Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at Carm.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick.

Hey everybody, welcome to the show. It's me, Matt Slick. You're listening to Matt Slick Live. You are so inclined, you want to give me a call? It is easy.

All you have to do is dial 877-2072276. And if you want to email me instead, you can do that. That's easy as well. Just send an email to info at carm.org. Info at C-A-R-M.org.

Put the subject line, radio comment, radio question, one of those. We can get to it. We have nobody waiting right now. If you want to give me a call, it is easy. I'm waiting for.

For you. And also, I'm working on two articles today on the Trinity, refuting some attacks on the Trinity. Hopefully, you can release those later.

Now, I'm supposed to be on TikTok also in an hour and a half-ish. To answer questions with some atheist group, apparently. They want me to come in and talk to them. I know what they want to do ultimately. They want to argue against God and justify their atheism.

And the idea of how do you know God exists and is the Bible true and things like that.

So I'll be discussing those things. And hopefully. Hopefully it'll go better. It'll go well. And you can pray for that.

And uh I think that's about it, actually. I can't really think of anything else.

Now, we are working on a new website, and I keep telling you that. We had some good news, bad news today. And the good news was that, oh, the bad news was that one of the foundations of the system altered something and made, was going to push it back three weeks for development adapting. But the good news was our programmer guy fixed it. And he used AI and did some stuff, and he really knows his stuff.

And anyway, long story short, we're hoping at the end of August the new website will be out. It will be different. Uh, it's not going to be zippity-doodle looking, uh, it's going to be practical and very fast. And we're going to have an option of you being able to sign up with your own username and password and uh. In that, you know, to keep records of things like that.

But you don't have to. You don't have to.

So there's that. And we're thinking also about starting new forums, new software and forums. We're visiting some old ones and seeing about that. We've been having some difficulties with the ones we've been at now, so you might as well just do a whole new shebang and get everything going and do everything new. All right, like I said, if you want to give me a call, 877-20-72276.

And if you want, you can email me, info at carm.org, info at carm.org, and put in the subject line, radio comment, or radio question, and we can get to you and stuff like that. All right, all right.

Now, let's get to Jose from Palm Springs, California. Welcome. You are on the air. Yes. Hey, Matt.

My question really quick is what is the difference between a Jew, a Hebrew and an Israelite? That's a good question. Uh Abraham is a is a Hebrew. And If the word Jew came from Jacob Jacob J. Israel or is it from uh I think that's what it was.

I don't know. I'm trying to remember because there's similarities and there's differences. Maybe I'll write an article on that. What's the difference between a Jew, an Isra Hebrew and Israelite, and a Jew? I think it just has to do with ethnic origin.

and names adopt adopted with it. I think that's what it is. Hebrews were the Old Testament people of a certain ethnic group, an Israelite. Came out of one of the Israel, his name Israel, but I think the name became adopted to the whole of the nation of people, and a Jew, well, was from Judah.

So uh there's that there's that.

Okay.

So far, I mean, it's a good question though. All right. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. You're welcome.

Hope that helps. I got maybe to write an article on that. Hey, folks, if you want to give me a call, the number is 8772072276. And uh I wanna Uh I want to hear from you. Give me a call.

We got a lot of stuff going on. All right, all right, all right. Let's get to. Jermaine from California. Jermaine, welcome.

You're on the air. Oh, hey, Matt. Yeah, I just saw him. Hey yeah, I I'm sorry about that. I have hit the new buttons.

Yeah. Want to talk about relationships. in heaven? Does the Bible actually elaborate on The family relationships and past relationships, because I know one of the big appeals of things like Mormonism and and these other beliefs. I know a lot of it seems to be family based.

people are just, you know, they love their family so much they kind of think they want to continue that to materity, so Does the Bible actually elaborate on that?

Okay.

Our vows are till death do you part.

So It's a covenant that we make. And so when I got married to my wife 38 years ago, and the vows was do you promise blah blah blah, till death do you part.

So upon physical death, we're no longer married. And we're not going to get remarried in heaven. We're not going to go through another ceremony. to get remarried.

So uh That's it. And marriage is terminated at the death uh of the spouse or the divorce, you know, illicit stuff like that.

Now in Mormonism, their appeal is to the flesh. Not to the things of God. Because they want to say, oh, marriage is so wonderful, you can have it forever.

Well, maybe, maybe not. But, you know, what's God, chopped liver? I mean, God is the infinite being of the universe with his glory and essence just emanating in pure holiness. Why would anybody compare marriage to something in heaven as being comparable to the very presence of God? And the only way you do that is if your ideology and your theology was just human-centered, not God-centered.

And so but anyway, no, there's no marriage in heaven. And except for the symbolic wedding feast that the church goes through with the bride of the bride of Christ with the son. And it's a typological thing. That's not going to be an actual marriage. But.

That that's it. We probably will recognize each other in heaven, though I think my friends might have trouble recognizing me because I'll be without sin. They're not going to know who I am. They're going to I'm going to explain it to them. But uh other than that, you know, that's it as far as relationships go.

Okay? Yeah, and um you know, as far as uh marriage, I believe. what you believe, but I think more of what I just to hone in on what I'm asking, I think a lot of folks Where they love their family unit, just like the mother, father, brother, sister, and And yeah, that thought is terrible develop at that, but I I think a lot of it centers around maybe their the mystery of we don't know, we can't contemplate you know, what good things God has for us.

So I hear people like they love their spouse so much, or they love their brother or sister so much. Would there be some semblance of that kind of relationship in that? Like, would it. you know, kind of or safe work involved, but it would just turn into something deeper. Oh, yeah, we're going to have relationships with each other because we're going to be friends.

And any interaction in a good way, which is going to be in heaven, means we have relationships. I'll recognize my wife. She'll recognize me. We'll no longer be married. And we'll just enjoy fellowship with one another without our ailments, without our sinfulness, our tendencies, our failures.

And it'll just be that much better. But it'll be centered around the glory of the Lord Jesus Christ, not around our love for one another. Not that those things are bad because they are. They're good. But when.

Cults work, what they try and do is lower God and exalt man. And they can do that in different ways. And now, as far as exalting man goes, it's you know, this one in the case of Mormonism, as you mentioned. The idea is the exaltation of human relationships as a pinnacle of perfection and holiness.

Well, that's just man-centered. I've been in the presence of the Lord when I was 17 and He came to save me. I'm going to tell you, I remember it well. And. I remember it well.

Marriage is not going to be something I'm going to be wanting or desiring in heaven. It's going to be just an awesome experience of his incredibly profound holiness. It changes you. It permeates you. He becomes the central figure of everything.

Just because it's just natural, and it's not like you lose your identity or you don't have relationships with others, it's just that he's so much. Better that that's going to be the issue and our concerns.

So You know, we're going to have relationships in heaven, but they will not be in a marriage relationship. And for our fathers and our sisters and brothers and children, we're going to be familiar with each other in that earthly relationship that exists in heaven. But. We'll just know us, we'll know each other from that perspective there. But it's not like an eternal family.

We all live together in the same house forever. Uh it just uh you know, just doesn't work like that.

Okay.

Right. And and I can see the insanity of that because it in your mind it might be ideal, but In wouldn't make sense because you're roller mother, father, mother.

Well, then they'd have their brother, father, mother-in-law, too, and they'd have this weird hierarchy that really would fall apart.

So. Yeah, I I like how you look at it. Yeah, and I'm not knocking family relationships or the beauty of what family relationships can be because they're just incredibly valuable and wonderful. I mean, my wife and I would give our lives for our children. I'm sure you would for yours.

It's just how it is. But when Okay. When that becomes The measure of what goodness is. It's pure humanistic philosophy. It's not rooted in the infinitely holy God.

And the only reason I keep harping on this. Is, you know, I know what it says in Scripture, and I know that my personal experience comports with scripture in that time of that. That day when I was 17, 51 years ago, getting saved. And I remember the Incredible presence. Not just, ooh, I feel warmth.

It was, oh my goodness, I'm in the presence of incredible holiness. And it reduced me to sobbing mass of repenting tears. And then Christ was there, and I couldn't see him or touch him, but his holy, deep, perfect presence permeated into me. And I remember it so well. It was just profound, profoundly other, profoundly perfect, profoundly good.

And And I couldn't have experienced any more. It was maximal because he was there. I mean, there was more to him, I'm sure, but I'd have been vaporized. And so. I know what it's, at least I believe that experience was from him because it certainly changed my life.

And I've calmed down after 51 years, and this is what I'm like. I mean, it was quite an experience. And I'm not making doctrine out of experience, but it's just that. It's just that God is the treasure, God is the prize, God is the standard, not marriage, not family. As good as those things are and can be, that's not the standard.

And anybody who would say that those are the standards of heavenly Grace. They don't know who God is. They have not experienced Him. They just have not. That's it.

So Alrighty. Yeah, that makes more sense um when you put it that way. I just kind of almost wonder if being in a family unit that is run efficiently is almost like a test run for something so much better than we can imagine. True. That's true.

Alright, brother, there's a break. We gotta go, okay? Let's call back again. You too, my friend. Couple us.

Alright. Say Someone said, how much would it? PC custom built and signed by Matt Slickby. Yeah. Hey, we'll be right back.

Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey, everybody, welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, it's easy.

877-207-2276. All right, let's get on with Luke from Washington, D.C. Luke, welcome. You're on the air. Hi, uh, Matt, how are you?

I'm fine. I'm fine hanging in there, busy as usual, you know. Yeah, we got two days. My question is Now why this pentecastrialism grows? Going faster than many traditional Protestant denominations worldwide.

I don't know. I'm not a sociologist who could do a study to answer the question specifically, so I can only guess. And I would say that it's because more people are just becoming interested in God, and Pentecostals are vibrant and alive, and they have decent arguments for their faulty doctrines, and so people not knowing better will join up. And it happens like that.

Okay.

Hello there. Pentecostalism has a prosperity gospel.

Some of them are a prosperity gospel. And they have different structures They gave a different type of message, charismatic experiences. Uh oh. But lack of emotionalism Uh it's dangerous, you know, dangerous, you know, especially if they're uh Africa, India, those countries there. Going very bad.

Yeah, I know. I know they are. Because. People want something that will give them money and security, and so the prosperity gospel tickles their ears, and that's what happens. And then they're they're dancing and uh doing kinda um health to health miracles and uh dancing.

Jumping, emotionalism, you know uh So many things are they doing in the the services. It compares to Uh protest. Ciao. Why are you doing this? Uh dancing and uh speaker things that when they were So they can dance also?

I'm sorry, why should that last part?

Well yeah, dancing's fine. Yeah, they di you know, dancing is fine in worship. Uh raising you know, flags, trumpets, instruments, um, kneeling, standing, clapping. These are all talked about in Psalms, which was the the book of worship. Yeah.

But I didn't see that in Protestants they are very quiet you know they you know I know. I know. You know, it's just culture, that's all. I prefer myself, I prefer more exuberance, but there are a lot of people who don't. That that's all, it just just depends.

Okay.

Yeah. It's okay. What about technology? What about ethnology?

Well, they need to study the Bible, and unfortunately, a lot of people don't want the theological constructs of foundational truth. They want experience and solutions that are personal problems, ASAP. And because of that, they don't get grounded and they drift around from false theology to false theology. Though it doesn't mean they're not all saved, but it just does mean that there's a lot of error that's out there. We had our Friday meeting today.

We have a weekly staff meeting on the ministry. We have two guys from Africa. that c that uh they come in on their phones. And Like one guy in Nigeria tells us regularly how few people know what the gospel is. That even some pastors, people who want to be Christian pastors, don't have any theological understanding in a lot of ways.

They minimally understand stuff, preaching that your goodness and your faith combine get you to be saved. And so he's going around teaching them the truth and handing out literature. And he's working. He says people are just ignorant because they get a lot of bad ideas from a lot of different sources. And it's just, it's a real vacuum there of truth.

So he's going around from area to area, preaching and teaching. We support him. And I wish we could support him with more money, but that's what we're doing. You know, so he just tells us what's going on, and that's what we're doing. We're supporting him, okay?

Well when it's Legalistic, and they have to wear white dress, they have to shave their face, and so much. Clearly, sir. Yes, I know. Yeah. Yep.

That's right. I'm with ya, okay, buddy?

Okay, thank you.

Alright, well, God bless. All right. Now let's get to Ken from Connecticut Ken Welcome. You are on the air. Hey, Matt.

I was left confused. We talked uh two days ago. We ran out of time. Uh-huh. Uh we were talking about John 1-1 and If you recall, my question was about um which person of the Trinity is Is the term God referring to there?

And you you entered with oh that's the father So the son was with the father. Yeah, I said maybe. And that's wh where we had to stop. Yeah, it it might be the father. Yeah, it might be the Father because the term God in John after verse 14 is used of the Father repeatedly.

Now, is that the case prior to that? That's the question. What John is doing is it appears to be he's simply stating she's trying to show the deity of Christ. and the distinction. that he's identifying him with God.

And saying he is God. Which means he's talking about the essence of what God is: is with God, the divine essence, that being who is God, and yet he's also divine in his very nature, and yet he became flesh. And that's what he's trying to do. I don't think it's an issue of which person of the Trinity, because to say that that point then causes confusion. Because if it's the Word that's with the Father and the Holy Spirit, then the Holy Spirit and the Father are being called God distinct from the Son, and that would be a fallacy of equivocation.

And so we don't want to do that.

So I would say that God, in reference to what John is talking about, is just the nature and essence of divinity itself. That Jesus is that, but there's also a distinction because he's with that. But And he became flesh. And then it's expanded on later in other areas of Scripture. And yeah, I agree that it does leave confusion because It can.

Yeah. Well, it fits it really fine because the word was God is showing the unity of essence. But yet, the word was with God is showing distinction, and that's consistent with the Trinity.

Okay.

Have you ever heard the argument that the word doesn't even refer literally to Jesus? That logos doesn't mean Jesus, it means words. Yes. Yes, I've heard that. But then it says in verse 14, the word became flesh.

And what they'll do is they'll say, the idea or concept of God became manifested in the real world. But that's not what it says. It says the word became flesh and dwelt among us. We beheld his glory. And so what they'll do in their denial of the Trinity, which we get how the Trinity is arrived at and what it really is, in their denial of the Trinity, they will rip scriptures to shreds trying to make it fit their theology.

So you're right. I'm wondering why John used logos and he didn't use the Greek word for Jesus. Why didn't he just say yes in the beginning was yesus? Because the word uh the word logos had a meaning. Uh I'm going to break.

What we'll do, we'll get back, we'll talk about it because there's more to it than just the issue of word.

Okay, so hold on, man. We've got a break. We'll be right back, folks. After these messages, please stay tuned. If you want to give me a call, the number is 877-207-2276.

Be right back. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your call at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, we're going welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, it is easy.

All you need to do is dial 877-207-2276. Let's get back to Ken from Connecticut.

Okay, you there? Yes. Alright, so I wrote off some notes during the break that would help. You got me thinking. I might write an article on this specifically because your question.

Yeah. But I've known this for a long time: that the Greek and Jewish audiences would have understood the term Lagos a little bit differently. In Greek thought, it was the principle of order that was in the universe. In Jewish thought, It was that principle of God's active power and work, the word him speaking.

So, when John is using the term Lagos, he's invoking a term that has meaning for both Jew and Gentiles. Suggesting that he is the divine agent of creation, which we know from Colossians 1:15 through 17. He is also the John's the divine agent? No, Jesus I'm sorry. Yeah, that Jesus is the eternal divine agent of creation.

We know that from Colossians 1:15 through 17. And that He is the rationality of God in truth, because Jesus says, I'm the way, the truth, and the life. And as John says in in Verse 3: All things came into being through him, and apart from him, nothing came into being. He's expanding on the issue of this Lagos principle who orders the universe. And also, provides God creates everything, yeah, God creates everything through his word, right?

That's right, and so now what John is doing is also saying, in a I'll rephrase it really in a very you know, juvenile way: hey, guys, look back at Genesis 1. Hey, Jews, notice the power of God, and in the beginning, God was the word which I spoke. And hey, you Gentiles, you Greeks out there, this is the principle of order and logic that all things work around and through. This is who Jesus is. It's that kind of a thing that's going on when he uses that term.

Well, that's my understanding, too. That's interesting the way you phrase that because That's how I read it. Good. That you know, in the beginning was God's outward expression of God's thought. God creates everything through his word, and God also, all throughout.

the Old Testament through the prophets, he's promising that he's going to send the Messiah. There's a word. And then his word, God's word, was made flesh when the promised Messiah was born in verse 14. It's not walking around. It's what it is, and walked around.

That's it.

Yeah. And so the word.

So it makes sense to me that we should just stick to what it says and not change it into in the beginning was the sun. And the sun was with God and the sun was God. Yeah, because That's just right. And so in there also is the logic of him John teaching the unity of essence. That the word, who they know is Jesus, is with God, this being, this essence.

He's divine in his nature. Yet, there's also distinction. And that's what's going on. But then that's not what it's saying. It d it does it does not say that in the beginning was the side.

And the Son was with God in the Son. but says the word, but the word became flesh.

So how so let me ask you, is the word therefore the thing that became flesh, is it impersonal that became personal? Yeah, God's logic became flesh. Became language is that's very easy to understand. But man, God's word was made flesh. But that's not it.

That's not it. That's a false understanding. We got to correct this, okay? You got to understand something. An abstraction cannot walk around.

A thought doesn't have life and purpose. It's just an abstract in figurative language, of course, it can. And John wrote very figuratively. It's not figurative. John is not figurative.

The beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. And Jesus, but Jesus, no, John uses figurative language, but he's trying to demonstrate that Jesus was the pre-incarnate word was pre-incarnated. That you have to use.

So you're saying John uses figurative language, but it was not figurative? No, no, no, no, it's not what I'm saying. You're saying it's figurative. Hold on. You're saying it's figurative.

In the beginning was the word. Is that figurative or is that literal? In the beginning was the word. It's figurative language. It's clearly figurative language.

So, in the beginning, it's figurative or literal? Is it literal or figurative? In the beginning was God's word. I didn't ask that. It doesn't say that.

God's word was with God, and God's word was God. You're not figurative language. No, it's not. You didn't understand what you just did. You understood my statement and you basically changed it to fit your theology, which means you're not sticking with the word.

It says, in the beginning was the word.

So let me ask you: is the phrase in the beginning, is it literal in the beginning or is it not literal in the beginning? It's either one or the other. Literal or not? It's literal.

Okay.

So it's literal.

Now, in the literal beginning was the word. Was God's logic. Logos means logic. No, it doesn't mean logic. It does mean logic.

Okay, it does not. It doesn't mean logic? No, it doesn't mean logic, it means word. Logos, wait, logos doesn't mean logic, Matt? Are you being no?

Yes, logos means word. Logic is a different word. Then logos. There isn't a Greek word in the Bible that's used for logic. It doesn't have the word logic.

Okay.

Look, you're reacting, you're not thinking. You're reacting. Hold on, you're. Could you hold on a second, please? You're going to hold on a second.

Look, no, you don't understand. I know what you're doing. You're looking for an excuse to deny the Trinity. I've done this from the beginning. Because you use the same argument that all others have used.

I'm aware of this. You haven't surprised me. And what you've just demonstrated to me is your unwillingness to look at what the scripture actually teaches, because you have a veneer you're putting over it that you want to interpret things through. And the proof of that is that you altered the word of God in order to do it. I have to force you to think.

I have to force you. Is the phrase in the beginning literal? In other words, yes, hold on, let me explain. Then I said, is you said the word you said the word word means logic. I didn't say that.

Mm-hmm. No, you say that. Show me where the word word means logic in the Bible. Logic is where we get the English word logic from. You're not answering.

You didn't read it. Show me where the word word. Lagos means logic. Show it to me in the scriptures.

Okay, okay. In the very next chapter, Jesus says, listen to my words. That's lovely. Listen to what he's saying. You can laugh because you don't believe scripture, but in the very next- Oh, hold on, hold on, hold on.

Stop with the insults. Stop insulting me. Don't say I don't believe scripture. Don't look. No, no, I'm not.

I'm not. Listen to me. Listen to me. Stop. I'm going to mute you.

Okay, I'm muting you because you won't stop.

Now, don't insult me on my radio show and say I don't believe God's word. That is simply not true. It's a misrepresentation, and it's just an attack on my character. Please don't go there. Do you understand?

I already did. Don't don't know. You don't have to do that. You don't have to sit there and start attacking my motives or my ideas or say, I don't believe God's word. I'm the one who's going right there and trying to analyze it.

But you're the one who's saying the word word means logic. And I say, show me a verse where that's the case. You haven't done that. Can you show me? Uh-huh.

Oh, he bailed.

Okay.

Let me tell you something, guys. I'm very aware of this kind of argument. I was trying to be very patient with him. I knew this is what he was getting at, I knew this was it. And so he can't demonstrate from the scriptures.

I didn't hang upon him. He chose to leave. He cannot demonstrate from the scriptures.

Now, this is critical: that the word. Lagos word means logic.

Okay, and that's what he said, so he has to defend it from scripture. The word occurs 331 times in the New Testament. It is used of different in different senses. When the young man heard this statement he went away grieving. That's the word Lagos.

Does that mean when he heard the logic? Does it mean when he hears the word and understands it? Does it mean the word means logic there? It might be, it has places where the word might mean something like that, but it can have other places where it means something different. This is called a semantic domain.

If he's going to say that the word means logic, he needs to demonstrate it. And if he can't, then he he his statement's invalid. In Mark 12:13, they sent some of the Pharisees and Herodians to him in order to trap him in a statement. In a an idea in a statement that that wanna wanna get him. And so It's a message in, let's see, the word is used, and they were amazed at his teaching, for his message was with authority.

And so The word logic has to do with deduction. or induction or abduction. And it has different forms. I study logic. And so to say that that word there means that it's just not the case.

And he needs to demonstrate it, but he can't. That's why he hung up because I called him on it. And I put his feet to the fire and he wasn't able to do that. I've heard this argument so many times that the word logos is an impersonal thing. It's just the idea that became flesh, thereby denying the deity of Christ and the incarnational work of God.

That's all it is. And I've heard it a thousand times, and he failed. Let's get back to anybody. Hey, we don't have any callers waiting right now. If you want to call me, 877-207-2276.

I'll be right back. It's Matt Slick Live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everybody, welcome back to the show. Let me just kind of recap a little bit before the uh the guy uh imploded.

The interpretation of the idea that the word simply means logic, and as I asked him, how is it that an impersonal something can become personal? What they have to say then is that it's just the idea that became personal. But that doesn't make any sense because it just means an action of a plan. But who is it that became personal? You can't have an impersonal entity become a personal entity.

It doesn't work. And so, this is one of the fundamental errors in the logic of that kind of a thing. What John was doing is showing the personhood and the distinction as well as the relationship to the identity of God Himself, saying that the word was divine. Because, if to say that the Word was an impersonal force or an impersonal idea and yet it was God, then is to imply that God Himself is impersonal. And so, the incoherence of that kind of thinking reveals itself through cross-examination.

Let's get to Kyle from Ohio. Kyle, welcome. You're on the air. Good evening, mister Slick. Hey, how you doing?

I'm Greg. You said something that was so funny. I just had to make a comment. I was driving in my car, and you said when you're in heaven, your friends won't recognize you because you'd be like a much better person. They don't know what I've looked like without my sin.

They go, Who are you? Yep. I feel the exact same way. I go to church where some people can be a little pious. It always makes me think of, I believe it's 2 Corinthians, maybe it's 10, 12, where we compare ourselves to ourselves.

You know, that's not a wise thing to do. And I I posed a question to them because I know that I am what I am with the grace of God. Like my friends would think I'm so good. I know who I am, okay? Without that imputed righteousness, I'm done.

Or my best day, I can't please God without Christ. But I posed a question to them. I said, What if we could go in a room? And what if we could just put all your thoughts on a monitor? Let us look at your thoughts.

And you have no idea. I said, I wonder how would you do? They got quiet. They got so quiet. Oh, no, no.

I would shy away, curl up in a little ball and hide behind something. That's right. But I just really love that statement, man, because I feel the exact same way. I mean, people would think, oh, I'm really good. No, I mean, I'm better than what I used to be, but I compare myself to.

Just a whole people don't understand the holiness of God, the holiness of Christ. I don't think they just quite get it, that there is like zero bit of darkness of you. And it was just refreshing to hear you say that. And that's all I have to say.

So you have a great evening. I appreciate it because you're a guy of like-minded. Uh consideration. I don't want to say humility because that becomes arrogant. But you know, I I think humility is knowing your place before God.

And you and I would get it. Yeah, we get it to that point by his grace.

Someone was telling me because I gave a testimony, I had to do a testimony for this some kind of dinner group thing we had, and I let them know that you know, I have not been with a woman in like uh 19 years, and that was my direct choice, sexual limorality. And they were saying, Oh, you're so strong. I said, No, no, no, no. It's only by the grace of God that me. Jeff cannot be with a woman for night.

Now touch, grow, touch. Cheers. I treat all women like sisters. I look at I look at them in their face. And it's only by the grace of God that I can do that.

It's not me, it is his power that's in me. And when they started trying to give me a compliment, told me that I am so strong, I'm like, no, I'm not. It's his strength in me. He's in the Holy Spirit technique. Yeah, but it was just refreshing to hear you say that, and that's all I have to say.

So, you have a good evening. YouTube brother YouTube, God bless. All right. Yeah, I enjoyed that. All right, let's get to Oh.

Patrick from North Carolina. Patrick, welcome. You're on the air. Uh hi, Matt. I wanted to ask you about the word was God.

Is the word of God the Bible? In one sense, yes, and in another sense, no. But when it says the word became flesh, would it be fair to say the Bible became flesh? No. But that would be the case, though, right?

Because Jesus. Is the Bible in the New Testament So Jesus is the is the Word of God. And I would do that. Words mean what they mean in context. It's called a logical fallacy.

Called the fallacy of equivocation, where the word or phrase changes meaning in its usage, and the lack of clarification causes confusion.

So In one sense, the Word of God is simply said to be the entire Bible. In another sense, it's said to be the person of Jesus. It's just the phraseology. Is used in different senses, just like the word green is used in different ways, in different contexts. It can mean color, it can mean envy, it can mean being naive, it can mean money.

It can mean sick. It doesn't mean that the one word has the same meaning everywhere any more than the phrase word of God means it has the exact same meaning everywhere. 'Kay. But if the word became flesh in the New Testament, how can Jesus be in the Old Testament? Because he's the preincarnate Christ.

Wherever you have a manifestation of God in the Old Testament in a personal way, then it's the preincarnate Christ. Because Jesus says in John 6, 44, that not that anyone has seen the Father. They were seeing God Almighty in Hebrew in Exodus 6, 2 and 3, but it was not God the Father, it's the preincarnate Christ.

Okay.

What is that reincarnate Christ? Is that in the Bible? The phrase is not there. But for example Adam and Eve walked with God. God spoke to them.

It was a personal interaction in the garden. But The Bible says, Jesus says, not that any man has seen the Father. John 6:46. In 1 Timothy 6, 16, Paul the Apostle says, speaking in the context of God the Father, dwells an unapproachable light whom no man has seen or can see. You can't see him.

So He's not been seen in the Old Testament, but they were seeing God Almighty. Who were they seeing in the Old Testament who's God Almighty? but not the father.

So you don't believe the Father is God? Oh my goodness. Yes, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit all comprise the one divine being, God. Yeah, but if the Trinity is Father, Son, Holy Spirit, and they're all God, so that makes four, not three. You know, literally, I have an article on my on my uh uh monitor that I'm going to release probably tomorrow on that exact issue.

Exact issue. From an argument I had in a debate with a Muslim who said that the Father has all the properties of God, the Son has all the properties of God, the Holy Spirit has all the properties of God, the Trinity has all the properties of God, therefore there's four persons or gods that have the properties of God. And then I go in and I show it's a fallacy of equivocation, the fallacy of composition, and a category error. And I explain why, because the lack of ter of determination of the terms and how they're understood.

Okay, I'll be releasing that later.

Well, I believe the previous caller, when he said the logos was uh logic, that's what the Bible is. Bible is logic for us to read today.

Well, you see, look, the term Word of God, for example, it says in John 10:35, if he called them gods to whom the word of God came, the scripture cannot be broken. There, Jesus Himself is referring to the phrase Word of God as the Scriptures.

Okay.

Yeah. But he's also. The word became flesh, which was born of a woman. Yes, but to say. to say that um Let me get over here.

Because I I have notes in John 1.1, all right. Look, in the beginning was the Word, the Word was with God, the Word was God.

Some people will mistakenly say or argue that Lagos simply means logic or some impersonal rational principle. But this interpretation Denies the personal identity of the word as presented in John 1:1 through 14 in the whole context. and furthermore, a an abstract principle, And an impersonal principle can't become personal. You understand that?

Well, no, because if the word became flesh and it was Jesus. And that means the word ended, and Jesus came on earth for 33 years. Not the word of God. Jesus was a human being for 33 years. Look, this happens all the time when I talk to people.

I'll raise an issue and they just ignore it and they go on to something else. I raised an issue. You ignored it. Let me explain again. Let me explain.

You're saying that the the word logos means an impersonal, rational principle. That's what you're saying. Yeah. Principle. But then you're also saying that this impersonal rational principle became flesh.

But that's saying a human being born of a person. But then, but then, but then, you're saying the impersonal becomes personal. That's impossible. No. He's mad.

That's why you're trying to make a difference. You're not listening. You're not listening. You're not listening. I'm going to hold your feet to the fire.

An impersonal thing like electricity can't suddenly become personal. because its natures are different. The essences are different. The natures are different.

Well you could have get this. Yeah, but electricity's in our brain. But Patrick, I want you to. Patrick, I want you to think. An impersonal, an impersonal, an impersonal thing like an idea.

A thought A thought is an abstraction.

So if I have a thought about something, it's just a thought. The thought by nature does not have self-awareness, it is not alive.

Okay? No, but your body is not. Would you listen to me? Listen to me. Listen to me.

Listen to me. The thought. Didn't say body. I said the thought. You apparently, like a lot of others, I'm going to say this, are incapable of having a rational understanding of logic.

This is why you commit these errors all the time. I've done this countless times, where I've had to sit with somebody and repeat myself over and over. A thought, like an idea, is not self-aware. If you're going to say an idea or a principle, a principle is an idea. If you're going to say such a principle becomes something it isn't by saying the impersonal becomes personal, then you've lost its identity.

You've lost its continuity. It's logically impossible. I can teach you about this, but you can choose to remain in your ignorance. You can choose, you can choose, you can choose to remain in your ignorance. You can you can choose or remain in a you can choose to remain foolish.

Look, I've written 4,700 articles and I talk to people like you all the time.

So look, you mentioned the word lock.

Some can be a human. Can a rock become can a rock become human? Can a rock become a human?

Okay, because a rock is impersonal.

So, the nature of that which is impersonal cannot stop being impersonal and become personal because it's a contradiction. The Bible became human. Excuse me. Excuse me. Stick with the topic.

You already admit a rock cannot become personal. The reason is because a rock by nature is impersonal. An idea or a principle is by nature also impersonal.

So how does an impersonal actuality become personal? You've already admitted it.

Okay, so the rock is now born of a woman? And that makes it personal? The word Patrick became flesh in the Bible. Patrick. And now it's a human.

Patrick. Patrick. So can a rock be born of a woman and then become personal? Its nature changes from impersonal to personal? Patrick, you're not thinking.

Okay, we're done. We gotta go. We gotta go. We gotta go. There's a break.

There's the end of the show. Folks, that's a perfect example of irrationality. What happens to the mind when you negate the doctrine of the Trinity? You adopt irrationality, incongruity, illogic. And that's why I tackled him.

I got a little tired. I just tell him this is what his problem is. I have to debate this all the time. It's sad. Hey, have a great weekend.

Talk to you Monday. Another program powered by the Truth Network.