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Matt Slick Live

Matt Slick Live! / Matt Slick
The Truth Network Radio
June 9, 2022 7:11 pm

Matt Slick Live

Matt Slick Live! / Matt Slick

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June 9, 2022 7:11 pm

Open calls, questions, and discussion with Matt Slick LIVE in the studio. Topics include---1- How do those who believe in infant baptism connect baptism with circumcision---2- Did Jesus come to create a new religion---3- Does Jesus fulfilling the law mean we no longer have to keep it---4- A caller wanted to debate whether or not you could lose your salvation.--5- How is it fair for the woman to have to marry the rapist in Deuteronomy 22-28-29-

Matt Slick Live!
Matt Slick
Renewing Your Mind
R.C. Sproul
Chosen Generation
Pastor Greg Young
Family Life Today
Dave & Ann Wilson, Bob Lepine

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live! Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at

When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live! Francis, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick.

Hey everybody, welcome to the show, Matt Slick, Matt Slick Live, and for the newbies, it's my real name. Okay, if you want to give me a call, all you got to do is dial 877-207-2276. We had a nice staff meeting today and enjoyed that, and let's see, just going to let you know before I get to the hate mail, because it's Friday, I love hate mail.

We do hate mail on Fridays sometimes. We want to let you know that we stay on the air by your generous support, and generous support would be something like $5 a month. If you could think of maybe, well, you know, helping us out a little bit, that would be great. All you got to do is go to, C-A-R-M dot O-R-G on the right hand side. Well actually just go to, I'm so used to the old site, forward slash donate. That's all you got to do, forward slash donate, and you can sign up for $5 a month. That would be huge. That would be helpful.

So there you go. All right, now what we do on Fridays a lot of time is hate mail, and I like it, and so people tell me they like it, so I'm going to do some hate mail, because it's hate mail Friday, and if you want to watch, you know, watch this, all you got to do, I'm just sitting in my office, but you can watch by going to forward slash, no, keep doing all this, On the home page on the right hand side is the, you'll see a picture of me and there's a radio thing, and you click on that, and you can click on a link that opens up after you get to another page, and you can watch.

You can watch it on YouTube, and you can comment on YouTube and things like that, and so Charlie and Laura and I are inside a stream yard, and we can see everything that you say, you type, gets fed into, I just remembered something else, it gets fed into the stream yard thing so we can respond to it and type and things like that. All right, all right, let's see, I've got so many things going on. All right, you know, I'm just going to jump into hate mail, because I dig it, and usually they prompt some good discussions. Usually, let's see, now this one says concerning women in ministry. Any good thing that is not the norm would be fought against. Women in ministry is one of those things. In these last days, women in ministry and church and evangelism have exploded in spite of intense opposition. The prophet Joel saw this great explosion. So Joel, man, so Joel is the one who saw women in ministry expanding? Wow. And its beginning was at Pentecost.

Oh really? At Pentecost, women were not silent but spake with tongues just like the men. No one can form a proper and correct judgment to all the evidence.

Yeah, the person, yeah, it's unfortunate, you know. People can't understand the word of God when Paul the apostle clearly says he doesn't allow women to teach or exercise authority over men but to remain silent, for Adam was first created, 1 Timothy 2, 12, 13. Elders are also, or pastors are also elders, 1 Timothy 5, 17, and in Titus chapter 3, or 1, 1 Timothy 3, it says the requirements of elders are to be men of one woman, or man of one wife, husband of one wife.

Women can't fit that. So yeah, here we go. One more time, I'm just going to offer this if you want to debate me on this. On the topic, does the Bible support women pastors and elders? If you want to do a formal public debate like in your church and we can have it filmed live, I'm open. I'm open. Let's do it. Does the Bible support women pastors and elders?

I'd be glad to do that. And this is the umpteenth time I've offered that challenge in 17 years of radio and guess how many times people have offered to take up that challenge in 17 years of radio? Zero. Now why do you think that is? Maybe because they know I'd be turning to scripture and say, can you please explain this? And then they won't be able to and then what I would do is look under their feet and see if they got the Bible there. They're trampling the Bible underfoot just to make their own perspectives stand. Let's see, if Peter in his day found Paul's writings hard to understand, how could people today whose heart are packed with prejudice and biases against women understanding his writings?

Wow. One thing needs to be understood, Christ is the head of the church, not the mortal male man. God chooses people according to his own sovereign will. God calls, anoints and powers the church recognizes and retains.

So this person doesn't understand what the Bible actually teaches on this topic and as is often the case when I get emails like that on that topic, they don't go to the verses that the scriptures need to in order to address the issue. They don't go. They just ignore them.

Why would you do that? Okay, so let's see. Here's another one. I have not read through this one. Let's see. Wow. Oh, here we go. Thank you for your reply.

Apparently someone replied. Bride truth hinges on scripture in Zechariah concerning the olive tree, lampstand, et cetera. And scriptures in Malachi concerning the coming of Elijah during the last days. Here are several main points. Apparently, this guy is going to list out the main points that are there in the book of Zechariah. And let's see. So Satan is the head of Christianity.

That's what he writes. That's interesting. Judas had a governmental office of Elijah, which was transferred to Satan. Interesting.

Yeshua cannot return it unless Elijah prepares the way. Hmm. Naylor is this man whom Yahweh has called to bring forth these truths. Oh, cool. A guy named Naylor is chosen by Yahweh himself to bring forth these truths. Naylor. Wow.

I wonder if he's a carpenter. The body of Christ will not ascend alive only the bride. Hell is a real place of cleansing, but not forever, only for an age.

All people will have a place in the kingdom of heaven according to the tabernacle model. There's so much more that can be accessed on YouTube. Wow. Wow. One of the things I've noticed is when people make statements like this, there's no exegesis. There's no scriptural representation. This is the verse that says this. Notice this verse. This is what it says here.

It's very, very infrequently that that will ever happen. All right. Here's one more. You do not know the truth. A very stupid person to write such a crud about God's word. I feel so sorry for you, an unlearned.

Okay. You got to understand I'll crack it up because you just called me unlearned, but can't construct a sentence. I feel so sorry for you, comma, an unlearned period. So you're unlearned. Matt, you're so unlearned, but let me tell you that you're unlearned. Well, I can't even use grammar properly. Anyway, he says, God will come down hard on you if not now, but will at the judgment for your actions.

You need to study Hebrew and Greek in department. I feel you have some kind of hate in your brain. What is it about? It makes me laugh. I actually get a kick out of this stuff. Oh my goodness. Wow.

That's a long email, man. I tell you, get some stuff here. Please stop your insanity. Maybe do some research about how religion came to be instead of putting all your faith in a book because books that teach anything are outdated. And on top of that, everyone knows about God, Jesus, blah, blah, blah. We all know about your holy book, which plagiarized off the hundreds of older stories like the book of Gilgamesh. Stop forcing yourselves on other people who know and don't care. Wow.

This guy has no clue about what reality is. As for me, all I ask for as a Wiccan is acceptance, like how I've accepted Christians invading my life and my space where I never tried spreading my religion. I would have so many of you angry, hate-driven, mindless monkeys. Okay, hold on. It says, I would have so many of you angry, hate-driven, mindless monkeys. So that's pretty good.

That's pretty good like that. I stopped being a Baptist for my mother's side. Wow. And adopted my father's Wicca faith after realizing Christians are mostly hypocritical, mindless idiots, unable to actually learn about their faith as opposed to blindly following whatever words some pretty new yet still irrelevant book says. Wow. I saw more hatred on except that's in your church. You didn't go to my church.

Then the most bully, bully-filled school you run around telling people what they're doing is wrong and what you should be. Oh boy. Oh, cause it's even more. Yeah.

I can't read all the rest of that stuff. Hey, that to me is fun. You know, I enjoy hate mail.

I enjoy it. All right folks, you have four open lines. Why don't you give me a call?

877-207-2276. Let's get to Dave from Kansas City. Dave, welcome.

You're on the air. Thank you. Sure.

Thank you. Matt, where I've ended up as kind of, um, in a box, I'm kind of a reformed Baptist, but I, I don't care about the mode of baptism. I just believe in believer's baptism. Can you help me out with connecting circumcision and baptism like the Presbyterians do?

I have a real problem with doing that. Sure. Sure. Okay. So if you were to go to, for example, you were to go to Romans 4, 11, it says, and he talking about Abraham received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of faith, which he had while uncircumcised.

So circumcision was a sign of something he possessed. That's what Paul says in Romans 4, 11. Okay. No big deal. Now, if we go to Genesis chapter 12, verse three, God says to Abraham, and I will bless those who bless you and will curse those who curse you.

And in you, all the families of the earth will be blessed. Okay. You with me so far? Okay. Yep. So then the sign of that covenant promise is circumcision. He says, this is my covenant, which you will keep between me and your descendants after you, every male among you shall be circumcised. That's Genesis 17, 10. So the sign of the Abrahamic covenant is circumcision, right? Correct. Okay.

Now, absolutely. So I read you, uh, Genesis 12, three, it says in you, all the nations shall be blessed. Now let's go to Galatians three, eight. Paul says the scripture for seeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham saying, all the nations will be blessed in you. All right. Now, so Paul calls the Abrahamic promise, which is that covenant.

He calls it the gospel. So we have to ask the question, is the Abrahamic covenant still in effect in light of that? Uh, yeah. Okay.

Uh, I mean, that's where so far it's spicy. Well, it's it, he calls it the, uh, the gospel and well, we know that the Abrahamic covenant is still in effect because the Gentiles are blessed in you. All the nations shall be blessed.

All right. Now when we go to Colossians two or in verse 11, you in him, you are also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands in the removal of the body, the flesh of the circumcision of Christ, having been buried with him in baptism. So Paul doesn't equate, but he relates circumcision with baptism. And he says, circumcision, he says, you know, circumcision is a seal of the faith he already had. Now it's a bit of a problem for the, for the pedobaptist view, but we can get it through that. And then he relates it to circumcision. And so the point it would be then if the same Abrahamic covenant is still in effect, then what's the covenant sign.

And there's a covenant sign for infants. We got to break. So hold on.

There's the music. Hold on. We'll be right back.

You can respond. Hey folks, Four Open Lines. Why don't you give me a call?

877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right.

Welcome back everyone. We have three open lines. Why don't you give me a call?

877-207-2276. Dave, you're still there? Yeah, absolutely. All right. So that was a kind of a quick intro and there's more, but so what'd you think?

Well, I thought it was good. You know, I was in a Presbyterian church that had half Baptists and half Presbyterians in it, and they actually did a little study on the waters that divide. And then we went into this, but eventually it came down to, you know, they believe that Presbyterians believe that the covenant has continued on. The Philippian jailer baptized this whole household. There was a covenant of baptizing everybody into the body of Christ.

And I just couldn't connect the dots. I just said, Paul didn't baptize. Every time Paul talks about, you know, circumcising somebody like Titus, he said no.

He could have brought that up at that point and said, Hey, gentlemen, you know, these are the baptism replaced circumcision, but he didn't. No, he didn't say it replaces it. And neither did I, just so you know, it, he related. I know. But here's the thing. Here's a question from the other side, so to speak. The covenant is a pact or an agreement between two or more parties.

Okay. And so at the church, do they do child dedications? Do they do baby or child? Because if they do, if they do, they're making a covenant. Then we have to ask, where's the covenant sign because what they're doing when they do a baby dedication is they're making a covenant. And then they ignore the biblical pattern of a covenant sign.

I mean, I did that's just how it is. I know that churches throughout the ages have done that Lutheran church is Catholic light. I mean, it's all, we all want each other and anyway, but yeah, well personally, I affirm infant baptism, but not for salvation.

Okay. I affirm it under the continuation of the Abrahamic covenant. That is the blessing of the gospel and that children can be included in the covenant. It doesn't save them. And I look at it covenantally, but on the other hand, I say to people, but you know what? There's nothing in the Bible that says an infant's baptized. So you know what?

It's up to the parents and their personal opinion about that. And I'm good with that either way. I'm more like John MacArthur. I'm a leaky dispensationalist anyway, but my problem, my problem is that I cannot connect the covenants at a certain point. Um, you know, so that's what makes me a leaky dispensationalist and that would be a whole other issue for a fireside talk some night. But, but the point is that, that the Paul doesn't seem to connect them when he has the chance. Well, you mean circumcision and baptism? Correct.

I mean, Paul had Titus at the Jerusalem council and said, I'm not going to circumcise this guy. Well, that's different. That's different. No, no, no.

You can't say that. He could have preached to them. No, it's not an issue there. The Jerusalem council in acts 15 was dealing with legalism and the Jews who were there. And so it wasn't an issue of baptism had to do with the circumcision issue so as not to offend certain Jews and things like that. So it wasn't about baptism.

So it's not necessary to connect those two there. Okay. Well, I mean, he could have said at that point in time, gentlemen, I baptized him. Do you understand? And fulfilled, you know, a revelation to them, but he, he doesn't, he stopped short every time.

I think he does. But anyway, yeah, I won't belabor the point, but okay. Thank you. There you go. Okay. Thought.

Thanks. Okay. All right.

Well, God bless Dave. Thanks for listening. All right. Okay. All right.

Four open lines. If you want to give me a call, eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Before we get to Sherry next, I just want to say in the chat, there's a gentleman, um, uh, baptized by Jesus is his nickname.

He's called the show a few times. And this guy says that water baptism stopped after, uh, I think it was after John. And without a doubt, I proved this is so he can hear it. I proved that water baptism continued in acts 10 44 through 48 when Peter said, get water for baptism. This is proof.

So what I find interesting is that when, when someone sees what the scriptures clearly teach and continues to reject it, can they truly be a Christian? Just a question. Four open lines eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Sherry. Welcome. You're on the air. Hello. Oh, I can do that voice. You know, Sherry, my voice doesn't go that high. Um, Jerry, I'm not hearing you and you are clicked.

There we go. All right. Can you hear me now?

Yeah, no, I hear you. Sure. What do you got? Okay. So I'd like to know if you could show me what scripture says that the Messiah comes to the Messiah comes. What did the Messiah come to invent Christianity or a new religion?

You're breaking up. So did Jesus come to create a new religion, including including Christianity? Yes.

That's one question. Yes. No, he didn't come to create a new religion. He came to fulfill the Old Testament law to do the will of the Father to atone for our sins and to complete fulfill.

Well, to fulfill means that when it prophesies something about him, he came to fulfill that prophecy. Okay, so, um, so did he, um, fulfill the law so that you don't have to keep it any longer? No, he fulfilled the law according to the prophecies and requirements of him being the Messiah under the law who would offer a sacrifice at a certain time and place. And with his death, according to Hebrews eight 13 and Hebrews nine 15 through 16, then the law, the Old Testament law is abrogated and now we're under the new covenant. I don't think any scripture says that. I think you took the scripture out of context, but I'll just see if you can show me a scripture that says verbatim that Messiah Yeshua said that the law was no longer valid.

Did I say the law was no longer valid? You said something about it being aggravated due to a scripture that I believe that you have taken out of context. So what was nailed to the cross? Let me ask you, what verses did I quote then if they're taken out of context? I quoted the references to you. What was it?

It was Hebrews, the ones that Hebrews, I believe it was 10 verse four. No. So how about this?

How about this? For this reason, Jesus is the mediator of a new covenant so that since a death has taken place, so the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance for where a covenant is, there must have necessity be the death of the one who made it. Okay, so the covenants that Yahweh makes are eternal and he gave us a new covenant, but he didn't give us a new law. Can you hold on? Hold on. You're making a lot of statements. You're not proving.

You're just saying something. What church do you go to? I'm just curious. No. What church do you go to?

Pardon me? What church do you go to? I don't go to a church. I follow Yeshua. Oh, and who is Yeshua? He's the Messiah, last time I checked.

That's Jesus? No, his name is Yeshua. He was never named Jesus. Then why does that say in Matthew 1.21, you shall call his name Jesus? Because that's the, what do they call it, the anglicized, Hellenized version of his name because no person in scripture was ever named Jesus. His name has always been Yeshua and if you would learn some difficult Hebrew, you could do that.

Oh, have you had Hebrew? Yes. Okay. Wow, that's good. What's a gimel?

A gimel is a letter of the Hebrew alphabet that looks like a camel. Okay, let me tell you what. Hold on and I'm going to talk with you about that. I think we would love to hear you, what you have to say. Okay. Hold on through the brain. Thank you.

Hey folks, this should get interesting. We have four open lines at 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Alright, well welcome back to the show.

Let's see. Sherry, are you still there? Hello? Hello? Sherry? Hello? Yes, I'm here. I'm sorry.

I had to mute my microphone. It's kind of confusing with re-verb on it. So you say the name of Jesus is not Jesus even though they said it. So the name Jesus or Jesus occurs over 900 times in the New Testament.

Are they all wrong? Yes, they are because listen, the Hebrew word for he will save is yoshia. It derives from the root word to save, yasha. What language was the New Testament written in? Hebrew. It was written in Hebrew. Wow, do you have any evidence that it was all written in Hebrew? Yes, there's Josephus and there's also, if you go to, you can look up Shem-to-Matthew. Okay. It's only burned on Hebrew scrolls.

Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. Okay, so I've checked out the Josephus information. It's not in reference to the entire New Testament. So you're saying all of the original Hebrew New Testament documents are lost? They were burned, yes.

What I've learned lately, I haven't studied it out thoroughly. And who burned them? Oh gosh, the Roman people, I can't remember who.

I just saw it the other day. So the manuscripts that were copied by the Jews, sacred documents of the Hebrews which would, in the diaspora in the 60s when the Jews scattered all through the Mediterranean area and they would have taken varying copies to different areas, all of those were also obtained and destroyed, right? Well, like I said, I'm not exactly certain on that issue because I just saw the video the other day and it goes to... Okay, so I don't want you to say it.

So let me get this straight. So I just asked a simple question because they would have written all, you're saying it's all the New Testament documents of 27 books would have been in Hebrew. And then they're in a diaspora, which is when Nero was, excuse me, when Rome came in and kicked rear on Jerusalem, then the Jews were scattered called the dispersion of diaspora. They would have taken these Hebrew documents with them all over the place and they would have already have had them copied because they were sacred documents in the Christian Hebrews. And it went all over the Mediterranean. And so somehow all of those original Hebrew copies early times were all burned. They had got them all and burned them, right? And replaced them with Greek, right? I did not say that.

No, I did not say that. What was the origin of Yeshua? What lineage was he born from? Yeshua is a Hebrew thing. We're talking about the Greek.

I'm trying to get you to demonstrate that the New Testament documents were written in Hebrew. And since you said they were all burned, then I'm trying to say, how do you know they were all burned? Because they would have been dispersed throughout the Mediterranean area. That means someone had to go get them all, find them all and burn them.

Like I said, I just saw the video the other day and I'll have to do some more research and I will be happy to inform you. So then who wrote the Greek equivalents? The Greeks who followed Yeshua back in the day when he was around.

Would that include Paul? Paul was a Jew. He was a Roman. Did he speak Greek? He may have to some extent, but he was a Jew who spoke Greek. So then all of the apostles, when it says Paul wrote Galatians, then somebody else translated it from the Hebrew into the Greek and they could then burn the Hebrew.

Right? Like I said, I'm going to have to do some more research on that and I will be happy to let you know. So let me ask you, is Jesus God in flesh? Yeshua is the living Torah, the living Word, the Light of the World.

Let me ask you another question. Is Jesus God in flesh? The name of the Messiah has never been Jesus. His name is Yeshua. He was the Word made flesh. He is the living Torah and the Light of the World. Is the Word made flesh God in flesh?

Yes. So this person that you call Yeshua, does he have two majors? No, I don't call him. He is the living Word, the Word made flesh. What name do you want to call him?

What's the name you want to call him? His name, Yeshua. Okay, so does Yeshua have two natures, a divine nature and a human nature? Yes, he was the Word made flesh. Okay, so the answer is yes or no?

He has two natures, divine and human. Either yes or no? Yeah, he did. He did, yes.

Does he have that right now? He is sitting at the right hand of Yah in the Shema'im and we are waiting for his imminent return. I tell you what, maybe if I were to ask this same question slowly, you would answer the actual question. See, I asked a specific question. No, you're not answering my question. I said, is Jesus right now, Yeshua, right now, does he have two natures, both divine and human, right now?

Yes or no? He ascended to the Shema'im in the flesh, yes. Okay, I didn't say, I didn't ask, did he ascend in the flesh? I said, does he right now have two natures, a divine nature and a human nature?

Yes, he does, because he will be returning where he came from. Okay, so the answer is yes. Now look, I'm going to tell you, Sherry, it shouldn't take you this long to answer a simple question. I shouldn't have to ask the same question over and over again. Well, I'm giving you the same explanation as I give everybody because, I mean, we need to understand Hebrew because the Messiah was not some blonde hair, blue-eyed Gentile who said, forget the law and just show up in a service on Sunday.

Excuse me, I didn't ask for an explanation, I just asked for a simple answer to a simple question. So let me ask you this, now this you can pontificate a little bit on, so what must you do to have your sins forgiven? Repent and believe that Yeshua is the savior of our um, he's our savior and that he came to atone for our sins which he nailed the penalty of to the cross. Okay, so if I worship on Sunday is that acceptable? Do you keep the Sabbath? I asked if I worship on Sunday is that acceptable? You can worship any day of the week you like but the Sabbath is commanded. Okay, so I can worship on Sunday if I want, right? But do you keep the Sabbath?

Okay, yes and no. So I can worship on any day, correct? You can but the Sabbath is a commandment not a suggestion. Do you have to keep the Sabbath to be saved? We are told that if you love me you will keep my commandments, those are the words of Yeshua. If anyone says they love God and does not keep his commandments that one is a liar and the truth is not in him. First John, you're going to John 14.

1 John 1, 2, 3, 4, yeah. So let me ask you a question, do you have to keep the Sabbath to be saved? I would imagine that's part of qualifications, yes, because you cannot disobey the commandments and be a follower of the law. The answer is yes, you have to keep the Sabbath to be saved. Okay, keep the Sabbath.

If you are true, if you truly want to follow, you too. Okay, what else do you have to do to keep yourself saved? Obey the commandments. Obey the commandments.

Hold on, hold on, hold on. Obey the commandments, okay? Which commandments? How many of them are there? Okay, just give me three. Just give me three. Okay, here.

I'm sorry? You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not bring to ruin the name of Yahweh your God. Okay. And you shall not commit adultery.

There's three, how many more? Okay, so, but you didn't, also Sabbath is in there, you have to keep the Sabbath, right? Yeah, that's the fourth amendment. Okay, so you've got to keep the Sabbath, you can't commit adultery, and stuff to be saved. So, I assume you can lose your salvation, right? Can you tell me what 1 Corinthians chapter 6 verses 9 through 12 says? Yes, talking to the unbelievers there, not talking about the believers. So, you can lose your salvation, is that correct?

Absolutely, you can. Okay, so you keep it by how good you are, and how you obey the law. No, you keep it by simply living your life as a kadosh, set apart holy life. Okay.

I mean, so the question is. So, so then you keep your salvation with God by your obedience to the law, the commandments? Yes. Okay, so how's that working for you?

How are you doing? Are you keeping all the commandments? To the best of my ability, yes, I can do all things for you still.

You're not, you're not keeping them. Oh, because doesn't it say, doesn't it say in Deuteronomy 26, 25, doesn't it say that you're to obey all of it, every bit of it? Yes, you are, you are to do so to the best of your ability. It doesn't say to the best of your ability, does it? Why are you altering the text the way Eve did talking to the devil, when she just slightly altered the word of God to make it fit? Why did you just do that? I didn't just do that. Which commandment is too difficult to obey and why? No, I asked you a question. I asked you, if you're keeping the commandments, you said you're trying. Now we're getting a break here, a hard break. So we'll get back on and we'll take, I want you to think, are you keeping them or is it not the case that you're keeping them?

It's either yes you are or it's no, you're not. And the level has to be perfection. Has to be perfection. We'll see how you're doing with that. We'll be right back, folks. Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. All right everybody, welcome back to the show. Having fun in the chat room. All right, Sherry, are you still there? Yes, I'm still here.

Thank you for waiting for me. Sure. Would you say that Yeshua is the standard of moral perfection? Yes, he absolutely was because he was the living Torah.

Okay. Do you keep the law on the same level as Yeshua? I'm not a perfect individual.

He is and was. Do you keep the law on the same level as Yeshua? To the best of my ability. Do you keep the law on the same level as Yeshua? I keep the law to the best of my ability because I am not the Messiah or the Word made flesh or the living Torah.

So I do not intentionally go around lying, healing, committing adultery. Is it the case that you keep the law on the level of Yeshua or is it not the case that you keep the law on the level of Yeshua? I can't keep the law on the level of Yeshua because Yeshua was the living Torah. So the answer is no, you don't.

All right. So you don't keep the law perfectly, but Jesus did. Yeshua. And you're trying to be right before God by keeping the law. Yeah, that's what the scripture says. 1 John 2-3-4.

No it doesn't. But it says in Deuteronomy 27-26, cursed is he who does not confirm the words of the law by doing them and all the people shall say amen. And we know that the law in Deuteronomy 19-18, Leviticus 19-18, you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength. Are you loving the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength? Yes, to the best of my ability.

Okay. So the answer is no, you're not. Because you're not doing it on the level of Jesus, are you? Because Yeshua was the living Torah.

He was the perfect man. I'm not a perfect person. You're not listening. You're not keeping the law on the level of Jesus. It took about a minute to get you to admit that.

Then the law says that you're supposed to obey it, Deuteronomy 27-26, the law says you're supposed to love the Lord God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength. I'm asking you, is it the case that you are loving the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength? Are you? Yes, I am to the best of my ability.

No, no, no. You don't say yes, I am to the best of my ability because that's not even true. That's a lie. You don't do it to the best of your ability.

Yes, you do. Because we are not. You're lying. You are lying. I didn't.

I'll show you how. You're lying because there's always something more you can do to honor God and love Him even more than you always are because otherwise you're saying you're keeping on the level of Jesus, excuse me, Yeshua, which you said you're not. That means you're not doing with all your heart, soul, mind and strength. You say you're trying, which means you're not doing it, which means you condemn yourself to your own state of damnation by your own law. That's incorrect because... It is correct because you're not a Christian. You're right, I'm not. I follow Yeshua and He did not come to invent Christianity.

You don't have, sorry, you are lost. I'm just informing you, mad, but you don't have your sins forgiven because you dare, you dare to add your works to the blood of Christ. Can you quote me scripture on that? Yeah, Romans 3, 23, we maintain that man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. Romans 4, 5, the one who does not work but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly. His faith is credited as righteousness. Romans 5, 1, having therefore been justified by faith. So the Bible says that justification, this declaration of righteousness is by faith without any works of the law. If you go to Galatians chapter 3 verses 1, 2 and 3 and Galatians 5 verses 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5, you can read those and you can see that anyone who would take any part of the law, represented by circumcision, is then cursed and doesn't have salvation according to what Paul the Apostle was teaching right there. I believe you're picking those out of context.

You don't know the context. Okay, read Matthew 5, read Matthew 5, it's one of the chapters. Excuse me, excuse me, excuse me, you don't set scripture against scripture. Right, scripture does not contradict itself, it's clear.

Why does the devil, why is Satan going to wage war against those? Sherry, you're a cultist. No I'm not, I follow Yeshua, I don't believe.

No you don't. Yeshua did not merely condemn the act of adultery, he went much further saying, I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman with lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart. You're saying that you have to keep your salvation and your forgiveness and your compliance with the law, which you admit you're not keeping. Okay, can you tell me that those people who do violate the law, who do lie, cheat, steal, break, all in all, they're going to be saved too, they can just do whatever they want and live their life the way they see fit instead of according to the commandments of Yahweh, that they're saved?

I didn't say that, but the reference you're going to, no I did not. In 1 Corinthians 6, 9, you know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God. Can I finish?

Please let me finish. The unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God, do not be deceived into fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, effeminate, et cetera, as were some of you. As were, you were that, not anymore.

But now what makes you call those? Okay, Sherry, you don't listen to the word of God. You've trampled the word of God under your feet. Because when I'm speaking the word of God, you have to just jump in and alter it and change it.

And in your pride, you say you can keep the law sufficiently to get your salvation with the infinitely holy God of the universe. That's what Mormons teach, that's what the Roman Catholics teach, that's what the Jehovah's Witnesses teach. No they don't. Yes it, yes they do. I've been studying them for over 40 years. The JW's hate the Jews and they don't think the Messiah was a Jew.

You know, Sherry, you don't listen. They do the same thing you do. They add works to salvation.

No they don't. No, I'm not adding work, I'm telling you what scripture says. What does Revelation, go to Revelation 12, I think it's 12 of these. You're jumping all over the place. When you jump all over the place, a person that just jumps all over the place generally is a person who doesn't think very logically or critically. You're jumping all over the place and I'm trying to get you to see things one verse at a time. I have to ask you the same question multiple times to get you to get an answer.

You keep changing the word of God, you keep changing what I ask. I'm trying to bring issues to your attention that you're not acknowledging. Okay, we can move along because we're almost out of time folks. We've got another caller waiting and obviously she doesn't have all her paws in the litter box. Let's get to Matt from Wisconsin.

Matt, welcome you're on the air. Hi, can you hear me? Yes I can, yes I can. Okay, okay good. So I became familiar with you not very long ago, I think like a week, week and a half ago or so. Okay. And I saw a couple of your debates, one with one you had with R.N.

Rauch, one with Matt Gilhoney and another with a gentleman whose name I don't remember but the topic was on the morality of the God of the Bible. Are you an atheist? I am actually. And so as I understand it, correct me if I'm wrong here, but do you claim to get your morality from the God of the Bible? Yes.

Okay, so I had a question that pertained to a certain passage in the book of Deuteronomy. Okay. So before I go into that, I don't know very much about you, but do you have a daughter? Yeah, and be careful, but yes. Okay, okay.

So the passage I had a question about here is Deuteronomy chapter 22 verse 28-29. Okay. Because we might have children listening, I'm sorry I didn't mean to cut you off rudely, but there's some bad stuff there if she gets accosted physically by a guy and then he's going to pay money, et cetera, okay?

And you can't divorce her, yes. Okay. Okay.

Just trying to be polite. Okay, so can I ask, okay, so given that passage, what you said, if you know, some happens to her, the man goes and pays the father 50 shekels and they are married and they can't get divorced. And so that is a decree from the God, which you claim to get your morality from.

So the question I asked is if you found out that your own daughter was this thing happened to her and the man who did it and the man who did it came to you and paid you the equivalent of 50 shekels of silver, would you give him the blessing to marry your daughter? Of course not. Why not? Because if a guy came to my door and this is the case, I'd call the police on him and we'd prosecute him. Okay. Why?

Now, you ready? There's something called ethnocentricity and this is what you're committing here. You're failing to understand the culture of the time. That's one thing.

I'll explain what's going on there. But another thing is you're presupposing in your atheism that you have a universal value of morals by which you can then judge this God of Christianity. You may not like it. You can't do an external critique because an external critique means you have to have a set of morals that are universal, that are applicable to the situation to which the God of Christianity must adhere. But then to have an external critique by which you can justify universal morals is not something you can do from an atheistic perspective.

So that's one problem. If you go to an internal critique, which is what you're trying to do or you may want to do, then all I got to do is give you the culture and say what the culture was at the time so you can understand. In that culture, for a woman to lose her virginity in a certain manner was to forfeit her right of marriage because no one would want, and I don't mean to be derogatory for the ladies, but this is how they would think of it, she'd be damaged goods. So in that culture a woman who to no fault of her own was accosted that way was so to speak damaged goods and largely the men would not want to marry her. So she then would not have someone as a family to take care of her and no progeny and blessing of children. So because they didn't have jails back then in the Jewish culture, the man who did this was then forced to marry her and he could not divorce her.

He had to take care of her because he was the one who had to live up to her responsibility. Now we may say now I wouldn't do that, you're right, I wouldn't do that now, but that's what it was back then. If you want to say it was wrong back then, then you have to come up with a standard by which you can say that it is wrong, not just that you don't like it, okay?

Go ahead. But why would God give different rules for different people? I mean if he can command you to not wear, if he can command you to not wear different fabrics, if he can command you to not look at a woman with lust, why couldn't he command people against this?

I mean a woman is raped against her will and is forced to marry someone against her will and can't get divorced. Now it doesn't say forced, you were almost out of time, I'd love to discuss this more with you, but it doesn't say that. And if you want to read the text you'll say, hold on, hold on, we're almost out of time here, I'm just telling you that it doesn't say what you said, it didn't force her, but it was his obligation to do that and if he didn't do that, well there was problems with him socially. Now if you're going to say why would God say that then and not now?

Because the culture was different, the situation was radically different, that's why. We're out of time. Seriously, call me up next week okay? Alright? But I'm going to give you a hint, study universals and how you can ground morals and see if you're an anti-moral realist or a moral realist and we can talk. Hey buddy, call back next week okay? Folks, we're out of time and the Lord bless you, hope you enjoyed that. By God's grace, we'll be back here next week, talk to you then. Your program, powered by the Truth Network.
Whisper: medium.en / 2023-04-07 10:46:40 / 2023-04-07 11:05:00 / 18

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