The Drive with Josh Graham - Panthers Get a Win

Attention, please. This is The Drive with Josh Graham Podcast. Tune into The Drive 3 until 6pm weekdays on the Sports Hub. I love it.

It's brilliant. The Carolina Panthers are in the win column, and Kyle Allen's getting all the credit today, it seems. However, that's not who I'd give the game ball to if it was me making the decision. Ron Rivera deserves the most credit for that win, not Kyle Allen. Like quarterback play, head coaches are often given too much of the credit for the wins.

They often get too much blame for the losses. But Riverboat Ron, he lived up to his nickname by sticking with Kyle Allen when it wasn't convenient to do so. He believed in him before Sunday, and I think he deserves most of the credit for that. He knew about Cam Newton's injury, according to the timeline he presented, right after the Panthers lost to the Bucs that Thursday night. Which means, if he thought there was a chance Cam wouldn't play against Arizona, what an opportunity to bring in a veteran quarterback.

Ten days to prepare versus the normal six? Maybe you could get somebody like a Robert Griffin III via trade, or Ryan Fitzpatrick, or a Colin Kaepernick as a free agent. Bring in one of those guys. I was one of them that fell victim to that, thinking Kyle Allen wasn't good enough and Carolina needed to bring in a veteran. Ron Rivera made guys like me look stupid yesterday, and reminded us all why he deserves the benefit of the doubt as a two-time NFL coach of the year. He knew Allen had the potential to have the performance he did yesterday.

In fact, the way that he spoke about it, he banked on it. Now, I'm giving Ron Rivera a lot of the credit, but in the interest of fairness, we were right to criticize it before, or at least be skeptical of it before, his belief in Allen. Because last year, Cam got hurt, and it wasn't Allen starting week 16 against the Falcons.

It was Taylor Heinecky. And when the deep ball was thrown in stretches when Cam clearly didn't have it, I think about the Giants game, most notably to set up a halftime field goal, it was Heinecky coming in, not Allen. So if Ron believed in him so much, why is Heinecky getting the start? Kyle Allen never sees the field in week 18 against the Saints, probably not against the Cardinals yesterday if Heinecky doesn't get hurt against Atlanta in week 17. So then Allen gets the start, and he's great against New Orleans. Then the offseason happens, and everyone's talking about Cam, and specifically what the Panthers are going to do behind Cam on the depth chart. Back-up quarterback became one of the primary concerns among Panthers fans, and the Panthers altogether. That's why you draft Will Greer in the third round. And if Carolina had it their way, Will Greer plays well enough, they don't need Kyle Allen on the roster. But Greer hadn't gotten to that point, Allen was better in preseason and in training camp, so Carolina decides to keep three quarterbacks. Ron deserves credit for that, keeping three quarterbacks, not signing a veteran when popular opinion last week was to do that. He stuck by Allen, and not only did that, he was unafraid to be aggressive with Allen. He threw on first down five of the six first downs of the game.

I think I said that right. Threw on first down five of the first six first downs Carolina had. He was throwing in a two-minute drill. Carolina didn't knee it out and just go to halftime. No, they were aggressive, and DJ Moore had the touchdown grab as a result. Ron leaned on him in adverse situations after the fumble and Arizona scoring.

He threw out of that. Scored a touchdown leading him down the field, Curtis Samuel getting into the end zone. Down early in the third quarter, continuing to go with Allen. Great coaches find a way to win that game. Cliff Kingsbury got fired in the Big 12 last year. Ron Rivera, a two-time coach of the year in the NFL.

This is a game. If Ron really is the guy, that's a game he wins, and he out-schemed Kingsbury. It was a must-win game for Carolina, and he pulled it off. But it's a day removed from Kyle Allen having this terrific effort.

Ron had a chance to evaluate the tape. Here's what he had to say about Kyle Allen's afternoon in Arizona. Well, I mean, it was really no different than what we saw last year against New Orleans, and that was he had good command of what we were doing. He spread the ball around, which, as you guys know, is something I really do like to see because, again, then you really can't focus in on one guy. Greg Olson played a huge part, helped settle down the young quarterback, getting himself open, presenting a good target, making good plays and catches. He almost made a spectacular one in the end zone early on, which would have been great, but he was there to help settle the guy down. What's your viewpoint on the Carolina Panthers quarterback situation? 336-777-1600 on Twitter, at SportsHub.

Try it if you want to chime in that way. The big news of the day, the Panthers are going to be without Cam Newton on Sunday. They officially ruled him out for the Texans game.

They want him to be 100 percent. Ian Rappaport was the first to break the news, and he said as well that it's a day-to-day situation versus a week-to-week, so Cam very well could return for the Jaguars game at home the following week. Ron said there's no timetable that he has for Cam Newton's return.

Smart move by Carolina. Figuring out who Cam is is far more important than a September win in Houston on the road or even the playoffs this year, because you're in a position next summer, you likely have to make a call. Is this somebody you're going to commit four years, $40 million or $30 million at least per year in each of those seasons for a quarterback who's going to be 32 beyond the end of his contract? Beyond his contract expiring, 32 years old moving forward, you need to see him at 100 percent to accurately gauge where he's at and see what he currently is.

No limitations. Kyle Allen bought you that time if you're Ron Rivera. So that's the big thing.

I think they're handling this about as well as you can. Also developing Kyle Allen a little bit, if the answer is grim and Cam cannot recapture his form for 2015 or can't be in a weak quarterback, it gets to the point where David Tepper and Ron don't want to pay him that amount of money moving forward. Well, you have Kyle Allen who can win games it seems like, has a good arm, and you drafted a quarterback in the third round. And we saw the Pittsburgh Steelers do that with Mason Rudolph, even though the Steelers lost to the 49ers, he showed a lot of good things yesterday. Carolina's developing the position, also they're pressing the right buttons with Cam and looking at things from a big picture perspective rather than trying to win a road game in September against the Texans.

You know who did win a road game in September yesterday? Daniel Jones did that. And I'm being told that Desmond put something together in honor of Daniel Jones. We have a direct line to Daniel Jones that we use on this show and we have another for Doc Rivers.

So Dez and Daniel Jones put something together which we're going to get to in just a second. But Chad is in Winston-Salem who wants to hand out a game ball yesterday for the Carolina Panthers win over the Arizona Cardinals. Chad, who does your game ball go out to? I got to hand out a secondary game ball besides Ron Rivera, which that was a good call on your part by the way, to one Dontae Jackson. That second interception, dude, when he baited, he was laying in the weeds and baited Kyler Murray to throw that ball and he jumped up 70 inches, that 70 inch vertical leap. Next year, Sharks will be watching Dontae Jackson week on the Discovery Channel.

Excellent work there. I didn't know if it was going to be a great game for Dontae Jackson when he missed a tackle, two tackles leading to a touchdown. He had that big leaning tackle that he had with the shoulder, same drive, two missed tackles as he tries to do it the same way. And in honor of the Redskins playing tonight, Dontae, he was going into the locker room yelling, you like that?

You like that? Big game for him. He's a big play guy. I'm kind of learning. He's not all about the little things. He's about the big stuff. I'm excited to hear what you just did here.

I haven't heard this yet. I don't know what Daniel Jones did for us the day after the big win for the Giants at Tampa, but let's find out together. Let this wash over you. Y'all thought Zion Williamson was going to be the only hot rookie from Duke University this year, huh? You ridiculed the New York football Giants for even picking me. Why'd y'all do that? Why'd y'all pick Daniel Jones of all the players number six overall? That made no sense.

You question my abilities, how I throw, how I pass, how I get dates on Tinder, how I test tomatoes at the Piggly Wiggly for freshness, how I prefer lemon pepper wings over garlic parm wings. No debate. I heard it. I heard it all. It almost made me cry.

Almost. You will not defeat me today, cruel world. I will defeat you. Even knowing I was coached by the quarterback whisperer himself, our lord and savior, David Cutcliffe, wasn't enough.

You still laughed at me. There's a new sheriff in town and he's taller, cuter and stronger than Eli Manning. He's taking a bite out of the Big Apple. It's a new day in New York. Brand new day. My time. It's my moment. The Daniel Jones era has begun. Wow. He was super excited to do that. Emboldened. Daniel Jones coming from just being the sheepish quarterback taking number six to being this swagger monster. He's going to be wearing he's going to be wearing fezzes and Cam Newton like hats and scarves, maybe short sleeve suits and short pants.

Jorts. The evolution of Daniel Jones. It's begun. Testing tomatoes at the Piggly Wiggly for freshness.

That's right. Who's been questioning how he gets dates on Tinder? What are you guys talking about? Talk.

Talk. You're on the drive with Josh Graham, the sports hub at AM 600 AM 920. All the on the left half. Fifty six yards to send it to overtime. Here's the snap ball down. It's another block field goal today. It is the app state of North Carolina.

Thirty four thirty one. That's Adam Witten's call. The voice of the mountaineers Saturday as Appalachian State gained its first power five win as an FBI school and the first since that historic win in Ann Arbor 12 years ago, beating the Michigan Wolverines were now being joined by Adam Witten hearing that call back. How would you rate your call one to ten?

I'll just I'll say this, Josh. I would rate the amount of nervous energy that exploded out of the mouth of me and Mackel fresh at like twenty seven. And you could hear it there. Both of us just screaming block and, you know, the sheer surprise and jubilation coming from that, you know, I don't know about it. I don't know about other app fans, but I never really felt like we were even though app was winning the entire game after they after they erased the early seven nothing deficit. I never really thought until the very end with with that call that that app was going to win the game because we've been mentioned of it so many times up until that that play that app had come so close and had their hearts broken in so many games over the last three years.

Tennessee, Wake Forest, Penn State. And, you know, I was just kind of thinking to myself, they get the ball with 30 seconds to go at their own 20 yard line, no time out. I said, of course, they're going to get in position to kick a 56 yard field goal and send it to overtime. And it's just going to draw out as long as it possibly has to.

So I don't know about the call, man, but I can just tell you can hear just all the nervous energy and anxiety. Just bursting out of us at the end there. Michigan. I think that game in 2007, it put Appalachian State on the map nationally. My viewpoint here with what Scott Satterfield built and really an unprecedented level of success from a team going from FCS to FBS, maintaining championship culture at the FBS level in the Sunbelt that they had previous at a lesser level of college football.

It's just such a remarkable feat. But this win here, I thought, validated App State as a legitimate FBS program that could come in and actually finish the job against a power five school when in past years they haven't been able to quite finish things out. Is there validation that comes along with this win in Chapel Hill, you think? I think so.

I think so. Because at the end of the day, I mean, we had heard it's been coming up to Saturday's game that App has had this reputation as a giant killer. And yes, they've gone toe to toe with some of the best teams in the country over the years. But the reality was they lost 11 straight games against power five schools and nothing since the Michigan game back in 2007. So, yeah, it is a little bit of validation to be able to say, we've been saying for a while now, we're as good as anybody in the state.

We can play with anybody. And we've proven it. We just haven't gotten the wins. But, you know, finally they were able to close one out. And what was interesting, Josh, is the narrative after the game, especially with some of the players, it was kind of a combination of, you know, beating an in-state opponent out of the ACC and be able to claim a little sliver of state or a big sliver of state bragging rights.

But then the other part of the narrative was being able to finish the job after coming so close. I mean, you heard from guys like Jordan Spair, who's a linebacker, some of the seniors on this team who, you know, experienced Tennessee, experienced Wake Forest, experienced Penn State. And they haven't had anything concrete to be able to show that, yes, they've won some ball championships and bowl games, but they haven't been able to beat any of the P5 teams or winning any of the games like this. And now they have something to show for all that hard work and that dedication and everything that people have been saying about them being, you know, one of those top flight programs in the state and the region.

And so, you know, it was just kind of interesting to see that narrative kind of going back and forth between those two pillars after the game on Saturday. The voice of the Mountaineers, Adam Whitten, is with us on Twitter at Adam B. Whitten. Listen to Mountaineer talk here on Sports on Triad tomorrow at 7 o'clock last week with the show and then everything leading up to the game and what you've dealt with after the kick was blocked and the Mountaineers ultimately won in Chapel Hill. Give me a sense for just how much this means to Appalachian State as somebody App State fans go to when it comes to just being the voice of the team.

What have you heard? Yeah, it's just great. I mean, whether you're a player, a coach, a staff member, a broadcaster, a fan, you know, whatever your stake is with this program, it really kind of came to fruition. The effects of winning this game and what it means around the state and around these communities, it comes to fruition Sunday morning. You know, people going to church with their App State polos on and getting comments.

I went in earlier this morning to pick up some bagels for the family or Sunday morning to pick up some bagels for the family. I was wearing an App State hat. You know, I had people say, hey, congrats, congrats. And they just want to talk about the game and what it meant and how cool it was. And so that happened a lot on Sunday. And then the real payoff, I think, is for a lot of people going into the office this morning. I mean, you know, I dropped my son off at school this morning wearing my App State polo and some other people are wearing their polos and everyone just wants to talk about Saturday and how cool it was. And then when people get into the office today, they're taking shots at their Carolina comrades and they're celebrating with their App State peers. And that's really where this thing has really paid off. It's a different dynamic than some of the other things. When you beat an in-state opponent and you work with people and, you know, people that are fans or alums of the team that you beat, they're all in your circle because you live in this state.

That's what's really cool about it. Give me a sense. Did you celebrate at all Saturday night this week? You know, I'll be honest, I didn't celebrate a ton. It was it's an exhausting day.

I mean, you guys, you know, you guys are a great affiliate of ours. And so, you know, you carry the entire two-hour pregame show. We were on the postgame show for over an hour. So it was a long, exhausting, draining day.

We were up and at it early Saturday morning. And so when the game was over, we just kind of stood there and looked out at the state, the empty stadium with the lights on before we left. I drove back to my home after the game was over. You know, I was able to kind of see my wife, who I hadn't seen since Friday. And we were just kind of going over the game and talking about it because they were there in attendance. She brought my kids there to it.

And so we were all there in Chapel Hill, just not all together. So it was my first chance to really talk to her about the game. But, man, I sat down and just poured myself a Yosef Golden Ale and, you know, just kind of went through. And I was able to respond to, you know, a bunch of text messages and tweets and things like that that people had sent after the game was over. And so that was my opportunity to really kind of decompress on the couch, watch some of the late college football games, and kind of relive it all a little bit in my mind, talking to people about it. So I didn't celebrate a whole lot. I was pretty tired, but I was still able to kind of relive it my own way.

Drinking Yosef, staying on brand. Adam, thank you for spending time with us. It was a great call, a great game, and we look forward to the next game as Appalachian State receives AP top 25 votes.

Who knows? Maybe it'll be in the top 25 pretty soon. Thanks for doing this. Thanks, guys. Appreciate it.

Got it. That's Adam Whitten on Twitter. Adam B. Whitten, listen to Mountaineer talk tomorrow.

He is right. It is a tiring day. I showed up at the stadium around 2.45, 3 o'clock, and Adam, Molly, and the gang gets on the air. They get on the air at 1.30, two hours before kick. And there's like a clear window separating the broadcast booth and where I was sitting in the conventional press box, the general press box. I looked to my left, and you could just hear through the glass. I was sitting close enough to the glass how excited Adam and them were at that call right there at the end. In fact, I want to hear it one more time because I really do feel like it was a callback to the Michigan game in 2007. Once again, here was the call of Adam Whitten from Adam Whitten as App State beat North Carolina on Saturday. Ball will be on the left hash.

56 yards to send it to overtime. Here's the snap. Ball down. It's blocked!

It's blocked! They did it! App State wins it on another blocked field goal.

Today it is the App State of North Carolina. 34-31. The Mountaineers beat the Tar Heels today. Voice cracking, color analyst jumping all over the play-by-play man. Blocked kick to close things out.

Desmond? Where have I heard that before? 37 yard field goal. This is it. This is it right here. It's already. The snap's good.

The whole thing. Blocked! The kick is blocked! The Mountaineers are going to try to take it by the lead to the big house.

30, 20, 15, 10. The Mountaineers have just beaten the Michigan Wolverines. The Mountaineers of Appalachian State have just beaten the Michigan Wolverines in the big house.

Okay. Not nearly as egregious of the color analyst jumping all over the play-by-play guy's call. But still, it only seems fitting that the first FBS power five win App State gets since, the first power five win since the Michigan game, it comes on a blocked kick, and the color analyst making his presence note. I never had an issue with the color commentator doing that kind of thing, because I used to do color commentary, until I started doing play-by-play. And now I hear it in a different, like... It bothers me every time. Yeah.

I mean, it's one of those things. Now, granted, the Michigan one, I get it. Michigan was number five in the country. You were at Michigan. A hundred thousand people are cheering against you. This game is just as big, North Carolina.

To the people here in the state, like nationally speaking, it isn't. But what makes college football special? I often get this question from people who say, why do you like college football as much as the NFL, or more than the NFL? There is no equivalent to what App State did to North Carolina in the National Football League.

What is that equivalent? Not playing a team for 79 years, and then beating them, and having your first Power Five win in 12 years. Going to church, as he mentioned, and seeing someone with North Carolina gear on, or someone you know to be a North Carolina fan, or whether you're going to a water cooler at work today as an App State fan. That amount of trash talk, it doesn't matter for the NFL. You could say, oh man, the Redskins and Cowboys, it's the same deal. Uh-uh, you play again six weeks later.

Seventy-nine bleeping years! There's no equivalent. I want to know what church this is where you can wear Carolina gear to it. Like, what is up with that?

What do you mean? That's foreign to me. You can wear Carolina gear to church?

Yeah, why not? I'm sensing a cultural divide here. Yeah. I've gone to a non-denominational church my entire life, and yeah, they don't mind if you wear polo and jeans. Really?

Yeah. It's not really like they had a black church. I've been to black churches before, and I wore polos. I would love to see that. I would love to see you at a black church.

Tell me when. That would be a great thing. I don't go to church anymore, but yeah, that would be great.

That would be a fantastic thing that's just a video tape. I'll be soulful. I'll be clapping. I wore Jersey once as a kid to church. It didn't go well for me.

No, it never goes well. Polos and jeans. You wore a jersey to black church? Oh, yeah. It was a throwback, too. Is it okay for me to call it black church?

It sounds great to me. That's what it was. Black church. I'm sweating right now. That was the minute when you said it. I was like, wait, what? You can wear Carolina gear to church? Yeah.

Sorcery is this. That's crazy. It was a Rams Eric Dickerson jersey. What? When did you realize it wasn't okay? We had what they call the Ursher's, the Ursher's, the black church coming over to me, just frowning in displeasure. Just not pleased. Did that skirt you out? No, I mean, it was a church we grew up in, so we all knew.

It was like a little family, so got chastised a little bit. We've learned a lot over the last few minutes. You are listening to WSJS Winston-Salem, WCOG Greensboro, WPCM Burlington, WMFR High Point. All of those signals together with sportsubtryout.com and the app make up sportsubtryout. It's the time of the week where we get the hot takes and hot takes only. Let's get crazy.

Your calls are welcome at 336-777-1600. Mac Brown, North Carolina head football coach, will join us next hour. There's a lot to get to in college and in the NFL, so let's waste no time. Let's get crazy. Let's get crazy.

The rules are simple. Hot takes only, Desmond. Goes for the callers too. If the take is hot, you will be rewarded with this sound. I've been in here. It is the smelling salt of radio.

It just wakes me up and gets me ready to go. I've been in here spitting hot fire like Dylon for the past month. It's been two weeks. It's been a month. It's been four weeks. I've been keeping count.

But then for a much longer stretch, about six or seven months, you didn't know what this segment was. You were pretty bad at this. I'm just saying the larger sample size says you're not that good at this. I corrected it. I corrected myself.

Ah, there was a market inefficiency. I got you. Yes. So hot takes only. If they're not hot enough, we'll let you know. Dez always thinks his takes are really hot because it comes out of his head and he's the one in control of the button and the air horn. And that's made apparently obvious when he's the one hitting the takes.

336-777-1600. I'll get us started. The Emmys were last night. Not sure if you noticed. Bill Hader, a big hit at the Emmys with Barry, which I enjoy a lot. It had me thinking, I love SNL.

SNL season's getting ready to start pretty soon. Bill Hader is the best SNL character of the century. The best SNL cast member of the century, Bill Hader. Give me him over Tina Fey, over Seth Meyers, over Kristen Wiig. He's got the best impressions. He has my favorite characters. Bill Hader, the best SNL cast member of the century.

Wow, bro. Who would you put up against it? Probably Kristen Wiig, but hey, man. I think Bill Hader has better characters. I'm not here to judge your opinions. Oh, I know.

I'm just trying to get to the other side of it, though. Kristen Wiig, I understand it, but Bill Hader, I think Stefan? All the impressions that he does? Do you count Will Ferrell, or would he be 90s? It's such a mix, so it's hard for me to say Will Ferrell. Because he was there for a much shorter time, if we're limiting it to just the century, then Bill Hader to say Will Ferrell is the best of the 21st century so far. I can't do it. So Bill Hader is the best SNL cast member of the century.

Des, let's get crazy. I've been thinking about this long and hard, and people are going to call it a homer pic, but it's really not. I've heard for the past two plus years, how people do not want to give Christian McCaffrey credit for what he is. And there's many reasons why, but we kind of all know why.

It's kind of reverse, you know, whatever. Christian McCaffrey is the best running back in the league, hands down. That's not a hot take!

Yes, it is. It's not a hot take! Find one person that says he's the best running back in the league. Matthew Gary had him as number one running back in preseason! That's fantasy! I know, but you asked me to find someone who... That's not a hot take!

Yes, it is. He's second or third! If no one else is saying it, that's a hot take! Matthew Barry said it!

That's fantasy! That's not... Aaron, saying Christian McCaffrey is the best running back in the NFL, it's not a hot take! He is the best running back in the league.

That guy had a thousand and a thousand season last year! Right, and even you said he couldn't get there. He had 200 all-purpose yards, to the point where everyone's saying, yeah, he's probably one of the best running backs in the NFL. I didn't say one of the best in the NFL. I said THE best. T-H-E-V. That doesn't make it a hot take if someone's considered one of the best.

You just say it. He's the best. He's the best. There's no one close to him.

Remotely close. Not Alvin Kamara, not Melvin Gordon, not Saquon Barkley. Just do better!

It's Christian McCaffrey and no one else. Just do better! This is ridiculous. Aaron, let's get crazy. Tekashi69 has been in the news lately for his ability to, apparently, cattletail on his gangsta constituents. Can I do my best Tekashi69 impression? Are you ready for this? I'm so ready. I'm gonna stop you before you get the chance! I've never heard it before. Is that what he sounds like?

That's exactly what he sounds like. STUPID! I'm gonna stop you before you get the chance!

STUPID! Most people would think that his rap career would be over after him being a very public snitch. However, after he completes his, uh, whatever they're gonna give him, he might get months, days, or all that telling he been doing. After he completes his obligations to the court, he will release a new album with Rachel Delazol. Whoa!

I didn't know where you were headed there! How is that gonna be received, though? Poorly in the black community. Is Jesse Smollett gonna be on that? Juicy Smollett? That guy?

Is he gonna be on the mixtape? For a second, I was worried about you. The delivery of all of it. But then Rachel Delazol gets thrown in there.

Eh, that's gonna be interesting. I hate this segment. Just because you're not good at it?

No matter why I hate it, I just do. This is me expressing myself. You were so excited a second ago. I was. Can I do my best Dez Hot Take impression? Are you ready?

Yes. AppState's the best team in the state of North Carolina. I know people say they're one of the best teams, but I'm out here saying they're the best. Better than Wake Forest.

Doesn't make any sense. They're the best team in the state of North Carolina. Speaking of best team in the state of North Carolina. Wake Forest right now.

You better come with it. They are ranked in the coaches' poll. They are getting votes in the AP poll. They are 4-0. And they're facing Boston College this week. I think Wake Forest beats Boston College, beats Louisville, beats Florida State, beats NC State, then goes on the road, beats Virginia Tech. College game day is going to be in Clemson as Wake Forest at 9-0 is facing the Tigers. The Deacs are going to be ranked in the top 15 November 16th as the Deacs roll through their next five games. 9-0 Wake Forest. Top 15 ranked Wake Forest later this year. By the way, the Deacs haven't been ranked in the top 25 since 2008.

That seems crazy. First time they've been in the coaches' poll since 2008. They're 24th. I'm surprised they're not in the AP poll, too. The numbers Jamie Newman's putting up. Dave Claussen, three consecutive winning seasons. It's blatant disrespect.

And I think they used that as a chip on their shoulder. And they're going to go into Boston College and get a win. Boston College, they took care of business this weekend, but they lost it home on a Friday night a week and a half ago to Kansas, which isn't a good sign. I do want to have the discussion, though, legitimately.

Who is better if they go head to head? Wake Forest or Appalachian State? We'll do that in about five minutes.

Mac Brown going to join us on the show again at 5.30. So we'll cover all bases. App State, North Carolina, Wake Forest. Let's go to Lynn, though. Lynn in Greensboro. Let's get crazy. Lynn, let's get crazy. Yeah, before I get to that, kudos for Virginia for coming back from 17 down.

I'm too embarrassed to say who my favorite baseball team is, but if they need to get their face out of the deep dish pizza, I'll win a friggin' baseball game. Okay. Is that it? Are you okay? It's not your fault, Lynn. It's not your fault, Lynn.

It's not your fault. Okay. There you go.

Sometimes radio can be just a venting force where people need to let it know how they're feeling. Craig in Greensboro. Let's get crazy. Craig, let's get crazy.

Yes, the Carolina Panthers are not only going to win the NFC South, but they're also going to go to the Super Bowl, and I got one more for you after that. What's that? This is the worst segment on the show.

Yeah! That's a hot take for sure. Who's playing quarterback for those Super Bowl-led Panthers? He's gone?

He might drop. Craig thought he was going to drop a sneak bomb on the show and get out of here. Appreciate Craig and his infinite wisdom and knowledge that he supplied to the drive today. Des hates this segment so much. Do you want to try and punctuate it, Des? I'm going to give it to you. I had one more written down, but at this point, I'm like, you know...

He's leaking confidence. I was thinking about how... I'm going to give you the option.

Do you want to take the microphone or give it back? This is a Papa Doc end-of-eight-mile situation. Oh, I ain't going out like Papa Doc.

You ain't going to put me in like that now. All right. I was thinking about the only good thing about people trying to bring on the Christmas season early is the fact that they start selling Dewey's cookies early, right? Are you familiar with Dewey's cookies? Yes.

Okay. So the cookie thing. So I got to this whole thing of what's the greatest cookie? Oreos are the top-ranked cookie of all time.

They beat everything. I want to know. There's no quiz, dammit. Oreos are the best cookie of all time.

What do you need to know? I bet you, Aaron, I bet you, if you search a list, top cookies of all time. Let's see how Oreos are.

It has to be one or two. I hate you both. We'll get the answer to that question.

Who is the best team in the state of North Carolina at State or Wake Forest? We'll answer that question next. I hate you all. What are we going to talk about? Talking about. This is the Sports Hub at AM 600 AM 920. Now back to the drive with Josh Graham.

Music. We knew we were going to have to rotate guys and we knew that everybody had to be prepared for their opportunity. And opportunities of a lifetime must be seized within the lifetime of an opportunity. And today was a three-hour opportunity and everybody had to be ready to seize it.

They did. That's Appalachian State head football coach Eli Drinkwitz after the Mountaineers took down North Carolina for the program's first Power Five win since being in FCS, going up to Ann Arbor and beating Michigan 12 years ago. It had me thinking though, who's the best team in the state of North Carolina? Is it 4-0 Appalachian State or 4-0 Wake Forest?

Your thoughts welcome on Twitter at sportshubtriad3367771600. I think the answer is unmistakable. I think it's an easy answer and there's no slight that I'm throwing Appalachian State's way whatsoever. But Wake Forest is the best team in North Carolina.

This is nothing to do really with App State. Being in this discussion is incredible considering how short their time has been at the FBS level. But we're stacking up a team that gets its first Power Five win in 12 years versus a team that is in a Power Five league that has had three consecutive winning seasons within the league in Wake Forest. Now you might say, Josh, Appalachian State, look at the teams they're playing and where they're playing. How would Wake Forest do at Penn State? How would Wake Forest do at Georgia? How would Wake Forest do at Tennessee? App State just hasn't had enough opportunity aside from Miami visiting Boone. How many Power Five teams have played on the mountain?

It hasn't happened that often. However, these two teams played each other just a few years ago, I thought. Wake Forest won the game.

It was close. Wake won by a point. Wake Forest was on their home field.

I get all that, but this is Wake Forest's best team. And that App State team was coached by Scott Satterfield. And I don't care how much you like Eli Drinkwitz, and I happen to like him a lot. Eli Drinkwitz, it's way too soon to say this guy is Scott Satterfield.

There's a reason. Sat is coaching at the ACC right now at Louisville. And it's because of the great stuff, the almost unprecedented level-like stuff he did in Boone. So, Dave Glausen, year six, ACC program, three consecutive winning seasons, seem to be their best team they've had, returning contributors at almost every single position. Of course, Wake Forest is better than Appalachian State is. App State, they should be ranked in the top 25 if they win the next few weeks.

I truly believe that. Wake Forest should be there already. They're there in the coaches' poll at number 24. It's a sham that the Deacs aren't already ranked in the AP top 25. But they will be when they beat Boston College this weekend. When that happens, the Deacs will be in the top 25.

So don't really worry about that too much. I know Dave Glausen is worried about that. We'll talk to him tomorrow at his press conference. I'll also be on Chris Lee's Wake Zone for WXII tomorrow. You can find that on WXII's Facebook page, 645 Tomorrow. Also, we'll put that up on our social media shortly after that. But Wake Forest is the best team in the state.

You could chime in at 336-777-1600 or on Twitter, as I mentioned. A lot of you have questions about the Carolina Panthers. We'll get to those in a second. But we have a brooding upset, Desmond Johnson, in the control room. Because Des, it's not an act. He's just not good at delivering really hot takes.

And we won't question them if they're too hot. But saying Christa McCaffrey is the best running back of the NFL, does it really qualify really as one? And then he came in, he closed the segment with saying that Oreos are the best cookie of all time.

And we didn't give him that either. And we ran out of time before Aaron was able to look up what the top cookies are, according to general ranking lists that you'd find on the internet. Where do Oreos rank? Number one. Of course they do! Oreos are the best cookie and everybody knows that!

They're the best selling cookie in the world with over 3.28 billion dollars worth of cookies sold. So Des hates the segment. He legitimately does. Like the caller did at the end saying, this is the worst segment on the show. When, early on, many people thought this was the best segment we did. Oh, how the tables have turned. I love how he was just like, Oreos are the best cookie of all time. As if we were gonna be, whoa! Oreos! I expected y'all to have that reaction.

I've never heard of those! Because everything I've said the past month or so, that's the reaction you've had. No matter what the take is. Good, bad, hot, cold, lukewarm. They're supposed to be hot! Rachel Dolezal doing an album with... That's not a hot take.

That's like some kind of crazy, weird, fantasy thing. That's not a hot take. You counted that as a hot take. That really is hot. That's not a hot take.

I don't even know what to call that. You were in control of the button. You gave one of the callers a hot take, who essentially just said he wants his baseball team to win.

I didn't tell you to do that. Oh, I know what baseball team he was talking about. Yeah, really? Yeah. The deep dish give it away? Yeah, just a little bit.

Alright, that's fair. Matt tweets in. What makes the Carolina Panthers a playoff team in your opinion? I think they're about the 11th best team in the NFC at best. Around Cam Newton, around Kyle Allen, you have what I think is a pretty hot take here. This might be a hot take. You have one of the best running backs in the NFL who Des believes...

I don't even want to say it's so hot. Krista McCaffrey, the best running back in the NFL. Alongside probably the best receiving court Cam Newton and the Panthers have had under Ron Rivera, DJ Moore, Curtis Samuel. And they started looking like the guys we expected them to be yesterday. Greg Olsen, a massive day. The O-line really held up. Darryl Williams rotating a little bit with Greg Little at left tackle. First time we really saw Greg Little playing a role with the Panthers in his rookie year.

Defensively, Brian Burns getting after it. Gerald McCoy isn't getting as many snaps as we used to see him get with Tampa Bay. So it's going to take time before we realize the impact of Gerald McCoy being on this roster. Bruce Irvin, that remains to be seen too. The corners, Dante Jackson missed some tackles, but then it's fair to say he bounced back in a major way. James Bradbury, he's been solid all throughout the year. He's been one of the best corners in the NFL.

If you look at pro football focus, Bradbury's been great. So everywhere you look, Carolina has just talent across the board. So I don't know where you're seeing 11th best team in the NFC. At worst, they're probably seventh, maybe sixth. There's a lot of talent on this team.

It's a playoff roster that we're seeing here. Another thing happened late last hour while we're revisiting old stuff. We were talking about what makes college football unique versus the NFL. There really isn't an equivalent to what we saw Saturday in Keenan Stadium. The Mountaineers beating North Carolina, that type of environment, what it meant to Appalachian State fans, the end state battle.

You don't really have an equivalent to that in the NFL. The Mountaineers not facing the Tar Heels for 79 years. So it meant so much to Mountaineer fans for them to win that game. You know, when you're going to the office today, you're talking trash to Carolina fans if you're an App State fan. And I gave the example, and Adam Whitten did too, going to church and talking a little smack there with your App State polo or your North Carolina polo or North Carolina fans wearing their polo getting smack talked to them. And Des said that, uh, I've never seen anybody wear team polos to church.

So this is one of those cultural divides that we have. So you invited me, hey, how about you go to a black church sometime? And I said, I've been to black churches. And in trying to prove, I guess, that I've been to a black church, this happened. I'll be soulful. I'll be clapping. Move it on! What?

Why did I go to the Jefferson? Aaron immediately recoiled. After I sang that, you can hear Aaron's reaction. Just isolate me singing and the immediate reaction of Aaron, which is the correct reaction.

And now this is blowing up on Twitter. Move it on up! Aaron's reaction after that, though. How quickly did Aaron realize, oh no?

Immediately. Move it on up! Yeah.

But I mean, after I say that, Des, you can hear it on the air, Aaron's reaction to this. Move it on up! Oh wow. There it is! Yeah.

Oh wow. But Aaron, then, just a devious, devious person, doesn't say anything on the air. Just goes to Twitter and says, I love how Josh Graham's song choice for his imaginary time, which was not imaginary, in a black church is none other than the theme from the Jeffersons. I feel like the church you went on was on the Warner Brothers lottery. I thought we were on the same team, Aaron! Did they hit all the hits at the church you went to? Jeffersons, Cosby Show, Different World, Martin. Oh, they had him some, Martin.

The deluxe apartment in the sky. Yeah, man. But no, I deserve to be called out on. With this, I did lean on me a few weeks ago. So, just, I need to stop doing this. What, trying to be soulful? Moving on up! No, I'll never stop being soulful. Never will.

Mac Brown is going to be on this show in about 30 minutes. That's something worth celebrating, I think. Moving on up! To get the other side of things, because we've been spending a lot of time talking about Appalachian State, and rightfully so, but the North Carolina angle of this, you win the first two games, coming from behind, final drive, Sam Howell finding Daz Newsome against Miami, North Carolina staging the comeback down 20-9 against South Carolina, then getting two interceptions from Miles Wolfhoek to open things up in Charlotte.

But these types of things catch up with you. When you play close games and make it come down to the wire and put yourself in a hole, when you start playing good teams that are going to be playing in bowl games, then that doesn't really work out well for you, regardless where the game is played. In Winston-Salem, that wasn't going to work out down 21-0, and against Appalachian State, that wasn't going to work out for the Tar Heels. So, it's going to be interesting to see how they fare, maybe not against the Tigers, but in Coastal Division play. Because remember, the Wake Forest game was a non-conference game, so they are 1-0 in the Coastal Division with a win against Miami. If they lose to Clemson this week, they're still very well in contention in the Coastal Division, and who doesn't think that North Carolina could compete with Georgia Tech? What have you seen from Virginia Tech to make you think that the Tar Heels can't beat them? They struggled with Old Dominion this past weekend, and that game was in Blacksburg, I believe. That was 17-7 in the second half. Virginia, they had issues.

Or, excuse me, I got that backwards. The Virginia Cavaliers, they're ranked in the top 25. They are ranked ahead of Wake Forest. They seem to be the second best team in the ACC. They're going to get set for Notre Dame this weekend, 18 versus No.

10. They were the ones that struggled with Old Dominion this past weekend, not Virginia Tech. That game was competitive in the fourth quarter before the Cavaliers ultimately pulled away and won by 11. Virginia Tech, elsewhere in the Coastal Division, they struggled with Furman, won that game by a touchdown, 24-17. So, who exactly in this division do you think North Carolina can't hang with? At the start of the year, you would have said Miami, just because of sheer talent.

But, they've already crossed that bridge. They've already eclipsed that challenge. So, when you look at Virginia Tech, edging Furman, barely. Virginia, struggling to get past Old Dominion. Georgia Tech just being flat out bad. Duke, Duke, I don't think anyone's scared of Duke. NC State, I wouldn't say that formidable. North Carolina still very well can win the Coastal Division, even though they've lost the last two games and it's year one under Mac Brown. So, don't lose sight of the big picture, is what I would advise.