ACC Commissioner Jim Phillips on the state of the conference currently

With the commissioner of the Atlanta Coast Conference, Jim Phillips. Thanks for inviting us to the party again. No, love having you. Gracious host last night. I didn't realize you bought ice cream for people. I would have left with the Peloton last night.

Yeah, it was really for Amy Acola, our deputy commissioner's daughter, Allender, who I think so highly of. And I think we've tortured her this week with too much work. And then everybody kind of jumped on the bandwagon when they heard ice cream was going to be the kind of end of the night activity for us. That's actually the better way to end a night. We should have ice cream at the end of every football game.

Why don't we do that? I know Kevin Keats at NC State, if they have a road win, they go out for ice cream. Let me get your sense of what the lay of the land in college football, really, because that's really what's driving everything. But the lay of the land in the college landscape today, and where the ACC fits into it. I think the ACC is in a really good position nationally, when I look at the landscape.

And I base it on a few things. First of all, the geography, where our schools are, 15 amazing institutions, top 25, top 50 schools. You look at the academic profile, as good as any conference in the country. When you take a very objective look at what the competitive success has been, it's undeniable. So, if you want to spend time on college football, and a sport that gets a lot of attention, the ACC second in number of appearances in the CFD, second in the number of national championships. Basketball on the men's side, I think maybe in the last 15 years or so, nobody's won more championships.

Around multiple schools, not just one school, but multiple schools. Women's basketball, as good as it's ever been. And I think, as you see, every Final Four, the ACC continues to populate it with teams. Sixteen national championships the last two years, most of any conference. Nine national championships this year, the most of any conference. I can go on and on, but that tells you that, you know, you're having success. From a revenue standpoint, people talk about that quite a bit, and we absolutely are trying to close the gap.

You have two that have gotten away from everyone, two conferences, and then, you know, everyone else. But we're in really good position as we move forward. But that's not going to satisfy any of us. We want to make sure that we close that gap. And I don't know that, you know, chasing a dollar is the right thing. As I talked about, I think with you before, is I think it's chasing success. And what do we need to have success? What are the investments that the campuses are going to need to make?

And how do we help funnel those dollars through those campuses? So, I feel good about the plan that we have moving ahead with our partners, with ESPN and Disney. And then we're being proactive with our success initiative process, which will, I think, reward teams that have postseason success in football and basketball and distribute more dollars towards them.

That makes perfect sense, to be honest, that the teams that do better should reap some of those rewards. You said something that I think is really important here, in that you can't, like, closing the gap on the SEC and the Big Ten, financially. I mean, I just don't know the way it works, the way the landscape is now.

I just don't know how possible that is, because they're just about to kick in to a much bigger number. But does it really, maybe it's just, I'm looking at everything from a real-life perspective. I have, theoretically, what I need, because the guy down the street makes five times more than I do. Why does that put pressure on me? So, we can have envy.

How much does envy get in the way of what you have to deal with and what what you have to deal with and what the schools need to accomplish? I don't know if I could say it any better than that. I mean, I think there's truth to that. But I also realize that standing pat or sitting still, that's not the right path for us either. Dollars don't equate success. That's factual and that's not debatable.

But dollars do give you the ability to increase the number of resources and maybe eventually, obviously, create your opportunity to have success. So, I think there's a balance there. But what I do like about it is that we have engagement at the highest level with our board. Our presidents and CEOs are on top of it. Obviously, our athletic directors are heavily involved and we have the very best group of CEOs in the country and the very best group of athletic directors in the country. So, I feel good about where we're at.

I will. But it doesn't stop us from wanting to close the gap. It doesn't stop us from, again, trying to address these issues. But I think people should be proud of the ACC and be proud of what the graduation rates are, what the success in the classroom is, what the success on the playing fields have been, how the ACC has been a national leader, both in on-field performances but also in legislation and trying to make college athletics better now and into the future. Jim Phillips, the commissioner of the ACC, is joining us here at Football Kickoff.

So, at the ACC meetings in Amelia Island, we found out about something called the Magnificent Seven, which I'm sure they didn't call themselves because that would be kind of silly. But it certainly belies, unrest might not be the right word, but conversations that have been had about how we increase our revenue, what's the best plan for certain schools. So, it does belie some unrest and it's all based on finances.

How do you make them happy? Because I don't believe just the incentive-based earning is going to do that because I think they are experiencing something that we just talked about, that fact that, you know, neighbor down the street is making more money, therefore, we need to do that too. How do you deal with that growing uneasiness? Well, I think what came out of the spring meetings was something that brought us closer together because we had some really important conversations with the conference, again, the highest level at our board level. And we've locked arms to say, hey, we got to figure this out and we can do this together. So, it's part of, I think, just complex organizations. You go through these periods in your evolution where sometimes there's a bumpy road that you hit and it doesn't, at all, influence what I believe long-term of the ACC.

But, you have to address them, you got to work on them, you got to deal with them, and you try to get to a better place together. Let me think forward with you, if I could. I know we've got four different congressional proposals now. None of them are bills, they're all drafts. Do you have a favorite of the four bills? I just saw it read about one today with a senator and a member of the House.

So, that was weird. But, everybody's trying to find a path forward, right? What is the path forward? You and I will be on polar opposite sides of needing congressional help. I've never thought it's going to help or that they were going to provide that. But, could we be better with no rule? Because we're not going to be able to do that.

Because that would be even for everybody if there was no rule. But, what is the path forward? Why do we need Congress? Yeah, I would say, you know, three things. One is, it's this reaffirmation that these are students. Second is, we need national legislation in this space. If you have competition across state lines, there has to be something that makes the competitive piece of this thing level. And then, third is, we need some help relative to, you know, the constant litigation of it.

As it relates to name image and likeness, I've said it before, there has to be some structure to this thing, right? We need a standardized contract. So, if you're making $500,000 and I'm making $500, why can't there be a contract that's signed and has the right language, legalese, that really protects a student-athlete from a sinister kind of agreement, etc. So, that's one. Two is, agent representation and agent registration. There needs to be somebody that has some acumen that has passed some level of expertise in order to engage with a student-athlete, right?

And you're seeing that at every other level. Third is just this open registry of, it's okay, you have a great NIL deal, but it's not supposed to be an inducement. It's supposed to be based on your abilities, your name, your image, your likeness, and all the rest of it.

So, some registry that's open for others. And then, finally, is literacy on our campus for our student-athletes for them to understand. Some want to get involved in it, some don't. Some are spending a lot of time in the space, some are not spending any and anywhere in between, they should have that right. But what I would say, you mentioned that there's three or four different bills. But what I do appreciate is it has their attention and it's gone on both sides of the aisle, so it's bipartisan, which, you know, it's hard to think in our country right now, many things that are going on that there's bipartisan kind of appetite for. But having been to Washington quite a bit with a bunch of other folks, I think they understand. It doesn't matter what side of the aisle you are on, you have a responsibility where you can help to institutions, colleges, and universities that really end up being such an important part of the maturation of young people. And so, I give them, I really give them credit because they have a lot of other things going on and some really important issues. So, I think we'll get to the right spot relative to what that looks like, but I am glad that we've gotten some support from our elected officials. Jim Phillips, Commissioner of the ACC, I just want to ask one more thing about that before I have a little fun. Although this is fun, I'm having fun. If there, I know the NCAA said right off the bat, when NIH became a thing, we don't want it we don't want it to be used as a recruiting inducement.

And my first reaction was, good luck with that. Because there has been underground money under the table money or services provided to athletes since recruiting has been part of the game. I know plenty of stories. I've talked to coaches who have told me flat out what they did or they know that stuff's been going on forever.

So, NIL is here. We have the collectives, which we all know the collectives are being used to recruit athletes. Sure, they're providing opportunity when the athletes are there, but they're being used to recruit out.

We all know that. And the NCAA couldn't stop it before. They did a poor job of that.

And they're doing a poor job of trying to stop it now. So, my question, I guess, is why? Why keep, it's like a fighting a war you can't win. So, why do that? Why not just, this is me saying, we don't need any rules. This is just the way it is. Because if you have rules and you can't do that, now we're going back under the table. Because the money is going to always, I always think money flows, no matter where it goes.

So, am I crazy? Or is that ultimately where we're going to head if we keep trying to fight against it? No, I think you have to have transparency and disclosure on all things.

Right? And so, I don't think it prohibits student athletes in any way if we are able to get some federal legislation. I think transparency. Well, depending on what I've read. So, one of the ones I've read definitely is inhibiting students.

Yes, for sure. So, myself along with the other, I think, folks in college athletics feel as if we can get to a place where we have a national standard that this thing will settle in. And if there are inducements, illegal inducements and all the rest of it, we've suffered from that for a long time. And so, that's just the right of the world. And with that comes an obligation, though, for those that are acting in that space to be held accountable. And you have to have, again, if you're going to have competition nationally like we do in the NCAA, and that we really enjoy that there's great fan interest, there has to be some standards, there has to be some rules.

And this is one space where I just feel like we have to have some rules. All right, to football. All of it makes it a big, big season. We want Florida State to be good. Obviously, we want Clemson to challenge for a playoff, or both schools to challenge for playoff spots.

We're still just at four. With an expanded playoff, there will be more. And other schools. I mean, North Carolina's got Drake May. I think Duke's got a good team. Have a hard, you gave Duke a very hard schedule.

It's going to be tough for them to win nine games. But there could be a lot of good football teams in this league. And this is probably an important year to kind of re-establish the ACC brand for football.

I agree. I mentioned earlier in our interview how bullish I am and the great success we've had in the CFP and nationally. But it is a good opportunity. And I think one of our conversations yesterday, we were debating, like everyone's talking about two schools in particular, Clemson and Florida State. But we have a bunch of other schools that can be really good this year and compete for an ACC championship. And if you're competing for an ACC championship, history tells us you're going to be in the mix for a national championship. So, I think this is as balanced of a league as you'll ever see.

I think the margin of difference is small. It could be a play, right? Or two. And in the end, I really like that we've gone to this three, five, five schedule where it allows us to play every student athlete over a four-year period is going to play every school in the conference home and away at least one time. And we've gone too long where we've gone five, six, eight years where schools in the conference haven't played. So, all of that sets up to then one division, the two best teams will meet here in Charlotte in the first Saturday of December. And so, you eliminate now if you have divisions and you end up having two really good teams in one division, only one gets a chance to go to the championship. So, it helps us not only it helps us not only for our own conference, but it helps us in the CFP as we look to get multiple teams into an expanded playoff. Looking beyond this year, this year's just four, next year, I mean, I've never been a playoff guy, but that's fine. This is where we're headed.

And yes, multiple, two, three, who knows how many. The CW is now part of the ACC's television package family. And it's good because now like I had to add another service in order to get extra games on Bally's and a Carolina Hurricanes reporter and I needed for the road games, I needed to watch that. But now the CW will be available on basically, I think it's available maybe even in more homes than ESPN is right now. So, that's cool. And I know you mentioned yesterday that see the CW was involved in golf and you mentioned live golf. So, live ACC football. Can we do that? That's how you bridge the gap.

Suddenly the ACC is paying out more than the SEC in the big 10. Oh, I love being on with you. CW is going to be a great partner. They really are.

I love how you just ignored that. Yeah. Raycom will produce them, reduce the games, but they'll be on CW and they are in every household.

So, the distribution is strong, strong. And I remember, you know, nearly three years ago, just the initial Intel from, you know, the ACC, there was such frustration about, we love our schools, we love our teams, but we can't get the games. Right. Right. And so, we got the Comcast deal and the ALT, some of these carriers that weren't covering the ACC network are offering. We've got that done. Now we have a new partnership with CW for 13 football games this upcoming fall.

They're going to play them in prime time as well, which should be fun. And it's a station that is widely distributed, which again, helps our brand and helps people consume our product. But it's really an exciting time for the ACC for a lot of ways.

And they're trying to get into sports, obviously. And that's a good thing. All right. We'll close in there. I'm not going to ask you to pick a winner in the league or anything like that, but thank you so much. I appreciate it. You got it.

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