Healing the Mother Wound

This is the Truth Network. Kingdom Pursuits, where you hear from ordinary people instilled with an extraordinary passion. Together we explore the stories of men and women who take what they love and let God turn their passion into kingdom pursuits.

Now, live from the Truth Booth, your host, Robbie Dilmore.

Well, here we are, just a few weeks from Mother's Day, and how amazing God's timing is sometimes. It just blows me away. We are so honored to have with us today Phyllis Mantelli. Unmothered No More. She wrote that book a lot about this idea of a mother wound.

I don't know if you ever heard that. It's an amazing opportunity, I think, to let Christ heal us from something we may not be aware is um Lurking in our past, but healing the power of walking through your own childhood story. Welcome, Phyllis. Thank you. Great to be here.

Yeah, isn't it? And so. I I have noticed that quite often behind a title like that, there there's a story. Oh, there's the story. Yeah.

So this is actually my second book. This is more of a training book through the coaching that I've gotten certified for trauma informed coaching. My first book was Unmothered Life with a Mom Who Couldn't Love Me. And it goes through my it's a memoir of how I grew up with a very dysfunctional, toxic mom. She was bipolar, suspected bipolar.

She was alcoholic, very violent. I grew up in a pretty violent home life. And so Yeah, just trying to figure out like how to grow out of that and then at the same time trying to love a mom that's really, really difficult to love. That's so beautiful. Um It r it really is.

And and and you know, when you think about The way that God made us to reflect Himself, and women reflect this idea of compassion and what mothers were supposed to be designed by, as God has it. And I had a fascinating experience. I do a podcast called Robbie and the Rabbi with a wonderful, very, very kosher rabbi in Jerusalem. And we study Hebrew together, which I happen to love that language. But anyway, I was in this horrible car accident about a month ago, three weeks ago.

And um I had some pretty severe injuries. And my rabbi friend says, Well, Robbie, what's your mother's name? And I said, Well, my mother's name was Marge.

Well, When we pray for people that are going through some type of healing process, we always invoke their mother's name. Because that's the compassionate side of God. Right? And he did that for my wife. He said, as well, he said, what's your wife's mother's name?

And so when he prayed immediately following, you know, it's Robbie, son of Marge. And and and Tammy, son of I mean, daughter of Neldon, I thought How fascinating is that that they that they would invoke that? Um But that was what we were supposed to have. Unfortunately, like I I am assuming you has your own children? Yes, I have.

I'm a grandmother of four. Of course.

So that is part of why I can really speak on this subject is that I have broken the generational dysfunction in that. And so Lay it. But oh thing. Can you kind of lead us a little bit into Um what a what a mother wound might what what the symptoms might be, what that feels like. Yeah, well I think you know you kind of named it.

Well, it's funny that you were saying that this rabbi was talking about son of, mother of. That's very biblical, right? That's how we read it in the Old Testament as you know them by their families. And I think, you know, the mother wound, what happens is when you grow up with a mom that and you know, if you dig deeper, there's always more trauma behind that. You know, the parents themselves have gone through stuff and unfortunately don't know how to.

Make that better or choose not to. And so, you know, we grow up thinking: well, your mom is supposed to be this caring, loving, gentle. Safe person, but what happens when you grow up with a parent that is struggling that isn't that safe, loving, gentle person? And so everything that you learn. And we didn't grow up.

And so, um, You know, it was very confusing to me. I had a very weird relationship of thinking of God, that he was punishing me. Um that I must not be chosen or good enough because why would I have these parents that were violent with each other and then not great with us?

So, um I think you grow up wondering like, why did I get the shortstick, basically? And so it's there are certain things you look at when you look at other family members when you're growing up, or look at other friends' families. You notice the changes. You start noticing, because it it's pretty normal for you if you grow up in chaos, that just becomes your normal. But when you start looking outside, you notice, like, wow, that mom was really loving and she was caring, and she didn't yell at her child when something went wrong.

she gives hugs freely and those kind of things. And and then, you know, you add substance abuse and all kinds of other things to that and it just becomes a mixed bag.

So that's, you know, you can tell when you when you're growing up with someone that Really isn't, I guess what you could say, the norm if that's there isn't really a perfect family, but like. you notice when there's things that are a little off. Yes.

So Darren we're co-hosted today with Darren Kuhn, a good friend of mine who's also very much in this idea of ministry we do together in reconciliation of father wounds. And so what does that stir in you, Darren, as you hear that? Um I my heart breaks. Um For not just Mm-hmm. Phyllis, but for all of the people I I uh I've actually thought about doing a talk.

On the mother wound. to a bunch of guys because I know so many men Who are fatherless, and we do work with a lot of fatherless men or men whose fathers were very passive or absent or whatever. But When mom has to Where Both of the sets of pants, so to speak, in the relationship for their children. that's a very stressful, hard thing and and they're human. And so they do things to comfort their brokenness.

that ends up compounding you know, the way they treat their kids. And Um I have some experience with that. Uh I have a daughter who has some experience with that. And uh I sat in a room with about five hundred of the most masculine men I've spent time with several years ago out in Colorado, while a lady named Stacy Eldridge gave a talk on the mother wound and basically on behalf of the mothers of all of those men. ask them for forgiveness.

and prayed over them. and I was completely and totally blown away. At The response of those men. And I have to tell you, when Stacey walked up there, I love Stacey. I love John, her husband.

But I was like, oh, I'm not into that. I don't know that I want to sit here for an hour and. listen to Stacey talk about the mother wound, although I have some mother wounds. And But I was completely blown away. God did amazing things, and I I would venture to say that four hundred out of those five hundred men were on their knees crying and praying, and um asking God to help them forgive their mothers.

um and accepting her request through this surrogate mother in Stacy, It was one of the most amazing things I've ever seen in my life. And it. I have begun to understand some of my woundedness that Came from my mom. and the ways that she treated me at times, and my mom was extremely compassionate and loving sometimes. Most of the time, and other times, a little bit scary.

And so, um. And I, you know, unfortunately passed that on to my kids until I began to understand that and start trying to break that. generational curse as well. And so man do I have a lot of um A lot to think about there.

So we again, we're going to be back with Phyllis and her Unmothered No More book. You can see this is a critical thing for all of us to get our hearts back and to operate fully with our own children and and you know Begin the forgiveness process of a lot that's going on there.

So I'm excited about this with Phyllis. And we got Fonda coming up a little bit. And then we're going to, of course, play some shenanigans here shortly.

So stay tuned. A whole lot coming up. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion. And uses it to build the kingdom.

And today we're so honored, really, to have with us Phyllis Mantelli and Her book, Unmothered No More, The Healing Power of Walking Through Your Own Childhood Story. Um which is amazing how you can get your heart back through that. And we got a lot on that. We also have Fonda Bryant. And Fonda, you've got a big event coming up.

So Fonda, what you got for us? Oh, yeah, good morning, and thank you for always having me. I have a motorcycle rod, a green ribbon rod. Coming up next Saturday with Harley Davidson. And you don't have to have a Harley.

You don't have to even ride. I'm hoping Jerry's going to come out and ride because I've seen his Harley. Yeah, it's different. Yeah, Monday, I mean, May 1st is the start of Mental Health Awareness Month. And I always like to bring awareness to months.

And even though mental health is 365-24-7, I like to, it gives us an opportunity to bring even more awareness.

So the motorcycle ride is going to start. Concord, right near Speedway Harley-Davidson. I'll have a sign out there. And then they're going to ride CMPD, the very professional motorcycle unit. They're going to lead the ride.

And we're going to ride from Concord to Independence Harley-Davidson. And then in Matthews, and then when we get there, there are going to be prizes, food, music, all kinds of stuff. And I'm just very proud to team up with Harley-Davidson. It's a great event, and it gives people the opportunity because mental health is not, you know, people always look at mental health or suicide prevention as doom and gloom, but you can have events to really enlighten and encourage people and educate people.

So my ride is one of those ways to do that.

So I'm really excited about it. Hopefully the rain.

Well hold up. Fonda, how do people get connected to that? Is there a website or How would they get tickets? Yeah, they can, like I said, it's going to, because the money raised is going to go towards my nonprofit, so it's $30.

So it's $20 for the rider and $10 for the person on the back. And so if you go to my website, Wellness Action Recovery, the flyer is on there, but people can also call me just as well. And my number is 704. 807-3267.

So that's 704-807-3267. Or they can go to my website, wellnessactionrecovery.org, go to the events page, and they will see it. My phone numbers on there and information as well. But I'm hoping a lot of people are going to come out and we'll have a beautiful day for people to get out and ride and have some fun and get educated on mental health, suicide prevention, and also resources that can help people and their families.

So, wellnessactionrecovery.org. Yeah.

Well, thank you, Fonda. That's awesome. I so admire all the work you do in that area. And it's so helpful. God bless you.

Thank you. All right. Bye-bye.

So. Bye. Grateful for Fonda and what she's doing, opportunity to support that. And so getting back with Phyllis. Forgiveness is a gigantic part.

Yeah.

You know, as Darren was going through that, and I was thinking about your own ministry, I would imagine. that this isn't about indicting our mothers, right? Right, I think that's really important. And I loved what Darren said, too. I want to just say.

I Really hope that more men can step up and talk about this subject too, because I have had some men reach out to me and say, I do have a mother wound and it's a completely different kind of conversation. If more men could be that mouthpiece for the other men to step up, I think that would help also. But yeah, the forgiveness component. is very layered and it's um it's tough because I will say I ended up taking care of my mom. Um Over the years, for about 16 years before she passed from dementia, and there were broken hips and You know, lots of other little things that we had to do while at the same time I was raising my girls.

And I was conflicted. And so part of my book is. showing women that um We have to set boundaries. This isn't just I think people think forgiveness is just like forget all, go back, like be loving. I get really conflicted with the when people pull out verses of like honoring your mother and father.

It's like, yes, we do that, but also God also doesn't like abuse. And so he's not asking you to step into something that could be potentially dangerous. Like some mothers are very, very dangerous. I have had a lot of clients where the situations were volatile.

So how do you find a forgiveness bent on that?

So forgiveness is really About for yourself to say, like, I, you know, we don't have all the answers of why some of these things happen and how it began, but what we can do is sit with that and protect ourselves and our future families and give thanks to, if nothing else, thank you for giving birth to me, and I forgive you. I mouthed those words to my mother on her deathbed. They told me in the nursing home she would be probably passing away within the next 24 hours. And there was a sense of relief, if I'm being honest, because she She was so difficult to be around. But also it was amazing because there was also this sense of loss in Sadness that I wasn't expecting.

And I whispered those words to her the night before she passed. I said, I'm okay now. I forgive you, and you can go. It's all right. And I think just you know being able to find that emotion within yourself It's okay no matter what the outcome, like I can learn to forgive to open my heart so that I can raise my kids in a more gentle posture.

So What you're describing, um, interestingly in not coincidentally, I'm sure. Is my wife had a phenomenally difficult relationship with her mother, which was. She was violently abusive when she was younger. violently abusive and And then um because of substance abuse and the same kind of thing it sounds like with your mom You know, her life fell apart. hugely and we ended up taking care of her for probably the last ten years of her life.

Which led to, in my wife's case, Um, and I think she would tell you uh what they c I think it's called complicated grief. There's a word for the type of grief where you're like you said, you're trying you you you can hardly wait for the day that this is over with, but by the same token, you don't want it to be over with because it's your mother. And and my wife really, really, really um has struggled with that. And and and there's a little bombshell that that my family did not expect. For my wife to go into this really difficult grief process over her mother, which we all.

Had long since run out of patience for. I mean, I love my mother-in-law, I do, but I mean, it was difficult because she was a very difficult person. And but by the same token, Um You know, God showed up for her. God showed up for my wife. But I think that's got to be a huge part of your ministry to people that have gone through what you went through there because it's really difficult.

Yeah.

Well, I became certified as a trauma informed, spirit filled, God ordained trauma coach with Freedom Movement in 2023. And now I'm going through Another certification for story work. And this is really where my passion and what I know God has put me on this earth for. Is that when we go through that? What you're describing is trauma, huge T trauma.

we have these mixed feelings. And I think one of the things that we always do is Is we say, well, this and this happened, but you know, they were pretty good parents, but this and this happened. And it's like, we're not vilifying the parents. We're saying, name the harm that has been done to you. That is so important because you can't get to the healing of your own heart, and that's not where God wants you to stay.

He wants you to go down into the pit so that you can get real with your emotions, say what happened, name it, claim it, and then he's like, okay, now we're going to do the deep work, and now we're going to pull you out of the pit. This is why a lot of what happened to me in my 20s is even though I hated watching what my mom did with her life, I copied the same thing. I started doing the same kind of you know, um destructive behaviors. And Things that I had grown up watching, and it I just came to a point where I just had to say, Am I going to become my mom too, or am I going to be a different person? And so, you have to really start digging through those emotions, and so I think that.

people forget that, you know, God doesn't when he healed, people say, oh, I'm healed from that, I don't think about it. And I'm like, well, your body still feels it. And somebody could trigger by saying something or doing something, it could bring you back to that moment. Unless you know what that moment is about and you've worked through it, then you're able to go, oh, I know what this is. This is familiar.

Okay, let me get curious about that. And let me work through that so that I can be a whole person. Not hiding behind the veil of Christianity of saying, I mean, there's a lot of women that sit at small groups and in church that are really hurting from past. things with their moms. But they think that they're less of a Christian if they talk about it.

And I'm saying that's what the enemy wants you to do, is to keep that a secret, to keep you binded into these silent agreements that are not helping you live the fullest life. What you need to do is share that with somebody trusted. to say, this is what is on my heart, and I need time to grieve this. Don't be afraid of grief. We can't get to the holy instantly.

We have to go through the grief. It's where God does his best work, and then you can come out the other side. And you can actually be more of an open person and be able to help other people too. It it I love your story. I'm sitting here thinking, wow, I really need to.

Get Phyllis and my daughter Danisha kind of hooked up together because there's some similarities there. Um, but man, thank you so much, Phyllis. This has been really good. Are you still doing a podcast? I am.

Good. The Unmothered Podcast. All right. Good. So we're going to be back with a little shenanigans and a whole lot of fun with Phyllis in studying these ways that we can get our hearts back.

From our motherland, we'll be right back with a whole lot more Kingdom Pursuits. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion. And uses it to build the kingdom. And oh, I love Phyllis Mantelli's passion for Unmothered No More, the healing power of walking through your own childhood story.

We're going to get to that, but you know, it's. Kingdom Pursuits. And so speaking of mothers, this close to Mother's Day. Come now. Oh yes it is.

Yeah.

And As you might guess, we have a few mothers. ideas to run by you.

So Are you ready, Nick, for this? I know Darren is, and we've we've briefed Phyllis.

So speaking of mothers, what do you call a mother cow that just gave birth? What do you call a mother cow that just gave birth? Tired. That's true. But also decaffeinated.

Which made her more tired, just saying, yeah, whatever. Uh Well I personally loved this one. I think my mother used it on me. Why do moms feel the need to tell such bad jokes? Why do moms feel the need to tell such bad jokes?

Oh no.

Okay. Because they want to help you feel Grown up. Yeah.

What uh Wait, groan. The operating word is groan. Groan is the key. And I know this one will get repeated by every little kid that hears it. Um.

How much how do moms make a tissue dance? How do moms make a tissue dance? You may have heard this one. They blessed them? Bless you?

They blessed them? That's good. I like it. They put a little boogie in it. Yes.

My eight-year-old grandson will love it. Oh, I know that. That's right.

So, and of course, you know. I know my mother would use this one, why are computers so smart? Does that have a motherboard? Yeah, right. They listen to their motherboard.

That's right.

That's right.

And this one just really really tickled me earlier today. I laughed for five minutes over this joke. Why is it so hard for pirates to call their mom? Yeah.

Uh I don't know. Yeah, they left their phone off the hook. And of course I have to round out the whole list of these regular ones with this one. Why did the mommy cat want to go bowling on Mother's Day? Oh, why did the bomby cat want to go bowling?

on Mother's Day. I don't know. This one's pretty easy actually. Have you got it? She was an alley cat.

Oh, an alley cat. All right, with all that said, we have a riddle chance for you to call in and win today. And I'm excited to hear who can do this one.

So Here's the riddle: that you can call in Wynn at 866-348-7884. 866-348-7884. Tell us which mother in the Bible while praying. Looked like she was on Cloud Vine. Huh.

Which mother in the Bible? While praying, looked like she was on. Cloud Vine. 866-348. 7884.

She looked that way. But Perhaps not. 866-348-7884. And if they can guess that riddle, Nick, tell them what they can win. Absolutely.

Yes, I've been winning a prize from my Kingdom Pursuits Prize vault. We have action Bibles. We have back scratchers. Date the Word books. If you know the answer to Robbie's riddles, give us a call 866-348-7884-866-34 Truth.

Yeah, we're currently stocking up on the legendary gospel back scratchers, only available through Kingdom Pursuits, where you get. All the beads of, you know, the red bead, the green bead, so you can share the gospel while scratching somebody's back. Only, only available by entering our riddles at 866-348-7. I do love them. 866-348-7884.

And it looks like, oh, somebody's already may have guessed this one. 866-34Truth.

So getting back to Phyllis. In your book, Unmothered No More, you say, you know, it's a follow-up to your other book, and this one is, the goal of this one is what?

So, the goal of this second book is more of a self-help, like teachable book. Walking them through the first book was a memoir, and it just kind of walked through my life story and. How I came out of, well, I found God at 35 years old when I was pregnant with my second daughter. And so it walks through a whole journey of that, of how God just brought me out of all of the darkness, and then really being able to love my mom. People read that book.

It's about six years old now. They said, well, what do we do now? Like, we know we are we recognize your story. We are your story, but what how did you do it? Like, give us a step by step.

So that's why I went into the coaching process too. And I realized that a lot of people couldn't afford coaching services. And so I just started writing down. I had a program, a six-week program, I do have it. Called Patience and Grace, and it's a mother-daughter wound coaching session, six-week session.

And I thought, well, maybe I could pull that plus some of the things I've learned from my trauma coaching. to put into a book form so that people could get a synopsis of that. in a less expensive way, and it's not as intense because it's not working with them one on one, but it gives them a place to start so they can start making these changes in their life to really, you know, find a placement of how they can handle their moms and also if there's a a place where they need to work on certain situations that they find that they're falling into patterns that they don't like, that were like their mom and they don't want to be that way. Just those kind of things in this book. Phyllis, how would you what would you say to the to the mom that's listening to you right now that still has kids?

And she realizes I am The Mother Wounder. Yeah.

Well, chances are she probably is because I know I had to go back and talk to my older daughters and apologize and say I kind of did some things wrong because of my own trauma wound and I didn't realize it at the time. But I always tell people, it's never too late. Do that. And so you have to, one, work on yourself. And then, two, I'm a big believer in going and having.

honest conversations with your children age appropriate wise. but letting them know like, hey, mommy's going to be doing some things differently. I'm not going to react to certain things. And I just want to apologize if I scared you in this situation or if I overreacted or something like that. Whatever the situation is, you always have a place to go to And come back to restoration.

And also, I would say, before you react, I always love the power of a pause. sit back and realize what's happening in my body right now. Why am I reacting so fiercely in this moment? Or opposite, why am I shutting down in this moment? Really asking those questions before you react to your children is super important.

And I would just really, really encourage to get a coach or a therapist or whatever it is that you feel that you need. Talk to somebody and tell them I'm having these intense feelings. And I don't know why. I think I know where it came from, but I really need to work through these things. That's so beautiful.

I just actually went and bought the book. I'm like, you sold me. Unmothered no more. Easy. Go to Amazon 1999.

You can have it on your way before you think about it. Because I'm like, man. Man, what a helpful, helpful thing. And hopefully it'll help our family because I know it's a generational thing that's going to keep going on and on. But meanwhile, man, everybody, we got calls on my riddle.

So. We got Mrs. Peaches, we got Minnie, and we got Ramona, and all of you. I would love, love, love if you would please hang on, because I want to get to all of you. Even if the other person gets it, that doesn't mean I don't want your answer.

I definitely want you. To get a chance to win whatever we always are giving away at Kingdom Pursuits. And so, Mrs. Peaches, Minnie, and Ramona, as well as Phyllis, when we come back on Kingdom Pursuits, we're going to find out which mother in the Bible, while praying, looked like she was on Cloud Vine. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com.

Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion. And uses it to build the kingdom. And how fun right now! We not only have Phyllis Mattely, we have Mrs. Peaches, we have Minnie and Ramona all on the line at the same time.

It sounds like somebody may have their radio on in the background, and you might want to turn that off so that we can. Do this, but I just thought the best thing to do was since Mrs. Peaches called first, I'm going to go to her first. But Minnie and Ramona, you're with us now, so please stay with us, okay?

So, Mrs. Peaches. Which mother in the Bible? Yeah, which mother in the Bible, while praying, looked like she was on Cloud Vine. They thought she was drunk.

She was Hannah. Mm. And looks at the literally. And I relate to that story because when I was. In the military, the OBGUI and doctor told me I never have children.

And I said to myself, not him, You don't know the God that I know.

So I went into the prayer room at our church. and fasted and prayed for The chow. And that chow at that time I forgot I pray. This child Walked through the door. It blew my mind.

And I didn't know. I said, Lord, what's wrong with that baby? Whose baby is that? When my daughter got five years old, that was that baby that came through that door. Last week.

Yeah, that is sweet.

So, while you're holding on, Miss Peaches, because you're you won and you're gonna get it. We got Minnie is in Ohio, and we still got Ramona, too, but I want to talk to Minnie right now.

So, Minnie. Tell me your thoughts. Yeah, it was Hannah. You're right, it was Hannah. And so, what what in that story touched you?

She tried and tried to have a baby and it wasn't working for her, so she was freaking out. And and it was the same to not have a child back then those days, so Um She just wanted so bad she promised him to God if he gave her a child and then she wanted to have more children after she gave him to God.

So that was pretty wonderful. Yeah, and he he gave her something special, right?

Something really, really, really special. I'm so glad you called in, Minnie, to share that. And how about you, Ramona? How about you, Ramona? I'm sorry.

Hello, Robbie. How are you?

Well, doing pretty good. Considering our circumstances, But I won't elaborate. I just want to say that you are an amazing person. for what you've been through and And yet you're still Carrying on. Oh, I wouldn't know how did you miss out on all this fun.

And believe me, it's been fun today.

So, Ramona, how can we pray for you? It sounds like you have some circumstances.

Well, just just praise it. My husband and I will have patience to to get through this phase in our life. Uh it's just uh Uh a a new adventure. And the Lord is in all of it. And we're just trusting him.

Well, let's do that. Boys, when we got us all in the line, let's pray. Lord, thank you so much for Ramona. And I thank you for the sweet, sweet spirit I hear in all the ladies that are with us today. And um The whole idea of motherhood and compassion, and what you're teaching us all through this show.

Lord, I pray that you would guide Ramona and her husband through this season, that they would, in humility, see the door that opens. to your heart and what's going on, and that you would guide and direct them in in the in the in what it is that you have for them in this season. Lord, I know that you love them. I know you love the people that are involved and what she's struggling with, and I just pray that you would be in the midst of it and you would um Make a way where there seems to be not one right this minute. Again, I thank you for Ramona.

I thank you for many Mrs. Peaches. And I thank you for Phyllis. God bless you all. Oh, can I give my answer to the question?

It she was not wobbly in her mumbling. Of course, her name was Hannah, the mother of the Yeah. Or Samuel, sorry. Yeah, it's beautiful. If you go to Shiloh in Israel, and I was there twice last year.

That's where she prayed that prayer. And you can stand exactly where Hannah prayed it. And sh they have her prayer right there, um, right where you can tell where the tabernacle sat. It's it's an amazing place. And I can't think of that place without thinking of Hannah.

And what all her family meant to that is quite a story. But thank you all so much. God bless you. You guys have an amazing Mother's Day, okay? Thank you.

Thank you. Yes, thank you. God bless.

So Phyllis, we only got a couple more minutes. You better give our listeners one last thought to get them to buy this book and then review it for you and make it happen. Yeah.

Well, I just do encourage everyone to feel free to purchase this book if something touched your heart today and or if your heart is pounding fast and you're realizing like I think this is my story, then you definitely I would encourage them to buy both the books So you could read the memoir first and then the teaching. um book and if anyone um Had any questions about how to get in touch with me, they can reach me on my website, which is phyllismantelli.com. That's absolutely beautiful. Again, the book is Unmothered No More: The Healing Power of Walking Through Your Childhood Story. Unmothered.

No more. And again, by doing that. Like, man, this would be a good thing to get to a friend that maybe you know that's going through something like this. You know the story, or maybe somebody in your own family, I was thinking, man. This thing is awesome.

Unmothered, no more. It's right there at Amazon, $19. You can have one on the way. Thank you, Darren, for being with us. Thank you for being with us, Phyllis.

And then go back and rate it. It means the world to authors to have your feedback.

So, thank you, guys. Thank you, Darren. You're welcome. Thank you. And thank you for listening to the Truth Network.

It means the world to us that you join us every Saturday. Golly.

So excited to be with you again.

Alrighty, all good. Ms. Peaches, stay on hold. I'm going to give you information real quick. Miss Phyllis, thank you so much for being a part of our show today.

I will be making this show into a podcast in about an hour or two. It's called Kingdom Pursuits, anywhere you get your podcast from, and it'll be right there, okay? Perfect. Thank you. All right.

Thank you. Bye-bye.

Alright, MS Peaches, you still there? All right, thank you so much for holding on.

Alright, thank you so much, Pete and Pizza, for holding on. Let me get your. Actually, let me switch over to the phone so I can get your information real quick, okay?

Okay. And Miss Minnie, I see you're on the line. Just stay on hold. I'm going to get right with you as well.