What Happens When We Die? | Sunday Message With Max Lucado

Hey there. Thanks for listening to the Greg Laurie Podcast, a ministry supported by Harvest Partners. I'm Greg Laurie encouraging you. If you want to find out more about Harvest Ministries and learn more about how to become a Harvest Partner, just go to harvest.org. And it's a great honor for me to be here with you.

I'm so, so, so excited to talk to you and talk with you today about one of my favorite topics. And that is where do we go when we die? Where do we go when we die? I love what you're doing through Harvest and the wonderful work of the Crusade.

I keep following from a distance. Everything that's happening here, 6,500 people baptized in the last 12 months at Pirate's Cove. My goodness, I'm tempted to go there and get baptized myself just to be a part of it. Hello to all of you in Maui. Hello to all of you at Orange County.

Hello to all of you watching online. You don't need the reminder. You don't want the reminder.

But nevertheless, here it comes. We're all getting older. Each day brings us closer to a final breath, a final heartbeat, a final sigh. Raise your hand if you're younger today than you were yesterday.

And for those of you who did, I've got a sermon on honesty I'm going to bring next time. Death comes to all of us. It comes to the young.

It comes to the old, the rich, the poor, the decadent, the decent, the king and the commoner. Given that we're all headed somewhere, shouldn't we know where we're headed? Given that we're all headed somewhere, shouldn't we know where we are headed? Shouldn't we give our journey some serious thought? In fact, shouldn't our destination be our obsession? Of all the things we don't know, don't you think we should know what happens when we die?

This is our message topic today. What happens when we die? What happens next has been a major occupation of my puny brain over the last few years. What happens next is actually the title of a new book that's just releasing right now.

I mean, it is coming out as we're speaking. It's brand new, and it traces heaven's timeline. The Bible has so much to say about what happens next. God never wants to scare us. He just wants to prepare us, and He tells us, amen. There is a timeline in your Bible, a beginning in the book of Genesis, following all the way through the end of Revelation. The Bible tells us what to expect. Now, the next major event on heaven's timeline is what we call the rapture. The rapture is that moment in which God will supernaturally rescue His church before a time of great tribulation. Today, I'd like to answer the question, what happens if I die before the rapture? Well, I'd love to be in the rapture generation. I just think that would be the coolest thing, man.

Put me down on that list. But I don't get to determine that. And it could be that I die, and it could be that you die before the rapture. And so one question that surfaces a lot, but I don't think it's discussed enough is the answer. If I die before the rapture, where do I go?

What happens to me? Well, the Bible has an answer to that question, so let's pray and then explore it, shall we? Great Heavenly Father, we bless Your name.

We do. We honor You as our King and our Savior. Today, Father, my heart is full of gratitude for Greg and Kathy and for the great work that this work here has done and how many souls are going to heaven that would not have otherwise had You not worked through the ministry of Harvest Church. We beg You today to increase the population of heaven and speak to those hearts who are unsure. Let them know confidently where they are going when they die. Through Jesus, we pray.

Amen. Ted Williams is widely regarded as one of the greatest hitters in the history of Major League Baseball. He is the last player to bat over 400 for one season.

That happened back in 1941. These days, Ted Williams hangs out in a one-story warehouse near the Scottsdale Airport, and that's where he has been since the day after he died in 2002. Now, his curators would not like me using the word death. They prefer to use the phrase, well, he just ended his first life cycle. Now, they don't confirm nor deny the appearance of the slugger's body in the facility, but his daughter does. And according to her, when he died, excuse me, when he ended his first life cycle at the age of 83, he was packed in a crate of ice, flown to Arizona, and his body was injected with some form of deicer or antifreeze. And there he is to this day, he and 58 other bodies, and they're awaiting a Lazarus moment.

Their bodies are being held at minus 196 degrees. And they have banked their bodies on the hope of what they call reanimation, that somebody someday will discover something that will enable somebody to poke a needle or push a button and trigger life cycle number two. Now, nobody can fault the MVP for wanting a second trip to the plate. Nobody, especially a famous batter, likes to hear the words, you're out. In fact, most people dread that moment.

They are, according to the Bible, held in slavery by their fear of death. Have you noticed we don't even like to talk about it? We don't like to discuss it. No, we exercise, we take vitamins, we try to eat well, we do our very best at the thought, if we could just postpone it, just push it away. Maybe you can relate. Maybe you are held in slavery by your fear of death.

Boy, then I'm glad you're here. Because when you say yes to Jesus, your death is defeated. He is the Lord of life and death.

And of all the things that you should do in life, don't you think that you should take care of that final moment? That your fear of death should be in the hands of the man who rose from the dead and proved that he has power over life and death. Most people, however, live in utter fear of death.

And they have for a long time. Epicurus, who died in 270 BC, described death as the most dreaded of evils. The 17th century philosopher Thomas Hobbes deemed his death as my quote, last voyage, a great leap in the dark.

Robert Green Ingersoll, one of America's most outspoken agnostics, offered no words of hope at his brother's funeral. He simply said, life is a narrow veil between the cold and barren peaks of two eternities. We strive in vain to look beyond the heights.

That is such sad, depressing language. Wouldn't you agree? Can't we aspire for something greater than a great leap in the dark? Can we posture death in a more positive light than a dreaded evil? Our good God tells us that we can. You know what our good God tells us? He tells us that death is not the end, but it's really just the beginning.

And it's not something to be dreaded, it's something to be anticipated. It is a necessary moment in which this mortal body is taken away so our immortality can live forever. Wouldn't you love today to put your head on your pillow and know that if you don't awaken in this life, you'll awaken in the next life, in a wonderful life? God sees this age not as the final performance, just the opposite. God sees this age as just a casting call, just a time. Did you know that the purpose of this life is to decide where you'll spend the next life?

That's it. That's why at this service, at the end of this message, I'm going to give you an opportunity like Pastor Greg always does, to say yes to Jesus, to say yes to Jesus. Because if you say yes to Jesus, hear me, this world is as bad as it'll ever get for you. But if you say no to Jesus, this world is as good as it'll ever be for you. The purpose of this life is to determine where you'll spend the next life.

That's it. Period. And so today we're going to talk about what happens when we die because you need to know God's plan for you. Consider this assurance from the Apostle Paul.

He said, we want you to be quite certain, brothers, about those who have died. We want to make sure that you do not grieve about them like other people who what? Have no hope.

Hear me. God does not want you to have no hope. And we live in a day in which so few people have hope. And their greatest hope is to have as much fun as they can before they die.

That's it. But God has another plan. He wants you to face your future with no hope. Now the people to whom Paul wrote these words, the church in Thessalonia, had buried their share of loved ones. And Paul wanted them to know, to be quite certain, that was his phrase, quite certain, that their death was no reason for despair.

Could you benefit from the same confidence? Maybe you've buried a parent. Maybe cancer has taken the love of your life.

Maybe warm tears have fallen upon the cold face of a loved one. If so, God speaks to you, and he will transform our grief into hope-filled faith. How? By getting specific. He tells us what happens when we die.

Listen to me, please. If a Christian perishes before the rapture, before the rescue of the church, if a Christian perishes before the rapture, that person's spirit immediately enters the presence of God, and that person begins enjoying conscious fellowship with the Father and all of those who have gone before. Now where do we find such hope? Well, in the answer to three really important questions.

Here we go. Question number one, where do we go when we die? Where do we go? Well, the answer, paradise. Paradise.

That is the term Jesus used with the thief who was dying on the cross next to his. The crucified crook asked, remember me when you come into your kingdom. And then, in what is a great act of grace, Jesus told him, I tell you the truth, today you will be with me, where? In paradise. Now is paradise heaven?

Sort of. John Wesley called paradise only the front porch of heaven. It is the first stage of our eternal rest, our eternal state. It is hors d'oeuvres of our heavenly feast. It's not the final version of heaven.

It's not the ultimate expression of home. Paradise is the gathering place of the saved until Christ comes for his children. Paradise is the gathering place, the collection place of the saved until Christ comes for his children. Paul was privileged to have a peek into paradise.

Have you ever looked at this mysterious scripture from 2 Corinthians 12? He said, I was caught up into the third heaven 14 years ago. Whether I was in my body or out of my body, I don't know.

Only God knows. Yes, only God knows whether I was in my body or outside my body. But I do know that I was caught up to where, church? Paradise. And I heard things so astounding that they cannot be expressed in words that no human is allowed to tell.

Is that not fascinating language? He was caught up into the third heaven, somewhere beyond our seen universe, up in the third heaven. And he heard things that were too astounding for words. Paul, a man of words, could not find the words to describe what he saw. The experience was so splendid that Paul, he didn't even know if he was in a body or outside of a body. God knows, he said, I don't know.

And what he saw was so otherworldly that he was told not to share the details, to think. This is what your deceased loved ones are experiencing. Do you know someone in paradise?

I do too. This is what they are experiencing. It's not the domain of spooky dark spirits. It is instead the land of super abundant life. It is a joyful community of saints. Dead believers are not dead. They enjoy the presence of God.

And since nothing unholy can dwell in the presence of God, we know that they have been made holy. There is no curse, there is no temptation, there is no fear, there is no guilt, there is no regret. They are experiencing the front porch of heaven, paradise. Question number two, when do we leave for paradise?

Some of you are saying, wow, where do I sign up for that? When do we leave for paradise? I'll tell you, immediately upon death, immediately. Close your eyes on this life and you open your eyes in the next. This was the promise that Jesus gave that thief on the cross. I tell you the truth, when church?

Today. Today you'll be with me in paradise. I have a hunch that this thief, when he made this request, was hoping for some far off event in the future. In which he would be taken into the kingdom of Christ. Boy, was he in for a surprise. He went from torture to triumph. In the blink of an eye. He was instantaneously swept into the presence of God.

We can expect the same. The spirit of the believer journeys home. While the body of the believer, again this is before the rapture. The spirit journeys home while our bodies remain on earth. Yes, there is a time in which the spirit of the believer is separated from the body. Perhaps you've heard the phrase, to be absent from the body is to be at home with the Lord.

The apostle Paul coined it. He said, we would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord. Now to be clear, at the rapture our bodies and our souls will be reunited. If you're alive during the rapture, you will never go through a time in which you are separated from your body. At the rapture, our body and soul will be ushered to meet Christ in the sky. But if you or if I die before the rapture, there is a time in which our bodies will remain in some state, buried, cremated, destroyed, however they are. They will remain on earth until that great and glorious day of the rapture, in which these physical bodies will be healed.

What a moment that will be from no more cancer, no more pain, no more arthritis, nothing. However, if we die before the rapture, our bodies remain here and our souls go to heaven. The apostle Paul says, during this time we will be at home with the Lord. How many of you know we're not home yet?

We're not home. This morning I awoke in a hotel. It's a very nice hotel. I'm very grateful. Pastor Greg, thank you for putting me in a nice hotel.

It is very nice. I really like it, but it's not home. It's not home. It was unfamiliar. I walked into the wall instead of the bathroom door.

I don't know my way around. That's how we are right now, dear friends. That's why this world just feels so wacky and brokenhearted. We're not home, but your loved ones who trusted Christ are at home with the Lord. Amen.

I would applaud for that, too. There was a disciple by the name of Stephen, and as he was being martyred, he was stoned for his faith. He saw Heaven open and the Son of Man standing at God's right side. As he was near death, he prayed, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit. Safe to assume that Jesus did exactly that. Though the body of Stephen was dead, his spirit was alive.

Though his body was buried, his spirit was in the presence of Jesus himself. Now, some of you are a bit puzzled because you say in your heart, wait, Max, what about those people who spoke to me about purgatory? Aren't I supposed to go to some holding place where my sins are purged, purgatory, and where I pay penance? Have any of you ever heard that? Purgatory.

What about that? Purgatory, apparently, is that place for an undetermined length of time. We receive what our sins deserve.

We're punished for our sins so that we can rightly receive what God has prepared. Well, two problems derail this idea. Number one, we cannot pay for our sins. We can't. But Jesus can. And he already has.

He already has. None of us can endure what our sins deserve, none of us. But Jesus already has. And our, listen to me please, our purgatory occurred at Calvary. Our purgatory occurred when Jesus died for us. Our sins need to be paid for, absolutely.

But the problem is I can't do it. And you can't do it, but Jesus can. And the problem with purgatory is that it creates yet another system whereby we think we can save ourselves, and yet the unique hope of the Christian faith is that we're saved not by works, which purgatory would be a work. But we're saved by faith and the grace of Christ. Amen? Other people feel that while the body is buried, the spirit is asleep. We're sleeping.

And they come by their conviction, honestly enough. I count seven different times in two different epistles that Paul used the word sleep to describe death. And so a person could deduce that in that time between death and the return of Christ, we're all sleeping. And if such is the case, who could complain? We could all use the rest, right?

But there's a problem. When the Bible talks about those who have already died, they are not asleep. They're alive and well. Their bodies are buried and inactive, awaiting the rapture. But their spirits are wide awake.

Just two or three examples real quick. Matthew 17 and verse 3 describes the transfiguration in which Moses and Elijah appeared and spoke with Jesus. And the apostles recognized Moses and Elijah. They were alive and well. Jesus told the story of Lazarus and the rich man.

We'll refer to him again, the two of them again in just a moment. The rich man was in Hades, which is the collecting place of the lost. And the poor man, Lazarus, was alive and well in paradise in the presence of Abraham. Here's a scripture that speaks of thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly. Look at this, being joined by the spirits of the righteous made perfect. Again, I can't help but think about my mom and my dad and my older brother who have already gone into paradise. Can you think of some people who are in paradise? They are in that circle, in that group. They are with the angels. They are singing and their spirits have been made righteous. And what about that wonderful scripture?

We'll look at it here in just a moment. Hebrews 12 one that talks about the great cloud of witnesses that surrounds us. Couldn't these be the heroes of our faith and the loved ones who have gone before? So no, there's no purgatory. There's no time out. There's no reformatory.

There's no probation. The moment the believer takes their final breath on earth, they have their first glimpse of paradise. The moment the believer takes their final breath on earth. When I just entered the ministry, I was called to the hospital by a lady who said, my husband is dying, and I got there too late. He had already perished, and I still remember seeing her lipstick on his hand as she had reached down to kiss him as he was perishing. And as I walked in, she said, where is he? He was here one moment, and now he's gone. He closed his eyes.

What happened? How joyful it was for me to be able to say, I know you miss him, but he is in the presence of Christ. He passed from here to there, and he's at peace. I once one time wondered, why are there only three resurrection stories in the life of Jesus? Only three times did he raise somebody from the dead. Only three times out of all the people who had perished before he walked on the earth. He could have raised a whole graveyard to life.

Why were there only three? And I asked a guy once, I said, what do you think that was? He said, well, maybe Jesus couldn't get any more volunteers. Paradise would be a hard place to leave in this earth. Who wants to come back?

One more question. What will we do in paradise? What will we do in paradise? Again, paradise is the front porch of heaven. It's not quite our eternal state. That's yet to come in the timeline of heaven. When we go to paradise, if we die before the rapture, and we enter paradise, what will we do?

Well, the first order of business will be the healing of the soul. We know this because of Jesus' story of the rich man and Lazarus. Lazarus was a beggar. He was, according to the scripture, full of sores. And every day he was laid at the rich man's gate. Can you imagine a more pitiful sight? Lazarus covered with ulcerated, open wounds. And each day he was loaded into a cart and he was carried to the property of a rich man's mansion, presumably to eat the scraps that might be thrown from the kitchen, maybe a piece of bread or a chunk of meat. The sores on his flesh were horrendous, but not nearly as bad as the sores on his spirit. How many times had he heard words like, Good job. Or, What a waste. I wonder how many wounds he had on his spirit.

How many do you have? If we could somehow see the inner wounds of our lives, all those times that we were rejected, criticized, mocked. If we could somehow expose those inner wounds, we would all appear as if we were brutalized POW patients, prisoners.

We've all got wounds. But did you know that the first order of business when you go to paradise is those wounds will be healed? We believe that because of what happened with Lazarus and the rich man. The rich man went to Hades, again the collecting spot for the lost, those who have rejected Christ. But Lazarus, who apparently had faith, was taken, look at this, he was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom.

Such a beautiful thought. Radiant ambassadors of heaven came for Lazarus, and they winged him, they carried him. They carried him into the presence of Abraham, where he was placed in Abraham's bosom. That is to say, he was held. He was secured. It's kind of like when you're a child and you sit on your grandpa's lap, or your mama's lap.

It's a safe place. Here we have arguably the most famous Hebrew, the patriarch, Abraham. And here we have at the other end of the social spectrum, Lazarus, a beggar. And yet there in the presence of everyone in paradise, Abraham puts his arm around Lazarus, the poor man, and treats him like a king. And he is healed instantly. He is affirmed. All wounds will be healed in paradise.

And once they are, we will ponder the glory of God. Oh, the depth of the riches and wisdom of the knowledge of God. How unsearchable are his judgments. How inscrutable are his ways. Friends, don't ever think that we will exhaust our study of God.

Each attribute awaits us. Friend, you were made to walk with God in paradise. I believe that the most important book of prophecy in the Bible is the first book of the Bible, the book of Genesis. If you want to know what life is going to be like in the end, look at what life was like in the beginning.

Did that make sense? If you want to see God's intended state, God walked with Adam and Eve, and they had no shame, no embarrassment, no fear. He walked with them in a perfect place. They were perfect children in a perfect relationship with God. That's a picture of our eternal state. That's paradise. And that's how we will experience God. And we will be exposed to the most beautiful display of our Heavenly Father.

How unsearchable are his riches. Now, sometimes we dread heaven because we feel like we'll be bored. I mean, who wants to sit on a cloud and strum a harp, right? Well, that's somebody else's perception of heaven, not the perception of Scripture. We will explore the goodness of God, the ideas of God, and we will work with God. Yes, we will creatively see the further expansion of his kingdom. Remember how Adam and Eve were put to work in taking care of paradise? So it will be.

We will be put to work. And we will delight in serving with our Heavenly Father in paradise. And then upon that day, and I'm biting my tongue not to get too far on that heaven's timeline, but at some point, we will return with him and enjoy a thousand-year reign of Christ right here on this earth. Paradise is not populated by clueless clones or lobotomized spirits, but by curious, happy, and one more, prayerful saints. Yes, saints in heaven pray for saints on earth.

Why would I say that? Well, because Jesus prays for us, and we were made to be like him. Christ at this moment intercedes for us, and Scripture says, when Christ appears, we will be like him, for we shall see him as he is. So when he appears to you on your deathbed, if you die before the rapture, when he appears, you will be made to behave like Christ.

That is what God intends from the beginning. So people of paradise are comprising right now a triumphant church and a militant church. They're triumphant in the sense that they're at peace, and they've already won the victory. They're militant because they know many saints still on earth are in need of strength, and they pray for us. The people of paradise enjoy a far better state, but it's still incomplete. They are anticipating the new heaven and the new earth.

They are living in eager expectation of a glorified, perfected physical body that will be revealed at the rapture, and they are, and this may surprise you, they are looking forward to the return of the rest of the saints. We can thank the Hebrew writer for this. Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a huge crowd of witnesses to the life of faith, let us strip off every weight that slows us down, especially the sin that trips us up, and let us run with endurance the race God has set before us.

Oh, my goodness. We are surrounded by what he calls here a huge crowd of witnesses right now at this very moment. The eyes of heaven are upon you and me, encouraging us. The apostle envisions like it was a great stadium of spiritual athletes, and the stands are filled with the Abrahams, the Moses, the Martha's from prior generations.

They've completed their race, and now they've moved up into the stands, and they're cheering us on as we continue to run lap after lap. They're not pictures in a gallery. They're not statues in a church. They're not just names in a book, but they are God lovers cheering on those who run on the track.

Now, I find such encouragement in this. In the church where I preach in San Antonio, Texas, for many years, it's not there right now, but reading this makes me want to go find it. We remodeled the room that the pastor sits in right before he goes out to preach. We called it the green room.

I don't know why we do. It's not green, but it's called the green room. And for many years, decades, hanging in that room was a picture called the Great Cloud of Witnesses based on this scripture.

It was painted by a wonderful artist by the name of Ron DeCianni. And in that painting, there's a preacher, just like I am, except he was wearing a coat and tie, preacher standing behind a pulpit. He's got his open Bible, and he's speaking. He's preaching to the church.

And yet, surrounding him are witnesses. Moses, the lawgiver, is there. John the Baptist is there. Peter, who preached the Pentecost sermon, is there. The apostle Paul is portrayed in the background, as are other more recent pastors, like Charles Spurgeon and Martin Luther. He's just surrounded by these preachers.

And for many years, I would stand and look at that painting before I came out to preach, and I could almost hear them saying, go, Max, go, give them heaven. And so I ask you, who's standing around you? Who's cheering you on? Moms, is there a Great Cloud of Witnesses of other moms who've already gone on saying, just keep going.

You'll get a good night's sleep eventually. School teachers, are you surrounded by teachers from generations past? Physicians, surgeons, as you treat people, do you sense the presence of those who are in paradise at this moment, cheering you on? This great communion of the saints, those still on earth, receiving the prayers of those who have gone on into paradise. The scripture says that we are watched by millions of loving eyes. Since we are surrounded, let us run with endurance. The race that God has set before us.

Listen carefully, this passage says, and you will hear a vast number, a vast multitude of God's people. Noah is cheering you on. Mary, the mother of Jesus, is cheering you on.

Your elementary school teacher is cheering you on. An uncle that you never knew. The martyrs from the first century church.

What about missionaries to Africa from 300 years ago? Do you have a mom, a dad in paradise? They're cheering you on. We're never told to pray to them, by the way, but we are reminded that they root and cheer for us. I hope you've learned something today about paradise.

Just enough to wet your appetite. Again, I hope I'm a part of the rapture generation. But if I'm not, I'm pretty excited about what's about to happen. And can I just say, the more I read about what happens next, the more excited I get. I'm just thrilled. Sometimes I wake up in the middle of the night and I say, OK, Lord, I'm ready.

Take me. What I do know is that Epicurus missed the mark. Death is not the most dreaded of evils. Thomas Hobbes was wrong. Death is not a leap in the dark.

Ted Williams, he was a great baseball player, but I got to say, his death preparation didn't even get him to first base. Human deep freeze won't defeat death. But God has.

And if you're in Christ, he will defeat yours. One final story. Linville Baker pastored small churches in Texas for his entire life. By the time he turned 65, he was ready to retire. He had had heart issues.

COVID had beaten him up. And so he had acquired 150 acres of land out in the middle of nowhere in West Texas. And he and his wife planned to build a house there. And on the last day of Linville Baker's life, he spent that day with his brother, Loris.

I know, unique names. Linville and Loris. And they did what they had done growing up on a ranch. They threw rocks at watermelons.

They chased squirrels. They were just like two little boys. And finally, the sun began to set and Loris needed to leave, leaving Linville there all by himself. And no one knows exactly what happened next. But from the medical report and the police report, we can begin to piece it together.

65-year-old Linville had a heart attack. He was so far out in the middle of nowhere, there was no phone service. And so no doubt, he clutched his chest and he stumbled toward a rise, an elevated area where he and his wife had planned to build a house. And there he sat down beneath a tree and prepared to enter paradise. And before he died, he did something remarkable. He took off his boots. He took off his boots. It's like he knew he was about to step onto holy ground. And so he did what people do. And there he was found later that evening by his son. And the son said there was peace written all over his face.

That's how a good man dies. Oh, dear child of God, that's what I aspire for you. That's what I aspire for you. But more importantly, that's what God has ordained for you. It is not his will that you live in fear of your final moment. Have you said yes to Jesus? I'm about to offer us a prayer or lead us in a prayer. Just phrase by phrase, I'm going to ask everybody to repeat this phrase with me. It's a prayer of salvation.

And for many of you, it's reaffirming a decision that you've already made. But I'm praying that there are some watching either online or at another campus or right here in this wonderful room who will say yes to Jesus for the first time. And after I say amen, I'm going to ask you to stand up if you're saying yes to Jesus for the first time.

And never to embarrass you, oh no. Just to celebrate you. And the rest of us will applaud your decision, won't we?

We will celebrate your decision. So it's just a simple prayer. Repeat it with me phrase by phrase. Lord Jesus, I'm a sinner. I need your forgiveness. I give you my life. And I give you my death. I trust you as my Savior. In Jesus' name, amen.

It's now now a beautiful prayer. Hey everybody, thanks for listening to this podcast. To learn more about Harvest Ministries, follow this show and consider supporting it. Just go to Harvest.org. And to find out how to know God personally, go to Harvest.org and click on Know God.