Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at KARM.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick live.

Francis taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey, everybody, welcome to the show. It's me, Matt Slick.

Your list of Matt Slick live and let's see, today's date is January 8th, 2023. So there you go. Hey, if you want to give me a call, all you got to do is dial 8772072276.

And if you want, you can email me at info at KARM.org, info at KARM.org. And just put in a radio question, radio comment. That reminds me. So yesterday I was with my wife and we went to a store for a little bit. And long story short, I ended up talking to this guy about the Lord and he had a cross on and I said, hey, have you crossed me anything? You know, he said, yes. He says, I'm a new Christian. I said, oh, good. We just got talking there for a little bit.

And, you know, I mean, I sort of encourage you and praise God and things like that. And and I said, so what church are you going to? He told me this name of this church and rung a bell or something. And I just said, do they have women pastors there at the church?

He said, yes, they do. So right away within a minute, you know, I'm sitting there going, well, and I started talking about how women pastors are not biblical women. And he didn't like it. And, you know, I said 80 percent of the denominations that adopt women pastors within two generations are approving of homosexuality and stuff. I said, I said, I can give you the reasons.

I gave him my card. I said, check it out. You know, I got a lot of information on this stuff. But anyway, you know, I should have a slogan, you know, messing people up on a daily basis. That could be a good thing from Monday through Friday and sometimes on the weekend, too.

So poor guy. But, you know, it just reminds me that there's so much heresy out there in the Christian church. And to me, I just got to whine a little bit.

I got to complain a little bit. Why is it people don't believe the Bible? It's just that simple. Believe the Bible, OK?

That's what it says. So, you know, people are like, man, we do. We just want to agree with your interpretation of the Bible.

Well, OK, let's talk. You can call, you know, and, you know, when it says do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man, but remain silent for Adam was first created. I said, what does that mean? It means you could she could have authority over a girl. But he just said no. It was cultural. But he said it was because of the created order. So how do you work that? And how's an elder, which as a pastor is an elder, how's an elder to be the husband of one wife?

How does that work? It was just cultural. We just stop with just the cultural stuff. And, you know, you don't believe what the word says. And then there's things about predestination. You know, I don't believe in predestination. God would never do that.

I show him where he does it. You know, the scriptures, you know, predestination doesn't. And, you know, they go, no, it doesn't mean that. It says it right there.

And so what I'm finding is that a lot of people, a lot of people, they submit the scriptures to their feelings. That's right. Wonderful feelings. And I think it was SpongeBob who said that. I think it was because we when the kids were young, this is 10, 15 years ago, we would have SpongeBob Saturdays and we would get pancakes and sit down and watch SpongeBob for an hour or so, the whole family. It was fun, you know.

And I remember once I asked my daughters, you know, they're like 10, 11, 12, 13, 15, whatever, eight times 10, 11, 12 range. I said, hey, how can it be fire underneath the water? And they would give me these explanations, you know, as if I didn't know anything. And it was just awesome. Well, dad, let me explain. Because they would make up something, right?

And that's what a lot of fun. But any rate, I think it was SpongeBob who said, I'm going to trust your feelings. But I may be wrong on that one.

I may be wrong. I think a lot of people, some of you can tell me what they said. So, what they said. Anyway, so, yeah, so, you know, I teach things in the scriptures that a lot of people don't like. And to me, it's like, I don't care if you don't like it or not, that's your problem. You know, I teach that God works all things after the counsel of his will. Ephesians 1, 11, that's what the quote says, where God makes all things even the wicked for the day of destruction. You know, Proverbs 16, 4. You know, or I'll teach people these things, oops, excuse me. I'll teach them this stuff, and they go, no, I don't believe it. I would never serve a God who predestines people.

You wouldn't? Well, you better be careful what you're saying, because that's what the Bible says. And they don't like it.

I think it's because, there's two reasons. One are being taught mamby-pamby, hammock theology, or skipping stone theology. You know what skipping stone theology is, right? It's where you take a rock, and you throw it across the surface of the water, and it doesn't really sink. Well, it doesn't either.

It sinks down, but I mean, you know, it skips across the surface. That's what a lot of the sermons are. That's what I'm getting this impression, because I talk to a lot of people, and they're telling me that, you know, basically God's the blond haired, black, Caucasian surfer dude dressed under a woman's nightgown. And I can say, well, that's not what it says. And I show people this stuff, you know. And I go to a thesis like Ephesians 1, 4. It just says, he chose us in him before the foundation of the world. And people go, no, no, no, Jesus, no, God knows, God knows what we're going to choose. And so he's saving us based on that choice. That's not what the verse says, you see. He chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before him in love. He predestined us to adoption as sons who Jesus Christ himself.

No, man, he looked into the future. That's what it says, what it has to mean. It has to mean it.

Please don't let it be true. And I take them to Romans 9, and verse 11. You know, for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that God's purpose, according to his choice, would stand not because of works, but because of him who calls, it was said, to her, the older will serve the younger, just as it is written, Jacob, I love that he so I hated. And when I read this to people, and I'm having a discussion with them, because they're following the blonde haired, blue-eyed Caucasian surfer, Jesus dressed in a woman's nightgown, standing at the door of your heart, asking permission for you to let him in. And then when I talk like this to people, I read them scripture.

No, I reject that. A lot of people do. A lot of people do. But, you know, I can also say there's a lot of people who just believe what the Bible says. And I have a lot of people who say, well, you know, it's got me thinking.

Well, that's good. It gets you thinking. But unfortunately, there's a whole host of people, and they're obstreperous and recalcitrant and boisterously recalcitrant sometimes. Not obsequious. That wouldn't be it. Not a sycophant.

No, no, no. But they're more like recalcitrant, non-Cescobadillians whose cogitation's a little bit askew because they're obtuse. So these are some of the things that I have to deal with sometimes when I'm talking to people. And when I talk like that, they say, what'd you just say?

And then I, you know, well, it's a bunch of stuff. Anyway, hey, look, if you want to give me a call, all you have to do is dial 8772072276. I want to hear from you.

We have nobody waiting. And if you enjoy my inane persoflage. Inane persoflage is, well, you know what inane means. Persoflage is just like a lot of empty banter. So inane persoflage, okay, I think it's a cool word, a cool couplet, and that way when you're talking to somebody you can sound uppity without really being uppity.

So it can be a lot of fun, you know. And I have friends that, they call them hip boys, truck boys up here in Idaho. And I talk to them like this, and they just stare at me. And they go, you know, you know, I say, am I too smart for you?

And they threaten me at that point. So, so, you know, that's what it is. But hey, look, I want you to give me a call, 877-207-2276.

You can also email me at info at karm.org, info at karm.org. And let's see, and then it put in the, I'm thinking it got something. And then you put in the subject line. You put in, oh, man, what did you put in?

You put in the radio question or radio comment. Gee whiz. Man. And so there you go. I was distracted by a thought.

That's my excuse. I really was. And then I forgot what the thought was. Man, welcome to being 67. You distract yourself with a thought. And then when you talk about being distracted about the thought, you forget what the thought was.

Maybe some of you have got that problem too, but it happens with me. All right. Oh, let's see.

Okay, there we go. And I'm in the chat room. We've got one caller coming in. And it looks like I'll be flying out to Tennessee on the 21st, 22nd range, Nashville area, in order to speak at a conference. Then I got asked to speak at a conference in Caldwell, California, Caldwell, Idaho, about 20 minutes from here.

And that's in April. And I got a debate set up for March 1st with an open theist. Is open theism true? Which open theism says that God doesn't know the future exhaustively, that the future's open.

So God has to kind of guess. So we'll be going through that. And it's with, oh, who is that debate with, someone asked. All right, now I've got to go look it up. Oh, man. Wait a minute.

I think I know where to go find it quickly. It's open theist Chris Fisher. I don't know who the guy is.

Maybe I've debated him before. I don't know, but, uh, I don't remember. I talked to so many people, you know, it's one of the things you talk to so many people that you forget who you're talking to.

You forget who they are. All right. Hey, let's get on the line here with, uh, let's get to, oh man, hit the wrong button on that one.

Let's get to Winfield from North Carolina or Winfield, whoever you're on the air. Hey, Matt, how are you? Good.

How are you doing hanging in there, hanging in there? Hey, so you were just talking about free destination and chosen and all of that. And I've been discussing with my two sons that subject over the week. One of the questions that came up was, well, God, if God chose the elect, then did he choose the people who are going to be condemned? Yeah, now this, this is a logic issue and there's different ways of kind of looking at it.

So let's just say that, uh, you have, uh, let's see, let's say you have, you have a fire that you're going to, to produce, you know, in your house, in the fireplace and you have 10 logs, let's just say, and you pick five of them out of the 10 and you pick five and you use those, have you picked the other ones not to be used or did you just not pick them and they go and just stay there kind of a bad one because you know, it would be the one to go to the fire, but, uh, this kind of a thing, if you have several objects and you only pick some of the objects and not the rest of them, you're actively picking one, but you're not actively picking the other in this general sense. So we know for, uh, we know biblically that God chooses people for salvation. Second Thessalonians two 13 Ephesians one, four through five. We know that that's the case. Now, does he decide certain individuals are specifically designed to go to hell?

I could make the case biblically that he does, and I could make the case biblically that he just lets them go where they want, but here's some verses that are interesting. This is Romans nine 21 through 23, or does not the Potter have a right over the clay to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use, Oh, there's the break. So I'm going to get back at the break. What I'll do is I'll read this. We'll discuss this and get some other issues related to this.

Okay. So hold on, buddy. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages. If you want to give me a call, all you got to do is dial eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Seven six would be right back it's Matt slick live, taking a call at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Here's Matt slick. Everybody. Welcome back to the show.

If you want to give me a call, all you got to do is dial eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six, and you can also email me all you have to do is, uh, just direct your email to info at carm.org C a R M dot O R G. And, uh, if you have a comment or question, just put it in the subject line as radio comment or radio question. There you go. Winfield, are you still there? Yep. Yeah.

All right. So let's get back to Romans nine 21 through 23, where does not the Potter have a right over the clay to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use. What if God, although willing to demonstrate his wrath and to make his power known, endured with much patience, vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, and he did so to make known the riches of his glory upon vessels of mercy, which he prepared beforehand for glory. Now about these verses, you see, it says that the Potter that's God has the right to do with what he wants with the clay. You can make one vessel for the, a good use and one for a bad use.

One for different uses. He has the right to do that. So we can make the case from here that God fits people for destruction. Now people may say, well, we don't, I don't like that. Well, okay.

The question isn't if you like it or not. The question is, is what does the Bible say? Now there's another version to look at here a little bit and I'm going to lay out some theology and we'll talk about this a little bit there's a, uh, Romans 5, 12 says that, uh, sin entered the world through one man and then in verse 19, Romans 5, 19 for as to the one man's disobedience, the many were made sinners.

Now this is an interesting, uh, word, uh, because, uh, the word were made sinners is cut, uh, cut test us, they son. And it is in Greek, the heiress passive, uh, indicative. And what that means is the heiress is past tense, but the what's important is passive, passive voice. It happened to them and indicative basically means it's a fact.

So it's past tense and it happened to them and it's a fact. So this is what it says for as through one man's disobedience, the many were made sinners. It means that Adam sin made everybody else sinners. That's what it says. Right. So that's original sin. Okay. So that's what that said.

I'll just, I'll go on, but I want to just pick a side note. A lot of people say, no, they, they reject that. I'd say, well, if you want to reject it, you can reject it all you want, but if you're going to be consistent and you reject it, Adam represented other people. He represented us, then be consistent and reject that the last Adam represented us. That's, uh, Jesus first Corinthians 15, 45, that the last he's called the last Adam and he represented us. So both are our heads of their people, just as it says in Romans five 18. So, uh, then as through one transgression, that's Adam sin, their resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness, their resulted justification of life to all men. So Jesus represented his people. Adam represented his people, which is everybody.

All right. So, so we can see then that all people are by nature, children of wrath. And that's Ephesians two, three, we are by nature, children of wrath. And, uh, all were made sinners because death entered through one man and spread to everybody.

Okay. So having said that, what we could say is that of the sea of individuals who all are naturally damned, they naturally belong in hell because their natures are fallen and they just the way it is, God reaches in and saves some. So he actively chooses people for salvation. That's second Thessalonians two 13, but I don't know of any verse that says he chooses someone for damnation. So this is why, uh, I kind of go back and forth because in one, one sense, yeah, he certainly creates, uh, vessels for dishonor, you know, and Proverbs 16, four, he makes all things, even the wicked for the day of destruction. Well, it's tough to get through, but that's what it says. So what I like to lean towards is that of all people that are made to be saved, of all people that are made and they fell in Adam, the elect are the ones chosen out of that to be saved.

The rest go their natural way. If it's the, if someone wants to say, well, that's how they chose, he chose them to not go, then you could say, well, then he chose them not to go. But if you said he's letting them go and you only chose actively the elect to be saved, then you can say it that way too.

And both in that sense could be true. So you see what I'm saying? Yep. Yep. Yep.

Yeah. I was just wondering, cause my, my youngest son was really struggling with, and I guess I am now a little bit with the fact that it's all, I know that it's like 20 verses where God chooses and we're predestined. So then when you look at the other logic piece, it's like, well, then to God, then basically make sorrow or whatever people can to be condemned. Yes, he did. And then you, then you look, then you link and you look at, you know, God is love and I know God is justice and his attributes.

It's just hard to get my head around that a hundred percent at this point. Yeah. Yeah, it is. And, um, here, let me show you talked about Pharaoh. All right. And so this is a Romans nine 14. What shall we say then there is no injustice with God is there? May it never be for, he says to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I have mercy.

I'll have compassion on whom I have compassion. So it does not depend upon the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God, who has mercy for the scripture says to Pharaoh, for this very purpose, I raised you up to demonstrate my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed throughout the whole earth. So he has mercy on whom he desires and he hardens whom he desires.

What people generally will do is they'll come back and they'll say, well, no, no, no. He didn't make them like that. He just strengthened what Pharaoh was already doing to himself and what people are doing when they automatically react that way is they're adopting humanism. So let me explain this. I've been using this term now a lot in reference to people claiming to be Christians.

In fact, I've been using it more with people claiming to be Christians than than atheists for real. And I have been lately, you know, because humanism is the teaching that man is the standard of righteousness. Man's free will is the deciding factor. Man's ability. Man is the measure. So God won't do that to Pharaoh because I'm telling you, God won't do it. That's what they're essentially saying. If I show them a scripture where it says that God raised him up for this purpose, no, you don't understand that in the old Testament, what happened was he hardened his own heart.

Yes, he did. And then God had to step in and harden his heart because Pharaoh was ready to give up and God hardened his heart so he wouldn't let him go. God did this to him and they don't like that.

Why? Because obviously we all know this, the historical figure of Jesus. He's obviously a Caucasian guy and he has light blue eyes and he's got long blonde hair and a perfect complexion.

And, uh, you know, he, he dressed in a woman's nightgown. He kind of walks, you know, I don't know if he's walking, you know, whatever. And, um, and he's asking permission for you to let him into your heart because it's up to you and your wisdom and your ability to let him in. And that's when it all becomes effective. That's when salvation becomes effective. That's when the atonement becomes effective. When you do something, it's up to you. And that's common theology today.

It's a heresy. Hey, man, hold on. Sorry about that.

There's another break. I'll get to some work on that a little bit. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages.

If I've offended you, then call me and say you offend me and then we can talk about it. Hey, we'll be right back. Please stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-22 76 is Matt Slick. All right, everybody. Welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, all you have to do is dial 877-207-22 76.

Let's get back on with Winfield. You there? Yep.

I'm here. Okay. All right. So there you go.

How about that? Yeah. I mean, I just, it is, I just have to, um, grapple with the fact that God is God. And that's it.

I can't, you know, I guess I could just deal with that. Yeah. Um, yes, it's correct. And yet he wants all people to be saved as it generally says in second Peter three, nine and first Timothy two, four.

And we can talk about that as well. And can he arrange something contrary to what he desires or he says he desires? And the answer to that is yes. And can, can there be a sense in which he wants someone to be saved, but doesn't arrange for it and answers?

Yes. He's Jesus speaks in parables. So people will not be saved Mark four, 10 through 12. So this is a deep topic. It's not just a light topic and most people, and I'm not knocking them because it takes a lot of knowledge and thinking to get through this. Most people are just not there. They can't put it together because they've not been taught over the years and how to fit this together.

And I'm not mocking them or knocking them. It's just they go to church and then, and they, uh, a skipping stone, uh, sermon is, is delivered and so they don't really learn deep theology and what's going on. And most people don't, don't want to, you know, so it's a deep topic, but there's more to it. Maybe that's why I'm struggling a bit with it.

Good. If you're struggling, it's a good thing. It means something in you isn't right. And the truth of God's word is exposing it.

And what you'll come to eventually, hopefully, is that there's a God, you are not him and you don't know how it all works. We know that the prayers of a righteous man avail much with God. James five talks about this.

Well, how does that work with the election predestination? I don't know. How is it that my prayers can influence God from eternity past to save someone? I don't know.

I don't know, but I do know that there are a lot of things I can't answer in this regard and they belong to the purview of God. So one of the illustrations I have used is there's a ceiling and there's a thread, a string that goes, it starts above the ceiling and comes down into the, where we are, we can see it. And it goes back up into the ceiling, travels for a while, different direction, comes down, goes up. We can only see one side of things. What's on our side. We don't know what's happening on the other side. And that's where I just let it just go, which I know what the Bible says, but I also know it says he desires all he pray for intercession for all.

And it makes a difference, but I don't know how it works. And so I just say, well, as my friend Bill McKeever told me, he says, he said, uh, uh, we're in sales, not production. I mean, just leave it to me. Okay.

All right. Well, I mean, what I, what I told my son was this, tell me if this is right. I was, I just told him, I said, I said, look, you know, I go, if you, if you chose God, then you have something to brag about. Then you can say on the day that you have to face God on judgment day, you can say, well, I chose you, but my neighbor didn't. So, yeah, and, but we do choose because God enables us to do so. He grants that we have faith. Look, it's one 29. So we actually do believe now I can get into this even deeper, but we got callers waiting.

Maybe some of them want to call back. We can talk about this even more. I can, but yeah, I've had these conversations all the time after I study more. All right. All right.

Sounds good. Appreciate it. Thank you, brother. All right, brother. God bless. All right.

Let's get to, let's see Nadir from Florida. Welcome. You're on the air. Well, hello, Matt. How are you doing? I'm doing fine. How are you doing? Doing well, doing well.

Hey, um, I didn't hear back from you regarding the debate on can Muslims prove, uh, or disprove the divinity of Christ. So I just was making sure we're, we're okay with that. Oh yeah. I get so many things going.

I, I, you'll find that I can drop the ball sometimes on purpose. It's just, what are we doing again? Um, so you want to, you want to debate me on the deed of Christ? Yeah. And so basically the topic is going to be can Muslims disprove the divinity of Christ. So the burden of proof is all going to be put on the Muslims. Exactly. Well, there's a problem there and I'm not trying to debate you right now. I'm just saying, uh, sure.

Using what source? Because if you use the Quran, then that's called an external critique and it's invalid. Right. That would be kind of like a, I don't know.

Of course that would be a fallacy. I can't say because the Quran said so, but yeah, no, we're going to use the Bible. We're going to use a lot of whatever is out there, but for sure. I do agree with you on that. Yeah. How about this as a title then? Uh, does the Bible, um, support or teach or affirm that Jesus Christ is God in flesh or the deity of Christ, either one.

What do you think? Hmm, I think, well, probably a mixture of both would be good. Could we say, is Jesus really God?

And maybe, maybe that would be a good one. Okay. And I'll just tell you, that's fine. Is he's really God using the Bible, right? Yes. Okay.

So does the Bible teach you this is really God. Okay. And you understand, okay, go ahead.

No, go ahead. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, for sure. I mean, is Jesus really God in the flesh? Really God, we can, we can look at it from many different angles and using logic, reason, science, the Bible. I mean, all these things we can throw in there.

And so we can look at it and see, is this man really God? Okay. Um, all right.

You're going to use logic, philosophy, and science. Um, I'm just trying to help you out here ahead of time. You might want to be careful. Oh, I appreciate it. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

But, uh, because science is, uh, is for the material world, philosophy presupposes, the universality of the laws of logic and, uh, certain things, but we can get into that, but the sources of scriptures, because that's what I'll be going to with the Bible says. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's just a follow up from the last debate I think you had with a Muslim metaphysician.

I'm not a big fan of his, so I thought we could have a discussion on that and clarify some issues. Okay. So what's the, what do you want to be the debate title? Uh, what do you need a specific title? Does the Bible teach that Jesus is God?

Is that good enough? Well, I would say like what I, what I posted to James, James is, uh, looking for the title, can Muslims disprove, can Muslims disprove Jesus is God or something like that, I think whatever James from modern day debate, whatever we submitted to him, I think we need to go with that because he's very selective on titles, maybe you have to have a standard of, I mean, I'm just helping out because this is, this is what I would do with people. I would say, look, you know, we had a debate right there. I'd say disprove. You have to have a universal standard by which you can then say he is or is not what your standard, if you go with the Quran as a journal, if you go with science, it's, it's a category error. That's what I'm just saying is you've got problems here. Yeah. So, no, I think it's, I think we can get into, I think, uh, the standard is going to be nobody is God.

That's the default position. Uh, and so whoever it is, they have to prove that they are actually God. We can look at the Bible.

We can see what it says over there. And so by default, he's not God. If we were to look at it objectively. So that's what your position is. Jesus is not God. So, and I will of course show proof that is clearly from the Bible and using logic, reason, science, whatever, that he's absolutely not God. Yes. Okay. Okay. He will use proof from the Bible that Jesus is not God. Okay.

I'm getting this cause it's being recorded. Uh, so the title is can Muslims or well, can Muslims can, okay. See Muslims is plural. All right.

I'm very technical. So Muslims, if it's just you, well, if you don't make your case, it doesn't mean other Muslims can't. So, you know, and it's just, just nuanced discussion. That's why I like to say, does the Bible teach that Jesus is God? Let me go to the scriptures because that's what it's going to come to anyway.

But if you want to do it again, we'll do it generically. Can Muslims just prove that Jesus is God? How about that? Can the divinity of Christ be disproved logically?

Oh, you, Christ be disproved. Uh, yeah, I'm writing it down. Um, okay.

You want to do that one? That's fine. Okay. Yes. And you're gonna need to respond back to James because I think he's waiting for you and you can, you can submit him that alternative title.

Where did he email me yet? Sorry. I do apologize. You know what I will.

Yeah. He, if you just, uh, like do a search on his name and your email, like modern day debate, I think you'll find it. But, uh, what I do, I'll forward you his email. That way, uh, you can just email me and that way we can get the ball rolling.

Okay. And so who are you? Why are you qualified? I'm Nadir. I'm Nadir Ahmed. We've been doing this for how many years?

I talked to so many people. We go back almost 30 years. I'm an old man.

That's my qualification. Okay. All right. Yeah. All right. And you want to say, use the issue of logic. Okay.

That sounds good. Are you familiar with modus ponens, modus tollens? No, I don't think I'll be going there. Yeah. Well, I'm just seeing if you know what is from the issue of logic. No, no. All right.

So I don't see modern day debates. Uh, just have him email me one more time at info. I'll pay attention for it. To, to, to, to, let me, let me do this. Let me CC you as you just give you an email that way you can see people break. Hold on.

Put it in, give it to the, hold on. We got a break. Hold on. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. Everybody welcome back to the show and it looks like we lost him. Uh, let's, uh, I'm not seeing his thing there. Uh, he's going to call back and, um, I did check all the modern day debate, uh, all the, uh, for the phrase and all my emails and I don't see it anywhere. So just have him, if he's still listening, just email me at info and we'll get it checked out. All right.

Next longest waiting is Emilio from, uh, Charlotte, North Carolina. Welcome. You're on the air. Hey, good afternoon, Matt.

Good afternoon. Just to let you know, we always listen to your, uh, program as we're, uh, driving to our Bible class and it's very educational. Um, I called now is that I was just listening to an individual who had a concern about those God predestined some for salvation and some for damnation. Right. And I used to struggle with this, uh, for a while.

And, uh, this versus, uh, on Romans eight, 28 to 30, at least to me, it gives me a better understanding. Right. We also predestined. Mm hmm. Yep. Yeah. So the way that I see it, first of all, we do have three wheel, correct? If we could define what free will is, but yeah, we do.

And once it would be defined. Okay. Okay. Now what I really enjoy over here is this on 28 and we know that God is that in that in all things, God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose. I mean, I think that that's a black and white, uh, okay. Now this is the part that gave me pieces for those God for new, okay. Because God for new, so that means that he knew whether we are going to, uh, I wouldn't say so much as accepting, but that we will accept, accept him, go to him, give ourselves to him, surrender to him.

He for knew whether we will do that or not. That's not what it means. No. Okay. So let me finish and then maybe you can explain a little bit more to me.

Sure. So it says for those God for new, he also predestined because out of our free will, he knew if we were going to give ourselves to Christ and then, then he says, we destined to be conformed to the image of the son that he might be the first born among many brothers and sisters. And then he says, and those he predestined, okay.

Because he, he already for knew. Well, yes, but let's get, cause we're, we got it. We're running out of time here a little bit, cause it's gonna take a bit to go through. Okay. So your understanding, I mean this, you know, carefully here, politely, I think there's a better way to look at it. All right. So the word for know in Greek is ginosko, ginosko, nosko.

Okay. Ginosko like konoser, but it's, you know, to know. And so when, when we see, when we see in scripture, when Jesus says, I know you, it means you're saved. He says, I don't know. He means you're not saved. God only knows the believers. Now he knows all things, but when he talks about it in that salvation way, that he knows you.

So that's what that's going on. So when he says those of me foreknew, it knows what it says. It says he also predestined. The foreknown ones are also the predestined ones. It does not say of those that in the future, he knew would pick him under the right circumstance or whatever he predestined them. That's not what it says, but that's a common understanding. The foreknown ones are the same group as the predestined ones.

Those of me foreknew, he also predestined. Now that's point one. Here's another point. Okay. In James 2. But to God, okay, but to the Lord, he doesn't have time for him. Here, present and future is the thing. Well, I can't say it is or isn't, but he knows all things eternally. All right.

And let me back up in here. So to look into the future, to see who'd pick him, so to speak, is a faulty doctrine because the Bible says no man does good, no man seeks for God. Romans 3, 10, 11, and 12, the hearts desperately wicked. Jeremiah 17, 9, he cannot receive spiritual things. First Corinthians 2, 14, he's dead in the sins. Ephesians 2, 1, by nature, child of wrath. Ephesians 2, 13. So he's a slave of sin. Romans 6, 14 through 20. So when some say he looks into the future, people just have free will.

They're going to make a choice and they're going to believe under the right circumstances. That's not what the Bible says. The Bible says he cannot receive. He cannot understand. He is a slave of sin.

He does no good. Doesn't even seek for God. That's what the Bible is saying about the unbeliever.

And so this is one of the things that's unbelievers. Okay, so no one in any circumstance in the future, it's not going to be that someone's going to exercise their free will. Now we've got to talk about what free will is. See, free will is the ability to make a choice that's consistent with what you are. So God, for example, cannot freely choose to sin. So free will has to be defined by God's standard, not by human standard.

We don't want to be humanists. So the biblical definition of free will has to fit what God is. No one forces him. He makes a free choice that's consistent with his nature.

To be consistent with his nature, God is holy. He can only choose holy things. He can't choose unholy things.

He cannot sin. So that's what's going on there. All right, so that's what free will is. The ability to make a choice that's not forced upon you. It's freely made, but it's also consistent.

It's consistent with your nature. So if the Bible says the unbeliever is a slave of sin, a hater of God, doesn't do any good, can't see any, seek anything, doesn't understand, cannot understand, then that's his nature. That he can operate his free will within that, and he will never be able to pick. Which is why it says God has to grant that we have faith. Philippians 1 29. And he grants us repentance. 2 Timothy 2 25. And Jesus says, you can't come to me unless it's granted to you from the Father. John 6 65.

So, for no can't mean, for other reasons as well, it cannot mean that he knows who's going to pick him under the right circumstances. It doesn't work biblically. Okay. Okay, so then how do you, so can you explain one more time about then those who are saved and those who are not saved? In other words, some are.

Yes. Yes, so all people are born under wrath and judgment because that's our nature. Romans 5 12, Romans 5 19, 1 Corinthians 15 22 talks about this. And God elects or chooses people to save.

That's Ephesians 1 4 and 5 and 2 Thessalonians 2 13. He chose us from the beginning for salvation. But the thing is, we don't know the means or the criteria of his choosing. We don't know if he takes, for example, your prayer and it's incorporated, which that gets into logic or priority and stuff.

I don't get into all those things. We don't know how it all works. We know that God does this from eternity past.

And so what we have to do is believe the scriptures say and move forward from there. Okay. Okay. All right, well, it's a thank you very much.

Denada. Have a blessing. Okay. Thank you. Bye bye. Okay. God bless. Bye. All right. A lot of theology there.

A lot of tough stuff. Let's get to Cameron for North Carolina. Cameron, welcome. You are on the air. Excellent. Matt Slake, how are you, sir? Doing all right by God's grace, man.

What do you got, buddy? Excellent. Well, uh, I just, uh, I was wondering, cause, uh, so I have a non Calvinistic bent, but I thoroughly enjoy listening to you, uh, on the radio, just like apologetics and just your knowledge of the word, I guess I was wondering also like something that would be useful for me without like delving into things that I've kind of deeply entrenched in. How do you, cause, uh, I also had a verse pulled up like first Timothy four 16, which pretty much means like to know your doctrine closely, watch your life and your doctrine closely.

So how can you, um, study in a way that you think is a systematic approach to understanding the Bible, where you apply good hermeneutical skills and you think you, you have, you have a re arisen to like, uh, a competent theology that is in alignment and alignment with the truth. Um, how can you have that held with a strong conviction, but still kind of like hold it in humility and in suspense, like affording the option to be correct. I have an easy answer. You ready?

How do you hold all this doctrine and learn all this stuff while being humble? Right. You ready? I don't know. I don't know how to do that. Okay. Um, you figured out, you let me know if you figure out how to be humble, you let me know because I don't know what it means. I do know what it means to be humbled. I know what it means to face God's word and to say, I don't know. I know what it means to say to people, ask me questions.

Sometimes I don't have an answer for you. Humility, I believe is knowing your proper place before God, but I'll tell you something with all that I know and all that I've been studying, I don't believe I've ever done anything out of a pure and humble heart, not a single thing, because I know what sin is and I know how entrenched it is within me. I can try and be humble, but I don't know what that means. Jesus was humble, but not me. So I have a saying, we fall in our strengths as well as our weaknesses. And it's something I've always had to work against with all the knowledge that I have is the fight against pride, the fight against pride.

And all I can do is lay before God and ask him to forgive me and expose such treachery of my own heart to me that I might confess it and repent of it. That's all I got for you, buddy. Okay. Awesome. Thank you, man.

Thank you. Okay, so when you figure out how to be humble with all this, you call me back and you let me know, because it's not a joke, because maybe you'll figure it out. Maybe God will bless you with that when my heart is too hard and he won't bless me with that.

I don't know, but if you find out, let me know. I'll tell you what, I kind of have, because I find that pastors have a hard time, like putting a finger on exactly what humility is as they preach it. And I'll call you on my next night off and I'll share with you what I think my definition of humility is, and then kind of see what you think about it. Sounds good. Awesome. Thank you, man. Well, thank you. God bless, brother. Have a good night. You too. All right. Well, we only have like 20 seconds in the show, so hey, I hope you guys out there in Radioland enjoyed the show, may the Lord bless you, I hope you have a great evening.

I might be online tonight, because I kind of feel like just talking and teaching might happen tonight, either in Clubhouse or Discord, or maybe not, no guarantees. But hey, I hope you enjoyed the show and I hope that you would also remember this ministry in prayer. We desperately need that. It's a spiritual battle and we need spiritual warriors. So please join us in prayer. Lifting this ministry up that by God's grace, we can expand his kingdom and bring glory to the Lord, Jesus Christ. Amen. And amen. May the Lord bless you. I'm out of here. And by his grace, we'll be back on here tomorrow, we will talk to you then.