How Far Would You Run For Jesus?

Welcome to Truth Talk Live. Alright, let's talk. A daily program powered by the Truth Network. This is kind of a great thing and I'll tell you why. Where pop culture, current events, and theology all come together.

Speak your mind. And now, here's today's Truth Talk Live host. We are running and the question today on Truth Talk Live is how far? How far would you run for Jesus, literally? Like, oh my goodness. And there's different ways that you run your race. And so, not only how far would you run, how do you run?

And I'm very interested in your thoughts on the idea, maybe some scripture that you like as far as how this applies. Call us. It's a live show. It just isn't the same unless you call. 866-348-7884 is the number to call in and share.

866-348-7884. Here to help us talk about somebody who's run 100 miles? Like, seriously?

In a 24 hour period? Like, I've never heard of such a thing. But we have Doug Elks. He's with AIM Missions and AIM Missions have all sorts of neat things they're doing.

One of the things he's doing is running a marathon in Jerusalem, actually, next month. Very exciting, but Doug, welcome. Thank you so much. I appreciate it and I'm so grateful to be back with you guys.

I love the Truth Network. I love the mission behind this station and what you guys stand for and super grateful to be here today. And so when you think about, you know, in your situation, you played basketball, you loved basketball, but then all of a sudden it's turned to running and that's the platform God has given you to share Jesus. You know, it is, man. And I'm so grateful for it.

And it's been really fun to learn and to grow in it. And, you know, I finished playing college basketball and I remember right after my season ended, my senior season, I was like, where am I going to put all this energy and passion? And I was like, you know, it'd be really fun to try to run a marathon because, you know, training for basketball, playing at that level, we did a lot of conditioning, but we never did distance running. I mean, the most we'd ever run is a mile.

We'd have our mile conditioning test. And so to me, that was a very far-fetched goal of trying to complete 26 miles. And I knew that it was going to challenge me mentally and also physically, but I had no idea until I got into about mile 22 of my first marathon is how much it would grow me spiritually. And that is what I fell in love with, with running specifically, was finding this moment of pretty intense suffering, but being reminded of the greater suffering that our Lord Jesus had to go through and endure in order for us to find salvation through his death and resurrection.

And so it's been a really cool way that's grown me and drawn me a lot closer to Jesus and helped me grow and deepen my faith as well. So can you take us back? That sounds like an amazing moment. Can you kind of take us back into where was that? And then all of a sudden, how did God raise that up in you?

Yeah, man. So that particular moment, my first kind of encounter of that revelation was in my first marathon, which was the Keough Island Marathon in South Carolina. And it was a marathon in December. I had been training for that race where I was going to school at the time, Western Carolina, where I played basketball in the mountains of North Carolina.

And I'm in, you know, leading into the November into early December. It's very, very cold there. And I'd get up and I'd have training runs in the morning at 22 degrees and, you know, fully layered and just really cold.

Well, I go down to Kiawah. And even though it was still winter, it was a very warm day and it was very humid day. And that was one of the things that I didn't know how I was going to take it. But I ended up, man, getting really bad cramps that day. I got cramps on both of my quads. My legs completely locked up. And I just remember, man, I was like, there's nothing I can do.

This is fully out of my control. But it was in this amount of pain and suffering that I was like, man, I can keep going. So I know I can keep going. Are you still moving your legs in spite of the cramps? So at that point, when when it got to the peak of this pain, I was experiencing both legs were completely locked.

The muscle is completely locked up. And I was kind of like it was like I was still hobbling kind of back and forth. And I just reminded myself, like, man, I got to keep going, keep moving forward and just reminded myself of what Jesus did for me. And it just gave this new sense of just gratitude and deep humiliation and what it means to follow Jesus. And what actually what was going on in that. And I just like to dig into stuff like this.

Yeah, let's go. So it was going on in there. You know, I'm trying to picture this, man.

You got legs like stilts. They're locked up. And in your heart, you're praying. Absolutely. So now God is in this and in your heart is turned towards God rather than to the pain. And as you turn your heart to God. Did your legs unlock?

Yes. So I think there was a moment where I was praying a lot. There was a really kind I think it was a man that came out of his home that part of the race we ran was through neighborhoods in Kiawah, a really nice area. Someone came out and I was by myself. I was between aid stations, so I had no help. And this guy said, hey, you look like you need some help. And he came and gave me a water bottle. And that helped a ton. But man, like I said, it was that moment of not even really being so concerned with the outcome of the race, but just finding a place where when we when we go through hard times, whether it's something we choose to put ourselves in or something that happens to us, we can just be reminded of the hope that we have in Christ. And that's what got me so excited.

And, you know, pushing myself takes me there to take you back there for one more second. So as I think about it, have you ever given any thought to the fact or it may not be a fact, but I can't help but note that God provided you that water. Amen. No matter how you look at it, he provides water to begin with. But it's like he brings the rain when we need rain. He knew Doug needs water.

That's right. And so either he put it on the heart of this particular messenger or who knows if it was actually an angel that shows up that gives you this water in this moment where that's exactly. I mean, I can imagine that humidity.

You've sweat a ton and you need you need hydration and God provides. And there you are. And so as you're doing this, God is birthing in you this idea of AIM missions, right? Yeah.

So to kind of back up a little bit. So I started AIM. The platform AIM was was birthed while I was still playing college basketball. And that actually was it was a COVID project. You know, up until my junior in COVID, I was junior in college.

I went through COVID. I wanted to be a college basketball coach growing up in Raleigh. I was in the hotbed of Duke, Carolina, NC State. Obviously, we're getting a chance to share the gospel at Wake Forest tonight.

We had respected their program as well. But I loved Coach K and I was so just I just was so inspired by the way that he could get guys to play so hard and play together and the leadership that he had and all these things. But when COVID hit, I got to go home and spend some time and reflect and I pray and say, Lord, what do you really have for my life? And ultimately, I felt like there was a shift in what God was calling me to do. And so I felt like I was supposed to help people and inspire people and motivate people. And so we started a platform called Ambition in Mind, the acronym AIM. At the time, we were doing mostly fitness stuff. We were doing mindset and all these different things. And over the course of the last several years, as I've grown closer to Jesus, I was convicted by Philippians 2-3, do nothing out of selfish ambition. And now our rooted verse is Acts 20-24. We consider our life worth nothing.

Our only aim is to preach the gospel. How cool is that? Well, how about you? What's your running for Jesus experience? I would love to hear. I wonder if you have something like that. I would love to hear it. 866-348-7884. I don't know what it's like to run 24 miles.

Maybe you do. You call us. 866-348-7884. We'll be right back. Welcome back to True Talk Live.

Today's question, and I love this question, how far would you run or maybe what have you experienced while running for Jesus? And our guest today, Doug Elks, with AIM Missions, and he's got some really cool apparel called Seek First. What a neat name for apparel. And when you look at it, like I'm looking at it right now, it says Jesus is King on beautiful basketball jersey with a cross and a number seven. So was that your number when you played for West Carolina?

It was not my number. We picked seven just because of the biblical significance of completion and all those kind of things. But no, I love the number seven.

Me too, me too, in so many different ways. It's the letter Zion, too, by the way. I don't know if you knew that. When you go to Jerusalem and run this coming April, you're going to get a chance to see all sorts of neat stuff. But just today, man, you've had a chance to share Jesus. As Stu put it to me, he said, man, Robbie, this guy, you've never met. Like, he's so on fire for Jesus.

It's unbelievable. So just today, what has the Lord given you an opportunity to do? Yeah, well, I'm very thankful for Stu. We'll give him a shout out because he's been such a light in my life and one of the greatest prayers that God has answered in the last several years is bringing godly men into my life to help disciple me and to help encourage me and point me to Jesus.

And so he certainly is one of those men. But yeah, this morning has been great. We started off the morning with actually before we got on the road for this exciting day of ministry, we we host a men's prayer group every Tuesday morning at 6 a.m. And so Frank and myself and some other men, we get together at the church and we pray together for about an hour.

And it's a really blessed time. What church is that? So we go to Summit Church in Raleigh with Pastor J.D. Greer.

Because there's a lot of J.D. Greer fans slash Summit Church people out there. Did you know that every Tuesday morning, man, you can meet with Doug Elks?

You need to show up, right? Yeah, that's right, man. We know how important prayer is.

It's the baseline. It's the foundation of our ministry and we believe that God answers prayers. Stu actually gave me a little prayer ring today that put on a little rubber band. So that's how we started the day. And then we made our way to see the High Point men's basketball team, which we were so grateful we had an opportunity to share the gospel with their team earlier this season. And we got to go there to encourage them and to pray with some of their guys and the coach about just reminding them and being encouraged in their faith as they head off to the NCAA tournament for the first time ever to play Purdue this week, which is an exciting time for them. We had a great lunch meeting with Stu and now we're here having a blast on the radio. So we're super grateful. Yeah, how exciting is that, right, that they get to play Purdue?

It's a big platform and they've got some awesome guys that love Jesus and they use their platform that God's given them to share the good news, which is really encouraging. Yeah, and a lot of running involved in that. That's kind of how you got involved in that.

You know, that's the deal. And if you missed the first segment, you heard an amazing story on how, you know, running these marathons really became a deep spiritual, you know, almost like a fast where you don't have anywhere else to turn, but to God. And he turned to God and, you know, you found that place. But then, you know, we described earlier before the show, I was talking to him about, well, how far have you run? And then he had this thing called an ultra marathon I never heard of in 20, I mean, 100 miles. Like, that's why I said, how far would you run?

Would you run 100 miles? Like, I have to tell you, this weekend I was at a Masculine Journey radio boot camp and the boot camp is not very far. And we always refer to ourselves as a band of brothers is where the band of brothers was filmed. And I don't know if you've ever seen that series, but the camp where they used to have to run up the mountain, which was three miles up and three miles back.

I don't know if you've ever seen that series. No, that's intense. And it is an intense three miles and they had to run up it in full, you know, armament with their gun and their backpack and all that stuff. And when we just drove, like we drove near the top, when we got about 300 yards or something, I said, well, let me run this part. Just to see, like, right.

Like, oh, my goodness, the training and what that has to be like to just, you know, run 100 miles. And you said there was a real spiritual aspect to that. Definitely.

Yeah, absolutely. And that was, you know, that whole kind of season of my life when I got thrown into that mix. And those crazy people were it was a blessing because, again, kind of going back to that prayer. God put a guy named Steve Weatherford into my life, who is now one of spiritual mentor, spiritual father. He's also my co-founder in this company, Seek First. And he was getting a group of guys together in Texas to run this 100 mile ultra marathon.

And I had about a six week heads up. Hey, do you want to do this with us from another one of our mutual friends? And I prayed about it and I was like, let's go. I don't know if we're going to finish it, but we're going to send it. We're going to give it our best. And by God's grace and his strength, I was able to complete it.

And again, just another really cool encounter with the Lord and just growing deeper spiritually through it. So as you describe that, it was 24 hours. How long? Twenty four hours and 58 minutes. It took me about 25 hours of consistent running. And so what is that average mile of 20 minutes or so?

So I'll tell you where I made a mistake. By the first half, I ran it in sub nine hours, which was way too fast. I was just feeling good. Adrenaline's pumping. And what happens is by mile 50 to 60, it's starting to get dark. You've been running since 7 a.m. all day. Your body hurts. You're hungry and it's dark. And now you get to run through the night. And that's just something you have to mentally accept. You don't always think about it, but you're like, oh, I have to keep going. I don't pick this up tomorrow. Like tomorrow is now. We go through the night. And that's when things got really challenging.

You're just trying to feel a little bit hungry. You've run until it's getting dark. And what time of year was this race?

This was in December of 2023. OK, so it was a little bit cooler. You weren't out there in the dead of heat running 100 miles. Yeah, no, it was warm during the day and then it was chilly at night. And, you know, thankfully we had a sauna. We had a truck sauna come up and Steve had it set up. So I remember getting in a few times in the second half of the race just to keep my body warm when I'd need to take a break and drink some fluids.

And take a snack. But, man, it was an intense moment for sure. So that first one you ran too fast. And then was there a point when you turned your heart to the Lord again? Or was it something you felt throughout? What was that like as far as actually running with Jesus through that? Yeah, several times, man.

You just have so much time to encounter him and just to have moments with him. I'd say between 60 and 70 was when it started to get really challenging. And I remember a mile. 85 is when I actually switched my shoes.

My feet were just really hurting. But mile 92 is the mile I talk about when I tell stories because it was just a mile where I sat down. So the quick back story on this race to give it some context, which I think makes it more interesting, is that it was supposed to be a 16-mile trail loop in Houston, Texas. This race was called the Brazos Bend ultra marathon. Three days before the race it gets canceled due to severe storms and weather.

And the state closed the state park and said that we weren't allowed to do it. And so Steve's like, give me 24 hours and I'll come up with a plan. So he calls back, and I'm anxiously awaiting this phone call. And he says, we're still going to run the race, but we're going to run it in Dallas around my church in a one-mile loop in the concrete parking lot of the church. So we ran 100 laps in the concrete parking lot of this guy's church in Dallas, Texas. And mile 92 was the time I sat down in the chair and I said, I don't know if I can keep going. My body was so broken, my mind. I'm starting to fall asleep out there. I'm hungry.

I'm like, it's pretty low as I've ever gotten physically. And I just remembered my friends picked me up and said, you have to just keep going one step at a time. And I think that's for someone listening right now. Sometimes you have to just take the next step.

It doesn't have to be eight more miles. It's like, what is the next step that you can take to grow closer to Jesus? And ultimately that's what I did. And one step turns into two and you keep going. And I'm just so grateful for God's grace and His strength in that. So, wow. But you had friends, right?

Yes. And the idea of being on concrete. Well, for some of you, it's going to go to another program. But others, we're going to have this program for the next half hour, depending on where you're listening. But all of you can go to truthnetwork.com and listen to the whole podcast. We've got a whole lot more coming with Doug Elks. And we need your calls, 866-348-7884, 866-34-TRUTH.

We'll be right back. You're listening to The Truth Network and truthnetwork.com. Welcome back to Truth Talk Live. Today's question, which, by the way, you can call. And I would love to hear. You know, I love your testimony or your comments or your thoughts, any of that stuff.

It's a live show for that very reason. You're the star of the show, 866 – well, actually, God is the star of the show. But we would love for your – you know, every one of us has that little God spark in him. I mean, he's inside of you, and so we need to hear.

866 is the number to call, 866-348-7884. How far would you run, have you run, right, for Jesus? Maybe it's your spiritual race. And obviously, I don't know about you, but I've reached that point, that 92-mile mark. Where I had to sit down, my feet were killing me. Because as you were telling that story, Doug, at the end of this last segment, instead of running in the state park where the ground might be somewhat soft, now we're going to run 100 miles on the pavement. That's right.

And it's a huge deal. And your shoes, like, man, I would imagine that they did need to be changed, right? Yeah, I think it was probably more mental than anything else, because, I mean, it's not going to change too much.

But I think just a new pair of shoes that gave me a time to kind of refresh my mind. But, man, at that point, I was doing whatever I could to get through it. And isn't that interesting that – I don't know, whatever you've done in physical fitness or even spiritual matters, that you can always go further than you think you can?

That's right. You can always – you know, there's always something that you don't think you have that God knows you have. And we talked a lot about that this weekend, that the only person that doesn't realize your potential or the only major player in your scene is you. That Satan is very well aware of what you're capable of. He actually has been attacking you your whole life because he wants to make sure that you don't do what you're capable of. God is completely – you know, he made you to have what it takes. He made you to do all these things. But, unfortunately, due to the beatings that we take and the pain that we experience – so there you are at the 92-mile mark, Doug, and I'm curious. You know, Jesus said his burden is light. You know, isn't that really what happened?

Yeah. And it's – I love what you said, just to kind of piggyback off what you said. I believe that all of us can go further than we truly believe in his strength. It's Ephesians 6, 10. It's like, well, let us be in the Lord's strength and in his mighty power. And I believe that's what we need to rely on.

So, you know, my former life I used to preach a lot of messages of, like, self-help and motivation and all this stuff. And there's nothing wrong with it as long as it aligns with how God has called us to live. But at the end of the day, we need to be reliant on the Lord's strength because we know that there will be trials. Jesus tells us that. You know, John 16, 33, like, in this world you will have trials.

You will have trouble. But we can take heart. We can have peace in Jesus and knowing that he's overcome the world. And that's where our hope is to keep taking that step of faith and keep moving forward even in the midst of some of the hardest things we deal with.

Yeah. And I can assure you, the closer you get to God, the more you push into that, the more you enjoy your relationship, then he allows you to go on adventures with him. And as you go on those adventures with him, then here comes, you know, the testing, which, you know, like anything else, your faith will be tested.

It's not unlike a muscle, right? That a lot of what Satan throws at you is just simply an opportunity for you to see how God's going to come through for you again at 92 miles or at 19 miles, or in my case, you know, 200 yards. That's it.

That's right. However that might look. But, you know, as far as your faith is concerned, you know, unfortunately, you know, it wasn't but a few weeks ago, and I was with a lady who lost her second daughter in two years, right? And, oh my goodness, you know, she talked about how she would go outside and she lives kind of on a farm and she would scream at God. And, but yet she was like Job, man. It was just, it was amazing to watch, but her faith was being tested.

But she went further and I think she thought she could. Because it gets real. Yeah.

That's real. And that's the neat thing is that as you go, and you share like you did with High Point University, and now you're going to go to Jerusalem. And so in Jerusalem, it's a little different situation there, right? What are you anticipating an opportunity to do?

Yeah, well, I'm very grateful. This will be my third trip to Israel. And so I've been two times prior to this trip. And then I go, I've been with a group called Holy Landings, which is an incredible group. Holy Landings. Holy Landings. I like that.

Yeah. They have such a powerful mission. We've been able to partner together and we create content. So we help other people get to see just the power that is in the Holy Land, in Israel. And so, man, there's really nothing like your first experience there. And I tell people all the time when I travel and I get to share my faith, share the gospel, is I will talk about how Jesus has changed my heart. And leading up to that, I will talk to them about how my faith increased so much by standing in the places where most of the Bible is written. And you get to just see, you know, these things that took place. And they're not fairy tales. They're real.

They were real events and history that took place. And you get to stand there and see these areas. And so it just, it's such a powerful place to be. And I've felt God's presence in powerful ways, especially around the Sea of Galilee.

That's actually my, I love Jerusalem, but the Galilee area is a really special place for me. He kind of liked it too. I recall.

About 80%. We got Lewis is in Spartanburg, South Carolina, and Lewis here on Truth Talk Live. You've got a question for us.

Yeah. I have actually, I have a question for our guest here and it's, it's something that's puzzled me, but you know, I'm kind of getting a lot of the answers to it so far on the podcast, but man, I got to ask, you know, why running, you know, why athletics out of all the things, you know, what is the, what is it about running, you know, other than, is it something more than just sort of that, you know, physical manifestation of these spiritual concepts that you're experiencing? Does it help you connect with people in it, like with, with other athletes, is there just something about it? Why running? Why did Jesus, or why do you think Jesus led you in this direction?

Yeah, Lewis, that's a great question. I really appreciate you calling in. You know, I think for me personally, a little bit of my background, which I know we touched on briefly, but I played college basketball and so leading up to now really, you know, basketball has been a big part of my testimony, a big part of my life. And so I've always been around sports and athletics.

And so when I got done playing college basketball, I was like, man, where do I kind of channel all this energy? And when I went into running specifically, I didn't go in with the intention of growing spiritually. That was something that I developed and discovered.

And I think there's a lot of things that go into that. One is like, I think when we are challenged or we were tested, like we were just talking about, I think we get to see and experience God in powerful ways. And it's for me, man, running has become such a place where I can be removed from a lot of distractions, the noise and business of the world, and really be intentional with God. And so I now use it when I travel and preach the gospel.

I'll use running as a place to spend time with God, asking for downloads for messages and different things he wants me to share. And it's been just a powerful part of my relationship and walk with Jesus. Oh, man, that's awesome.

You know, the, the Christian walk is personified in so many ways in the new Testament, you know, as like the armor of God warriors, it's even described as, you know, finishing a race and, you know, something like a marathon, something like a sprint, you know, but, um, you know, it's in so many different ways. Um, you know, yeah, that's, that's awesome. How do you, um, what, you know, it may seem like it may seem far-fetched, but what is one of your favorite ways? I think, I guess I'm asking this, right? Uh, what's one of your favorite ways that, um, you know, sports and running is that God's showing you those opportunities to, uh, to use it, to use the experiences, to use the events, whatever it might be, or maybe even an example of a testimony.

What's one of your favorite ways that God's used this in your life for him? Hmm. That's a great question, man. I love that. You know, it's, it's fun, man. I'll go on runs. Like I'm, like I'm training for this Jerusalem marathon. So I'm doing a lot of running volume right now, just training and, and I'll, I'll read something, you know, in the word in the morning of my quiet time, and then I'll go for a run and I'll feel like the Lord will just expand. It's almost like that's the moment where he, it's like, we're having a meeting, like, it's like, okay, here, go over the notes, go over, you know, what I'm trying to teach you through the word and then I'll kind of develop it or give you a new revelation. Um, one thing recently to kind of give you the most recent example, I'll give you something that's fresh on my heart is I was, I spent a lot of time this past week in the book of Jonah. And I've been thinking about, you know, his story and what that looked like. And while we know that, you know, God had a calling on Jonah's life and it initially in the beginning in chapter one, it says that he, he went away from God's calling. He ended up getting on the boat and I see that as him running away from, you know, what God had called him to initially. And so I think about that a lot. I'm like, man, am I running towards the things that God is calling me to or am I running away? And even if I'm running in the general direction, is that good enough?

Because what I believe is what you guys believe on this network is that Jesus says, I am the way, the truth and the life. And so I believe there truly is only one way to run towards God and it's through a relationship with Christ. And so that's been one of the biggest running illustrations examples I think is on my heart right now is just encouraging people. There's a lot of ways that seem right. I think it's Proverbs 16, 25.

It talks about there are many ways that seem right, but they lead to destruction and Jesus is the only way. And so we're excited to take that message and encourage people with that. Wow.

His strength is made perfect in our weakness. And I guess your official position is I should, all Christians should run a hundred miles, right? Amen.

I love it. It's a great challenge. And if you feel like to do it, go for it.

Or at least a half a mile. Just whatever you do, do it for the glory of God. We'll be right back with your question of 86634 Truth. You're listening to the Truth Network and truthnetwork.com. Welcome back to Truth Talk Live.

We're having fun. Oh man. Today, how far would you, could you, would you like to run for Jesus?

Or what does that, what does that raise up in your mind as you're listening? Maybe you have questions for Doug Elks. He's with AIM Missions. And your website, Doug, is?

aimmissions.com. And he's got some wonderful Seek First Where, is I guess the best way to put it, beautiful stuff, that helped fund his ministry, right? If you go to AIM Missions, then you can see this, well, I'll let you describe it. Yeah, so our Seek First is actually its own, it's kind of a separate thing. So shopseekfirst.com is our apparel. But the reason we created it was to help people be bold witnesses for Christ and to share their faith. And we do that through basketball jerseys, t-shirts and hoodies. And everything is very simple.

Jesus is King. That's the most important message that we want to help people share. And it's been so encouraging just to hear people's testimonies of how it helps start conversations in many places. But when we travel and we're in the airport or any place like that, it's very cool to see how many conversations you get to have. And we like to pray for people. It's been a tool to help open up conversations that lead people to Christ in public places. And so it's been a blessing for sure. And it really does exactly that. I know because of all my Truth Where that Stu gives me, people come up.

What does that mean? Oh, well, what an opportunity, right? And often you get a chance to pray with them. But I would also point out what amazing gifts this stuff is, right?

I bet you've got grandkids, kids, all that stuff. And they're going to be wearing jerseys. They're going to be wearing this stuff, right? And if it looks cool, they'll wear it.

And who doesn't want a hoodie, you know? And so what a neat thing to bless your grandchild with this opportunity to share his faith. At the same time, you know, bless this ministry. It's right there at Aim Missions. Yes, shopseekfirst.com. Oh, Shop Seek First. Seek First for the jerseys, and our ministry is separated. That's aimmissions.com. I like that.

Shop Seek First. All right. And we've got Mike is in Dayton, Ohio. Mike, you're on Truth Talk Live.

What you got for us, Mike? Well, you know, I love sports. And I love bowling. I'm a bowler. And I try to make this short. I was trying to.

So there's the question, Mike. I got to know, man, have you ever done like a bowling marathon? Were you bowled for 24 hours till your arm was ready to fall off?

Well, it felt like it sometimes. I mean, when you bowl like a six-game block, I've done that. Come on, now. You've got to step it up, Mike. We need at least six hours of bowling. Come on.

Oh, I haven't done that, but. For Jesus, now? It'd be worth it. It would be.

It would be fun to have like a bear, you know, what do you call it? Yeah, that's all right. I didn't mean to break up your train of thought. I was just having fun.

No, I understand. You know, in sports, there's a lot of muscle memory. There's a lot of doing things over and over and over again to become good at that. Every good athlete has a routine where he starts doing the same thing over and over again, a certain time of the day, a certain diet. He does all those things. And then great athletes really are very, what do you call it, disciplined on those things. That's the root word of disciple, by the way.

Right. And, um, and then all this thinking is, uh, I'm, I'm, I'm grateful. Well, how can I put it? I want, you need to be disciplined or, uh, and develop muscle memory. And Robbie knows that I listen to this show every day, like almost like clockwork and, and then, and that's part of my discipline to God.

You know, um, it helps me get closer to God by being disciplined and, and the things you do. Um, you know, it's, it's like running the race, the wind, you know, um, you, you want to be disciplined. You don't start off running a marathon by running a marathon. You start off, you run around the block first and then you developed yourself for an hour. Then you develop yourself for two hours. And that's the walk with God as well. Um, you want to, you want to discipline yourself to, you know, set up a time where you're alone with God, set up a time and be disciplined. Every day you do the same thing. Every day you do it again.

And then the, it becomes a muscle memory. And, and then you allow God to speak to you in those times of, of, of your needs. And then those are the days that you need God and all of a sudden you're, you're doing the discipline that you normally do. And all of a sudden God will speak to you. That's what's happened, Doug. So you were going to say, I saw you open your Bible. I love it when that happens. Oh no, I just, when you started talking about discipline, man, it's something we, uh, we had an opportunity to share.

Kind of, we did a, it was a secular panel, but I knew that they knew that I was going to come in to share faith on the panel. But we were just talking about Hebrews 12, 11, when you said it, and you know, no discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it. And it's so true, man.

It's like you hit it on the head. You know, discipline is something that we're called to, we're called to be disciplined. We're called to live in a disciplined fashion, but it's not going to be something that's enjoyable. Uh, for most of the time it's going to be painful, but we get to see that there will be fruit that comes from that lifestyle. And so, I think it applies to training for a race, but also just the way we, uh, grow with our, grow in our faith with Jesus. And so, Mike, you bring up a really interesting, you know, I was wrestling with that whole thought this morning that there is an idea of discipline, but there's also this idea of the spirit of religion.

Right? Like, I'm doing this so I can check the box off. I'm doing this because, you know, that's, and to some extent I've known people said, well, you fake it till you make it.

But then, unfortunately, sometimes you just keep faking it, and you never make it. And so, there's at some level, and that's the thing I loved about Doug's story, and I actually love about your story, Mike, and as I know your story, that when you experience that with Jesus, then it, he all of a sudden makes that so light, right? He says his burden's light. It's a yoke. And that yoke that you're pulling, by the way, becomes really light only when it isn't religion that you're doing. It is actually walking or running or bowling or fishing with Jesus, right? Right.

Doing it with God and not for God. Yeah, you always say that. I love that, too.

I do, too. I love that. Stu taught me that, and he said it once, and boy, did that stick to my heart. A lot of times where you used to just got to do it for, I got to do it, I got to do it. No, you got to do it with God. You know, I'm getting up in the morning, I'm going to go pray, and I'm going to do this with God today. I'm going to do this in the morning, and I'm going to be disciplined, but I'm going to do it with God. God, help me to help get up there in the morning. And you're asked, God, to help you to be disciplined, and that's really, it's really cool to have God just be with you.

And when you're doing those disciplines, you know what I mean? It really is. Well, Doug's got out his Bible again, Mike, so we're probably, we're fixed to get something else. All right, come on now.

Bring it. I love the conversation. No, I just, I appreciate what you shared just about how, you know, we want to be careful, because this is something I feel I could be very susceptible to fall into is this whole, you know, checking the box and being religious, because I feel like the way God has wired me, I am pretty disciplined in a lot of areas of my life. And so I think the big thing is just what I was reminded of and encouraged by, and I think this could help someone listening, is just that God knows the heart. And so I think that's a big thing for us is like, yes, it's good to be disciplined, but making sure our heart is in check that it really is to glorify and honor God and to grow and to deeply and compassionately love God and those things.

And so that's something I just try to be mindful of. Yes, it's good to do something you don't want to do, even though you know you should do it, be disciplined that way, but do it with a genuine heart posture that is actually serving the Lord. And so that's been, you know, I was just going back and looking at 1 Samuel and looking at David, and I think it's really cool to see how God used him and how much he truly loved God. And so for years and years, Mike, I would have told you that the word disciple means enthusiastic learner.

If you look it up in Greek and you really study all that and you'll come up with this idea of enthusiasm, and enthusiasm used to mean, and still does actually, but it's been changed, it means filled with the Spirit. And so when you get filled with the Spirit, then all of a sudden it's a whole different world when you're doing something than when you're not. But it's interesting that Nikita, Koloff, you know, like God brings all these people into our lives, he's the one that started saying, Robbie, yes, it's that, but it is also discipline because of what you described there from the Hebrews passage, righteousness. Right, this is the right thing to do, but balancing that with enthusiasm in the Spirit is an interesting little tight walk that we all get to run, those of us, you know, from my standpoint who do have discipline in our lives, we can so easily fall on the wrong side of that deal.

Yeah, you know, when you are disciplined, but then when God, God gives you these little nuggets that you need to put in your heart, he did this for me, God did this for me, God came through for me on this instance, he's healed me from this disease, he's helped me financially through this thing. And he helped you bowl what, 300 and something, what have you bowled, you're an amazing scorer? 877, yeah. 877, that must be more than one game, I didn't know you could. Yeah, that's three games, yeah, that's huge. That's 13 short of a perfect score on three games.

Well, I had a 300-300 on that series and then I bowled a 277 on the end. So, you need more training. That's a lot of purchase. Yes, exactly. You need more training. Well, thank you, Mike, as always, your calls bless me. And so, Doug, I always want to give you the last word of, you know, what do you feel God putting on your heart?

You want to leave with our audience? Yeah, the biggest thing that God's put on my heart is Proverbs 27, 1. Do not boast about tomorrow, for you do not know what a day will bring. And I just think there's an urgency to the Gospel. And I really just want to encourage people to not share it out of fear, to share it out of love and the same love that God had towards us when He sent His one and only Son to die, a death that we deserve so that we can live through Him.

And it's an important message and people need to hear it. Amen. Today. Now.