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The good might have got cut off there. It ain't like I'm going to go check before I post this. I'm Bart Winkler. Welcome into the Winkler Verse. It's time for.
Mm-hmm, mm-mm. Our first of twenty. 25. It's just that that doesn't need to be said, but for some reason. It does.
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Again, the promo code. Is bored, the tinctures, the gummies. The lip balms, the pet spray, so on. and so forth. Also, if you are listening to the podcast audio form, It'll go right in.
If you are watching our weekly video, I'm going to direct you to the audio after this because we're going to hashtag tack it on. I'm tacking on an interview I did. With Wayne Lara V. Packers Radio Network on the Infinity Sports. Network show.
I had a nice chat with Wayne. Um I did ask him. My favorite question I asked him was. Don't you as a broadcaster Like Has this worn you down seeing the playoff loss? Like, it wears the fans down.
Does it wear you down? Are you like, oh, God. Here we go again. I also asked him what's more likely Packers Super Bowl. Or Milwaukee Panthers Horizon League Championship.
So I got. I got a secondary job. in there and uh he agreed to go out for beers with me and I agreed to pay. Neither of which will ever occur. But it was pleasurable on the radio, and I thank Wayne for his time.
I thank Grant Bills and Paul Immig for their time. It's been too long since we've done this. Nice view both.
Well, I Thought we were doing it last week. I set up my computer and I sat here for an hour and a half and nobody joined. That's not true. I was gonna say I don't think I feel like a real a-hole. No.
If that happened. Is there anything to tell the folks anything that's new in our lives over the last Two weeks. I think I tell the folks at home what's new in our lives. Um I I mean, I've been here. You guys are well, Grant, you've been rocking it on your show, I know.
Had a couple of great uh on locations. Yeah, that was fun. stressful. People just you feel like a zoo animal. Uh but it was fun.
Yeah. I'll say delivery change when you get a live audience. Is your delivery change?
Well, that's what's weird, it feels like it has to. It's like, I'm not a stand-up. You know what I mean? Like, it's just a radio show. It's not for live in-person IRL consumption.
But it was really fun. Nice crowds and Got to be home with my family for a full week. I think that's the longest I've ever been home since like the summer I came back after my freshman year of college.
So that was kind of fun. I drove through your hometown, but I forgot to take the picture each time.
Well, that's okay. There's two exits. I mean, it's you couldn't simply take up pig it's two It's too much of an expanse to take in one picture. I mean, it's a metropolis. Should have went to UW Stout.
I should have. How dare I miss out? This was on my trip to the The Twin Cities. which was a blur. Because it was so fast, I was there for such a short time.
You watched the third quarter of this game? I saw the entire quarter. I saw the entire game. Um I did. Did I tell?
I told you guys I went on a silent strike for two quarters. That's right.
Well, because they did the Vikings horn after a, no, not the horn. The horn they do after everything. But they did like skull Vikings. We da da da. Like they're banging on the drum all day after a field goal, and I got pissed, and I was like yelling.
And everyone looked at me. And I've been at some of these away games. Where I say something and then the other fans want to fight, and every Viking fan looked at me, and like no one said a thing. Oh, gosh darn that poor troubled boy Mm-hmm. And my friends like, shut up.
I go.
Okay. Didn't talk for two hours like a real pussy. I don't know how many people know. What the noise comes from, but at the Viking Stadium, they go. Do you know what I'm talking about?
That play that bass line. 20 times a game. Do you know what timeout? Uh It's a low, it's a low bass line. It's from a song.
There's a lot of noise in this building. There's a lot of production value to it. Which is um I think would be great. If you are a Vikings fan. It took a little bit away from the product for me.
We wanted to. My friends are debating where to sit, and I go, I want to sit. As high as possible, I want to see the field. Like an all-22 kind of frame. Yeah.
That's where I want to see plays develop. That's not my style.
Well, it wasn't either. It was the only way we could get in. We fucked up tickets bad. We could have got tickets $150 at the beginning of the season from Vikings.com. And my.
Buddy and my buddies agree. No, let's wait. The Vikings will be bad. Um I paid 400 to sit up top. Last row.
Oof. Here, I won't play more than three seconds, but just tell me if this sounds familiar.
Okay. Yeah, what song is that? It's stained mud shovel. Mud Shovel. They've been playing that at Vikings games forever.
But it's too much. Like, I read it. It's a really good song from like 25 years ago. Like, can you stop playing, Bud Shovel?
Well, we play Tad Rundgren, Paul. I'm not saying it's not like I just don't I want I don't want to hear a song I like 25 times you know I mean like I want to hear it when I want to hear it I almost would rather hear something I don't care about like Todd Rundgren Even the like interstitials of songs that the Packers play are all like Stop the rock, can't stop the rock, you know? It's like, okay. I do like that songs get a second life in Green Bay as it's a new hit. It's a new release.
I feel like it's still their first life in Green Bay, though. That's what I mean. It's a song's second life because it gets a postmark. Yeah, sure. It's pretty cool.
Well, good to see you guys. Packers lost that game. Packers lost. Against the Bears, which didn't sting as much as it should have because the game really didn't matter. The decision making at the end is bonkers, just flat out bonkers from Matt LaFleur.
I gotta get he and Goudakin's hot seat. Yeah. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. Plenty of these things get addressed when we hashtag tack it on with Wayne Larrabee.
Make sure you get it. Um when we hashtag tack it on. All right. Ready? Yeah.
By the way, I'm going to add a couple. national ones 'cause I want to ask them, but we obviously will start local. Regardless of the Christian Watson injury, and no, the season's not over yet, but we're not going to break down Packers Eagles, right? That's for other shows. You guys can do that.
We do the. Oh, I'll break it down. We're going to lose. I've heard you say that from a national perspective, hashtag.
So we'll stick with the bigger angles, though.
So, regardless of the Christian Watson injury, but probably especially because of it. The Packers need to go out and get or draft a wide receiver one. The Packers do not have a wide receiver one. They need to go get one this offseason in some capacity. Or mm-mm.
Grant, you've probably been talking about that more than me. Do you have any Grant bills. I think they need to draft a guy with size and speed. I think they need their. Their field stretcher, you know, a guy, Paul.
How would I best describe this? A guy who, um, well, a guy who could take the top off the defense, you know, a guy like that. They they need another one of those guys. But it doesn't have to necessarily be their wide receiver number one. What they need is for, I don't care, Dobbs, Reed, Wicks to.
To show up and to take a step and to play like a wide receiver one when necessary. Like, I don't think the failure everyone now is like accepting, like, oh, maybe we do need a wide receiver one. No, no, no, no. No, I don't think there's anything wrong with the roster construction. Reed and Dobbs and Wicks.
just didn't rise to the occasion when they needed to this year. I mean, their issue. But the, but you know, this again, we did this back in August, and then we reset it again in like mid-October. We took our guesses as to like the Packers will have a wide receiver one. And then midway through the year, we said wide receiver one is, and I don't remember where we've landed necessarily.
But they don't have one. Like we all thought they would, and they don't. They do not have a WR1, right? We agree with that. Yeah, but again, that's the issue.
I just need one of them to be able to have a wide receiver one performance when it's their week, and none of them have been able to. How many out of 17 games was there a wide receiver one performance? Less than a handful. I mean, I'm not looking at the stats, but like, not a lot. Reed had one or two in the first month of the season.
Dobbs had a couple. Nothing comes to mind. Nothing comes to mind where I'm like, oh, remember when Romeo Dobbs just ate for 160 yards that one week? Like, nothing comes to mind. Yeah.
So I say not only did they not have one, they did not have a wide receiver one, but yeah, they had very few wide receiver one performances individually.
So, not good part.
Well, and you alluded to it, but the conversation. that we're having and the discussion around it is the complete contradiction of what we were celebrating. We were celebrating this room. We were celebrating how we have all these guys. that they can all contribute, that they can all step up at any time.
And now one of them gets hurt. And so now we're thinking we don't have a wide receiver one. this whole time. Was Christian Watson, the wide receiver one? Without us saying it, because if Jaden Reid goes down or Romeo Dodds goes down, are we having wide receiver one conversations?
I'm not sure that we are. I think deep down we all thought Watson was wide receiver one. That's how we're treating it. If any of these other guys goes down, it's like, oh, that sucks, but I don't know. It would still suck, but I don't know that we, the conversation shifted to wide receiver one.
And I don't I don't know. I don't I don't like where it's going. I don't Think, I mean, obviously, there's teams that have one. It's like, oh, God. Jamar Chase would be balls to have on this team.
You know, CeeDee Lamb and Jefferson, and all these guys that are amazing would be incredible. Amon Rod, it would be great to have. on this team. I think there are other ways to build it. I think like The way we were getting at was Do the Ravens have a wide receiver one?
Yeah. I mean, Zay Flowers is their best receiver. He's wide receiver one. Is he a wide receiver? Is he?
Yeah. All right. 14th best wide receiver world.
So one of these guys then could be that. Maybe. At least that's what we thought. And you see, the Bills right now, I mean, I don't think that they have. A wide receiver one, but Shakir's been stepping up when need be, and they get their offense from other areas.
Josh Allen, a big part of that. Ah, the Chiefs. The Chiefs, for the longest time, didn't have one.
Now they have three of them from five years ago. But when they first got rid of Tyreek Hill, Travis Kelsey became the receiver one. I know he was a tight end.
So maybe maybe this Recipe of Packers. Wide receiver still works, but it depends on an emergence of Tucker Kraft. Becoming like the main Weapon, and I know that statistically and like eyeball tests, he ain't Travis Kelsey, but when you watch these games. He's getting looks and targeted, and especially in gotta have it situations. Tucker Craft's ending up with the football.
So. I think uh there's other ways There's other ways to get production at wide receiver without saying we must draft 6'3 210. And I feel like that's what we're going to get focused on. I think I'd be asking this to circle back. I think I would be asking this.
Regardless of the Christian Watson injury, but he was the highest drafted. Packers wide receivers sends Siobhan Walker or something, right? Early, early second round for Watson.
So he had the, we've talked about this going back a few months. He has the highest upside. If there was going to be a true wide receiver one, From draft position wise, it should be Watson. But If he plays next season, he's playing in December. He's in the fourth year of a four-year rookie contract.
That he's You know He's these like you can resign him sure, but it's not like okay, I'm gonna give you like 18 a year, 25 a year, like those that have passed. Maybe he comes in two years and he earns that in his seventh NFL season, but. that window with his injury has now Close, whereas this offs had he had a great third season, had Watson had a great year three. which he did not. And he didn't get hurt.
Which he did.
Now you're talking about a big extension this offseason where you can start to say, okay, well, how much is Watson, a healthy, having a great third season Watson worth? He would probably be, you know, like even with that, you'd still have some questions, but. He is hurt, seriously hurt. And He didn't have that great third year.
So I think you have to say: okay, if Watson even is part of this team in 2027. After he comes back from his ACL or 2026, after he comes back from his ACL, he's not. Gonna come back. as wide receiver one on the depth chart or on the unofficial anything.
So Um My answer is mm-hmm. I think they do. Need that, especially because how many years can you get this Josh Jacobs out of Josh Jacobs? Maybe one or two.
Well, you're going to get it again in 2026 and 2028. He's good every other year.
So there you go.
So next year is going to be a real challenge. And then I'll add to this, and this is a name that. I'm sure you'll talk about it, and we talked about it last offseason. But I did copy and paste into my notepad Ken Ingalls and his Asking about something related to our guy T. Higgins.
Ken says Packer should absolutely be. Hashtag in the mix. As Brian Goodekinst often is, but like. You have a chance to not take a risk in the draft and say, oh, I sure hope I hope this guy now magically can be the wide receiver one. The Packers have cap space.
This isn't like, oh, well, they don't have money. Like they do.
Now, so do a lot of other teams. But if you think T is a number one on the right, and maybe he's just as a flowers type. wide receiver one where he's the 12th best wide receiver one. Yeah, he's not Jamar Chase. Obviously, he's on the same team as Chase and was the clear cut number two.
But T is T is better than Z. They're different. I mean, they are different. I would too, but I think they're probably both stop with that. What?
So wh wh why are you calling him T? His name is T. I know his name is T, but Mr. Higgins, what do you want? The the issue is not they are The biggest issue, the Packers went, what, 11 and 6 this year?
From a wins and losses perspective, they took a nice step. The most disappointing part of this Packers season for me is that Jaden Reid regressed a little bit. Dantavian Wicks didn't take a leap. Romeo Dobbs was hurt. Christian Watson like.
I still like that room a lot. But I think maybe they're a year away, and if they want to add to that group, they can. I'd rather use. Extra draft capital or extra money trying to find the guy that Rashawn Gary is supposed to be to go on the D line because I think they need that more. But it's not like his name is Terrence, and I'm calling him T.
I know. It's not the fact that you're calling him his name, T. I don't know why you're referring to him as his first name. That's what I don't get. Yeah.
Well, do you refer to LeBron as James? Yeah. Yeah, because those two are the same. That's the same thing, Paul. See?
I'm just saying, I'm saying when you have an identifiable kind of unique first name. And your last name is just James or Higgins, it's more Representative to say Beyonce. No one calls him that. This is something that would piss you off. I don't know why you don't understand.
I was just about to say Jesus, but can I say that as a first name? Mr. Christ. Yeah. Mr.
Christ. For what it's worth, T's name is Tamaurice. Tamauris. Oh, but I okay. Other free agents available.
Stefan Diggs. No, thank you. Hard pass. Keenan Allen, fresh off his interception, throwing into trip coverage. Nope.
Pass. Mari Cooper? Pass. This is it. It's a bucket of these guys that are 28 to 32 years old.
Yeah, Godwin. I think it's Grant's boy T, or it's the draft. But I do.
So, again, because Watson is out, and like. When you're going into the season that the Packers are currently in, yes, they're in the playoffs. I know we're talking about the future, but that's what we do on the show. We don't do the go listen to Grant Bill's Wisco Sports Show if you want the Day of the Day. Or Keys Maldives Scantling.
What was the name? Um But You go from having like this season where you're like, okay, well, Watson's in his third year. Reed and Dobbs and Wicks are in their second year. Once you get past that, and now you're going into the fourth year of Watson, who's injured, the third year of Reed and Wicks and Dobbs, it's like. It starts to happen really quick where it's decision time.
Right. And so. You should know by the end of year two If a guy is going to become A bona fide wide receiver one. You usually know. Not always, though.
Not always, but like Adams took until year three. Like it, it can like to truly. And that's the cheap example.
So I wasn't going to use it, but you went ahead and used it. I'll take it. But the point is, it does happen. It's. But you usually know it happens more often for the Packers because they draft guys who don't know how to use their hands, so they need a couple of years to figure out how to catch the ball, and then once they finally put that together, then they're awesome.
That's the missing piece for all of these guys. Yeah. But the the Traditionally speaking, in the year two jump. Sure. is when you find out if most players are going to be 20 pounds on Jeff Janis and made him the tight end.
What if I still think he's going to play corner? What if the year two leap isn't as pronounced because you were ahead of schedule in year one? Just an argument that you could make. Wicks. Like Jordan Love.
Yes. Or just the team as a whole. I think there's lots of different ways. that you could make that argument. Yeah.
Or I'll tie a bow on it and say I would give A good deal of money to T. Higgins to have him be wide receiver one, especially. in the absence of christian watson i think that would be a huge changer because again like i Josh Jacobs, if the Packers Win games in the playoffs, it will be because Josh Jacobs was a beast. But Yeah. Running backs go quickly.
So like we should be Very careful where it's like, how many years? 26. But dude, like Josh Jacobs, who's a Beast, like it happens quickly. You, you, you running backs get old really fast, really fast. Derrick Henry fell off a cliff.
Okay, fine. I'm being a dick.
Sorry. I know it's just, it's just whatever happened, whatever happened after the Giants that go with Saquon. I'm glad. You're going to hear from him ever again? Chargers practice squad elite veteran Ezekiel Elliott might be the counterpoint to that.
Do you guys have any? Mm-hmm. Like percentage-wise. Optimism That they win this weekend. Yes.
Percent uh It's less than fifty, but yeah, I have optimism. I mean, I'm in the teens. Oh wow. You're an owner, Bart. Come on.
I don't think the Eagles are good enough to be that fearful. No, I think that the Pac I mean, they could beat the Eagles. What was your percent last year against Dallas? I don't know. I can't imagine there were people out there who had a lower percentage.
Bart and I loved last year's Cowboys team. But also, the thing is, and I preached this for two months going into the playoffs. They're not going to be scared to go down and play in Dallas. That's where they go to. You know, bat.
How many times have they gone down there and sucked a game? You just sucked the soul right out of the Cowboys. And I don't think they're scared to go to Philly either. I just. Swore Jordan Love threw his first career touchdown.
Right. Or did he throw one against it? Was the did he throw against the Chiefs? I think I'm real scarred by that final sequence from Matt LaFleur. I think I'm really scarred.
Thank you. Like, I've said this about him. There's a decision that needs to be made. I think if he could freeze time, go back to his office, really try to figure out what would, I think he'd come back with the right decision. And a guy pissed me off last night.
He's like. He called and goes. The Packers went in spite of LaFleur. You know how we always talk about better coordinator than a coach. I go, LaFleur's past that.
LaFleur's a good coach. The floors are good. Coach. But is he a great coach? And to do that, you're going to have to get.
to a Super Bowl probably, and he's had better teams than this. Where he's also made bad decisions that got made fun of on Jeopardy. This is what I pointed out earlier today. It's not like Matt LaFleur did not do the Dan Campbell thing where it's like you come in and your team stinks and you got to learn how to win. And then you got to learn how to make the playoffs.
And then you got to learn how to coach the playoffs. He was in the playoffs the first three years of his career.
So, for a coach who's been in the league, what is this, his fifth or sixth year, he has as much playoff experience as anyone could possibly have, save for a Super Bowl. this many years into his career. Right. So it's not like big moments, big games. It's it's not like the lights are too bright for him.
And I think he's a really good coach too, but then I watch him handle that. Like, what are you doing? Against the Bears.
Well, I didn't know. Or when he says, well, I didn't anticipate that. It's like, well, it just seems like part of the job. It seems like he's never or at least he doesn't ever feel he doesn't feel like I don't get the feeling from him that he feels like he's in control. I'll say, let me use this as an example.
I was doing I do my show most every day. I feel in control. I feel like. I know the beats, I know the rhythm. But not just about my own show, because I can take my show and, you know, do it anyway, because I did Gelb's show on New Year's Day.
But even though it's the same show in the same like You know, I could do the same show in the same Studio Something felt off to me where I felt like I was behind in breaks, where I was catching up on information because I didn't maybe have the full day like I'm used to to preparing, or I thought things were changing in front of me that. You know, at night, if there's something happening, I'm watching it. When when things happen during the day, it's like, okay, now I have to refresh. Uh, social media, and did I miss anything? And what's going on?
I just felt less in control. And I think that I get that feeling from LaFleur where Maybe he is in control, but things get away from it. It just feels like he's playing catch-up all the time, even if he's winning a football game.
So then his decisions get a little... fragmented I don't know. I did, by the way, I did hear you host Gelb. Last week Wednesday, Tuesday. A week ago today.
We could go today. And it was diff you, it was you were different. It was different. I'll tell you why. I'll tell you why.
Tell us why. 'Cause I had two producers. And I didn't know which one of them was in my ear. Oh, okay.
So I never went to either of 'em. Because I didn't know who I was talking to. Yeah. Is this the first time you've declared this or did you tell them this? I told Carlos off the air.
All right, so we had a good transition here. Also, it was New Year's Day and I was using that with all due. To the network. I was using that as my ramp up back into the swing of things. Yeah.
This is a good transition actually then into the second question I had. I don't know the answer to this. I don't think I know my answer. I'm curious what yours is. With the benefit of full hindsight.
You know everything that you know January 8th, 2025. You know the way that Rogers' career plays out. You know the way Jordan Love's career plays out. You know the way that Justin Jefferson's career plays out. with the benefit of full hindsight.
you would go back and find a way to draft Justin Jefferson. in that 2020 draft. Justin Jefferson was drafted. In the same round, in the same year. You're saying if you take Jefferson, if you can find because he went before love, right?
Correct.
So you would have gone up, you know, like, what, five more picks or something? You're saying, would you have traded, would you have tried to get Jefferson to pair him with Rogers? Yep. rather than going on to Jordan Love. And that would mean now your QB situation is question mark.
Maybe it was still Rogers because you didn't have a successor, and you had two terrible years, 2023 and 2024, were terrible because Rogers was hurt and old, and now you don't know who your quarterback is. But you had Justin Jefferson with 2020 Rogers, 2021 Rogers, 2022 Rogers, which were. you know two or three of those were pretty good years for a quarterback Very good years in one instance. Full benefit of hindsight. That means you don't have love now.
You still have Jefferson, but your QB situation is a huge mystery. Maybe you won a Super Bowl. Maybe you got further. We don't know. But knowing everything you know about Jefferson, Love, and Rogers.
Full benefit of hindsight, you would go back in time, find a way to get up a handful more of picks and draft Justin Jefferson instead. Mm-hmm. Or mm-mm. By the way, these are my favorite topics. They're so hypothetical.
There's no right answer. Go for it.
Well, so the reason you would do this is you're thinking. This could get you a Super Bowl, of course.
So where would we rather be? Would we rather be here? With There's still too many people who are out on, or not totally convinced, on Jordan Love. Mm-hmm. Um but I believe we have a franchise quarterback.
Okay, so would you rather be here with the franchise quarterback? And if it's part of your liking, see the utter failure of Rodgers. in uh New York. Or would you rather be lost? And have had a Super Bowl.
Because if you have a Super Bowl with Rodgers and maybe he retires or whatever, then maybe you drafted. I don't know, Spencer Rattler. Maybe you got maybe Rogers retired, and you have Sam Darnold, and he's here and he's having a season. Um So if we're assuming That we would have gotten a Super Bowl.
Okay. And then the future is unclear. You certainly had a better chance at a Super Bowl in those three years with Jefferson than with Love. Obviously, one sat on the bench, the other ascended to be one of the best in the league. My hesitation with this.
Is that If we were going to get another Super Bowl with Rodgers, I wanted it to come in the middle of the teens.
Okay. I didn't want a Super Bowl with this Person.
Okay. I don't like Rogers. What?
Yeah. Where's the breaking motor sound effect? Everyone wants to think whatever. I don't know. I don't know that I could have.
I mean, obviously, I would have, but. It wouldn't have been as I don't know. I'm fine. I'm going to stay where we are. I'm taking the blue pill.
I'm staying where we are. I'll take Jordan love, I won't learn from my mistakes.
Okay. Now, what I would what what w what would be my ultimate ultimate? would be to fire McCarthy after 2014. Sure. A new coach.
Hmm. Fail with him, rehire McCarthy in 19. And win multiple Super Bowls. Or or I would just be like Oh, my God We've got Joe Callahan and Brett Hundley. Yeah, maybe I will give Kaepernick a call.
That I would have done. Re-ask me the question, Paul. With the benefit of full hindsight. You would go back. And find a way, by the way, let me just preface and say Justin Jefferson went 22.
Overall, love 26.
So you would have had to get up another four spots from when the Packers were, but let's just take that for what it is. Benefit of full hindsight of knowing how Rogers' career played out, Jefferson's career, and Love's career played out. you would go back, find a way to get up those four extra spots. Draft Justin Jefferson instead of love. Mm-hmm.
Or mm. Because I, and this is a matter of opinion, I don't think they would have won another Super Bowl. I don't think Justin Jefferson would have been the difference. Interesting. I I don't I don't think that team had it in them.
And part of that is Rogers, part of it is LaFleur, young LaFleur. I just don't think they had it in them.
So I would say no, because they Might have been fun, but I don't think the team is in a better spot today because of it. And I don't think there's ultimately what matters, I don't think there's an extra Lombardi trophy in the case because of it.
So, no, I would take the quarterback. Is there anything we like? Is there anything we could have done over the last 15 years? Like what's the what's the biggest thing we could have done? Not drafting TJ Watt.
Not having not having Julius Pepper say no moss and Morgan Burnett. Yeah. I mean That was a criminal act. Yeah. Yeah.
But yeah, outside of in-game decisions, is it I mean, really, it's drafting TJ Watt? Probably. Yeah. Have you ever watched him? He's pretty good.
Yeah, I watched him sit in the back room of Waukesha Sports Cards with his parents and not come out until a minute after the designated time while Vince Beagle and Daria Gumbawale and Corey Clement were sitting there ready to talk to fans, and TJ Watt was already acting like he was star of the ball.
Well, I mean TJ Watts, awesome. Daria Gumba Wale Could kick if need be. Corey Clement won a Super Bowl. And what did Vince Beagle do? Oh, that's the one we got.
That's right.
He's the one guy who's been drafted off the Packers defensive or Badgers defensive front who's absolutely blown chunks. What about hiring Jim Leonard as defensive coordinator? That would have been interesting. Yeah. Yeah.
They can't find a star on defense to save their ass unless they pay him to play safety. They finally found him because they signed him. What about drafting T. Higgins? What about drafting Terry McLaurin instead of your boy at tight end?
I hate that Sternberger gets to have a brand off joking about that. I think that's fucked. And it bothers me. And anytime he jokes about it, like, you know, certain sects of Packers' Twitter is like, he has a great sense of humor. Like, no, I don't think he should.
No, I don't think he should. Can Bostik joke about his thing? No. I think you should get to do anything about it except for maybe write a book.
Something shitty happens to you in life. You should everyone should be able to write a book about it. It doesn't mean anyone has to buy it, but you should be allowed to write one. That's just my take, though.
So The benefit of full hindsight thing So let me ask you this then. Jordan Love is currently, as it stands right now today, the blank best quarterback in the league.
Well, the athletic rankings every week, they have 'em six, seven, eight. Ri like overall? The way he's played. Are you talking about pro football focus or the athletic as like a subjective person? Their QB rankings, yeah.
Do you really think he's the sixth, seventh, or eighth best quarterback in the league? No, I would think he is behind Josh Allen. Mahomes. I will currently put him behind Herbert. Mm-hmm.
I will put him behind Lamar and Burrow.
So is that five? Five. I'm going to say he's better than Stroud right now. Yeah, Stroud, I have a question about that, but yeah. I think Jalen Hurts is better than people think, so I'll put him there.
I think so, too. I'm not ready to put Daniels over him. You're gonna you might have to do that soon, but okay. I think Dak Prescott is still above.
Sorry. Um Like Goff and Darnold, these guys I still. He's top ten. Jordan loves a top 10 quarterback. You just named like 12 guys who you think are better than him, though.
I wasn't sure about Goff or Darnold. And that's without even really contemplating any of the rookies: Daniels, May. Panex Nix. Yeah. Caleb?
Let me put it this way: I've seen Jordan Love play like a top five quarterback. What about Baker? What about Bryce? Stafford? Stafford.
I think that's his comp. What about Purdy? I think Stafford is his comp. Get white hot when you need to, make some mistakes, you miss some throws, but the high-end play is so good, you can win a Super Bowl with it. You just need to tap into it at the right time.
I think that's Love's comp. Grant, you don't need to name every quarterback, but. Just ballpark, where are you putting love? Right now, best quarterback. Blank.
ranked quarterback number what? Right around tenth. 10th to 12th. But even what's the lowest he is? What's the lowest?
14th? He's not worse than 15th. Also, if he comes out and lights it on fire against Philly on Sunday, people are claiming that he's top five. You know what I mean? And part of it too is what if I mean, this is kind of why I would advocate for a boatload of money to T.
Higgins. I'm not saying again that T is a top 10 wide receiver in the league, but even if he's the 12th best receiver in the league. Currently, the Packers' best receiver is the league's 35th best receiver? Sure. So, like, so my point is: 35th, 36th, which is how many percent you can get off at happyplacehemp.com right now with promo code boards.
But now you say that out loud, Paul. It's like, so we're paying the 12th best edge rusher. We're paying the 12th best receiver. We're paying the 12th best quarterback. But if you have enough of those, first of all for me, the T thing also then kind of comes down to like, Do I think a year?
Do I think this offseason I'm paying Christian Watson? No, obviously, because of the entry.
Next offseason, do I think I'm extending Dobbs or Reed or Wicks? For mega, no, no, not exact. I hope they extend them. I hope they progress to get extended. But is it like mega money extension where I have to like set aside cap space from 2026 because I'm setting it aside for Dobbs or Wix or Reed?
I hope they progress enough to get extension. But I don't think you're like, okay, well, we better set aside 15% of the cap for Jaden Reid. I don't think that.
So I think you get a T. Higgins. To help prove where love really is and what happens if we actually have. A caliber of receiver of Higgins. I call them Higgins just for you, Grant, rather than T.
Thank you. All right. So I don't know. I'm going to stick with what you said.
Okay. I'll very Pencil in an agreement, of course, of do not go back with hindsight, but. I think if love is a top 10 from now until 20. 33. If he's always hovering around the 10th, then you did the right.
Yeah. Um But Yeah, let me let me say this. Yeah, go ahead. You got more.
Well, Grant was just talking about you have the 12th best this, the 12th best of that, the 12th best of this. And I was thinking, because with Jordan Love, like, You're paying If you have a guy. There's a lot of good quarterbacks in the league. Yeah. So if you if you get one that's slightly behind, like The way that you did it, the guy you got, the guy you drafted, he's good.
But he's not still not as good as these other guys. Then you're gonna be able to do that. What are you gonna do? You're not gonna pay him. You're gonna try to find, you're gonna try to find a lottery ticket for somebody better, or you're probably gonna end up with someone worse.
But What Grant was saying got me thinking, like. In the NBA, I think there's a team. That has done a lot of things right. They've done the right moves. They've done the right things, but they're just, their guys still aren't as good as everybody else.
And that's the Kings. Yep. Oh, I thought you were going to say thunder.
Well, the thunder are great. Oh, sure. Yeah. I don't know if my audio came through 40 seconds ago, and I said, then they're the Kings. The Kings, yeah.
And also, regarding the Bucks. There's a new ringer article. Like, everyone, the way people rush the shit on the box. Zach Cram. Just let's see them.
They're going to be in the playoffs. They're going to play a playoff series. If they lose it, then write the articles. We're all so fucking quick to shit on the box. We gotta write something.
The whole website's gotta be populated. Oh yeah, right about right about What about the Bart Winkler show? The headline is stuck in neutral. And I do feel that I brought this up on I do our rock morning show on every Tuesday. And they're like, What do you think of the Bucks?
I'm like, Well, when their stars don't play, we complain that their stars never play. And when their stars play and they don't win, it's like, well, their stars are never playing together. How can we expect them to be good? It's like, well, then when it, I don't know. I don't know.
I do want to ask you about Chris Middleton to the bench. But I don't want to take the The off-ramp that you've just offered because I want to ask you two quick NFL questions. Yes. From a hashtag national perspective. Bryce Young will have a better career than C.J.
Stroud. I was hoping you'd go here. I'm just mad how wrong I was on that. Which piece? The I I mean, I thought Bryce Young was good.
But I didn't like that they benched him. And then they benched him, and then he came back and was good almost because of it. Turned out great. Shout out to that Andy Dalton car accident, I guess. Seriously.
I I mean it only the Panthers. Will he be better than CJ Stroud? Better career. I think we're gonna, I think, you know how a DNA strand looks where it's like twisted? Yeah.
Yep. That's going to be the graph of these guys.
Okay. They're just going to keep weaving in front of each other. Everyone's down. But they're both good. Yeah, they I mean both teams have their starter Bryce Young is We we all agree like This is the best quarterback in the draft.
This is the second best quarterback, not even a quarterback player. Yeah. And then they come out and go 0 and 5 on a team that sucks ass and we're like Oh, this guy's fucking terrible. And I knew it. I was telling ya.
I told you. They should have taken a D-tackle from Alabama. Yeah. They'd be one and four right now. Instead of yeah, right.
And I mean Jacoby Brissette. Be their quarterback. Or in that tier.
So granted. Bart kind of opted out with his DNA thing, but Better career, Bryce Young more than C.J. Shroud, mm-hmm, or mm-mm. I think Bart's answer is really good. And I don't just want to pass and say I agree with Bart, but I think it'll come down to.
Which coaches are surrounding them. And who's building a better roster? And actually, I might trust Carolina a little bit more.
Well, I think it's good. He's an offensive guy. I like their front office. Our boy Eric Eager's in there. You know, he's shaking the trees.
Yeah, Eric Eager ain't going somewhere to fail. Yeah, uh-huh. That's what I'm saying. And Damik O'Ryan's. Damiko Ryan's every, oh, culture loves that.
Okay, but. And it's the same with Dan Campbell. I think he's great at creating culture too, but if you don't have the men at the wheel on both sides of the ball to scheme it up and to call the plays. Like, you can only go so far.
So, I think if Bryce Young has his. His coach, Dave Canalis, and that team can actually build around them, and they should be able to. Like, I don't know, I think it'll come down to. coaching and roster and and I think they'll probably go back and forth, like Bart said. If next one, last one for the NFL.
If you are the NFL league office. You would say that the most attractive wildcard weekend game The Packers and Eagles.
Well, you've already said that. You've already said that. Yeah. Who's who's you? Me?
The NFL. They gave him the prime spot. Which spot? You're saying the 3:30 sat Sunday game? 3:30 Sunday is the most viewed game of the weekend.
It's America's game of the week. That bet block gets more viewers than Sunday Night Football. Even, even like, are you saying on a typical playoff week? Are you saying during the regular season? During the highest-rated window of all of NFL is that block.
Sure, but is that true in the playoffs? Yes. Well, so they put that game there, yeah.
Okay, I thought I saw something from last year that the Sunday night game.
Well, maybe it's maybe it's matchup dependent. I don't know. It's two massive brands with playoff history. Logos. uh championship pedigree Outside under the lights and the elements.
Oh, yeah, Chargers, Texans in a dome. That's going to look great on TV. Which leads me to my question. Here's my question. Is Chargers Texans?
More Buccaneers. Commanders or is Commanders Buccaneers more Chargers Texans? That makes sense. I mean, I get it. Unfortunately, it does, yes.
Because I think Buccaneers. I think Buccaneers Commanders is pretty Chargers Texans.
Okay. I know what you mean. Tough. Yeah, I get what you're saying. And the second most attractive matchup is Steelers-Ravens or Yuck.
No. Anything with the Steelers, I'm out on. I took the chance. They threw that on Prime, dude.
So that's what I'm wondering. Like, is that because they wanted to give their new partners at Prime a good matchup, or because they wanted to give them the shittiest, or not the shittiest? Steelers, Ravens, every broadcast network has had this game 17 times in the last 18 years. You're saying they didn't want it, like these other networks. If there's a game to give up, it's like, all right, you can take your spin on this rivalry.
Now, Wild card upset most likely of the weekend. Who do you like? The baller thing to say is Rams over Vikings. Oh, yeah, that's mine. That is mine.
Dan Campbell, I agree. Who told Kevin O'Connell? When he said that, when he said, see you in two weeks, I go, this motherfucker, he knows what he's doing. He knows the Vikings are going to see him a third time and then beat him.
So he's given the Rams bullet. Because I swear, Kevin O'Connell's face was like, You shithead. He didn't like that he said that. See you in two weeks. Campbell, that's his best move yet as Lions coach.
I, you know, what I love is going into Vikings Lions, the prevailing thought, you might have disagreed, but I think the big picture thought if you surveyed 100 or 1,000 people was. Mm-hmm. I mean, the Lions, they can't stop anybody. Shit, Sam Darnold might be the MVP if he wins this weekend. And what's stopping this Vikings team from winning the Super Bowl?
And then when they get the one seed, the Lions, they'll probably be out in the first round. And then the Lions knock a block off the Vikings, and it just flips completely. It's like, well, Sam Darnold's awful. They're going to lose to the Rams, and no one's beating the Lions. Like in one evening, it completely flipped on its head, which I guess is why the NFL is great, but.
And I kind of bought into it both ways going in. I'm like, I. Man, I think the bike this bike is. You know, I might ride the Rams. Eh, out, eh, oh.
What?
Kind of buying into the Rams. I don't think I am. Cooper Cup looks washed, and it just, they're winning. I love McVay. But No one does a good McVeigh impression.
Have you noticed that? Yeah, it's a bummer. Actually, I lied. There was one more I wanted to ask you on the NFL. Anything vis-a-vis coach openings?
I'm not buying this Belichick shit for a second. No, it got shot down already. I think. Let's be clear. Diana Rossini shut it down, which means it's very viable as a possibility.
What is with the Diana Rossini slander? He's wrong a lot, is what the slander is. Is she? Yeah, I don't trust Diana Rossini. I agree with Rogers on that one.
I mean, she she has a lot of strikeouts looking. On her on her own. She's not Bob Nightingale. What are you talking about? I mean, she kinda is.
Okay, okay, okay. Sure, sure, sure, sure. No, you're right, you're right. Belichick's coming back. But there was like an hour this afternoon where it's like Belichick's going to coach the Raiders.
And now I feel like that's kind of the crazy thing is that it would be Tom Brady. coaxing it back. Like, that's the oddest part is. Yeah. That if that relationship Brady and Belichick was as Done as it was reported to be.
Oh, didn't you watch the roast? They were buddies. The roast brought everyone together.
Well It brought Brady's ex together with someone new. What's the best coach opening in your guys's mind's eye?
So let's go through them real quick. Bears, Raiders, remind me all these. Jets, Saints is the word.
Some of them are so bad they're not even worth remembering.
So, is it the Bears, the Patriots, the Saints, the Jets? The Jets should hire Rex Ryan. I believe that. I would want I would want well. Hmm.
I don't think any of them are good. That's why they're all open, guys. I think that well, that's the okay, but every once in a while. There's a job that like Chargers was great. Packers, when it opened, was great.
I think the Patriots is the best job. I don't think it's close. It's either for me, it's either Patriots. Majors of a quarterback. And they have an owner that wants to win.
Yeah, and even though he fucked up this whole thing. Yeah. I don't think that he Um Is gonna like Get in the way. I mean, he let Belichick run things for the longest time. I don't trust Shad Khan to, I mean, he doesn't even know if he's going to fire his GM, depending on the coach.
That was interesting. Yep. By the way, Paul. A E W W E AEW took advantage when WWE got shitty again because of Vince. They gotta do something.
This WrestleMania season. I'm worried about the E. I did not enjoy. That m that first raw. I think they I think that was a very bad product.
I heard so much positive stuff about the E this week. Because you're hearing it from people who don't watch the E. Yeah. If you actually care and why, it took two years of his storyline with The Rock being a bad guy. Oh, stupid.
And he came out and was putting over Cody Rhodes. And then Cody Rhodes was like, oh, shucks, G. He's not happy. Nope. Bad.
Yep. Um, so AEW has they they need to get their shit together in the next four months. Yeah. Well, I think as long as they just keep leaning into being like the wrestling company, like that's that's what that's their niche, right? WWE is going to always be like the entertainment brand, and that's for some people, and that's fine.
It's not for me. I think AEW needs to go wrestle in cool places too. Like the ballroom they did. The ballroom thing was so cool. Like they need to go wrestle on a ship, like with Jericho's shit.
Yeah, that's a yeah. Just go wrestle at a county fair or something. Cool venues are like WCW back in the day did their thing from Disney World. From Hollywood Studio Magic, what do they call it? MGM Studios at the time.
Do you know that? I saw Billy Schmidt once wrestling in front of Casablanca on Brady Street. They need to set up a ring there and do it. Cool venues are a big deal. They really are.
Okay. All right, you want to do anything else, or should we do bucks a different time? Oh, we can slip in a box if you're okay with it. I kind of want to ask about Chris Middleton to the bench, but I don't know how consequential it really is for the closing lineup.
So here's the one I'll ask you because. It was in a group chat with buddies the other night. If John Horse works out a Jimmy Butler trade, it would have to include Conneton, Portis, and Middleton. Let's say we do one for ones. I'm so confused.
So, if if Pat goes three-way, yeah, because Conaton would have to go into cap space for another team. That would allow you to aggregate salaries, and then you could combine Porters with Middleton.
So it's doable. It is doable, but let's just say John Horst has everything agreed to, it's all set. And it's essentially You know, it's Middleton out, it's Porters out, it's Connetton out, it's Butler in. John Horst has it all worked out. He should first call Giannis and legitimately ask Giannis for Giannis' opinion.
Who's getting traded, Middleton? Middleton, Portis, and you can't trade Middleton without asking Giannis. That's where I'm at, too. The bond is too deep. Also, the only reason the honest would say no, right?
The only reason. And I do not want Jimmy Butler here at the age of, I think people forget 35. Or even, yeah, six. Yeah. The only reason I would be tickled.
About a Jimmy Butler. Dame Giannis Big Three. is that it would be Heat culture. In Milwaukee. Everything they've tried to do and put together.
for the last five years. Fucking would have happened in Milwaukee. I didn't think that's it. I think that would just be splendid. We wouldn't win shit.
But we probably won't anyway. I mean we won the NBA Cup. But just that like jab at the heat, like 10 years of Giannis wants, Giannis wants, yeah. How about we get all your targets? Right here.
Yeah. Granted. Horse has it all worked out. He should. legitimately Ask Giannis' opinion before doing it.
Or mm-mm. He should ask Giannis' opinion or he should just do it. No, he should ask Giannis' opinion. Sure. Yeah.
So you do want to clear it. You want to clear it first. Yeah, see what he says. What if he says no? Definitely not.
Don't do it 'cause tr 'cause Giannis is very loyal. He will do it because I don't really care whether they do it or not. Wow. I think Chris and Jimmy Butler are different versions of the same thing. Like, neither one can stay healthy for long stretches.
Both are. Totally uh capable of turning it on in the playoffs and they need to Neither gives you a ton of defense. Both are old and expensive.
So, okay. If Janice wants to do it, sure. And if not, sure. How about this then? The Bucks, as currently constituted, can win the finals.
Or Not will, but can. I mean can. Yeah, I think they can. You do? Mm-hmm.
They have one of the best players in the league. It puts you in the conversation. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. The benefit, by the way, is I should say about this hypothetical Butler for Middleton Porter's and Conentin thing: you do shed a lot of money off of next year's.
cap because of Middleton's deal. Because of Fortis's deal, because of Conenton's deal, and because Butler is expiring.
So in theory, you can. You can wipe a lot off the books for the 2025-2026 season.
So there is like the future benefits that even if it were to fail. and butler walks or whatever else, you do have a You're no longer on the second apron stuff. You have cap advantages. to doing it even if this year's team with that wouldn't win at all. Isn't Jimmy, isn't his contract done in like a year or two once he this?
I mean, he's essentially expiring. All right. Well, that's interesting. Yeah. That's appealing.
Um it is. One last complaint. Remember when Ben Johnson was like, I'm only interviewing for jobs I would want? Took at least three interviews, didn't he? Yeah, he's going to meet with the Raiders and Patriots, Friday, Bears and Jaguars on Saturday.
I feel like I feel like society needs to Come back a few steps on Ben Johnson. No, wrong. I think we need to trace it back. Don't He should stay in Detroit. Continue to enjoy enjoy Dan Campbell's Shield.
Not go somewhere where he's gonna suck ass. Good. It depends on what he wants. I've heard your take, Bart, that As a Packers owner, the team you least, the coach you least want to end with the Bears is McCarthy. Yeah.
I want to think you're joking. That's a terrible take. Must not. It is. Yeah.
Because McCarthy is Like A grown-up? Good with quarterbacks? Zero bust potential. Zero bus potential. Not going to put Packers Bears over.
Hey, Mike, Mike, you used to play for the Packers. What do you think? Is that rivalry pretty big? Is that you really want to beat them, huh? Look, if we beat the Packers on our schedule, we beat the Packers.
I'm here to win one thing, and that's the Super Bowl. I'm not going to focus on one game, one rivalry. It's a great rivalry. I've been a part of it, but I'm going to focus on the Super Bowl. Unlike every answer that's ever been given by anyone in my position, I am a bigger picture guy, I am a champion.
You don't you don't win championships just by winning divisions. I know that. You don't win championships just by beating the Bears or beating the Packers. You win championships by going all the way. And I think we have what it takes to do that.
All I'll say is, yes, McCarthy raises their floor. But McCarthy could go there for four years, raise the floor, and then he'd have to leave, though, for someone else to come in and. Ascend them further. Why? I disagree.
He's won a Super Bowl. This is what's so funny with me about winning. When people talk about Matt LaFleur, it's like you can't win the big one. You know who has won the big one? Tomlin, who people want to get rid of.
John Harbaugh, Ravens fans are like, when's this guy going to win again? Mike McCarthy, who no one respects. Like I was just starting my Packers beat career the last time Mike McCarthy has been to a Super Bowl. It was a long time ago. You were in seventh, sixth grade.
It does really start with me. They're not wrong. I'm just saying, like, it's a long time. Even when you're out of it, you never truly are. Were you in sixth grade when Mike McCarthy was last in a Super Bowl?
Grant. Seventh grade. Thank you. It's been a long time. It was a great year.
I want to hear more about one. Uh I I don't I don't know. McCarthy, I don't know that people would be psyched about McCarthy, but there's no bust potential there. There's no bus potential, but I mean, you're the...
So, if you're the Bears and you're basically just saying, can you please just raise our floor a little bit? Is that really what you're settling for? Yeah, it's what the Bucks did with boot and holes where they won a championship. I don't know if I agree that Boone. I mean the Okay.
I don't know. It felt like their ceiling before that. And I remember listening to Buck's postgames with Radio Joe was just like, just get. the eight seed and get some experience. Just get in there so you know what the playoffs feel like.
Like that was what we were dying for.
So are you really, are you really anointing? Are you saying McCarthy is a QB guru? Is that, I mean, are we really hearing? No, I'm saying I'm not saying he's a QB guru, but I think I'd trust him with Caleb Williams. He's a known quantity in a way that Ben Johnson is not.
Yeah. Brian Flores is not, and I like Brian Flores, but And Ben Johnson, Ben Johnson's going to be like, oh, geez, this is my big shot here. I got to do good. McCarthy's just gonna be like. Man, I've been bouncing around all these places.
I just had a deal with Jerry Jones. I just want a coach. Did you guys see Jerry Jones and are either of you watching The Landman, by the way? I saw the clip of him acting. I have not been able to do it.
That's unbelievable. I've watched it 10 times. I can't, how is it so good? What is it? He's he did a cameo of himself in Taylor Sheridan's new show.
Who is that? He's the guy who made Yellowstone. And he's he's visiting. John Hamm and Billy Bob Thornton, I think, are like these two super rich oil men. And John Hamm's in like a hotel bed.
And Jerry Jones comes in and like lectures them like, this is how I've lived my life. built my fortune and it's It's with my kids, and he like he's like on the verge of it's unbelievable acting. Like, it's really, I'll have to send it to you.
Well, you know that I'm more of a broadcast TV guy, which, by the way, today, Wednesday, January 8th. Hold on.
Sorry. There's a big Debut coming up in just a few hours. Where our boy Tim Allen is back in switching gears. That's tonight. Before an all-new Abbott Elementary with a it's always sunny in Philadelphia crossover.
We're watching this. Big night on broadcast TV. Big Abbott Elementary household, we are. Oh, very good. We just finally caught up.
Very good. Are you shitting on me? By saying like I'm shitting on up. No, we just finally caught up on Abbott. We finished it.
We're up to it. I thought you were saying, oh, you guys finally caught up to something that everyone's been watching. I'm like, I don't, I don't know. Like, are we no, we've been watching it and have finally caught up on the rest of the season. Oh, okay.
Okay. Okay. But now there's a show I want to watch this crossover tonight. But I can't. Colin's sick.
Well, when am I going to watch it? I can't watch it before work. I can't watch it after work. I got to watch it with my wife. When am I going to watch it without her tomorrow?
Mm-hmm. Plus, I'm trying to cram through the first season of Severance. Again, it's being called generational. It's so fucking good. It's ridiculous.
Even re-watching the first episode, I'm like, oh my fucking God, this is so goddamn good. It's so fucking good. Remember this season, like this new season of Severance, like they had to pause it for like a year because of like, you know, 100% reviews, 40 critics, 100%. That's a really almost impossible thing to follow up on. And they, even with like the internal strife that the show had.
Apparently they've achieved it. Are they doing that week by week or are they dumping week by week through March? Through March. All right. Well, we're just going to wait then.
I don't like to do the I'm not I don't like the episodic thing. You would have never cut it in the broadcast TV era. I don't even know how I did. I mean, clearly, I grew up with the same stuff you did, but now I'm a binge guy. Boys, thank you for your time.
You as well. If you are on the YouTube. Head on over to the Audio. We're going to hashtag tackon Wayne Larravy. If you're on the audio.
I'm going to insert some commercials and it will play right after. These words. Green Bay Packers getting the win over the Saints in week 16, 34-0. The voice you heard there, Wayne Lara Voice. of the Packers Radio Network.
Packers, since then, maybe not so good. I watched that Saints game the first half with my kid. That was our bedtime routine. And he woke up and he thought it was so funny that the Saints ended with Zero. 'Cause it had not happened yet this season and zero's a funny number for kids.
Um So it was a very good father-son-Packer night for me as a Packer fan. But then he also is one of these He's a kid.
So if he's rooting for the Packers the whole game and then the Vikings win, well, guess what? He was rooting for the Vikings the entire time. And he was rooting now for the Bears the entire time.
So I'm a little worried that we're going to get to this playoff game and he's going to root for the Packers with me and then tell me. He was rooting for the Eagles the entire time as they do lose to Minnesota. And lose to Chicago. And we'll start there. Wayne Laravey, again, Packers Radio Network.
Wayne, good to talk to you. I I just the I think the big conversation About any team that, I mean, it was a tough loss in Minnesota, it was a tough loss to Chicago. I know that fans get apprehensive because you want to be coming in just like riding a rocket into the playoffs. You also don't want there to be questions that is this kind of stuff going to happen in the postseason. But it's a new season and you should be able to turn the page.
So are the Packers sort of in that turn the page mode? Are they a little worried about some of the stuff that's happened the last couple of weeks? Where are they closer to at this point from your vantage point? Show.
Well You know, Bart, it's easier for the players. I mean, they turn the page quicker than we do. That's for sure. The fans and the observers and that type of thing. Players, you know, they flush it.
Monday, they came in, they flushed it out. They saw the mistakes and everything else and they'll be in tomorrow. The start of the work week, and they'll be focused totally on Philadelphia. And that's whether they won the Bears game or not. But I I agree with you.
You know, they they knocked out New Orleans thirty four to nothing and You know, but they weren't real sharp. I mean The offense wasn't really hitting on all cylinders, but it was the Saints. They were depleted. And you know, the Packers playing at home. And so then the next week you go to Minnesota for that big game, and the Vikings had their way.
And the following week, you've got the Bears who are pulling out all the stops and doing all kinds of stuff because. You know, it's the end of their season, it's the end of that team, and uh, there'll be a new team next year, so you Um, it was an interesting finish to to the season. You'd like to see a young team like this go in on a on a um positive note with wins in their last three or four games, but that's not the way it is.
So this team will have to go to the playoffs and flush it out and hope they can turn the page. Again, I'll uh you know approach some of these Questions I'm asking you from a broadcast standpoint. But also, I mean, I'm not shy that I'm a Packer fan. Slash. owner And I would think that One of the conversations that has been going on, at least in some Packer corners, has been like the hot seatness of Matt LaFleur.
And I don't want to do that with you. I don't think that that's a real thing. I think that as Matt LaFleur comes into these playoffs, I'm not, I mean, this is not Matt LaFleur's best team that he's come into the playoffs with, I don't think.
However, if I am worried or concerned Or wondering about how something's going to play out in these playoffs. It might be more Matt LaFleur than it is. The players, and I've been very pro LeFleur. I think that he's done wonders. I think navigating the Rodgers to love thing, I mean, I don't know how a lot of people do that and still be the coach of this team in all this time.
It just, the lad, how that game ended. And some of this stuff, and it's a time management problem with a lot of these coaches throughout the league, it seems like. But how that game ended, and it seemed like he wasn't sure. Maybe that was just he wasn't sure what he wanted out of that game. But I would be more.
I think Apprehensive about a Packers deep run because I'm worried about some of the management stuff from the coach rather than the players. And I don't know if I should be feeling that way or not. Yes, you know what? I don't think so, Bart. I think and you're right.
Hey, listen, time management is not as easy as we on the couch think it is. You know what I mean? Um it's it's a lot more difficult than than that. And you're exactly right. I mean, teams, coaches throughout the NFL struggle sometimes with that.
But no, the job Matt LaFleur has done and he has Control and command of that locker room. But you got to understand, this is a young team. And, you know, when they came off of Aaron Rodgers, Basically, there was a three-year process put into place. Uh what changed the process? No the process didn't change.
What changed were the expectations when they went to the playoffs at the seventh seed last year and knocked off a 12-5 Dallas team, and that blew them out. And then the next week played pretty well against the San Francisco team that, between you and frankly, wasn't playing very well coming off their bye week.
Now, they were the best team in the league, San Francisco, last year, no doubt about it. But they weren't playing that well in January. And they, you know, the Packers had a chance to beat them in the fourth quarter. The Lions should have beaten them the next week. They were up 24-0.
And the the Niners somehow got to the Super Bowl and then played their best game. Of the postseason in the Super Bowl and lost in overtime to Pat Mahomes and the Chiefs. We all know how that went. But so, you know, my point is this.
Okay, this Packers team is is improved. This team is on the right tur trajectory. But the best team the Packers are going to have They're going to be at their best next year. After this draft kicks in, and they're top of the draft, they have injuries. They're going to get an offensive lineman who's going to start Jordan Morgan.
They're going to get a running back who will give them a third-down dimension in Marshawn Lloyd next year. These kids that are playing now on defense and doing a tremendous job at Duran Cooper, Bullard and Williams will all be in their second year and should take a jump up. This is going to be a good football team next year if they have a good draft and they're going to be able to add, because they're out from under the salary cap issues, they're going to be able to add a couple of more free agents. And I think next year is when they're going to have their best team. That's my opinion.
But I know that the Dallas game and the way last season ended in the postseason. That changed the projections. And I'm not talking about observers, I'm talking about people in the organization. And they're going for it this year, and they feel like they had a shot at it, and that's great, and they should, and they should go for it.
Well, there's been, I mean, they're in.
So, yeah, you're going to go for it. Wayne Larravey, Packers Radio Network. But there's been plenty of teams that you have seen that have been. You know, super, like, okay, the Packers are favored to win the Super Bowl. They are the number one seed.
The road's going to go through Lambeau Field. And of all these teams that have done it, it was a six-seeded team, the lowest seed at the time back in 2010, who had injuries, kind of, you know, okay, gonna go to Philadelphia, probably lose, didn't lose.
So they're certainly going to do it. And I think the NFC is a little more wide open than the AFC, so they can do it. Or or like they're going to try to do it. They also, though. With that being said, injuries in and injuries came up again.
In this last week, Jordan Love, a little banged up, looked like he might be going back in. I don't think there's real concern about him playing in this game. The bigger issue, and I know that he's not like a hundred-reception receiver, 100,000-yard guy, but Christian Watson, his Absence is going to completely Change like how defenses look at the Packers in that passing attack. How do they account for that? How do they account for your speedster, your guy that's been reliable in big moments, too?
He's not going to be there for you. How do you account for that against Philadelphia? Yeah, because he's the guy who stretches the defense, no question about it. He's the guy that if if if I'm you know Vic Fangio and uh I'm drawing up the game plan. Christian Watson's probably first on the list of, okay, we got to deal with this guy.
We got to make sure this guy doesn't get behind us, that kind of thing.
Well, that's not the case. You know, the only Christian Watson is, I think, now it's between him and Jaden Reed, but I think Christian Watson is. The most capable receiver of becoming a number one receiver in the Packers Corps. They have five really good receivers, okay, but they don't have a number one, okay? The two guys in Philly were.
would be number ones in Green Bay. The two guys in Minnesota will be number ones in Green Bay. But the Packers have very good young receivers who can emerge as a number one a true number one receiver, and that's what the future is about. But I thought Christian Watson had a chance to do that. The problem for poor Christian, he can't stay healthy.
And you know what it's all about. Mike McCarthy used to talk about this all the time. It's all about the three As, okay? Uh ability. Accountability availability And the last of those A's is the most important.
Because if you aren't available, it doesn't matter how much of the other two A's you have. And unfortunately, Christian has had injury issues throughout his career. This is a big one. Um it's no fault of his. And I just hope next year he can come back and maybe assume that role as the number one receiver because he's got the top of the speed.
He's got the top speed to blow out of defense. Wayne, you get to see this team win a Super Bowl. Right. And and in the years since then, and we've kind of talked a little bit about the playoffs. Um There's been it's not it's not just that the Packers Lose.
in the playoffs. It's it's the way that they lose sometimes. Where is like how like How Jacked up, do you get? compared to maybe ten, fifteen years ago, Do these like as a broadcaster, and you're close to the team and you're doing the best you can. To try to bring that enthusiasm and do it professionally, but I know you care about this team.
How does this not weigh on you when you're calling these games all these awful losses over the years? Yeah, I know. No, I mean, um Most of us are still not over fourth and twenty-six from the two thousand three playoffs.
Okay. Even though they went in 2010 to Philadelphia and beat the Eagles twice, opening day and in the first round of the playoffs. Yeah, you know, and Bart, you mentioned some things. It it's been hey, listen, the Packers have had great success, but there have been some disappointments in the postseason. And you know, I look at that 2011 team after the Super Bowl.
You know, they get all those injured guys back. It's the most talented Packers team I've seen in twenty-six years. And they go 15 and 1, okay, and then they get to the playoffs and the Giants beat them in Lambeau Field. They have the number one seed.
Now the other team that was the best team I think the Packers have had since the Super Bowl team. was in twenty twenty one, I believe it was. They have the number one seed.
They have the home field advantage. They have a week off. San Francisco beats Dallas. San Francisco comes Green Bay on a snowy Sunday Saturday night. And beats the Packers on a couple of plays by special teams, a blocked field goal and a blocked punt return for a touchdown.
And they beat the Packers. You know, those are teams that were Um those are Super Bowl caliber teams. The 2014 team beat Tom Brady and the Patriots in Green Bay that year. Tom Brady and the Patriots went on to win. The 2021 team, they beat the Rams, the eventual Super Bowl champs.
They ran him out of Lambeau Field in late November. That game was over in the third quarter. Earlier that season, they beat the Bengals, the team the Rams played in the Super Bowl. They beat the Bengals on a day when Mason Crosby couldn't kick the football into the Ohio River from the end of the pier, and yet he got a field goal and finally beat the Bengals on the road.
So those are teams you look back on and you say to yourself, I'm sure you do as a fan, and say, those teams are good enough to win it all. And they could have and should have, but didn't quite get it done. And it comes down to this: it's hard to do. And let me put it this way. It's either your year or it's not.
And I don't care how good your team is. A break, a fumble goes against you, a turn of events happens in a game, and it's not a best of seven series, it's one and done. And you know That's hard. That's hard to deal with as fans.
So, what's more likely here? Packers Super Bowl victory in 2024-25? Or you also do work with the Milwaukee men's basketball, the Panthers, a Horizon League clinching tournament for them. Which I get more excited about? Oh, guys.
I think I love the Panthers, Wayne. You know, that Panthers team is pretty good, Bart. I know. You should get down there to see them a little bit this year. They're darn good.
And but the league is pretty good too, the Horizon League. Youngstown State's a really good team of a couple of others. But anyway, no, I I think the Packers are on the right track and they're building this team. And and you know, yeah, everybody was excited. I I still think, hey, they've got a shot.
Who's to say they don't have a shot? You know what I mean? So they go into they go into Philadelphia. They're a four and a half point underdog. They were a bigger underdog going into Dallas last year.
So Hey, it's a new season, and you never know what's going to happen. But yeah, I think the Packers have a shot to do something this year. But I also think the Milwaukee Panthers have a real good shot at winning the Horizon League and being in the NCA tournament. Yeah. Well, we'll get I promise we'll get you on for that again, too.
Okay. They go. They go. We'll have you and Bart Lundy, the head coach and me, a little round table.
Sound good? I think we should do it over a few beers somewhere. Oh, all right. I'll even buy. Yep, well, then I'm in.
Nice.
Okay. All right, Wayne Larravey, voice of the Green Bay Packers on the Packers Radio Network. Good to catch up with you. Enjoy the weekend and hopefully weekends to come. As a Packer fan, I say that as a broadcaster, I am nothing close to neutral and I never will be.
All right, Wayne, thank you so much. We'll talk again. All right. Take care, Bart. That is Wayne Laravey.
Again, he will be calling the Packers on the radio network. And also he does call those Milwaukee Panthers. Yeah, I gotta get that in there. And yeah, the coach's name is Bart, so you know, I'm doubly pumped. Gotta get that in there, okay?
I have no shame about that.
