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Is Evangelicalism Reformable to Biblical Fidelity?

The Christian Worldview / David Wheaton
The Truth Network Radio
September 17, 2021 8:00 pm

Is Evangelicalism Reformable to Biblical Fidelity?

The Christian Worldview / David Wheaton

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September 17, 2021 8:00 pm

GUEST: DON GREEN, founding pastor, Truth Community Church (Ohio)

“Evangelical” has become a very broad term with hardly any meaning. It once described a follower of Christ who believed in the complete truthfulness of Scripture, essential doctrines about salvation, sin, God, Christ, the call to tell others about the gospel of Christ, and more.

Today, seemingly every professing Christian who is not part of the totally compromised liberal mainline denominations self-identifies as an “Evangelical”…except for those who want to avoid at all costs being associated with Donald Trump, for whom Evangelicals mostly voted.

But the doctrinal stances of professing Evangelicals today, including Evangelical churches and organizations—on interpreting Scripture or hot button issues like homosexuality, race, and women in preaching roles—span such a wide spectrum that the term has all been but lost.

With the Evangelical church and movement becoming a mile wide and an inch deep, is it possible and even advisable to try to recapture the term back to its more faithful roots?

Don Green, founding pastor of Truth Community Church in Cincinnati, Ohio, joins us on The Christian Worldview to discuss what was an "Evangelical", what caused the compromise, and whether Evangelicalism is reformable? Don is preaching at the upcoming “Reforming Evangelicalism” conference at Grace Church in Greeley, CO, which you can attend or watch online.

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Is evangelicalism we formable biblical fidelity that is a topic we discussed today. Right here on the Christian worldview radio program for the mission is to sharpen the biblical worldview of Christians and to proclaim the good news of Jesus Christ. I'm David read the host in her website the Christian A big thank you to our listeners for your encouragement and also to our national sponsor Samaritan ministries who provide a biblical solution healthcare.

You can go to the website to find out more about the Christian worldview and Samaritan ministries just a little follow-up. Early on in the program today before we get into the topic. We have never had more request for transcripts. Then after the interview last week with Dr. Peter McCall, that's a great thing. I just keep in mind when we produce transcripts that typically come out on Tuesday after the program airs on the weekend takes time to generate them, edit them so forth. So lot emails asking about when they come out Tuesday is typically the day for that and now just to touch on a couple more things before we get to the topic of the day so many unprecedented things are happening almost every week in this country that are just what can only be described as full of lies and authoritarianism like is this America anymore. We didn't get a chance to play the audio last week of Pres. Joe Biden mandating the vaccine for all companies with more than 100 employees and for federal employees as well. Hard even call him president, knowing what likely happened from a fraudulent standpoint in the election and, perhaps, who is actually running this country behind the scenes. Anyway, I digress. So listen to the audio from this Joe Biden press conference last week and you can easily find out who was going to be blamed for covert anything bad that happens in this country. My message to unvaccinated Americans is this what more is there to wait for what more do you need to see we made vaccinations free, safe and convenient vaccine is FDA approval over 200 million Americans have gotten at least one shot. The patient, but our patience is wearing thin.

And the refusal has cost all of us. So please do the right thing with gusto taken from lead me listen to the voices of unvaccinated Americans were lying in hospital beds taking her final breath say if only I'd gotten vaccinate. If only the tragedy. Please only become yours.

I tell you these people on the left are professional liars. That's all that can be said about them blaming the unvaccinated when this is actually right now. Look in Israel almost everyone unvaccinated in the Delta variant is spreading like crazy. There the so-called vaccines aren't effective against people getting or giving Calvin they're not officially FDA approved, despite what he said. Dr. Peter McCullough talked about that last week. Our leaders are exceedingly sinful and wicked. Since when does the government have the authority to make you put something in your body. It doesn't take too much squinting to see where this is all going.

What this can be further restrictions on the unvaccinated where you can go what you can do taking your children know why you can see that coming.

You're a danger to your own children quarantine centers, denial of access to health care who knows where it's going to be, and now we find out this week that the vaccine may be causing some forms of cancer and that it weakens your immune system your member earlier this year. Perhaps that we played some audio of Dr. Ryan Cole talking about the vitamin D deficiency people in America have live in more than northern climates, will this according to life site news I in a September article, but this is back from March, when he was quoted as saying this. He's a board-certified pathologist and owner and operator of a diagnostics lab. He trained the Mayo Clinic.

He runs the largest independent testing laboratory in Idaho. He reported to the public in a video produced by Idaho state governments capital clarity project that he is seeing a massive uptick in various autoimmune diseases, and cancers in patients who have been vaccinated. Listen to this two minute audio of Dr. Ryan Cole were seen in the laboratory. After people getting shot, forcing a very concerning walked in a low profile of these important killer T cells that you want in your body. It's almost over a reverse HIV and HIV. You lose your helper T cells or CD4 cells in this virus post vaccine. What were seeing is a drop in your killer T cells or CD8 cells CD8 cells do they keep all other viruses and check what my singing laboratory I'm seeing an uptick of his family viruses I'm seeing herpes I'm seeing shingles and seeing mono and seeing a huge uptick in human papilloma virus in the cervical biopsies and cervical Pap smears and women.

In addition to that there is a little infectious kids get: molluscum contagiosum. We need to keep that in check.

You need CD8 killer T cells.

I am seeing a 20 times increase in individuals over the age of 50 of this bumping rash that's innocuous but it what it tells me is the status of these individuals who got shot literally system of these individuals know most concerning of all is there's a pattern of these types of immune cells in the body. The key cancer and check well since January 1 and the laboratory have seen that he 20 times increase of endometrial cancers over what I see on an annual basis, a 20 times increase, not exaggerating at all because I look at my numbers year over year on I've never seen this many endometrial cancers before, and seeing invasive melanomas in younger patients normally will catch those early in their thin melanomas. I'm seeing thick melanomas skyrocketing in the last month or two. I'm already seeing the early signals and we are modifying the immune system to a weakened state rate study out of Germany that looked at these profiles on young individuals. After the Pfizer showing this walked in and we don't know how long. Maybe the immune system knows can regenerate and those rations will go back up but who studying it, and where the long-term trials two months four months. How long is this profile often.

That's chilling audio that this so-called vaccine that was rushed and by the way, by Pres. Trump who was the one pushing it at first but of course is taken to whole new levels. When the Biden administration came into power that this injection whatever they're putting into the bodies of millions of people now may have deleterious health impacts on them very serious. Once so just keep that in mind as you consider whether you're going to be pressured into getting this so-called vaccine. The only thing to conclude here is that we are in a very bad state in our country right now couple other stories this week that are really troubling is that left-wing governor Gavin Newsom who was recalled in that state.

In California, one the recall election in a landslide in California is basically a one party system state massive homelessness, crime, terrible educational system expensive full of illegal immigrants authoritarian lockdowns over COBIT and he still was elected governor in a landslide, which means the people of California either diluted or their one party machine is completely fraudulent when it comes to elections.

Either way it's very bad news and then you probably heard this week about Mark Millie, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff is the top military officer in the country came out in the book by two authors from the Washington Post that Millie had told this to his counterpart position in China. He said Gen. Lee. I want to assure you that the American government is stable and everything is going to be okay. This is right before the election in 2020. We are not going to attack or conduct any kinetic operations against you if were going to attack I'm going to call you ahead of time. It's not going to be a surprise unquote that you did hear that right and it is truly beyond comprehension how that's not considered treason and this man has not been removed from his position yesterday general Millie hasn't even denied saying this and it is actually being defended as this is what our military commanders do when they talk to their contemporaries in other countries you may remember this general as the one who is the absolute hater of Donald Trump and who was pushing white rage, ideology and critical race theory on the military. There's no way to sugarcoat it.

Our government is on the left and every branch big businesses on the left. Our educational system is on the godless left our media and entertainment industry are joined in the godless left. I can't think of a major institution in this country that is not on the God rejecting left at this point in time.

In fact, this leftist worldview is impacting the evangelical church as well now. Which brings us to the topic of the day is evangelicalism reform bill to biblical fidelity. The word evangelical has become a very broad term with hardly any meaning anymore.

It once described a follower of Christ who believed in the complete truthfulness of Scripture. The essential doctrines about sin and salvation God in Christ and others in the call to tell other people about the gospel of Christ today, seemingly every professing Christian who is not part of the totally compromise liberal mainline denominations self identifies as quoted evangelical except those who don't want to be associated with Donald Trump in any way, for whom evangelicals voted for in large numbers, but the doctrinal stance is a professing evangelicals today in evangelical churches and organizations on interpreting scripture or hot button issues like homosexuality. Racer women in preaching roles spans such a wide spectrum that the term evangelical has all but lost its meaning here, just an example I read this week from the online publication pride source crossover Christian and pop music megastar Amy Grant you consider this great evangelical right for years. Everyone knows who any grant is.

She recently made clear her thoughts on the LGBT Q community in Christianity grant shared her most pro-LGBT Q sentiment to date with Apple music's proud radio host Hunter Kelly. Here's what Amy Grant said evangelical Amy Grant said who loves us more than the one who made us grant as Kelly in the July 12 interview quote. None of us are a surprise to God. Nothing about who we are or what we've done. That's why to me it's so important to set a welcome table because I was invited to a table or someone said don't be afraid your loved Gay straight. It does not matter. This is Amy Grant.

It doesn't matter how we behave. Grant continued, it doesn't matter how were wired.

We are all our best selves. When we believe to the core I'm logged and then our creativity flourishes were like I'm going arrange flowers in your table on my table when were loved were brave enough to say yes to every good impulse that comes to us unquote that from the evangelical megastar Amy Grant who then just this last week played in a concert for 9/11 with other well-known Christian contemporary music stars Matt Redman and Michael W Smith and big evangelicalism goes on in all its confusion.

So what the evangelical church in movement, becoming a milewide and hardly even an inch deep. Is it even possible and advisable to try to recapture the term back to its more faithful roots Don green, the founding pastor of truth Community Church in Cincinnati, Ohio joins us today in the Christian worldview to discuss what was in evangelical what caused the compromise and whether evangelicalism is refundable. Don is preaching at the upcoming reforming evangelicalism conference at Grace Church in Greeley Colorado which will tell you about today was it to the first segment of the interview with Pastor Don green done.

Thank you for coming on the program today.

This is your first time on the program and so I'd like to ask you just to briefly tell us about your background, how you came to saving faith in Jesus Christ and about truth. Community Church.

I was born and raised in southern Indiana.

I had exposure to the gospel and some ways in a small country church in a little town that no one's ever heard of. And I thought myself a Christian for a long time.

David bed I went to college I went to law school and through a variety of circumstances in Scriptures, it became obvious that I was not a Christian and in fact I was a sinner that was doomed to eternal wrath.

I was in big big trouble before a holy God. And so, based on things that I had heard in the past. I cried out in simple faith to Christ.

I was repenting of my sin and yielding my life to him and asking him and his love and mercy to save me and he did and changed my life and that of the big thing that happened in immediately after my conversion. David was that the spirit of God opened up my eyes and my mind to Scripture to be able to understand them. To love the word of God and that set me on a trajectory that eventually led me away from my law practice and in two studies at the Masters seminary out in California and through a long series of circumstances I came to Cincinnati to be the founding pastor of truth Community Church. The Lord is blessing our ministry were very encouraged by all that is happening just with the simple philosophy explained our philosophy of ministry to people like this, we open the Bible teaches, and we deal biblically with the consequences and it's really, if it's really simple as that Christian worldview. David Wheaton returns in just a moment. Psalm 46 starts God is our refuge and strength a very present help in trouble. Therefore we will not fear, though the earth should change the earth is changing strong delusion has bewitched the leaders and peoples of this world. So what's a Christian to do focus on the most important thing God and his perfect and powerful attributes are new featured resources.

Dr. Steven Lawson's book show me your glory. Understanding the majestic splendor of God, for limited time we are offering. Show me your glory for a donation of any amount to the Christian worldview. This hardcover book is 278 pages with the retail price of $19 to order go to the Christian or call 1888 646-2233 or write to Box 401, Excelsior, MN 55331 that's in the Christian

Be sure to take advantage of two free resources that will keep you informed and sharpen your worldview. The first is the Christian worldview, weekly email which comes to your inbox each Friday contains of the upcoming radio program along with need to read articles featured resources, special events and audio the previous program.

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Be sure to visit our website the Christian we can subscribe to our free weekly email an annual print newsletter resources for adults and children and support the ministry. Now back to today's program with host David Wheaton you are can be part of a conference coming up that has a very interesting theme to I think a very relevant theme our day and age is the reforming evangelicalism conference is being held at Grace Church in Greeley, Colorado. Some listeners will maybe recognize that church pastor Travis Allen has been a frequent guest on this program before. So he's invited you, along with Tom asked all another another guest on this program from Grace Baptist Church in Cape Coral, Florida. Though the present of founders ministries and also Phil Johnson, the Executive Director of grace to you you for manning any part of this conference on reforming evangelicalism and so I wanted to start out with with a question on how widest spectrum. Evangelicalism is today. It has their widely divergent theological viewpoints across different denominational lines and organizations all considering themselves evangelical so on. On one side you have what I would categorize as conservative. Byblos this by John MacArthur Steve Lawson some of the more well-known ones and then you have other well-known evangelicals like David Platt or Matt Chandler or many in the Southern Baptist convention who are really intent on this this issue of social justice, then you have.

I think even those who are in the charismatic movement or even the new apostolic Reformation. People like Jill Alstyne or Bill Johnson Bethel church Redding California.

They they meet may seem very non-Orthodox in their biblical viewpoints by think they consider themselves evangelicals. I think the culture will consider them evangelicals. Then you have those who are more theologically moderate or even a liberal like the national Association of Evangelicals, Christianity today seminary. Like Fuller, which is very liberal, theologically Rick Warren Andy Stanley Tim Keller. The Beatty on yet we lay the issues very widely done none on the inerrancy of Scripture, social justice, immigration summer for summer against unvented immigration. The issue of homosexuality, race and reparations.

Critical race theory. I mean the evangelical movement is a very very big tent. So my first question on this topic is what was in evangelical and what or whom do you think represents being in evangelical now and originally it was an expression of commitment to the authority of Scripture and the primacy of the gospel of Jesus Christ. The Bible is the inerrant and infallible holy word of God and that Jesus Christ is the only Savior of the world and that only through faith in Christ. Can anyone be saved and and along with that becomes a comes a corollary of recognizing the sufficiency of Scripture, the sufficiency of Scripture for ministry to the church and and the sufficiency of Scripture for what we proclaim to the world and with the broad scope of people that you mention claiming the label of evangelical and the the contradictory viewpoints that are held under that umbrella is rather obvious to me that the term itself has been so diluted that it's that it's almost not even useful anymore because it doesn't describe anything specific. If you can have if you can have Fuller seminary and John MacArthur under the same term. It's obvious that something's happened to the language since the term was originally instituted and so what were hoping to do with this conference is to bring things back to what the real issues are and whatever label we use for for conservative biblical Christianity. Going forward, that the issues that are represented under the term evangelical would be clarified and defended and asserted against those who are undermining them, either consciously or unconsciously, unintentionally, with the scope of their ministries John green with us today in the Christian worldview radio program, the founding pastor of truth Community Church that's in Cincinnati, Ohio would be accurate to say Don that the evangelical movement or the evangelical church has changed more in the last let's say 40 years. Then in the previous 100 years old say the first 60 years did the term evangelical come about sometime in the early 1900s, maybe you could explain that when you look at what happened in there in the charismatic movement first. For example, over the past 50 years that that's an attack on the sufficiency in the final authority of Scripture when you're open to new revelation from God, and you think that God speaks outside of his word and speaks directly to people today in this in the spirit of their hearts. You've really undermined the very foundation of what it originally meant to be in evangelical which was built on the exclusive final complete authority of Scripture.

And so there has been a great shift and along with that it you know even in you know even in war very more recent years within the past decade or so, as evangelicals have have embraced through the Gospel coalition and the MLK 50 conference that that happened there and and this idea of racial reconciliation being a gospel issue. The reality is is that they the meaning of the authority of Scripture and the meaning of the gospel is being redefined by the introduction of new things that were not part of the original the original term so new revelation from God, violating the final authority of Scripture calling racial reconciliation. A gospel issue and, in other words, you can't be saved unless you're engaged in their version of rate racial reconciliation, completely redefining the simplicity of the gospel is its express, perhaps in first Corinthians 15, for example. That's why we need to come back and redefine terms as were due hoping to do in this conference to to reform and to challenge these these assaults that have been made on biblical truth and and to stand clearly humbly unapologetically on the final authority of Scripture and the sufficiency of the gospel as it is revealed in an Scripture for listeners in the Denver area you be able to attend the conference in person, you can just go to grace to find out how and Greeley spell GREELEY grace but the great news is, anyone can watch this conference live streamed from anywhere, again, go to that same website grace all the sessions will be live streamed. The conference is September 24 through the 26th.

Let's talk about some of the things that have happened. The methodologies that have had that have entered in the evangelical movement. Some may have had more impact than others, but you think about the 1970s that was really the that the birth of Christian contemporary music that started to come into the evangelical church the seeker model with Bill Hibel's and Willow Creek started somewhere in the late 80s early 90s and then after that the 90s to thousands, that the very highly program church program for every person who comes the turning much more into a directive. The audience that the the felt needs going on their life.

The creating is worship experience multisite campuses.

Now we have one church and that's that.

Pastors beamed over to other churches that are under the umbrella of that church or just even during the covert pandemic that the online church that that the growth of that. So Don, what do you think have been one or two of the most damaging theologies or methodologies that have occurred within the evangelical church over the last 2030 years.

I've always been disturbed by the shift that took place with Willow Creek Bill Hibel's work for and you know in just turning things into a seeker sensitive model. I don't even know if these guys recognize at the time the fundamental shift that they were making.

We cannot orient ministry in order to please the unsaved world. The gospel confronts the world. It does not comfort the world and there and repentance and in their hostility to God. And so if you are gearing a ministry or if you are shaping your ministry in order to draw and an audience from the world. You've already given up the battle because you have said I will be a servant of unsaved man and to give them what they want, rather than a servant of Christ, proclaiming his truth and trusting the Holy Spirit to work in the lives of both the redeemed and the unsaved. In order to come accomplish his purposes, and so you see straight from confidence in the gospel you strayed from confidence in the spirit in a desire to please a world that is at hostility with God.

You know Jesus. Jesus said that men don't come to the light because they love the darkness and they they hate the light and so our responsibility. David, as you know so well. Our responsibility is to proclaim the truth and to trust God for the consequences of that whether our ministry grows when we see people outwardly converted to Christ or not. We just have to trust him for the consequences rather than shaping our ministry to try to bring invisible numbers inside the walls of the church when we don't do a service to the world. When we do that and also we we abandon the purpose of the church which is to present every man complete in Christ.

I look at the seeker sensitive movement as being the inflection point where the trajectory really really got off track and were were dealing with the consequences of that to this day. You know, 50 years later, very good, founding pastor of truth Community Church in Cincinnati, Ohio. Don Greene joins us today here in the Christian worldview radio program you can find a more about the church, the Don He also has a daily radio program and that website is the truth. there is more than just the church within evangelicalism. There is just a host of parachurch ministries as a matter fact, there is actually a term big Eva that's used to just describe the. The vast array of that the movement of evangelicalism out there and much of it has to do with parachurch minute ministries. There is the evangelical book industry just unending number of books being churned out by all these publishers most being really not worth the paper they're printed on very few come out that are I think very helpful biblically and sound biblically, you have the whole evangelical music industry.

The contemporary Christian music industry that just churns out music and influences churches in so many ways. Then there all the various non-church ministries again parachurch ministries first social care or this particular mission or that how do you think the whole evangelical parachurch ministry dynamic has affected what evangelicalism has become well if I could focus on just one aspect from familiarity with some other parachurch ministries, it necessarily results in a dilution of of doctrine and the dilution of the deep truths of Scripture in order for parachurch ministry to survive it needs to have a broad footprint of of support from people from a double diverse realm of theological commitments and so inevitably there. Their doctrinal statements if they even have one is very brief, very shallow in order to encompasses many people under their big tent as possible and as they as they grow in influence and as they grow in their resources, they become a more dominant influence than anything about their ministry actually justifies and that happens at the expense of the local church and so let's save got a faithful pastor, preaching the word to the same congregation week after week for 10, 20, 30 years, but his congregation is 5800 hundred and 5200 people, you know that's that's kind of the realm that we are operating in a trees community and people have a sense of looking at the measuring it by the size rather than by the fidelity to truth. Looking at the parachurch ministries and all of the big attractions that they can put on and things like that. It has a kind of an maybe an unrecognized shift in expectations that success is merit measured by the size of the ministry rather than what what is being taught in the faithfulness of ministry to the people under under the leadership of the local church.

I'm greatly concerned about that in and you know and I'm greatly committed to the local church and and that's what Christ promised to build. He promised to build his church, not things that are outside the biblical structure of qualified spiritual leadership, teaching designed to edify the saints and to exalt God. You know I'm content to do it. Christ ways and let the let the parachurch ministries that let them go. I'm not trying to emulate them in my own ministry I just want to be faithful to the Lord teaches to my people, and let the Lord Jesus that is also that wherever he wants us to trust him. The blessed holding his will and that's all I care about Christian worldview returns in just a moment when it comes to your healthcare provider. What are some words you would use to describe your experience with comfort and peace.

Confidence will have Samaritan ministries and those are just some of the words are members use frequently like Samaritan member, former long-term board member and no staff member Jamie Hiles uses to describe his 24 year relationship with Samaritan ministries target words into the comfort of the relief you have. As you come to terms that's American ministries is real is flyable is working.

Is there we just thank God that he's allowed us to have that kind of peace to be in a situation where I can focus on things that are far more important to be part of a growing caring community of Christians who faithfully share each other's medical needs.

Each month, all without the use of insurance and find out that's in Samaritan ministry' W. David Wheaton here volunteer host of the Christian worldview radio program. Listeners are often surprised to learn that we as a ministry pay for air time on the radio station website or app on which you hear the program. The primary way this expense is recouped is through listeners like you donating to the ministry or becoming a monthly partner. Our aim is to have each broadcast outlet fully supported by the listeners to that outlet. If you are a regular listener.

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That's 1888 646-2233 or the Christian and be sure to specify which station website or app you listen is that helps us decide whether to continue on a given outlet. Thank you for your support. Thanks for joining us on the Christian worldview. Just a reminder that today's program and pass programs are archived at our website. Christian things are also available and be sure to share with others. Now back to today's program with host David Wheaton done green founding pastor trees community church in Cincinnati, Ohio joins us today. Their website is truth is also going to be speaking at the upcoming reforming evangelicalism conference just outside Denver at Grace Church Greeley you can attend in person or watch it online.

Grace is the website done with only one Bible how to explain how evangelicals come to such widely different views on the same somebody more hot button issues of our day women preaching to men. The issue of homosexuality now is is as entered the evangelical church diversion viewpoints on that same sex attraction being okay you can be can be a same-sex attracted Christian issue of critical race theory. Of course, was was brought before the Southern Baptist convention. There was a resolution in favor of using as an analytical tool. Of course, social justice has really taken hold and really divided by even those on the more conservative conservative theological and of evangelicalism.

How do you come to such widely divergent views on these issues, we only have one Bible in part I think that while we have only one Bible, we have different men interpreting it. For one thing, and these men come out come in Scripture with different motives and with different presuppositions is the Bible which was you know completed. The canon was completed 2000 years ago, does it speak final truth for all time or do subsequent events and subsequent human learning. Change the way that we artists understand Scripture and with a cultural shift just to pick on one topic that you mention with a cultural shift on homosexuality. If we are driven by what culture says then were going to reinterpret Scripture against the long-standing historic understanding of the church of the Orthodox church for centuries and even millennia going to reinterpret it because there's a sense that what's new learning is more important and is better than the revealed pages of Scripture and what was established 2000 years ago and so if men are hungering for that which is new, that which is in conformity with the spirit of the world that is going to influence and change the way they interpret Scripture and eventually they'll put into Scripture or they'll twist Scripture to bring out the preordained conclusion that they wanted.

If I think that homosexuality is good or that it at least should not be criticized by spiritual leaders. Then when I go to the Bible. I'm going to find what I want and instead of what the Bible says and that's why exegesis is so important to study Scripture for what it says let the Bible speak on its own terms and adjust the world to Scripture, rather than adjusting Scripture to the world very well said thank you for that Don green with us today on the Christian worldview, founding pastor of truth community in Cincinnati Ohio.

I want to read up just a couple sentences of that the preview for the upcoming reforming evangelicalism conference that you going to be speaking at outside Denver, Colorado. It said this is the perfect time to reassert creeds and confessions.

The Reformation solos in the doctrines of God's sovereign grace, the theology that one set the standard of orthodoxy for evangelicalism is needed now more than ever to captivate the hearts of God's people and guide the churches and their pastors. We want to see a new generation of evangelicals rise up reform evangelicalism and rediscover the true beauty of the evangelical in all its glory. Perhaps God will grant us kindness in our time to pour out his Spirit and revive the land that from the conference preview and that's a certainly noble mission. I'm wondering how realistic that is seeing how far the whole evangelical movement is gone whether it's worth the effort trying to recapture a term rather than just exhorting churches and Christians to be faithful to Scripture. In part two of that question is what you think the apostles would do with the apostle Paul traveled around and dealt with false teaching and drifts in and the churches that he had started her that he ministered to. How do you think he would deal with the drift going out with an evangelicalism today. Let me start with the last question that you asked there about the about the apostle Paul II think we have a clear answer to that question in in Scripture as he was riding his parting words in second Timothy two is the next generation pastor so to speak.

He said in second Timothy chapter 4, I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead by his appearing and his kingdom preach the word be ready in season and out of season, reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with great patience and instruction that the apostle Paul in the biblical mandate to to the men of God who are leading churches and have positions of spiritual influence is to proclaim truth to teach the word to explain it in its context and to exhort sinners to believe in Christ and to exhort that the faithful to grow in the grace and knowledge of Christ and and you're right, humanly speaking, you know where you were kind of leading into with your the initial framing of the question, humanly speaking this at this is hopeless, humanly speaking, this cannot be recovered.

I mean we got we got 2000 cats out of the barn and were not going to be able to shepherd them back into back into the barn and get control over this again. The thing that were relying on his we teach the word and teaching it from a minority position in the in the broader church.

The thing that were relying on is the great power of the Holy Spirit in order to bless our efforts beyond what we could humanly manufacture to to bless his word to the glory of Christ to the salvation of sinners and to bring a wandering church to repentance. I have no confidence in this conference itself to be able to accomplish anything, simply by the human power of the speakers, but I have great confidence in the power the Holy Spirit to use it to accomplish the purposes of God, whatever they may be. Our job is to be faithful to the word leave the consequences to God and hopefully when we enter into his presence on the merits of the righteousness and shed blood of our Savior, to hear him say to us, well done, thou good and faithful servant. If I hear those words, the purpose of my life is been fulfilled. David very well said Don green, the founding pastor of truth community with us today again in the Christian worldview. Their website is truth

He also was a radio program daily. The truth is the website for that he speaking at the upcoming reforming evangelicalism conference will tell you how you can listen to that org attend that and I'm just thinking as you're giving that answer how important this would be for pastors and elder boards to take in what you and the other speakers are going to be saying the regular Christians as well. Those in the congregation.

Of course, but particularly for those in leadership to get a biblical ecclesiology for how they should be leading their churches that will be very important so highly encouraged for pastors and elders to to take in this this excellent conference. Let's talk about one other issue that came up within the Southern Baptist convention.

The largest Protestant denomination in America, perhaps even the world data election of a new president this year at Litton took over for JD Greer almost immediately after he was elected came out that he had been involved in plagiarizing sermons from JD Greer and I think maybe for some others for offer last many years. This was just a one time thing.

It had gotten permission from JD Greer to use his material in that but he never credited it when he was when he was preaching. It was like a word for word. We played some of this on the on the program is one thing for one pastor to plagiarize sermons but the reaction or the lack of reaction. The lack of pushback, lack of demand had this man resign it in one of the biggest evangelical positions and in the country I think was with is still shocking. So how do you explain the lack of action taken over such a clear issue of of sin, plagiarism, taking someone else's material and using as if it's your own and how common this turns out to be not only with at Litton, but other pastors and of buying and borrowing sermons.

This is apparently commonly done. What does this say to you done I wasn't anticipating you to bring this in the interview, but I'm really really glad you did at the time that those stories were breaking. I wrote about this extensively on my personal Facebook page in my perspective, David everything that we've talked about before now is is child's play compared to how devastating this scandal is to the future of the evangelical church for the next 50 years that the largest conservative Protestant denomination or convention or whatever you want to call the SBC has has openly embraced and accepted a man who is not qualified for pastoral office Scripture is clear that the man of God is to be able to to teach and be able to refute those who contradict. And it is essential to the pastoral office for man to be able to do that if he does not do that.

He's not qualified for office.

The convention leadership in the seminary leadership. The flagship seminaries. None of them. To my knowledge ever called for his resignation. They might've said oh that's not such a good thing that they never stood boldly against this in a way that would've cost them their jobs and the result of this is that the next generation of pastors trained under the leadership of SBC seminaries has as their flagship model, a man who did not do the work of the ministry. A man who did not study to show himself approved and and they have been they are being taught by example that the word of God is not important enough for you to actually spend your time studying it yourself and you can advance to the highest levels of ministry without showing any integrity toward the word of God that is devastating for what it means to the future leaders that are being trained under the leadership of the Southern Baptist convention and you can tell by the animation in my voice. I am, I am greatly exercised about this. I am greatly I am greatly grieved that this is been accepted by men who apparently concern numbers and dollars more than the integrity of Scripture, and what this means, by people who will adopt the example of the ad. Litton is devastating for the future of our church. I don't know how you recover it, humanly speaking in the next 50 years.

When you have set an example for future leaders to follow like that. This is worse than anything about vaccines or church mandates or anything like this is has much longer lasting consequences than any of the current issues that are occupying the attention of the church that so well said Don. The reason you say that is because you know that the pulpit is the the starting point and the ending point of not only a God and honoring church. The point of which you people. Our lives are saved in and in believers are disciple than everything else and if that's compromise as as it has been in the example here. This was dealt with like a political scandal yet is, deflect, and do a few an inner interview send out some counterpoints and so forth and is let time pass and something else comes up, and people forget about it that that's how this is been at L actually right that is exactly right.

So it is extremely troubling. II think your view of this, that this is a major, major problem because it's going to degrade the pulpit in the eyes of younger men who are aspiring to be pastors and what it means to be a preacher of God's word is is right on point.

Don Greene joins us today here on the Christian worldview final question for you is as in light of that, why is and when some nothing about big question people have in their areas are listening today and that they don't perhaps have a church like you been describing today where there is a high view of God in Scripture there is not sound expository preaching years. There is pragmatic methodologies in their local church and they don't know what to do about that in order to go.

Why is sound expository preaching from a church is pulpit. The starting point in the ending point me that is the most important part of a God honoring local church. That's right, David. It's it's from the pulpit where we learn who God is who Christ is who we are as sinners and what the gospel is in the pulpit is is God's appointed means of providing truth to his people and proclaiming truth to a to a lost and rebellious world. And if you compromise the pulpit.

You shaken the foundation upon which the church is supposed to stamp all called the, the church, the pillar of truth and in the pillar and the support of truth and if you if you evacuate an and you rendered in all the pulpit, then everything else falls along with it and and we become nothing more than a social gathering around no common human values. Maybe, but the voice of God is silenced when the pulpit is compromised and it is the voice of God.

We need by which I mean the truth of Scripture applied to our hearts by the Holy Spirit in the pulpit is central to that without the pulpit.

All of that goes away you might have a man up that is speaking but you're not getting that the truth of God proclaimed in the power of the Holy Spirit and that is what the crying need of the church is today so well said Don, thank you so much for coming on the Christian real view today but thank you even more for your fidelity to the word of God preaching it faithfully standing up for truth and at the same time. By the way, pointing out air. That's another overlooked thing today is that when there's so much air going on receipt in Scripture it's pointed out in Scripture and just overlooking it or just talking about the good things. The things that make us feel good, that's not what Scripture calls Christians to do and especially pastors to do so.

Thank you for being faithful to Scripture, and that way as well. In all of God's best, and grace to you and your your church and your family and thanks again for coming on the program will David, thank you for having me.

Thank you for what you do and would certainly covet the prayers of your audience for for the Ministry of truth community to chance. It's a blessing to have been here with you and may God bless you as well. Okay.

Hope you gain from that conversation with Pastor Don Greene and just a reminder, he will be part of that reforming evangelicalism conference held at Grace Church in Greeley, Colorado September 24 to the 26 you can attend in person, or you can watch online, go to Grace to find out more. One thing that I just took away from hearing Don was about the importance of pastors just being so clear and so strong and so Bible based in Bible centered in their preaching.

They can't back off the things that they think might offend people sensibilities today.

They need to preach the full counsel of God and also the gospel that God created you and me to know him, obey him and give him glory, but that our sin separates us from God and puts us under his judgment, but that that's what Jesus Christ came to reconcile to live a perfect life and then to diets that are sinless. Substitute in the cross so that God's wrath and justice could be satisfied over our sins, and that by repenting and believing in his work and not her own works, we can be forgiven and made right with God. That is the good news. And if you've never believe that put your faith in that you need to do that today.

That is one of the key aims of this program not only sharpen the biblical worldview of Christians but to proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ that sinners can be made right with a holy God. Find out more by going to our website and reading what must I do to be saved, thank you for listening to and for supporting this radio ministry sure to take advantage of an current resource for a donation of any amount by Steve Lawson. Show me your glory. You can find out about and all our contact information is given right after this program, let's remember Jesus Christ and his word. They are the same yesterday and today and forever. So until next time think biblically live accordingly and stand firm. The mission of the Christian worldview is to sharpen the biblical worldview of Christians proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ. We hope today's broadcast encouraged for that and hear a replay of today's program or to sign up for the weekly email to find out what must I do to be saved to your website first or call us toll-free at 1-888-646-2233 Christian worldview as a listener supported ministry and furnished by the overcoming foundation, a nonprofit organization can find out more water resources make a donation become a monthly partner and contact us by visiting the Christian bowling toll-free 1-888-646-2233 writing to Box 41, Excelsior, MN 55331 Xbox 41 Excelsior, MN 55331.

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