If you're planning to contact the dead, as we all do now and then, then the Ouija board is probably your best option. But these things, unfortunately, don't tend to come pre-installed with a convenient block button in case you fail to get through to your recently deceased great uncle Albert and instead find yourself on a private line with Abraxus, great archon and demonic prince of the 365 spheres.
So you're playing with the Ouija board. The Ouija board, the idea is it's not your hands moving the thing around, but it's Demons basically moving the Alright. Did it work? I just I had one and I was with one of my friends and this guy was you know he was a very Stoic kind of guy. He wasn't a type of guy to like get scared easily.
Like me and him used to, you know, do all types of crazy stuff together. He wasn't the type of guy to. for one to play into it and two. to get scared about stuff like this. It's just me and him.
So we start asking it, then it starts moving. I didn't even need to ask, I knew it wasn't him. He knew it wasn't me. It starts moving.
So we're asking it multiple questions. And I started asking him, like, well, when am I gonna die? And it gives me a number, and it says from an overdose. It says 37 from an overdose. And then he asked it.
And it gave him a number, and it gave him, it's a, I think, like heart failure or something, a heart attack or something. To this day, that friend is scared.
Well, friends, you just heard in that clip, the darkness of the demonic. And we are in the midst of a season of the year where the demonic and darkness is elevated. People are celebrating evil spirits in the season of Halloween. And as Jan and I have had conversations over the last number of weeks, we thought it would be very important to share a bit of her story about dabbling in the demonic, but also give a stark warning against the dancing with the devil and dealing with these new age demonic things.
So, Jan, welcome to the program. We're so glad you're here. Thank you for having me. Yeah, thanks for joining us, Jan.
So you and I have traveled all over the country and spent time together talking about some of this stuff. Tell our audience, because it's a fascinating story, just how dangerous it is to dabble in some of this stuff, especially in your case with a Ouija board.
Well, I think there is an intrigue with the supernatural, with the paranormal. And I was young, very young at the time. And I longed to know the future. You know, and as I say that, I chuckle. I mean, let's read the Bible.
It's called prophecy. Amen. It tells us about the future. But I guess I wanted to learn a different way. Way a different kind of the future, what was going to happen to me personally.
And um There's again, there's this intrigue with this kind of of supernatural. and I happened to be handed one day A Ouija board. Let me just explain. There might be some who don't even know what that is. It's a board with the alphabet on it.
You put What's called a planchette on top of it. You can put your hands on the planchette, ask the board questions. It moves when you get really good. You can take your hands off. It'll move without you.
And answer your questions, spell out answers. And Some of these predictions that this board was telling me came true. No. I mean, never mind that most of what it predicted was baloney, but some of it came true. Yeah, didn't you ask it a question, a particular question, and it answered it?
Well, I asked it, where do you get your power, Ouija? Wow. And it spelled Satan within seconds. And it was that kind of accuracy. And by the way, I had a somewhat of a biblical background, so I knew what I was doing.
And I also knew that the answers here were very mysterious. But I also was getting gentlemen Hooked. Of course. And it was telling me a little bit about the future, and some of that came true. And the more This went on, and it went on months.
the more hooked Into the dialoguing with the devil, dancing with the devil, I was getting. And this is particularly attractive to young people, and particularly at this time of year. Yeah, you're absolutely right. And it's almost like that mysterious intrigue of, okay, what's going on here? Am I moving the planchette?
Is it moving itself? What's going on with all of this different spiritual things going on? And for the planchette to simply tell you. That Satan was giving the answers, that should be a warning sign.
Now, Jen, was that a warning sign to you? It was. But it also told me very creepy things. And remember this is a creepy, uh, little instrument we're talking to and for that matter the devil is very creepy. But I mean, he told me The board told me that I was gonna die on the freeway.
Well, At this point, I haven't died on the freeway, but you know, that was some years ago, and it Quite frankly, that creeped me out too. I mean, but it it was those kinds of answers that made me sit up and wonder, first of all, I had enough of a Bible background to know this was supernatural number two. It wasn't of God. Therefore, it had to be from the dark side. And I mean, some months later, I would realize: my goodness, Jen, you are throwing your life away almost literally.
Wow. Why on earth are you wasting your time like this? But more than that, why are you getting addicted to wanting to know the future? When again, everybody can open the Bible and learn about the future, but at that time, I'll be honest, I got hooked on this. At my Christian College, because at that time everybody in that Christian college and they weren't doing it to be demonic, they were doing it out of naivete and they thought it was cute and they thought it was funny.
Yeah, Josh. And it it's almost like a drug when you get addicted to drugs and then that leads to other drugs. And from the guests that we've talked to, this type you start out with a Ouija board, it can lead to tarot cards, crystals, and then you're into full-on witchcraft. And we'll talk about that in a little bit, what goes on here, right here in Minneapolis with Paganicon and all these other things. Yes, and I think what all of these things are, and Jane, I'm sure you recognize this now, is they're all just footsteps towards getting hooked, being more intrigued, and being really deeply pulled into the demonic side and away from the light of God's word.
Yeah, and I think, and you gentlemen have featured enough new agers, ex-new agers. and so have I over the years, that the audience is familiar with the doorways to the demonic. And I think the biggest doorway And we've heard from Jen Nitsa and others, this is the new age. And we've got tarot cards and we've got meditation and energy healing and crystals and seances and Astrology. Are they harmless?
Well, no. Are they Satanic.
Well, they're inching there for sure, but they seem pretty harmless. Like the Ouija board seemed harmless to me at one time. And pretty soon, you know, again, you got your foot in a little bit more deeply, and a little bit more deeply. In my case, I had people praying for me, and that's how I was able to throw this thing away about a year later after my life was almost destroyed by the influences on my life. But I think that what we need to emphasize is.
There's even new age in the church. That's how much stuff like this has crept in. There really is. And Jan, you and I were just talking the other day about a chiropractor. It's a Christian-based organization.
And in one of the bios of one of the doctors, they talked about the Enneagram, her Enneagram, number, whatever. And that is a New Age tool that, again, is like it's a doorway into the demonic. These are becoming more and more culturally normative. And people are accepting them as. Oh, that's just this.
That's just the Enneagram. Oh, it's just a Ouija board. Oh, it's just tarot cards. Don't worry about that. There's nothing spiritual about those things.
But the stark warning is this: no, there are things that are spiritual about them, and they are dark and demonic tools. Yeah.
Well, let's talk about some of these cultural things that are Our whole society is adopted, and that's the day of Halloween.
So I think we should take a look at this clip and and We'll get your comment on it. Every year, millions of people around the country spill in the streets. Dressed as fairies, goblins, characters from their favorite movie franchise, and everything in between. partying and making mischief. But outside of a good time, how many know why they do it?
Today, Halloween is a billion-dollar industry. But exactly how did it get there? Halloween. a night when the boundary between the living and the dead grows thin, and the ordinary world transforms into a realm of shadows. Costumed figures roam the streets, but behind these playful disguises lies a deeper, darker tale.
a story rooted in ancient rites and restless spirits. Long before it became a night of candy and mischief, Halloween was born from the fires of Saar En. The Celtic festival, where the veil to the other world was at its most fragile.
So many people. Have no idea, you know, the significance of Halloween and what it means to celebrate Halloween. It has become part of popular culture without many people really thinking about what it represents. Anton LaVey, who was the original founder of the Church of Satan in the States in the late 60s, had a very well-known quote where he said. It makes him so happy to see that Christians are allowing their children to celebrate the Devil one night of the year.
Hey friends, we've got Jan Markel with us today talking about a special episode here about dark things and dabbling in and dancing with the demonic. We just heard a clip. Jan, let's. Get your thoughts on that.
Well, again, we're in the season. Again, I don't quite understand the fascination, the lure of, let's just say. uh skeletons and witches and if you want to drive down almost any neighborhood in any city. In the Western world. This is what they're obsessing over right now.
As though it's fun and games, as though it's all just for a joke. Believe me, in many, many cases, this is no joke. This is no joke. It's become one of the biggest commercialized. Days of the year, it's overtaking Christmas now with people buying all of these things to put outside their house.
getting dressed up, not only their children, but we're seeing adults. Oh, yeah. going to parties like we saw in that clip and Glorifying.
Well, celebrating Satan. I'm going to be blunt. You folks are celebrating Satan is what you is what you're doing. And how is this God glorifying? And particularly when you start seeing children, you know, eight-year-olds coming to your front door dressed as who knows what, Satan or a witch or skeleton.
It's all none of it's God-honoring. And Christian, you need to examine why on earth, why on earth would you want to participate in this? And why on earth would you want your child or teenager to have anything? And church, why do you want to participate in an event like this? Many of you do.
Yeah, Josh, what can Christians and churches fight against this or what can they do to combat this? Yeah, that's been a conversation that I've had in numerous conversations with numerous churches in different areas. And really, as a family, what we do is we don't celebrate it. Our children don't dress up, they don't go out. We actually make it a family night.
So we stay in, we keep the front light off, and we watch a movie together. We may indulge in a bit of candy or popcorn, whatever that may be, but we don't celebrate it. We don't make this a big deal outside of our home because it is so dark and demonic. And my son's friends do it. My sons have been ostracized for not doing it.
But we have to take a stand as a follower of Jesus and not get pulled into the culture and what the culture is celebrating.
Well, then, the culture, and of course, we're in an area of the country here in Minneapolis. And the Paganicon, the annual, I know it's 12. Twice annual celebration of pagans. At one time was in a hotel five minutes from where we're sitting. I attended three times.
I only went to the exhibit area so I could literally talk to the witches. And hopefully we can show a photo or two of that. But I literally would walk up to these, and the one thing I loved asking them is: do you have a spiritual background? In other words, what denomination might you have been at one time? And they had been.
whatever, Catholic, Methodist, Lutheran, all different denominations. And they just said, you know, that wasn't for me. But being a witch with a pointy hat is?
Okay. Uh tell me how that's fulfilling. Believe it or not, it was. Yeah, we've had our friend Carl Tycreb on. You've had him on, we've had him on, and he's gone to this event with you.
And He goes up and talks to them, and he really gets deep into what they really believe. And a lot of them, unfortunately, came out of the church. We have a city. 10 minutes from here to the north of us, that has the largest Halloween celebration in America. And it's sad to watch People come out and celebrate this.
And it's like, why can't we get people in the churches to come and celebrate? The life Death and resurrection of our Lord and Savior. I mean, it's just, it's so sad to watch. Yeah, all these holidays that are celebrating the demonic are just exploding in popularity. And I mean, we've got tinfoot demons and ghouls in our neighborhood right now.
And it is, what it drives me to do is when I'm driving around the neighborhood, I am driven to prayer. I am praying for those families. I am praying for the children in those homes that they would have the eyes to see and the ears to hear and the heart and the mind to understand that this is dark and they should not be dabbling in these things.
Now, Jan, as we are bringing all of this to a close, what are some final thoughts and maybe some final stark warnings for those who listen to this?
Well, I think the primary takeaway perhaps is let's talk. try to redeem the time. I think you sure can hand out gospel tracts when the kids come to the front door if you're going to indeed be. I'm participating by replying to the doorknobs and all that. But I think we can use it to be sharing the gospel.
I think that's the only way to redeem this time. And I know some churches have all sorts of activities where they try to sanctify it. And I don't know, you're a pastor, Josh. I mean, if that's possible, I guess that maybe you can explain that. But I find that difficult.
I do. It really is. And especially when churches are doing it on the s very same day. It's as an alternative, and I understand that, and there is gospel opportunities there, but it is a slippery slope, and it has to be dealt with very carefully. Josh, would it be possible even this year, Halloween's on a Friday night, is it possible gather your youth group, pastors, get the youth group together and talk to them about The wiles of the devil, the dangers of the occult, the dangers of witchcraft, the dangers of rock music, and how it's leading to all this.
If there'd be an opportunity, a teaching session, perhaps. Yeah, I think it would be a great thing to do is to get youth and young adults or even the whole church family together and deal with these things at different levels with different age groups because the church has done great with sharing the gospel at times, but the church has failed in areas of dealing with culturally normative things that are anti-biblical, that are really going against what the scriptures say.
So that would be a great suggestion to get them together and to teach on the darkness of the demonic, the darkness of Halloween. Yeah, I don't think the average. Person or even Christian realizes just how dark and deep. And widespread this is the occult, the occult practices, witchcraft, warlocks, all that. I mean, it is so embedded in our culture, and especially we were overseas, it's out of control over there.
And it's come to the United States, it's embedded itself, it's dangerous. Like Pastor Josh said, I think we should just come together as a church family, not only Teach and talk about this, but pray for the Pray for the lost. Amen. And I think, really, just to end this out, what would you expect the evil one to do? What would you expect him to lead with?
He wants to lead people astray from the truth of the Word of God.
So, what's he going to do? He's going to give. little opportunities to dabble in the demonic, intriguing or mysterious ways, whether it be tarot cards, a Ouija board, or anything like that, to pull people away and give them a spiritual experience that would be addictive, they would be hooked, and they would wind further and further away from the truth of the scriptures.
So, Jan, thanks for sharing with us. Thanks for having me. It was great to talk with you. And I do pray that people that will hear this will understand just how slippery and evil these things are.
