Men and Money

Welcome to Man Talk, brought to you by TAWCMN, talking and walking Christian men's ministry, where they're devoted to breaking down the walls of race and denomination, and challenging men to take their God-assigned role. Here's our hosts Will Hardy and Roy Jones Jr., a black guy, and a white guy. Welcome to Man Talk, and I'm Will Hardy, and I'm sitting here with sub for Roy, who's out vacationing and I can't be with him. So we got Pastor Ken Kline here today, who is going to be on the show. Welcome, Ken. Thank you, brother.

It's good to be with you, Will. God is so good, and today's topic we're going to be talking about men is men and money. Now, you know, anytime when you're talking about money, it always hits a sensitive spot I think with men, because there's so many avenues, you know, you can go with money, but we're going to be talking about men and budgeting, how it affects the relationship, what men do with their money, and all this. But before we get started in talking deep into this, I want to just mention, men, that regardless of what goes on in your household when it comes to money, ultimately you are responsible. God will hold you responsible for everything that is going on in that house, because he placed you as the head. And so you're going to have to give an accountability. Remember what God said in Genesis chapter three, when he gave the judgments to the serpent, the woman and the man, and he told the man, he said, because you heeded the voice of your wife and aid of the tree of the garden that I commanded you not to eat, that you did it.

So whether or not you believe that you are not a man who is able to do financial matters, then God is going to hold you responsible. Isn't that right, Ken? That's it. Absolutely.

I agree. So what does men really supposed to be, when they come into the knowledge of the truth and come into the gospel kingdom, what is it that men should basically look at when they initially get into a relationship? Because he starts out single and he wants to go out and just spend his money because he really has nobody he has to be accountable to, you know, but then he gets married. So what starts to happen there as you have it?

It's an age old thing. It's amazing to me how many men in premarital counseling, when we hit the financial component, let's talk about future finances and what this looks like. There's kind of a grin and a smile and there's almost a what's mine is mine and what's hers is hers. And so we're going to both kind of work on this together and we're going to, you know, she's got her kind of things and her goals, but unless that comes together under one authority, it's going to be a long hard battle.

And I always tell them that in our premarital sessions, I said, dude, I got to tell you, it's going to be a long hard battle is long. And I think you and I even talked about a little bit before the show, the separate accounts. A lot of folks still to this day, I would say majority of the people that sit in front of me on Sunday mornings have separate accounts, her account, his account. You know, and when, when you talk about, when you talk about separate accounts, you know, I think that sets up a element for disaster because if you have someone in, in typically in a marriage, and I know I've seen this too in premarital counseling to where you have a one person in that relationship who is a saver and then the other who is a spender. It's conflict.

Absolutely. And it's not just having an account, a separate checking account, but so many times in, in, in marital counseling with some issues, the cards, the separate cards, and even the hidden cards, the ones that somebody didn't know about that too is being that that probably leads into a whole nother subject we'll talk about. But I think just having separate and not having those conversations with one another so often. And I just admit it, the times that I've gotten myself in trouble years ago for spending, you know, not $10 or $20, but spending a substantial amount without ever having the conversation and knowing that she would be okay with it when she wasn't okay with it and how that led to tension and conflict.

Quiet nights, a few nights on the couch every now and then as a result of that, but we live and learn. And one of the things I've come as I've matured as a Christian over the years is no secrets. With my soulmate, the one that I blew out my candle, I don't know about you, and we lit that unity candle, we became one. And at that moment in time, so did the checking accounts, and the surprises and the hiddens.

We have one set of accounts, and we talk to each other about them daily. Well, you know, because marriage, marriage is, it's teamwork, you know, it's not an individual, you know, with individual responsibilities. When God called, he called man and woman to be one, leave father and mother and cleave unto your wife and they too shall be one flesh. So if you can't talk about money before you say I do, then it's like, what reason would you have to talk about it after you get married? Because the issues, whatever they are, prior to one coming and saying, I do, they only going to intensify. Yes.

And once that intensity increases, then you have that man or that woman now, you know, being at odds and not communicating this, whereas they should be communicating. Mm hmm. That's correct. So, so in, in Haggai chapter number two and verse eight, it says all silver and gold belong to the Lord. Oh, I love that because, but what about the cash, Will? And you know, when you or credit cards, but, but see all of, all of that is, is it's resources. Yes. So, so God has given us all of these resources. And of course we have to be held accountable and we will be held accountable for everything we do. But when you don't trust your spouse and you have the secret account, you have the secret credit card or you're stashing cash away, then that tells me that not only don't you have trust in the one whom you married, but you don't have trust in God.

And you're basically committing like financial unfaithfulness. Yes. That's it. That's, that's a good, a good way of putting it. I think in the interesting thing about that trust that you're supposed to be building together is secrets tend to grow. I've noticed too, they get bigger.

We've had this, we've had these talks about pornography that tends to grow and get bigger and bigger the longer you don't deal with. I think that's true with money as well. When you have financial secrets, I spent a little more or maybe I got an extra check.

Maybe I got a bonus check in ministry. There's been many times I've received an honorarium for maybe doing a wedding or a funeral or speaking in an engagement and it would be easy to say, well, she doesn't need to know about that 200 or that $300 because that's mine and I'll cash it and then I can get that little thing that I wanted. But the thing is it may sound trivial and small but it's still breaking trust. I love to just make sure I share with my wife and what those things are. And there have been times that I've been able to say I want to bless you and she said, you don't have to give that money to me. You're the one who spoke and I said, but we're a partner, not only a ministry, we're partners in life and I am going to share it with you. And again, that's a little thing but it's building the trust rather than breaking the trust.

And you know, I think that shows too. It shows maturity in God. You know, coming back to the scripture again in 1 Timothy chapter six and verse seven, it says, for we brought nothing into this world. That's right.

And it's of certain we can't take anything out. So, you know, if we're hoarding and we're not letting go of what God has given us to bless someone else and that person might be someone within our own family, then we're doing a disservice to them as well as the Lord God. And if we do all of this hard work in saving, saving, saving, and then all of a sudden we depart this life, now Johnny come lately is driving your car, wearing your clothes, eating your food, living in your house and sleeping in your bed. So what good would it be for you to do all of these things and not let God bless you to bless someone else? Yes.

Oh, man. This may lead into more conversation but it's interesting to me too. I was thinking before we even started the show how many times Jesus had conversations about money. And I look at today and I think, wow, this problem's just got out of control with our spending issues, our debt issues, our tithing issues.

I mean, we could do a segment really on each one of those things. But it really isn't, they're not new issues because Jesus spent most of his, a lot of his parables and stories were over money issues. And you know, money, money, we all need money. We need money to live. We need money to survive and eat and pay the bills and things like that. So money is a necessity of this life, but we should not let money control us.

Exactly. And see, this is again in first Timothy chapter six, verse number 10, it says for the love of money. Well, I think we have a tendency to say money is the root of all evil, but is the love of money. That is the root of all evil.

And that evil comes about when it starts to sway you and bring you into an area of your life that you might have some secret sin that you're trying to supply. So on the other side, we're coming up to a break now, but on the other side of the break, we want to continue this conversation with men and money. TAWCMM would love to have you join their community of men for breakfast every first and third Friday of every month. They have Bible discussions and fellowship after the best breakfast in town. The meeting location is at their gracious host church, First Christian Church in Kernersville, 1130 North Main Street in Kernersville. They have a hard start at seven o'clock and a hard stop at eight o'clock.

First time visitors eat for free. Join your hosts, Will Hardy and Roy Jones Jr., a black guy and a white guy. Hey everybody, I'm Warren Smith. Join me and my Colson Center colleague, John Stone Street, for Breakpoint this week. It's your weekly briefing on the news and how to interpret it through the lens of a Christian worldview.

John Stone Street, Warren Smith, that's me. And you, each weekend, right here on this station. And we're back with talking about men and money. And you know, when we were on the break, we had ended talking about how money controls. And the rest of that verse goes on to say that when it strays you from the faith and in their greediness, it pierces them with many sorrows.

Oh my Lord. When we think about, when we think about how money promises things to you. And it does. Money promises you, oh, you can have a good time when your pockets are full. You can do what you want to. You can have whatever it is you desire because you have it. And now don't, you know, it'll say things to you like, oh, don't restrict yourself because now I'm able to give you any desire of your heart.

It's almost promising you the things the word of God will promise you. In addition, it says, you know, the world says, if you just had a little bit more, things wouldn't be so bad. If you just had a little bit more, you'd be a little more content. You'd have a little more happiness. You could do some more things. You could buy some more of those things you wish you had.

Then you'd be happy. The world tells us that. And a lot of us fall for that lure. We go after it.

And you know, um, when we do that, I think it, it, again, it shows our immaturity because where is our faith? Are we allowing ourselves to truly be the representatives of Christ's kingdom in which we were called or are we allowing ourselves to be beat down by money and all of what money has to do or will do for us if we allow it to control us? Yep. You know, so it's, it's a, it, and it's not necessarily a catch 22 because if you know Christ, Christ is going to lead you in doing with that money what you need to do and then he'll give you more in abundance. Sure.

Absolutely. And it's amazing to me in so many of the conversations I have with just the friends, the guys, family members, male family members, male members of my church, the discussions about that control of money, how much time is spent, anxiety is there, sleep has been wasted because how am I going to make it work? How can I fix this?

How can I get out of this? And it really is a big control issue. Someone said one time, you know, whatever it is that controls most of your thinking is your God. And I hate to say it, but I think for a lot of our men who wear the name of Christ as Christian men, they have another God in their life and I really do believe it's probably, if it's not possessions, it's clothes, it's money, it's focus on money, they're thinking about money. And so I think it's a huge problem.

It is. And the material, the material things that money offers, because again, listen to the words of Jesus in Matthew chapter six, verse number 24, no one can serve two masters. That's right.

I mean, how many, how many times we've heard that either you, you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to one and despise the other. You can't serve God and money. And see, when, when we give money more attention and it becomes what we listen to, instead of listening to the voice of God, now what we're doing is we're, we're attempting to govern our own pathway because we say I got money and, and with money I can have influence. That's right.

That's right. It's a, I don't, I won't shift gears too fast, but I also see where it's taking our blessing away, where God said, you know, give me your best, give me your first, not only with your mind and your heart, but I think our tithing situation is really, really struggling. I know that the new norm for Christians in America based on recent studies is less than 3% for Christian American families, less than 10% of Christians in America tied less than, tied 10% or more in the course of a year.

It's getting smaller and smaller every year. And with that, we see so many people losing the favor and blessing. It's just tied together. When we honor God with our firstfruits, he will honor us. It's proven you cannot outgive God. And so money and God do go hand in hand. It's not that money is evil. It may be the root, but it's not evil.

It's what people do with it and their focus and their love for it. Our focus should be to love God and honor God. If he's providing for us as Jehovah Jireh, the great provider, then we should be honoring him. You and I had a great talk outside.

I loved it. And it was, you brought up the point about you don't have to pay your tithes. Remember that, talking about that? It never says that in the Word of God. And I love that when you share that with me. We honor God and we give to God. We pay our taxes, but we don't pay our tithes. That's a privilege that we get to give back to God. Over and over a thousand times in my life, I have seen it proven. And I would absolutely tell any man that's listening out there, you cannot outgive God. It's impossible. And he even said to himself, you can test me. If you don't believe it, you can test me. And through all the struggles I'm seeing with men, having – why are all these things happening to me?

Why did this break and that break and this break? And I really, I want to share with them and tell them, maybe you're taking from God and robbing God by not paying him, not paying him, but giving to him what he deserves from your firstfruits, which he's given you. I really believe wholeheartedly, a hundred percent, that when you give faithfully to him, he not only gives faithfully to you, but he gives the abundance back to you. And listen again, what the Word of God says, since you mentioned that. He says in Malachi 3, 8-10, Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings.

You are cursed with a curse, because you have robbed me even this whole nation. Bring, bring ye all the tithes unto the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house. And prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, If I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that you will not have room enough to receive it.

Isn't that wonderful? That's true. I mean, you know, God, God, there's all kinds of windows that God wants to open for families out there who are struggling if they only be obedient to the Word of God. That's right.

Absolutely. I mean, there's windows out there and there's abundance. And we're not preaching and talk and prosperity here. We're just telling you what the Word of God says right here in Malachi chapter 3 verses 8-10. He'd say that he will give you, he will open up the windows of heaven. He'll pour you out a blessing. He will shower the blessings down on you in such a way that you wonder, why am I receiving all this abundance from God? And again, it's because of your grace. I agree. God is so good.

He is good. And, and he loves the way I believe when, when we be obedient, God just have this big smile on his face and he's just saying, here's my children being obedient to my word. You know, they're, they're letting me be manifested through their lives. There's others out there who, who are struggling and we have just come to God with this richness and gracefulness that he has given to us so that we can show the world who Jesus is.

Yes. There's a great verse that popped into my head as you were sharing that, the making God smile. And I thought the joy of the Lord is my strength.

Nehemiah 8-10. And I ask people all the time, I think we say that backwards, even though we don't, that my joy is God's strength, but it actually says the joy of the Lord is my strength. Why would God be smiling? And what would bring God joy about us? It's our faithfulness.

That's right. And it's our, our willingness and our, and our relationship to him, but also our just faithfulness and our giving to him, for him, speaking for him. But if we make God smile because of the way we're honoring him, knowing that he's smiling on me is a, is a sign of favor.

It makes me strong. That's where I get my strength from is knowing that my papa God is smiling because of, because of me and because of the way that I'm living for him and honoring him with my life. And when he said, give and it shall be given unto you good measure, press down, shaken together and running over shall men give unto your bosom. So with the same measure that ye meet with all that shall be measured to you again.

So if you want a small blessing man, then just think small and that's all you're going to get. If you want God to tremendously pour out and open up those windows of heaven, then he will do that. But you have to be faithful to him and allowing him to work in and through you.

Just trust God, trusting, trusting the Lord with all thine heart, lean not into your own understanding. So men, you don't have to struggle. There's no need to struggle. So if you're struggling right now, just go to God and say, Lord, I'm struggling.

I don't want to struggle anymore. I want to give all this to you. I want to abundantly say, Lord, take charge of my finances.

Do for me what I can't do for myself. Heal, heal me. And as you're healing me, you'll heal my wife and you'll heal my children. Oh, I love God so much and I love what he's doing. So praise God, man. We thank you for listening to another episode here of Man Talk Radio. And we thank Pastor Ken Cline for being here in the absence of Roy.

God bless you until next time. As we wrap up today's show, be assured that TAWCMM, Talking and Walking Christian Men's Ministry is building a community of men that are Christ followers with the desire to be servant leaders in their homes, communities, churches and work environments. Check out our website for upcoming events and regularly scheduled meetings. Drop us a note for topics that you would like to have us visit in the future. Thank you for joining us on Man Talk today. Visit us at www.tawcmm.com. Men walking the talk.