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Now, on with the show. This is the Rich Eisen Show. Chris Weber, do you want to take a swing at the Jaden McDaniels scoring with 1.3 seconds left and Jokic having an issue? There's no more protocol. You don't want a guy to score at the last second because they're up, then win the game.
The Rich Eisen Show. Earlier on the show, NFL Network Insider Tom Pellisero. Coming up. Eagles GM, Howie Roseman. ESPN senior NBA writer Brian Wintorst.
And now, it's Rich Eisen.
Now, number two of the Rich Eisen Show is on the air right here on Disney Plus and the ESPN app and ESPN Radio, Coast to Coast, and SiriusXM Channel 80. Wherever you get your satellite radio, we say hello to everybody listening to us. Howie Roseman, the GM of the. Philadelphia Eagles is about to join us on this program. He's, I'm told, making his way to the Philadelphia Eagles studio right now.
Um he isn't there yet, um again, because he's probably fleecing somebody.
Somewhere. Yeah.
Okay. Am I wrong? Is that the wrong one? I'm sorry. He's professionally conducting his business as the general manager and expertly conducting business of the Philadelphia Eagles.
Has a GM ever had a statue built? Ha ha ha. Great question. Of themselves of the team ever honored a GM with a statue? That's a good one, man.
I don't know. Are you jealous, T.J. Jefferson, of the Philadelphia Billies getting Don Manningly as their interim manager and then all of a sudden they haven't lost yet and now they're winning games and they're not ten and twenty one like the Mets are after April? Am I jealous of this? Yes.
Are you? No, because I'm used to my team sucking. Oh, right. We're going back to that old saw. What do you mean, old saw?
Am I supposed to do? Am I supposed to do? Poor Metfan, we're never going to do it. You sit here and trash talk the Mets only.
Well, because it's so much fun to do it.
Okay, but so now when I say something, I'm playing up. Oh, I don't know what to say, folks. No, honestly, the latest former Yankee single-white female over by the Mets, Luke Weaver, was the one who blew yesterday's win.
So again, you forget. Devin Williams is one of the ones that you win World Series in the 90s.
Now that's true. You never will acknowledge it. That's true. Except. What's the difference between what I just said and what you said?
Won championships? Yeah.
Okay. Well, without us, not help them lose. 21 of their first 30.
So, what exactly do you want me to say? Just I'm confused. What you want me to say? You tell me, and I will say it. It is a Yankees town, not a Mets town.
New York. I don't live there. I love visiting you.
Okay. Been there a few times. Had some of my greatest memories there.
Okay. Apparently, after 27 championships. New York is a Yankees town.
Okay. 2017. Chris, I will turn to you. Don't put I'm going to put you in this position. You have been to New York multiple times.
Courtesy of the Rich Eisen show. Recently. Recently. Yeah.
How many Mets fans versus how many Yankee hats? I got to say. How many Yankee hats versus how many Mets hats? Last time we were there, I was mentally keeping a count of I saw in two days. I said two days.
I saw one. I saw one Mets hat. Here's the reason, though, right? This color is easier to match clothing with. That's true.
That is true.
Okay, so yeah, I have this hat because it matches it. The dark navy is a good black. You can wear it. This is very specific. Oh, I didn't know it was a fashion thing.
Well, you're making a statement. I didn't know it was a fashion thing. Oh, it's New York. It's always fashion, right? I saw one Mets hat in two.
I know it's the Met Gala. Yeah.
coming up. Yeah.
But it's not about the Metropolitans. What is the theme this year? Oh, you know, it's about being 10 and 21. I looked it up. Because it's a Met Town.
Costume art. Ah! You know what the costume art is? Coming dressed as a New York Met whoopee pie. Wow.
You know what, Chris? I think maybe one Sodo thought it was a Met Town because he actually has won a championship in Aaron Judge. Excuse me. We have not answered the question yet.
So, you know. You know, I love where your head's at, T. Thank. I don't want to be that guy sometimes, but sure. We haven't answered the question.
Are you jealous that the Phillies changed their manager? His team changed their manager. How many games we have? One, three in a row at one point. We got two win streaks to talk about.
Your guy stays put because Steve Cohen is. We're loyal. You don't know nothing about that. George Steinbrenner would change managers at one at 12 p.m. and one at 12 a.m.
All right. You don't know loyalty. You missed an opportunity there to say 2 p.m. Oh, that's good. Look at that.
Well, I wouldn't overdo it, though. Look at that.
My gosh. I never thought in a million years the Yankees would be up nine over 500 going into May, and the Red Sox would be 700, and the Mets 11 under. My gosh. I didn't think this whole. treat the season like it's a football season, talking about baseball every day like it's It's the Wins mean everything, and the losses mean it's over.
What's funny is that everyone in the AL East and the NL West. or on a losing streak. There's 131 games left, folks. You got a lot of time. I'm tied with the dodger though.
Straighten this out. Howard Rosen is going to join us shortly, hopefully. Nick in Alaska. Let's take his phone call here. What's up, Nick?
Yeah, in Alaska. Man, where are you at? 907. You there, Nick? Yeah, hi.
Um Yeah, I'm here. Yeah.
Um, long time listener, you guys are actually so great together. I love that there's like the Rich Island show, but there's like So many other people, so many other voices. Yeah, thanks, man. Um yeah, I heard you guys talking about Billy, um, I'm originally from there, so right now is a great time for me. Uh I thought the sixes were gonna get swept.
And now, I mean Yeah, I don't know what to do because it seems like Every time My hopes get up, they just seem to get crushed. Yes. Especially with Embede there. It's like you're talking to me specifically. You want to help him?
Help him. Help my friend from Alaska. Nick, I don't know because I've sat in this chair and I've given many, many instances where the Sixers have completely just blown it with Ben Simmons and James Harden. But now you're looking at a case where Joel MB. might be your fourth best player, even though You know, he's not really.
I don't want to get my hopes up neck, but I got a weird feeling. Uh-oh, you went higher register. I got a weird feeling, Nick.
Okay, this is it, Nick. Nick, let me ask you this. It's different, baby. It's already different. Where are we at the time of year?
Is it sunny in Alaska all the time, or is it dark in Alaska? Exactly. Where are we right now? That part of the world. Can you see right now?
Right now, it's like the weird in-between where everything's melting.
So it's like really wet, but it's really sunny. Listen, it's kind of a metaphor for being a Sixers fan right now, right? It's wet. What's up? But it's also sunny.
It's always sunny, right? Look at us doing this son of thing. All right, Nick, let's go. Call back Monday, Nick. Yeah, call back Monday.
Thanks, Nick. Let's celebrate, Nick.
Okay. Callback Monday. It's all working in Philadelphia, right? It is an hour. Honestly, flyers.
Move on. Correct? Correct. Phillies haven't lost with Don Mattingly. Nope.
Don't you baseball? Right? Woo. The six is a force to game seven. Let's go.
But most importantly, you want to talk about success. Howie Roseman's back on the Rich Isaac show, right? Here we go. Getting into something, my man. I knew it.
Right. It is sunny in Philadelphia today. It's one of those northeast days, 70, May. You know, I don't know. Do you get weather like that in LA?
Yeah, let me see. Let me look outside. Can confirm. Yep. Yep.
How are you doing, man? Good to see you. Good to see you. Oh, my gosh. As always, I have so many questions.
You're so kind to do this every single year after the draft. It's kind of a tradition. The only other tradition, unlike any other involving green, is the Masters. I agree. I'm not even asking.
You know, Rich, Joe Douglas, who's back working for us, one of my good friends. I'm so glad he's back. He used to call me on trades. And finally, I pick up the phone and I'd say, Tell me what I'm saying no to.
So I feel like these conversations, like, just give me the questions that I'm not going to answer first so we can have a conversation about everything. Right. Do you want to do that? Because we'll do that right now. Please.
We'll do that right now. Get it out the way. A.J. Brown's still an Eagle. Unfair conversation about Jalen Hurts.
Let's talk about the draft.
Well, I mean, everybody's saying Makai Lemon coming means A.J. Brown's going, Howie? AJ Brown's an eagle.
Okay, and Mikai Lemon is an eagle as well. Um I've never seen What happened in the draft? before. where one the guy's on the phone with another team And Is it true you couldn't reach him because he was on the phone? With another team?
Is that did that really happen? Because it looked like it from the video. Howie? The trade with the Cowboys happened pretty quickly on the clock. We had done some ground work with them before they were on the clock and kind of just had to finalize some of the terms.
So we got on the clock pretty quickly. We waited a minute just to kind of explain to our staff what we were going to do, what we were going to pick, kind of get our ducks in a row. Um, you know, we s we started calling about six minutes.
So when you have six minutes, uh, not not much panic there, you know, just kind of figuring out where you are and, um, all right, you know, sometimes when you call guys that It goes to voicemail. You got to get back on them. You know, they're doing other things. You know, one of the things that I did learn from this is I don't really pay attention to the list of who's at the draft. Not out of disrespect for who the league brings.
You know, I think that's a special moment for their family, but it's just not one of the things I research. You know, I feel like my mind is cluttered with a lot of stuff, so I don't think about that.
So I wasn't really thinking, hey, this guy's at the draft. We'll get in touch with him, no problem. I went to a dark place. I went to a place where it's like, you know, we better find out where this guy is and get him on the phone for us to pick him right here.
So, you know, started calling the agent, couldn't get in touch with him, kept calling Mackay, and then. Fortunately, with about three minutes left, got in touch with him. Didn't know that video was going on, didn't really know everything around what was going on with him, but certainly felt like it was important to get on the phone with him. You know, it's just. You think in your head as a GM, like, I gotta hear the guy's voice.
You know, I gotta make sure. Why? Why do you have to hear it? Why you gotta do it? Yeah, the world's a crazy place.
You just don't know. God forbid something happens. You just don't know. You don't know where they are. And For me, it's just hearing them and talking to them.
It's just an easy part of the process. It's never really been something I was concerned about. We had one guy. When I was the personnel director, That we couldn't get in touch with when we were on the clock, but his parents picked up and just said he was so frustrated he hadn't gotten drafted that he went for a walk.
So, you know, we were like, Well, yeah, you gotta go find him and get him. I don't know, in like the next three minutes. It's just y you just want to make sure all your I's are dotted and your T's are crossed. Right. And so you finally got through to the agent and you're like, put him on the phone.
Like, I don't care who he's on the phone with right now. You I imagine you did not know the Pittsburgh Steelers on the phone with him. At the time, no, just like we need to get in touch with him. It wasn't even like who's he on the phone with it. It's like, we can't get hold of him, we need to get in touch with him.
Right now. Yeah.
And was the eight minutes also clearly a factor, right? Eight minutes here different than the ten. The usual to be fair, I think this all got resolved with a couple minutes left. I think we're still, it wasn't like uh, you know, situations where it was like there was a situation in the draft where uh it was like. you know, ten seconds left on the clock.
I think it was like in in the fourth or fifth round. And in my mind, I'm going, if I was right behind them, would I just like jump up and make my pick the minute it hits zero?
So I went through that. I went through that a little, Rich. I bet. And last one on the procedure here before we get to the kid. Did you think of at some point I got to pivot here?
Or are you just like, screw it, we're going to draft this kid without speaking to him? And nobody in the room said he's right. He's been right there. He's in the green room. He's cool.
Nobody said that. That's a good point. I'm going to get my draft room back together and say, why don't we have a list of who's in the green room? Let's make sure we do that. You're right.
I feel like you're trying to get some people in trouble on my. I'm just fascinated by this. I've never seen anything. A little pot star is going on over here. No, I've never seen anything like it, though.
I'm just fascinated about procedure and what would happen, what does happen. And, you know, I've spoken to Andy Reid about this. He basically says, I want to know: is the kid, you know, alive? Like, is he healthy? Is everything good?
You need to. Who did I work for the first 14 years of my career? There you go. We're putting pieces together. Where do you think I learned it from?
We're putting pieces together here. Best of the best. What do you love? Why do you like Makai Lemon as much as you do? What do you like about him?
He's a natural separator. He's got the ability to separate at the top of the routes from the slot, playing outside. He's got really strong hands. The play speed is really good. The run after the catch is really good.
We talk a lot about instincts, having natural instincts. Really, in anything that you do, you need to have instincts in that career. You know, it's whether you're doing the job you have, which you got great instincts, Rich. Thank you, sir. It's whether doing the job I have, average at best instincts, or playing football.
You know, like you need to have great instincts to be great. And Makai has great instincts. And so excited to bring him here. And obviously, he's going to be judged on what he does going forward from here. but feel like we have a good vision for the player and the role and feel like he's a good fit As a person, which is equally as important to us.
And you got a Heisman winner on your team in Devontae Smith, and now you have an academic Heisman winner on your team in Eli Stowers from Vanderbilt, the tight end. Oh, Rich, let's talk about the fact that our two Balitnikoff winners were both drafted with trades with NFC East Rivals. We got both our receivers, you know, with trades, which obviously benefited them the first time we did it as well, win-win situations. And, you know, I think in this situation, it will benefit them as well. But just ironic, right?
You get the Balinikoff winner in Devontae, Balinikov winner here in Mackay. And, you know, it's probably unique that we're trading with Dallas, but for the same position and the same award winners. But I cut you off. I'm sorry. No, it's okay.
No, we were talking about that moment on the draft. If only Malachi Lawrence for Dallas turns out to be like Micah Parsons, who was that guy? And interestingly enough, the choice that was. To go for Dallas to move down and for you to take up was the Micah Parsons first round draft choice that Green Bay. oh, gave to Dallas.
It's full circle. I'm on it. I'm on it, Howie. I know you are. I know you.
I have no doubt.
So but you did actually step on my what I thought terrific transition. to Eli Stowers in our conversation. But that's okay. That's fine. I can generally manage as well.
You know what I mean? Yeah, you have instincts. Thank you. What do you like? Eli's awesome.
We had him on a month ago. Smart kid, insanely talented on the field. How does he fit into your offense in your estimation? How would you? Yeah.
When you talk about the tight end position, their ability to match up, you know, there's obviously a lot of 12, 13 personnel going on in this league. And when you talk about guys who could win one-on-one versus linebackers, versus safeties, the guy is a unique athlete, like an unusual athlete. But he's also got an unusual skill set. You know, he's got great hands. He's a great route runner.
You know, he's incredibly tough. You can't be recruited as a four-star quarterback at Texas AM. And then obviously go in, and he got beat out at New Mexico State, and then transition to this period, to this position at tight end, and not be. Tough and physically and mentally tough. And he is, you know, he is an elite character person as well.
You know, the interesting thing is, I don't know if you know this, he's unbelievable genes. Both his parents were. College athletes. I think his dad had a chance to play in the NFL for a minute, and his sister is a national championship volleyball player and the most valuable player in the tournament.
So when she came and they came and visited too, you know, maybe that's our next non-football player background to draft in the seventh round. I like it. I've got three more things to bring up with you, and I'll let you go on with the rest of your Friday if you will indulge. I don't know when it was. Was it.
After Stowers, before Stours, but right around Stours, that you made a trade for Jonathan Grenard from. Minnesota, and then you signed them too.
So, how does one do that where you're Clearly, you set up compensation and you talk contract. You have the permission to do so. And then, boom, he's not only an eagle, but he's got a. a nice new contract to go along with it.
Well, you know, we had started those conversations. You know, we had lost a free agent from our team. during the three day negotiation window, a good player. Had a lot of success on defense last year. Felt like the defense was in a good spot.
Added some players, including Reek to man the other corner spot. But still felt like, you know, really our bread and butter is our O-line and D-line. And have an opportunity to bring in John here to really kind of fill that void that we lost during free agency. The guy is a heck of a player. He really can win in multiple ways.
He can play with power. He can win with athleticism. He's an unbelievable motor. He's a captain. He was captain for that Vikings team.
He went to the University of Florida. Nice. Yeah, I kind of slide that in there. I heard that. I got it.
That's great. And so I think for us, you know, it just, it was an important piece for us, for our D-line. You know, we really want. To think about our football team and think about our strengths along the line scrimmage. And we really like the guys that we have on our defensive line, but felt like adding him could really just give us that little turbo boost.
Like, you know, your son played that video games and they hit that turbo button. It's like, all right, we got Grenard. I like it. I love it. One of my favorite draft choices and draft moments, Howie Roseman of the Philadelphia Eagles here on the Rich Hisen Show.
Uar Bernard. from the International Pathway Program from Nigeria. Um 251st overall. Is it true he's never played a snap? of organized football.
Howie, is that true? Facts. Facts. Wow. So, how my gosh, how does one listen?
You obviously got Jordan Milata from the same program years ago. Like, what's the plan to take somebody who's got the highest? Height speed comp of Miles Garrett. And teach him what organized football is, Howie.
Well, first, I mean, we have to have enough awareness to understand what happened with Jordan is such a great credit to the person that Jordan is, you know, the work that he did, you know, with our staff, including Coach Stoutland. And that's a unique experience.
So for us to sit there and say, hey, we took this player and we're going to get the same results, that would be naive for sure. But what we saw was an unusual athlete, unusual athlete, high character. Athlete, and we did a lot of work on him. You know, we sent our position coach. Clint Hurt down there to work with him because if we're going to use a pick on him, just really wanted to get somebody down there who we trusted that will get their hands on him, just like we did with Jordan.
And Clint came back and just said, Man, this guy's got unusual power. He's got unusual athleticism. He's really willing to work and learn. And I really feel like I can develop him. And for us, a lot of times in my mind, I'm going like, What happens if I don't?
You know, as opposed to if I do, like, how am I going to feel if I don't?
So sometimes that's like, hey, if I don't make this trade for the player, how do I feel if I see him go to another team? And so in this case, just like with Jordan, it was like, I want the result to be with the Eagles, either way. I want to see what that result's going to be. And if it works, obviously I want that benefit for our football team. But even if it didn't work, I wouldn't have any regrets because I I feel like it was something that we wanted to try and try to develop.
We had a lot of support with it. We have a lot of people who are going to rally around it. And so whatever will happen will happen. Obviously, Jordan, a unique, unique case. Um one of the best stories really, you know, in my 26 years in the NFL, and you know, I'm biased 'cause it's with us.
But I mean, you think about that, a guy's playing rugby and comes to the US and world champion and all pro player and like the best person, like I almo I almost feel like it. Probably the best singer. Yeah, I was about to say he's a great singer, too. I don't know what UR's baritone sounds like, but I mean. No, I've spoken to him a couple of times, not feeling that from him, not getting the sense that that's an area he's going to thrive, just personally.
I could be wrong. I've been wrong on evaluations before. Thanks for the time, Howie. I always appreciate you chopping it up after a draft. And you be well.
Let's chat again soon, man. Really appreciate it. I can't wait. Thanks for having me, as always. Right back at you.
That's Howie Roseman. The Man on the spot there, EVP and GM of the Philadelphia Eagles, right here on the Rich Eisen Show. A SOFI personal loan is here to help you achieve something once thought impossible, which is overcoming high interest credit card debt. Walk the tightrope of your finances with one low fixed rate monthly payment, no fees required, and as soon as the same day funding, that's right. Pull off your own debt-defying stunt with a SoFi personal loan.
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Um If I may say, um, it went on too long. Yeah.
So we'll do it after Brian Windhorse Tower 3. Lovely. I imagine you can. What's more likely it still works? Hour two or three?
That's right.
Okay. So Fernando Mendoza is going to wear number 15. Um for the Raiders. That was Tom Flores' number. A lot of folks are wondering: okay, is he going to be wearing it for the Raiders?
The answer is yes. And Tom Flores. has personally given it his blessing. The 89-year-old Tom Flores. Pro Football Hall of Famer, I'm pleased to say.
Um Told the Raiders Paul Gutierrez, who writes for the Raiders' website, quote. He deserves my blessing because if he's not the real deal, I don't know what the hell I'm doing. End quote. Wow. Called Mendoza perfect.
He can make every throw. He can make the plays. What can't he do? He does it all. He's fun to watch.
Plus, he's a good-looking kid like me. End quote. All right. I love it. As the article said, another deep belly laugh ensued.
Felly, you getting the fifteen? Yeah, maybe. Um Gutierrez went to Mendoza. He's more handsome than me, but it speaks to the testament of once a raider, always a raider. He is just he is perfect.
People are going to start to accuse him of being Too perfect. That's coming. Mendoza. Is it already there?
Well, he's too good to be true, that he says the right thing all the time. Yeah, he did let the F-bomb fly. I think he does have a little of the red in him. You know what comes across as too good to be true and perfect? Me?
Tom Brady. You two. Yeah, you're right. You. My bad.
I said Tom Ready, I should have said you first. My bad. You knew it wasn't. That's true. Again, I mean, you want to talk about it.
I'm so blessed to be part of this organization. I can't thank. Flora is enough. I'm so blessed. I had a good college career.
I haven't done anything in the NFL. Again.
So but he's saying the right thing. He's going to wear 15. It's an eternal blessing, he said, of the choice that Flora's made to allow him to wear. Every single day, I'm going to have a commitment to excellence to make sure that I can live up to that standard. Are you saying all the notes?
The notes. Hit me with a throw deep, baby, at some point. Yeah.
Yeah, the last time Flores wore 15, plenty of players have apparently worn it. Because the Raiders don't retire numbers.
Well, Minchi war fifteen, right? I think he might. Laura's last ward in Oakland in 1966. Yeah, Cardinal Minchu War 15. There it is.
From Tom Hanks' appearance on this program years ago. I swear that always sounds like Randy Moss to me. What? Throw it deep, baby. Throw it deep, baby.
Yep. I don't hear it. He loved it. But you don't know Randy Musk, clearly. Yes, I do that.
I I can't wait to see Mendoza get out there and play professional.
Well, week one, you'll see him. It'll look good. You really think so? In all honesty, let's do a what's more likely right now. I'm afraid to get excited.
Why not? Why are you afraid? I just. Why? Every year we're like, all right, this is our year.
It's going to be good. But why are you afraid? I don't know. Just don't get my hopes up. Same reason I'm afraid about these Sixers.
Exactly. Game 7, man. We've been told.
Well, I mean, I know fan is the root for fanatic. which means you're not thinking straight. Can't be afraid to get hurt. As a fan. Oh.
I think I've suffered enough personally. I just think he, I don't know, man. I think he's got his head screwed on straight. He's exactly what you want if you're a Raider fan.
Okay? Which is He's going to go home. He's gonna be when was the last milk drinker the Raiders have had at a uh at the quarterback spot, you know? Not Minshew. You know what I mean?
Like. And and uh the coach Comes from obviously the the Kubiak system and everything else. Mendoza can move. He can move the pocket. That's why Cousins is coming there, too.
Well, he can't move the I understand that, but that's what Cousins is always done. He can move a little bit. Although not maybe on his Achilles now. He's going to have to show in training camp. Mentally, that he's got it.
That he's got it. He can protect himself. He's got, you know, Matthew Hasselbeck always says. You can't get on the field. Unless you learn third-down protections.
So I imagine Mendoza is smart enough to pick up on that. I totally understand that. I get it. But You know, end of the day. I don't think he beats out Kirk Cousins.
In a quarterback competition. and cousins is your weak one starter. Because you don't have to do it with this kid. But I do think he is going to succeed, Jay. I think you got the right guy.
I hope so. Let's get him a number one receiver. Um Okay, you're right. Yeah.
I got you. That'll be a process. Yeah.
Maybe the one can come to the fore on on on the team. For sure. Whoever it is, just catch a 50-50 ball and catch a back shoulder because he's pretty damn perfect at that. He does make those throws all the time. He's not late on it.
He doesn't lay it out there. He's really good. 844-204-RICH, number to dial. Alan Shipnuck will join us next to talk about what appears to be the end of the live tour. That's next.
This is The Rich Eisen Show.
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Look who's joining us back here on the Rich Isa show. A man who has been chronicling the live tour for a very long time. I mean, for us, and obviously for himself and the outfits for which he writes, and the man who's a best-selling author of the latest book of his book on Rory McElroy's life, Alan Shipnuck is back here in the program. Alan, thanks for joining. How are you doing, man?
I'm delighted to be here. Thanks for having me. You got it.
So. Where do things stand uh with the Live Tour in your estimation, Alan? Yeah.
Well It's chaotic, as always. I mean, that's been Liv's vibe since its inception. Just chaos merchants, and it's great content, as it always is. It's rarely about the golf, it's always the macro story. And so, You know, we know that the Saudis are pulling their funding at the end of the year.
That the person who's nurtured live golf, it was his brainchild, you know, His Excellency Yashir Al-Ramayan, has cut and run. He's left the board of directors. Which to me is a super weak move. You're the captain of the ship. Like you should go down with the ship.
You don't just, you took the first lifeboat to get to get off the decks. But so the real question is, can live somehow find a way to endure beyond this season by attracting outside investment and new sponsors and new corporate partners? Certainly the age of decadence is over at Live Golf, but can it endure in some fashion? We're going to find out in the coming months. But Live as we know it is dead.
And will there be a zombie live that continues? We're going to find out what does a zombie live look like. No Bryson DeChambeau. Possibly no John Rom, but still a lot of good players who need somewhere to play and are now finding themselves on the outside looking in of the entire structure of professional golf, potentially. Um a more condensed schedule probably They might just pick up stakes in the U.S.
where they've never been able to penetrate the market and focus on an international schedule where Liv has generated some enthusiasm by going to these sort of golf-starved world capitals. Have to be smaller purses. The big guaranteed money would go away. That might have to be worked out by the lawyers how exactly that looks.
So there's a lot of questions, but. You know, Liv has made it clear that there's an appetite for golf all around the world. And when they've gone to Australia and South Africa and Korea and other places like that, the reception's been pretty warm. And the fans have turned out and they've had some media coverage and they've had some decent ratings.
So. Um The scale of live was probably too ambitious. If it can exist in a more downsized fashion, then I think there's probably a place for it. You know, live was always a monument to excess.
So, what is live without the decadence? It's kind of, we already have a European tour, we already have an Asian tour. Is there an appetite for an austere live golf? I don't know. So, what's the number?
that could keep live going, 'cause there's a number. And I know they got some, they're in the hunt. for revenue, I am sure. Um What what is the the number? And I I guess, if you don't mind, what was the number the Saudis were putting in?
And what's the gulf? Yeah, that's a big delta. The Saudis are putting in a billion dollars a year. And of course, that was $50 to $60 million a year just for John Rahm's contract, even before the winnings. It was purses of $33 million.
It was this huge build out around the tournaments. And so You know, you can. You can run a PGA tour event for 20 million dollars, 25 million dollars. If Lib does that times eight or ten, and then there's you know the ancillary cost of staff. I mean, maybe you need 250 million to run live golf.
Good luck finding that. Good, honestly. Good luck finding that, I imagine. No, well, or am I wrong? The interesting thing is that Lib is saying their revenue is going to be up $100 million over last year.
Now, the question was: is that real revenue or is that from Saudi Aramco and all their subsidiary companies of the PIF? But they have attracted Rolex, they've attracted HSBC. The individual teams have done a pretty good job of becoming somewhat self-sustaining with clothing and apparel and equipment deals.
So. You know, the live model was always to sell the franchises. They've never been able to do it because they were asking, you know, half a billion dollars. But the sports sector is booming. We see massive amounts of money coming into every level of professional sports.
So, could you find a board rich guy in Korea who would buy the Korean golf club for 100 million? Maybe. And if you can replicate that times 13 or 14 teams, you've gone a long way to generating the revenue you need. And there's no doubt that You know, the fact that the money was coming from Saudi Arabia scared away corporations, it scared away consumers, not across the board, but some people were always gonna be squeamish about it.
Now you take the Saudi side of the equation, and maybe Live can attract more blue chip sponsors.
So it's an interesting thought exercise. We see how much money is in professional sports, and we know that a lot of rich dudes love to play golf, and they'd love to be in the pro-ams and say they own a team, which is not a thing you can do in other levels of professional golf. It's going to be a huge test of Scott O'Neill, the CEO, and they just brought him two new board members who are turnaround experts in the financial world. It's possible that Liv could endure it. There is a way forward, but it does seem like a long shot.
And. But I I think when you look across the sports world, How many things are getting off the ground and achieving liftoff because there's just seemingly an endless appetite?
So, maybe. I think the answer is maybe. Interesting.
So. Um I'll ask you, Alan Shipnuck, a question I've never asked you before. Why did the Saudis cut and run? Pretty much. Yeah, there's a lot going on, including a war in Iran.
And one of Aramco's oil refineries was hit by Iranian drones, had to shut down for 11 days. When your entire economy is based around oil production, and that was a glimpse of how vulnerable it could be if this war drags on. A couple weeks ago, the Public Investment Fund of Saudi Arabia put out this new five-year strategic plan. And the core of it was we're going to invest domestically in all of our projects, and we're cutting back our international spending. And in that context, sports looks very frivolous.
And so they sold, the PIF sold its soccer team. They abandoned the Snooker Masters, which is a big deal in some parts of the world. They had a 10-year commitment. They just shut it down after two years. They pulled out of Tom Brady's Flag Football League.
So this is not particular to Live. This is a wholesale change in priorities for the entire kingdom and how they want to spend their money in this precarious moment. Live is just the biggest, noisiest example of things that are going by the wayside. the man who's hosting the next Live tournament could be the one who potentially kills it. Who said?
So United States. I guess not to bring geopolitics into this sports conversation, but if the war is what's causing. the Saudis to pull out And that Essentially, could mean the end of the live tour. Then What I just said I think is true.
Well, it's a delicious irony because Trump has hosted live events from the very beginning, including the next one. Including the next one. He's profited from these events. And part of the reason LIVE was even founded was as this exercise of soft power to give the Saudis access to the Western world and to decision makers. And it succeeded in this cozy relationship with Trump.
So, yeah, it is a delicious irony that he may be one of the reasons. I think after $5 billion in losses, people were looking at Live Golf with, you know, jaundiced eye. The one guy he was keeping alive was the governor of the public investment fund, Yasir al-Rahmayan. And he loves golf and live has always been his baby. But everyone has a boss.
In his case, it's a ruthless one, the crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman. And at some point, he had to say, listen, we gave this a go. We haven't really, we've made relationships that will endure now in all these world capitals. We don't really need the golf tournaments anymore. You didn't get a green jacket.
We're not in at Augusta National. We never got a TV deal of note. Like we gave it a good shot. We're still losing money. It doesn't seem like there's a path forward to be profitable or even to break even.
So the experiment's over. And I'm sure this pains Yassir because you've never seen anyone happier than Al Rumayan at a Live Golf Pro-Am, zipping around in his cart. It was like fantasy camp for him, playing a few holes with Dustin Johnson, playing a few holes with Bryson, getting a short game lesson from Phil Mickelson. Like he loved Live Golf. And so I'm sure there's some heartburn, but ultimately the crown prince is not a golfer.
He doesn't care. He's looking at the balance sheet saying, why are we incinerating a billion dollars on this a year on this vanity project? It's just time for it to end. And that's where we are. In the last two minutes, then, I guess, the success of the lives, either moving on and surviving or not is some of the name players that you mentioned and their desire to stick with it.
Or the PGA tour welcomes them back because they do have some sort of amnesty program they're willing to. To meet, where does that stand? Alice? Yeah, it's very delicate. Certainly, Bryson DeChambeau brings box office.
John Rahm is a great player. He's not as much of a star as Bryson. They're the two key pieces. There's a lot of good young players that live golf. I mean, that's the irony, is the fields have actually gotten better and deeper, but it's always been built on star power.
And you Bryson supposedly was asking for half a billion dollars from the PIF to sign a new contract.
So he probably helped kill it too. Like, they said, this is ridiculous. Like, we can't give Bryson DeCambo half a billion. Like, we're out. And um so You know, Bryson has said, like, we have an obligation to the players who came after us, like all of the stars who found a live.
Like, we're okay, we're good. We've got money in the bank.
So, this will be the ultimate test of his word. Does he mean that? Is he going to display the ultimate loyalty and try and help live survive? I mean, he has this new holding company that's making investments in the golf world. Maybe Bryson just buys Live golf and it becomes the greatest vanity project in all of sports.
There's a lot of delicious scenarios, but ultimately, I think you'll see John Rahm back on the PGA tour. I think you'll see Bryson back on the PGA tour, whether that's next year or they try and give it one more year on Live to see if they can make it a go. They have a window of their playing careers and they don't want to they don't want to lose their primes fighting this battle. And y at some point, you just got to do what's best for yourself, and that's playing on the best tour against the best competition and optimizing yourself for the tournaments that really matter. I guess um w we'll find out, you know, what the appetite is and Um And for the rest of the year, correct?
The Lib Tour has at least 2026 to figure this thing out, correct? Yeah.
We thought so, but then the Louisiana tournament just blew away.
So. It's gonna be week to week. It's gonna be tournament to tournament. And again, it's always, it's been chaotic around live golf since day one. And so it couldn't go out any other way.
The Rich Eisen Show Podcast. Mm-hmm.
