Welcome to the Line of Fire Mics, Dr. Alex McFarland. It's time for the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and president of Fire School of Ministry.
Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome back to the line of fire.
Alex McFarland here. Very, very honored to be sitting in for Dr. Brown, who's traveling right now. And we have got two power-packed days. What a thrill to be on this show and to sit in for Dr.
Brown, whom I so greatly respect. And today, we've got a couple of guests, and you're going to meet one in just a moment. Later on in the show, you're going to hear from Dr. James Dobson. Tomorrow afternoon, we'll have Dr.
David Jeremiah on. And I'm just so glad it worked out that I could be here. I've been on the road for most of this year touring. We're promoting a new book called Stand Strong America that I'll tell you a little bit about. But with me in the studio right now is the guest that I want to introduce you to.
And I'll cue this up by asking a question. I'll ask this question: Is it possible to raise godly kids in a no-rules college? Culture.
Now, think about that. And we'll get to your calls in the show. The lines are open, 866-34TRUTH, with me to discuss the news of the day and any other thing that might come across our line of consciousness. A brother, colleague, and friend, John Rosemond, his website is rosemond.com, R-O-S-E-M-O-N-D. He's a parenting expert, a best-selling author, one of the most powerful communicators I've ever heard.
And he's done all the media. We can talk about his resume. But like myself, he shares a conviction that the home is the building block of society. We've witnessed in our lifetime really the disintegration, the undermining of marriage and family. And the home doesn't fare too well in much of American life these days.
And to talk about this and much more, we've got him for a whole hour. What a thrill. John Rosemond, welcome to the line of fire.
Well, thank you for inviting me on the show, Alex. I really appreciate it. Appreciate the opportunity, and you are a good friend. Thank you.
Well, it's just the providence of God that you happen to be in Charlotte today. I'm in Charlotte today, and it just worked out because on any other day, we might have been on opposite sides of the continent. We could have been. Yeah, so tell the listeners, give us the John Roseman story here in a moment. Uh in a moment.
Well, I grew up in an atheist household. Uh my stepfather was Jewish. My mother converted to Judaism. I floundered around in uh searching for some faith anchor, I would call it, for many, many years. Um experimented with atheism and Buddhism and Hinduism and this was the late 60s, new age was entering the cultural scene at that point in time.
And Really regarded church and people who went to church as just a bunch of hypocrites. And my wife, who was a believer, Persuaded me finally to go to church in nineteen seventy eight and um We began attending an Episcopal church, which I hope this doesn't offend anyone out there, but it didn't require much of me at all. You could believe in just about anything and be a good Episcopalian. And so I suppose, Alex, that it was the right place for me at the time. And I got over, as a consequence, my antipathy toward church and people who went to church, found that it was a great social environment.
I can't say that I grew in faith there. Began reading uh books and and both of my um I refer to them both as my parents, my stepfather and my mother. Between the two of them, they had three PhDs, microbiology, epidemiology, and plant morphology. Taught at the university level, I grew up in a very intellectual household. And I guess that's the music, so I'll tell you the rest of the story when we come back.
This is the line of fire, Dr. Michael Brown, Alex McFarlane, guest hosting for Dr. Brown today in studio with John Roseman. Stay tuned. We're back after this break.
It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34 TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.
Welcome back to the line of fire. Alex McFarland's here. The website for our guest is rosemond.com. John Rosemond, parenting by the book. He's got a radio show.
You're on AFR, right? Yes. And what's the name of your show? Because I said so. Because I said so.
Yes. Which is the thing no child wants to hear. That's right, but every adult needs to say.
Okay.
Okay, now we're going to, I want to get into your parenting and child-rearing expertise. And folks, if you have a question, I'm watching the board, but I want to hear his story. The number 866-348-7884. Maybe you're a parent. Maybe you're a grandparent.
Maybe, like myself, you're just a person who's concerned about the culture. John Rosemund is, in my book, the two voices for marriage, family, and parenting in America. One is James Dobson, whom you'll hear in an hour. And the other right now is John Rosemund. You've got a chance to pick the brain of one of the best.
But you were sharing your testimony.
So you come up in a very intellectual household. Very intellectual, atheistic, Darwinistic. The point of my saying that they had PhDs in the life sciences taught at the university level was to say that, and we talked about stuff like this all the time. I was part of these conversations from a very early age. Um It was just accepted that Darwinism explained everything.
And I began reading Alex's books that argued against Darw Darwinism in the early 1990s. Mind you now, I'd gone to church for twelve, fourteen years now, and Episcopal church, you know. It was a social club, is what it was. That's what it was. Gastonia, North Carolina.
Okay.
And to be a good Episcopalian, you stand up at the right time, you kneel at the right time, you say the right things, you read the right things, blah, blah, blah. And So I began reading these books that argued against Darwinism. Uh Philip Johnson um Michael Behe, Darwin's Black Box, and so on and so forth. And I've always regarded myself as an intellectually honest person, defined as someone who. When evidence is demonstrated to him that that his current Point of view about something is wrong, he is willing to change his mind.
There are many people who are not willing to do that. And I am. That's one positive thing I will say about myself. And I became convinced in the course of reading these books that these people were correct, that Darwinism made really no sense, that I had bought into it because it was just the thing to do in my household. And um So, in the early 1990s, began to believe in God, a creator God who is sovereign, supreme over the universe, etc., etc.
Uh still could not wrap my head around quote that Jesus thing end quote um Thought that was largely mythology. uh invented, embellished, whatever, perhaps unwittingly by largely by people who did not know him directly. After his crucifixion, did not believe in the resurrection, did not believe that he was fully divine. And then, and I used to feed my need to keep Jesus at arm's length. By going to bookstores, that was before books started becoming extinct.
Let me ask you this, John. As you go to church, and you, like myself, I grew up in a very high church kind of environment, recited the Apostles' Creed. That's right. That's what this was all about. Were you thinking about, okay, wow, this Jesus, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried?
I mean, were you beginning to connect the dots?
Okay, Jesus was. They say he's God incarnate who died for our sins. What do I do with this? I mean, was that what you were thinking? I thought that they were talking at best symbolically, metaphorically.
I did not believe that one had to and and we were told this from the pulpit, that you did not have to believe literally. Anything that the Bible said in order to be a good Episcopalian. You didn't have to believe in the virgin birth. All of that stuff was irrelevant. Being a good Christian was all about doing good works.
And that was a very comfortable notion for me.
So, anyway. I would go into the bookstores and I would get books that I later discovered were the books that Dan Brown used. as his research foundation in writing And um So one day I'm in a bookstore, Barnes and Noble, looking for a new book to feed. My need, this is the way I put it, to keep Jesus at arm's length. And I pull Lee Strobel's The Case for Christ off the shelf.
You know, he's a very close personal friend.
Well, that's great. We've had him on the show. Greatest guy in the world. I like him. He and I have had lunch together, and I had the.
The listener can't anticipate the rest of the story. I read and accepted Christ. Parenthetically, let me say for those that may be listening, because I know we do have skeptics that listen, and if you th lest you think Christianity is for the unintelligent Strobel has his law degree from Yale. Not too shabby. And he was an atheist.
We've had him on the show. And he was one of the guys that broke the story about the Ford Pinto exploding. And anyway, Strobel, very smart guy, wrote a book called The Case for Christ. Yeah, he was one of America's leading investigative reporters, worked for the Chicago Tribune, probably one of the top five at the time newspapers in the country, may still be. And so I read the book.
You know, many people, Alex, when they talk about coming to Christ, accepting Christ, they say things like, well, I accepted Christ at 2:33 in the afternoon on October the 7th, 2006. People ask me, when did you come to Christ? And my answer is.
Sometime in the year 2000. Because I read the book and it was so shocking to me. I mean, I said before, I'm an intellectually honest guy, and he was a guy who was presenting these. Apologetics. in a very straightforward, rational way that cut right through Any argument That I might have been able to pull up.
And I put the book down and I thought about it and thought about it, and I picked it up again and read it from cover to cover a second time, you know, trying to get into it and find some flaw. The Achilles heel. Yeah, right, the Achilles heel. And probably read it three times, Alex, before asking Christ to come into my life, forgive my sins, and be my Lord and Savior. And so it was instead of a moment, you know, this kind of.
uh explosive moment um It was a process. And interestingly enough, I've talked to other people who had the same experience with Lee's book. They read it, thought about it, read it again, thought about it, and finally Accepted the truth of what he was saying. Anyway, you know, that's very much like C.S. Lewis, though.
In Lewis's biography, Surprised by Joy, he talks about this process where he was an atheist. He became open to the idea of God. Then he learned more and more about Jesus. But Lewis's kind of Kodak moment, he said, all I can say is when I got on the train at London, I did not believe that Jesus was the one and only Son of God. But by the time I got off the train in Oxford, I believed that he was.
And that's not a real long trip. Yeah, yeah. Lewis also. Talks about his conversion. He says it's like waking up in the morning.
You don't remember the exact moment that you woke up, but suddenly you were aware that you were awake. And I know the reason I want to let's unpack this a bit because there are those Damascus Road moments at 12:35 p.m. on December 10th, 1999, as I was sitting at my kitchen table in front of, you know. That's fine. And if you've got a testimony where it's that vivid, but don't you think that the Damascus road experiences are maybe the exception rather than the rule?
And this relates to marriage and family because I I say this, John. I think God's normative ideal is that. Kids almost never remember a time they weren't. Following Jesus. You know, because they grow up in a stable, loving, two-parent family where mom and dad both are followers of Jesus.
They, at a young age, before they accrue all this baggage, you know, I hear these testimonies that. Not yours, but others where people are, for 30 years I was a drunk in the gutter, and then I found Jesus, and sometimes that happens, praise God. But isn't it possible? Preferable where kids never know a time they didn't love Jesus? I think it probably is.
I don't think it's a more valid experience. I think everyone who has authentically come to Christ has had their own valid experience in terms of that happening, the process by which, the moment at that happened. Hold that thought. This is the line of fire: Dr. Michael Brown, Alex McFarlane, and John Roseman.
Stay tuned. We're back after this break. Go away. Hey, this is Michael Brown. I want to invite you to join me for our second ever trip to Israel, February 25th through March 6th, 2017.
This is a great opportunity I get to interact with you, our radio listening audience, and our ministry partners as we experience the land of Israel together and it will be a life-changer. We've got a great price on the trip and if you're one of our monthly supporters, our torch bearers, you're eligible to receive a special discount for this once-in-a-lifetime experience. Space is limited, and we're accepting applications on a first-come, first-served basis. For more information on the trip to secure your spot, go to askdrbrown.org, click on the Israel banner, or call our office at 704-782-3760. Oh God of burning, cleansing flame, send the fire.
It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Super Welcome back to the line of fire.
Alex McFarland here. You know, John Roseman, that we're going to come back to in just a moment, he's just somebody you want to talk to for hours on end. I'm sitting here thinking it's kind of a bummer. We've only got an hour together this first hour. And then, folks, I do want to encourage you to stay tuned because in the second hour of the line of fire today, we're going to have attorney Abraham Hamilton, the third public policy analyst and general counsel for the American Family Association.
Abraham Hamilton is going to tell us about his recent board meeting with Target regarding their gender-neutral bathroom position. And then, also in the second hour, Dr. James Dobson, who was my boss when I worked at his ministry in Colorado. We love Dr. Dobson.
And, John, I just want to say I'm in awe of you. I want to get to your books. Listen to some of these titles, folks. And you tell me if we as a Nation don't need to really benefit from this man's wisdom. The well-behaved child, discipline that really works.
Making the terrible twos, terrific. Parenting by the book, Biblical Wisdom for Raising Your Child. I love this title. Grandma Was Right After All, Practical Parenting Wisdom from the Good Old Days. Those are just a few of the many, many titles of this prolific scholar, educator, and Christian brother.
And let's just say this: you're on the road speaking. You are all over North America. And how can people, if they wanted to book you for their church or their city, how do they find John Roseman?
Well, thank you, Alex. I appreciate that. You're very gracious. Just go to my website, John Rosemond. There is a link you can send me an email, and I call you back personally.
Wow.
So, not a machine. Uh but well, they may get a machine. Yeah, but they get but I will call them back personally. What is your ideal event? Um My ideal event is as much time as I can have in front of uh an audience.
or audiences of people in any given location. to talk about what has happened. to the raising of children in America over the last 50 or so years since we began listening to people like me tell us how to raise kids. People uh Who are listening to the show may or may not know that I'm a contrarian. voice in my field.
I'm a family psychologist who does not believe in psychology. And um I realized when I accepted Christ into my life. That a psychological worldview, and it is a worldview, it's not a science, it's a philosophy. And a biblical worldview were poles apart, opposites, completely, no similarity, no overlap. And No common ground.
And I realized I had to make a choice, and I made the correct choice. And what I've been doing for the last, what is it now, 16 years. is helping people understand. That most of the problems that we are having in American parenting today, the reason why today's parents are having so many more problems than any Generation of parents in America has ever had. The reason that we're having the kinds of problems that we are having with children, children hitting their parents, for example, unheard of 50 years ago, is because we have been listening to psychologists tell us how to raise children.
We have been listening to And I don't mean by this to say that psychologists are evil, but I think that psychology is an instrument of the serpent. And the serpent's goal has always been To persuade us that God is not telling us the truth. This is what he said to Eve. Right away in the garden. And we adhered in America to a biblical child-rearing ethic.
Until the mid sixties. Mm-hmm. And at the behest of psychologists who, because of Dr. Joyce Brothers, which many of our listeners may not recognize the name, the media had given a platform to psychologists. We began listening to psychologists tell us how to raise kids, and it's been a disaster.
Well, I know one of your books is called Parent Babel.
Now, listen to the greatest subtitle. By the way, I like your book titles.
Okay.
No, thank you. This is a subtitle Hall of Fame. John Roseman wrote a book called Parent Babel: How Parents Can Recover from 50 Years of Bad Expert Advice. Uh what do you mean by that subtitle?
Well, you know, let me deal with the irony of it first, because I am regarded as a parenting expert. And as you said, I'm I'm one of the you know, people say parenting expert. Uh they may probably say John Rosemond, which is which is But yeah, I I'm very appreciative of that. But Uh everything I do I do in His name, for His glory. But what I'm saying in this yeah, what I'm saying in this Um Subtitle is that Because, and I said it before a few minutes ago.
We're in the trouble that we're in, Alex, because we've been listening to experts. Professional experts, people with capital letters after their names. Who were selling us a child rearing ethic that was completely in opposition. to God's plan for child rearing. As set forth very clearly in Scripture, in his word.
And it is because of their babble, their parent babble, as I call it in the book, that we are in the trouble that we are in today. I completely agree. Let me say this: I've spent the last 11 years around PhDs. I was president of a school. I've taught in a number of schools.
It's an honor. But I've spent the last decade plus around PhDs. And I say there are four kinds of PhDs. There are some that love Jesus and use their education to further the kingdom of God. And then there are some that love knowledge, and they may not be a Christian, but they're just, and very rare, the unsaved PhD who just seems to be a person who loves knowledge and loves trying to teach people.
But most, and if your experience is different, you feel free to disagree. In my experience, and by God's grace, I've spoken it over 200 years. universities Pride and insecurity drive so much of academia. Pride and insecurity. And many of the PhDs that love to disconvert young people.
and denigrate God and Christianity in America. They're prideful, they're insecure. And people in my field are intellectually arrogant. Hey, we've got a break. Dr.
Michael Brown showed the line of fire with John Roseman, Alex McFarland, and more after this break in the go away. It's the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH.
Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome back to the line of fire. Alex McFarland, just uh. For For the sake of information, I'll give you my website.
My website is simply my name, alexmcfarland.com. And I will say a big thank you to Dr. Brown. He is traveling, he's en route to Australia right now. He texted me earlier in the show and he said, Please have the listeners pray for me as I'm on the road to Australia.
So do pray for Dr. Brown. If you are unaware, Dr. Brown is a national treasure. He is a PhD.
He's an academic, but he loves Jesus. And he's one of the greatest communicators that I've ever heard. Last year, we had him at North Greenville University, where it's my privilege to direct the apologetics program there. But we had Dr. Brown at North Greenville, and nearly 3,000 students were just mesmerized by his presentations.
And so we thank him for the chance to be on the line of fire. And I'm also deeply, deeply grateful for John Roseman. I want to tell you, in two Two days of broadcasting, multiple segments. You're the only guest we've got for an hour. And that's an honor to have you for an hour.
It is an honor, but we ought to tell the audience that I told you I didn't want to talk for a half an hour, that I barely scratched the surface of anything.
So I sort of twisted your arm.
Well, no, you didn't because I thought, really, I wanted to have you for an hour because I'm thinking, okay, maybe I don't want to ask for too much. I don't want to ask for the moon, you know.
So the fact that you were amenable to that is a good thing. But before that break, we were talking about pride and insecurity that drives a lot of academics.
Now, I meet young people that grew up in a Christian home. Maybe went to youth group, maybe, you know, Christian school. They go, and it seems like four years of college can dismantle. What mom and dad worked 18 years to instill. And oftentimes it's somewhat gleeful, secular, kind of.
Proselytizing professors that love to see the faith of conservative Christian young people destroyed. Um how do mom and dad maybe preemptively guard against that or prepare for that?
Well, you know, I think we're told that in Deuteronomy chapter six, verses six and seven, Alex, it's something that I two verses that I ponder quite often. Impress these commandments upon your children. As you walk down the road, as you prepare for bed, the Ordinariness of Those settings is what struck me at some point in time. And I'm convinced that what God is saying is, look. We should be talking about our children, talking to our children about God and creation and Jesus.
at every possible opportunity. This is not conversation that should be reserved for a moment here and a moment there on the way to church, on the way home from church. What did you think about the sermon type of question? God is saying, Look, in the most ordinary of circumstances, walking down the road, Getting ready for bed, we should be talking to our children about the things that really, really matter. And I think that's where.
We as a uh body of believers We as the body of Christ are um falling short. And I think that because we are falling short in that regard, our children, when they leave home, are vulnerable to the secular humanist process. Propaganda that they are almost inevitably going to encounter in college. And by the way, from all that I understand from talking with insiders, I'll call them. Even in many Christian universities.
In many Christian universities, for example, psychology is taught the same way it's taught in a secular university. Hey, another break and then another long segment. Stay tuned. The line of fire, Dr. Michael Brown.
It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.
Alex McFarland, big Dr. Michael Brown fan here, Alex McFarland.
So honored to sit in for two days. I'm here this afternoon. I'll be here tomorrow. And, folks, we're so blessed. We've got some great programming in the next hour.
In fact, exactly like an hour from now, we'll have Dr. James Dobson live on air tomorrow, Dr. David Jeremiah, and much, much more. I do want to give the website askdrbrown.com. And then, of course, Dr.
Brown is so prolific, and everything he does is just spot on, right on the money. There's videos, there's articles he's written. I encourage you to pray for the ministry and to follow Dr. Brown because he's a treasure trove of Christian truth, as is our in-studio guest right now, John Roseman. And, you know, in the spirit of full disclosure, we're friends.
I mean, we're colleagues, and I'm interviewing you, but we've been cultivating a friendship. I met you. I mean, I've known of you for a decade, but I met you at a home school convention in either Cincinnati or California. California. Yeah, and we began to talk.
That that was notable. And I'll throw a question your way. I met you, heard you speak. It was great to get acquainted because I had admired your work for some time. But that wa that very same home school convention in California, there were thousands of people there.
And there was I'll never forget a brother and sister who had seen me the year before. And they came back, they're like, oh, Mr. McFarlane, we loved you did your, what you'll hear your freshman year, preparing for college. We wanted to come back.
So I'm talking to this beautiful teenage brother and sister, and I look, and the girl's arm looked like a piece of raw meat. She was cutting herself. Oh my goodness. And Aye as said. Let me see that.
And she blushed. And I said, Let me see your arm. And I said, You're cutting, aren't you? She just begins to weep. And I said, Do your mom and dad know this?
And she shook her head, No. And I thought, Now, here, and of course, we found her parents, we prayed, and I said, Look, you know, your mom and dad need to know about this. Here we were, in, as you recall it. Thousands of people, Christians. I mean, and yet here's a kid.
Everything would say they're poised for success, and yet there were issues in her life, and she was engaged in self-mutilation. I followed up with that family. We tried to get some help for them. But, John, what's going on? I mean, our world just seems to be off the rails nowadays.
Well, you know, a child comes into the world. Prepped, if you will, probably a better term, but I'll use that prepped to be self-absorbed. Um that is the state. in which he is received into the world. And during his early years he is in fact treated, especially during the first two, as though he is everything with a capital E.
That He is everything and everything is about Him.
Okay.
And I think that the self-esteem movement in child rearing has solidified that. In other words, in previous generations, mine and prior generations. The parents understood that it was their job to reorient the child toward other people. To instil in the child a service mentality. To, you know, this is why we used to say to children 60 plus years ago.
Things that we no longer say, like you're acting too big for your britches, you better get down off that high horse, you must think the world revolves around you. Keep it in mind, you're just a little fish in a big pond. We don't talk that way to children anymore because we have lost that point of view. We are allowing children to remain in a self-absorbed state. And I believe that.
Self absorption Leads to an incredible state of emotional vulnerability. The flight or fight reaction kicks in. When you're totally self-absorbed, the world becomes a threatening place. And you deal with that either through bravado, aggression, or flight, And I believe that the cutting phenomenon is a logical reaction on the part of young children. To the high self-esteem culture that we have created for them over the past 40 to 50 years.
And we've seen the rise of Internet, Wi-Fi, technology that has really served to be a wedge between many relationships. Hasn't technology to a large degree separated us? Yeah, it's separated us. It's allowed us to, it's allowed young people to continue to stay wrapped in their own little personal bubbles. If you watch them in groups, one of the things that Strikes me and other people my age is that they'll be.
five teenagers standing around in a group and they won't be talking to each other. They'll all be looking at their phones, texting and so on and so forth. You watch them in any public place. They're not talking. And I think this is so detrimental to the spiritual health of the individual, to be able to remain the little boy or the little girl in a bubble.
Mhm. All of their lives, all of their childhoods. You know, in the time that we've got left, let's talk about. I know that, well, there's three things I'd like to do. I want to give some hope to parents, especially maybe young parents, that are thinking, what kind of world am I bringing my kids into and how are they going to navigate that?
I want your thoughts on the Orlando shooting, which this shooting at a gay bar. which comes after weeks and weeks and weeks of debate over transgender.
So let me just throw this out. Is there hope, in your view, of recovering a culture Where gender norms are defined and recognized. Boys are boys, girls are girls. You fall in love, boy meets girl, boy gets married, I mean, to girl. It seems like we've just so lost any sense.
of moral boundaries, gender lines. Is there any hope of recovery in your mind, John? Moral relativism that the serpent introduced into the world in the garden has been growing in strength ever since, for the last 5,000 or so years. It triumphed in America in the 1960s. We have been a postmodern morally relativistic culture ever since.
And the fact that we now. believe in gender relativism is simply an extension of what has been growing for 5,000 years and what triumphed in the sixties. I personally do not believe that we are going to recover And America that is unified in its point of view concerning anything. I think we are fractured and I think we will remain fractured. I think that Christians need to realize that We need to solidify the Christian community in America.
We need to bring it into one body, one point of view, one thought process, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, because this is our strength and our salvation until. The uh until Jesus comes back and and uh saves us all. Christian unity. Absolutely. And I tell my audiences, the only.
Uh the only people who have reason to hope Are Christians. The secularists, the humanists, the self-esteemis the atheists are lost. Oh, exactly.
Well, you know what? H. G.
Wells wrote in the early 20th century a book, A Short History of the World. And he said I've got the quote in my computer, but he said, as the 20th century began, man will go from triumph to triumph and will usher in a veritable utopia.
Now, three decades later After two World Wars, The Ovens of Auschwitz, The Rise of Communism, his last book, HG Wells wrote a book called The Mind at the End of Its Tether. How's that for pessimistic? Homo sapiens will not survive Homo sapiens. Mankind will destroy itself. Yeah.
Well, I mean, I, being a Christian, I don't believe that. I believe we are destroying what everything that previous generations built and gifted to us. And I think that we've been destroying it since the 60s. But like you said, his naturalism, there was no hope in that. Yeah, right.
Only in Christ do we really have hope, don't we? That's right. Absolutely, Alex. You and I know that. We were going to talk a little bit about Orlando if you wanted to.
I don't know if you want to or not, Still. I do. How would you sort of coach parents to talk to their children about this in the news? Wow, as the break comes on. Yeah, so we'll take that up when we come back.
You're listening to John Roseman, Alex McFarlane, sitting in on the Dr. Michael Brown Show, the line of fire. Don't go away. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution.
Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. The very grateful Alex McFarlane sitting in for Dr. Michael Brown today and tomorrow. Time fleets away, so I want to dig for gold here, John.
And I know you always bring it. How may parents talk to their kids about Orlando? All right, well, here is my general rules of thumb concerning talking to children about just about anything. and that is you tell children what they need to know when they need to know it. The operative word obviously being need.
So how How should parents talk to a child about what happened in Orlando? uh it depends on the child's age, the child's maturity, the child's intelligence, the child's uh, I'll say general state of emotional strength or vulnerability. And so I don't think that there is one general way of saying to children this is what happened in Orlando. In fact, I think, Alex, that there are some children Uh who should not be told what happened in Orlando. And if they ask what happened in Orlando because they have seen something through the media or heard something at school or wherever, What happened in Orlando, Mommy and Daddy?
I think it's perfectly okay to say a terrible thing happened in Orlando, and we prefer not to talk about terrible things like that here in our family. Suffice to say, it was terrible, it was evil, and that's all you need to know. Then there are other children. Older. more emotionally sturdy, that you can go into a longer, more involved, and I'll call it a fact based, for lack of a better phrase, explanation.
But again, children tell children what they need Yeah. When they need to know it. And what about for Christian parents weaving the gospel in to say, look, there's sin, there's evil, there's righteousness. Absolutely. I mean, there's a teachable moment in the news just about every day, isn't there?
Well, there absolutely is. And to draw your children away from the concerns of the everyday secular world into the gospel as often as possible. And again, this is Deuteronomy chapter 6, verses 6 and 7, is certainly something parents should be doing. Let's talk about the transgenderism, which is so much in the news. How do you advise parents to talk to their kids about that?
You're asking me hard questions.
Well, because you're a parenting expert. I know. I'm supposed to know everything.
Well, again, you tell children what they need to know when they need to know it. If children come home with questions about children, Transgenderism, I think it's acceptable at times to say there are very confused people in the world, and there are adults who are confusing children about these issues. We know what a boy God created male and female, He did not create male, female. And 20 other things in between. And so, as you just pointed out, this is a teachable moment.
It's a way of drawing children to the original creation story in Genesis 1 and 2, and talking about what that means, what that means through all historical time. And to let children know that it doesn't matter sometimes what a lot of people think. That's what matters is only what God says is the truth. Amen. John, did you see in the news last week the Oregon judge that ruled a woman doesn't have to identify as a female, but she can choose, quote, a non-binary gender designation.
You know, binaries to male and female. On the legal, I mean, we could talk about the legal implications of that because case law sets precedent. Give me your response to a society that we make up all these suffixes now of, you know. trans, que gender queer. Um it's not just male and female.
Um where do you see this going? And is there any hope of of a return to normalcy about gender? Uh no. Not in the secular world, I do not believe that there is any hope of return for them. And this is another reason why we Christians have to come together.
We have to come together on the critical issues of our day, and this is one of them. And what I think about this is this is just a replay of Genesis chapter 11, the Tower of Babel story, in modern times. That story was all about uh uh The arrogance of human beings believing that uh they were capable Auf uh of of establishing A relation, how should I put this? of achieving a Positioned for themselves in creation that they had no right to whatsoever, and that they were the deciders, they were the determiners. I think that this is what this is all about, Alex.
This you know I was talking with a seventeen year old girl who insisted that she was a boy, and she said to me that whether you're a boy or a girl is not a matter of biology. It's not a matter of what s your body looks like or is composed of, it's a matter of how you think. And I said, Well, then the same must be true of species.
So if you claim to be a boy and claim that that is correct, then it is perfectly valid. for someone else. two claim that he or she is a squirrel. or a dolphin, And that would have to be equally correct, would it not be? And she insisted that that was a different thing.
No, no, no, no, no, that's a different thing. And I said to her, no, child, if gender is fluid, then all biology is fluid.
So we can jump phyla, can't we? Oh, we can do it. We can become plants, trees.
Well, and do you know, interestingly, now this is true. I mean, this sounds like something we might make up. There was a thing about people who identify as dogs and they get in touch with their inner puppy. There was a gentleman in, I believe, Canada who claimed to be a dog. Yeah, I mean, there are articles, and people individually and in groups, they get together to live out their puppyhood.
Yeah, what we need to understand, Alex, is that truth is very, very threatening to these people. and they are going to do everything they can politically. to repress the truth. And that means they are going to do everything they can to silence us because we are the biggest threat there is to them. And, um Uh they know.
Deep down inside, that we are telling the truth, and nothing. Do you think so, really? Yeah, and when I say deep down inside, at a subliminal level, I'm convinced they know we're telling the truth. That what's written on their hearts is the same as what's written on ours. They can't escape that.
I was doing a QA at a Methodist University. And of course the conversation gravitated toward moral issues. Uh like half the kids on this front row were putting their middle finger to me. Uh as I spoke. Yeah.
John, you're a joy. Thank you for being on. We've got a great time. Appreciate it. Welcome to the Line of Fire Mics, Dr.
Alex McFarland. Okay.
It's time for the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and president of Fire School of Ministry. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH.
Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome back to the line of fire. Dr. Michael Brown, Alex McFarlane sitting in, guest hosting.
We're going to hear from Abraham Hamilton III in just a moment. He is an attorney with the American Family Association and recently met with the board members of Target.
Now, as you may or may not know, the American Family Association has a Target boycott because Target has really been playing into the hands of the transgender lobby. And the American Family Association said, hey, you know, let's protect children and little girls, little boys. Let's keep the bathrooms male and female. And of course, Target has really pushed back against that. And as a result, there are more than 1.3 million people that have signed the Pledge to not spend their discretionary dollars at Target.
And we're going to talk with Abraham Hamilton about that. And we're going to hear from his experience with the board members of Target just a week ago. But let me digress for just a moment. And I want to say a couple of things. One, I'm very, very thankful to Dr.
Brown for allowing me to be on the program today. It's really an honor. I am an evangelist at heart. I'm a Christian apologist. And if you don't know what apologetics is, it's the evidence for Christianity.
Christianity is under attack these days. And apologetics is the evidence why we believe what we believe.
Now, worldview is what we believe. Apologetics is why we believe it. I travel the country, I speak, I write books, got a brand new book out called Stand Strong America. But one of the things, let me give you a little vignette if I can, and it's a good segue for Attorney Hamilton in a moment. But a lot of people, even Christian people, will say, well, if you.
Stand up for traditional morality. If you talk about male and female, if you defend traditional marriage, that would violate the First Amendment.
Now, please listen very carefully. The First Amendment has been hijacked basically to imply that we are a thoroughly secular nation. And in defending morality, in no way does that mean that we can't stand up for moral truth. Stay tuned, we're going to come back and we'll talk about this farther. Can't do it.
Hey friends, this is Michael Brown. I want to encourage you to join our support team today. Become a torchbearer, one of our regular monthly supporters that enables us to broadcast the line of fire around America and around the world. And oh, every month we sell back into you in many, many different ways. Join our team, become a torchbearer.
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Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34 TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome back to the line of fire of the Dr. Michael Brown show, Alex McFarland, your guest host today.
And folks, you don't want to miss the voice that you're about to hear because in the next few moments, we're going to have a conversation with Abraham Hamilton III. He is public policy analyst for the American Family Association. He's an attorney. He's a thought leader in Christian worldview and the moral issues that we're facing, a member of the Louisiana State Bar, and just so many other things. things I could say.
But Attorney Hamilton, we are very honored to have you on the line of fire and thank you for your time. Oh, no problem. It's a pleasure to be here and it's an honor to be on the line of fire for sure.
Well, and you know, you and I are colleagues within the American Family Association. It's been our privilege to know each other a few months. You're kind of new to the team there, and tell me what all you do with AFA. I am new. I am the public policy analyst for AFA.
So it includes, I'm also a spokesperson for AFA.
So it includes a lot of interviews, television, radio, analyzing various policy nationwide. For example, House Bill 2 and... North Carolina, which is now law. as well as House Bill 1523 and the state of Mississippi and other policies nationwide, how they affect the nation as a whole, how they affect the church, and as well as to try to provide a baseline consideration for Christians across the country to be engaged in the culture.
Well, and you know, one of the things that we're going to talk about is your recent visit with the administration of Target.
Now, the American Family Association has a boycott going on of Target because of their support for the transgender agenda, and I want to talk about that. But for those just tuning in, we're talking with Abraham Hamilton III. He is a public policy analyst with the American Family Association. And, Abe, let me ask you this. Why should people care about what a corporation like Target is doing with the way they label the bathrooms in their stores?
Why should this be of interest to Americans? Absolutely. So, it's a two-fold reason. First and foremost, well, I won't say foremost, but I'll say point A, because they're not. one and two in terms of hierarchy and priority.
But point A, naturally speaking, Targets policy is dangerous. It allows for biological men to get access to women's restrooms and dressing and changing room facilities.
So it's not just in the restroom, but also in the changing rooms. Men who don't have to do or say anything. They can just access the facilities. I have a background in criminal law and there are more sexual predators in America than there are transgender individuals. Specifically, there are more registered sex offenders than there are transgender individuals.
That is an amazing reality because the American Family Association's position is that Target's policy would allow predators to use the cloak of their policy to gain access to create more victims. We've always said that our concern is not the transgender community. Our concern are the predators who will take advantage of the policy to create new victims. And additionally, which I think is a far more salient point, is that I believe that the very uh reality of the gospel is at risk because the scripture teaches us that god made them both to be male and female That comes from Genesis 1 and 2 foundationally. But if men continually are able to communicate that there's nothing unique or distinct distinct about manhood and womanhood, that literally is an attack on the authority of scripture.
Well, if Genesis 1 and 2 can be called into question, then so can Genesis 3, which is where we get the entrance of sin into the world, which produces death. And the only remedy for sin is Jesus Christ. Sin in its consequence is death.
So if Genesis 1 and 2, as it pertains to manhood and womanhood. and marriage are no longer applicable, then why should anyone believe in Genesis 3? And if Genesis 3 is no longer applicable, then why should anyone receive our Jesus? Wow, that's really powerful. And I want to talk about that.
I want to talk about the gospel, the implications for the gospel, because as you know, one of the things that we've witnessed in recent years is what I call a radical egalitarianism, where from the root word equal, where there are no differences. And this is really kind of an enforced egalitarianism where no distinctions between male and female will be recognized. Am I correct? Yeah, you're absolutely right. And the Lord is so specific in Scripture and said that he has entrusted his image into the The authentic and distinct.
distinct display of aut authentic masculinity and femininity.
So any attack on the distinction between manhood and womanhood really is an attack on the very image of God as he has chosen to display it in the created universe.
Well, when you sat down with Target, and I know there's a story online, folks, I would urge you to Google on One News Now, a wire service. Basically, Target's management stockholders said to you, the attorney representing AFA, basically Hey, nice talking to you. We don't care. Is that right? That is the translation of what they said.
So I can tell you, in gaining access to the shareholders' meeting, I spent time praying and I asked the Lord to guide me. And I know that Target anticipated me kind of getting on a moral soapbox, maybe even preaching or something in the shareholders' meeting. But I believe the Lord gave me. guidance as to how to go about communicating in a way that would resonate with the shareholders. And so the question that I asked specifically to Target CEO and the chairman of the board, Brian Cornell, was did Target conduct any uh cost-benefit analysis prior to announcing this misguided bathroom policy.
And I told them, as you know, over 1.3 million people have agreed to boycott your stores over. Did you conduct a cost-benefit analysis before announcing this? Surely the shareholders will want to know this information, right? Uh The answer was a non-answer. Brian Cornell went about providing a politically rehearsed.
Oh, by the way, you know, we believe in diversity. We believe in inclusion. We believe making our store a welcome place for all who would come here. And I said, Okay, but let to be clear. Are you telling us, the shareholders here, that you did not conduct a cost-benefit analysis?
He then punted the question to Catherine Smith, the executive VP and CFO. And she. basically provided a similar non-answer. She said, rest assured that we've looked at everything and from what we see there has been look at what she said, there has been no material impact.
Well, that wasn't my question. My question was, did they conduct a cost-benefit analysis beforehand? Exactly, exactly. And the answers, of course, they did not. The answers are no.
And they tried to sit me down. And interestingly, there were other shareholders in the room who came up to me afterwards and said, Mr. Hamilton, we heard your question. And we also heard that it didn't answer your question.
Well, and let me just say there has been huge material impact, hasn't there? Absolutely. What has been the impact on their stock value? Their stock value has dropped nearly 20 percent since they announced this misguided policy on April 19th.
Now to be fair, the retail businesses in a state of crises because Amazon is doing so well.
However, you have competitors like Walmart who is up. And Costco, who is down but just about a percent, whereas Target stock is down nearly 20%. You know, and I mean, that is a discernible decrease to the value of over $10 billion dropping in stock price. And even more so than just the general vacillations and vicissitudes of the economy up and down. I mean, that is a marked change that I think is directly attributable to the boycott.
Yes, absolutely. And I think you would have to be ignorant, blind, or just straight up deceitful. To not acknowledge that reality. But their communication from the very onset of the meeting is that their commitment to diversity and inclusion is based on their feelings, basically. And they've said, In not so many words, we know what you're here for, Abraham Hamilton III.
We know what the American Family Association stands for. We know what those 1.3 million people are petitioning to boycott for, but we don't care, and we're going to do this anyway. Folks, the website for the boycott, and I urge you to sign this, is afa.net, afa.net. And I guess if you Google it, you'll find it on the site, AFA.net. I would implore.
Everyone listening to sign the boycott. You might not be a Christian even, but you ought to care about America having a moral foundation. Because, you know, here's one thing: if we're going to throw out sexual ethics, why should we retain economic ethics? I mean, if there are no moral boundaries, no moral parameters that we have to recognize, male and female, you know, as Fox News Todd Starn says, you know, God made it clear just by, you know, the plumbing, not to be scatological or too graphic here, but just male and female biologically are different. But even if you don't care about the gospel, you should care about America having a moral foundation.
So, Abe, we've got to take a brief break. I want you to give a website that people can learn more about, not only AFA, but your role at AFA, and then we're going to, I want to come back for another segment with you.
Okay, absolutely. You go to afa.net. AFA.net. You can access the boycott, get any information you want to get. on myself and the ministry that we're doing here at the American Family Association, but it's critical that you join us in this stance because this supersedes politics.
This supersedes anything that normally would be prejudicial or race-based. This is common sense reality and we need all hands on it. Stay tuned, the line of fire with Dr. Michael Brown is back after this brief break. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr.
Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome back to the line of fire. Alex McFarland, your guest host here.
We're talking with Abraham Hamilton III, an attorney, public policy analyst for the American Family Association. Abe, what I'd like to do, we've only got a couple of minutes here, talk about the difference between morality and religion. Because as we talk about the gospel, and we understand that the blurring of gender lines really does make it harder to share the gospel, but somebody might say, well, hey, I'm not a Christian. You know, I don't care about the gospel. Let's talk about just the belief in morality that was sort of the predicate on which the founders built our nation and wrote the Declaration and Constitution.
Why is morality important? Morality is critically important because without having a baseline for morality, we really have no Uh means of Engaging in civilized society. I'll say it this way: some people say, Well, you can't legislate morality. I said, Well, That's a ridiculous statement because all law is a fundamental morality determination. You know, we are Criminalize theft based on morality.
You know, we criminalize murder based on morality. Those are moral judgments that are made. If a society jettison jettisons Morality. We simultaneously Invite chaos. There is no stability, there is no maintaining or any semblance of order without morality.
So even those who may not have a particular adherence to the Christian gospel. They certainly can understand. Um The notions and the need for morality. A perfect example is Maya Dillard Smith, the former director of the ACLU in the state of Georgia. This is a person who has got her undergraduate degree from Berkeley, a master's degree from Harvard, who worked at the Ninth Circuit U.S.
Court of Appeals and is really a self-described radical progressive. a person committed to electing Democrat women all over the country, you know, but she objected to the ACLU's support of the transgender restrooms. And why did she object?
Well, she had an experience. In California with her own two little elementary school-age daughters, she went into a restroom. and was followed by three men. Three men with deep voices all over six feet tall. She reported herself, her children, her daughters were immediately Frightened.
Mm-hmm. needl needling her with all types of questions that in her own words she was unprepared to answer. And so as a result, she found herself as she says, principally and philosophically no longer aligned with the ACLU. because of their advocacy and support for transgender bathroom issues. This is an example of a person who's not necessarily a a political conservative, but who understands the fundamental necessity of morality.
Sure. In the jeopardy that her own children are placed in when put in a restroom in a closed space where she's the only other adult in the room with three biological men and her two little daughters. And folks, we have to speak in the only language that corporate America really understands, and that's dollars and cents. And you might not think it would make a big difference, but it will make a difference. AFA is there at about 1.3 or 4 million signatures.
We're trying to get it to 2 million to try and say to Target and to corporate America: look, we citizens, there are some things that we're willing to fight for. There are some things that we are willing to really, really invest in, and that is the moral foundation that has been America's sustenance for 240 years. Abe, time fleets away. We've got to get you back on sometime. Any final thoughts about just where we are in the culture war and any ray of hope you can give people like myself that love God and country?
Absolutely. So I really believe we're at a place, and I said this a little while earlier. Um At the culmination of Acts chapter 6, 7, and 8, even though the Lord instructed the apostles to respond to the Great Commission, you find that they really didn't leave Jerusalem until after Stephen Stoning. It was the persecution that really. led ultimately to the facilitation of the Great Commission.
And I believe this moment we're in today is not synonymous, but not equivalent, but similar. in that um you know there have been encroachments on biblical morality all throughout america's history but now the agenda is turning to face our children. We have the president saying that Schools will be forced to allow boys into girls' restrooms. We have corporations telling us that unless we agree that men should be allowed in women's restrooms, we are bigots. and and and you know racist homophobes you know and we recognize that this is now trending on the safety of our children I believe that prescient focus could cause us to respond in a way that other issues Have not caused us to respond.
And the hope that I have is from 2 Kings chapter 6, one of many sources. But when. Uh the Syrian army was encroaching upon Elisha and the servant woke and saw the great hordes that they were facing. He was frightened. He was startled.
He was almost. catatonic in fear. And when the Lord When Elisha said, to him. They are more forced than are against us. And then he said, Lord, open this boy's eyes.
And I believe we're in a similar moment because we are standing on the right side that if we find ourselves not just just maneuvering in human ingenuity. but recognize that we have a host that supersedes what we see with our eyes. and that the Lord would open our eyes. We'll recognize that there are more for us than there are against us. Wow.
That is so inspiring. You know, I was on a conference call the other day with George Barna and some Christian leaders. And, you know, even still, nowadays we hear so much about the shrinking of the evangelical world, but they estimate, and these are conservative estimates, there are somewhere between 65 and 100 million adult Christians. And I don't mean nominal. I mean people that really have a relationship with Christ.
65 to 100 million Americans. And Abe, what could be the outcome if even a fraction of that demographic would say, you know what, I'm going to speak up, I'm going to stand up, I'm going to defend truth in our culture. What would that do? I believe we have a moment right now where the Lord has given us similar to David when he faced Goliath. You know, when David faced Goliath, the Lord so moved on his heart, he never acknowledged that he faced a giant.
You never find in scriptures where David recognizes Goliath as a giant. He just sees him as an uncircumcised Philistine who dared to find the armies of the Lord of hosts.
Well, what ended up happening in Israel once Goliath's head started rolling. Israel became a nation of giant slayers. And I believe that if a fraction of that 65 to 100 million of Americans stand up here on this moment, With Target, for example. And the world sees. how Target falls, you'll see other giants begin to fall.
Last thing I'll say is there was once a time, and I started my legal career in Houston, Texas, my office was right down the street from a baseball stadium called Enron Field. There was a time when no one thought Enron could ever be stopped as a corporation. Today they're no longer in business. Enron Field is now Mid at May Park. Wow.
Just as in uh David's case. And just as in David's day. Giants can still fall today. God bless you. Abraham Hamilton III from the American Family Association.
The website, again, afa.net. Sign that boycott. Speak. Make your voice heard. Let Target know that you care about morality.
And if we're willing to link arms and speak with a unified voice, we can make a difference. Abe, my brother, colleague, and friend, thank you for being on the line of fire. Thank you so much for having me, Alex. And it's such a blessing to be with the audience here at the Line of Fire. God bless you all.
Folks, we've got a break. Alex McFarland here, the line of fire with Dr. Michael Brown. Stay tuned. We're back after this.
Shake.
Next time change the world. It's the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH.
Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Alex McFarland here, sitting in for Dr. Brown. He's traveling to Australia.
I'm very honored to sit in for two days, and we appreciate his ministry, and we appreciate the opportunity to spend some time with everyone listening talking about very important issues in the news and culture. And I'm so honored right now to bring to the mic just one of the great leaders in the world, certainly for the last three, three and a half decades, along with names like Billy Graham and Chuck Coulson. Right up there alongside those great leaders has been Dr. James Dobson. And he's a best-selling author.
He was for a number of years on the staff of the University of Southern California School of Medicine, and then famously has been a consultant with presidents, world leaders, and has touched not only the Christian world, but just America in general in so many ways. And we are so grateful for. For Dr. Dobson being on, and we're going to hear about what he's doing with Family Talk and his radio and all of his ministries, and then we're going to talk about the news of the day.
So, Dr. Dobson, thank you so much for making time to be on the line of fire.
Well, Dr. McFarland, it's a pleasure to be on the program with you and give my regards to Dr. Brown when you see him.
Well, I shall. I really appreciate that. And please convey our love and regards to Shirley and your dear family.
So bring us up to speed. How's the ministry doing? How's family talk and all that you're involved in?
Well, the Lord is really blessing Family Talk. It's just really been a pleasure. And I told somebody this morning I'm having the time of my life, and that's not all bad. The ministry is now heard on 1,300 stations and We're doing everything we can to undergird and strengthen families.
So I'm very grateful for the opportunity to serve. Sure. Now, um you're not at Focus on the Family. You're at Family Talk. The website is myfamilytalk dot org, I believe it is.
Am I right on that website? Uh that's Yeah. Correct. No, I'm no longer at focus, and I haven't been for six years. I I really anxious for the world to find out that That I didn't retire and I am still alive and kicking, and we have our own ministry.
Six years ago, I was asked to leave the ministry, and I did so after 33 years at that wonderful organization. Uh the rumor is that I retired. That's one of the talking points that you hear. Uh but it isn't true. I started Family Talk the very next day after my tenure at focus on the family ended.
But Uh the Lord uh has uh Um Yeah, he had his hand in my back, Alex, and he was saying to me that the job is just not done yet. The family is still losing ground, and it's in grave condition, and I want you to continue to do what you can to help.
So here I am.
Well, God bless you. And, you know, there's an anointing on your life. And so I thank God that at a time when lesser men might have, you know, gone to the beach and sort of hung it up, you're out there preaching the gospel, defending the faith, defending the family, and being used to touch the world. I commend you.
Well I I love people. I love trying to help. families. I've been dedicated to that.
Some friend of mine told me the other day that when I was a junior in college, I said, The family is in trouble and we should do what we could to help. Yeah, I was twenty years old at the time, so I've been at this a long time, and as long as the Lord can use me, I'm available.
Well, you're amazing, brother. And I want to say to everyone listening, it has been my privilege to be at the Offices of Family Talk a number of times. It is a thriving ministry. It's a beehive of activity. And we'll tell you more about that.
We've got a break, folks. Don't go away. The line of fire is coming right back with our very special guest, Dr. James Dobson. Join Dr.
Michael Brown along with Messianic Jewish pastor Scott Volk for a unique behind-the-scenes tour of Israel, February 25th through March 6th, 2017. Space is limited, so we are accepting applications on a first-come, first-served basis. For more information on the trip and to secure your spot, please visit our website at askdrbrown.org and click on the Israel Tour banner or call our office at 704-782-3760. Yeah.
God of light, hear our cry, send the fire. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.
Yeah.
Alex McFarland here sitting in for Dr. Brown. Very honored to have on the line Dr. James Dobson of Family Talk, his website, drjamesdobson.org. And Dr.
Dobson, there's so much I want to talk with you about, and I appreciate you sharing about all the exciting things at Family Talk.
Now, your dear wife, Shirley, she is still with National Day of Prayer. She's been the chair for a number of years, I know.
Well, she's been the chair of the National Day of Prayer for twenty five years, Alex, and she just poured her life into it and uh in the uh month of May The National Day of Prayer occurred actually May fifth. And Um excuse me, surely uh took that occasion to resign.
So she stepped down from that responsibility after more than two decades, and she asked Ann Graham Lotts to succeed her. And that is what is happening now.
So I'm very proud of Shirley. She did a wonderful job. There were this year. Forty-seven thousand prairie vents in the United States alone And in 97 other countries.
So the Lord has really blessed her and used her.
Well, praise God. And what a testimony and how God has used her. And I'm excited to hear that Ann Graham Lotts will be succeeding her. That's a great choice. Talk to us about family talk.
And Dr. Dobson, what resources you and your team are producing to help families.
Well, I've written Two books for the family since I left focus on the family. And the first is Bringing Up Girls, and it accompanies Bringing Up Boys. I think I've written about 35 books now. And the most recent is called Your Legacy, The Greatest Gift. And it has to do with Um Winning your children to Christ, which I consider to be job one.
And parroting. If you don't get that job done, And if they die in an unrepentant state, Then you'll never see him again. How how's that? Put it in perspective. we really of all the other things we're trying to do, earn a living and things related to our health and all the vacations and all the things we get excited about, nothing comes close.
To that job of getting your children into the hands of Christ. And so. Uh that book, Your Legacy, I consider to be the centerpiece of all of my books because they've all pointed. in that direction, but this time I got it z. Wow.
That is so powerful and so true because if we miss Jesus, we've missed everything, haven't we? It's true for all of us. But if you look at what the scriptures have to say about parenting, Over and over again, we are commanded Uh as it says in uh Deuteronomy Six, and you might recall that the children of Israel had come out of Egypt and had. Had crossed through the wilderness, and most of them died in the process. And And in fact, Moses was getting ready uh to go to heaven Uh, himself, and uh the Lord had already told him he was going to die, so that was his last speech.
to the children of Israel. And you don't Um, you're not frivolous about your last words. You say the most important thing when that occurs.
So the book of Deuteronomy is his last speech. to the people that he had led. They were getting ready to go into the promised land. And he was warning them about what they needed to do when they got there, to not forget uh the Lord the Jehovah Uh and so he he started the His speech. on that occasion by talking uh to the people about their children.
And in Deuteronomy uh six says when you get up in the morning, when you lie down, when you go for a walk. Uh you write it on your door post of your house. You put it on your your forehead and on your wrist. And in other words, you talk about the Lord all day long so that your children have this heritage. They remember, they know who the Lord God is.
They know what He has done in the life of your family. And you simply must give that priority. And at the end of that comment, He says, this is a command. I command you this day to do it.
So that's a responsibility that we have And it is why I feel so strongly about this book.
Well said.
Well said.
Well, there's so much in the news nowadays that really provides a teachable moment for Christian parents just about every day. And Dr. Dobson, as you and I do this broadcast, the world is reeling from these shootings in Orlando. And how would you talk to parents about how they would discuss this with their children?
Well Alex, uh it's on everybody's mind today what happened uh down in Florida and I keep thinking about the the Christian mother and father. who lost a son or daughter. in that tragic event. They were murdered and some of those Christian parents didn't know I'm sure. There are fifty of them.
50 families. didn't know that their son or daughter were into the gate. and lesbian lifestyle. And they learned about Both shocking. Stories or bits of news at the same time, and my heart goes out to them and to all families who lost.
somebody in that that last Sunday, that terrible day. I it it's just tragic on so many levels, isn't it? It really is. And the trouble is it there's more to come. I haven't heard anybody say we can stop this.
I just don't believe it's possible. You know, uh when when a country forgets its cause and begins to move away from the scriptures and the things that we were warned about and told. that you can't hire enough policemen and enough FBI agents and enough military to protect you. because the whole country is infected By what's taking on Taking place today, and we really do need to be praying for a revival in this country because that's the only thing that'll bring us back from the brink.
Well Dr. Dobson, what what's happening in America? Things like Florida. I agree. We we brace ourselves because it's just becoming an almost daily occurrence.
And it just seems like we're we're lost at sea and don't know any way back. Uh what's what's your analysis of the America of twenty sixteen?
Well, I think what I was just saying gets very close to it. There if you just look at the things that are taking place, think of the Transgender issue there. Little children are being taught to choose whether they want to be a boy or a girl. And then what the President did when he virtually ordered all of the school officials in the country, all the public schools, to open those bathroom doors for Boys and girls, and then the locker rooms, in the showers. I I mean, that almost takes my breath away.
Not only that, it is wrong and evil and harmful to our children. Um but because it Uh is it It it is the evidence of a sickness, a wickedness in the country. that was not here. The world I grew up in is much different, and the world today has gone much farther into moral decline. And the world into which I was born, and many of the people who are listening to this program today.
And we really do need to be in prayer. Because there is no other way. There's no other answer to it.
Well well, a voice of moral and spiritual clarity won't come from anywhere but within the church, will it? Of course not. Of course not, and many people are hungry for it. They're waiting to hear some good news. And the word gospel means the good news.
And we have it. It's been given to us and it's precious. And we need to share that word with uh our fellow man and fellow woman that's out there. And we need to elect Officials who will do righteous things, and I'm afraid we don't have it now. Dr.
Dobson, hold on, we've got a break. Stay tuned, folks. The line of fire with Dr. James Dobson. Do not go away.
We'll be right back. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34 Truth. Here again is Dr.
Michael Brown. Alex McFarland here. So honored to be sitting in for Dr. Michael Brown. So honored to be speaking with Dr.
James Dobson. His website, drjamesdobson.org. I encourage everyone listening, just Google My Family Talk. You can hear Dr. Dobson throughout North America on the radio.
Incredible books, resources. They've got an app for mobile devices that's just tremendous. You can search his great library of content he is creating, drjamesdobson.org. And Dr. Dobson, thank you for holding.
We truly appreciate your time, and we don't have a lot of it. Talk to us about the election. And let me cue this up by saying this: I want your thoughts on the political landscape and the election coming up. But I was on a phone call with George Barna and a number of leaders a couple of weeks ago, and research indicates pastors. Are speaking out about political and moral issues less than they've done in about 10 or 15 years.
And I believe pastors have been entrusted with a great platform. I know you've used your platform to courageously speak for righteousness. What do you see the role of pastors and leaders in this political season? How incumbent is it on us to speak about these issues and just give us your take?
Well, Alex. First of all, let me thank you for having me on and for this program and my friendship with you. I've known you for a long time. You used to work for me a long time ago, so we go way back. I am very concerned about what's happening to our country and.
The church is the hope. of the future. And I just am discouraged by what you just reported That they're saying pastors are afraid to speak up. They're intimidated, apparently, and don't want to be. accused of being partisan or what have you.
Listen, if we don't have the church, we're in a world of hurt. that we've we've got to have men and women of faith who will stand up and call sin by its name and will speak for righteousness in the culture. I don't know if this next election is going to satisfy that need or not. Um I w Would like to tell you if you don't already know, because it's been in a lot of newspapers. and uh news media.
But I'm going next week to New York City to participate. with more than a thousand people in a conversation with Donald Trump. Uh and and the purpose is not to endorse him. It is to clarify what he stands for, what he believes. and what he will do as President.
And we've asked people not to come if they've already decided not to vote. or have decided not to vote for Donald Trump. If you're still questioning what to do, that is the place.
Now it's too late, it's filled. the capacity and at the Marriott Hotel in Washington in New York City. Uh but uh I'm one of the uh uh the s uh spokesman. uh for that event And I would really appreciate prayers. that we will accomplish what we came there to do.
If it's not there to endorse Donald Trump. What is it for It is a conversation. It is not an argument. It is not to stand up and scream, it's just to talk. Together, and it's made up of evangelicals and evangelical Catholics.
who want to come together to To answer the question, what do I do in November? Mm. Wow.
And I'll be there and I encourage people to pray for that. And, you know, I encourage people to pray for the candidates. You know, I can honestly say I pray for Hillary Clinton. I've prayed for President Obama. I'm praying for Mr.
Trump. Don't you think the church needs to really harness this power of intercession and do more praying than perhaps we've ever, ever done? As I said before, Alex, there's no other answer. I mean, we don't have the solutions. To the problems that we face as a nation.
We're at war. in the Middle East and it's coming to our shores. and there may be some hard times that are around the corner. For us, we've got to get on our knees before the Lord and ask Him to lead and guide. And and to let his A voice be heard and known.
And I ask for the ministers of the country too, that they'll have the courage to stand up. For righteousness, for the unborn child. We killed fifty-five million of them. And now a year ago, we completely redefined the institution of marriage. And I never thought that.
Well, I'm afraid I did think it would happen a long time ago, and I said so. But many people were shocked by that. And then what's at stake is the Supreme Court and all of the judiciary. including the appellate courts and the District courts There's no check and balance. on the on the judiciary today, do what they will do.
And um that That could virtually destroy this nation. if it comes to pass.
Well, so we have a lot to pray about. We do. And, you know, Dr. Dobson, I speak for millions of listeners when I just want to say thank you. You have been at the very forefront, proclaiming truth, winning the lost, equipping the saved for a long time.
And I believe you're doing your best work right now. Family Talk. And give us that website again for Family Talk and how they can find their station with your program in their city. All right. I don't know.
I don't use it myself. It's that I've got my colleague here. Dr. James Thompson. Dot org.
Yes. And we are also on Facebook We have three point eight million people following us on Facebook.
So uh there's a lot content there that's available to people. 3 million plus on Facebook. Dr. Dobson, the time is just about out. Thank you so much.
We love you. We thank God for you. And you just keep on keeping on. You're a great friend and brother. Give my regards to your family and come see us again.
Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Well, folks, on the line of fire, you've been listening to Dr. James Dobson of Family Talk. He's amazing.
I encourage you to read his books, listen to his radio show, and support his ministry, and then do what you can do to be a voice of truth in this culture. You know, everything Dr. Dobson said is true: that we need a revival, we need an awakening, and it's not going to come from anywhere but within the Family of God.
Now, listen carefully, my friends. In John 17, verse 21, Christ is praying his high priestly prayer. He's on his way to the cross, and he prays in verse 21. He says, Father, that they all may be one, O NE One, that the world may believe thou has sent me. There is power in unity.
And folks, we'll never get a perfect candidate, but we've got to do what we can do to vote, to persuade, to speak up. and to prevent evil.
So do what you can do. We'll see you tomorrow on the line of fire. Uh
