This episode brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game?
Shifting a little money here, a little there, and hoping it all works out? Well, with the Name Your Price tool from Progressive, you can get a better budgeter and potentially lower your insurance bill too. You tell Progressive what you want to pay for car insurance, and they'll help find you options within your budget. Try it today at Progressive.com. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Price and coverage match limited by state law.
Not available in all states. Let's see, May 22nd, 2025, Eastern Conference Finals, Game 1, Western Conference Finals, Game 1. Thinking about what I wanted to talk about, I had to bring in my man. I had to bring in a special. I mean, this is like royalty. I had to bring in a special guest. My guy TJ Jefferson, he's the co-host of No Contest Wrestling, but also the co-host of the Rich Eyes and Show. I had to bring him in for a couple of different reasons. One, because he's great at what he does. That's one thing.
Thank you. But you're tuned in to a lot of different things. The wrestling part we're going to get into, of course, a little bit, but the basketball side of it too. And you know, listen, the game last night was just phenomenal. I mean, Indiana at New York, Indiana was down big, but yet they were able to come back within about two and a half minutes, cut that lead, take it to overtime and eventually walk out of MSG with what I think may be a series changing kind of win.
New York had it. But watching that game when Indiana was down 14, what about two and a half minutes ago, whatever it may be, what'd you think? I thought it was a wrap. Everybody thought it was a wrap, right? Like the Knicks seemed like they were comfortable.
They were cruising. But the thing with Indiana is they just kept chipping away, right? They, they were, they could have just laid down, Jimmy. They could have been like Indiana. It's not them, but they could have been like, all right, bet. This is an L you know, we just want to steal one game here anyway.
And they could have, you know, like let's cruise, but they didn't put it on cruise control. They kept chipping away and they, and the Knicks were exchanging threes for twos as the lead is the time actually got down around that two minute mark. It was truly like if you, when you don't have a dog in the fight, right.
And you're just able to watch the game as a fan, that was so much fun to watch. And, and then at one point, you know, cat hit that three and kind of tapped James Johnson on, on, on the chest as he rolled back up court. And I thought at that moment, all right, next got it. This is it, right. But these paces, bro, there's something else. There's something different, man.
They just like, I I'd imagine that must be like when you're in a Halloween or a Friday the 13th movie and you keep stabbing Jason and Michael Myers, and then you turn around and homeboys still coming at you. All right, let me shoot them. Bam. Now I'm going to run up the block. No, here he comes. He's still walking. Oh, I'm going to stab him.
No, he's still coming. There was nothing they could do to put this team away. You know, it's one of those things too. So you ask yourself, did the Knicks lose it or did the Pacers win it? And two things can be right at the same time. I think the Pacers because of the way the game is today with the three point line, a 20 point lead 15 point lead is nothing with two, two minutes left in the game, two and a half minutes reason why it's because you got, it's really a five. This is a 15 point game is a five possession game for that.
Okay. So now you're with, with five threes, which we saw happen at the end of this, you can get back in the game. So you're never out of it, especially with the team that uses the three point line to their advantage. If you're not a, you know, volume three point shooting team, and that's not your thing, then sometimes it's tougher to get back in games, but if that's what you do, and now you can pick up the pace, that's something in the end. And you know, if Indiana made the little plays down the stretch, they got to stops when they need it, they forced New York to kind of get out of their comfort zone when they were rolling in that fourth quarter, especially late in the fourth quarter under five minutes for some bad decision-making by New York, some missed free throws. And again, that's the slim margin. If Nimhark misses one or two of those threes at the end, the game is over.
True. But the momentum was on the way. That might've been nice knee Smith at the end too. He Smith did have a big three, two minutes, imagine you missed that. Okay. Me Smith, you missed that.
That changes everything. So when I look at the game, the coaches tell you this all the time, give yourself a chance to win, just stay in the game. Despite what may be happening of the three quarters, three and a half quarters. If you got a chance to get back in and put the pressure on the opposing team. And that's, that's something I saw from a basketball perspective, Indiana do.
And I, it was actually an Emhart who actually hit the three that I was talking about. But let me ask you this, because of course you've played basketball at the highest level. So it's for me, I'd like to get in your brain a little bit when you're the Knicks, I I'd have to think that your whole thought process is don't let Tyrese Halliburton beach, which seems like when you have a player on one of those teams, it's always like, let the other guy beat you. If you're going to lose, they, I'm not saying they let this man that's number, but I'm looking at the numbers. He, he had one 30 point game this season and he had 30 yesterday.
Now I was listening to some of the other talk shows earlier that they taught. And you know, a lot of players talking about how there were support defense on the next, trying to cover him. But to me, Jim, it seemed like a lot of times if the man's chucking it up from 23, 24 feet out, are you really defending that a guy who you're not expecting to go off like that? Like what would be your defensive thought process if you're trying to watch this dude? Well, here's the thing with Tyrese. You got to keep him out of transition. You got to keep Tyrese out of transition, force him to operate in the half court. How you play the pick and roll with Miles Turner. I'll be topping is very important because if he can turn the corner and get that big body downhill, then he makes it, it makes it tougher to stop him. Now, is he getting these shots in transition? Is it off of some kind of penetration and now pitch and he's shooting? That's one thing. If he's really breaking you down and beating you individually, that's something totally different.
And how you guard the pick and roll is going to be different. And in the beauty about this series, it's the same thing I'd say about Brunson. Brunson had 40. Okay. I think he joined Michael Jordan, Kobe Bryant, Jerry West, James Harden, I think Allen Iverson as one of the guards with the most 40 point games in, you know, a playoff game. That's some company. Those are some good players.
Okay. He got 40. So if you're Rick Carlisle and Indiana Pacers, how you guard the pick and roll in game two may be a little different. They were going over the top, chasing and Jayden was able to get to a spot.
Do they change that? That's the beauty of a seven game series is that the adjustment, you see what, and also two is, it's two things coach is going to tell you this one, we go back and look at it and say, well, they'll ask what adjustments you need to make. They say, one, we need to operate our game plan a lot better if we didn't see that's a, that's a key to coaches look at and say, like when I Clippers were playing Denver, I think it was game one, game two, it might've been game one or game five. You know, it was all about, it wasn't that they didn't play well. It's that they didn't execute the game plan the way it was supposed to.
So coaches would say that like, yeah, I mean, there's not too much of a judge. If we execute the game plan, we got a chance, but that's the beauty of TJ to me of game two is watching how these adjustments or how we tweak the game plan just a little bit, or do we execute it a lot better because down the stretch of the game, it was one team that made the plays. And that was in the end true. But the Knicks were still hitting shots. The Knicks were still playing. Well, let me ask you this again.
Okay. So when you talk about game plan, it seemed like up until a certain point in that game, everything was going to next way. It was, and it seems as though their game plan was being executed and it worked out.
So if you're the Knicks, what, what do you take away from this? Because it's not like things weren't going your way. It's not like you weren't making your socks. It's not like you weren't playing the ball.
It seems the way that you play, it said they got incredibly hot and we don't see stuff like they get hot. See, see what I'm saying? So, so here is that. And that's the key is that you can't allow a team to get those shots off. Now it's easier said than done.
Okay. So for, for 46 minutes, 47 minutes, 48 minutes, you've been able to contain the three point line relatively securely, not giving up the shot, but what happened. So what they're going to look at is in the last two and a half minutes, what changed defensively? Why those shots were open? Now that backdoor cut that Nimhar got on Josh Hart. Yeah.
Think about that. That's a layup. Obie Toppin with the dunk layup. The put back layup. So it wasn't always a three point shot. It was those little plays too.
So a second shot opportunity goes up and Obie Toppin comes over the top. Yeah. We didn't block out.
Okay. There's one play where, um, Halliburton had the ball. He hit a guy. I can't remember who had to lay up, but Josh Hart lost his man. That's the one hit him with that nice dish. And he cut to the rack, got the layup. That's what I'm saying. So that was a defensive misstep. We look at the threes and even we look at the threes and that layup costs. Let's say when Indiana took the ball out of bounds and they in New York didn't file when Mitchell Robinson was guarding Toppin and there was a switch and he jumped up and Toppin went back door for that dunk and got slapped on the arm.
Yeah. Where was the communication there? Were you supposed to file?
Were you supposed to stay back? See, those are the correctable errors that if you're a coach for New York, you look at and say, what costs us down the stretch on why we did not in particular execute defensively. That little two and a half minute stretch is what you're going to really break down because like you said, you know, for the other 47 and a half minutes, you played really good basketball, but why is the breakdown? I mean, that's, you know, in this game to me is going to be the key for New York coming back. So what do you think is the mentality of these Knicks going into game two? Do you feel the despondent or do you feel like they're going to take it as like we had that little stretch where we didn't execute the way we could better than that. We had this game in hand. Do you think that they're up right now or do you think they're feeling a little bit down? It's hard to say because not in the locker room, but knowing the who was he was our assistant coach with the Rockets under Jeff Van Gundy, knowing Jalen Brunson, knowing Josh Hart, knowing Mikel Bridges and covering them in at Villanova, being familiar with Kat, watching OG, I feel that they think they gave the game up, that Indiana didn't beat them and that they're still the better team that gives you a different mentality gives you because it's not like, you know, this team just beat us and you feel deflated.
I don't think that's what the Knicks feel now. Conversely, the big question too is Indiana. You snuck that win.
People say, are you satisfied? Do you get satisfied with splitting for Indiana? It's like, no, we want to get to forget all that split stuff. We expected to come in here and win game one. And now we expect to win game two.
That's the mentality. And that's what I love about this because these two teams really feel Indiana being down. We shouldn't have been down and we should have won the game. Yeah.
New York. We were up. We had the game. We gave you, we gave you the game.
You didn't beat us. And that's what I love about this series. Yeah. It's, um, you know, it just nineties basketball, right? Just feels like you're right in the fact that we do have the Knicks in the Pacers, right?
It does. It does feel like that, that, that nineties throwback with, with Reggie and Ewing and everything. And is there a villain though? Because, because Miller was the villain and Reggie was the villain was a villain in that. I don't think there was a villain until there were a sector was a second left in the game when Halliburton made that shot.
And then did that. He did the choke because now I'm assuming this man is public enemy number one in New York city. So it's going to be interesting. Like, you know, those New York fans are, they were causing the ruckus.
Right. And something happened yesterday that I could not believe Brunson's at the foul line at the end of the game, the crowd that the garden went silent. I could not believe how quiet it was. Well, he was shooting, but still like, I'm still shocked how it was like that crowd. They were scared almost. They were trepidation that he may miss because usually what they do is that like they were cheering MVP, MVP, and then they'll stop. When he was about to shoot, I guess my point is where there are no Pacers fans in the building that night, because you could have heard a mouse peeing on cotton. It was so quiet when he was at, at that foul line. And I just thought like, maybe the fans are getting tight now, you know, because they're trying to like, all right, everybody shut up so you can make these shots.
Give me, give me your, okay. We, cause we're going to talk about the Denver. I mean, Denver, Minnesota and OKC, but game two, who wins it? I think the, Oh, obviously the Knicks have to, right. They got to win game two.
They go down though, two on the road. I think you need to change your name Saran. Cause it's a wrap though. If you're the Knicks, your mentality, like I said earlier is we don't want this guy to be this. So maybe we'll accept letting somebody else step up because do we believe that this man can pull this off again and again in the seven game series. But as you and I were talking about before the show started, these Pacers are deep. So even if it's not him, it can definitely be another one of these guys who nobody in America knows, by the way, like I kind of feel like that's also a cool thing too.
These guys, nobody knows these pacer players outside of Halliburton. So I love the fact that now people are getting introduced to a, to a worldwide audience and it's going to give these guys on the bench a chance to get their shine because it might not be the guy who got busy in game one. It's probably going to be someone else who's going to get their chance to step up. So it's going to be interesting to see how the Knicks react to that. How are they going to defend him? And if they try to take him out, then who else is going to step up for this team?
Well, I like Indiana. I mean, I like New York to figure it out in game two to kind of even the series. The challenge New York has is when the ball gets boggled down for somebody else to make a play. That's what Indiana has, whether it's Nembhard, who's a point guard that can make a play, whether that's TJ McConnell that can make a play.
So you can get the ball out of, if they're in a game with Halliburton, but you still have other guys that can manage and negotiate the court and make a play. The problem with New York is against a really good defensive team. Who else not only can make a play, okay, make a play for yourself to go into the shot clock or make a play for your teammate. That's one of the challenges New York has when the ball is out of Brunson's hand. That's why you heard Halliburton say, win the non Brunson minutes. That means when he's on the bench, we need to win those minutes. Like Jokic, win the non Jokic minutes. And I think that's the strategic core advantage roster wise that Indiana has. They got three basically point guards with Nembhard, with Halliburton and McConnell that can make plays. And to me in a seven game series, I don't know how much you can lean into. They can lean into that a little bit more.
But game two, I got, I got in, I got a New York. This message is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. May is military appreciation month and we're celebrating the military community that goes above and beyond every day with Navy Federal Credit Union. Navy Federal was created for the military community and is dedicated to ensuring that its members feel celebrated and honored every single day. For over 90 years, Navy Federal's mission has been to support and uplift the military community.
And this May is no different. It's not just a credit union. It's also a partner dedicated to helping its members achieve their financial goals. All active duty veterans and members of military families are eligible to join. Navy Federal is excited to celebrate military appreciation month as a special time to recognize our troops and the profound contributions they make. Learn more at navyfederal.org slash celebrate. Navy Federal Credit Union. Our members are the mission.
Navy Federal is insured by NCUA. Summer's here and Nordstrom has everything you need for your best dress season ever. From beach days and weddings to weekend getaways and your everyday wardrobe. Discover stylish options under $100 from tons of your favorite brands like Mango, Skims, Princess Polly and Madewell. It's easy too with free shipping and free returns, in-store order pickup and more.
Shop today in stores online at Nordstrom.com or download the Nordstrom app. So let's look at this. You as a player, right? You're playing this game. Halliburton hits this shot and you would think it's a lucky shot, right? Let's be honest.
It's deflating. But then he goes and he does the choke symbol. You as a player, how are you feeling about that? Or is that just... At that point, I don't even think from a, from a player perspective, you don't really, really see that. You like can't believe the shot went in.
That's your thing. You're, you're thinking in your mind, man, we had this game. We forced him to take a tough shot. He ran back behind the three point line, threw it up. It hits the back and it goes up and you're thinking, now you can imagine being on the court. That ball was probably in slow motion. I was saying that on the show today, it hung up there for a minute. And it goes, so you go from, we need a stop. We got this too.
You're just watching your feet. Now give them credit. They came on overtime and kind of dominated the first couple minutes. But once again, Indiana slow walked, you know, they slow walk them. So that's why I think this series is made for TV is probably what the NBA needed. I, I, older rivalry renewed different character, different faces, a different time period, but the same kind of intensity. Yeah.
Okay. Even though Indiana wants to get up and down, it's the same kind of intensity. I think this is something in the Eastern Conference final. If you don't have Boston in it, that you need it, you need it, right. You needed this kind of animosity, this kind of competitive nature.
Well, me personally, I needed the Sixers to be in there, but that's a whole nother story. We already talked about that, but not now this is just switching real quick. Well, let me switch it. Can I talk about Brunson real quick?
Okay, go ahead. Because you know, there's this trope, I guess, going around and he's a foul merchant and okay, fine and dandy, but it's not a bad thing. It's not a bad thing because my thing, I look at Brunson right in a sport that's dominated by obviously big men. He is the most average looking cat on that, on that court. He's not big, doesn't look, he runs particularly fast. You know, it seems like he's a guy that we'd be playing pickup with who somehow made it to the NBA and is dominating.
Right. So to me, I feel like a man his size, he's got to take advantage. He's got to do the little things because he can't match up physically with some of these players. Like he's not going to out jump somebody. It's not going to really outrun a lot of these guys. I feel like his game is like predicated on him being able to like get contact.
And you know, I, like I said, I don't like the foul merchant thing. I guess I can see the more I'm thinking about it, where it would come from, but I don't want that to be the defining characteristic of Jalen Brunson because I feel the brother's too good. Do you, do you rank Jalen top 10 players in the league? Well, you know, throughout the playoffs, we keep hearing that he's the most clutch player, right? But would you rank him as top from the top 10 players right now, would you rank him top 10 in the league or just outside?
Hmm. I mean, it's easy for me to sit here today and say, yeah, I'll put them in the top 10. I think top 20 definitely without thinking.
And then I think I'd have to think about paring it down to 10. Let's say we put them in the top 10. Four of the top 10 players are non-athletic.
They don't use their athleticism to overwhelm me. Jokic? Yep. Just to the free throw line.
Donch, Donch, Luka? Yep. Just to the free throw line. Brunson, we mentioned. You know the other one?
They play tonight. SGA. You see what I'm saying? It is a theme there because they understand how to get to the free throw line. To me, the merchant part is smart because listen, he's utilizing and playing within the rules of how to pick up fouls. It's different if you are out flailing around a lot of times, but if you're able to get a man on your back and kid him to run into you, ain't your fault. That's the smart basketball. SGA understand what they all understand is how to get to their spot.
They don't, they're not overly athletic. Do you see that quicker change of direction Jalen Brunson had at the top of the key in the game? It was like a quick change and he was down the lane. Okay. He's not the fastest.
The one where he dipped the ball down. Okay. So when you got to appreciate that, because when you go to the scouting and there's people in the combines and everybody, well, his measurables don't look good.
And let me interrupt real quick. Am I wrong by saying what I said about the fact that he okay. But if you go to talk to scouts and you talk to people, that's why he fell in the second round. Is he a point guard? We know he's a point, but can he garden space? Is he quick enough? Is he athletic?
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. My question is can he play? If he can play, I can figure it out. Yeah. And that's what you see with Jalen and SGA.
And then we'll keep it with there. Cause those who are playing, they know how to get to the line. My third year I was fortunate when I was averaging 25, I would get to the free throw on eight to 10 times a game. I would understand how to get there. Let's say the opposing team was, had four files. I knew the next file was a penalty. So I would take, I would initiate the offense under hook my opponent, run down the lane and pick up a file. That's just knowing time and score, understanding the situation and knowing how to pick up files. MJ knew how to do it. Colby knew how to do it.
Steph is really good at hooking people. Exactly. So you got to know in certain situations, how a guy is guarding you, how to get to the line. And the beauty of it is those guys get their team in the penalty, which is very important because if I can pick up two to three quick files early in the quarter, now they're going to be two other files, maybe with six, seven minutes left in that quarter.
Now I'm in the penalty and I'm at the free throw line. So I don't look at it as a bad thing as the way those two in particular, the way Luca does it is a little bit different. Okay. Okay. Cause he's complaining and I love Lucas game, but he complains and he flails and he does stuff. I don't like that aspect of it, but SGA and Brunson and then Jokic, how they do it.
Amen. And how, what do you attribute Brunson's success to? Because like I said, he, he, there's no measurable jumping off the page. Go back to, you know, you, you, you've seen the commercial with him and Rick outside and he's shooting and doing all of that. His dad was, you know, every time he hit a jumper, it looked like I think he did the drill where he would throw the ball over his head, make him run, get the ball, come back. Well, see, but Rick wasn't an over athletic point guard. He was a hard worker who knew how to play. And it's the reason why he had longevity.
So he imparted that wisdom to guess who? So it was all about footwork. It was all about body positioning. He was all about being able to make multiple shots, whether it was mid range from behind the arc or being able to finish at the rim. This one I knew, and I said this before because I had the opportunity to really cover Jalen along with Josh Hart, along with Mikel Bridges, their years at Villanova. Jalen is the number one point guard coming out of high school. He could have went anywhere he wanted to. Right.
And probably started. He chose to go to Villanova. And why is that important? It's because at the time, Ryan Archie Diacchino was the starting point guard at Villanova.
A going to be senior. So Jalen, along with his family, chose to take a more difficult path, which is he's not starting right away, but he'll learn how to play the game the right way from an outstanding coach in Jay Wright, but from a veteran mature point guard who played at New York, actually, Ryan Archie Diacchino. Okay. At one point. And to me, when I saw that, that's a certain humility you have to say, I need to learn how to play the right way. And I watched him just grow and grow and learn how to play. And it was patient and boom, that's, you know, two championships and national player of the year still didn't get the love to get drafted, still had to prove himself at Dallas and boom, look where we're at. So when you asked me that quote, I go back to that decision to go to Villanova under those circumstances to learn how to play the right way. And it's boded well right now for what he's doing in the league. It's amazing.
It's amazing. And, you know, you know, we had Steven A. Smith on the Rich Eyes and show two days ago. I want to ask him this.
I didn't get the chance to. So if I could bring it up with you now, the New York City point guard is a thing, right? The New York City is known for their point guard play from one who's he all the way down to now Brunson, but he's not from New York, but he's not from New York. He's not from New York. You tell somebody from New York. I think everybody in New York would say that's ours. No, but it's not.
And again, that was seventies, eighties, nineties, early two thousands for New York. I came out with Kenny Anderson. Yeah.
Okay. Who was at that time to me, Chibs, if there was social media, I believe he would have been in the same realm of a LeBron James. That's how I think the snap and the nostalgia around and the aura around Kenny was at the time by starting as a freshman in high school, by setting these records, by doing things that you didn't really see. But think about that's a lineage from Mark Jackson to tiny Archibald to Kenny Smith.
You can go down the line, Ray for Austin, Ray for Austin, Red Autry, God sham, but those were older guys. You don't have the same impact as the New York point guards as you used to, because Stephanie from there, they're from Carolina. You know what I mean? Look at the point guards that are playing in league. Okay.
Brunson from Chicago. Yeah. So at one point it was great, but the world has evolved so much that that's not still the case as far as dominating the point guard position out of New York.
In my opinion, I feel you. Okay. I'm from New York though.
I'm still playing in Brunson from Chicago, but he plays in New York. He's a neck. So I, like I said, I ain't got a fight at dog in this fight.
I'm just saying if I were a Nick fan, that's how I would choose to look at it. No, man. Come on, man. So, so, so, um, speaking of which, and we touched on SGA, Minnesota, man, when I saw Minnesota play against OKC, it kind of looked like in their face. It was like, they knew it was coming. The defense, they didn't know it was coming like that. Like that.
You know what I mean? And, and OKC, the beauty about, okay, here's the thing about OKC. If I can guard you right here and you don't have to help and you don't put me in rotation, well, I'm good. And they have players that could do that. And that's what I think frustrated Minnesota. Minnesota couldn't really get to the paint.
Didn't get those that help position to kick out for the open threes. OKC dominated points in the paint. They got on transition and it was one of those things where Minnesota was kind of rolling a little bit and the bodies for OKC, whether it was Dort, whether it was SGA, whether it was, um, you know, other guards that can't Caruso, especially coming in. Um, that's the difference, man, with this OKC team, their ability to guard one-on-one is so crucial. It's not like they're a great rebounding team, but they dominate you like that. Even though you got a Hardin-Stein and you, you know, inside with the acquisition and Chet Holmgren, but where they get you is they get up into you defensively and they make it tough for you. And your main guys to kind of beat you off the dribble, force you to help.
And you get those open shots and they don't turn the ball on either. It's this SGA thing. And one other thing we're always in sports, they're always talking so much about relatives and, you know, the families, but no one ever until Richard Jefferson really start hammering the point during the game that, you know, you, this is a family affair, you know, with these two that it just doesn't get touched upon. So that's just one thing I'm glad we're hearing about, but SGA, man, here is the thing for me. And this is personal as a Clippers fan, as you know, I'm afraid that these Thunder will win this championship and that will make that the worst trade in the history. But that's, that's revisionist history though, because at the time you didn't, nobody knew, nobody knew SGA was going to be this. You had an opportunity to go get a perennial All-Star in Paul George who was considered top 15 player. Yeah.
You go get them. You, you, and if it gives up young talent because of what you've already seen in Paul George, you go get it. Nobody knew that this was coming. Nobody knew, but that's a situation too, that I think he really benefited from. And the reason why I say that is because you're thinking, well, maybe he'd be SGA and Clippers. We don't know what that dynamic is at the Clippers if he's still there. But what we do know is SGA was able to mature as a player in OKC with the ball in his hands all the time, learning the hard lessons, the defeats, the disappointments, but also how to win games, how to lead. Could he have done the same thing the way the makeup of the Clippers are all the time?
I don't know. And so you can't discount that though that move worked perfectly for his development and growth. And now we see all of that.
I don't know if he gets that, if he's the main cornerstone, if he stays in LA because it's LA and the roster was totally different. That's just, you know, my opinion. All right. So I shouldn't feel as bad as I'm feeling. No, don't it was a no brainer. So no, you got to go get him. You got to go get him.
You just have to at the time. Paul George is available. Come on, man. And that's not a slight at the young SGA. It's just, that's that guy over there in the Easton that took LeBron and Cleveland to game seven and could do it, you know, could do it a little bit of everything.
Plus he's from here, you know, Palmdale. It definitely, definitely made all the sense in the world when it happened. I know I was excited, but now, like I said, every time I watched this cat play, it just, you sit there and you just go, wow.
How many times you see trays like that though? I mean, that that happened where it seemed like at the time it was a no brainer because of the exchange in between and then things play, but it's not an exact science. It's like the draft is not, I don't care what you do. It's not an exact science on what you think this move is going to be five years from now. Right now it on paper, it was the right, there's a right thing. But now we look at it and everybody's like dumbest trade to Clippers.
Come on. At the time you don't look at it like that. Eczema isn't always obvious, but it's real. And so is the relief from Evglis. After an initial dosing phase of 16 weeks, about four in 10 people taking Evglis achieved it's relief and clear or almost clear skin. And most of those people maintain skin that's still more clear at one year with monthly dosing. Evglis LibriKizumab LBKZ a 250 milligram per two milliliter injection is a prescription medicine used to treat adults and children 12 years of age and older who weigh at least 88 pounds or 40 kilograms with moderate to severe eczema also called atopic dermatitis that is not well controlled with prescription therapies used on the skin or topicals or who cannot use topical therapies. Evglis can be used with or without topical corticosteroids. Don't use if you're allergic to Evglis. Allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. Eye problems can occur. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening eye problems. You should not receive a live vaccine when treated with Evglis. Before starting Evglis, tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. Searching for real relief?
Ask your doctor about Evglis and visit evglis.lily.com or call 1-800-Lily-Rx or 1-800-545-5979. This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, Prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail biting novel from time to time with services like Prime Video, Amazon Music and fast free delivery Prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into.
Visit amazon.com slash prime to learn more. And that's that's one of those situations where there's a win-win. It didn't look like it at first. It kind of looked like it tilted towards New York because the Randall thing, trying to figure it out how it was going to work didn't seem right.
But it took time. It took time for Ant to figure out how to work with Randall and Randall. What space he needed and how to work with Gobert. I think Randall and Gobert work better together.
And Randall is a beast, bro. I mean, just yeah, I think he's comfortable in a space right now and he's playing like that. You saw the first half he had, you know, despite the loss, you know, and I think for New York, you needed to have a spacer on the court with Brunson.
You needed to have a big that can pick and pop. Okay, that wasn't Julius. That wasn't Julius again. That wasn't Harden signs game, you know, and I love Harden sign. I think you could have found a way to keep him as his backup that mean that have been great, but they didn't want to pay him. Yeah, but you needed a cat in order for this offense for New York to be really activated for Jalen to have that, you know, optionality off of the pick and roll.
So it to me, this was one of those trades where it made sense for both because of how they play and how they want to play and now we may have a crash course of things change where those two could potentially be in the finals. You talking about the storylines from that. It's all right. Come on, bro. I mean, writes itself, man.
Let's talk about Ant Man. What's he got to do in game to turn this whole thing around? You know, the funny thing is, is and said it. You got to make more plays when and was activated. What was that game against Denver? Seven that the last game, okay, where he didn't shoot it well, but he was this he had the 12 assists. Yeah, that might have been game five or six, whatever was but that's where he's good. Remember, he complained about being double teamed and complained about he can't get his space and complain. So that limits you on what you can do is makes it easy for the defense to take you out of it to me and the scoring will be the scoring.
He didn't score in the fourth quarter. We get he had 18 points, but the great players figure out ways to make the defense play pay for always having all the eyes on me and when ant is doing this early and again being aggressive to me is not just being aggressive shooting. Okay, I'm gonna tack off the dribble. You come now making a play. If I see the double team coming, I'm getting off the ball early, put you in rotation and now it's up to my teammates and make a player make a shot.
So that's my thing with ant. That's the adjustment. That was game five. Okay, that was game five. So limit his turnovers because ant can be loose with the ball. Yeah, true that because that game five he had like eight, seven or eight turnovers, right?
He had four and yes, yesterday seven in that game. So he can be loose. He can't be now sometimes turnovers happen. I get it.
Don't get me wrong. His decision-making on where it needs to go, how it needs to go and when it needs to go to be very important against his OKC team, that temple team come attack it, get off of it, let it come back to you. Now you can go one-on-one and attack the defense. But if you trying to face that thing head up while they're set is going to be hard to get to your gaps because they're at boxes and their elbows. It will force the ball out. But if you get it, give it up, get it back on the second side. Now attack.
Now you got a better opportunity to get it. Also get stops and get out in transition. OKC wants to run a little bit. They want to run. Yeah, true. So guess what? Best way you do you run on a running team, but you gotta get stops.
So to me, that's the formula for ant. Do you think they got a chance to win this series? Oh yeah, no doubt. I think they do now.
How Conley plays deep and cinjo plays Nas Reed's play. I think that's going to be very important. I think they'll all play better in game two. I mean, they have to.
Well, you don't have to. You know what I'm saying? In order for them to win. But no, they had the others because listen, in championship and where we're at right now, Eastern Western Conference Finals, your stars will be your stars. But like we saw with the Indiana game, guess who stepped up? It was out.
It was nice man. OK, OK. That case and Wallace stepped up with OKC. Your stars are going to get the headlines. But when you win big, you can always go back and chart the best known player or your role players who really had impact on the game or on the entire series to that championship.
Ultimately, that championship team. OK, so let me ask you this this time next week. OK, we got game five this time next week.
I'm being DR. Oh, Dominican, Dominican Jim. Next Wednesday is the Western Conference Finals. They'll be in game five Thursday Eastern Conference Thursday.
So where do you think? Just look into that crystal ball. Give me a prediction. What do you think we're looking at when both of these series?
OK, so Wednesday is Western, right? Yeah. So today is game two. He's game two. I say Minnesota win.
Well. I mean, OKC could be up to go back to Minnesota, bro. Yeah, I think I think OKC wins this game.
Go up to go up to Minnesota. I think we could we could see. Three one Western Conference. Really?
Yes. I would love it to be two two. I think this OKC OKC team is different, bro. Deep in as we talked about, I think I could I think that could be three one. I think the Indiana series. So that would be game. So I'm sorry next Thursday would be game one would be game five. Three to Indiana Wednesday's game is game five, I'm sorry. So it would be game will be game five to two to. So you're picking the tools to no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
I'm talking about Indiana and New York. You said so game. So wait. So Wednesday is game five. Yeah. OK, so it's game five. Mm hmm. So so you think to two.
So it'd be I think I'm sorry. I would three one. So three one OKC. I think OKC handles their business at home. Minnesota. They split in Minnesota.
Three one, three one. OK, going back to OKC. So Thursday will be game five of the East to two to two. Yeah. I think that series I think Indiana, New York can get one in Indiana. I think you're right.
New York, New York can get one in Indiana. This is so exciting because, as you know, we were talking about this on the Rich Eisen show. We've been hearing that youth is served, right?
That's a saying that goes around. And it looks like we finally have reached the point where now youth will be served because there's no star. I mean, there is guys who are stars, but we're talking about worldwide stars that people in other countries know. There's not youth more so towards OKC. Well, I'm just saying youth in general in terms of when this new champion is crowned.
I believe what the seventh new champion in a row. You're going to have an SGA. You're going to have an aunt. You're going to have a brunch and you're going to have a Halliburton. You have some of these young bucks who are now we've been hearing about youth getting served. Now it's truly going to be true. Youth movement is really happening right now. And, you know, I think it's like this is the new guard, you know, the old guard, the staff, the LeBron, the KP, you know, Tyrese, all of those, those time their time.
You know, obviously the time in front is far shorter than the time behind. This is the new era and these are the new stars. And one of these guys is going to grab this mantle of, you know, superstar. And I think that's what's kind of exciting because we don't really know who's going to win. You don't.
You don't. We don't know which player is going to step up and say, I'm him. And I think that's the beauty of this right now with these four teams is I don't know what's going to happen, but as a basketball fan, taking my individual fandom away, I I'm excited, man.
I feel like the game is going to be in good hands with some of these players. And, you know, this whole debate about who's the new face of the league, it could very well come from one of these four teams, a player who steps up, steps up and a lot of that face of the league and everything. It's time to think about the parody you talked about.
We haven't seen this kind of parody NBA since the seventies. Yeah. When you have multiple teams win championships and that's something that the NBA was striving for. The NFL has had it. Yeah. Parity wise, it's extremely difficult to do what Kansas city has been doing, you know, had done before by winning back to back. And this is so hard.
It was to try to win three in a row. I mean, it's just football is a different animal. And NBA, the way I think the salary cap structure and the CBA and second apron is built now going to be extremely difficult to want to pay two max players, super max players. You got to figure out how to thin out that, build your roster differently, and you're going to have more parody across the board. If you look at the teams, the way they're being built and constructed right now, you can't really say that any of these four teams, maybe outside of OKC are going to be dominant for the next five years. Cause OKC is going to have to make some decisions on what they do with their roster because they can't pay everybody. But what they, those draft picks the replay, what they've been able to do.
That's why, that's why I was going to say they're different. A case in Wallace is easily step in not easy, but if a Lou Doric gold moves on, okay. Cause they developed him and they got draft picks to go get somebody else young.
So they, they sit in a unique position, unlike a lot of other teams because of their draft assets. And they have replaceable parts. If someone would leave my SGA, that's a whole different story. Home green is a little different story, but the other parts you could replace and still be competitive. He doesn't seem like a replaceable.
You can replace him. He doesn't seem like it, but the Jalen, you know, depending on salary structure, come down the line. Everybody's not going to be paid. I know Lou Dort has paid already. SGA has paid. They got the paycheck.
Okay. Hartenstein's contract at 50 million, I think it is, is pretty reasonable in today's world. But those younger guys, you have to figure it out. They don't want to go into Sam Pressley to the second apron. They don't want to do that. They got assets.
So parody is great for the league. I think one of the challenges is you need a bad guy. You need a team. You got to prove to get that's the way the NBA has been, whether it's been the Celtics, whether it's been, you know, the Lakers, whether it's been the heat, whether it's been golden state, whether, you know, those times I can't say Philly has been a hated team, but they kind of been in that situation in early, late seventies, eighties, you know, because of Dr. J and even George McGinnis before that, um, and the pistons, obviously we all rallied to hate them. And it was a team like San Antonio.
You didn't really hate, but nobody really galvanized to, but you knew exactly how dominant they were. I don't know the way the NBA is being built out now. Is that a bad, good or bad thing that we don't have? Cause golden state, I think, will they still be competitive? Can they do some stuff? Yeah, but it's not going to be the same dominance that we saw in the past. So do we do it before we get off this show? Do we need that team that we love to hate?
Well, I mean, look, the Knicks beat that team. It could be, but look, in order to have a hero, right? You need a foil, right? So you have to have someone to oppose the hero to make you like him even more. So yeah, I think, I think a bad guy quote unquote is kind of necessary just for storyline sports storyline purposes. But I, I don't see him in within these four teams yet. Not yet.
I think New York may be the closest to that in these New York or ant, but see, it's so likable to me. He's so he's so, but he's, he's like, he's, that's the problem. I don't think, I think his personality is so good, but he speaks his mind, right? Like Charles Barkley just speaks your mind. You asked me, I'm gonna tell you, I mean, the man that went up to president Obama and was like, I'm him. So, but then some people that, that brashness turns them off, turns them off, but that's what I was saying.
As far as, you know, people are confident in themselves. It makes other people uncomfortable, but that's why I say, I think ant could be the guy that kind of is really right there because either you like him or you don't, I don't see how you don't. I love ant. Yeah. I just don't think people see him as the villain.
I think, you know, he's got the commercials going on now and I don't, I don't think in him is like the villain part, right? Yeah. You know what I mean? Like some people embody the villain, like Draymond, like Draymond, his personality and the way he is, he's, he's too likable to be a villain. You know what I mean?
Yeah. You mean ant. Ant is too likable as a person, you know, because he's so brash. He's so honest. He's so authentic. You know, he wants really the involvement of his teammates, even though he understands he's the best. So it's hard not to like that dude, man. And SGA he's Canadian and they're all super nice. So it's hard to dislike him too.
You know? So I just don't know if we're going to get that, that villain, unless, unless it's Tyrese Halliburton, who was a huge fan of pro wrestling and then he taps into that Hill persona, which, you know, if he wants to kind of use that wrestling thing that he loves so much, so he can be Reggie 2.0. I look with the, I think the choke sign made him like, again, public enemy number one in New York. I wouldn't go walking around dolo for the next, you know what I'm saying? I price I price chill in the hotel or have James Johnson with me. Anytime I left, you don't walk them New York streets kid by yourself. Put you on the spot before we get out of here. Who wins tonight tonight? Why you, why you, why, why did you repeat what I just said?
It's classic. It's buying you, buying you time tonight. We've been talking about all this stuff.
I mean, not the other night, not two nights from now tonight. I'm going, I'm going with, you know, what are you doing? There's a man named Doug West, who was an Altuna legend who was a winter Villanova team playing for the team.
I'm rocking with Doug West. So I'm going with the team. All right. Okay. All right. So we'll, we'll circle back around. I know you'll be texting me later and I'll text you later on it and we'll see, but I appreciate you stopping in bro. Are you kidding me?
I've been wanting to do this for a minute. We may have to do this once a month where we talk about a little bit of everything is we've got some other stuff. We got to talk about the wrestling and some other real quick. Before we go, you talked about the salary cap thing just really quick and the Celtics, right? They're, they're in a bit of a conundrum with Tatum. He's going to be missing probably all season. They got Brown at 600 million in contracts.
What do you think happens there? Cause obviously that's a lot of money. Those two, unless you can get value, you know, Tatum is not going anywhere. I don't know why you would get rid of Brown. I think the outliers are Brzingis because of his, I'm fortunate because he's just health man. When he's healthy, it's a different thing. You know, Al Horford is not making a lot of money like that. His money may come off the board this year because well, Al Horford has been making money since 1965.
But you know, the true holiday's name has come up as an issue. Cause the thing is you, you got to look at it too is like Bill Belichick said, you got to know when to get off a player before they get too old. Okay. And still have value to get something back because you see where Derek White has assumed that point guard position and kind of can guard. So if you don't have Drew, you feel comfortable with Derek being there. So can you get younger with some pieces for Drew holiday? That makes sense.
And I'm not saying that that's what you do. Um, and again, it, you don't want to overreact because of what happened and thinking that it's all over, but when you do have an older player like a Al Horford and like a Drew holiday, you got to start to look at what that roster looks like for next year and what these parts are. Cleveland has to answer the same thing. Not that they're older, but does the combination of Garland Mitchell, small back court ancillary pieces.
Do we need to get bigger, better on the wing? Okay. And I know that's why they got Hunter, but you saw in the playoffs with Ty Jerome, he may be a, he's a free agent, may get a better offer with Matt Shrews. They got to kind of expose in the playoffs.
Okay. So Cleveland has some questions despite having 60 plus wins, but they want to, I'm not saying blow it up, but they got some holes. They got to fill. And that's the, you know, only one team wins it.
Everybody else is scrambling, trying to figure out what they need to do to get better for next year. So I appreciate you brother. Thank you so much. You already said it. It took you five hours to figure it out that Minnesota was going to win it. So stay tuned. Have a great weekend. Everybody be some great games tonight. It's OKC Minnesota tomorrow.
Oh, the thriller. Second game, MSG, Indiana at New York. Love it. Love it. Love it. We'll get with you next week. Thanks again.
Have a good one. Actor Michael Rosenbaum. You know, some of the most talented people in the business. Let's get inside of Jack Osborne.
Bands would say Black Sabbath was a huge influence and thank God you liked it. Yeah. Elijah Wood.
Peter gets on the phone. Elijah, would you like to play the role of Frodo? Did you cry?
Probably screamed at the top of my lungs. We play iconic characters, Black Canary and Black Siren. Who would you choose? Probably Black Siren. She's like, I got this. And that's how Katie Cassidy feels. She's got this. I like that. The Inside of You podcast. Follow and listen on your favorite platform.
