Coming up on this edition of Judica County Radio, your hosts are Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer, managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm, right here in North Carolina, where they practice law. We are getting into estate planning, probate and non-probate, but we're using Homer Simpson as the example. That's all coming up next. on Judica County Radio. Yeah.
Whitaker and Hamer presents. Judica County. Put Joshua Whitaker and Joseph Hayman. Welcome in to Judica County Radio. Your hosts are Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer, Managing Partners, Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm.
They're practicing attorneys here in the great state of North Carolina. They placed offices convenient for you in Raleigh, Garner, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Fuque Verina, Gastonia, and in Moorhead City. I'm Morgan Patrick. A pleasure to jump on with the attorneys, talk about a lot of different legal issues that are out there. And today we're focusing in on estate planning, probate and non-probate, but also from the, I guess, the eyes of Homer Simpson.
We'll get into that. But as we always do, we open up the show with what's been going on. Josh, you're first.
Okay.
Well, we haven't been together. I was thinking earlier. We haven't been together in a while, right? Because we had the. Don't get emotional.
We had the holiday weeks. My whole family had the flu for like one week, you know, and uh So it's been a minute since we all sat down, but I was thinking about I was going to start, you know, hey, it's 2026, right? It's 20, we're the first show of 2026. Crazy. But it made me think, I was listening to uh.
I was listening to some Farsides. You know who Farside is? Yep. Yeah. You know who Farside is?
Yep. Yep, everybody knows. I can't hear you, Joseph. You sure? I can now.
Yeah. I was listening to Farside, one of my favorite songs by Farside. They start the song off, it's 1995, and I always loved that song because '95 was a good year. What made it such a good year? Is there any particular thing?
Well, it was my senior high senior year in high school for Shearer at State, you know. I think that album came out in the summer. Hmm. But I was like, it's 2026. That's what maybe anyway.
Well, I I'll show you how old I am. You said far side. I was thinking of the comic strip.
Sorry. I figured you didn't know who Farside was, Morgan. No offense to you personally. I knew. I'm 10 years north of you.
So, yeah, I was in Myrtle Beach. I was lifeguarding and doing the radio gig. Yeah. Farside was a good comic. They don't make them like that anymore.
Nope. Um But everybody doing good. Everybody had a good holiday. Did. Family time, I know you guys did the same.
Joseph. Yeah, I spent a lot of time with Josh's family. Um No, it was good, man. It was good. It was uh it was nice.
Nice break, man. I like when the kids don't have school. Thinking about just pulling them out. What are they gonna do? And uh and just teaching them, letting them come here to the office with me and learn.
About safe planning. The people I know that home school, they say it's like the instruction part of the day is like a hour or two. And then the rest of the day is whatever you you want it to be. That may even be too much. I think we could.
A tight fifteen. I think you give us a tight fifteen and we could Yeah, we could probably get it done in that amount of time. They probably get bored around the office though, probably. Yeah, yeah. That's good, man.
Kids need to learn to deal with boredom. But I might. I might have told you this. I spent the So, my kids know that I'm a lawyer. I don't know they really know what.
You know, when you're a kid, you don't really know what a lawyer does, really. Like, your older kids know. I mean, how how young are your kids?
Well, maybe the older kids know. But I try to tell my kids, I try to give them like make them believe in like made-up. laws. That's what I do. That's good.
So you just try to lie to your kids, basically. Yeah, okay. But I have them, I think, thoroughly convinced. That We've talked about P.D. Pablo before, right?
We talked about the North Carolina song before. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What the what's the name of that song? Uh Raise Up, isn't is that the official? And what do you do in the song?
You twi you take your shirt off and you twist it around your head like a helicopter.
So I told them if you're in North Carolina and you hear that song, you don't have to do anything. But if you're outside of the state of North Carolina and you hear that song, you physically have to take your shirt off. and wave it around your head like a helicopter. That's right.
So we're going to New York in March, and I'm going to make sure somewhere along the lines they hear that song in public. and see if I've like drilled that into their heads. I think that's a great, great, great plan. And I think you need to report back to us if your kids do not take their shirts off and twist them around their heads like helicopters. Are you offering some kind of incentive to do that?
No, it's just the law. No, if they don't do it, he will take them to Guantanamo Bay and drop them off to be tortured. Hard. prison time for not representing your state. I don't know, I think if they got representation, they could probably get out of that.
Yeah. My kids, after they spend two to three years in the law office with me, will be able to take care of them, man. And they'll learn during that two years, they'll learn a lot. They'll come out very humble, you know?
Well Today, you know We're gonna we're gonna get back into the We're gonna get back into the estate planning, get into that groove. You know, this is the time of the year where we hear from a lot of people, right? Because we just were starting a new year. A lot of people have resolutions. They're going to get stuff done.
And we hear from a lot of people because they're finally, you know, something has happened. You know, they've lost a. A parent, or you know, they're going to have a new child, or Know a kid is over 18 and they're updating their estate plan, and so December, January, February. Even into March, we have a lot of people coming in who have decided, like, hey, this is something we're going to get done. It's almost a resolution.
And so. In that vein, I thought we would kind of do a quick review of probate assets. And non-probate assets basically looking at the average person when you pass away, this is what you own. This is what's probate, this is what's non-probate, this is how a trust could help. And I don't want to put everybody to sleep.
I want to give everybody a frame of reference.
So I figured we'd do like a estate planning for Homer Simpson. Of the Simpsons. There's a difference. Did you really have to qualify? I don't know these days, man.
This was ninety five, everybody would have known who Homer Simpson was, but in 2026 I can't guarantee that everybody knows who Homer Simpson is. Anybody listening to this radio show knows who Homer Simpson is.
So, Homer Simpson, you know, and I picked him because most people know who he is. Most people are familiar with this show, right? He has two kids. Yep. They remain underage.
They've been underage for 20, well, they came on in 90.
So they've been underage for almost 30 years, right? They don't age. They've been underage. Yeah, they just don't age. And he's got a spouse, and he owns a house, and he's got a couple of cars.
He's got a good job. Yep. You know what Homer Simpson's job is, right? Is a nuclear plant. Isn't that what it is?
He's not a nuclear plant.
Okay.
He's a.
Sorry, I'm not a huge fan like you. He's the safety inspector.
Okay.
That's what it is. All right. All right. All right. All right.
I um I dated this girl a long time ago. high school, long time ago, I dated this girl. She had a brother who's a really good kid. Young kid. And I didn't have much experience around kids at that age.
I had a younger brother, but he's only a year or two younger than me, right? I hadn't been around a lot of kids. And so she had a very young brother, like early elementary school age brother. And so I would go over there and, you know, Help play games with him or whatever because he was always around. He was a good kid.
But I asked him what he what he wanted to be when he grew up one day, right, making conversation with the kids. And he wanted to be an airplane, not a pilot. An airplane. He wanted to be an airplane when he grew up. And I was like, maybe one day, man.
Yeah. Maybe you can do it. You check back in on that kid yet to see if he accomplished his goals? No, no, but I think we would have heard about it on the news if he. Yeah.
Yeah. He's holding a man. Yeah, we want to know if you've checked back in with your date. Yeah, is that the one you say all the time when you're like, I really wish I would have married this lady instead of my wife? Is it that one?
No. No, not at all. I just make it short, man.
So high school. Not at all. But when you said nuclear plant, that's what that reminded me of. One day I want to grow up and be a nuclear plan. Yeah.
Yeah. I like that, man. Anyway, Homer Simpson. We're going to take a look at him as if he came in to do an estate planning consult. There is an episode of The Simpsons, by the way.
Where he goes to a financial planner. He agrees to go to a financial planner 'cause they're in so much debt. Hey, But he didn't think it was a financial planner. He thought it was a financial panther. You ever see that episode?
No, man. It's pretty good. I feel like there's an episode for every like there's literally every scenario on earth they've covered. I saw I do in my consults. I'm like, you're kind of like Homer Simpson in season nine, episode four.
The clients really walk out. They leave. They leave. They say they left something in their car, and then you hear them pulling off. Screeching off.
Really? Judica County Radio, Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer. We are back for 2026, managing partners here at Whitaker and Hamer Lawfer and the power behind the program. Practicing attorneys here in North Carolina, they placed offices convenient for you in Raleigh, Garner, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Fuquay, Verina, Gastonia, and down at the coast, Moorhead City. We have complimentary consults on estate planning.
If you've got any questions, obviously grab one of these consults. Call our number 919-77270000. That's 919-77270000. You can also visit the website wh.lawyer. Again, the number 919-77270000 or the website wh.lawyer.
We're back with more at Judica County right after this. Judica County Radio. Your hosts are Josh Whitaker, Joe Hamer, managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm. They are practicing attorneys here in North Carolina. Offices located convenient for you in Raleigh-Garner, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Fuque Verena, Gastonia, and in Moorhead City.
I'm Morgan Patrick. If you've got a question you'd like the attorneys to address at some point in the future, just throw us a question on email, questions at judicacountyradio.com. That's questions at judicacountyradio.com. And again, we'll get to that on a future program. And here today talking about estate planning, probate, non-probate, and we're tying it into The Simpsons.
We'll explain that here shortly. But if you've got a question about estate planning, you can grab one of our complimentary consults at any time. 919-7727000, meaning you're not paying for it and you're You're not obligated to become a client, but you could be on track with your estate planning 919-77270000. You can also visit the website, wh.lawyer. Josh.
Okay.
Alright, so we need we need to review Because I'm understanding that you guys don't have a good working knowledge of the Simpsons after my earlier questions. We know they're yellow, they don't age, and that Homer is a safety inspector.
So athletics does a stronger experience. And they've got cool, funny voices. That's true.
Alright, so we're pretending. We're pretending. Homer and Marge roll into the Whitaker and Hamer. Garner office and they sit down with me and um And so we've already had them fill out our forms ahead of time so we have the basic information about them. And we know that Homer and Simpson are Homer and Simpson.
Homer and Marge are married. They have three underage children. They own their house. I forget it's Evergreen Terrace. I forget the address.
Good God, man. Evergreen terabytes of knowledge, man. They have One car? I've only ever seen one car. I think I've got a car.
Yeah, I got one car. Yeah. Which is weird because Anyway, they got the one car. They got one car. Homer is the safety inspector for the Springfield nuclear plant, so I would assume.
I would assume he has a 401k. Right? I would assume there's, you know, probably some life insurance there, like a life insurance policy. And we know Marge is a stay-at-home mom. And that's what we know, right?
That's. They probably have bank they probably have checking and savings accounts. Right. Um And then that's it. And a lot of people, that's what they have, right?
That's. That's the goal. You own your house, you got a 401k, you've got your kids. And savings and checking, and some people have more, some people have less. But if we were going to say, hey, here's the average.
family, that's pretty average. Yeah. Yep, I'm with you.
So One of the things we do when we sit down with folks is we look at their assets. And and we we figure out like Hey, what's a probate asset? What's a non-probate asset? And so what. I usually start with non-probate assets and I do that because Um Would j I guess Joe, what what's a non-probate asset?
Yeah, so a non-probate asset is anything that's not subject to probate, right?
So anything that the court is not going to be involved in the disposition of, things that pass. Automatically without the need to set up an estate. That's your definition right there.
Alright, so yeah, so probate acids are ones that when you die. Whether you die with a will or not with the will, your non-probate assets are going to go to your heirs. automatically. Right and and and and a lot of assets here in our example are gonna be non-probate, right? And so we'll start with uh Ev most everybody has a checking account and a savings account.
and if those are set up correctly. Uh those are those those can be They can be probate or non-probate. If you've set them up correctly, they're non-probate. If you set them up correctly, Joseph, what have you what have you done? To make them non-probate.
Yeah, any kind of accounts, you have a payable on-death beneficiary, and that's all you need to do. And that's going to make, again, The death is a triggering event that's going to transfer ownership, and you're not in a situation where. You need to... involve the court. Which again, that's the goal, right?
That's our starting point, is to avoid having to bring the cord into the equation as much as humanly possible. And so to build on that, if Homer and Marge You know, some folks come together. and get married, but they keep separate accounts.
Some people come together and get married and make everything joint. And so if you're. If you've got bank accounts that have just your name on them and you don't have a joint owner, your spouse isn't on there. Your kids aren't on there. If you're the sole owner...
of your checking account and your savings account and and whatever banking accounts you have. Those are probate unless you do what Joe said. You have to make it pay. You can make it by contract with your bank. You can say, hey, this account, when I'm dead, I want it paid to.
My kid's 50-50, or my one kid, or I want it payable to my spouse. You can name what you want to happen. when you die, And if you do that. All those heirs have to do is show up with your death certificate, and the bank is going to give them. Whatever funds are in those accounts.
But if you don't do that, If you just have a bank account, it just has your name. You never set a payable on-death beneficiary, there's no joint owner. That's going to have to go through probate. That's going to have to go through the courthouse.
So, this is a banking and checking accounts, depending on how you've set them up. Could be probate. Meaning, they have to go through the courthouse, there has to be an estate opened, creditors have to get notice. It's public information, how much are in those accounts? That all is down in the courthouse in a file.
But you can easily make that asset non-probate. Does that make sense, Morgan? As a non-attorney, as our official non-attorney? I think it does. I think it does make sense, but I mean, you really have to kind of dig into this.
I mean, for the average person out there, it's confusing. Yeah. So When we talk to you, we want everything that can be non-probate. Without us having to be involved, without attorneys having to draft a will, without us having, we want you to get the benefit of making any asset. An asset's anything you own that has value, but any asset.
That can be non-probate, that's what we want to do. That makes your life easier. That makes your heirs' lives easier when you die. And it doesn't cost you anything. You don't pay legal fees to go make sure your banking accounts have a POD, a payable on-death beneficiary.
And a lot of people haven't done that. And that's the. You touched on something important, man, because there's a lot of. There's a lot of things we will do for you, and there's a lot of documents that you need to make sure that everything is handled correctly. But that is.
That's something that you can do. You know, right now, you don't have to come in and sit down with an attorney, period. And that's in. Taking as many of your assets as humanly possible and making them non-probate assets. Which again is it can be very easy depending on your situation, or it can be a little bit more complex if you have a more tricky situation.
But generally speaking, that's where you want to go with it, right? Non-probate assets and You can make sure that any accounts you have. are handled that way. Immediate it just takes a little legwork. Go down to the bank, talk to these financial institutions and get it set up.
Yeah, so that's an asset that almost everybody has, and you can easily check up on that, right? After you meet with us. Talk about it, go down to your bank and just make sure. Like, maybe it was your own account. Like, I had an account that was just me.
And then I added my wife when we got married. And I had to go back because I did not, when I opened that account when I was 18. You know, I didn't have kids. Right. That does require Um Some updating, and it's a pain in the butt, and no one wants to do it until you're ready to do it.
But that's an easy one to wrap up. Um And that way, when you die... There's no delay in those funds going to your heirs. They'll be available immediately. And because otherwise, your accounts get locked down, right?
When you die, if you don't have a joint owner, Who's alive? Or payable on that, those accounts are going to be locked up until someone's gone downtown, opened up an estate, become your. Executor, your administrator, your personal representative, whatever you want to call it. and you've got proof from the court. Those funds are just gonna be locked up.
And so that's an easy step.
Well, I would say, in that same vein, We want to make sure Any life insurance you have, right? Life insurance is handy. I don't sell life insurance, but life insurance is handy to have. you know, life insurance, your 401ks. Pensions.
All of that stuff is is not as long as you've set it up. Is non-probate, meaning it's going to be available to your heirs right away upon your death. You just got to make sure. Your beneficiaries are up to date. Right, and you might need contingent beneficiaries, right?
So you might have, let's say, you have a life insurance policy, you got when you got married. And it's your policy, your wife is the beneficiary. And that's it, right? And then you and your wife are both killed in a car accident.
Well, now this asset that would have been non-probate is going to be probate because who's your wife's heirs? How do they know who to pay? They don't. You have to go downtown and open up an estate. And so we see a lot of times when we sit down and talk to people where They haven't updated that.
Right. We've seen where they still have ex-spouses. As beneficiaries because they haven't updated it since they've been divorced and since they've gotten remarried. And then we see people who don't have the contingent beneficiaries set up.
So I've seen people who passed away thinking they had everything in order. But their beneficiary was a spouse. or a child or somebody else who had passed away. Right, so now the insurance company would normally have just stroked a check to your beneficiary, it had been non-probate. And now they can't because an estate has to be open because the beneficiaries weren't up to date, they pre-deceased.
Um How about that? Morgan, I'm going to start asking you questions as a resident board attorney. What is that? Is that just a bunch of Words, or does that make sense? Or are you paying attention?
I mean, it is a lot of words. I mean, it makes sense. I mean, you explain it really, really well, but I think for just average Joe, I mean, it's a lot. I mean it's a lot I mean that that's why I mean you need guidance in this area. And I think the best summary is.
Okay.
Checking accounts, savings accounts, investment accounts, 401ks, life insurance. Just make sure your beneficiaries are up to date. Maybe, you know, and once a year is a lot, right? Once a year doesn't sound like a lot, but at least every couple of years, you know. Check back in.
Make sure you have a copy of the policy handy, right? When you're dead, You're dead. When you're dead, profound statement there, brother. And your spouse. Has to figure out, and maybe like if you're the spouse, you know, there's spouses that are better at planning, there's spouses that are better with money.
And if you're, if you're the, especially if you're the spouse that has all this organized and kind of knows. what's what's going on. If you don't write this down. If you don't have the folder where everything is, like Your spouse, when you're gone, is going to, on top of grieving you, on top of figuring out how to pay the bills, and maybe taking care of underage kids, they're going to have to piece this together. Like, oh, I remember a premium comes out of our bank account every month for life insurance.
Who do I call for this? And the goal, part of this is just making it easier for them. But updating your beneficiaries annually or Is biannually once every two years or twice a year? What's biannually? It's whatever you want it to be, man.
It's your show. I'm going to say it's once every two years. Yeah. All right. Yep.
That's a good that's a good timetable, man. I'll give you that.
Well, I think a lot of us too, when you think about it, um You know, our parents are aging. And these questions start to pop up when you start thinking about your own situation. You know, I've in the past six months, I've been talking to my folks about where things are. How do we do this? What exactly do we have in writing.
I think as a society, we procrastinate on these things because this is the this is the end game. A lot of people don't want to talk about it, so they put things off and then, as you mentioned, Josh, something happens. Where is everything? And we're going to talk about other assets after the break, but we're talking about the base. This is baseline stuff: get this stuff organized.
Uh take a day to make a spreadsheet, you know um put some documentation together. But this the more you have, You know, we're talking about kind of an average family, but the more you have, the harder it gets, and it's complicated even more if you're like a business owner. A lot of times on this show, we kind of talk to the self-employed, the folks who own their own businesses. But if your family depends on that income and you run the business, you know, somebody. needs to have a plan for what happens if you you know, something the worst happens, you die unexpectedly.
Uh We will continue this discussion coming up on the other side. You're locked into Judica County Radio. Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer are your hosts. They're the managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm, right here in North Carolina, where they practice law. And they placed offices in Raleigh, Garner, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Fuque Verina, Gastonia, and in Moorhead City for your convenience.
And for a complimentary consult on estate planning, simply call us 919-7727000. Say, hey, I'd like one of those complimentary consults on estate planning, and they'll sign you up, 919-7727000. You can also visit the website, wh.lawyer. We're back right after this. Judica County Radio, your host, Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer, managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer law firm, practicing attorneys here in North Carolina.
And again, offices located Raleigh, Garner, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Fuque Verena, Gastonia, down near Charlotte, and Moorhead City down at the coast. If you've got a question you'd like the attorneys to address on the program, send it to us. Questions at judicacountyradio.com. That's questions at judicacountyradio.com. And complimentary consult on estate planning.
If you've been thinking about it, we're talking about it today. And you haven't gotten the ball rolling, great way to do that is a complimentary, no-obligation appointment. See how you're doing. Call us at Whitaker and Hamer 919-7727000. That's 919-772-7000.
You can also visit the website wh.lawyer. Josh.
Yeah, so we were, you know, we were talking about the things that you can do. We would talk to you about this in a consult. This is, we kind of go through a checklist. But but making sure you can take care of everything on your own. that you can take care of.
And so we were talking about bank accounts, investment accounts. You know, as you have kids, as you may get divorced, or a spouse may die. You want to make sure you've updated your beneficiaries. With the banks. But that's that, we were talking about that.
Vehicles, all right, cars. Everybody usually, well, not everybody, but when you pass away, you usually have some vehicles that are. Titled At the DMV in your name. And You know, unfortunately, most of the time, those are those are. Probate assets, right, Joseph?
Yep, yep, that's right.
So vehicles are kind of kind of a pain. Because usually, if you want, you know, if you haven't done any estate planning. You're going to have to, they're going to have to go through probate. A file is going to have to be opened downtown.
Somebody's going to have to be put in charge of your estate. and given the power to sell or otherwise distribute those vehicles to get the DMV title. Straightened out, and you can't just go up to the DMV with a death certificate. You've got to get that figured out. And to even further muddy that conversation and take it to another level of depth.
you know, when you're talking about a trust-based estate plan, um You know, trust can be nice because they can give you some degree of asset protection during your lifetime, right? And Trust, you can drop everything in trust that would otherwise be difficult to make a non-probate asset and avoid the probate process as to most everything. Um But when it comes to vehicles, you know, a lot of folks are hesitant. to drop a vehicle into a trust, even though technically you could, because Then whatever asset protection you're getting by virtue of having that trust, you know, you've got. Potentially, the one thing that is most likely to bring you liability.
in the trust now. completely defeating the purpose of that asset protection.
So Vehicles are tricky, man. in terms of easy disposition. Yeah, and I I think they're I think some attorneys I think different attorneys probably have different opinions on vehicles.
So, vehicles, they're non-they're probate. Vehicles are probate. If you don't do anything besides get it tiled in your name, Uh someone's going to have to go downtown so they can get your estate open to deal with those vehicles. There's really not a lot of easy ways around it. And one of the things that we're going to talk about later, Joe, like you just alluded to, is as part of your estate plan, You can have a, we talk about revocable living trust, right?
So you can have the family revocable.
So here it'd be the Simpson Family Revocable Living Trust. And if you have an asset that we've determined is probate. And we want to make it non-probate, we can title it in the name of the trust. But, like you said, Joe.
Some attorneys don't recommend that.
Some attorneys maybe would, depending on certain circumstances. But vehicles are. They have to be dealt with. And there's not always an easy. It just kind of depends on.
you know who's driving it and your Your tolerance for risk and things like that. But that's RVs, boats, trailers, right? Any, you know, mobile homes. Mobile homes that aren't uh affixed to property have have a title. And so there's always the DMV title to worry about.
But. Yeah, that's a probate asset. I feel like we hadn't talked about Homer Simpson enough, man. I was really jazzed up for. that, yeah.
The uh Yeah, yeah. We should talk about it more, but I'm the only one who's got any, I'm the only one who's got any Simpsons knowledge. All right, all right, all right. And you're bragging about that. Yeah, I wanted you to flex on us, man.
I wanted to watch your name. I want to find somebody. I want to find like Simpson's trivia locally, like at a bar or something, that has like a million dollar payout. But I'm done after season 14. After season 14, I got no.
And your kids are up on this stuff too, right? Pretty good. Pretty good. Wow, you could take a team and go in there and just wipe it. But if it's trivia for season 15 to the present, I got nothing.
I got nothing for you. No one cares no one's gonna do that though, man, 'cause no one No one cares about that, right? Right? I've been meaning I've been I've been really meaning To start watching The Simpsons, the new Simpsons.
Okay.
I read That last season was like a really good season. It was like a real big comeback. It was funny. It got good. reviews from critics and fans and uh I just can't I can't Watch a T V program.
At like a set time anymore.
So let me ask you this, Josh. Was there a reason why you stopped watching?
Well season 14 I don't know why I personally stopped watching. But season season one through eleven is classic. And maybe up to season 14 was good, and that's when it fell off. And it fell off for a long time. And the writing just wasn't as good, or they lose somebody that wasn't.
Josh just got too old, man. These are all fine questions. Have you matured? Maybe so.
So The Simpsons started in 89.
So season 14 would have been what, like 95, 94? No. Yeah. It's a loss in the minutia, yeah. Yeah.
Yeah. All right. Evergreen tears, they have a house. I'm assume it's jointly owned. They bought it together.
They owned it as husband and wife. What does that mean, Joseph?
So if you own property as spouses, the type of ownership you have is called tenants by the entireties. I think it's important, you know. It it There's You can own property jointly with anyone, right?
So you can. Say, Josh and I own a piece of property together. Meaning, we're both on the deed, we both have an ownership interest. Josh and I. This may come as a surprise that the listeners are not married to one another.
So, in the absence of specific language stating otherwise, we're going to own. As what's called tenants in common.
So we're going to both have an undivided interest in the property, but that interest does not have any survivorship component.
So if I die, My piece of the property, my ownership interest is going to go to my heirs. It's not going to automatically absorb in Josh. But. If it's specifically stated that we own it as joint tenants with Ryder Survivorship, then Josh is going to take that property as soon as I die. Again, it's a non-probate asset.
And married folks who own jointly, who own together and they're on the deed, that's the way it's handled. The other spouse that survives is going to take that property without having to do any kind of probate work. I think if you look at the stats, you know, people People don't get married. As often as maybe people did 30 years ago, right? Marriage is less common.
Than it was twenty, thirty, forty years ago.
So people aren't getting married as often. And people are kind of getting married later in life than they used to. 20, 30, 40 years ago on average. Um And so you're seeing a lot of people buy a house. By themselves, right?
They're not married, they're buying a house by themselves. And once you do get married, if that happens for you. Updating. The ownership, updating the title of how you own the house is going to be an important part. of your estate plan, because if you are married Right?
Say I buy the house when I'm 21. I own it for seven, eight years. I get married at at twenty eight. One of the things that you're probably going to want to do. You don't have to do it right away, but if you're doing an estate planning as a couple, you're probably going to add that spouse.
and own that house. as tenants by the entirety because that's a That's kind of like a privilege of marriage, being able to own things that way. It protects you from judgments and it makes estate planning. Easier. Because your spouse.
if they survive you. really just has to have a death certificate, right? There's no going downtown. That's gonna pass. Non-probate, right?
And this is easy to do. Um And sir, any And some people, um Some people are going to want to keep things separate, and that's fine too. But if you're doing an estate plan together, we're trying as attorneys to maximize how much can get to the. Air. As non-probate assets.
Morgan, I feel like I'm putting everybody to sleep. I'm wide awake, man. I feel like I just mainline coffee. I perk up when The Simpsons come on. Yeah, I feel like I just mainline coffee, man, and I'm just jacked.
And I'm hanging on every word, man. I mean, but the bottom line, the overall, I mean, it's very important to, you know. Understand that having this estate plan, understanding Making sure that your beneficiaries are updated, and you've already said on the program today, it's not like you have to do it week to week. I mean, this is something you revisit. Probably every other year, but with as you age, it probably needs to be even more frequent, and more than just yourself needs to be on this page.
It needs to be your spouse. You need to have probably an estate planning attorney that's in touch with what's going on with your plan, just so these things can be updated because it can get. Harry, crazy, if one of you passes away and a lot of this information is not available. If you've sat down with an attorney and you've planned your estate, the normal average family. If you've planned If you've done your planning, I mean, you really should have everything kind of wrapped up.
Yeah. And it it gets more complicated the more again, like I said, the more you have. Right. You know, the more you have, it gets it's a get it gets a little complicated, but But the goal in an estate plan is that the surviving spouse just keeps moving. Right.
There's a plan. For how to replace income. whether it's life insurance or something else. Um And everything is going to, all the assets are kind of designed to move to that surviving spouse automatically. And that's.
And that's that's the goal. Um And it's easy enough, you know, with very little planning, really, in the grand scheme of things, you know, an hour or two. A year. And for most people, that keeps everything up to date and ready to go for when. Because it's not if it's going to happen, right?
We're going to die. It's just when it's going to happen. And, um,. It's not as bad. I feel like we're making it sound harder than it is.
Well, it's hard if you don't. It can be. You can make it a lot easier by doing these things. Right. You take the steps, but it's taking the steps that seems to be the hardest.
For most people out there, they just don't do it, or they put it off and put it off until something happens, and then it's too late. It's not too late, but it becomes more complicated. All right, so Judica County Radio, we're going to continue on the other side. We're talking more and more about probate, non-probate, estate planning, making sure you have your affairs in order. And as Josh pointed out, it's really not that hard, but you just have to go through these steps.
Again, to grab one of our complimentary estate planning consults, you can call our number 919-7727000. That's 919-77270000. You can also visit the website wh.lawyer. Again, these are complimentary. No obligation to become a client, 919-77270000, or go to wh.
We're back right after this. Judica County Radio, hosted by Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer, managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm, the power behind this program. And again, they're practicing attorneys here in our great state of North Carolina. And they placed offices all over our state for your convenience down at the coast, Moorhead City, over near Charlotte and Gastonia. You got Fuque Verina, Goldsboro, Clayton, Garner, Cleveland, and of course the cap city, Raleigh, North Carolina.
I'm Morgan Patrick. A pleasure to jump on with the attorneys. Today we are talking about estate planning probate versus non-probate, and we're using the Simpsons, Homer, and his crew, as our guiding example. And Josh, where are we going next? One of the things I haven't brought up that's very important for Homer and Marge.
They have three young children. Yeah. And so one of the things when you have young children is you're going to try to think about that situation. You know, more than likely, right? Homer and Marge, more than likely, Homer's probably going to die first.
The man. usually does in that situation where you've got a you've got a husband and a wife. Usually, men die sooner than women.
So, if we're playing the averages, we're preparing her estate plan so that when Homer's gone, and he's not a healthy guy. He's not. If you've watched The Simpsons, he's not. He's not in good health. Several episodes revolve around his heart.
That's one thing I do know about The Simpsons.
So, if we had to guess, Homer's probably gonna die first.
So, we're actually, most of our estate plan thinking is like, how do we make it so Marge. Can Keep her quality of life and keep moving after he's gone.
Now, Occasionally You lose a husband and wife at the same time in a car accident. Or you know, I've I've been practicing for 23 years now and um And I've only seen that happen once, maybe twice, where we had a car accident that took. Yeah. a a mom and a dad, you know, or you know, two spouses. Um but it does happen.
It does happen, and so part of your estate plan is planning for that. And that holds up a lot of people because you gotta figure out a couple of things. And we've talked about it before on the show, but here. Who's going to be the guardian? If something happens to Homer and Marge.
You can choose. You know, who you want the guardian of your kids, your underage kids, to be. If something happens to both you and your spouse, right?
Now, I can't choose that. Right, if in my will, if I die and Charlotte, my spouse, is still alive, I can't say, well, if I die, I want my brother to be the guardian. It doesn't work that way, right? But if both spouses are gone, you guys can choose. Who do you want to take care of your underage kids?
And I don't know who that would be for. Homer, right? Homer's got a brother. Homer's got a brother. You know his brother?
You know who plays his brother in the show? No, I don't. And I don't. What's his name? Don't tell me you don't know his name, man.
I know the name. I know who voices him. I'm trying to remember the name. Danny DeVito does the voice of Homer's brother. But he's only on like two or three episodes and I can't remember his name.
Herbert. power.
So that's Homer's brother. that they don't see very often, and then Marge has two sisters. Um Whose names I can't remember now either. Selma, Patty, and Selma. Yeah, I know the sisters.
More than I know Herb. I feel like Herb's more obscure than the sisters. All right, Homer's got a dad who's in a home. Abe.
Okay.
And Marge has a mother. Whose name I don't remember.
Okay.
Who's also in a home? Yeah, all right.
So they have to decide they have to come together and say who would we want to be guardian of our kids if we both pass away. And maybe Homer wants it to be Herb. Right, maybe. Maybe Marge wants it to be her sisters. Maybe they don't want it to be family.
Alright, maybe they do want Mo. Yeah, Mo. I don't I can't imagine Mo Sislak is their choice. Yeah. Um But most of Homer's friends are drunks, right?
Yeah. Bardy. Yeah. Functioning alcoholics though. Ned Flanders would be a great choice.
Do you think so? The next door neighbor? Yeah. But they have to decide that. And I tell you what, man, that holds up the most estate planning I've ever seen.
Where people are trying to figure out who, in this situation, that probably is not gonna happen. Who should be guardian of our underage kids? I think I'd agree with that sentiment. That is the number one thing that. gives pause and kinda shuts down the process.
More often than anything. And I would say don't don't let it. Yeah. Right, you know, come come to the most reasonable agreement. Homer doesn't, you don't want his dad in an assisted living facility to be the guardian of the underage kids.
But come to the most practical decision that you can, knowing There's less than a 1% chance this is ever going to come into play. Yeah. Yeah, and and it's better I always tell folks that get stuck on that that it's much better for, you know, even if you're not a million percent sure. We hope that you are, but if you're not... It's so much better to to have some say than to have no say.
and to have it be that that free-for-all situation that nobody wants. Yeah, because if you don't have anything in place, and God forbid that happens, so you have done no estate planning, you do not have a will, you and your spouse are in a car accident. and you have it named a guardian, then guess who's gonna figure that out? The court. The core.
Yeah. Yep, you're gonna have different people around you who think they should be guardian going to a court. And saying, like, hey, we should be awarded guardianship of your underage kids. And you might have families kind of fighting on who that should be. The court could decide none of your family members are in a position to take care of your kids.
Assign somebody else, you know. Yes, it's better just to have somebody named Than just leave it up to chance, which is what you're doing. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Infinitely better. Um And then whoever you name, you should probably tell them.
Right. If you go through to your will and you said, hey, I'm going to say my brother is going to be guardian of my kids, you should probably tell them that you've. named them guardian make sure they're Cool with it. It's far better than the alternative of you just dropping your kids off dropping your kids at the doorstep after you get to the end of the day. Yeah, I got I got three boys and I'm sure my family would do whatever they could to take care of them, but still it's nice to know ahead of time 'Cause not everybody can take care of three kids out of the blue.
Yeah, especially your kids, man. Especially the Whitaker boys, man. But um But yeah, so that's going to be a big part of their estate plan. And from an attorney's perspective, that's a very small, that's a clause in a document. We're not really doing a lot of.
Planning, but that's a decision that takes a long time for our clients a lot of times to make. Um And again, not a big piece of the puzzle for us from an attorney perspective, but a very important Decision that hangs a lot of people. We have one more segment with Judica County Ready. We'll come back and we'll wrap up the program. You're listening to Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer, managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer Lawfarm, our hosts.
They're practicing attorneys here in North Carolina. And again, they placed offices around our state for your convenience, right here in Raleigh, also Garner, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Fucuv Arena, Gastonia, and down on the coast at Moorhead City. Again, complimentary consult on estate planning. Simply call our number 919-772-7000. That's 919-7727000.
They'll get you signed up for that. You can also visit the website, wh.lawyer. You can sign up there as well. Again, the number to call is 919-772-7000, or visit the website, wh.lawyer, for that complimentary consult on estate planning. We're back to wrap up Judica County for this week coming up next.
Judica County Radio, final segment. Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer are your hosts. They're the managing partners, Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm, and they're practicing attorneys here in North Carolina. Offices all over our state for your convenience: Garner, Raleigh, Cleveland, Clayton, Goldsboro, Tuclave Arena, Moorhead City, and down near Charlotte in Gastonia. I'm Morgan Patrick.
A pleasure to be on with the attorneys.
Now, you may have a question you'd like answered on a future program. You can send it to us, questions at judicacountyradio.com. That's questions at judicacountyradio.com. And again, complimentary consult on estate planning, that's what we offer up. You're not paying for it, and you're not obligated to become a client, but you can see if you're on track with your estate planning.
We're talking about that today. Again, to grab one, just call us 919-777. That's 919-7727000 or visit the website wh.lawyer. Josh.
Well, I think we've done good by Marge and Homer. and helping them get some basic things. done. You know, what we haven't talked about we talk about it all the time though. We haven't talked about powers of attorneys and healthcare power of attorneys and living wills and things like that.
We're going to do those. In our fictional meeting with Homer and Marge, um. But the but but kinda hitting the kinda hitting the big things. You know We didn't really get to this joe. We kind of ran out of time, but I would still probably recommend a revocable living trust for Homer and Marge.
Yeah, yeah. I think it makes sense. They've got minor kids, right? We're assuming they're minors. I mean, they are a minor.
They're forever girls. I mean, technically. They'll never be girls. Yeah, they're all 20-plus years old, minimum, technically, but in the show. They never grow.
We'll assume they're minors and... When you got minor kids in the absence of of A trust. The court's going to step in, and for those kids to take any assets, they're going to create a trust for you. This would be a scenario where we would we would lean towards a trust for these folks, for sure. Yeah, something it's something to remember.
You know, if you're under 18, you can't really own very much. Right, if you're under 18, you can't take title to real property, you can't deed your under 18-year-old kid. an interest in real property, you can't You can't take title. Um You know, if an underage kid is your beneficiary on your life insurance. and they're under 18 when you die.
the life insurance company's not going to cut them a check. They're gonna make a trust or a guardian or somebody get appointed and cut the check to them to manage until they're 18, right? And so when you've got underage children, you've got assets, and Homer and Marge, I think they're in a lot of debt if the show is to be believed.
So I don't know what their equity is. in their houses. There's an episode where Homer gets a third mortgage to buy a T V. I don't know that we could recommend that to the listener.
So, I don't know how much equity they have in some of their assets, but they have assets. And underage children, you know, if you're worried about both of you being gone, a revocable trust is going to make a lot of sense 'cause that's an easy way Um otherwise A lot of this is avoiding. I don't want this to sound bad. But a lot of what we do is to avoid you having to interact with the clerk's office, with the court system. Get a guardian appointed, having heirs fight over things, you know.
You know, and I to keep your business out of The courthouse. Which I like that idea of positioning everything in such a manner. where no one can fight over stuff when you're gone. It's very clear and easy. You know, a trustee has instructions.
I like it. It's clean. We like clean here, man. We like clean. That's right.
The cleaner the better. But we do, we do, and we see an uptick. But if you, you know, Morgan's going to give you all that information if you call us and you mention the radio show. If you call us on the weekend, we're not there.
Alright, so you'll have to leave us a message, but we'll reach out to you during the week. And we'll get you scheduled for a consult. Again, we do that in person in one of our offices. If you'd like, we can do it by phone, we can do it by Zoom. But that's what we do.
Once we get you into our system, we get some information from you that we need, kind of like what we know about Homer and Marge. We know some of their basic. Information and We kind of tell you what we think would be appropriate, and we can tell you what that costs. You know how long it takes, what you need to do. Um It's we try to make it as simple as as possible, but You know, the calendar is already getting a little crowded for 2026, and so this is something we do when we're on the radio.
And uh We've enjoyed it. Yeah, I mean, this is a great opportunity for listeners out there to just get some questions answered. You've probably jotted down a few as you've listened to the show, things that pertain to you and your family. Grab one of the consults and come in and get those questions answered. The number to call is 919-77270000.
Again, just leave your name, contact information, and of course, you want that complimentary consult, and they will return the phone call. If you call on the weekend, obviously, they'll get to you early in the week and they'll set up that appointment. 919-7727000. It is complimentary, no obligation to become a client. You'll get a lot of good answers about estate planning as it pertains to you.
919-7727000. You can always visit the website wh.lawyer, get all the information there, and you can sign up there as well. 919-7727000 or WH.lawyer. Another edition of Judica County Radio is in the books for Josh Whitaker and Joe Hamer, your hosts and managing partners at Whitaker and Hamer Law Firm in Praxington. Here in North Carolina.
I'm Morgan Patrick. We'll see you on the radio next week. Yeah. Judica County is hosted by attorneys licensed to practice law in North Carolina.
Some of the guests appearing on this podcast may be licensed North Carolina attorneys. Discussion on this podcast is meant to be general in nature, and in no way should the discussion be interpreted as legal advice. Legal advice can only be rendered once an attorney, licensed in the state in which you live, has the opportunity to discuss the facts of your case with you. The attorneys appearing on this podcast are speaking in generalities about the law in North Carolina and how these laws affect the average North Carolinian. If you have any questions about the content of this show, you can direct such inquiry to Joshua Whitaker at jmw at mwhlaw.lawyer.
