight cis man, revolutionary, tough guy, can fall in love and really see the humanity. that doesn't matter what the outer shell is, it matters who you are inside. and you can see the humanity in another person. That pure love is something I think is so important.
right now. You think that's the theme at the end of the day for this? I do. Yeah. I do, and I think that's what.
Manuel and Yeah. when he first wrote the novel. for people to see humanity. the humanity in everyone. You've always talked about inclusion.
and love and acceptance. And this is sort of another extension of that. Yeah, you know, this movie has all the things for me because it does talk about love and the quest for it. and trying to find it. And that's been a big theme in my life and in my artistic career.
And then it has. The queer community aspect to it, which is also very personal, close to my heart. And then it's three Latino leads. which is also something that I've been and my production company has been you know, championing since the beginning New Year Regan productions. It's like That's part of it, is making sure that there's representation and in big Hollywood films.
And this is a big, beautiful Hollywood musical. It's not just a musical on a very small budget, but it's still big. You look at it and you don't think this is a small budget movie. Wow. You know, donatillu is always, we were always talking about Latin excellence.
Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Latino excellence at its best. When you did Let's Get Loud, did you know how much that was going to resonate, I guess, with the LGBT community?
That it Let's Get Loud? Yeah. Yeah, it's funny. You don't always realize everything. You know, when I decided to do the cages at the Super Bowl with all the little girls in it, all the little Latin girls in it.
um because of what politically was going on at that moment. I didn't know if they were going to let that fly. Maybe they didn't. And they almost didn't. But we snuck it in.
And using Let's Get Loud and Born in the USA and all of that, and making that statement. and singing that with my child there. and them screaming that back to me. Cause I'm gonna live my life. Mm.
That was one Most of all. Yeah. I'm sorry. Oh, I didn't know it was gonna catch me like that. It was one of the best moments of my life.
Just to see them there, yeah, and being so joyful and happy and. being exactly who they were. It was beautiful. I've read somewhere where there were a lot of people who Beyonce and Lady Gagon and these people did musicals relatively soon after they kind of were Yeah. You just never got that opportunity?
Uh no. Um, I I auditioned for a Vita before I recorded music, back back back in the day. Yeah. But Madonna already had the part and so, you know, they were just seeing people, I guess. I don't know.
Really? They do that sometimes. Yeah, you never know what what happens, but or why they do it, but Did you know that? I didn't when I went in. Yeah.
And then I did the audition for Alan Parker. It was it's a very funny story. I go into audition for a Vita and I sing my heart out rehearsing, you know, the song all week and whatever and and the scene. And I do it and he finishes. He goes, You're wonderful.
You're amazing. He goes, You know, Madonna has the part, right? I said, Oh. Yeah, no, of course, yes. He's like, okay, but thank you.
And that was it. That was the end of it. Yeah. Chicago, did you audition for Chicago? I did not audition for Chicago.
I did audition for nine. Yeah. I auditioned for nine and I remember getting very close. For it was me and Penelope Cruz, and they wound up giving it to Penelope. I remember getting that.
Call. and being devastated. Being very sad. But Penelope did a great job, and I love, I worship Penelope. She's amazing.
And then there was Bye Bye Birdie was gonna be a thing, right? Bye-bye Birdie was gonna be a thing, and then that never happened. Listen, this was the first one I was meant to do. I'm fine with all the things that happened. I trust the journey And this is something I'm very excited for everybody to see.
I had to play three roles. Very different. from who I am. From anything you've done. And from anything I've done and You know, they were very distinct roles with very distinct emotional moments in the in the movie that were beautiful.
It was a it was a blessing. You've been in this spot before where folks are talking about hinting about Oscars and other big awards. Where do you where do you Put those expectations. I don't put them in. I don't.
I learned my lesson last time. But also, I think the joy for me. doing it. every single moment. It's great to be in the conversation.
Yeah. Uh among that you're like you're doing work that people recognize and that they love. That's enough. And it's not that you can't want more, or that you don't want to stand up there and say thank you. Of course, we all want that.
I realized that I don't need it. In the way that maybe I thought when I was younger. Yeah. Not that I wouldn't love it. I just want to do that though, disclaimer.
Not that I want to. Yeah. I'd be very grateful for that too. Yeah. Just put that out in the universe.
Grateful for all the things. Mm-hmm. Um When you were doing this, it was such a hard time in your personal life. How did you manage to? to deal with that.
Yeah. It was tough. It was a tough time. Yeah. It was a really tough time.
And then Affleck is also one of the producers. He is, right? The movie wouldn't have been made if it wasn't for. him in artist equity. Is that right?
Yeah. That is right. And I will always give him that credit. Because he was always pushing it or? No, because they financed it.
They did. Yeah. Yeah. I told him that this was a role I was born to play and I wanted to do it and he was like, okay. and he helped make it happen.
was making it kind of a refuge for you a little bit. To just get out there and not think about stuff. It was. It was hard not to think about stuff, but It it was like the best and the worst of times. in a way.
Because it was every moment on set and every moment I was doing this role, I was so happy. And then it was like back home it was not great. And it was just like, oh you know, how do I reconcile this? Um But you get through it. And you know Honestly, I have to say It was the best thing that ever happened to me.
Because it changed me. Yeah. It didn't change me. It helped me grow in a way that I needed to grow. Um Become more self-aware.
I'm a different person now than I was last year. I think, a year and a half ago. You do seem like I mean, I don't know you at all, but you seem like you're in a good place. You seem happy and confident. I am.
And that this summer was like probably the best summer I've ever had. I had so much fun. I'm able to enjoy things more and be grateful. I'm so grateful for them that I'm able to enjoy them more. And I don't have as much pressure.
It's like when you asked about the Oscar thing, it's like, I don't put that pressure on myself anymore. I realize that the joy is in living. and these moments and really embracing life. And everything that it brings to you, for the lessons that it brings, and then for all the triumphs that it brings, and the hard times are the lessons, and you have to understand that. You have to understand that, and once you do.
everything just becomes a little bit lighter and you can really really fly. And I feel like If that hadn't happened, I wouldn't I wouldn't understand that. Does it feel like you're flying now? Yes, it does. It does.
And I still feel like I want to fly higher. I want to see more, I want to do more things, you know, and But I'm going to savor them in a way that maybe in my twenties and my thirties I didn't. I'm Jane Pauley. Thank you for listening. And for more of our extended interviews, follow and listen to Sunday morning on the free Odyssey app.
or wherever you get your podcasts. Starting your own business can be intimidating. Suddenly, you're wearing all the hats. Designer, marketer, customer support, shipping expert. It's a lot.
That's where Shopify comes in. Shopify is the global commerce platform powering millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e-commerce in the US. Shopify has your back. With hundreds of ready-to-use templates, you can launch a beautiful, professional online store that looks and feels like you. Need content?
Shopify's AI tools can help you write product descriptions, headlines, even enhance your product photos. Want to grow your reach? Easily create email and social media campaigns to meet your audience wherever they're scrolling. And with Shopify's world-class support, you'll have expert help for everything. Turn your big business idea into with Shopify on your side.
Sign up for your one dollar per month trial and start selling today at Shopify dot com slash Odyssey Podcast. Go to Shopify dot com slash Odyssey Podcast. Shopify dot com slash Odyssey Podcast.
Now streaming on Paramount Plus. In 2020, a lip-syncing nobody took over the internet. What's up, guys? For new joiners, it's your boy Whitey. And also, your mom.
I've been blusting after William White, who's younger than my son. I feel like a lot of my fans needed to feel young again. Like, Gaina sparked back. I've probably given him anywhere from $100,000 to $200,000. Thirst Trap, the fame, the fantasy, the fallout.
Now streaming on Paramount Plus.
