Russia's Invasion of Ukraine: Separating Fact from Fiction

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. Michael Brown.

Michael Brown. Thank you on YouTube. Thank you The Can-Do Spirit in America.

Anything's Possible, Make Your Dreams Come True. That's not really found in countries under communism, Marxism. There is that oppression, that hopelessness that you mentioned, and it is interesting to see changes come as the cloud starts to lift. What about spiritually? Is there a lot of religious tradition there? Is there a lot of vibrant faith?

What did you run into? The believers who are, you know, Christians, they were definitely just very on fire for the Lord because being persecuted for so many years really gave them such a deep hunger and closeness to God that was, you know, amazing to see. Also in that, a big difference because, you know, when they had faith for something, it wasn't that they questioned it, but they just stood on that faith because they knew that God is the only answer that they have. And culturally in general, most Ukrainians would say they are Orthodox Christians, but it doesn't necessarily impact their lives in any way other than some of the holidays they will go to the church to get things blessed by the priest or things like that. But yeah, the Charismatic Evangelical Baptist Christians, the ones we've known, I mean, they are very, their faith is very real to them, is what I would say.

That would make sense. I remember Richard Wurmbrand saying that when the Iron Curtain fell in Romania, all these Christians from the West were flooding in, they were going to teach the Romanian church. And he said, do you think someone that was in chains for 20 years and never denied Jesus might have something to teach the West? So how did you end up working with orphans? It was just the church that we ended up working with there. There was a group of people that was already doing work with orphans. Ukraine has a large orphan problem.

There was over 200,000 orphans in the system at that time when I moved there. So that just became something God put on our hearts. And then we have, now we have a church there. It's been there eight and a half years, Church of Truth and True Hope organization. And the church was started to really reach the orphans because they're still stereotyped and mistreated, you know, by many others and never felt comfortable going to some other churches.

So we wanted to make a place where they felt they had a family and that they were at home and they were not going to be treated any differently than anyone else. So after 18 years now, you've seen many of them grow up and get on with life. Are you seeing transformation? Yes, we do see lots of transformation. You know, we have good stories and we have bad stories. Of course. You know, we have kids who are on drugs and God has miraculously set them completely free overnight, waking up the next morning, zero drug addiction, zero desire to smoke or to drink, all of it broken off of their lives overnight.

You know, some of our ministers are, they grew up in the orphanages and they remember us from when they were 10 years old and they're in their late 20s now and they come alongside of us and help us with our ministry and it's just, yeah, it's great to see what God is doing in these lives. Excellent. Excellent. All right.

I just wanted to get the personal background and paint a little bit of a picture there. So we interacted via email about these points, but I'd like to do it on the air now. And again, you always have to ask, okay, am I getting accurate news?

Right. And often in America, if I see the same things being reported in a very liberal left wing web website, a very right wing conservative website, websites in between, and they're all saying the same thing. That tends to be a bit more confident that things are accurate than if I'm seeing it in world news, you know, saying the same thing in Israel, saying the same thing in England and a few others like, okay, this could really be, you know, the same story here being reported because otherwise you just don't know how much bias there is. So here's a Christian brother in Russia, and he was responding to the show last week where I had Fred Merkert on with me.

He's ministered in 150 nations, used to be the international director for youth with a mission, and he was bringing some of his perspective. And I asked, is some of Putin's desire, some type of megalomaniac driven desire to reconstitute the former Soviet Union, something like this. So he wrote to me, first, I'd like to say that Putin is not pursuing the reestablishment of the Soviet Union. These are not the sentiments in Russia at all.

When asked many times about it, he always said no. And moreover, it's not even feasible since ex-Soviet countries are already different economically and in their mindset. All Putin wants is good relationships with them economically and militarily, totally respecting their independence. I wouldn't say his actions are megalomania driven either. He very well knows from his own experience what terroristic threat to the nation is.

So his foreign policy is simply national defense oriented. So what's your take on that? I mean, when Ukraine first started just making steps to try and have better economic relations with Europe, not saying that we didn't want to still have economic relations with Russia, even at that moment, it was already like, no, they were interfering with our politics. That's when some of those revolutions started happening.

That's when some of the fighting started happening because it was just like, no, absolutely cannot be Western thinking in any way because that's too much of a spread. So it's, you know, they still just want to be the ones controlling Ukraine. That's what it's always been for us is if we make any step away from their control, then they do everything they can to stop us. And so this is something that you have seen then for 18 years and that the man or woman on the street would confirm in terms of this is the reality in Ukraine? Oh, yeah, definitely. They all would say that any Yeah, if we don't have a Kremlin backed authority, then they're, they're gonna not be okay with that.

They're not going to just let it slide. Right. Again, that's been my understanding and just want to confirm from within your borders there. And the brother who wrote wrote with a great heart, great spirit, humble, loving Russia, loving people of Ukraine, and not not writing to correct me, but just saying, Hey, there's there's another perspective here. So I wanted to challenge that perspective and said, perhaps that's what you're being told within Russia, but the rest of the world and the people of Ukraine don't see it like that either. So he did agree that that Russia does not want Ukraine to come into NATO, because that would be saying, okay, all the neighboring countries or virtually all the neighboring countries are in NATO, and that would be threatening to Putin. Does Putin have any reason to feel threatened from the neighboring countries?

I mean, if we were able to be more democratic and more part of the European Union, I don't. We have no ill will against Russia. Most Ukrainians have family in Russia, you know, so it's not like we want to turn on our brothers and sisters and hurt them. But we want still just the ability to live with what is left our country, Ukraine, you know, and that it's no, I don't think he would have we wouldn't be a threat to Russia. They're way bigger and way stronger than Ukraine is.

We know that. And what's Ukraine's current situation with with nuclear weapons? Were those all turned over years back in a peace treaty? Yes. When Ukraine became a free nation, that was that was one of the agreements we had to surrender all of our nuclear weapons. Right.

So the idea, then, that if Ukraine came into NATO, that there would be nuclear weapons right next to Russia, it wouldn't be Ukraine's would have to be somebody else's then theoretically. Got it. Yes. Got it. All right. We come back.

I want to go through a few more of these points. But then I want you to paint your picture for me as best as you know it to what life is like right now for the people in Ukraine. In fact, we're going to start there. What what is the level of suffering? What else can be done aside from pray, praying and and how America, the rest of the world look to Ukraine right now?

Does it feel as if we've abandoned them in the midst of a real crisis from what appears to be a tyrannical move from Russia with all of its power? We'll be right back. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the line of fire by calling 866 three for truth.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks, friends, for joining us. Those watching may notice on my studio desk a copy of the silencing of the lambs just came in. And for all who preordered the signed numbers, copies, sign them all. We're getting them right out. We did this already today.

Our team jumped right on it. We've got videos about this on Facebook and on Instagram. And tomorrow the book goes live.

So if you ordered preordered somewhere, the audio book or the e-book, you'll have those waiting for you. So check it out. Silencing lives. Oh, tomorrow I'll let you know how you can overcome this attempt to silence us.

Silence our voices. OK, I want to go back to our focus on Ukraine right now with Leanne Peterson, who has served as a fire international ministry there for 18 years and really looks at Ukraine as her home. How bad are things nationally right now for the Ukrainian people? Is it just key cities or is the whole nation feeling the power of this invasion? The entire nation is feeling the power of this invasion. I mean, just as we speak right now, I was getting messages from my home city. It's the first night we've had air raid sirens going off there.

So they're asking to pray for the safety of Krivor rogue. But right. Kiev is definitely affected in the east. There's definitely some cities affected in the south. There is a lot of fighting going on. And that first morning, I mean, in my city, too, there was military bases bombed everywhere.

We had a bombing that morning as well, just outside of our city. So, I mean, the pressure is really intense right now. And that is especially what is hard for our believers and our pastors and our leaders, because so many are fleeing. I mean, there was, you know, one day there was no food at the grocery store, but now there's food back on the shelves again, thankfully. But there's no cash.

The gas is running low. Like for my personal life and my church, many of us have young families there and there's a lot of young kids. And that's where they're struggling. Do we try and leave? Do we try and escape or do we stay? And I mean, right now, if your family was to leave, the men have to stay behind because all men of fighting age are not allowed to leave Ukraine.

So it'd be sending women and children to the West, trying to get them out into Europe. And so, I mean, it's definitely. You can just, talking with all of my friends and my church, I just see they are sending them food, but you can tell that there is a toll, there is a price being paid, and it's wearing them down a bit.

But they're doing the best they can. Our church is there. We have tons of supplies ready. We've already housed refugees from the East. We've housed refugees from Kiev. And we're just there ready to help in any way that we can. And you were booking your tickets to fly back knowing that war was potentially imminent.

Why was that? Well, I mean, my life is invested there. These are my people now. God has given this heart, a heart for this nation. And that's, you know, so many people here keep telling me they're so happy that I'm here and I'm safe. And I'm like, yes, I appreciate that, but my heart is there. And if there is any way I could be helping my Ukrainians, that's the place where I would rather be.

But God has stopped me for now. So I'm here in America. Yeah, well, I'm glad you're safe, but I'm eager with you to see you back there with your spiritual family and what has been home for you these last 18 years. And you're an American and at heart Ukrainian as well by identification with the people. How do you feel about what America's done and not done so far?

I appreciate the support. You know, things being lit up with blue and yellow and, you know, Ukrainians, they feel that. They feel the prayers. I mean, definitely.

We have so many testimonies about rockets that have landed that haven't exploded. We know people are praying, you know, and that's why we see things. But at the same time, they say, can you do anything more? Because, you know, we're we obviously cannot hold this off forever on our own. And just recently, Biden offered our President Zelensky a ticket out and he said, no, I don't need a ticket. What I need is help and ammunition. You know, he's staying right there in the middle of the fight.

He's not leaving Kyiv. And yeah, we're just we do we need more physical help. That's for sure.

Yeah. And that probably is the single line that has been the most repeated. I don't need a ride. I need ammo. And I'm not fleeing.

I'm staying and fighting. And obviously the world has now taken note of this man that was a comedian, Jewish comedian that ends up unexpectedly the president now is becoming an international hero. And the people of Ukraine holding off Russia this long has been a surprise to many as well. So let me get back to this perspective from Russia. This dear brother writes, since Ukraine has been heavily pumped with arms for the last few months by U.S. and NATO, Putin's goal with the recent intrusion is to demilitarize and denazify Ukraine. Otherwise, there's a real threat to Russia's very existence. The targets of Russian troops in Ukraine now are exclusively military facilities and disarming nationalistic groups with strong Nazi ideology, which have been tormenting Ukraine, killing people and committing various kinds of atrocities with impunity since 2014, the Odessa massacre being one of them. When Ukraine government was forcefully taken over with their strong support backed by U.S. and European governments. In fact, when that happened, the Republic of Crimea in 2014 didn't want the nationalist rule over it. That's why it decided to vote for joining Russia, which it did with Russian troops protecting the citizens from nationalists while the vote voting was taking place.

There's a whole lot in there. It seems quite outrageous to me. What's your take? To me, that just sounds like the Russian propaganda machine doing its job helping Russians believe these lies. In Crimea, for instance, all the information we saw about that vote to become part of Russia was already – all the ballots were pre-marked.

Yes, we have many people who told us they went to vote and it didn't matter because the vote was already done for them. That is why after Crimea was annexed, over 2 million citizens left Crimea to come to mainland Ukraine because they did not want to be part of Russia. Sure, there were some Russians there that would have Russian ties, but I can't say it's the majority of Crimea that wanted to become part of Russia.

It would have been denazifying Ukraine. He must be referring to the fact that people stood up for their rights and protested illegal elections or those types of things, but that's just people standing up for what they believe in. That's not Nazism. That's saying we have rights as citizens not to be lied to and not to – we have a right to vote and for our vote to count for something and not just be bought. You have neo-Nazi groups or outright Nazi groups in Ukraine like you do in America.

From my understanding, these are marginal and marginalized groups. If the country is so heavily Nazified, why on earth did it elect Zelensky, a Jewish man, as president? This is completely unprecedented. If you take this whole denazify thing – and that's been one of the greatest outrage. I've been reading reports from Israel and stuff like that, that that word is being used because it's obviously such a dirty word in Russia because of the war that ended up between Germany and Russia and World War II, so costly between them. But is there this hyper-nationalism that is actually Nazi-oriented, that's tremendously influential in Ukraine, and that has Zelensky in its back pocket?

No. I can't see any evidence of that happening. The only thing that this war, which started in 2014, has happened is that it's brought more unity to Ukrainians. They value their country and their nationality more, and they love their country more than they ever have. They realize they want to be farther away from Russia and its values. That's the only thing that has happened. They're still loving of other countries and loving of other people.

It's not that they're being exclusive from anyone else. Electing Zelensky, that was the highest voter turnout they'd ever had, and he won by over 70% of the vote. He was the chosen people of the Ukrainian people, overwhelmingly. Did you know of him before this as a foul-mouthed comedian playing a Jewish teacher on TV? Were you aware of who he was?

Yes. He's also from my home city, so I do know about him and his comedy. I had seen some clips here and there of things that he had done.

I had known who he was, yes. When he said he was running for president, did people take it seriously? Because he made this TV show, and in the TV show he showed what he would basically do as president, it was kind of his platform, basically, with humor in it. People had already been watching this and loving it and being like, we need a president like that, one who will stop corruption and one who will work on the roads and do all these things.

And so when he said he was running, I think, no, people thought, okay, he's serious because he just kind of told us what he wants to do in this TV show. And why do you think he won when the ultimate election came after runoffs or whatever first came? Why did he get 70% of the vote? What was it, positive about him or negative about the others? Well, negative about the others was people were, Ukrainians are sick of corruption. And so since there was so much in his speech about anti-corruption, I think that was very attractive to most Ukrainians. And they were hoping that since this guy was not a politician, maybe he could do things that other presidents had not done for us.

And I would have to say he has done a lot. The status of the roads in the last two years in Ukraine are unbelievable. I mean, he has redone all of the major highways.

They were so bad. I mean, it's just pothole from pothole to pothole. My car, I had 12 years, I had to change the shocks three times because the roads are terrible. And he, in two years, got all these roads fixed, you know? And my dealings with the government officials, when I turn in paperwork, I don't have to worry about paying bribes anymore because I can just pay to set government fee and get my things done. So, you know, there's definite changes happening.

Amazing. And I remember just chatting with you about bribery and what you had, you get stopped by police, you get this and that, everyone's expecting a bribe. And, you know, it's much more common in other countries than we're used to in America, where we still have issues. But in any case, you know, there are more specifics we could get into. And I'll shoot a note back to this brother from Russia. He deserves to hear that, some of our email interaction. But we appreciate you there. We appreciate your heart. We appreciate your service. Can't wait for the door to open up for you to go back to a free Ukraine and keep ministering there. So thanks so much for joining us today. Yeah, thank you.

All right. So, friends, if you want to support Leanne, you mustn't expect me to mention this, go to fire-international.org. Leanne Peterson, you can stand with her ministering to needy, hurting people in Ukraine.

And let's pray, God, your best for the people of Ukraine, the people of Russia, the people of Europe, in Jesus' name. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the line of fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks so much for joining us.

Here's the number to call, 866-34-TRUTH. We've been focused on Russia and Ukraine. Now we're switching back to America. Let me give you a special announcement. Tomorrow, grabbing something here for those watching, it is the latest book. My latest book has just arrived.

I have been counting the days for this to come in. The Silencing of the Lambs, the Ominous Rise of Cancel Culture and How We Can Overcome It. This will put in your hands practical strategies, things you can do as an individual, as a student in school, as a pastor preaching from the pulpit, as parents, as business people, as churches, steps you can take to make a lasting difference and to overcome this attempt to silence us. You'll find it eye opening.

Then you'll find it inspiring, practical, edifying, encouraging. So we just signed the first preordered copies. We're getting them right out to you. So those are on their way to you any moment out of our office coming your way. So really excited about that. Tomorrow, I'm going to take you into the book, not to say, oh, here's about my book, but to really give you as much content as I can over the year, to give you as much meat as I can over the year, and then to give you as much inspiration and practical instruction as I can over the year. And then Wednesday, we'll be playing a very, very special interview different than anything I've ever done on Light on Fire, someone that I've come to known as Kelly. The world knows Scott as a female to male transgender shouting at the top of her lungs.

We must do something to stop the abuse of children through transitioning through puberty blockers, through various drugs, through surgeries, through the ideology that they're being taught. This is not someone who's a born again Bible thumping Christian. Quite the contrary. When we talked before the show, I said, remember, no profanity. She actually had a profanity. But like, I want to say so.

Just squeeze that. And then she began to post this. And by the way, not at all offended by me referring to her as Kelly. It's not being insensitive in any way.

And she began to post, we're going to be having this discussion and so on and said, OK, we made a deal on the show that she won't use profanity. I won't speak in tongues. I mean, we're talking about a smile, of course, that was done.

Very, very different ideologies. But friends, this is going to be an eye opener. Trust me on this. I don't really hype something like this in advance. Trust me on it, because it's not hype. OK. Are you ready for a little controversy here?

You ready? 866-34-TRUTH. So former Attorney General Bill Barr, whom I really appreciated while he served under Trump, who seemed to me to be a no nonsense guy, who seemed to have many strong Christian values. His speech at Notre Dame about religious freedoms was very, very important. And one of my friends said, man, my age, he said, when I grew up, I want to be like Bill Barr. Just talking about, wow, he's been so rock solid and so steady now would be looked at as an enemy of President Trump. And he has a new book about to come out. I'll slightly modify the title to make it more acceptable on national Christian radio.

One darn thing after. So just a slight modification of the D word there and according to to Barr. And he said this before the election was not stolen. Trump lost it. And then he says that that he believes the former president would have been reelected by, quote, moderating even a little of his pettiness. And he urges the GOP to move away from Trump and, quote, his erratic personal behavior ahead of the twenty twenty four election season. Now, CPAC, which is a very, very large conservative political conference and organization.

They just had their recent conference. Trump spoke. Senator Cruz spoke. Governor DeSantis spoke.

Some of the big heavy hitters. And a straw poll was taken among those there as to who they want to be the Republican candidate in twenty twenty four. And Trump came in first overwhelmingly, even got more percentage this time than what was it a year ago. I think fifty nine percent now. Now, DeSantis was a very solid second. What in the high 20s?

I mean, others didn't even crack two percent. So here's my question for you. Regardless of whether you're Republican or Democrat, conservative, liberal, regardless of how you voted in twenty twenty, I want to know your opinion. Now, in particular, if you did vote for Trump, I'd like to hear from you or you do consider yourself a political conservative or you vote Republican in particular. I'd like to hear from you.

Do you agree with Barr that the Republican Party needs to look for another candidate other than Donald Trump? That whatever the benefits are, that the costs are too high. That when you when you weigh the good versus the bad, that there's a lot of good and we know what to expect in many ways that would be important and we would find valuable and positive. But the bad, the negative ultimately outweighs it. The collateral damage here.

Let's paint a picture for you. Let's let's say your your husband, your wife is calls your out of state. She calls in, honey, I'm really sick. I got to get to the hospital now that I've been trying to call 911.

I can't get through. You say, OK, well, hang on. I I got a friend, you know, a friend who lives down the block. I'm going to call him. He's like he's a NASCAR driver. And if anyone gets you there quickly, he can get you there quickly. Well, he does. You know, it's an emergency and you get this guy and he gets you there quicker than anybody. But along the way, he he kills two civilians and and crashes into another car and badly interests three children. But he gets you there. OK, you care about your wife. It's life and death.

You wanted to get there, but at what price? So that would be the question for us as followers of Jesus. And this is very, very fresh news.

This is all fresh news within the last two days as followers of Jesus. Can we say, well, we voted for him and we voted for his policies and we don't like a lot of his behavior and the erratic nature of his behavior. But that's not who we have to be. We can be godly. We can set good examples. We can be careful in our speech. We can we can do the right thing and love our neighbor. And so, yeah, we voted from just for the policies and all this other stuff we don't like.

But watch us live as followers of Jesus. Or was it that we so identified with him and so defended him and became so known as the Trump people that it hurt our witness? And even though he did a lot of good Supreme Court appointees standing with Israel, fighting for religious freedom, standing up to international terrorism, these are big things. And maybe this is obviously totally open for debate. There could be very different perspectives on this. But maybe if he was president today, Russia would not have invaded Ukraine.

And perhaps if China is getting ready to try to take over Taiwan, China might not have thought of that if Trump was. I mean, these are big, massive humanitarian issues that affect potentially hundreds of billions of lives. But if the church in America compromises its witness and that further leads to the deterioration of the gospel in our country and the deterioration of the nation as a whole, then that's of even greater consequence than the good that would be done. And these are just questions to put out. And what about the degree that the example of Trump trickled down?

Now, these are questions you may flatly disagree with me. What about the degree that the example of Trump trickled down and in many ways polluted much of the church? As I've often said, when you go to our social media sites, we sound just like the world. Now, we did before.

I've been grieving over this for years and years. It's not that I'm perfect, OK? But there are things that are clearly wrong that we can address. And for the most part, when you go to our social media pages, maybe we don't have as much blatant sexual content, certainly hope not.

Maybe we don't use as much profanity as the world, hopefully. That's not the biggest issue in the world, but hopefully our speech is more careful. But our attitudes, the sharing of misinformation, freely slandering, attacking one another to the point that we're not known for our love one for another, but for our hate or mistreatment, our anger towards one another and against one another, was the negative example of Trump in the White House just who he was bringing constant controversy, conflict. I mean, there was hardly a resting moment. And the idea was that if there wasn't a conflict, the president would start one. Just kind of the way he operated was.

Was that not worth all the good? Or you'd say, hey, those are our choices then. But now we have a fresh slate. Let's get a different candidate for 2024. So what's your take?

866-348-7884. Do you agree with Bill Barr, even if you don't agree with other points that he's made? Do you agree with him that it would be better to move on, especially if you voted for Trump the first time around or you consider yourself a conservative Republican? I'd love to get your take. And by the way, the reason I'm asking for your input is not so we can have an echo chamber here. The last thing that I desire is for you to call in and just say, OK, we agree with you on this.

In fact, I've just given you different points of view. Yes, I agree with Bill Barr, by the way, on this. I agree that if Trump had just been more of a decent human being leading up to 2020, that he would have been reelected as to whether the elections were stolen. My position has always been that if they were stolen, that the court system would reveal it, that the truth would come to light with that not happening.

I have a giant question mark as to whether they were stolen or not. But either way, that doesn't affect my point of view, because I believe with all the prayer that went into this, that we can say whether the election was stolen or not, that God put Joe Biden in the White House, not Donald Trump. And yes, that's actually him. It's not a shapeshifter and all the other nonsense that I've heard over the months.

And nor is it an actor. I believe God put Joe Biden in office. I believe that as much as I believe God put Trump in office in 2016.

That was so unexpected and so out of the blue. I believe God did that. You might say, well, everyone who is in office is put there.

Fair enough. You could believe that. But I believe that there was an unusual degree of sovereignty in bringing Trump into office in 2016. And I believe God very specifically appointed Biden in 2020. Now, was that judgment? Was that was it just people voted this way?

Whatever. You could argue that. But from my perspective, I absolutely say that surely is God put Trump in office in 2016. God put Biden in office in 2020. Was it blessing? Was it judgment both ways?

All subjects we can discuss. But I agree with Barr. I believe if Trump had just been a decent human being, he would have been easily reelected in a way that couldn't have been stolen in 2020. And on top of that, I do believe that we can do much better with another candidate, that there are people out there that will hold to godly values.

They'll be good, strong leaders for all of America that would do better than Trump without the baggage. Either way, it's just the president, not the savior, not God. That's about you.

Feel free to differ or to agree or have another position entirely. We'll be right back. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the line of fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks for joining us on the line of fire. 866-34-TRUTH. Friends, every week we dig into the scriptures. Every week we take your questions on a wide range of subjects. Every week we catch up on Israel and Jewish related subjects. And every week we look at what's happening at the world and the world around us and we do our best to serve as your voice for moral sanity and spiritual clarity. So in the midst of all the craziness, you can get your bearings here. You can kind of clear your head.

You can get your faith strengthened and then you go out in your world and shine like a bright light. It's Jesus in us. If he can use me, he can use you. If he can use you, he can use me.

If he can use us, he can use anyone to make a difference. All right. I'm going to get some of your comments here. Again, there is no right or wrong answer. Okay, in God's sight, there may be. But on the show right now, we're just talking. We're just sharing our views.

We'll start with Brett over in Asbury Park, New Jersey. Thanks for calling the line of fire. Hi, Dr. Brown. Thank you so much for taking my call and thank you for discussing this subject today. It's also something that grieves my heart.

I am a lover of Jesus. I have a YouTube channel focused on ministry and equipping people, especially with the gift of the Spirit. And it's something that I've talked a lot about with a lot of the people that tune into my channel over the last couple of years, because I've noticed that there has erupted almost this pent-up anger and frustration amongst a lot of my brothers and sisters. After Biden got elected, I noticed that it was almost like this just rage that this couldn't have been an accurate election.

It had to be stolen, and there was so much stuff that were not fruit of the Spirit that seemed to erupt in people that kind of threw me for a loop. And it makes me sad, because especially I follow a lot of different teachers in the body of Christ that have, for years, preached hardcore truths about the faith and principles of integrity and truth. And yet, when it came to Trump, I felt like so many people that I looked up to sort of compromised their values to follow after a candidate that looked very Christian and sort of promoting the ideals of the Christian faith, and yet personally lived so many things contrary, it seems, that it just leaves me confused.

And it's like, I don't know where we go from here, you know? Yeah, well, obviously what we have to do is recognize that many of us did get off track in our emphasis. It's not blaming Trump.

Trump's who he is. I'm responsible for my actions, and Christian leaders are responsible for their actions, attitudes. But we first have to recognize that we got off track. I'm just talking about my brand-new book, Solacing the Lambs, but the book coming out in September is called The Political Seduction of the Church, how millions of Americans confuse politics with the gospel. So somehow, this thing became like the gospel issue for us and Trump's re-election, the faith issue. For many, obviously many didn't vote for him, but many who did, as if the fate of the nation depended on him being re-elected and our freedoms and the state of the gospel depended on it, and then with it, that anger. So we got in the flesh, and we have to recognize that we did. We have to humble ourselves before the Lord and recognize that we got off track somehow, that we got way too politicized.

I'm not only saying that Trump voters got way too politicized. I believe the church as a whole got caught up in that. So we have to recognize that and then major on the majors again. It's like anything in life, if you major on the majors, put the first things first in terms of relationship with God, loving God, loving your neighbor, great commission, making disciples, a lot of other things fall into place. Right. Well, and I appreciate that, and you know, what I go back to myself personally is that I look at other major nations, like Iran or North Korea, and I see that, you know, their governments are partly ever in alignment with the Christian faith, and yet some of those churches are flourishing greater than anywhere in the world.

So that's what I go back to is, you know what? I don't need a president that aligns with my faith or even a president that aligns with any kind of Christian value for me to know that I can function as a Christian following the will of God. Yeah, and the challenge, the paradox, is that it's good to have freedoms. I'm glad that I'm not being tortured in a prison right now.

I'm glad I can go home and lay in my own bed next to my wife and talk, as opposed to we haven't seen each other in 20 years, or our kids were taken away from us when they were little. I appreciate the freedoms we have in America, but we also know, as you said, that often the churches that are growing the most, thriving the most are the ones under persecution, that are enduring hardship, that don't have freedoms. So we say, OK, for the good of the nation as a whole, these are good principles. Biblical values are good values that will help for the nation as a whole. And if we can have freedom, great.

But we must preserve it diligently, because our great issue in America has not been so much over the years lack of freedom, but too much stuff that has taken our eyes off the gospel. Hey, thanks for weighing in. I appreciate it. Let's go over to... All right, we lost Jamie.

Let's go to Deborah in Raleigh, North Carolina. Thanks for calling the line of fire. Hey, Dr. Brown, thanks for your show and thanks for having me on.

Sure. I would just like to say, if we had a real media right about now, I would love to see Trump reelected, but he's just going to be harassed and distracted just like before. I really appreciate all the things that he accomplished. I'm so thankful for the things that he did for the black community, for Christians, for Israel, particularly for the unborn.

But I just feel like they just gave him such a hard time every step of the way and that it could only get worse at this point. So that's quite an interesting observation. And of course, some of the prison reform, helping historic black colleges, other things economically that many black leaders felt were helpful for their community. That's another factor. Again, those are humanitarian issues of concern to all of us in America. But let's paint a different picture. There's no question that there is extreme hostility towards Donald Trump from the secular media and the left leaning media.

In fact, that's what you got day and night, day and night. Even the whole thing, Trump derangement syndrome. That's that's all some could talk about. What if Trump so, yes, next time around, could we expect it to be even worse? Yeah, that would be the ultimate outrage. We didn't get rid of him. We tried to impeach him twice.

We tried to defame him and that was back. That would be the ultimate nightmare. What if he was a different kind of person and just didn't respond, didn't get in the trenches and in the dirt and started throwing his own dirt back at them and just tried to govern? Would that make a difference or you feel he'd still be hindered?

I feel he would still be hindered personally. He's who he is. But what caught my attention way back is there's this guy who when he made a statement and they tried to twist it, he didn't back down. That got my attention. Yeah. I didn't know that much about him.

Maybe I should have. But when he stood up to whoever, I thought, you know what? That's what America needs. Yeah. And I think he's going to be Trump. I just think he is going to be Trump. And if they call him out, he's going to answer. Yeah.

Deborah, barring divine intervention in his life. Yeah, I expect Trump to be Trump. Thank you. And you're right. That's what a lot of Americans liked about him.

And by the way, I I liked it to a point. In other words, OK, you're Donald Trump. You get misrepresented. You're going to get right back up 10 seconds later and say, OK, here's what you said. Here's what you came at me with one fist.

I'm coming back at you with two. And it was going to be misrepresented. And I have to be a gentleman and be presidential. So I appreciated it to a point. But then when it got just as fleshly and carnal. And now to me, it's like, OK, you are the president. You have to get down in the mud and then get even lower and start calling people dogs.

And whoever it is that you don't like, you throw them under the bus. So that was the problem. But Deborah, appreciate a lot of what you had to say. A lot of a lot of insight there. OK. Let me step back and say this. I just want to make an appeal.

All right. There are a million other places. Literally, you could be listening.

You could be watching all kinds of other things you could be doing. But you have taken time to sit with me, which I appreciate. And trust me, I really, really pray for these broadcasts. I really, really pray for God to use us to be a blessing to you. It really, really matters to me and to our team that we're having a positive impact on you.

And I'm not about to give you a financial appeal. OK, where is he going with this? Because this is where I'm going. That there's a real stewardship we have in the Lord. There's a real entrustment that he's made with us. And again, anyone on the air, anyone preached beyond a pulpit, anyone with an audience, you have an entrustment. But I'm just saying, I take it really seriously before the Lord.

Even though it's every day, even though it's 13 years, it matters. Because we often talk about life and death issues. If I can help you, if I can bless you, if I can strengthen you, if I could give you perspective, if I can answer your questions, the emails we get from people who are losing their faith, we're getting disoriented and we help them back on track.

They mean the world to us because we want to see eternal good come out of these broadcasts. So I just want to make an appeal. I'm not trying to provoke controversy. I do not live by, oh, any attention is good attention. Let's get people talking and get them all worked up. Nothing of the sort from our end.

We don't do that. That's fleshly and carnal. I just want to make an appeal to you to ask yourself if in the 2020 elections, the time leading up to it, the time since, is it possible that you put too much emphasis on the elections? Is it possible that you put too much emphasis on who is going to be in the White House that was going to determine the fate of the country for the next hundred years or our religious freedoms forever or as if only one person could, quote, save America? Is it possible you get your heart into it too much? Your emotions into it too much?

Is it possible you even became worldly and carnal in your attitude? Just putting out questions. I want to be responsible before the Lord to ask these. Search your heart.

And if that's the case, ask the Lord to forgive you, to wash you clean from any defilement, and then to renew that first love for Him and then for your neighbor. Major on the majors. Keep the main thing the main thing and you'll be blessed. Back with you tomorrow. This is how we rise up. It's our resistance. You can't resist us. Another program powered by the Truth Network.