If you’re not a fan of the ACC expansion, you’re not alone

So let's just, let's just start with, I know you don't like it, nobody likes it. SMU likes it. Well, SMU is coming to dinner and not eating.

That's just awesome. I don't know if Notre Dame likes it. Notre Dame likes Stanford. Notre Dame likes Stanford.

And honestly, the whole Notre Dame thing has just been so overblown. Notre Dame was irrelevant here. Their vote doesn't matter. Their vote didn't matter to this situation. But they were the only school talking about it publicly though.

Nobody else was public. Right, but what does that matter? Neither speaking about it until North Carolina last night. So Notre Dame served as kind of like the majority whip here. So do you think that Syracuse went, well Notre Dame thinks it's a great idea, therefore we should do it. See, I don't think any of that matters. I think that certain schools looked at it, I think certain schools looked at it and said, hey, this would be a good idea, whether it is or not. So they're voting for it.

NC State didn't, Brandy Woodson didn't go, you know what, Jack Swarbrick said we should add Stanford and Cal and SMU. So I think we're going to do, I don't think any of that really matters. I think we focus on the wrong things here. I think public pressure does matter though.

And the way this stuff gets out, you often have to ask who most benefits. And since Notre Dame is the school that's most publicly out there in favor of it, odds are they're probably the ones putting out that $72 million figure a week and a half ago and putting out and leaking out a ton of stuff that ends up putting pressure on schools to try and act and revive this back from the table from where it was two weeks ago. What Jim Phillips should have done then was we're going to vote on this or we're not going to vote on this, but we're going to settle it two weeks ago. And the fact that it was left open and that they didn't say two weeks ago that this is a done deal, it's kibosh, opened the door for conversation to be revisited. And I do think Notre Dame was the one that helped push this back onto the table and get us to this point where we are today.

I couldn't disagree more. The fact remains that the league knew what the financial numbers were. Whether we know about them or not doesn't matter, right? The league knew what the financial numbers were. They know what's in the TV contract, right?

What is it? The AD of Syracuse, former ESPN, right? A former ESPN guy.

Right, Wild X. So he knows what's in the contract. And the league does too. So I don't think any of this outside pressure does anything in this particular case. Do I think it was handled inartfully? Yes. Should we have been discussing this publicly for two weeks without anything happening until today?

No. It should have simply been, hey, there's a rumor and then boom, the next day it happens, which is what happened two summers ago with Texas and Oklahoma and what happened last summer with Southern Cal and UCLA. All of a sudden there was a rumor and then there was a vote and boom, here it is. That's not what happened, which speaks to some other things that happen behind the scenes in the ACC. And I'm glad you say that because what I think when people say flatly lack of leadership on display on things, I think people might misguide that. I don't criticize Jim Phillips for this move happening because it's university presidents that pressed the button. But I do criticize Jim Phillips for the fact that this dragged out two weeks and for it being not put into kibosh on it two weeks ago, one way or the other, having resolution, having games played while this is still unsettled. And while Stanford, as you mentioned, is out of Hawaii today getting set for its opener, I don't think that was well handled.

I don't think the fact that schools are airing out its grievances publicly. When we saw Jim Delaney running the league, when we see the SEC running the league, even if things weren't unanimous, they're going to say it's unanimous. North Carolina just put out a statement 10 minutes ago that flat out said it was a no, just like Florida State did and Clemson kind of hinted at with the statement that it put out. Everybody's airing out the dirty laundry publicly, like North Carolina did with its Board of Trustees announcement, which came from a Gmail account initially last night.

Funny enough, I was sitting next to Pete Thamel at the Wake Forest game last night when that dropped. And we were all just kind of looking at each other, say, is this thing legit? We don't really know. But the larger point is, if you want to find something to identify as lack of leadership, it's not being able to control the schools within the conference. And it doesn't seem that Jim Phillips has control at all on the messaging of this.

And that's lack of leadership. Yeah, I mean, it may be. I mean, I like I know Jim Phillips is talking as putting as positive a spin on this as he can. But even though I think I come at this from a different perspective than everybody else that we have talked about and I don't like it, I know I want people to understand I am not pro.

Man, I think it's awesome. And Cal and Stanford and SMU are in. I am not pro this, but what I am what I'm absolutely for is some level of action because I think doing nothing is the wrong play because the ACC tried nothing before. In the wake of like I said this last year, when Southern Cal and UCLA were added to the Big Ten, if the Big Ten wasn't taking Stanford, rather, Washington and Oregon, that was the time for the ACC to move. I agree.

That's it. But we didn't do anything there because honestly, it's silly to add schools from the Pacific Coast to the ACC. And then we got into this weird little hybrid conversation about, well, you know, we could just put their games on the ACC network and make more money, which is I don't know what that does. It's very, very little money, but maybe. But at that point, they should have just said, you know what, you're going to need us and we might just need you.

So let's do it. But that would be taking George Klyavkov's job because the Pac-12 was going to get swallowed whole by the ACC. I just don't know that any of that would have made as much sense as anything does today. I think doing something was important.

I don't know what this really does. I don't think it necessarily makes it worse. And I do believe it adds some money. And that's ultimately what it came down to and what it always comes down to. I think the financial piece has been talked about enough. And I think you outlined it very well there.

That certainly was a piece of this. What isn't being talked about enough is the protection piece of this. And I'm not talking about that in a let's just do something so strength in numbers. We're not like the Pac-12. It should never be about strength in numbers.

Sure. But actually, in this sense, it might when you consider the contract that goes through 2036 with ESPN. It is on paper that it can't be renegotiated by ESPN unless I believe they sink below 14 or 15 schools.

That's below 15. So if you want to protect that contract long term, adding these schools will give you protection if, for some reason, Florida State or whomever can test the grant of rights and get out successfully. Even if we don't see that answer, if you do lose a few schools, you could still protect the contract. Well, then you wouldn't have had to do this with Stanford and Cal then. You could have done it with any school.

So you should have just at that point, you should have just added Navy. Right. I mean, or you call the academics piece comes at this. Remember, it's not Jim Phillips and A.D. who are making this call. Academics still matter a great deal. And the Atlantic Coast Conference, Josh, Josh, Josh. No, these are university presidents that look at Stanford and Cal and probably agree for the most part with what Jack Swarbrick told Dan Patrick last week. We can't leave Stanford and Cal in the dark, these top 20 institutions. Again, to make the point in state, everybody's focusing on Randy Woodson right now, who was the swing vote. We do was that price at Duke.

Let's not forget he voted for it. And Wake Forest voted for it to Susan Winty, the president of Wake owns a degree at Cal and Vincent Price owns a degree at Stanford. Like I don't look academic word world in academia in the ACC. It's not hard to look at how many private schools and how many top 40 academic institutions there are to understand that if university presidents are the ones pressing the buttons here. Of course, they'd be more willing to add Stanford and Cal than East Carolina or maybe Bobby.

I love you. There are a million reasons that this was done before we get to academics, the academics of those two institutions. By the way, SMU is a top 100 school, according to U.S. World and U.S. News and World Report. In fact, they are 72nd tied with NC State on the list.

Well, in the last one, Stanford was fourth and Cal was 20th. It doesn't matter. It doesn't make a difference. That's not why they were added. And that is simply something. Oh, look at this.

We can also say that. But it has nothing to do with it. You're not adding schools.

Otherwise, they would have added Tufts. It doesn't make a difference where you are. They would have added MIT or Johns Hopkins. It doesn't.

The academics doesn't matter. And you know it. Let's not buy it. Let's not buy the crap because it has nothing to do with that. That is, let's just say, added value. Right.

To all of this. I know there are academics, but everybody in that room. I mean, that is something of convenience. It's 100 percent about money.

It's the only reason. Otherwise, you would have added different schools. It's 100 percent about money and what those schools were willing to to accept. SMU, no media share.

Stanford and Cal coming in at 30 percent. That's what they're willing to accept. Let me move on, because we're not going to agree on. We actually do agree. It's all silly.

But I think around the around the margins, we don't. Give me give me your take, your read on what we saw from the Wolfpack, even though I know you were watching the Demon Deacons and Elon last night. First half good.

Second half not. Your read on the Wolfpack last night. And I confess that I actually watched more of NC State while sitting in the press box at the Wake Forest-Elon game.

Absolutely. I'll make a confession that that was the case. But, you know, funny enough, I can probably recap both those games at the same time and saying NC State and Wake Forest experienced similar nights last night. Neither were all that impressive. State, you know, they trailed for a lot of that first half or the entire game. The UConn was in punters distance from them. Wake Forest, you know, they had to play their starters throughout an entire game against Elon because because Mitch Griffiths threw that pick six in the game. And both are really hoping the cliche is true, that you're a lot better in week two. You have your most growth from your first week to your second week when Notre Dame and Sam Hartman's coming back to rally.

And that's next week. And Vanderbilt is going to be facing Wake Forest, a Vanderbilt team that is improved from last year under Clark Lee. With all that said, the schools are going to take it. NC State gets the win. Wake Forest gets the win.

North Carolina and Duke would be, you know, they'd kill to have the same results that NC State. Yes, different tasks, right? Very different tasks. So it's underwhelming. But there's enough good there that you'll take what the result was. Yeah, look, my takeaway from the Wolfpack is simply. I think it was it wasn't for a lack of trying. They tried offensively. There was no precision in the passing game. There were drops. There were missed throws. There was bad protection.

All of those things must get corrected. My bigger worry coming out of the game was, man, when Connecticut just lined up and ran it, they had success. And that is not a recipe for success against Notre Dame.

How do you look at tomorrow night's game? And I know you will be there at Bank of America Stadium for North Carolina versus South Carolina. Sir, are the Tar Heels going to meet the moment?

I don't think so. I think South Carolina is probably better set up here. These are almost the same teams, though, like you think about it both last year. I mean, Carolina is in the inferior of the two divisions in the ACC and wins nine games last year. South Carolina wins eight in the inferior of the two SCC divisions.

And, you know, you look at the way they were trending at the end of the year, though. South Carolina had its two biggest wins in a decade in the same month against Clemson and against Tennessee. North Carolina lost four in a row, including a couple of home games that were pretty bad losses against second and third stream quarterbacks from NC State and Georgia Tech. And Drake May's numbers weren't very good in those games either.

So I do think that the hype we've seen this movie before. Two years ago, North Carolina, preseason number 10. Oh, Sam Howes and all these draft projections, top 10 pick. And let's just ignore the fact that he lost his top two weapons at wide receiver and offensive line is still a little bit of a concern. Let's just overlook that. Miami Brown and Daz Newsome aren't around.

Well, that sounds a lot like Drake May right here. Now you're trying to replace Josh Downs and Antoine Green. And we're still looking at our watches. It's 232 right now. And we're about 24 hours from kick. We still don't know if Taz Walker is going to be able to go. Can we just say play him North Carolina? Just put him on the field and dare the NCAA to come after you. What are they going to do? I have no idea. But still, are they going to send the National Guard to Bank of America Stadium and keep Taz Walker off the field? No. Play him.

Deal with the repercussions. South Carolina has their Taz Walker in Juice Wells. They do. He's a tremendous player. And Shane Beamer has done a great job. And quietly, South Carolina has done a really nice job in the series against North Carolina over the last five years, but really over the last few decades too. I think South Carolina wins this game. It's a close one, but I lean South Carolina even though the odds makers have that flipped.

Yeah, well, two and a half point, two and a half point spread. Josh Graham, Winston Salem, my friend at Josh Graham Radio, Sports Hub Triad, all of that. You're the man. You're on the air in 27 minutes. I'll talk to you down the road. Oh, that sounds good. Enjoy week one, Adam.

And I can't wait for us to hang out in Palo Alto one day. The band is on the field. Yes. Tiger Woods, ACC legend. Talk about that today. Eric Dickerson, Alex Morgan, John Elway. We got them all. We got them all. Katie Ledecky. Katie Ledecky is the greatest swimmer in ACC history.

Book it. No, it's two-way athlete, not Julius Peppers. It's Tony Gonzalez. There you go. Tony Gonzalez was a yes, that which I almost said, I'll talk to you later, Josh. In the last hour, but up up up.