Will we see UNC and Duke going for the ACC title?

I appreciate your time. Mr. Hale. I know you're busy working on a story.

So we won't keep you too long, but I want to start with North Carolina. I said last week that I think they're about to take their offense to another level with another dynamic player like Tez Walker, but they were already averaging almost 500 yards a game. I do. I think they were about to get even more explosive and that's that could put them in a strange conversation. I don't disagree with this at all. Um, look, you've got, I think one of the top two or three quarterbacks in the country and where you want to put Drake may in that conversation is certainly open for debate, but you know, I, I, I've watched a good bit of Caleb Williams and, and I know he's got some sort of, you know, magical ability at times, but you saw him play last week against Notre Dame and didn't look so spectacular. And I've watched the Oregon Washington game and you know, I'm all for putting Bo Nix and Michael Maddox and the Heisman conversation, but I didn't see them do anything that I don't think Drake may can do. So you got one of the best quarterbacks in the country. You've got an absolute plethora of options in the passing game, which of course, does Walker changes that dynamic and adds, as we saw last weekend, a huge playmaking threat, but not to be overlooked is how good those tight ends are. You know, you have a lot of runners in the conference and you know, I think you can go two or three deep at that backfield too. They are just good across the board. Offensively. I think the offense sort of goes as far as the old line is going to allow them to go. That's maybe the one area that it has played well and much better than last year, but it's the one where I still want to see them. You know, Miami was, it is a really good pass rush. Miami is a very physical, talented defensive line and Carolina looked good against them.

That's amazing. That's a really good sign. We'll see if they're in the crew playoff mix and if they're going to beat, say Florida state in an ACC championship game, that's the one unit that I think still needs to reach maybe that next level. And then, yeah, I mean, I don't see any reason this isn't one of the best offenses in the country.

This is going to sound weird. I really do want to talk about North Carolina here, but their game at Keenan against Duke, A will tell us a lot about how they can block a defensive front because Duke's defensive front is spectacular and that could end up also being a preview of an ACC championship game. It's Duke and Carolina in the final four of basketball and it's not out of the realm of possibility that Duke and Carolina will be playing in Charlotte at the ACC for an ACC championship. But back to UNC, their defense is better than anybody thought it would be. And to me, their offense was always supposed to be good. I think it can be unbelievable, but their defense is probably better than average. And if your offense is great, your defense might not have to be much better than that.

Yeah. And frankly, look, I think when an offense is really clicking, it sometimes can adversely affect a defense. I think everybody's looking for the perfect offense and the perfect defense, and I just don't think those two can coexist. But I do think a little bit of last year was them running a system that always put stress on their defense. And so a little bit of the success on the defense this year is just the way that they have adjusted how they are scheming up an offense. And so that it is not always like, hey, you know, we went three and out or we scored in two plays, but get back out there and do something. The number of plays that the defense has had to be on the field for. And moreover, the number of stress plays that the defense has had to be on the field for is way down. That's helpful as a unit kind of grows together. The other thing is that the more and more success they have, I think the more that confidence grows. Last year, that was a defense that was just, I mean, it wasn't good, but it was also utterly beaten down at times. I mean, there was no excuse for how bad they were other than the fact that they just didn't look like they wanted to be out on the football field.

This is a much different unit. And then you look at the way that kind of all the phases are playing together. The pass rush is so much better. And Miami was a really good test for that. And they didn't sack Tyler Van Dyke a ton of times, but they disrupted the backfield routinely. The defensive backs, I mean, night and day compared to where it was last year. And Elijah Hussey and Marcus Allen and those guys have really turned into genuinely solid, and in some cases far better than that, ACC football players. And then in the middle, you've got probably two of the five best linebackers in the conference and power echoes and said, great, that is a good unit front to back.

And I am frankly astonished we're having this conversation. Well, look, what's going to be fun, and I might surprise you in a second, I might not, but we're going to get to that Carolina-Duke game. And I believe the first college football playoff rankings will have come out. And unless Carolina, you know, in the middle of the night stubs their toe on the coffee table that is at Georgia Tech, I mean, they're going to be 9-0. And they're going to be, I don't know, top six, top seven, if not higher in that conversation. It's not like their schedule was terrible in the non-conference. It was pretty good.

And they have been super impressive, and they have Drake May. So now I might, David Hale is joining us, I might blow your mind. If Riley Leonard is 100% or close enough to it to play, I think Duke's going to win that game at Florida State Saturday night.

That's soclearlyyou.com. Sotictu decrevisitinib is a prescription treatment for adults with moderate to severe plaque psoriasis who may benefit from systemic therapy or phototherapy. Don't take if you're allergic to Sotictu. Serious reactions can occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections, including tuberculosis. Sotictu can lower your ability to fight infections. Don't start if you have one. Serious infections, cancers including lymphoma, muscle problems, and changes in certain labs have occurred.

Tell your doctor if you have a history of these events, or if you have an infection or symptoms like fever, sweats, chills, muscle aches, or cough. Or if you have history of hepatitis B or C, liver or kidney problems, high triglycerides, or had a vaccine or plan to. Sotictu inhibits TicTu, which is part of the JAK family. People 50 and older with heart disease risk factors who use a JAK inhibitor are at increased risk for certain side effects, sometimes fatal. It's unknown if Sotictu has the same risks as JAK inhibitors.

Call 1-888-SOTYKTU to learn more. I don't think that's a crazy thing to say. I look back to when Mike Elko was at Wake Forest. He'd go down to Florida State and every year have far less talent than some of those good Jimbo Fisher teams had. And he'd make it a football game. And he did it because he's so good at forcing teams to play the game he wants to play as opposed to the game that they want to play.

And so I think there is certainly precedent for that being the case. Mike Elko is just a hell of a good football coach. Now, having said all of that, Florida State's got a ton of weapons and they are good almost everywhere.

And they're deep almost everywhere. And I still don't think we have seen Florida State play close to its ceiling. I mean, they have had moments where they've looked really good.

They've had hams where they've looked really good. I don't know that they've had a game front to back where they have played great football. Does that happen against Duke?

I don't know. Look, I think it's certainly possible Duke can win that football game. The more talented team is at Florida State. And I think that is also a team that rises to the occasion. There's the old Milton Berle joke about every time he got into a manhood measuring contest, he only took out enough to win. I feel like that's a little bit of Florida State as well.

They take out enough to win. Victoria, isolate that. Just isolate that.

I want to keep that forever. David Hale, ESPN.com covers the ACC in college football. What was the difference, you think, between State and Duke Saturday night on the ACC network? Duke is a good football.

They can't get out of its own way. It is perplexing to me to some extent because they are not without some ability on offense. I've seen Robert and I take far less talent than that and at least do something with it. It's hard for me to look at NC State and say that's a less talented offense than what Robert and I had at Syracuse last year.

I am befuddled by how bad that whole unit looks. To get beat by three touchdowns in a game in which you allowed four completions, that's as rock bottom as you get unless you just played Navy or something like that. Kudos to Duke for going out and winning that game the way that it did down its best player. I think it really goes to show that Duke is more than a one man band. It is hard for me to look at NC State right now and figure out how it has come to this because there's just no reason it should be this bad. Duke has home run hitters. NC State doesn't. I think the bottom line for me is that whether it's Waters, Jacquez Moore is also someone who is capable of going the distance, Jalen Calhoun, and for all the things Dave Doran said after the game about penalties and dropped passes, Duke did that too.

That reminds me a little bit of the Clemson game because Davo did the same thing after Clemson. Duke did the same thing in that game and they still beat Clemson by three touchdowns. Look, I think Duke is very good and I love their defensive line.

I love their secondary. I think Duke's defense. To me, Florida State has relied so much on Keon Coleman that I think Duke can handle him. And if Duke can handle him, then Florida State, as you said, Mike Elko is going to make you play the game that he wants you to play. If Duke can handle Keon Coleman, I think Duke has a very good chance to win.

Plus, Leonard is, but he has to be healthy. They're not beating Florida State with Henry Bieler. They've run into the same problem against him as Duke will run into against Jordan Travis. And this was one of the things, after the Clemson game, Jordan Travis sort of got upset with Davo and said he showed our passing game no respect. Well, what it was is that most defenses say we can't let Jordan Travis beat us with his legs and then he beat them with his arm. And Riley Leonard is sort of the same thing.

It's like you got to pick your poison there. Like Duke is not a one dimensional team. I mean, you can look at NC State. That's a zero dimensional team. Duke is a two dimensional offense that if you want to take one thing away, they have a second gear. And they showed that, I think, against NC State that, you know, when you know they're not throwing the ball, they can still beat you.

I think Florida State's a little bit like that, too, though. It is Keon Coleman is is the star there. He is the playmaker. But Craig Benson's a really good football player. Jordan Travis can beat you with his arm and his legs. And the other guy who has been a little bit quiet because he's been banged up the last few weeks. But Jaheim Bell at tight end is a little bit of a do everything guy.

And if Johnny Wilson's fully healthy, which TBD, but it sounds like he will be. There is weapons at Florida State that, again, I agree with you. I think Mike Elko makes this a game. But there is a lot that Florida State can do well if they're clicking. No question about it, David. They're sort of the David Hale of the ACC. And you don't even have to be clicking. You don't even have to be on your game. Yeah, that's exactly.

I like this analogy. Let's put that out there. David has already made the the archives forever with the Milton Berle story. David Hale at a David Hale joint on Twitter. Thank you so much, man. I'll talk to you soon.