The Rich Eisen Show Basketball Podcast #25. Celtics run to the Finals, Jimmy Butler, Steph Curry, Warriors- Celtics preview

Hey everybody, what's up? Welcome back. It's the Rich Eisen Show Basketball Podcast here on a Wednesday, June 1st, NBA Finals time, guys. Joined as always by my boys, Adam, Chudwin, TJ, Jefferson, fellas. What's happening? Great to be back.

What's cracking? I don't mean like my boys. This is a team. We're all... Yeah, I was... You kind of threw me out there for a little bit. It's not like I'm like the point god or anything. It's like, we're all... Thought I was visiting your podcast as a visitor.

No, no, no. This is our podcast. We do this together. We're having a great time. We're here in the NBA Finals. Now, as we record this... You're a little underwhelming with that. After all these months, we finally got to the finals. And my team is in it.

I know, I'm trying to like downplay it. Adam, did you notice that Brockman was more hyped when he called on the phone that one week than he's been in person? I've noticed like you were super hyped on the phone.

I want that Chris Brockman here. Well, that's because he is with the birds and the bees and wherever he was. That's true.

That's the problem though. By the way, the two times that I've been super duper hype on the show, we lost both games. Like that game when I called in, I expected us to close out or win that night. We didn't win. And then game six in Boston, Miami, I was so hyped for that.

On the big show, we were just like, oh, is Larry Bird going to show up to give the trophy to Tatum in Boston Garden? And then they lost. So I can't get up anymore. I just got to keep it. I got to keep it down here. You know what I mean?

Tempered expectations. So we're getting ready. But still, screw that, be hyped. I mean, I am super hyped.

Get excited, man. Well, considering where this team was, it's been talked about a lot in the national media. They were 25 and 25 on January 28th. And now they're in the NBA finals. It's really crazy. All the metrics and the analytics people said that Boston had one of the best chances to make the NBA finals.

And you kind of read those articles. And I know as a fan and I was just like, what? They were with it. Were they watching the same games that I was watching? Like for the better part of this season, I get really at no point did this Celtics team ever look like a finals team. The talk of breaking up Brown and Tatum. I mean, we talked about it on this show. It was like getting louder by the week, by the disappointment, by the buzzer beating loss. It's just like it was so frustrating for the most of this season.

And then I don't know, man. Jalen Brown tweeted out the energy is about to change and it seems like it really did. And and now here we go. They've gone through the Nets, the betting favorite the entire year to win the championship. They went through the defending champs in the second round and they went through a team that beat them in the bubble, the Miami Heat, to get to the NBA finals. And I think this is the best case scenario for the NBA finals. I think it's going to be so entertaining. I think the league has to be through the roof. The numbers are going to be huge.

I expect big ratings. I mean, two great storied franchises, you know, an all time great Boston going for the 18th championship. And then the last decade or so, kind of the team that's really been kind of running the NBA, the Golden State Warriors. I think it's going to be a great finals.

Guys, what do you think? Well, well, first of all, I have to say that I can't remember a team that people had no expectation of making the finals, making the finals. This is the greatest run since I think the Knicks in 1999 when they made that finals is the East seed.

They were the seven years, the 80. They're the AC that year, 1999 lockout year. And I can't remember another East team where people were like, there's no way this team can make the finals and all of a sudden they're in the finals. So not only that, but the Celtics had such a hard journey to get to where they are, having to face the bucks and the heat in the nets.

All three of those teams were, were finals contenders during the middle of the season. So the fact that the Celtics went through all those teams shows how tough of a team they are. I have underestimated the Celtics from the start.

I've been fading them. I mean, not, not betting wise, but just in my head though. And this, this is a tough, good team. Do I think they'll win against the, against the warriors?

I guess we could talk about that a little later. I'm going to say no, I think, I think that they will, that they will make it a tough series, but to me, golden state is just the better team. It's going to be so entertaining. The ratings will be off the charts. You have the premier defense in the league in Boston, the premier offense in the league in golden state, a great matchup. You have the up and coming star and Jason Tatum against the reigning superstar in Steph Curry.

So you have East coast versus West coast, California, Massachusetts. It's, it's setting up to be awesome. So I'm very excited.

Yeah. TJ, what do you think? Well, just to touch on something that Adam said earlier about like an East team that you didn't see coming and you said you had to go back to the Knicks. I don't think you have to go back that far, obviously with the West, but right off the bat in 14, 15 golden state, like when they went to that first finals to start this run, nobody really knew that this was coming. I believe the year before they got beat by the Clippers in the playoffs. And again, I should have checked this, but I didn't even think to say it until I went to one of those games where the Clippers beat them by like 40.

Yeah. And so the next season, you know, I know they started off hot that that season, but I don't think anyone, I can vividly recall as the confetti's falling in the warriors are winning. I remember sitting there going, I did not see this coming. I mean, as the year progressed and you saw, wait a minute, Steph Curry is like a little bit better than he was before right now. So as the season progressed, I feel like you may have felt it, especially once the playoffs hit, they won 50, they wouldn't 67 games that year, I think. So yeah, I think that that was just a team that just snuck up out of nowhere. But this Boston team, yeah, man, the last rights were being read for them around the mid-season point. And for them to keep it together, because I know, I almost called you Chris, and that's weird because I never say that. I know Brockman, there were, you know, there was a story about a team meeting and internal team meeting early in the season, right?

Really early in the year. So man, it just props to them, props to me for hanging in there. And I can't imagine how bad the Boston and New England media was when this was going on and they weren't doing well. But for that team to stick together, to push through whatever challenges and obstacles and you know, whatever chemistry problems they may have been having to for them to push through that, to make it to this point, it is pretty impressive, man.

It really is. Because I'm not as surprised by Golden State being there. I didn't pick them to be there at the beginning, but it's not shocking. But the Celtics thing's a little bit surprising for sure. I think coming out of the West, we just thought, you know, Phoenix looks so great last year and they had the 2-0 lead in the finals on Milwaukee.

And you kind of seen how that progresses, right? Like, I remember the Bulls getting beat up by the Pistons every year, but you kind of knew that last year, like I think in 89, I was like, I think this is the last time for the Pistons. They kind of broke through. And, you know, we thought Chris Paul looks so good and seeing Booker mature and DeAndre Aiten become a dominant big man. And they had all the pieces, the good role players, the defensive bridges and Crowder experience, a great coach, Monty Williams. You just thought, man, this is going to be, you know, okay, okay. They kind of blew it last year.

Yeah. You were kind of like Rich too, but like, I don't know. I just, I thought Phoenix was going to be there. I mean, look, I'll admit I picked the Nets to win the title. I thought they had too much talent. They got two great players.

But again, we talked about it at Nazium, but we never thought the COVID thing was going to kind of wreck that team like it did. And then KD gets hurt a little bit. But I mean, I thought the Nets were going to win the title, kind of like most people. But we knew the Lakers were going to be kind of, kind of, you know, not garbage, but like they weren't going to do anything. But I thought it would be Phoenix and New Jersey, Brooklyn. But as a Celtics fan, I'm so happy. The pride, the way they fought through it, the chemistry issues, they kind of dumped Dennis Schroeder and Josh Richardson. That was obvious early on.

It wasn't working. They're bringing a glue guy, kind of Derek White defense. And they're just a maturity of Tatum and Brown. And Marcus Smart, really. You know, he's really taken his game to another level, become a true point guard. He's defensive player of the year, albeit that was a little controversial pick by some people. But good three point shooter, not great, but he kind of became a leader on this team. And the role players can't talk enough about Al Horford, what he meant to this team, his second go around. Guys like Grant Williams, the emergence of Robert Williams defensively. I mean, I think if he doesn't get hurt, maybe he's a defensive player of the year candidate.

We might see him win one down the road. And then I made a Doka man, just Brad Stevens stepping away from this team. Like if Brad Stevens is coaching this team, they're probably not here. You know, maybe his message has run out with those guys and bringing in a new voice, a former player, a guy who learned under Greg Popovich. That's it to him just being able to take it to the next level with these guys being stern, not messing around like all the player meetings, calling them out in the media. It was what these guys needed to hear to break through the next level.

And they did it. You know, we don't often talk about coaching trees in the NBA the way we do with the NFL, but you just said it right there. I played for the Spurs, learned under the Popovich tree. And when you talk Popovich, you're talking a guy who, you know, other than Phil Jackson, you're talking about someone who's like maybe the greatest coaches of all time. So, you know, much like someone under the Belichick tree, he learned under the Pops tree.

And, you know, and he brought maybe a little bit of that hard assness that was necessary for this team to have. And especially like you said, a former player, you get a little I would imagine a little bit more respect from the guys you're coaching once they know that you've done the same thing they've done. You've traveled the same roads.

You've had the same path. I think so. And it's not like he's a superstar player, like like Jason Kidd. Exactly. He was a role player.

So, you know, we had to grind. Right. But I mean, just think of the job Jason Kidd did with Dallas. Phenomenal job coaching in his second go around as a head coach. It was his second go around.

So he kind of learned from his mistakes with your guy, man. Just props to him and props to your team. Props to everybody. Props to that team.

It's going to be exciting series. And you know how much it pains me, Adam, to say that. Right. You know, it hurts. It hurts my soul, you know.

And I think that if Pao, the next person that maybe if fam needs to slap somebody, maybe should be Pascal Siakam, because had his wayward elbow not met Joel Embiid's face in this whole situation could be different. But I digress. If Jason Tatum wins the MVP of the NBA finals, TJ, you will be in therapy all summer. All summer. Did you just say summer? So you. OK, good. You're going to limit me to the summer. Not for the rest of the rest of his life.

Well, actually, it'll be it'll be weekly visits in the summer and then it'll be monthly for the rest of your life. You better check in on me. The finals match up with Golden State has just been kind of chilling for a while. Just let me ask you this real quick, because I know what my answer is. Did you think Jimmy Butler's shot was going in? Absolutely. Yes. I was I was completely convinced he was killing it all game. I was actually thinking of you during that last minute.

Chris having a panic attack right now. You want to set the scene for you? Yeah. So it's Sunday night. OK.

So first off, Sarah had some family come down from the base. So they're going to say they're going to stay fans. OK. And then. So Friday night, we're watching the game and they and they lose. They just blow it, you know, and we were playing golf all weekend, too. And we were just like, man, it would just be nice if like they went on Friday, game six, wrap it up, then we could have a nice kind of peaceful golf trip. We don't have to worry about the stress of a game of a looming game seven.

And then, of course, blah, blah, blah. They lose on Friday. Right. So when we set up Sunday where it's like we're kind of having our Memorial Day kind of feast or whatever, cookout grill of a lot of food because they're leaving Monday morning. And so our magical comes over to because there's tight with with their family and he's from the bay, too. So he's also a Golden State.

So he requested to come over so he could. So we're up. We're up. The Boston's up the whole game. You can use weed, Chris. Don't feel weird about it.

It's OK. It's double digits the whole game. Like it's pretty comfortable. Yeah. And with three minutes to go, it's 13. OK. And then it's eleven and nine and seven. And then it's true.

It's a three. And I had to go outside. We had the TV going outside, too, because we're kind of going back and forth. And I just left everyone and I went outside in the yard.

That's only from the flex on the side of me as an outside. And I started cleaning up the yard while the game's going on. Still, while the game is going on, because I just needed so I couldn't just get you because I felt the collapse coming. I feel like I just it just felt like they were going to lose.

And my aim is going to this. Drew sits to three and I scream at the top of my lungs in the backyard, just like f bombs. So I'm sure it freaked out my neighbor. Yeah.

The neighbors definitely heard. Right. There was a time out and then. Right. There was a time out. And then. Wait, what happened? Oh, no. Marcus Smart missed another wide open three.

Right. And then Butler's coming on the fast break. Look, I've been playing basketball my whole life. That's my favorite shot.

A fast break. Pull up three when nobody sees it's coming. And he was hot the entire game, hot the entire game.

But here's the deal. I thought it was going in. I thought I thought for sure he was making it.

But in hindsight, you look at it. Miami got every call in this game. Jimmy Butler has been getting every call the entire series. Al Horford is great as defensively as he's been this playoffs. He was on his heels. The late look at the look at the wide shot.

It's wide open. Why does he go to the basket? You know, he's at least going to get a foul call and two free throws.

Most likely he's going to get an end one. I think he's thinking. No, I think he was just in the flow of the game. He was on, like you said, a fast break three. And oftentimes that's that's a momentum shot. He was going for the dagger. He thought that he played every minute.

TJ, you pointed out he played every minute but two in the last two games. You know, and Adam, I think the thing is, you're hired. I said this on the big show yesterday.

I think what it came down to is maybe that guy knew he had nothing left to give and he wanted to end it. And also you're at home. You hit that three at home.

That place goes insane. You know, though, granted, if he does it, that three to Celtics probably have 16, 15 seconds left. But now you've got the building rocking.

And now that little burst of adrenaline is going to come for those guys who were super tired. So you really don't know. You know, I think it was in. Honestly, I didn't know. I did. I just see him pull up and you're like, he's making this for whatever reason. I didn't because you. OK, I don't know if you, Adam, we've talked about this, but Chris and I talked about this a lot from watching so much basketball on TV and the angle they present you with your at least I am.

And I know Chris said he is. I'm pretty good at watching the shot and figuring out if it's going in or not, just especially once it hits its arc. When it was in the air, you could tell it was going left. But when he pulled the I guess you're like, oh, my honestly, I was like, this is how we lose. We blew a 13 point lead with three minutes ago. It would have been worse than the dagger three. It would have been worse than the trailblazers epic defeat against the Lakers in 2000. It would all for sure. Yeah, it would because I don't know, man.

No, no. Because the Blazers were down 15 at the start of that quarter of that fourth quarter against the Lakers. The Celtics were up 13 with two minutes left or whatever. It would have been the worst choke in conference finals. The only reason I disagree is just because the Heat are the number one seed.

Right. So it's never really an upset if they beat. It wouldn't have been an upset for them to beat anyone even being down that much. I kind of think I just think their their position would have kind of made it less of the worst collapse.

You know, I don't know. Epic choke job. It would have been bad, though. It would have been so bad. And it's just Miami. Their fans are so annoying. I think it's like I said on the show, half their fans would have been they were gone. They would have never seen it. It was getting ready to go to live on Sunday.

Little Memorial Day weekend party. Thank God. But it was tough, you know, shut out, you know, because we've had this conversation and I remember two podcasts ago. We're like, why is Jimmy Butler not mentioned in the top players in NBA? And then we said, well, after after I think he had forty seven that one game in the playoffs were like he will be. And then he kind of had two games where it was just like, OK, maybe this is the reason why he's not listed amongst the greats. But game six and game seven, I don't know if he's a top 10 player in the NBA. He's 1000 percent the top 15 player.

Did he make all NBA this year? I don't think so. I don't believe. I don't think he was.

Sure. I don't think he was. I don't think he was even 13.

But what I mean, yeah, it's pretty much everything you could ask. It was, you know, came down to the wire like a memorable shot. And a weird series, too, you know, the games were just kind of blowouts and both teams won a lot of road teams won.

I mean, look, Miami hadn't lost a home game in the first two rounds and then they went one and three at home against Boston. I think that that the the Tyler Hero injury really cost the hit. I think that he probably would have won the series if if Hero was at full strength. That guy was so important in terms of getting buckets off the bench. He could hit a bunch of threes in a row, get them going. So they didn't really have that spark. I don't I still don't really understand why that he didn't play Duncan Robinson as much as is they could have. He was essentially a bench warmer the whole series.

And as much as Vincent, they liked him, obviously. I just think that even to hit some big shots. But even in game seven, I just think Duncan Robinson could have could have provided more of a spark. So I don't understand that. I don't I don't go against what Spoelstra does, though. I trust him as a coach.

He's one of the best coaches ever. So for whatever reason, he didn't think Robinson was the guy. But I kind of wondered why that it was a situation that was happening there. You know, on title runs to, you know, you have to get you have to get kind of lucky and you got to get some breaks. And Boston got really fortunate that Chris Middleton was injured, didn't play at all in that series, you know, got kind of fortunate that even though they lost the game where Butler missed the second half, Butler clearly wasn't the same in game five in Boston. And then, you know, our hero goes out.

So sometimes you got to get kind of lucky there. But looking at this finals matchup, Golden State versus Boston, this is going to be really fun. I mean, Golden State seems like they're playing kind of back at their peak. T.J., you had said it years ago, man.

Everyone get theirs in the two years because once his team is back, they're going to be really tough. And it seems like we're we're at that point now. Yeah, you know what they are. It's like I remember watching the Spurs. And this brings up a whole thing about, you know, I was looking at Amari Stoudemire today and he was talking about dynasties and what constitutes a dynasty in his opinion and what doesn't.

And that's something I think we can have a talk about at a later time. But, you know, watching like the the Spurs in their dynasty for those five titles, it was like I watched the Spurs right guys and I would be I'd see them make plays in the way they ran their offense in the way like backdoor cuts, Chris Passes hitting the open man, the extra pass. And I was like, this team is so smart. Like it's and it was hard to even even when the Spurs beat your team, it was hard to get mad because they were playing basketball at the highest level, but intelligent basketball. And they were making all the right plays, all the right, you know, cuts, just everything they did seem to be just textbook. And I feel that way about the Warriors.

It's like everything they do seems to be the right play, the right pass, the extra pass, the the cut. You can say what you want about Draymond Green, but the guy's intelligence on the basketball court cannot be argued. And so it's like, in addition to the fact that you have two of the greatest shooters that God ever made, you also have a bunch of highly intelligent basketball players who have high basketball IQs who have been in this situation before who played in pressure. You could say Jordan Poole hasn't, but he did in Michigan.

You know, he played high level games in college. It's kind of really cool if you can take away that this isn't your favorite team. It is cool to watch basketball played at this type of level at the highest possible level with some really intelligent and gifted basketball players. And we and we talked about Imea Doka coming from the Popovich tree. Well, you have on the other side, you have her who came not only from the Popovich tree, but the Phil Jackson tree. And also from the Michael Jordan tree, really. So he had three of the greatest basketball minds around him. And Adam, you got to add tech swimmers to that, too, then.

Really, you know, triangle offense. There you go. Yeah, Steve Kerr. The thing with him that reminds me of Phil is he does such a great job at managing people, managing egos. He got that from Phil Jackson. Very important.

See, of course, a chill guy. He understands people. He's highly intelligent. He played the game so he gets respect from the players like we talked about with EMA as well. And what he did with that team with Durant's cannot be understated because, yeah, they were incredibly talented, but it is tough to manage those egos. And he did it in such a great way. You've seen him on the sidelines, either calm people down or hype them up.

And the guy just knows exactly what he's doing. He won, I think, four championships as a player. He's won multiple championships as a coach. He's one of the greatest basketball people to ever be in the NBA. So this coaching matchup is great, probably two of the three or four best coaches in the NBA going head to head against each other. So that's going to be interesting to see the strategy shifts in terms of game to game matchups and in changes from one game to the other.

You know, I was reading this thing on the rear this morning. Who do you guys think is the best player in this series? Is it Tatum or is it Curry? Oh, man, that's a tough one, man.

It is kind of tough. I was surprised. I kind of thought I'd be lopsided for Curry. But everyone who is contributing to the article, it's pretty split 50 50. I mean, like if we had to draft a player, who do we choose?

Who would you choose? Number one? If we were doing a draft of all the players and we're not talking future, we're just talking right now. Literally right now in 12. Yeah, June 1st.

Right once tomorrow. Right now, I have to slightly give the edge to Curry just because he has more experience in the finals. Tatum has never been there before. Tatum was phenomenal in the last series, save for that one game where he scored about 10 points.

Tatum is a better defensive player. But Curry, I just think in this series, trust him. I just trust. I just trust Curry more.

And that's just the main difference. Yeah, I totally get that. TJ, I get that. Yeah, I again, my obsession, my weird obsession with Jason Tatum has been noted. And it's like, what do you call that obsession? It's almost like that girl that you want single white female, but she missed out right. You missed your chance, but you're still just like looking at her through the window in the rain, kind of like Mortimer and Randolph. We're looking at, you know, Eddie Murphy and trading places, looking at that escargot that weird stings. It's just like me. So would it be weird if I said Jason Tatum?

No, I don't think so. I mean, like I said, people in the article are really making the case. Just his his his two way versatility, the way he's able to kind of rebound and defend the wing. And, you know, he's kind of developed a fearlessness to kind of take any big shot for Boston.

He really has. And we talked about Curry's obviously is three point shooting is legendary all time stuff. But Tatum is really developed that sidestep three that he really does now. And I mean, I love Jason Tatum, too. But Curry is just kind of on a different level.

Steph is Steph. You know, that stat I saw after the game on Sunday was I think Golden State has this group of guys have one hundred and twenty three games of NBA finals experience. And Boston has zero. So man, I mean, I experience matters, obviously, but I guess in the same, you know, the same breath you could say is the Boston team doesn't know what they don't know. They don't really know how big the finals is. You know, I wouldn't be surprised if they came out and stole game one just based on that factor. I mean, I don't know. I I kind of thought Golden State just watching them play and how they finished off Dallas, that they were going to kind of dominate whoever came out of the east just because of how tough the road was for Boston and Miami.

But I don't know. Maybe now maybe that's just a homer in me. I'm kind of talking myself into this could be a six, seven game series. And oftentimes if a team has had a lot of rest like like the Warriors have a lot of times in game one, they can come out a little sluggish. Yeah, a little rusty. They haven't played in a while, whereas the Celtics had an incredibly intense game on Sunday. And so that's good because they've had enough rest three or four days to Thursday, but not too much rest, maybe. So I could definitely see that where the Celtics come out and steal game one.

Yeah. I mean, also, you got to look at I might be getting ahead of myself here with this, but you know, they talk about historical runs to an NBA championship. If the Celtics were to win going through the Nets, the Heat or the next the Bucks in the Heat and the Golden State Warriors to win a title, you have to now I mean, legitimately, you have to look at this as one of the greatest runs in the history of the association based strictly on the teams that they had to get through the individual players. Players were talking, taking out Durant Kyrie. We're talking about taking Giannis at peak power like you got Giannis and he is, you know, at top of the food chain right now. And then you have the Miami Heat two years removed from an NBA final with a player who was as hot as any players ever been in the last two games of a playoff series.

So if the Celtics are able to win four more games, the historical significance of this can't be overlooked. The significance of me being absolutely insufferable for the rest of the summer. And that would be the thing. That would be the absolute worst thing, because it's not like I can hide from him, right? It's not like I can't pick up this phone call. I spend more time with this guy, honest to goodness, than I was thinking about this the other day. Like a lot of my friends, they're all married, got families. We don't see each other. Like I see Chris Brockman, minimum of twenty five hours a week in person. And then we probably talk over the course of seven days for another hour on the phone.

So I can't, I'm not going to be able to escape this. I'll be wearing that Boston hoodie sweatshirt that he has every day for the rest of time. I mean, I might legit get a Tatum finals jersey and wear it every single day the rest of the summer. Well, I mean, you should.

It would be well earned because he would deserve that. Chris, Chris, if they win, will you get an I love Tatum tattoo on your arm? On my arm? Yeah.

No, no. Well, you see that thing I tagged you in on Instagram the other day? The guy got a Boston Celtics.

I've seen that before. So when did he get that? Last year, right? Yeah, it wasn't this year.

So I think it was last year. So we should do that, Adam. We should make Brockman get like a little calf tattoo with a cloverleaf or so. Yeah, a little, a little lucky leprechaun, because he won't do it on his arm.

Right. He won't. But I mean, his calf, you know, what about a river situation on his butt? Yeah, maybe on the butt cheek. Yeah, I don't want to make him do that.

I mean, it's going to be hard enough to get him to do it on the calf. When you talked about like the historical run that Boston could potentially go on. I mean, if Golden State wins, we're now in a whole different conversation.

We're talking about the dynasty of the of the tens into the aughts or into the 20s. And then we're talking about where Curry ranks all time. We mentioned it last week. Suddenly now he's in the top 10. Suddenly now you're having the conversation of him compared to LeBron James. And Stephen A. Smith said that this week, if that he thinks Curry is going to get two of the next three.

That's what he said. And then his five will be more than LeBron. And suddenly he he's now above LeBron. I mean, just the things that we're going to be talking about, I think two weeks from now are going to be pretty outrageous and ridiculous. But that's kind of what we do here. And, you know, guys, normally I hate outrageous and ridiculous sports talk radio takes, but because that's what we do for a living, I am here for it. You have to be for this in particular, because what if what if Steph does with another ring? What are the average is like thirty five this series and they win a ring and he finally gets his MVP? Yeah, that's and that's the thing, right? We're talking about the MVP.

That's the one thing that's kind of alluded him. And I feel like that's the thing that people, if they're going to hold anything against them, it's like, well, you didn't win finals MVP if he gets finals. Yeah, he has he has to win MVP this year to cement his legacy. What was legacy is still always going to be there. But to not win one MVP in four times would be would be kind of a kind of like, oh, what went on those finals? But even though you can't, you just have to go and take a look at the stats and go. Iguodala got MVP for holding a man to 38 points per year.

Something like that. Yeah, I mean, the most. Yeah, that MVP was absurd that Iguodala played great. No business winning it, though.

And then you have the one year. I mean, LeBron should have been MVP on the losing team. Like, even though he didn't win the finals, he was so good. So. But yes, Steph, I don't. You know, that's the thing. It's like this to the staff replace if he wins another ring.

I'm sorry. You mean you get four or does he get the five? Yeah, I'd like I'd love Steph Curry, but in no way, shape or form, am I ever going to sit here and tell you Steph's a better basketball player than LeBron James?

What about this? And I'm 1000% never, ever listen to me, Adam, because I think never, ever, ever, ever, ever. Magic Johnson is the point guard. No, any I didn't say magic.

I'm just saying I'm just going to throw that out there because I know there was Kendrick Perkins. Big Perk said that if Steph wins, he bumps magic off of his Mount Rushmore. Let me tell you who's place is solid in Mount Rushmore.

It's never and that's everything. Mount Rushmore is only four. We got guys by next week. Let's come up with something different. We need five, Adam.

We need another name. Magic, not magic. But I was going to say if he wins a fourth championship, maybe Larry Bird is replaced. Oh, Larry Bird has only three championships. He didn't play that long. He had a back injury played till he was in his early thirties. He also had three MVPs straight. He did have three straight MVPs. His peak was incredible. One of the all time greats. But just because of Steph's longevity, the fact that he will have one more championship than Larry and he has so many years to go.

I think this is a huge possibility if he wins a fourth that he could replace Larry's as where it where it was to Mount Rushmore, though. Yeah. Larry's top ten, though, right? There is look top ten in my eyes I've ever seen.

Yeah. But again, we're at that point where, like like I said last week, we're adding guys, obviously, because we're historians of the game. I've never seen will never saw Bigo. But I know that they're the amongst the 20 greatest players of all time. But if we're just going to limit it to what we've seen and yeah, I mean, it's just too bad that the three point shot wasn't like super prevalent in bird's days. Oh, he would have had so many more threes.

Yeah, not even a question. He would have been shooting twenty threes a game. So like so Steph Curry, he's making four hundred a year, right? Something like that. It's ridiculous.

I guess I could have it up here. The most bird ever attempted in a year was eighty seven, eighty eight. He was ninety eight for two thirty seven. Bird never made one hundred threes.

The most he ever made in a year is ninety eight. They're ridiculous. Wow.

Wow. I mean, Steph Bird would have really thrived in this era. Steph made I mean, he had one hundred sixty six this year.

He'd make Luca look like a role player. I mean, I tell you about this year. He had two hundred eighty five to let me get two hundred and eighty five threes this year. That's what I mean. Larry Bird never had more than one hundred.

Never made more than one hundred. Yeah, he is. Well, I mean, Steph is attempting like three, four X of what Bird back in the day. So, you know, it's a different game now, obviously. But man, but Larry from the top ten, that's tough. I mean, the argument will be there, though. Yeah, you're probably right.

You're probably right. Especially if he gets to five. If Steph gets to five with two with two finals MVP, it's out of the question. But like I said, guys, I think we're talking about Steph Curry being like top five, top six ever. I think we got it. Like I said, the whole Mount Rushmore thing is very it's over.

I won't say it's overused because it's necessary. But with basketball, we just got to come up with something that's five. Is it five guys?

Top five? Let's we can work on that. All right. Let's get out of here on this, guys. Now's the time. Let's let's hear it.

Prediction time. Adam, what do you got? Well, before this, you know, I just want to do one thing with you guys. And Adam, I will take your suggestion on this. You know, back in Altoona in a summer league I used to play in.

What we would do is once you advanced in the tournament, you had the opportunity to take one player off a team that you beat and add them to your roster. It was it was amazing. There was this guy named Mark who lived in Johnstown when I lived in Altoona and me and my buddy Dougie Peffer shut out the path. He's now the new men's basketball coach in Altoona. We drive like half an hour, 35 minutes every game day to go pick this guy Mark up. He would wait for us outside of a Burger King.

And then my man would come to Mansion Park and he put in like 23 and 10 every night. Left handed post player with a jump shot couldn't be stopped. So my question to you guys is we take the Celtics and we take the Warriors if they could take one player from each one player from the teams that they've beaten to make it to the finals.

Here's the deal, though. It can't be the star. It has to be a role player. Who would the Celtics take from the Nets, the Bucks and the Heat? One player that could add to their team. And who would the Warriors take off the Nuggets, the Grizz and the Mavs? So let's eliminate their star players, you know, so we won't use Luca, the Joker, Giannis, KD, Butler.

We'll take those guys. Like, who would you say? Like, if you could pick a hole that one of these teams has and go, this role player would fit this hole.

What would you think? Man, that's really interesting. I think when I look at Brooklyn, man, it's a toss up for me. It's either it's either Bruce Brown or Gordon Dragich, to be honest. Dragich, I thought was so important for Brooklyn. Just that veteran calmness. Very underrated punter. Like, did he start for them? But just kind of kind of coming off the bench, just a guy who has been there through the grind, been there through the wars and could, you know, offer that steady hand. And if he needs to, he can kind of fill it up a little bit. He can give you 10 points in 10 minutes. You know, that's a guy. Oh, man.

Every time he made a shot, like, oh, Rogich. So I think for me, I think I would go I would go dragich to back up Marcus Smart. You know what I would do? Just because I feel like Boston's front court is not necessarily their strength.

And we don't know about Time Lord's knee. You know, take Drummond. No, believe it or not, bro, I would take Brooke Lopez. That's exactly what I was about to say for Boston.

I think he would be a good fit. We're talking about Brooklyn. No, I just said take one player from the entire the entire because Adam was like, we should just pick one. I thought we were going team.

First of all, it's like that might take too much time. So yeah, definitely. I think Brooke Lopez for Boston would be perfect on there. It's just to help spell out Horford. I thought we were going team by team.

Yeah, we were. But like I said, we could just make it quicker. So or what about a P. J. Tucker provides tough defense can hit that corner three open up things up the court. But with that Adam is like they already have like a P. J. Tucker type guy already. You know, just I was looking at someone who I feel like that could fill a hole that they have.

You definitely read about Brooke Lopez. That's one thing Boston's kind of never been able to do in the recent years. And that's why they get eliminated in the playoffs. They could never protect the rim ever. And so now, you know, the emergence of Robert Williams, even Grant Williams blocked some shots. But getting out Horford back, that's one thing he's been able to do is like his block on Struce was almost like Bam's block on Tatum. The bubble, you know, it's one of those things we like. Wow. I did not see that come. Also, if you think about this, if Danny Age is still in charge and Brad Stevens isn't, I don't think Danny Age makes that trade to Oklahoma City to give them those draft picks that gets them here for back without Horford.

I don't think you're in this position. I mean, Danny Age hated giving up draft picks. I know a lot of the guys that Danny Age acquired, but that was a Brad move to get to get out Horford, you know, and to get to get Derek White. Derek White's been huge in this playoffs.

And then I have like a random guy for you for for Golden State who beat Denver, Memphis and Dallas. I would pick Jaron Jackson Jr. for the Nuggets. I feel like his skill set would fit in well with this team. You know, again, another team here, their front court isn't necessarily their absolute strength, but I think he coming in with the rebounds, playing defense. I feel like he's a guy who could definitely help the Warriors if they were to have that Altoona rule and be able to snag a player. He's definitely a guy on the rise out of Jaron Jackson Jr. Yeah, Jaron Jackson Jr. plays great defense, protects the rim. He can sneakily hit threes also.

Yeah, he was like three point game that they don't think he made a three after that. But he'd be great on that team, providing that interior defense. And another player I have potentially would be Aaron Gordon from the Nuggets. OK, another guy who's a big guy, plays good defense, can hit some threes. So that's the same similar type of player that can fill that role for the Warriors. Yeah, I just I like I said, I always thought that'd be interesting. And every year during the playoffs in my mind, I just go like, all right, who would they take? Who would they take? I just I don't know. At one point, I would feel like it would be amazing if the NBA really did like establish this type of role and you could poach a player.

Yeah, seriously. I feel like do you feel like this finals is going to be high scoring or low scoring? You know, like the way the heat and the Celtics like those games are under 200 total points seemingly most games. I can't tell I can't tell this is going to be one of those like Golden State Memphis games where we're in the two forties or is it going to be, you know, maybe like low 200s? You have arguably the two best defensive teams in the league. But despite that, I believe that it's going to be high scoring. I agree. Yeah, you have the fireworks of Steph and Jordan Poole and clay and then you have Tatum and Brown. Yeah, I think it's smart to shoot through.

Yeah, like Grant Williams. Like, yeah, I could see that these games going to like 110 to 120 each. Yeah, I see that scenario high scoring games.

And I hope that's what happens to think about that the last couple days. I can't tell if it's going to be because I think the total for game one is like, I think it's to 11 or something. And I was trying to figure out if it's going to be high or low scoring to 12.

That's what the first total is. I can't tell. I don't know. I don't know.

I don't know yet. A lot will depend on who controls the pace. Yeah, because if the Warriors are controlling the pace, it's going to be high scoring. If if the Celtics are in control, it's it's probably going to be a more or lower scoring.

I think so. But then that was how Boston got out to such an early lead in Game 7. They kind of really push the pace. That's a good point.

It was like 22 to 9 right out of the gate. All right. All right, guys, prediction time. TJ, what do you think, man?

You know, I the other day I saw I forget who it was. It was one of the guys who would refuse to make a pick. He's like, I can't make a pick until I see a game played. I kind of feel that way.

I totally get that. But, you know, for our purposes here, just first blush just next week after there's been a couple of. I'm going to say this game, this series goes seven games. I don't know if that's wishful thinking or what I really believe, but I'm going to say seven games.

And I'm going to say at the end of the day, when it's all said and done, the Golden State Warriors maybe just have just a little too much and outlast the Celtics. OK, Adam. Yeah, like I said before, pick against him again. Do it.

I'm going to do it, Chris, which is actually a great luck charm for you warriors. To me, they have too much depth. They're too strong. They have the experience. They have the home court advantage, which is which is big also. So a good series. I believe it'll be the Warriors. Forty two warriors win six games. Steph gets his fourth title.

OK, I'm going to go the other way. Ben Lyons texted this to me, TJ, the other night. And I think I I don't know, wishful thinking. I'll say Celtics and six. They are able to steal one and then go back to Boston and and close it out in game six. Anything's possible, man. Anything's possible. And then and then Bill Russell's there to hand out the Bill Russell finals NBA trophy finals MVP to Jason two times. Oh, OK, Jason.

I don't know. We'll see. And I'll sit in the corner of my my living room and weep silently for what may have been TJ's guitar side. All right. It's going to be an awesome NBA finals, though. Thanks for tuning in with us. And we'll check in next week after a couple of games. Thanks for watching. Peace.