NIL or NLI: Which was the bigger move?

Another guest that I would vote for to represent me in Congress, from CBS Sports, talking college sports and off-season topics, it is Chip Patterson. Check out the Pick Six podcast, follow him on Twitter. I'm like, Jacob, but you sounded like that actually hurt your feelings. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry. It's the Cover Three podcast on CBS Sports, College Football. Who's on there with you now? Is it Kanell? So it's Tom Finelli, Danny Kanell and Bud Elliott. And Elliott, yeah, Finelli and Florida State.

Check it out. They got all the scoop on college sports. And speaking of which, I hear everybody talking about NIL, but you tell me the bigger move is actually on NLI.

Before we even get to that, I have to ask you this. Who are the ad wizards that couldn't come up with more distinguishable acronyms than NIL and NLI? Two of the things that we're going to talk about most in college sports.

How did that happen? Yeah, and they both have to do with signing documents in terms of what school you're going to go to. This is very, very confusing. The poor newsroom is getting pinged left and right because they're like, the headline stack says NIL when it should be NLI and not NLI when it should be NIL.

No, incredibly confusing. And like those who have a three to five year view of the future or shoot, Mac Brown, if you listen to him talk this week on Fine Bomb two years into the future, we'll be dealing with employment status, at least at the college football level. And most of this will go away. But the national letter of intent. See, it's tough.

It's tough. We remember it because it came first. And that was signing day. Signing day and the fax machine was you signing your national letter of intent to a school. And within that, there has been pushback over the years. You shouldn't even sign it.

It's not a good document. Legal experts have said that you give away so many rights that you don't need to. You can just sign financial aid papers or you can just show up and enroll. You don't actually have to make this pledge, which at times, if a player has wanted to leave, has been very difficult because they've signed this document pledging, you know, their intent to be at a university. Now, we just saw Duke basketball, for example, when they get Kyle Filipowski is going to be coming back. They find out that one of their top recruits, also a big he asks to be released from his national letter of intent. Now, John Shire granted it and Duke granted it and he was able to go and commit elsewhere. But over the years, there have been times where a lot of these players have been stuck at a program when something changes, like someone coming back to school or a coaching change.

And they haven't been able to get out of a situation that they don't want to be in. And that's where the NCAA is getting just absolutely crushed for. And we can talk about in a little bit, you know, them asking schools to obey rules, not state laws. But I do think that this is some common sense stuff when it comes to the national letter of intent, because right at the top of it, there will be no penalty for somebody who asks for a release as a result of a head coaching change.

Like that is the one thing that makes the most sense. You signed school in December as part of the early signing period. That coach decides to go to another school or he gets fired. You should not have to go to that school.

I was like, man, what is up with this common sense that they are pushing through right now? I'm not used to this. There is also going to be no penalty if you go to a school and then you complete at least one semester and then you just want to be released.

You want to get out of there. That's fine. You don't have to go sit out somewhere else. And then for your transfers had similar adjustments. And just what I see here is something that may only be in place for like two to three years. But it is exactly what we've been talking about, how unfair the relationship is between players and coaches. And yes, compensation is a big part of that. But it has also been the freedom of movement, the freedom of a coach to be able to leave at the drop of a hat.

And the fact that some players who committed to a university because of the relationship with that coach are then stuck in the wake of that. And so the one time transfer rule, the transfer portal, that has all been a part of this. And this just seems like the next level of this. And if you're wondering, this is not for this current cycle. This will be in the next cycle.

So for the 2024-2025 academic year. That was the one that sounded, that always sounded most ridiculous. So you would get in that scenario, especially if it was like a Lane Kiffin scenario. Where the coach was like only there a year and then left. And people were like, no, no, no, the player has to sit out. You're like, the coach literally just did the exact same thing and is getting paid handsomely.

Probably leaving one school and taking more to come to another. And yet still we had these players that were like, nope, nope, you sign up. And people tried to defend it as like, well, players shouldn't be picking a coach. He should be picking a school.

And it was just, you know, it was a little bit. If I could get my, if you give a mouse a cookie on, I think that you should be able to, on your national letter of intent, there should be four coach names. I think it should be the head coach. I think it should be the coordinator on your side of the ball.

Oh, gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. I think it should be your regional recruiter because like, for example, you know, the head, the head coach, you might only meet five or six times during your recruitment. Your position coach, that would be the other one, your position, your specific position coach.

But then the regional recruiter, you know, if you are in Florida and you're being recruited by USC, the USC assistant who might be in charge of Florida could be not your position coach, not your side of the ball, but they're in charge of Florida. So that's the person you're talking to. That's the guy you trust. That's the guy you called. Or that's the guy the first week of school where you're missing home and you're like, hey, man, that, you know, I'm not feeling great. That's who you want to talk to because you have a relationship with them. Yeah, exactly.

So again, like I'm being a little greedy here right now. The laws, not laws, the rules that they're changing are only for a head coaching change because it is like, it makes me a little sick to my stomach that there is an entire news cycle the week after National Signing Day where not head coaches, but assistant coaches move. Like an entire staff can turn over and you can tell that that is an agreement between the assistant coach and the head coach where the head coach says, hey, man, I know you're about to take a job.

You got to wait until we lock these guys in and then you can go and take off and go somewhere else. So I would extend it to, again, coordinator, your side of the ball position coach and the like regional recruiter. I mean, on 24 seven sports, you go to recruits profile. It tells you primary, secondary.

They give you all the information of who's in on it, who's established the relationship. But for right now, a step in the right direction, again, even if a national letter of intent is not even going to be a document that we continue to use three, five years down the line. I'm taking a quick time out from this interview. You made a reference that I didn't get.

I always try to educate myself. What is what is to give a mouse a cookie? Is that what if you give a mouse cookies can ask for a glass of milk? OK. All right. So it's like and then you give him a glass of milk. He's going to ask for more. Something else is going to ask for something else.

All right. To be fair, you are a dad. But like, is that a reference you knew before you were a dad? And I'm just it's like a cultural thing that I'm missing. Or is this like, no, these books are on my shelves now and I read them nightly. If you give a mouse a cookie was a book that I remember from my childhood. OK, it's kind of it's been, you know, obviously co-opted and launched into kind of a banger of a children's television show, too.

So that's that's kind of where it's operating in our world. Does he have a movie? Does he have a special? There are specials. There's like I give a mouse a cookie Halloween special. Give a mouse a cookie Christmas special.

It's pretty solid. I've never heard of this mouse or his cookie. Give a mouse a cookie and ask for a glass of milk. And then one thing will lead to another. And that's when the adventure begins. What? That is not the song. You just made that up.

None of that rhymed. There's a ukulele on it and everything. You'd really enjoy it. It's a very pleasurable, you know, like give a mouse a cookie trash truck.

Like the things that are just like nice and good vibes all the way through. When we get off this interview, I'm going to take some calls to see if I'm the crazy one, because I didn't know who give a mouse a cookie was. All right. Let's see.

That was the big headline that I was seeing yesterday. All right. Let me let me be clear on this one.

I think you kind of feel me on this, although you might keep up for your friends because you're national media as well. But like there is I am I am pro player rights. I mean, I think, you know, most of me, I don't I'm not as educated on the issues as you are or many other people. But like I like you said, I'm pro player movement. The things that the logical ones that make the most sense are like, duh, we've got to be able to do these things. Right.

I'm even pro. Let's figure out the employment thing. I referenced yesterday your suggestion of making them conference employees because the conferences are one. They're the ones who signed the television deals. That makes a lot of sense to me. Any any situation we figure out is going to have some complications and some wrinkles that we'll have to iron out.

But like that would sound cool to me altogether. But so I am mostly on the pro player anti NCAA side. Right. Like it's always easy to be anti NCAA. But was the headline legit yesterday when everyone says the NCAA is telling schools to ignore laws and break laws? Or was that being a little bit hyperbolic when I saw national writers being like, oh, the NCAA is telling you to tell your lawmakers to shove it and listen to us?

What's what's everyone talking about when they mention that issue? So the what state legislators are doing and by the way, like 32 different states across the country have currently adopted some sort of NIL regulation. But the regulation are almost always going hand in hand with the state universities and finding ways to make it more advantageous for them to be able to benefit from it. The Missouri is the state that I reference the most often, where if you are a high school athlete in the state of Missouri, then you have an opportunity to be able to get NIL opportunities earlier. And that is going to be there more for you if you go to, for example, Missouri. And so I think that what the NCAA is trying to do is they're going through and the argument that they are using is being a part of the NCAA is a voluntary organization.

And because you are volunteering to be a part of our organization, then you have to go by our rules. I think that the NCAA is throwing out some last ditch effort Hail Mary's because it is not getting what it was hoping for, which is a nationwide federal NIL law, which would have most importantly, this law supersedes all of the state laws all across the country. They're looking at Congress.

They've been going there. They even took Nick Saban to D.C. like two weeks ago. If the GOAT couldn't get it across the goal line, you know, all the legislators always like to be like rut the one yard line.

You just got to push across the goal line. If Nick Saban, the guy who gave Derrick Henry 50 carries a game because he didn't trust his quarterback on the way to a national championship, if Nick Saban couldn't Derrick Henry that thing across the goal line, then like they're not going to get a federal law that supersedes all the other laws. Now, one thing that was suggested yesterday as this was getting pushed around that I thought was poor decision, but interesting is like, what if the NCAA starts suing the states? Like, what if we start getting like NCAA v. State of Mississippi and they try to concoct some legal argument that, you know, you can't have these rules for your public universities when the public universities are volunteering to be a part of the NCAA and by volunteering, you are agreeing to abide by the bylaws.

So you can't break the bylaws and claim the state law is the law of the land. They are going to find themselves having to do this on a state by state basis because they are not getting federal help. This is just the beginning of it. And again, I think that the next step is going to be to try to find a big case they can win just to be able to create a little bit of precedent in that in that manner. Ah, yes.

Take it to the courts, baby. That's the that's everyone's motto these days. How you thought you referenced this earlier. How long are you predicting until we have college athletes as employees? I'm not in the two year plan just because I think things move a little bit slower than that. I would be surprised if so the next season, the twenty twenty four season is the first year of the twelve team playoff. Currently, we only have a contract in a format for the twenty twenty four and the twenty twenty five season. The twenty twenty six season is going to be the next sort of twelve year contract, new era, new college football playoff. By the time we get there, USC and UCLA will have arrived in the Big Ten. By the time we get there, Texas and Oklahoma will have arrived in the SEC. We've got a bunch of big changes that are actually happening on Saturday with the likes of Cincinnati, UCF, BYU and Houston joining the Big Twelve, a bunch of new teams joining ECU and others in the American Athletic Conference. I just think that once all those pieces settle and then we get to that next playoff contract, that is when I think we'll have a new financial reality.

That is when I think that we might have it. This was I was also talking to somebody about the being an employee of the conference rather than an employee of the university. And it was pointed out to me that they almost can't be employee of the university or you don't want to go down that line because of Title nine. But that if you are an employee of the conference, then you are able to avoid some of the extra regulation that is placed on the universities in terms of what they're able to do. Interesting.

Chip Patterson, check him out CBS Sports and the Cover Three podcast. Is that a forty five you have sitting on your bookshelf there? It is.

Do you want me to grab it real quick? It's the bonus forty five that comes with Songs in the Key of Life. So I just want you to tell me what it was. That's all. It's got Saturn and Ebony eyes on it.

So there we go. You're looking extra fit. Did you change your background or do you have like different background?

I feel like I was I used to be looking at something different back there. Okay. A new house.

Yeah. New house. You're in the new house. I'm in the new house.

Come hang out. All right. I'll stop. New house at the old place. It is. That's how you roll.

All right. College football. How many days? Fifty nine.

Something like that. Fifty some odd days at the twenty sixth was the big one because twenty six was exactly two months away from week zero. So when it starts. Week zero. We got Notre Dame and USC playing on week zero. So it's weeks. Can't have a week zero.

It's that didn't count. All right. I'll talk to you soon. I'll come by the new house at the old place.

Sounds good. You'll be well. That is Chip Patterson. Check him out. The cover three podcast. I feel bad. I messed up his podcast name earlier.