Hi, this is Nikita Kolev, the Russian Nightmare, from the Man Up Podcast, where we explore men's and women's fascinating life stories that will challenge you to man up, because it's time. Your chosen Truth Network Podcast is starting in just a moment. Sit back, enjoy it, share it, but most of all, thank you for choosing the Truth Podcast Network. This is the Truth Network. Welcome to Truth Talk Live, a daily program powered by the Truth Network, where pop culture, current events, and theology all come together.
And now, here's today's Truth Talk Live host. Happy 4th of July week, weekend, Independence Day. Is this just a bunch of flipping burgers and hot dogs on the grill, fireworks, time with family on the lake, getting pulled in the water weenie behind the boat, or is there something deeper to Independence Day?
Is there something deeper, more foundational? Just the word freedom. Everyone, just think about that word freedom, and just think about how awful your day is right now, and how all the bad things going on, and think about all the things we complain about, but then stop and think, we're free. We're free to complain in this country. St. Nick, our producer, we're free to complain. You're like, Stu's back in the hot chair on Truth Talk. I don't know if I like this.
Well, you're free to do that, because it's a free country, right? And we're free to do this show and talk about Jesus, and encourage people, and give shout-outs to Eric, who I literally saw in traffic at a light on the way to do the show today. Eric, big time shout-out to you.
Eric has an amazing smile. I can tell that guy's got some anointing on him, just gave me a word of encouragement. And Eric, thank you for tuning in to 97.7 FM, Winston-Salem, North Carolina, AM 830, and God bless...how about these people? How about these people? Mark, Mary, and their son Matthew are listening right now in Lynchburg on 93.7 FM. Shout-out to them. They are also featured on our Share the Truth program that will hit this Independence Day weekend, so be tuned in to Truth Talk weekend.
We'll make a podcast out of it. Nick is the podcast maestro, and they've been sharing the truth! They've been sharing Christ there in Lynchburg, listening right now on 93.7 FM, a little bit of heaven on 93.7. So wherever you are, wherever you're listening, a lot of you are listening on your smartphone.
It just got smarter because you downloaded the free Truth Network app. God bless you, we love you, we're glad you're here, we're glad you are free to call in and disagree with us, because that's the beauty of America, and that's the beauty of our freedom. Our whole society is based on freedom, and that's why Pastor Rob Pacienza, who is the pastor of Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church, amazing church in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, he's the host of Truths that Transform TV and radio. He's a commentator, he is an author, he's a father, he loves Jesus, and he's a regular contributor to this program, in fact his ministry was Ministry of the Month last month, across the Truth Network, and he's on all kinds of stations you're listening to right now. If he's not, call management and say, hey, add Truths that Transform. You remember a fella named Dr. D. James Kennedy, Evangelism Explosion?
This is Dr. Kennedy's disciple number one, Rob Pacienza. Did I undersell it, brother? What about all that, man? I love it. You've never been introduced, and so you've been introduced by Stu Epperson, so I appreciate it, brother. Well, no pressure, no pressure for you. You're like, oh no, I've got to say something smart now.
Exactly. Hey, you know, you really lit me up just a day or two ago with a text, and thank you for coming on the show today. This is a special Independence Day, Independence Week program, and you know what, we'll play it in January.
You know, when Nick calls me and says, Stu, we need a Best Of this weekend. You know, we're going to play this show, even though you're here, so if you're hearing this in a February or whatever, you know what, you're hearing the truth is we're free all year round. Independence Day, it's remarkable, Pastor Rob, just give us a context for the deeper notion of Independence Day in this free country we live in, this wonderful free country we live in, and then I want to jump on this article you wrote about, and this is the question of the day, should Christians be patriotic? Oh my, should Christians be patriotic? So we're going to talk about that all hour long, and we've got a guy who just wrote a shot over the bow article about it. We're going to read some of that and share it with you.
He is with us right now in the air. But Independence Day, Pastor Rob, what's it mean to you, and what should it mean to all citizens of this wonderful country on God's green earth? America's Independence Day is an Independence Day like no other country. Every nation has some type of celebration where they recognize the birth of their nation, the birth of their society as they know it today, but America is in a class all in of itself, and the reason for that is America was founded through the lens of a Judeo-Christian worldview. It was the Judeo-Christian worldview that gave birth to principled liberty that led to nearly 250 years of flourishing in this nation. It was a common morality that shaped a common liberty that shaped a common freedom and flourishing for all people in this country, and we are reaping the benefits of the founding fathers and the vision that they had 250 years ago. We're reaping the benefits today. So the revolution that took place in 1776 is in a class all in of itself, and we really should be grateful people in the 21st century for how this country was formed, for the type of independence they fought for, and really what was the religious conviction and motivation that really motivated them to break away from England, to declare independence and to say, no, we will have no other king over us except for King Jesus, that he is the only sovereign that will reign and rule over us, that the king is not above the law, but the law is above the king, and that what happened, as I said, many years ago was really unprecedented anywhere else in the entire world.
Wow. Okay, now we're going to get into this this hour. We're going to get into Christians and patriotism. We're going to get into both extremes. One extreme of like having a worship America service, where it's like, well, hold on a second, I thought we were worshiping God and we elevate or over-venerate on that side. And then the other extreme is like, well, we're going to step away from public policy, we're not going to get involved in voting, we're not going to get involved in policy, or we're not going to talk about marriage, abortion, because those are, quote, political issues, and Christians are going to kind of retreat. Somewhere in there, Pastor Rob Pacienza is going to share with us the balance, and we're going to welcome your phone calls on our live portion of the show at toll-free eight six six three four truth eight six six three four eight seven eight eight four should Christians be patriotic. But Pastor Rob, the beauty of our country going in this next break with gettin' more is, Columbia University students can chant death to America and death to Israel in New York City and burn the flag because of people that fought for their right to do that in America. Isn't that true as we go to the break? Absolutely.
That's the irony. Those that would bash America and want to tear this nation down. We'll come back right after this with Pastor Rob Pacienza.
Hang on. Christian and patriotism. You're listening to the Truth Network and truthnetwork.com. Christians and patriotism. Should a Christian be patriotic? I thought we were citizens of heaven. Philippians 3 20. Our citizenship is in heaven. We look for the Lord to return. What's all this talk about having the flag in church and having the flag... Trump got all that heat for having that American patriotic Bible.
What about all that, and it set some people off? Well, our guest today is not advocating for that kind of Bible necessarily, but he is strong on Christians and their role in our government. He's Pastor Rob Pacienza, and we're going to get to him after we say thank you first to our underwriting partners of this segment of Truth Talks. Stu Epperson is hosting today, and I've got two drinks before me. I've got my Le Blue Ultra-Pure bottled water, longtime underwriting partners with us, and my VineTastic, which is this new... I'll just read the label here. It is zero sugar, zero calories, zero carbs, and it's got the antioxidants of the muscadine grape squeezed in there, and they are on a crusade at vinetasticandmightymuscadine.com to educate America on how to be more healthy, how to live longer, how to take care of your heart.
Your body's the temple, so thank you Jerry, Judy, Candy, and the whole gang at VineTastic, Mighty Muscadine, and Le Blue Ultra-Pure bottled water is the sister company to them. And more information is available at mightymuscadine.com, and they've made available a special promo code, TRUTH, for our listeners for special savings. Thank you for supporting our underwriting partners here of Truth Talk, and thank you, Pastor Rob Pacienza, for being with us today, and for your stand for Christ.
Now, if you could summarize your article real quick, we've got a caller on the line, and we have people listening from all over the place. It's a special Independence Weekend edition of Truth Talk and Truth Talk Live, and we're talking about patriotism and the believer. And your article effectively is patriotism and the pastor, by faith, you know, by faithonline.com, he's the host of Truth is to Transform, he's the pastor of Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church. So Pastor Rob, give us a summary, and then we'll take some calls here, of why you think Christians, it's good for them to be patriotic.
Absolutely. So when you look at, for instance, Proverbs 14.34, what does it say? It says, Righteousness exalts a nation. Solomon wanted us to understand from very early on that the people of God had to be had to be concerned about their nation, how was righteousness going to be administered in the in their nation in the public square. And so my our love for God and our love for the kingdom compels us to love our neighbor to love our nation to make sure that righteousness is exalted in the public square that our theological convictions are shaping our public policy.
So my love for God, she can call me to love my nation. That's biblical patriotism. That that's, that's, in that order, that that's, that's the most important thing we need to remember, that when Jesus started to gain followers in the first century, and he started to preach to them that the kingdom that my kingdom is not of this world, he didn't also say now forget about the Roman Empire. No, he said, go out into your countries, go out into your nations, love your nation in such a way that the that the righteousness of God is manifest, that they understand that the that the righteousness of the kingdom of heaven is far superior than anything that Rome is going to offer. So he didn't say, forget about your homeland, forget about your nation. He just said, make sure that first nation second, but he never tells people to forget about their nation. No part of loving our neighbor well is having a biblical sense and biblical perspective of patriotism and love of nation in which righteousness is exalted in the public square. Okay, folks, you agree or disagree? He's saying the cross is before the flag, but we certainly are to act as citizens and be concerned and care about what's going on in the culture. And it's interesting how a lot of times the left will use this social justice and other things as a love your neighbor kind of approach.
Well, he just invoked love your neighbor to stand up for Christian values, to love your neighbor, to have a rule of law, to have an order to have justice in our society, and to be patriotic as a believer. What do you think about this, folks? 86634 truth, 86634 87884. Let's go to Dayton, Ohio, and let's go to B-man. You're on the air, sir, on Truth Talk. Go ahead. Hey, God bless you, Stu, and God bless you, brother Rob.
I want to move to Fort Lauderdale now after hearing that opening. And let me read this to you, brothers. If Satan rules in our halls of legislation, the pulpit is responsible for it. If our politics become so corrupt that the very foundations of our government are ready to fall away, the pulpit is responsible for it.
Who said that? My brothers, Charles Finney, Pastor Charles Finney, who was born in the late 1700s and was part of the Second Awakening here in the United States of America in the 1800s. So with that as my sort of my preface, my brothers, it so encapsulates what we as Christians should be here in the United States. Okay, but what about people that say you're getting in there, you know, you have this patriotic service at your church, it's like a Worship America service.
It's like, what in the world? God didn't, you know, make America special. What about Christians in Nigeria? You know, do we have a little bit of a higher-level privilege than them over there?
I mean, what about these people that over-conflate and they wrap the cross, instead of putting the cross before the flag, they wrap the cross in the flag. You know, what about that, sir? Absolutely.
Absolutely, Stu. Well, I can almost guarantee you, if we were to go over to Africa where those Nigerians are and we said, hey, would you like to come to us to the safety of the United States of America and become American? I'll bet they would jump into our cars, our boats, our planes quicker than we can say, the Lord loves you. Yeah, but Pastor Rob, and I'm not disagreeing with you there, but Pastor Rob, the goal isn't to make someone an American, is it a goal to bring someone to Christ? That is the goal. Absolutely, and of course, and that goes back to priorities. Our first priority is always to the kingdom of God. That's our ultimate allegiance. But just because I pledge allegiance to the flag and I'm patriotic, doesn't undermine my first allegiance to the cross and to the kingdom of God.
I love my wife and I'm loyal to her, and my loyalty to my wife does not allow people to question my loyalty to Jesus. In the same way, my loyalty to my nation, America, should in no way cause people to question my loyalty to Jesus and His kingdom. We need to make sure we have our priorities in order, but it's a false dichotomy, and the left has done this in our nation, where they have told us either, and the left in the church in particular, that it's either love Jesus and His kingdom, or love your nation, but you can't have both.
And it's time that Christian Americans that love the kingdom of God, but also love the liberty that our founding fathers fought for and died for 250 years ago, it's time that we speak up and say, no, we're no longer going to allow you to create that false dichotomy, that I either have to pick God or my nation, that I can love God and love my country in that order, and actually that God calls us to that. And that's what made America great 250 years ago. A lot of people are asking the question, what made America great? What made America great?
The reason people have flocked to this nation and are continuing to flock through this nation, to this nation, particularly through the southern border, is because they understand that there is something special about America, and what is special about America is what gave birth to liberty 250 years ago. Okay, more on that when we come back. Don't touch that dial. Listen on the app if you can't. Listen on your local station. We're coming back right after this. Hang on.
You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Just to make things a little spicier here, I got a quote from Dr. Adrian Rogers. He says this, quote, I make no apology whatsoever for being a red-blooded, flag-waving American patriot. I believe it is logical.
I believe it is reasonable. I believe it is biblical to be patriotic. Dr. Adrian Rogers, a definite, stellar, stalwart man of the faith, a preacher of God's Word, as is our special guest today, Pastor Rob Passienza, who heads up Core Ridge Ministries, and he's on TV, on radio, you've heard him on many of the stations you're listening to right now, Truths that Transform. Pastor Rob, we're talking about Christians and patriotism, and is it okay, A, for a Christian to be patriotic? You've kind of made the case for that all hour long, and B, how far do we go as believers? In your article, Patriotism, by patriotism and the pastor, you get into the freedoms, you get into the roots of our faith and the roots of our culture, and effectively, it seems like, Pastor Rob, you're just calling believers to step up and to be salt and light in the area of policy, in the area of public politics and everything, and you use the word politics in an interesting way there, because everyone's political, it's just, how is that tented, I guess, or how is that prejudiced, right?
Absolutely. We need a biblically informed, God-centered, Christ-exalting understanding of what it means to be patriotic, and part of our patriotism is talking about the great moral and social issues of our day, starting in the pulpit. It was ministers, they called them the Black Rogue Regiment in the 1700s, that were stewarding their pulpits, utilizing their pulpits to talk about what was happening in the American colonies, what was happening over in England, how was the king acting not as a benevolent leader, but a tyrant? How were their freedoms and liberties being stripped away? How were they refused certain rights, including the right to worship as they desired?
They were stripped of their right to a freedom of conscience, that they believed that the law was above the king, and not the king above the law. And so these patriots were really developed and discipled under faithful men of God that were preaching the whole council of God, and they were applying what the scripture said to what was happening in their current cultural moment. And that's why we're patriotic. We're not patriotic because America was the greatest military power in the world 250 years ago, or had the greatest economy, or they had the greatest political power, they didn't have any of those things.
We're patriotic about America in particular because of how America was founded. It was Alexis de Tocqueville, a French sociologist and author, that said, it wasn't till I came to America and saw the American churches and heard pulpits aflame with righteousness. Only then did I understand the genius and the greatness of America. That's what makes America great.
That's what makes America good. That's why we're patriotic, even as Christians, and we need more Christians that we saw, like we saw in the 1700s and the 1800s, that were preaching the whole council of God, and they were preaching it in the public square. We need righteousness to be restored in the public square, a love of God and a love of nation. I love my nation too much to allow her to become secular, to allow her to become unrighteous, to allow her laws and her policies to look more like the city of man and less like they did 250 years ago, the city of God.
Wow. So it's almost as though you're espousing, Pastor Rob, and I want to put words in your mouth here, it's almost as though you're espousing that a true believer in Christ who has the authority issue settled, that he is Lord, he's Lord of all, he's Lord over all, he's Lord above all. When you have that view, then you're not going to worship your country. You're not going to get politics or policy out of order or out of alignment, just like if you enjoy any number of things that can become idols. There's good things that become idols, and if a believer starts to conflate church and state, starts to put their government above the Bible, they get so aggressive in arguing their particular political agenda that they forget about the souls across the table that disagree with them, then they're misguided and they've got to go back to Jesus as Lord, and I'm going to reflect him in how I engage.
Is that correct? Am I putting words in your mouth, or would you agree with that? You're absolutely right. Our founding fathers did not fight and die for this nation in order to make this nation an idol. And they did not die and fight for this nation and to found America to give any one man a pedestal that was higher than the law. No, the reason they fought and they died and they established the United States of America nearly 250 years ago is so that God could be seen as the Supreme Lord and King, so that no man would be above the law, so that they could worship as they choose and worship freely and exercise the religion as the First Amendment says, and they would be able to exercise it freely where?
In the public square, not only in private, but in public. So yes, when we understand that Jesus is Lord overall, we're not going to turn America into an idol. Our patriotism is not going to become idolatrous. No, we're going to have a biblically informed patriotism, where as I've said previously, we love God and we love country in that order, but it's always Jesus first, nation second, but we can't separate the two. If Jesus is Lord, he's Lord overall, that means he's Lord over presidents and kings and nations and governments and public policy. Yeah, so those of you that get more excited about Trump or more excited about Biden than the Lord, you've got an issue with God there.
You've got to make sure that you remember who the boss is and who's number one, but in that, as he is Lord over your life, you're engaging and you're praying for your leaders, but you're not conflating. Now, I want to get into that, but first, and I want to read this, I've got to read this quote. I'll read it in the next segment.
Folks, stay tuned. By the way, download this whole broadcast. We'll make it a podcast within an hour after off the air. St. Nick, our awesome producer, makes this into a podcast, and it's tremendous.
It cuts a lot of stuff out and really puts in so you can grab and hear this in your own time. You can also share this on our Truth Network podcasting network, but Sean is a caller. Let's bring him on the line. He may want to disagree with you, Pastor Rob. Sean, what about all this Christianity and patriotism? Should we just get out of there and just, Christians, don't even talk about government, don't even talk about abortion and same-sex marriage, just kind of stay in your church lane and leave that to the professional politicians? I mean, they're all crooked anyway, right? Sean, what say you, sir?
Not a chance. I love what Pastor Rob is sharing, what you're sharing today, is to let freedom ring and let freedom ring from sea to shining sea in this great land of ours. We love God and we love the Lord Jesus, so much so that our bubbliness for them boils out into serving our neighbors and creating a community and a sense of community. That's something that we grew up in, but right now it's certainly lacking with the divisiveness and the heart aches of people that can't figure out the fact that we're in this together. This experiment that started over 250 years ago, with our Founding Fathers purposing to let freedom of conscience ring, we need to get back to this.
Okay, wow. Okay, so let me read this quote to both of you. I really enjoyed this quote, and I want to get your reaction, and maybe we'll get Sean's reaction, a caller, to kind of get his raw reaction. Pastor Rob, you talk about the error that people make on both sides of this thing, where you've got some folks that take it a little bit too far on the patriotism side and others that almost run away from it, and you say this, you say, "'A pastor can fulfill his office patriotically by expounding a biblical view of governing politics, the church, and the relationship between the two. In particular, he must help his church avoid two temptations.'" Here's the two temptations.
This is the article by Pastor Rob Acienza. The misguided view that the church isn't political, and then the second temptation, which is the dangerous temptation to conflate church and state. And so that's where Pastor Rob, if I'm not mistaken here, and Sean, our caller, you can correct me if I'm wrong here, that's where someone says, well, that's God's candidate right there. And if I don't vote, you know, that guy says, by voting for me, you're voting God's will. Is that going to be on the conflation side, Pastor Rob?
Going too far there? Well, what I mean by conflation, conflating church and state, is when they become two equals, and we begin to equate the gospel with politics and the kingdom of God with America, and that's where we have to be super, super careful. We do have to understand that the kingdom of God is way bigger than America, that the hope for this nation is way beyond politics.
It is the gospel of Jesus Christ. But the other extreme that we need to avoid is saying that Christians need to run away from politics altogether, particularly in the poll. But I think when you get to candidates and voting, here, going back to having a biblical worldview of patriotism and a biblical patriotism that honors God and honors country in that order, when we go to the ballot box, we understand that we're not ultimately voting for a man. We're voting for a platform, and we're voting for policies. Interesting.
Okay. This is really helpful in elections, when we're able to say, you know, I'm not voting for a pastor, I'm not voting for a perfect candidate, because I would never be able to find one. I am voting for a man or a woman that will fight for righteousness in public government.
We've got to take a break. Policy over personality, and what about separation of church and state? We'll tackle that with Pastor Rob Kovetz. Thanks for your call, Sean. You're listening to the Truth Network and truthnetwork.com.
So I saw it. This is real life, real time, what happened on a social media platform, a Christian friend out of nowhere, who I hadn't really talked to about politics, posted this. The separation of church and state. We don't need our teachers to be pastors. We don't need the Bible instruction and religion taught in our classrooms. Get the church out of our classrooms. Vote blue.
Which blue is the vote for the Democratic Party. That's what this Christian who posted? And I'm like, oh wow. And so there's this idea of separation of church and state. It's touted around, it's voiced everywhere, and mostly it's used by the left to attack the right to say, hey, you don't quit talking about God, and, you know, separation of church and state, no prayer in schools. Pastor Rob Passianz is our guest. I love it when we have these high-power, high-voltage guests on, like Pastor Rob, because then I can ask them the tough questions. I can put it right on you, Pastor Rob, about ministry is true as a transform. Hey, before you answer the question, give the website real quick of your ministry, in case we get going so rapid fire here toward the end of the program that we don't get that in, because I want folks to listen to your preaching and to see your awesome interviews, your television, your social media. Follow this guy, he's a real rising star, mentored by Dr. D. James Kennedy, Core Ridge Ministries. Pastor Rob, what's the main website for your information, and for folks to read this article you wrote about Christians and patriotism, especially this week of July 4th and Independence Day weekend and week? You can simply go to CRM.TV, CRM.TV, that stands for Core Ridge Ministries. There you can find our podcast articles, weekly television programs, all of our documentaries, books, all helping to resource and equip the Church in North America to stand for biblical truth in an upside-down world.
Yeah, and you know, what's interesting I love about your ministry is we haven't talked about any candidates on this show today. You've simply tried to drill into our listeners and build them up at the foundational level of Christian worldview. What's your view of God? What's your view of God's Word? How does that impact, how does it influence how you vote?
How does it influence your discernment when it comes to engaging the culture? And I really respect that, Pastor Rob, because it has to do with, you know, so many people are voting, well, I don't like him. Well, he's mean! Well, I don't like him.
He has all these gaffes. You know, and this other thing is age. Well, he's too old.
You know what? There are 90-year-olds that can run this country. It has nothing to do with age. It has to do with policy.
It does not have to do with personality. I don't like what he said about this or that. Of course, character is important, but you're not voting for someone who is... All these people have issues with character.
You're voting for policy. Pastor Rob, am I wrong? Someone who is going to at least stand up for the unborn.
Someone who's at least closer to God's view of gender, that there's two genders. Am I wrong on that, Pastor Rob? Am I being too political?
Am I being too patriotic to say things like that? No, Stu, first of all, our founders would have been horrified by how much emphasis we currently put on a candidate or an individual. First of all, there is no such thing as career politicians. They served their office one or two terms, and then they went back to the farm or they went back to the bank. But there was no such thing as career politicians. And you just nailed it.
They were not focused on the person. They were focused on the policy. Who's going to uphold the Constitution, and who's going to stand for righteousness in the public square?
They were the primary issues of the day. How does the righteousness of God, the morality that is found in the Word of God that shaped the founding of this nation that shaped our founding documents and also helped to shape the founding public policies that made this nation great in the first place? That was the witness test for who would run this country and who would serve in the legislative branches of government, who would run our states and our cities.
It had nothing to do with their personalities, had nothing to do, certainly nothing to do with their social media accounts or how they looked or how they talked. Will they stand for righteousness? Will they uphold the Constitution? Will they reflect God's moral law in the public square so that the nation will be exalted?
That was the true test of every candidate that ran for public office, either at the federal level or the local level. Okay, and so much to unpack even now. We've got a caller on the line. We've had a lot of callers. We're going to take one more call from Jamal before we get his call. Pastor Rob, Separation of Church and State.
I don't want to leave the listeners hanging out there. Tell us how... Now, it's all over. It's got to be found all over the Constitution, Separation of Church and State, and I'm sure it's all over the Declaration of Independence, and it's all the amendments, right, in the Bill of Rights. You can find the word separation of church and state and all that, right, Pastor Rob?
Oh, the progressives could only wish it was found all over. Actually, it's nowhere to be found in our founding documents, nowhere to be found in the Scriptures. It was one line that Thomas Jefferson used to the Dansbury Baptist Association, assuring them of this, that there would be a separation to preventing the state to interfere with the Church. The whole idea was this Constitution and this new government will not interfere with your right to religion, with your right to worship.
That was the wall of separation. But there was never a wall of separation preventing the Church to influence the state or the Church to influence the public square. And then you go to the Bible, no, the whole idea of being salt of the earth in the light of the world, righteousness exalts to nation. It's the people of God shaping the public square, shaping public policy, and standing for righteousness. But it's to keep the state out of the Church, not to keep the Church out of the state. Yeah, and by the way, the ally of the Muslim, the Hindu, the Jew, the Catholic, the ally of all the religions, the ally even of the transgender, if I may say that, is the born-again Christian who says, hey, come worship how you want, proselytize all you want!
It's a free country! It has always been the people of God that have sought flourishing and what the Bible calls shalom for all people, whether it's the Babylonians, the Assyrians, the Jews, or the pagan Greco-Roman Empire in the first century. And the Left is trying to censor the people of God. The Left is trying to censor believers. Like it's like the one person, the one group that believes in freedom for all, the Left is trying to censor us and call everything we say hate speech, because we do believe Jesus is the only way, but we believe that in this country, a free country, you can believe whatever you want!
Absolutely. It's the reason for the greatness of America over the last 250 years, and it has always been Christians exercising their prophetic witness in the public square that has led to flourishing for all people. Yeah, and hence Independence Day, hence freedom, hence the celebration that we all celebrate, and hence we can have these conversations without shouting each other down, because we're more concerned with winning a soul than winning an argument if you truly follow Jesus and that includes, by the way, your school, your work, your family, and politics! And you don't divorce your family, well I'm a Christian at church, and I'm a Christian at work, but not at home.
You don't do that. You don't bifurcate your faith. He is either Lord of all or he's not Lord at all. And so, as we said earlier, Pastor Rob Passianos is our guest, he's the pastor of Coral Ridge Pastorarian Church in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. He is host of Truths to Transform in Coral Ridge Ministries on TV, on radio, just a compelling voice of truth and reason in these dark days, and so glad he's been a guest all our long.
We gotta go to Jamal. Jamal, you've been so patient, hang on, jump in here, sir, with your quote, your thought, your question, we're talking about Christians, is it okay, or should Christians be patriotic, or is that going too far? Yeah, thank you for taking my calls, Stu, and thanks for being on, Pastor Rob Passianos. I had that practice on saying that. Absolutely.
Well, thank you. Well, absolutely, I would say we can be and should be patriotic, and I'll pile on to what you guys said, and I'll try to be quick, not only has Christians been friends to other religions, Christians have been friends to many different demographics. They've been friends to every race, been friends to even non-believers.
They've been friends to the women when even women didn't have a voice. So if you want to be patriotic, that's fine, because the Christian way has led to liberation of pretty much everybody, and giving you liberation on this earth, and on top of that, giving you salvation for the life yet to come on the other side of the grave. So yeah, be thankful for where you're at, because, you know, you wouldn't want to live anywhere else, in my opinion. But that's all, take care, God bless, guys. God bless you. You know, to his point, Pastor Rob, what about Jamal's word, and to his point, it was the hot pulpits in America that gave rise to shutting down slavery. You know, it was the men of God that said, no more.
No more of this nonsense. Absolutely, I've already mentioned multiple times, Proverbs 1434, Righteousness exalts a nation, but I forgot to mention the second half of that verse, but sin is a reproach to any people. Our founders in the 18th century, and those that were leading this nation in the 19th century, people like Abraham Lincoln, understood both sides of that proverb, that if Righteousness, if we fight for Righteousness for all people, our nation will be exalted.
But if we embrace sin in the public square, a.k.a. slavery, for example, slavery in the South, then we know that we're going to become a reproach. Our founders and our nation's leaders understood that, and it led to freedom and liberty for all people. I mean, show me another nation.
That's, what a good word. Freedom and liberty for all people. Yeah, but it's all based in the imago Dei. It's all based that everybody's created in the image of God. One of my good friends, Alveda King, the niece of Martin Luther King Jr., she says we are all human race, one human race, and we need to celebrate that. We're not multiple races, we might be ultimate ethnic groups and people groups made from every tongue tribe and people group around the world, but ultimately we are one human race, born of Adam, born in the imago Dei, and when Christians are exercising their freedoms and their rights in the public square, everyone wins.
Everyone gets freedom, and we've seen it in exceptional ways here in America in the last 250 years. That's a great way to celebrate Independence Day and, of course, July 4th week and weekend, everyone. Thank you, Pastor Rod, for being on your website one more time.
CRM.TV. I love it. And remember, who the Son sets free is free indeed. Spread the message of the Son. Spread the good news of Christ. Use your freedom to spread the only good news of the Gospel that can set people free. This is a program powered by the Truth Network.
