How to Guard Your Marriage from Temptation (Part 1 of 2)

The issue is you need to take care of how things look. And if you take care of how they look, you take care of how they are.

Because if you're not alone, nothing's going to happen. Jerry Jenkins joins us today on Focus on the Family with Jim Daly to talk about helpful guidelines for protecting and preserving your marriage. Thanks for joining us. I'm John Fuller. John, we're called to honor our spouses with the way we act and speak, whether they're present or not. How about that? I have worked on that. I think Jean would agree.

I'd do much better at that today than maybe in my 20s and 30s. I hope so, Jean. But we are going to talk primarily to men today about boundaries that can be helpful for all of us, not just men, but women too. And we want to give you some practical tools to build trust and respect into your marriage. And if you're struggling in your marriage, we're here for you. We have so many great resources, programs, Hope Restored, Christian counseling. We're doing everything we can because we believe that if we can save a marriage, keep a marriage healthy, good things happen. Children do better.

All the indices really improve when marriage is kept intact. So we're here for you. Call us if you need that kind of assistance. Yeah, our number is 800, the letter A in the word family, 800-232-6459. And we have so much that we want to help you with. Just give us a call. Let me also tell you that parts of our conversation today won't be appropriate for children.

We'd suggest you direct their attention elsewhere. Now, Jerry Jenkins has over 210 books to his credit, and he's probably best known for a couple of those books called Left Behind. And then he's working with Focus on the Family on the chosen novels, three of which are published by Focus. He's married to Diana, has three grown sons.

I'm told eight grandchildren. That can always change. A little canary told you this, huh?

Yeah. He's just re-releasing his really exceptional book, which was foundational in my own marriage. It's called Hedges, Seven Ways to Love Your Wife and Protect Your Marriage. And when you call us, ask about it or find details about it in the show notes. Jerry, welcome back to Focus. It's good to have you. Thanks. Always good to be with you. Yeah, I so appreciate. I mean, first of all, just the way the Lord has used you in your writing and Left Behind.

And it's exciting. I mean, you have really contributed to the fabric of the country and the world through what God has inspired you to write. How did you become such a great writer? Well, I feel blessed. And, you know, I don't want to sound falsely modest, but I really think I'm mono gifted.

I don't sing, dance or preach. I just write and I feel obligated to exercise that gift. My mother taught me to read before kindergarten, which made me kind of an obnoxious elementary school student. The joke in our family is that by first grade, I was reading at a fourth grade level. And in college, I was still reading at a fourth grade level.

But that helped a lot. I loved reading. And then I loved writing up sports stories. And so at age 14, I talked my way into a sports writing job with a local paper.

I was still too young to drive, my mother had to drive me to the games and back. But when you get edited that young, you learn to write better than you might have. Yeah. And so that's one of the best really something. And again, the Lord has used you in incredible ways to communicate so many good things, so many truthful things about the Word of God about his character, etc. hedges is a book that you wrote many years ago, but you now have re written it updated it. Speak to the metaphor of the hedge. Why does hedge work for you for protection in marriage?

I just felt my younger brother, he's 10 years younger than I am, when he was getting married, he wrote me a note. And he said, when I get married, will I stop looking at other women? And I said, I wish, you know, I wish that was true of all of us.

You know, you probably won't. And so you need to protect yourself, you need to protect your hands, your head, your heart, your eyes. And, and it just hit me that, you know, you want to put a hedge of protection around your, your Christian character. And that metaphor seemed to work for me, you know, you're, you're hedging things in, you're hedging things out.

You know, one of the things that I appreciate about that is the recognition that we are wired in a certain way, and things catch our attention. I think it was Dr. Howard Hendrix, who made this comment years ago, he was a professor there at Dallas Theological Seminary. And he and a master's level student, they were walking across the campus and a beautiful girl walked by and the younger graduate students said to Dr. Hendrix, and he was about price 75 at the time and said, you know, Dr. Hendrix, when do you reach that point where when some beautiful woman walks by, you don't notice her? And his response was, I'll let you know.

He was like 75. And it's not to trivialize that. But there is I mean, there's a reality there that we are visually wired as men, and it connects with us. And we've got to as Christians recognize that, so we can put the hedge in for our protection. And I think one of the great freeing things that I discovered in, you know, trying to write this book, as a layperson, I'm not a counselor, I'm not a theologian, I'm not ordained. I'm a fellow struggler.

I'm a fellow Howard Hendrix. And, but I love this verse about flee youthful lust. I'm not even asked to stop and pray about it. Turn over a new leaf resolve, we all want to do that. We want to, you know, I'm going to beat this thing, you know.

And even God is saying, flee. Yeah, I've made you this way. You're going to have these issues.

You can run that to me is very free. It is. But it does take a plan. You got to know what the weaknesses are and what you need to do. Unfortunately, now we're going to get more into this as we talk through the various hedges.

But I want to put this up front so people are aware of it. One of the things that is very unsettling to me is the degree to which pornography is being used. And I'm talking about people in the church. I saw some data that showed that something like 68% of men in the church will use pornography at least one time a month. I mean, that is crippling to your relationship and to your solidarity to the Lord, right, I believe. And so, and within that 50% of pastors is what this research suggested and a high degree of women to almost 30%.

And these are people in the church. And so in that regard, bridling that appetite, that's what you mean by flee. I mean, don't entertain it, because it's like kudzu. It's like a weed that gets into your heart and then begins to grow in there. And it's deadly.

Yeah. And most of us, especially if you're visible in the evangelical world, if, you know, my profession happens to be visible, and of course, pastors and, you know, any evangelical leaders are visible. They'd love to say, I'm above this.

I'm more mature than that. And you'd be so disappointed to hear if, you know, if I fell to this thing. But, you know, you know how insidious pornography is now. It's everywhere. You can hit the wrong key on your phone, and all of a sudden there it is. And it's amazing how we rationalize, you know, the heart is so deceitful and say, I didn't look for this.

I'm going to see what this is all about. Because, you know, it's sexy and it's interesting. And it's, you know, and that's the time to flee. And also, I think accountability is crucial. I mean, you just be open with other men and say, look, this is something anybody would struggle with if it's there all the time. And anytime somebody succumbs to it, they feel guilty. They feel shame. And so you really want to have people around you.

And there are so many apps now that will show on your phone what you've looked at and will even show other people if you allow that. Boy, that'll... That's good. It's really good. A good reminder. Just in general, and again, we're going to get to the specificity of the seven hedges. But hedges, some people might say, and you're alluding to this in the sexual context, but let's apply it to just the general context of hedges. They're kind of overkill.

It's unnecessary. God loves me. He forgives me. I'm an adult.

What do you say to that person that makes those kind of excuses for the forethought of putting safety bumpers in your life, so to speak? Well, one of the big things we see today is people who are heartbroken over the prodigals in their family. And there is a promise that when they're old, they won't depart from the truth. We don't know how old, but one of the biggest issues is the example you set. And if there's inconsistency between what you're teaching and what you're taking kids to church and the church is teaching and how you really act, they can ferret that out. Now, that's not always the reason for a person to become a prodigal. But I think it's important to say, sure, God will forgive you, but shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Heaven forbid.

We need these. Really true. You've gotten some pushback from women particularly about hedges. I kind of scratched my head over that. What are the things that they will say to you about hedges, women? Yeah, I had an experience one time where, you know, one of my rules is the first one is generally known as the Billy Graham rule. He won't meet or dine or travel with a woman alone who's not related to him.

So it's his wife or his daughters was the case when he was alive. I maintain that rule too. And, you know, as a speaker and that type of thing, I'll have people call and say, oh, so-and-so will pick you up at the airport. And it'll be a woman's name. And I'll say, well, I need it to be, you know, either two women or a man or, you know, and sometimes that's embarrassing. And they go, oh, really? You know, well, this is a wonderful person.

And we know your presentation. That is the issue. The issue is you need to take care of how things look and how if you take care of how they look, you take care of how they are, because if you're not alone, nothing's going to happen.

Yeah. And no accusation. But as you say, women criticize people who announced this and say that they won't meet with a woman alone. They're insulted. And they say, you know, why wouldn't you and doesn't this discriminate against women and all the, you know, advantages that we have to have a meeting like that. And, you know, I will trade the embarrassment of having to maintain that rule for my 53 year marriage any day. Well, it's interesting because in a business context, I could see that criticism being rife because that's the glass ceiling, you know, if you're meeting at the club or whatever it might be where deals are being done. But protecting that, you know, have somebody along that is a third person in that regard. I think it's a must do in ministry.

I certainly try to do in the business environment because you'll be far better off and you won't be tempted in those ways. In fact, Jerry, you had a funny encounter with I think one of your cousins or something who came to pick you up and another person observing it was a little concerned about this young woman. Yeah, I have a cousin who's, you know, a few years younger than I am. And this is back when we were both young and, and I was waiting for her to pick me up, you know, at a speaking event.

And I happened to be talking to another person at that conference. And so my cousin pulled up and gets out of the car and she's young. She's wearing shorts. She looks great.

She looks, of course, she wants to embrace me. And so, so I'm saying, hello, cousin. And she had her, her child in the back seat, you know, toddler. And I was tempted to just lift him up and go, this is my grand nephew.

Put a billboard on there. Yeah, you had to be careful after talking about, you know, hedges. Yeah, all of a sudden I'm with this, you know, attractive young woman.

Yeah. We'll get more into the protective aspects of the relationship. But you also address the need to be intentional about cultivating connection with our spouses. It's not just a defensive posture. It's, you're on the offense for the relationship.

What are some of the things you address there? Yeah, that's an important thing. Because, you know, especially men who enjoy repartee and talking and being funny and, you know, being familiar, you know, it can lean toward being flirtatious. And I, you know, my role is, I'll flirt with my wife and you flirt with yours. You know, sometimes there are people who do this just to be funny. And they do it even in front of their spouse. They'll say, when are you and I going to run off together, you know?

And everybody knows it's just a joke. And they would never do such a thing until one of those relationships has issues. And then one of those people who's been teasing says, you know, have you ever been serious about what you're saying? I've seen it happen. Or they'll say, you know, all sudden, they become dependent on each other, and they start seeing each other. Two marriages break up. And then two more marriages break up because the second marriage has never worked either, it seems like. Yeah, it's insidious. And I think you're right, John, that you need to say, I'm going to put my attention, if I want to be funny, if I want to laugh, I want to make my wife laugh.

If I want to be flirtatious, I want to be flirting with her, not with somebody else. Hmm, those are good, good items. Let's go to the second hedge regarding physical touch another great, you know, lesson and law to live by.

What's that hedge? Yeah, that's the thing. We've come a long way in the church, you know, in my lifetime, I can remember when I was a kid, we were fairly formal in church, men shook hands, women might embrace, but men and women didn't. And then that kind of got freer in the 60s and 70s.

And it probably was healthy. You know, we were a little too, you know, formal and too staid. But depending on your age, and depending on how you do that, I think it's important. I'm very careful about who I touch and who I embrace. Now you talk about criticism, this is one that people go, Oh, come on, you know, you can, well, for one thing, I don't embrace any woman, other than in front of my wife, if I do, usually, it's a relative, or a dear friend, an old friend of both of us. Now, there are some people who just will approach you and say, I am a hugger. Well, I'm not. But you know, you don't you, you want to be appropriate. But I make it brief and friendly. And, you know, you have to watch your own heart and your own eyes, your own mind.

I mean, are there people that are embracing for too long? I just think it's something to be aware of and be careful. Yeah, you had a story in the book about that specifically. I don't remember all the details.

But if you can remember those something during your journalism career, many years ago, where somebody breached this, and it was a good lesson for you. Yeah, I worked years ago in a newspaper office, and there was a guy who had an issue with his own brother, was very ill, and he was very worried about it. And he was friends with the managing editor of that paper and his wife. Well, the husband, the managing editor wasn't there, and the wife was. And so she embraced this young guy. And he was probably 10 years younger than she was, and comforted him for probably too long, and led to an affair. Now, my friend was not without fault in this. But here was a woman who, in essence, traded the attention of somebody else for the inattention of her own husband. She had, you know, things to say about their marriage where he, he was married to the job.

And it wound up in an affair, which, you know, just created chaos. Jerry, let me ask you about compliments. That seems pretty natural, most appropriate to do those things. But you're just cautioning to make sure those compliments are in the right, packaged in the right way, if I could say it that way. So talk about that hedge of compliments. Yeah, this is one, again, where I'm drawing a fine line. And I should clarify, my hedges will not necessarily be your hedges. What I'm encouraging husbands to do is to look for their own areas of weakness, and shore up those areas. For instance, I'm not tempted by streetwalkers, you know, that's just not something that appeals to me. There are people that are, there are Christian men who say they drive through that section because they're looking and they're not going to do anything, they're just going to look.

That's a hedge they need to, you know, plant. As far as compliments, I learned this one from the way somebody talked to my wife once. In front of me, he didn't say, that's an attractive sweater or that's a nice outfit. He said, wow, you look great. And I thought, that's a little too familiar.

And I don't want to do that. Now, I've seen women where I could say, wow, you look fantastic today. Instead, I say, that outfit is attractive on you. That's a slight difference. But it's less personal. And again, I'm drawing a fine line, I realized, but that's an area for me.

I might get a thrill I don't deserve by even saying something or communicate something you don't intend or you do intend. Right. No, that's so true. You know, Jerry, I think it's obvious in the scripture, there's usually three things and the argument could be made, maybe there's three different things. But what I see is those hedges are about sex, money, and pride.

And, you know, for 5,000 years of biblical history, you see that repeated over and over again. Be careful about sex, money, and pride. And you know, the argument again, could be that pride kind of underlines all of that. And that's true. But I know some people that have the other two in check, but their pride is not in check. And, you know, so these things aren't just around a sexual context.

I mean, and you know, it's funny, I thought it was a good thing. I was with three other guys playing golf, the four of us. So I just cracked that conversation open and said, okay, the thing I read in the scriptures, these three things are the things that are going to trip as sex, money, or pride. So what's your weakness? And we got it out there on the table, and they weren't all the same. And then you told them that your weakness was gossip.

Right, right. And now I'm going to make sure I share this with everybody. I'm not using names here, but I just think that's another vulnerability where guys, you know, if you don't create a plan of attack to recognize these things that can happen to us, and then what is your exit strategy? If you're found in that place, what are you going to do to protect yourself, your marriage, your family? It's just wise to think ahead of time.

I think it is. And I've probably told you this before, but I have a little personal accountability group. There's three men that that feed into my life.

And one of them gave me some really good counsel. He said, you know, too often we think we need to worry about the will of God, you know, what's the will of God, and pray about it and try to ferret it out. He said, that might be important for certain issues, but the scripture says, there are verses that begin, this is the will of God concerning you. He said, whatever it says after that comma, you don't need to pray about it.

It's there. The will of God for you is that you abstain from sexual immorality. That's what this book is about. Yeah, no, those things are good. And the more open you can be with that, you know, trusted small group of friends or a friend that you can talk with. That's really beneficial, I think. I've also thought about, you know, I do that. I've got an accountability person.

He's older than me. Steve Menefee is a retired business guy. Great guy. Part of what was started here to focus on the family, the CEO forum.

And we spun that out years ago, probably in 06, I think. And, you know, it's continued to do really well. And it really is a place for executive wing people to come and share their faith and kind of grow in that way. But this is a core issue for them and the ability to create environments that are healthy. You mentioned the idea of being careful about physical touch and all these other things. You have a story in the book where the scripture really addresses this straightforwardly, especially men who prey upon women in a weak moment, like after the loss of a husband or something like that.

I mean, there are scriptures that talk about that. And in there, you counted a story of a female friend who had gone through some difficulty. And how do you manage that hurt as a man?

Maybe it's your wife's friend, whatever. What was your advice in that regard? My wife and I had a dear friend whose husband actually was in ministry. And when he failed, he threw her under the bus.

And this is common. You often hear, well, if you only knew what a shrew my wife was and how cold and this and that are unattractive and simply wasn't true about this woman. And because I'm careful about how I compliment, I told Diana, I said, she needs to hear from an independent man that she's not unattractive or shrewish or that type of thing. But I said, I wouldn't want to do that without you there. And she said, I think you should tell her. And so we chatted with her after church. And I just told her, I said, you know, the idea that you're less than or that you're unattractive is simply not true.

I said, if you know, if I'm speaking for other men, I think they would find you attractive. And it really, you could see it. It encouraged her. And it's good advice. I mean, but it's a tightrope. It is. I mean, you got to be careful.

I think talking to your wife about it and getting her permission and her direction, her intuition and having about that when you do and be there. Yeah. Because that can get wonky really quickly if you don't. What's the biblical basis for creating these kinds of hedges or boundaries? What is it rooted in? Where do you see that in scripture? There's an awful lot of scripture that becomes a biblical basis for hedges. You know, even as far back as Leviticus, adulterers were put to death in Leviticus. Now, I'm grateful that that's not the case today.

I think I have lots of friends who'd be dead. But that tells how serious God takes it. When Jesus dealt with a woman who had been taken in adultery, everybody loves to talk about the grace there and how he forgave her. But he also said, go and sin no more. He called it sin.

And he wanted her to stop. Can I ask you a question, Jerry, in that regard? You know, over the years you battle with these situations. So often we treat God like he's a grandfather with a stick, like he doesn't know what we do.

He knows it. He created us in a sexual context as well. Sometimes we lament those appetites that we have because they get us into trouble because they're not disciplined within the context of biblical marriage, etc. How do you think God sees these things? I mean, he knows we're sinners and it's only by his grace through Jesus Christ that we have salvation.

So is he kind of the grandpa that's shocked and ready to whack us with the stick? Or is he wanting that sin to work in us to produce the need and awareness in us that we need him? I mean, what is sin doing in our bodies and the danger of the church?

Now, these are big theological questions. The danger in the church to say, it's the way I am. It's the way I was wired.

It's I'm a man. It's not a good excuse when God's saying, no, I expect something from you. And it seems like in our culture today, we're less likely to give that discipline to the Lord. The old joke used to be the devil made me do it.

And now it's worse. We're saying God made me do it because he made me this way. And that is heresy.

And I couldn't have said it better than you did. He allows this, I think, to bring us to our knees. But it's not like a shocker to him. That's the point. So often we feel like, you know, it's the heavy-handed parent that catches us playing doctor at seven years old or something.

No, no, no. The Lord knows what's going on. You can't hide it from him. But the point being that he wants that to produce something positive, spiritually positive, when we trip and stumble and lean into him and ask for forgiveness and repentance. Yeah, I believe that. And 2 Timothy 2 22 is the one that I mentioned earlier, too, is flee youthful lust. Now, I'm no longer youthful, but my lust is.

Oh, interesting. So I'm fleeing youthful lust. Wow, that is well said, Jerry.

We have covered just about half of those hedges. Let's come back next time and cover the other half and get more into the need for us as Christian men and Christian women to live a life that is convictional, that we really believe these things, but live them out. And I think, Jerry, another big question for me or comment on where we're at in the culture today with the stats that I read at the very beginning or referred to in the very beginning that so many men and women in the church are caught up in pornography. We have got to discipline ourselves to live the word, be the word, A, so our kids can see it, our grandkids can see it, and the culture around us can see it. I think when we live that way, actually things will change. People will notice a difference, right? I agree.

Amen. Well, listen, you can get a copy of this great book right from us here at Focus on the Family. When you do, all the proceeds go right back into Helping Focus. If you can do it on a monthly basis, that's great.

A one-time gift is also good. If you can't afford this resource, we're going to trust others. We'll cover the cost of that, and we'll get it into your hands. We are a Christian ministry. We believe in the content that we talk about.

We believe in what Jerry has expressed through his book Hedges, and we don't want cost to be the issue. So get in touch with us. Help us monthly. Help us one time. Get ahold of us to get a copy, even if you can't afford it. Yeah, your donation goes so far in helping us provide resources to marriages, whether that's fine-tuned resources like Jerry's book, Preventative, or if you've struggled, we have a caring team of Christian counselors.

There's so much in between that we have to offer. Donate today. Make that kind of ministry possible. Request your copy of the book by Jerry Jenkins, Hedges, Seven Ways to Love Your Wife and Protect Your Marriage.

We've got all the details about how to donate and get that book in the show notes, or give us a call. 800 the letter A and the word family. On behalf of the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family with Jim Daly.

I'm John Fuller inviting you back as we continue the conversation with Jerry Jenkins, and once again, help you and your family thrive in Christ. Your kids are unique and so are you. You have your strengths as a parent and areas of growth too. Find out what they are by taking the seven traits of effective parenting assessment from Focus on the Family. Find out how you're doing on traits like gratitude, grace, and other research backed traits.

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