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Call 866-WINASIA or to see chickens and other animals to donate, go to CritterCampaign.org. Hey, this is Jim Graham from the Masculine Journey podcast, where we explore relationship instead of religion every week. Your chosen Truth Network podcast is starting in just a few seconds. Enjoy it, share it, but most of all, thank you for listening and for choosing the Truth Podcast Network. This is the Truth Network. Welcome to Man Talk, brought to you by TAWCMN, talking and walking Christian men's ministry, where they're devoted to breaking down the walls of race and denomination and challenging men to take their God-assigned role.
Here's our hosts, Will Hardy and Roy Jones Jr., a black guy and a white guy. Welcome to Man Talk Radio. It is time for Man Talk. Man Talk, what is that all about? Man, you know, I don't know.
I'm just a man and I'm talking. You know, before we get started, it's so funny. We were trying to come up with a name for the show last year.
Man Talk Radio just seemed like an appropriate tag for our show, right? Mm hmm. And then you were the black guy with a white guy.
Exactly. I'm sure y'all figured out now. One of us is white, one of us is black. We keep you confused. We call each other one or the other. But I mean, that's that's a whole nother story.
But, you know, and for that, I apologize from the standpoint of our titling. When we when you go to search Man Talk and if you tell someone to go search Man Talk, tell them to go Man Talk Radio podcast. Because if you just go Man Talk, a lot of things we've been sharing with you and teaching you and telling you to stay away from comes up when you just type in Man Talk for podcast search. So make sure you pass on Man Talk Radio podcast as the search. Yeah.
You get a lot of garbage, basically. Yeah. Otherwise.
So, Roy, last week we were talking about Steve Sonderman and the nice conference, you know, that that he had. And so there was another topic that he had in that particular study and it was called Making Disciples. See, and I don't think people really understand what it means to disciple someone. So when you when you hear the word disciple, what is it that a person should be doing to disciple someone?
Well, obviously, the first thing is that modeling their life after Christ. Right. I mean, that's truly where it starts in the first piece of that would be getting grounded in the word.
True, solid foundation in the word will. Right. And in order to do that, you got to be in a Bible believing Bible teaching fellowship. Right.
So that would be the first thing. Second thing is, is truly walking it out, not just being in the word, but walking it out so that you're living a life of example, as Jesus did. And it doesn't really matter how much knowledge you have in reference to the Bible. All you're doing is you're living out what you know. Right.
And you're sharing your testimony. And then the other piece is obviously what we talked about in the last show is investing in others. You've got to be willing to invest and find time to invest in others, because that's what it's about and growing together. You know, that's and we've all heard that you need a Paul Barnabas and a Timothy in your life.
Right. And, you know, when you when you invest in other people, what you're doing is you're planting seeds in their life is what you're doing. So when you and when you do your one on one or one on two or one on three discipleship, you are planting seeds. What the person needs to see is they need to see how a true born again believer models out the life of Christ. So if they see you doing something on Sunday and they're fellowshipping with you in church and then all of a sudden they see you out there in the world doing something completely different, then, of course, your life is not modeling what you're saying you believe.
That's the whole thing we've talked about is the face, the Monday through Saturday face or person looks totally different than the Sunday face. And that's not what you want to be doing. The other piece of that will with the disciple pieces that you're getting people men off the sidelines or people off the sidelines is this should not be for those that are just going to sit on the sidelines. This is for those that are going out and work to build the kingdom, because the whole point is to share the gospel, to show the love of Jesus Christ, to teach others what it means to be a follower of Christ and to share the story about Christ dying for us. Amen. And you know, some of the key principles that Steve was talking about when when you're investing in people is that you have to spend a lot of time with fewer people rather than a little time with a great amount of people, because you have a tendency to get more done in a smaller group. This is why I love the small group. And you've probably heard me if you've been listening to the podcast, I always say I'm a believer in a small group. I love the small group. I've been doing the small group for 33 years now, off and on.
And it has really impacted my life because you really don't know what people are going through, but they have a tendency to start to open up to you when they're in a smaller group. If I if I don't have to stand up in 30, 40, 50 people looking at me. Right. You know, I can be more relaxed. Yeah. And back to and then just to reinforce that we'll we've said this before.
Please be extremely confidential in those small group environments. And I can't stress that enough. And, you know, Steve Solomon will says this in one of the sections. What is a disciple, which is just the things we've just talked about? He says a learner, which is what we just talked about, getting in the word, listening to God, a follower, being a Christ follower and then a reproducer. You've got to be a multiplier.
And that means you need to multiply. Those are going to go out and do the same thing that you're doing with them, not sitting on the sidelines, but going out and multiplying to be active followers of Christ. But if they don't see you doing anything, you know, we heard here always hear that old saying, talk is cheap and it is, you know, you can talk something.
But if you're not walking it out, then you really don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to your you discipling someone else, because your life is really not going to demonstrate exactly what a true follower of Christ should be doing. And the things that we should be modeling in front of them. So one of these one of his other principles for building relationships is demonstration.
I mean, and that's it. You have to demonstrate. They have to see you living out this walk in Jesus.
They have to see it on it. Well, that's the whole premise of our ministry, right? Men walking the talk, right?
You're talking, walking Christian ministry. So it's one thing to say it. It's a whole nother to walk it out. And if you're not walking it out, then you should ask yourself why. And this is point number three that he had under that particular one.
People are looking for demonstration, not explanation. Oh, I love that. So so well, the reason why I couldn't get out there with you is because the reason why I couldn't go here is because every time you call, it's because it's because now we're not saying that there are not true reasons why people can't get together and, you know, do things and make accomplishments like that. But it's like every single time I call you every single time there's something going on. Yeah.
And folks, you're not fooling anybody. Exactly. Exactly. When we've called you five times and five times you've been busy or there's been an excuse and your mother's had the same birthday five times and your wife's had the same anniversary five times. In the first six months, we know there's a problem.
Or you've been to the dentist 16 times and you only got 32 teeth now. So and we're not we're not making light of a situation. What we're doing is we're saying these are real life excuses that people use.
They really do. And so we want to hit to the heart of the matter to say, if you are constantly saying I cannot because I want so and so to do it or they do it a lot better than I do, then how are you truly going to understand your purpose in the body? Well, and I would ask this will what if God treated you the same way that you're treating?
Oh, my Roy, I think I think you really got punch somebody with that statement. I mean, as you were speaking that will God just put on my heart. What if I acted the same way that you act?
Wow. If the father, you know, he's too busy with everybody else to answer your prayers or he's too busy with everybody else to spend any time with you. Think about that. That's in essence what you're saying.
That's exactly right. And see, you have to you have to build when you're building relationships, you have to spend time with the people that you are attempting to disciple. Well, you know, we've talked about this before and just had this conversation recently.
You know, a personal invitation and a personal relationship will go 10 times further than a text, than an email, than a blast that says, hey, come be a part of something. But if you pick up the phone and call me, Will, you've invested in me. You made me feel like I really matter. And if we're talking about belonging and the fact that we oftentimes don't feel like we matter and see that that's a key word that you stated there, Roy. Matter that you matter, because this is this is the second point under time spending with the people who you are discipling. Steve Solomon says, talk about what matters. So so you you hit it right on the head and see what what what matters to the person who you're discipling that you have to be a good listener as well as to be able to communicate effectively the need that that person might be seeking in reference to what it is that I need to do in order to follow Jesus. Right.
You know, so and we have to we have to effectively communicate these things. This is why what you're getting in your Bible study, man. This is when when you are getting the worship and the messages, what are you doing with these things? Are you going, whoa, wow.
You know, Pastor, he really preached a good message. And then you go home and you do nothing with it. You don't talk about it with the wife. You don't talk about it with the children.
You just go off to your day. And so that's wasted opportunity. It is. And see, all of this again is so easy.
It is. In order to sow seed, you've got to understand what the what the packet looks like. And if you're sitting in service on Sunday morning, you know, just want to challenge everyone that's listening. If you're sitting in service on Sunday morning, you're not taking notes. You're there's a few people out there that can listen to every word and can just about mirror back everywhere they've heard. Most of us with today's distractions can't remember two hours later what the pastor was saying or four hours later without going back in with some refresher. So we need to be taking notes so that you can take that refresh your mind.
Let God process that in your heart and in your spirit and then be able to deliver those seeds that you're talking about. OK, now I'm going to come in here, Roy, and I'll throw a wrench in there. I'm getting ready to throw the wrench.
The wrench is this. When you take notes or if you're taking notes, what are you doing with them? Because you can take notes and you can look at those notes and you can say, you know, what exactly was the pastor saying? I just wrote a shorthand down here, but I really can't understand the notes that I'm reading.
Well, you've got I assume that when you're taking the butch is a bad thing to do. But you need to be legible and obviously be clear in your thoughts of what you're listening to. Just jotting down a word here and word there is obviously not impactful. But most people, when they take notes, they're writing pretty complete thoughts so that when they go back and look at or should be when they go back and look at it, it's indeed they understand what they were listening to. And it refreshes and renews back to the renewal that we talk about quite often. Right.
Well, we'll see what they need. Well, what you need to be doing when you're taking notes is you need to go home and organize them right away. The right way.
The right way. Hey, folks, we're so glad you joined us as we're leading into break here real quick. Get ready to hear about one of our sponsors, Dr. Freaky, phenomenal chiropractor, been in the business for a long time. If you need any adjustments, please go see me. Be more than happy to help you. We'll be back with you in just a moment.
Your host, Will Hardy and Roy Jones Jr., a black guy and a white guy. Affordable chiropractic in High Point, as you might tell from their name, affordable chiropractic, even for the cash patient. Dr. Jeff Freaky has been caring for patients in High Point for thirty four years. Physical therapy such as ultrasound and spinal decompression for disc conditions such as herniation, comprehensive care for auto accident injury patients with no out of pocket expense. Remember, affordable chiropractic on West Lexington Avenue in High Point.
Call 336-885-1987. Welcome back. Welcome. I was just going to say great minds think alike. So we were saying welcome back at the same time.
Jinx on news. That means you can't say anything. But what we were talking about when we left was we were talking about investing in men and principles for building relationships with men taken from Steve Sonderman's conference that we had with him a few weeks ago. And so when you when you minister to a man, it's not the same as ministering to a woman. I think we understand that, you know, women are more receptive where men are more standoffish. You know, when it comes to trying to build a relationship with men and most men are not huggy, huggy, philly, philly, touchy, touchy, you know, in that respect. So they that makes them feel a bit uncomfortable, you know, when it comes to.
Hey, guy, how you doing? You know, and well, in this age of covid, we're not embracing anymore. But but, you know, you embrace a man and then people might look and say, oh, what's going on here if they don't really don't understand the relationship.
Right. Because and that person may feel uncomfortable if you just hug them in a restaurant. Well, you know me, I'm a hugger, so it didn't bother me. And I'm always hugging my brothers when I come up to them.
And, you know, even through covid, while we're wearing masks and doing appropriate precautionary measures, I still reach up and bump shoulders or grab the hand, just bump shoulders. But you're exactly right. Well, most men are just a little bit cautious. And it's because of the way we've been raised.
Right. You know, men don't cry, men don't show emotion. Men are supposed to fix everything that's broken. And and then some of these other components we talked about, you know, there's not a lot of faith put in men these days from society's injection. So one of the things that I think is we can't speak enough about is the is the need to fellowship one on one, if nothing else. You need a brother that you can sit down and talk to because there's not a man out there that's not carrying some sort of load. And most are carrying wounds from childhood and that needs to be dealt with and talked about and just opened up with another brother about how to help work through that. And this is this is this actually goes right into the next point here that Steve had on his his with the conference is that when you start talking with a man and he starts sharing his journey, you meet him where he's at. You know, because if if you're advanced in scripture and you know the Bible and you know, you've been walking with the Lord for a long time and this brother have not, you might want to fire off 10, 15, 25 scriptures right away and just bombard him with that. But you have to listen to this man because his journey is trying to move forward so he can talk out some of the things that he may have experienced as a young man or even as an adult that have carried over into his life.
Now, it problems that he might be experiencing with the children and then his wife and things like this if if he's married. So we have to meet that man where he's at. Listen, man. When when you are are discipling a man, listen to that man.
Listen to what he is saying, because through the words that he's speaking to you, he might be crying out. Right. And you are that listening ear. And it's important to be an active listener through that process. Will and part of that being sensitive to what the person saying is mirrored back so that you make sure you understood the message correctly from what that person was, was honest and transparent enough to share with you. Mirror back what you just heard from to that person. And that will build confidence in that person that you're actually truly listening and not just not just receptive of what they're the noise, if you will.
That's right. And stay on task, man. When when you are when you are discipling a man, stay on task. Don't waver and wander from the subject matter.
Right. Complete a thought after you have listened to the brother. Let him complete that thought.
And then you enter in. Don't try to over talk him or say you're doing this wrong and offering all these solutions without really him telling his whole story, because I don't know a judge out there who will make a decision based on one argument. He's going to listen to both arguments before he comes to a conclusion or she comes to a conclusion on a decision. And you don't have to settle it right then. Sometimes it got you need to go away, walk away and let God work on you with what it is you need to mirror to speak back into this person's life. Right.
But see, that's part of a man's nature, though. See, we want to fix it. It's broke. Let's fix it now. Let's fix it now. Let's just don't wait.
You don't you may not see tomorrow. I mean, we've come up with all kinds of reasons on why you need to do this thing. But Steve had another point as a key component is he said there can be a variety of reasons why you want to meet the person to disciple them. So when you're coming together. The meeting might start out is, hey, let's talk about what I want to talk about, but yet it should be let's talk about what you want to talk about. So you let the person who is being discipled rather than the discipler come in with the conversation and start opening up. And that goes back to that first point.
Meet him where he is and not you take him to where you may want him to go. Exactly. And that could be hard for most people because they feel like they've got it figured out. But it goes back to an independent relationship with Christ. Each person has a unique relationship with Christ.
So you're just trying to get that person closer to Christ and you're trying to teach them the fundamentals. It may look different than your relationship. You and I talked about that in the past. And we've seen that happen. You can handle certain things that I can't handle, that I would not be properly equipped to deal with. And God knows that.
So therefore, he's going to take you up one path and I may be coming up the sibling path on right across the street. But I think the bottom line is as a body, we work stronger together. Yes. So we always say many hands make little work.
Yeah. We build in building that relationship. It comes to a point to say, hey, you got something to offer. You got something to offer. So let's take all of the things that each one of us have to offer.
And we put them in this big kettle and we say, OK, here's the resources. But would that be the different parts of the body? Oh, yeah.
It would be the different parts of the body. The eye can't say to the hand, I don't have no need of you. See, you're going to get me off in the scripture now. I wanted to make sure you got that in there, of course. But the other side of that, I think, is when a man, and I think, again, Steve has it in his handout that he gave us, develop an atmosphere of acceptance and encouragement. Notice there's no word of judgment. Exactly. Acceptance and encouragement. And see, sometimes, Roy, the human nature wants to do that. They hear something negative about an individual now. It's like, OK, now I got to watch him all of the time because he might slip back. That's right.
And then I can't really, I don't really be hanging out with him because he's struggling. But Jesus didn't do that at all. He went right to the people that were struggling. He went right to the people who need a physician. He said, for those who are well, you don't need one.
That's right. But the people who are sick, you need one. And so we all need a physician. And of course, he was looking, speaking from the spiritual sense. You know, we are all sick spiritually and we need curing.
We need it to be well. And only Jesus Christ has the cure for the disease called sin. That's good. I tell you, Roy, it just makes me want to just drive on and continue to do the work. Because, you know, when we was listening to that song on the Christian Fellowship Group, that last song, I don't know, did you listen to it all? Oh yeah, Rise Again. No, not Rise Again. Oh, the other one.
Yeah. And what that song, it was an old hymn. I can't even remember the name of that hymn right now.
It slipped my mind, Roy. But what it does is the hymn basically says, what type of legacy are you going to leave for those who are coming after you? That was the theme of that hymn. What are you leaving for others when they start coming behind you?
What will they say about you like we were talking about in a previous show? The legacy, those things that you remember, they remember you by that had an impact on your life. See, these are the things people are going to remember. They're going to remember, you know, there was this brother, he sowed a seed in my life and I am where I am today because God used him to sow that one seed. And I hear often of Chip Ingram talks about, pastor out in California, talks about how this bricklayer that he worked with was used by God to actually sow into his life. And he became the man he is today as a result of that one seed working with a guy who lay bricks.
So it could happen in any form and any time with anyone because we don't know who that person is that's out there that's ready to sow that next seed. Well, I think it's important to pause here for just a moment and just encourage people that it truly is a love relationship. It is. It really is a love relationship.
And I know we talk a lot about the fundamentals, the blocking and the tackling, if you will, which is a key part of this walk. But I just want to pause for a moment and just think about how great the love was that God had for us. Just how great that love was that he would become man and come down and die on the cross for us. And that's phenomenal. And I don't think we really think about that. It's like as much as we probably should.
We should pause to reflect on that more than we do and just really the enormity of that whole process. And it's big, Roy. And what a blessing. Oh, wow.
If it wasn't for Jesus, I mean, we wouldn't be sitting here talking about issues that are affecting men and having man to understand what his role needs to be in his family. And you're not a dictator. You're a comforter. You're a leader. You're a servant. Servant.
You're a teacher. These are the things that God had called you to do. And in your family relationships and your friend relationships and your church environment and your work environment, you have to be a complete man all of the time and not half a man or three quarters of a man or a quarter of a man.
You have to be a whole man and a whole man follows Jesus. He's not afraid to cry when he needs to. He's not afraid to say, Lord, I don't know the answer to that.
If you don't know the answer. And folks, just remember, he loves you and that is that is what you need to take away from today's show. No greater love than what he showed for us and has done for us.
All you need to do is accept him. If you haven't done that, we just pray that you'll do that. Just have a wonderful rest of your day. And thank you so much for joining our show. And we'll we'll be back with you next week. And we'll it's always a pleasure to have time with you, my brother.
And likewise with you, my brother. And so when we get together again, we got more man issues as we wrap up today's show. Be assured that TAWCMM talking and walking Christian men's ministry is building a community of men that are Christ followers with the desire to be servant leaders in their homes, communities, churches and work environments. Check out our website for upcoming events and regularly scheduled meetings. Drop us a note for topics that you would like to have us visit in the future. Thank you for joining us on Man Talk today. Visit us at www.tawcmm.com. This is the Truth Network.
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