We go on three, two, and one. Good morning. This is Golf with Jay Delsing. I'm your host, Jay. I'm sitting down this morning with Mark McGuire. Mark, thanks so much for joining me this morning. Jay, you're welcome.
Thanks for asking me to be on your show. Oh my gosh, I look back. I can vividly remember the home run chase of 98. Your accomplishments go on and on. But let's go back because this is kind of a special time. I know you just had your second son drafted in Major League Baseball.
Talk a little bit about that, if you like. And what is it like to be drafted in MLB? Well, I mean, obviously it's a dream come true.
I mean, go back, first of all, to start with me. It's like, you know, drafted in 1981 out of high school as a pitcher by the Montreal Expos. And they offered me, in the eighth round, and they offered me a grand total of $8,500. And at the time I had a scholarship at the USC. And I remember my dad saying, well, if we figured it was $10,000 a year to go to USC at that time, we figured if they came up to around $40,000, I would sign and go pitch for the Montreal Expos.
Well, they didn't, they couldn't, they said they couldn't budge off the $8,500. So I ended up going to college and, you know, long story short, I ended up becoming a hitter anyways. And then I was drafted in the first round in 1984 by the Oakland A's. And I turned that into like, I think it was close to $150,000 signing books.
And that was a lot back in 1984. And then fast forward close to 40 years later, my son Mason out of high school was drafted in the eighth round a month ago by the Chicago Cubs. And he is a pitcher.
He stands 6'4", 195, and got a very live arm. And he is absolutely just a young kid that is ready to blossom. And I couldn't be happier for him. And again, another dream come true, something he's been working very hard at. You know, ever since I got back into the game and coaching back in 2010, my boys, both my boys, Max, who's 19, who's going to be entering the University of San Diego, he just transferred from Oklahoma this last September, or excuse me, this last August. So anyway, so he is going to be there at the University of San Diego.
So, you know, it's just one of those great things where they just love the game of baseball and things that worked out. A lot of hard work, a lot of, you know, the thing is, I walked away from my coaching job down in San Diego, you know, after the 2018 season. And I had another year left on the contract. And I came to a point in time where I said, you know, Max was entering his sophomore year, Mason was entering his freshman year. And I said, you know what? I need to be there with him.
My wife, I don't know if anyone knows, but I have triplet girls that just turned 12 on June 1st. So my wife being at home and I'm being on the road as a coach, you're gone a lot more than you are as a player from the house. I needed to be around and watch my boys grow and be there. But the one thing I did tell them, I said, listen, if I decide to walk away from coaching to be with you, and to try to give the knowledge that I know what it's going to take to be a minor league player, be hopefully a big league player someday, I'm going to be dead honest with you. I'm going to be hard on you because I don't want you to be soft. I want you to understand what it's going to be like when people are always going to be critiquing and giving you stuff. And there's more failure in the game than there is success.
And how are you going to accomplish getting through the failure? And they both looked at me and they said, yeah, Dad, we're ready for that. And so that's when I elected to walk away from the game as a coach, be here. And for the last three summers or more, we were traveling the country doing all these showcases and tournaments in Florida and Georgia, you know, Arizona, Texas.
It's just like we were all over the place, Alabama. It was eye opening for me as a father. And I love baseball. Believe me, I really love going and watching these things. You know, one of the great things about amateur baseball today is all these, you know, perfect game and baseball factory and all this stuff. They put all these tournaments on and all these showcases. You get to see all the talent across the country where way back in the day, we never knew of any of it. The only time we ever saw any talent across the country is if we played against them in college, basically, or in the minor leagues.
And it was a good eye opening experience for my boys and myself to really see what they're up against. And it wasn't really necessarily the talent. It was just the maturity and the growth in their bodies. And that was the thing that I kept telling them.
I said, listen, you guys have the talent. It's just the maturity and the growth in your body as far as I consider them both. My boys sort of late bloomers and sort of like what I was in high school and college and being a late bloomer and flourishing into the body.
It's just everybody's different. Some kids are I mean, I remember seeing kids that are six, five, six, six, two hundred twenty five. And they're going into their senior year in high school.
And I'm like, this is crazy. But it's eye opening because it for these kids, it makes them like work harder. They have to work harder because this is what they're up against.
And in both of them work very, very hard. And, you know, Max had an opportunity last year being drafted. And we elected to just say, we're here to go to college. And he went and played his first year at University of Oklahoma. And, you know, he didn't have a really great opportunity of playing there.
The times he did play on where he's playing consecutively for maybe five or six games. He did quite well, but they elected to go with an older junior college transfer. And then he elected to transfer to the University of San Diego. And he's got two more years for Mason. You know, he's again, another late bloomer with a flourishing fastball with the long arms. You know, sand six foot four one ninety five and the Cubs really like them and picked them in the eighth round. And I mean, I just like I can't wait to see what in the next three or four years when they just mold them into an absolute beast. And I can't imagine what he's going to be doing when he's at 220 or 225.
And who knows if he's going to be growing any more than six or he could be six, five, six, six. So it's just for them to to watch them go through this and all the hard work and and all the me getting on them quite a few times about things and not letting things slide. You know, I'm I'm one of those guys that I'm a I look at the little things and the little things with me are the ones that make the big problems. If you don't if you don't start closing the hole or the gap with the little things, those little things are going to be huge. And so the small little detail stuff I'm really big on. And those are the things that I really emphasize with them as far as their baseball with the way they play baseball, where they go after baseball, how they how they treat players, how they treat coaches. Just these little things that just to me are huge.
So but it's so satisfying as a parent. And I know Mason is extremely, extremely happy is what what's going on. He's been down there in the Mesa Scottsdale area for about a month now, getting used to the system and getting ready for instructionally.
And then Max is getting ready to go start his sophomore year at San Diego and comes first of September. Mark, I can't imagine the value of of your experiences and being able to relay that even to your daughters. As you go through life, being a big leaguer, your dreams can come true. You're walking talking example of that. That is so cool to be able to say that as a parent, isn't it? It really is. But I also know that it's a lot harder today, too, because of what these kids have to deal with as far as their expectations via the social media and far as I know my kids today, especially my girls.
And I think maybe my oldest one might be on social media today, but I'm not too sure about Mason, but just the expectations and what social media does and how people say things via writing through a phone rather than saying to your face. But the reality is, it's just it it's very satisfying to watch them flourish and what they want to do in. But being as a parent, being there and trying to give them advice, which we all know as parents, that's what we can. We can give them advice because we're given advice of things that that maybe have worked or maybe hasn't worked for us as as we grew up into being a parent. And God knows that we've all made mistakes. And but the but we've all learned from them. And that's what we do. We pass on our knowledge to these kids. And that's what I do as far as baseball, too. I mean, I I just I'm just real. I'm real to my kids about the baseball stuff. And I'm I'm like, this isn't good enough.
This is not going to be good enough. Now, you can accept that or not accept it. It's you have to understand that somewhere, somehow that's going to come back to you where if it's good or bad, it's just I just I'm just I just really talk on the points of just being reality. And then, listen, yeah, I'm giving an examples of like what I went through as an athlete, but someone says that can parlay into working in an office, being a doctor.
I mean, it doesn't matter or being a policeman, a fireman. Everybody makes mistakes. You just have to learn from them. And it doesn't matter.
It doesn't matter if you're a baseball player or not. It's just and it's just life experiences. You know, I mean, so many times that, you know, your back is against the wall.
Now, what are you going to do to peel it off and go forward? You know, and and that's where we are as parents in the where I use with all the stuff and the ups and downs and stuff I had to go through my life. And I try to give it to them.
And then, you know, and then they can take it and use it the way they want to use it. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, when you start thinking about the the experiences and the opportunity in front of them, whether the I don't know any occupation mark where you go through the fundamentals and do what you're supposed to do, take care of your body and work really hard that that's not going to get you ahead.
No, it's not necessarily. I mean, you got to have a lot of good things happen for you. You know, I mean, there's there has to be an opportunity for you to do that, too. I mean, you you create the opportunity. I mean, obviously, it can't help if somebody is in front of you that something happens where somebody gets injured and creates the opportunity for you.
But you can only take and do what you want to do. And then hopefully that door opens for you. And, you know, but the biggest thing is the what creates the opportunity is you understanding that in an embracing failure.
You know, that's my biggest thing in life. It's like, you know, you have to embrace failure. It's it's going to happen whether you like it or not. In one way or another, something's going to happen where you're going to have to face it. And what happens is like in the thing is almost like society today is nobody wants to face it.
They just they want to have an excuse for it. And it's unfortunate. But, you know, the thing is, you're going to be a better human being by embracing that and confronting it and going forward and learning from it and being honest about it instead of running away from it and putting your head in the hole and feeling sorry for yourself.
Listen, I was there, you're all there at one time. I mean, I, I can't tell you like, I mean, I go back to shoot after my 91 season, and I talked about this a lot because this was a turning point in my career in my life. You know, when I had total failure in the whole season, you know, hit 201 in, you know, 600 plate appearances, that's really hard to do.
I mean, that's really really bad right and going to the ballpark every day thinking I'm going to be sent out to the minor leagues and never happen. I took it upon myself to go, you know what I needed to find out who I was as a person, you know, and I know today sports psychologists are gigantic and, and I think it's awesome. But for me, the biggest thing was in order for anything psychology wise or mental wise to work, you have to figure out who you are as a person. If you don't know who you are as a person, it's really hard to accomplish anything.
And the thing is, is I had to figure out who I was as a person. Now, now that being said, this is the one thing that I really realized and my psychologist way back when close to 30 years ago, brought it to my attention, you are who you are by the way you were raised by your parents, your parents are who they are because of the way they were raised by their parents. It doesn't mean it's right or wrong. What does it mean, does it mean that's the way you want to live your life.
You don't have to live your life the way your parents raised you know it doesn't mean it's right or wrong. Now, it was like a light bulb when in my head I went, wait a minute. Okay, well, I used to be, I used to do things this way. And I used to do things that way, because that's the way I was raised by my parents. Well, as I was starting to go through therapy. I realized, that's not who I was as a person.
That's who my parents were trying to make me as a person. But as I got older, and I started realizing, well, I had a lot of failure in my life, and I had a lot of ups and downs the personal life, whatever it may be. I had to realize like, I had to find out who I was me as a person. And if you can't look at yourself in a mirror and like what you see. You don't know yourself as a person. You don't know what you can do or can't do. And over the time in the few years, three or four or five years that I went through therapy. The one thing that I, one thing that I think a lot of people out there can attest and will probably agree with me is when it happens a lot when you make a decision, whatever it may be. How many times you question your decision. It happens a lot, like, whatever it may be, it might be the simplest decision for a family thing or it might be a decision on make buying a car, it might be a decision on opening a new bank account, or just whatever may be, or opening a new credit card.
Should I get a credit card. Oh yeah, it's great. I can, you know, but then all of a sudden, a day later you sit there and go wait a minute what the hell I just do. That's not, I shouldn't have done that. And so, for me, what the turning point was, was me understanding that when I make a decision. I have to sit down, think about it. And then when I make it.
That's it. That's the decision. I don't go back. And it took a lot of time for me to really realize and understand that. And the one thing that my psychologist had me do, which is, it's really tough for kids to do this today because they're, they're raised on a computer and a phone. But one of the best things that I ever did was he said, you need to go right, go home, whatever may be, and write down the thoughts of what you're trying to do at that given time. When you make a decision. Now, 24 hours later, go back to that what you wrote down and see if you feel the same way.
And then if you change your mind, write down something new. And then come back 2440 hours later and see if you still feel the same way. And that was the turning point, you know, Mark, you're talking about life changing stuff when you realize that you have the choice to make a different decision in your life that I can remember that for myself as well where I've kind of felt like I was remote controlling.
My parents were still controlling me and I was in my 20s. And I'm like, wait a second, this doesn't even feel like me. Yeah, and that's, I'm dead.
We're thinking the same way. And that was the thing. And it's like, that was the turning point. And it's funny because it's like, when, when these things started happening and I saw these things sort of change, and they, it's like it doesn't change overnight nothing ever changes overnight. It's a process right. When these processes started happening. I started becoming secure me who I was, I started becoming secure with decisions I made off the field, but more importantly, I was making better decisions on the field as a baseball player in my mindset, just went off the it just went in the stratosphere is like the control of how I can control the way I was playing the game and the way I thought, compared to my first five years of playing the game of baseball professional level.
It's not even comparable. And it was all because of me finding out who I was as a person. And I know it today, there's a huge problem with mental health and I and I and I, and I am totally on board with that.
My thing is, my thing is is like mental health. Where does it start, how did it start. And to me, it all starts at the home. It all starts when you how we, how you were raised as a kid, how you can understand and how you can change it yourself, and how you can feel good about those changes, instead of understanding going, oh my gosh questioning every move you made.
And to me, that was the, that was the biggest thing for me in my life, and then I was really it parlayed into what I was doing as an athlete. And it's funny because when I, when I read and I see interviews and on TV or read things in the paper on the internet. She I was gonna say the paper there's no.
I just dated both of us. Oh my god. Listen, I used to love waking up in the morning. I used to have my newspaper delivered to my house, and I used to love putting a big pot of Starbucks coffee on ice to love drinking a pot of coffee in the morning and reading the paper and those days are over with right, but you can still have the coffee but you just read on it on your phone or your on your computer. Yeah, it's just like, I mean it's, it's just, it's incredible how like how powerful the mind is as soon as you understand that you are in control control of your mind.
Nobody else. Total control of it, and how it simplified the game how it simplified my life, you know, don't get me wrong, I mean I had a lot of ups and downs, you know, through my life since then, but I learned how to handle them much better. And I felt good about what I did and what I said about whatever it may be. And it's just like, then I go back to like when we, when we first started talking about my decision of leaving the Padres to be with my kids and to be honest with them and say I want to be dead honestly, this is what's going to happen. You know, those are things that I, if I didn't do what I did back in 92 the winter will choose the winter of 91 going to 92 is when this all started.
So, 30 years ago. If I didn't do those things, I don't know if I could be the parent who I am today I don't think I can be the person that I could be today. You know, Mark, it's really interesting talking about dealing with failure, when you, when you're a professional golfer. One person gets to win, and everything else has looked us at a loss you might have played well but you didn't win. When you're playing in Major League Baseball. If you can fail. If you can fail less than 60% of the time 65% of the time you're going in the Hall of Fame. So you're dealing with twice as much failure as you are, how on a day in and day out basis I just can't imagine the grind of them will be the length of the season, and then, you know, one hit out of three at bats is going to take you to the Hall of Fame it's hard. Well, you know what, so at the same time that I was making a change in my life as far as being a psychologist. Tony La Russa changed hitting coaches, and at the time, he hired Doug Rader, who to this day was the simplified the game for me and to me it was like, I mean he was a great player, former manager.
You know, he's out of the game now and I believe he lives down in the Jupiter area down in Florida, but the thing is, when, when I was going through all this stuff and trying to find out who I was and change, change my mindset and everything. The one thing to your point about dealing with failure. And it's, it's hard to say it's hard, any athlete, not even at it's it's hard with anybody, any walk of life. How do you deal with failure. And this is the thing he said to me, he says, Mark Do you understand that guy on the mound is paid a lot of money to get you out.
And then there's some days he's just going to do it. And I went light bulb went off, I went, Oh my gosh. And I felt so much better about, like, if I went over for. He says, you just have to figure out how he got you out and understand, that's okay, process it, file it in your Rolodex in your mind. And the next time you face them, you're going to be better for it. And I went. It just ease my mind about failure.
And so my offer for didn't turn into over 25. And it's like, I understood, and I started learning how to after a game. Now again, this is well before like the video revolution, it was just starting, you know, I mean shoot, we had VCR tapes back in those days with these kids, they don't even know that right.
And so, you know, today they have everything, which is so great for them, but it. So those were the times when, you know, I lived. I live probably 3035 minutes away from the Oakland Alameda Coliseum I lived over in the East Bay. And so I would spend my time driving home from the game, thinking about my at bats, and I was using my, my video with my mindset on what I visually saw. And so, and if I had a bad game I would like go over every bad how he's pitch was pitch, did I get myself out, did he get me out, or just, it was just a good at bat and he just beat me. And by the time I got into my driveway and walked into my front door. The game was over with. And I was thinking about the picture the next day, the picture the next day.
And that's how I simplified the game. And, and I don't know if I could have done that if, if I didn't wasn't going through the therapy of trying to figure out who I was as a person, but it's just so funny how it's funny but it's just so high grade how it all came together, a new hitting coach psychologist, and it just took me to another level mentally to where it helped me out tremendously, you know markets. There's not a value that you can put on it as an athlete when you get to that next level as a human being, the confidence in your, your ability in yourself is. It's going to show it almost can't not show out on the field or out on the course. Right, right.
Yeah, I totally agree. I mean it's just, I mean, I mean I think about golf I mean, just the dealing of like, I mean, I was lucky enough to play with a bunch of great professional offers and, you know, was really good friend Billy Andrade we sort of locked touch in the last few years but Billy Andrade I got to play in the, you know, the AT&T and, you know, after I retired and went down and played the ADT skills challenge and play with these guys and, you know, in, you know, play with a lot of the great players that you know I played with Phil Mickelson I played with Tiger Woods, you know, I played with Corey Pave and I, you know, I played with all these guys, it's just like, and I just. The thing is, it's like you talk about one of the hardest jobs to perfect is, and to go out there for four consecutive days and try to win a tournament and try to win some money to put food on the table for the family.
That is one of the hardest things to do on this earth. And the, the amount of respect I have for these golfers and what they go through is this, it's immense because think about all the other sports. For the most part, every sport is guaranteed guaranteed contracts for the, for the most part, you know football is probably the only one that doesn't have all guaranteed golf has no guarantee.
The only thing that's guaranteed is you go and drive in or fly into the next tournament and trying to make a living. But to like one day you shoot 63 the next day you shoot 75. Now how's that possible, you're playing the same golf course.
It happens every week, every week. It's like, it's incredible how tough mentally. You have to be to get over that, and to understand that and how to accept the like, okay, I screwed up this whole screwed I'm going to go I'm burning the next hole that you know mental toughness. And, you know, it's like me, I just love, love, watching Tiger, you know play in just the, just the, just him walking on the course and just his stare just intimidated all the other players, and just, you know, and then if he's like three or four strokes behind going in the final day and he's like three or four groups ahead of you and you're you're leading the tournament and also you're hearing the roars ahead of you, and he's putting the pressure on you're not even watching but you can hear the pressure it's like, but the mindset, you know, again, him being raised in the household with a father was the Green Beret. But let me, let me tell you the story about Tiger. So, I got to work out with Tiger, a few times. You know he had a place out here in California, and he actually he was a member of the club that I belong to out here. And I played with him quite a few times and I actually worked out with him. And to this day, to this day, he is one of probably the one of the strongest mentally and physical person I've ever worked out with ever in my life. He put me through, he put me through a set of push ups sit up routine that his dad taught it's this. It's a, it's, it's one of these, I still have it written down in my house and it's one of these things where. It's like you start off you start with like 10 push ups 10 sit ups 20 push ups 20 sit ups 30 push ups 30 sit ups 40 push ups 40 sit ups 50 push up 50s, and then you start going back down as a pyramid right, but you do the pyramid twice. He was done with it. And I was still on my, I was coming down the first term. And I'm sitting there going, but the mindset of him, like, just getting through that, like it was nothing is like the mindset of a Green Beret of a Navy SEAL.
And I think we all love watching those shows, you know, what it takes to be a Navy SEAL and going through all that conditioning and sitting in the water for ice cold water for 24 hours and sleep deprivation, all this stuff is like the mindset. That is a different person. And the whole point is, is the understanding of like how tough it is to to overcome failure and to see a golfer deal with he has to deal with, and to understand the tiger, if not the greatest has ever played I know there's there's arguments saying this, but in our lifetime, I mean, obviously I watched, you know, jack play in my lifetime, but in a lot of people's lifetimes that it was Tiger Woods, but the mindset and the strength of overcoming failure is just immense. And to me, out of all the people I've met on this earth. He is up, up, he's there, he's on the top of that. Mac, I thought I was a competitive guy till I met tiger.
And the guy doesn't give up on it you know he can have a 50 foot putt for a triple bogey and he's still completely focused completely into his routine the whole thing. Anybody Did you see anybody like that in MLB anybody, and some of the great Hall of Famers that you played with and in your great career. Is there anybody that stood out like that. Not the only the only person that I can think of is me.
Interesting. It's, it's like, to me it's like, I would put my mindset against anybody's mindset of what I had to go through, especially in the 98 season of what I had to go through the rest of my career 99 2000. The expectations that the mindset, you know, it's funny it's like, I always wanted to meet Kobe Bryant. And, you know, he lives. God, God rest his soul.
He lived like 10 minutes just over the hill for me, and I never ran into him never got to meet him. But I would love to just talk to him about a mindset, you know, and obviously he would have, he definitely would have been there with tiger as far as mindset. To understand of how powerful I mean think about all the adversity, he had to go through, and his injuries and what he had to come through and. And it's just like, that's just, it's just for me to understand like what I had to go through and to talk to tiger about. Now, I didn't get in details with tiger, because we're just out playing golf and having, but I, you know, I would love to feel to this day I would love to just sit down with him and just go, let's just talk the mindset of being an athlete. I would, I would give my right arm to do that, because it's like we're talking about different sports, but we're all talking about the same thing, talking about trying to be successful.
And, and to win. And as far as me it's like, I sit there and think, and nobody knows I've never I haven't wrote in a book, and you're the first podcast I've ever, ever done. And it's like, I've never wrote in the book I've never let anybody know what's gone on in my mind, it's just like, and I'm, I don't know, maybe I'm a mystery to a lot of people but in a lot of people don't know me they just assume they know me. But the power of the mind where I said, I'll put my mind up against anybody else's mind to accomplish something that the people that don't understand what I went through in 98, starting at the beginning of spring training into finish off what I did is. There's only one way I go back to how we first started talking about my psychology, there's no way in hell that I would have ever accomplished that if I didn't go through that finding out who I was as a person.
No way. Mark I don't know how you did 98 you had that wonderful run you broke that you broke probably the most storied record in all of sport. I was 61 I mean there is no question about it, I was glued to the TV in the Sammy Sosa thing was kind of made it made it more fun but it was really about you. And I don't know, I can remember every once in a while we get a shot of you in the dugout, either on deck or, or maybe in the whole being on deck, and before you're on deck, and I'd see you close your eyes and I'd see you get prepped and I'm like, he's, he's already watching this pitch. He's already seeing what he needs to see.
He's already living this, this, this moment. And you know what, Mac, that's exactly what tiger did on the golf course. He had already won the tournament in his mind. Well, okay. There's two things are alright so 98, and then tiger. So let me, let me tell you one story about tiger when we did talk on the golf course. And he did tell me about when he won the, I believe it was the US Open and Pebble Beach. Oh yeah by 15.
Okay. So the story is he told me was the night before he got up in the middle of the night around two o'clock in the morning three o'clock in the morning. He got in front of his mirror. And he shot every shot that he was visualizing on every hole.
Before Sunday, that night before Sunday. Ridiculous he told me that he told me he said all those shots happened. Isn't that incredible.
It is incredibly shivers gives me shivers right now to even think about that. Now, go to 98. Because that has how powerful, the mind can be to be in that moment to understand that the whole country is watching you to understand that they Fox broke all, you know, television whatever they're playing that that night, and they decided let's put, let's let's put this game on. Let's put this game on national TV, you know, when's that ever happened let's take all these TV shows off we're going to put a baseball game.
You don't even know how many hit a home run. I mean it's so hard to do right. But the thing is the mindset, and to understand, like, where I, where I could get myself to, and it's like, this is where I mean gosh I just wish I could sit down with Kobe and obviously maybe someday I get to sit down and talk to tiger about this on a real level. To, to really understand where you can go and like what to the point where you said like, I would close my eyes in the hole I close my eyes on deck. Well, I was doing that prior to the game, I would, I learned how to, to, I would go into one of the doctor's rooms or the doctor's rooms and lay on a table I would take, I would take about a 10 or 15 minute sort of cat nap if you want to call it, but I would, I would just totally close my eyes. And I would visualize on how this pitcher's ball was moving the starter.
And that's how I did it. Um, today, these kids have video they can do that and, and I go back to like so many times I would tell these kids when I was coaching like you guys don't understand that, yeah, I know there's percentages and what the guy's going to throw certain things I go to me that's great, but to me is understanding and learning the rotation of how his balls going to move is can is the key. To set you up on what you want to do. And so that's what I was doing, and I was, I was doing that before the game, I would do that on deck, I would do that in the hole.
I would do that sitting in the corner of the dog out, because my mindset had to be at another place, and there's only, there's only one place that only one person and get me there is, is me. And, but that's, that is, that's the incredible thing that you can do as a person is to open up into into really peel back as my psychologists say you're peeling back all these layers off this onion. In order to you to find the core of who you are as a person. And that, and that 98 happened because of my failure in 91. And for me to understand that, hey, I had to find out who I was.
And there's no way I personally don't think that there was any way that that would have happened if I didn't. If I didn't go through that time in 91, when I really thought maybe my career was over with and I was going to be a minor leaguer. You know, that's, that's how you, that's how you bounce through in past and embrace failure.
So Mark, if you were a golfer, you would use the exact same thing as what tiger said is what you did. You just, you just, you just supplant the sport and, and get into your visualization, get into your meditation and see it all the night before and, and see it all before the at bat. And the thing is, is like the realization of that, this is my life, or that was my life at my time during that time. It's like, why would allow anything or anybody get in my way of me trying to succeed without even knowing if it was going to happen.
But I was doing everything in my power to have that possibility to happen. Just like tiger was doing that getting up in the middle of the morning, the day before the final round of the US Open and going and blowing everybody away. We visualize every shot. I was visualizing a pitcher's pitch and how the ball was being moved. I didn't have to think about my swing my swing was when you're, you're playing that long you don't have to think about your swing to me it's all about the pictures release point and how the ball is going to move.
And if it's going to come into location where you're going to hit. That's, that's really it, and it's like the power of the mind and what you can do and set the point and that. Listen, I did that every day. I did that every day. For pretty most most of my second part of half of my career I'd start. I say that starting in 92 that's probably 92 to the end of my 2001.
I did that pretty much every day. And it's like, why wouldn't I do that, and then, and then when I was coaching Why wouldn't I pass it on to players today because it's like, listen, I wasn't the best player drafted in 1984, I was in the best player playing the game of baseball. I mean you have to be the best player to have the strongest mind. But how do you know that you can't possibly, how do you know that you, you might not someday be the best player in the game. If your mind can get you there, if you're not allowing it to get you there. And that's what I, that's one of the biggest things that I, when I was coaching is like, how do you know you can't be great.
If you don't get into that noodle between your ears. You know, and the first thing it starts is that you just start talking about it and start planting the seed or, as they say, start throwing the fishing line out there and starting to see if you get a bite on it. And again, this didn't happen overnight, this took time, this took effort. And, you know, I mean I can go into my visualization as far as like, I started seeing an eye specialist and started strengthening my eyes. And I know that's becoming sort of a thing in baseball today but again it's like the understanding that your eyeball is, is, is staying in socket by, it's held in by thousands and thousands of strands of muscle.
And you can strengthen those muscles just like you go in the gym every day and strengthen your legs, your arms, chest and back, you can strengthen your eye muscles. So what gets you tired. Okay, what really gets you tired.
You get drained, you get strain. What gets you tired first. Your eyes get tired first. If your eyes are tired your mind's tired if your mind's tired your body's tired.
It doesn't work the other way around. There is no way your body's tired without your mind being tired, or your eyes being tired. Your eyes can't feel good and all of a sudden, oh my body feels like crap. Your eyes are tired your mind's tired, and your body's tired. And so, that being said is when I started doing these eye exercises.
Again, this goes back into the beginning of 92 when I started seeing this, this eye doctor specialist and he was out of San Diego. And I started doing all these exercises I never stopped. And that's where, like my mindset and my eyes became more, I could see the dot on the ball I can see the writing on the ball, I can see a fingernail. You know, I used to tell Adam Wainwright, even Clayton Kershaw, I used to tell him, I said, dude, I see that knuckle curveball, I see that knuckle thrown up so high.
I said, I would sit there read the newspaper, I'm gonna hit the shit out of the game. They started laughing, they started laughing because, because, but that's how, that's how, that's how good I got as far as reading fingers, I could see a change up I could see a guy's little circle on the side of the ball and. But see that was like, but these were little things that I did when nobody really knows about, and it's like, but it's like that slowed the game down my mind was slowed down because of all the, all the work I was doing, figuring out who I was but my mind really slowed down, even more when I was doing those I exercises, when I learned how to really control my eyes in it, and really centered on us on the spot to your point of me closing my eyes and visualizing in the dugout on in the hole on deck, and then sometimes when I swing and miss I back out and I close and there was a spot on the back that there was a little spot on the back there was an R that is that are kept on Tony be right be right. And, and I would just keep staring at that and that was like my focus point where I just, just, I use my eyes, because, listen, Jake kidding, like, just like golf golf is visualization right, you have to see the shot. And you have to, and then you have to perform it. So your I see the shot your mind moves, and it tells your body where to go. Mark, same thing it's hitting.
It's amazing how similar it is I think, without a doubt. Let me ask you a question, how did you deal with off the off the field in 98 because when I saw you interviewed, you seem so humble, you seem like such a down to earth, human being, and you got so much attention. It had to be overwhelming annoying, I don't know what else, but it had to be so much to deal with.
Well, yeah, that was a. Yeah, if there was one. Listen, it wasn't necessarily a bad distraction. You know, listen, you can't go to school on how to how to deal with media. And how to deal with superstardom or, you know, whatever may be.
I personally thought I dealt with the best I possibly could. And I think, you know, from what I've been told, that was one of the reasons why didn't win the MVP because a lot of the media guys. A lot of the media guys didn't care for the way I was, you know, treating them or the way I responded to certain questions. And I was told that the reason why Sammy Sosa won the the MVP was because he was on a winning team.
Well, you know, it would be different today because if they use the metrics and the analytics that you live did today, you to wipe them out. Yeah, you know, I've looked at those things there's like only two categories that he was a little bit ahead of me and those were the categories that weren't that there's that much emphasis put on those things but you know that it is what it is and he had a fantastic year, and yeah, he, he was a happy go lucky guy and, you know, in, you know, it was a great battle between and I especially with the, you know, Cardinal cub series and understanding how that is just such a historical series every time you're in Wrigley and every time you're in Busch Stadium, and I mean it shoot man it couldn't have been any better, and I loved it but yeah, I mean, what can I say it's just like the dealing with the media. You know, I mean, there's there's yeah there's times you probably wish okay yeah I could have probably said things or could have been, but it's like when you're when you're going into the clubhouse every day after the game. I might have not done anything in, I felt almost embarrassed because the media want to talk to me, rather than talking to Ray Langford or, or Brian Jordan, or Matt Morris or whoever it may be during that time they had a great game. And it's like, it's like I felt bad because it's like gosh give them their dues guys I'm not the only player on this team. And I felt sort of embarrassed because they want to talk to me about why didn't have a home run or whatever happened I'm like, hey, you know what, those guys over there had a great day and. And so sometimes I might have gotten ornery, you know, and then think about it like, you know, they didn't really do any press conferences, until I think it started like maybe probably the end of August, the first of September, instead of having me meet, you know the 50 to 75 media members a day on the field they would set up a, they would set up a room somewhere in the stadium, be it at Busch Stadium or on the road, and then look what they do now, I mean it's a it's a it's a staple now and anything there's a there's a media room for everybody now. You know there's very rarely you see a big conjugate of media players are media talking to players on the field anymore.
If it's anything big there's a media room. So, yeah, it was it was tough, but I thought I dealt with the best I could I mean could I have done better I mean anybody could have done better but again like I said earlier, it's like you, you think there's no going to school and somebody teaching you how to deal with this there's no way, it's like you have the only way you're going to know how to deal with it is is being right in the, in the thick of things and sure enough I was in the thick of things and, and, you know, I tried to be sarcastic I tried to be funny but for some reason everybody thought I was so serious all the time and the only time that I was really serious in between the lines and. And for me, that was my sanctuary. I mean I felt so peaceful, when I took the field.
And it was like it was like this unbelievable great sanctuary to be out there playing the game. That is just amazing I look at some of the records. Mark that you have you still are the record holder for the most home runs per at bat at 10.6, you, you lead the you lead the league and slugging four times you lead on. This is one thing that I think is monster huge that never gets talked about your career, you lead MLB and on base percentage twice for a power hitter. Who does that. Well, I mean, yeah, I'm a career, career on base percentage of 390 something that's like just under 400. Yeah.
That's ridiculous, but that's funny because that stems back from college. My legendary and Hall of Fame coach rod dado. He always told me, you know, he called all his players tiger because he always forgot their names so we everybody was named Tiger. He goes Tiger Tiger he goes a walk is a good as a hit. And I would like, okay, watch as good as a hit. But how do you how do you get walks, you know, you can't get watched by being a passive hitter. You get walks by being ready to hit. And so, it wasn't like I went up to the plate going, I'm gonna, I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna get a walk right here. Now there's times many, many times that I would go to the plate going and think about this Jake. Think about how hard it is to hit when you know that picture on the mountain isn't going to throw you anything to get the discipline that you had to have.
Well, you stand up there being passive, or do you stand up there being ready to hit. I truly believe the only way to have a great on base percentage is to be ready to hit from the first pitch on. If you're ready to hit and you know your strike down, you go hit hit hit ball, hit hit ball, and then you go okay, and then if you get the three Oh I'm like, Oh, just please throw a strike just give me a chance to hit so there was so many times there was so many times that I would go to the plate going, this guy's not even come close to it. You know, and then, but that's, that's a difficult thing to do.
Think about that. It's a really hard thing to do going to play known this guy's not even throw anything close to the plate, but you can't be passive, you have to be ready to hit. Because I'm very proud of that I'm very proud of that. And it's, that's something that is just like, I really love and it's like, Listen, I had a little bit more strikeouts but I did walks. But shoot, I mean, today's things like striking out today's ridiculous it's like, how is that ever okay to strike out 200 times in the season.
How is that ever okay, it's not okay. I don't care what anybody says, when you strike out. You are not helping your ball club whatsoever. And so the acceptance of that strike me out. And for me it was like, it was sort of that was probably one of the biggest things that was hard for me as a coach to understand how these kids today would strike out three, four and five times a game.
And they wouldn't even worry about it. And I sit there ago, if I struck out three times in a game, I couldn't sleep that night. And today's, the game, these kids strike out, and I know these analytical guys well it's better that you strike out and not putting the ball in play and double playing it I'm like no it's not good to strike out because you're not helping your ball club whatsoever. I would rather have a guy put a ball in play because when you put a ball in play, somebody's moving something can happen a runners going to a player's going to sit different it's like something good can happen when you put the ball in play. Now listen, you're going to strike out. But if you're going to strike out, you better well you better know your strike zone you better walk a good amount of times to.
So what's next for Mark McGuire. I know you're going to watch a hell of a lot of baseball coming up. It's really exciting. Well, let's see.
Well, I'm still. I'm a soccer dad now, you know, two of my three, three girls play soccer. One plays on a club team and one plays a YSL. So, like last weekend I was at a tournament all weekend. This weekend I'm going to be in another tournament. You know, I'll be going back and forth to Arizona to visit my son, I'll be driving down the five freeway going down to San Diego, because then my other son, when he starts playing games down there. So, yeah, in about, you know, a few more weeks I said, my wife and I are gonna, I'm going to be the only the only male in the house to be with four women.
So it's going to be interesting for me. I usually have, I have boys around the house so it's like, yeah, it's going to be interesting time but it's going to be exciting time. I had four daughters man I got a full notebook I'll send it on over to you, you just, you gotta find your you're gonna find your quiet place because there's a lot of words that are in the air sometimes my man. I know, I know, I know it's like, oh, man, it is.
Yeah, it is. It is different because I've, you know, you know, I'm raising a household with five boys, you know, and then, then I had, you know, my, my son, Matt, you know he's 3034 going on 35 and. And then, you know the Max and Mason, and then, then I have, you know, wife wanted to get one more and we got three more so in there, all girls so. That's awesome. I just want to wrap up with this mark with. I noticed when you came back to St. Louis, you are so beloved here and you came back, and there was a to me. I watched you so much there was a market change in you as a man, there was something, and I don't know if it was just maybe it's just the rigors of not having to play on a daily basis, but talk a little bit about that and talk a little bit about the support in this crazy baseball town that we live in. Well, it's one of the key reasons why I elected to sign there after I was traded there in 97. I never felt the way, you know, listen I grew up in Oakland for 12 years and, you know, they had for the most part of a pretty good fan base obviously they're going through a tough time right now and trying to decide on what they're going to do in the stadium and they're going to stay and whatever.
And, and, and again Oakland the historical franchise to, but being from California and being traded to St Louis and really not knowing much about St Louis baseball and going there. And getting the reception I did that Friday night, when I. My first game there in Busch Stadium and hitting a home run that night and understanding like, wait a minute, this doesn't happen. I don't understand what's going on here it's like, really, this is the way a baseball player supposed to feel. This is incredible.
I've never under. And it's like I was just like going, I mean, I couldn't understand it it was like I was taken off guard like the, the support and cardinal nation. Being growing up in California we just we weren't in tune to it. You know we're used to going to ball games and leaving the games early, you know, to be traffic, you know, and people, people make their summer vacations and going down to downtown St Louis to watch cardinal games. So, it was, it was the feeling of like, just love, and I was like, I remember calling my representative and saying, this is where I want to be I mean I hope we can work something out I mean there. I mean this is incredible. Why would I even try to go, try to go with to be a free agent to go somewhere else when I've never felt like this ever. And to your point of when I come back it's it's the same feeling it's incredible.
I mean it's like, I just, you know, I met my wife there, you know, my wife, you know, born and raised across the river in Illinois and Glenn carbon, you know, and took her to California and her parents still live there and her sister so lives over there in Edwardsville and. It's just incredible and it's not going it's it's only get better. These are just, it's just, it's just families generations hand down the cardinal nation and this is what they do and you know you go all the way down to the south and the people listening to the history of cable wax and you hear the stories of listening to Jack Buck and, you know, Mike Shannon and all those guys that just like it's just the stories, just going all over the country it's just like when I used to travel my boys down through the mountains and I would get stories from people coming up, saying, Oh my god we're a huge Cardinal fans and love listening to the games and watching games when you're playing and stuff so just to love and I mean I you know Walt jockey and in the family and all the owners and I couldn't be thankful enough for them, even making something work, and for me to stay there and, you know, I mean I wish it was longer than four years I mean, you know, unfortunately I decided to walk away from it with all the injuries and just didn't want to deal with it could I could I have played longer I know I could have played longer but I just came to a point where I just felt like I just didn't want to go through all that anymore, and I walked away from it.
But the love, the love is never lost left left me never left at all. The other side of the game the mental side of the game and golf and in baseball and the prep and the demand is, it's, it's a, it's a huge ask. No, yeah, and but it all comes from the mindset, but, you know, Jay I can't go back enough to it. It goes back to finding out who you are as a person.
Yes. And it's like, until you can find out who you are as a person, and how you can deal with things on your own. And nobody else's opinion nobody else has given you any kind of anything. You, in your own room, look in the mirror. Understand, talk to yourself, figure out how you're going to accomplish this, good or bad, until you can get to that point.
Once you get to that point, then you're going to know that's who you are. And I can't put enough emphasis on that, and it's not easy work. It's a lot of hard work. And, and, and it's like, there's, there's a lot of hiccups during the way I remember having hiccups. I know I keep going back I remember having hiccups driving to my psychologist, going there.
Oh man, we have this one. But then I, you know, hour later I'm driving home feeling fantastic because he gave me something to work on. But you can overcome pretty much any and everything, and you are the one that will dictate it. And thanks so much for the time today I really appreciate I wish the boys the best of luck for girls. If you ever get back in town, I really look forward to connecting Yeah, yeah. Well thank you Jay and podcast.
I mean, you know, I really love just like just talking about knowledge and what we've gone through and in our lives and, you know, if we can help somebody get somebody on the right the road to recovery or the road to who they are as a, as a person, whatever it may be, it's just like, if they can use the little things and maybe go out and try to find some help and all the better. Peloton let's go. This holiday with the right music and the right motivation from world class instructors.
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