Using Kindness to Open Doors in the Culture

It's easy to be nice to the barista right when she gets your coffee right. It's easy to be kind when there's harmony in your family. But try kindness when there's dissension. Try kindness when you have a strained relationship with your husband or your children. Try kindness when you're not getting along with your neighbor.

It's a lot more difficult. That's Dr. Barry Corey, the president of Biola University, and he's with us today on Focus on the Family. Your host is Focus president and author Jim Dilly. I'm John Fuller and of course here in the U.S. it's Inauguration Day and our country formally swears in a new president for office. Jim, this has been, and this will be an understatement, an extraordinarily difficult political season for all of us. Well, the political division in this country has become as contentious as I've ever seen it.

And in the past couple of years, and really the past couple of decades, things have continued building to this fever pitch. It's heartbreaking to see such anger on both sides of our divided country. And I know that God's heart is breaking as well.

Many people now have strained relationships within their own family, family or even co-workers as a result of the outcome of the elections. So I felt that it would be timely today to take a break here in Sanctitative Human Life Week and talk about the issue of kindness. It's one of the traits, one of the fruits of the spirit that God gives us. And regardless of what's happening around us, we should still certainly show kindness to one another. I'm really looking forward to the conversation today because it will help us learn how we can better love God and love people and to live out the scripture in Micah 6.8 which says, He has told you, O man, what is good and what does the Lord require of you, but to do justice and to love kindness and to walk humbly with your God. And I think that's an awesome statement. So often we're missing those admonitions to project kindness. But when we show kindness to others, somehow what I've experienced is it opens their heart up. Yeah, it's kind of a lost art, but a great reminder today in the conversation ahead, we do have some ways for you to learn more about doing that. And just note that you'll find a lot of resources to encourage you along the way.

The links are in the episode notes. And we're coming back to a visit we had just a few years ago with Dr. Barry Corey, who's been the president of Biola University since 2007. He's written a couple of books, including Love Kindness, and he and his wife Paula live in Southern California and have three children. Dr. Corey, Barry to your friends. Thank you. It's great to have you here at Focus. It's great to be here, Jim and John.

Thanks for having me on your show. You and I have had many discussions about this theme about love and kindness and those virtues that sometimes get lost in the fray of battle, if we want to call it the spiritual warfare. Describe for me where you're coming from, what kindness is in that true definition, and why you believe we need to re-emphasize it. Yeah, well, I remember the very first time I met you, Jim, at Biola years ago, we immediately started talking about how can we be more civil in an increasingly uncivil culture.

Those conversations continue to germinate in my mind and in my heart as I'm looking at this rising generation of students and what are we modeling for them in a way that they're going to have an impact on our culture, in politics, in entertainment, in the arts, in commerce, whatever it might be. And increasingly, I believe that the antidote to all of the division and the skepticism and the anger and the polarization is for Christians to lead the way in living lives of profound kindness. It is what you mentioned in that Micah 6-8 verse that we are called to—we say love mercy sometimes, but it literally means to love kindness, not just to do kindness in some Nike-esque kind of way. We don't do kindness, we love kindness, and that means kindness is not a random act, it's a radical life.

And this book that I wrote is about how revolutionary our lives could be in our families, in our communities, in our neighborhoods, in our culture, in our politics, if we lived out this profound sense of kindness that the Scriptures call us to. Why is love and kindness—and I put those together because usually when you're looking at the fruit of the Spirit in Galatians 5-22, it's love, joy, peace, goodness, kindness, mercy—why do these things get lost? Do we acknowledge them almost with our head, but sometimes they're hard to deploy with our heart because there's that fight in us, we don't want to see injustice, we don't want to see things go against the Word of God, especially in a country that has historically embraced Christian values.

And now things are changing and we're in an environment where we don't have that singular social cohesive approach. Why does the ugly side of us show up rather than the God Spirit in us, that love and kindness that he possesses? You know, I've been using a phrase recently about living a life with a firm center and soft edges, and too often I think Christians have had firm centers and hard edges. We've got to stand up for this and we've got to defend ourselves, and so the hard edges are what we lead with, or we think that, well, if you have soft edges that means you have a spongy center that you don't really have any firm convictions or beliefs. But if you look at the fruit of the Spirit, kindness is right there, right in the middle, and I think it is one of the keys—it's not a gift of the Spirit, it's not optional.

You have to live this way if you are a follower of Jesus. That we somehow mistake kindness for niceness. What's the difference? Well, I think niceness is spongy in the middle, and kindness is radical and powerful. You can't find the word niceness or nice in the Bible, nowhere.

It's not there. But kindness is all over it. Old Testament, New Testament, scriptures are full of the word kindness, loving kindness, kind-hearted. As a matter of fact, Paul in Romans 2, 4 says, it's kindness that leads to repentance. He says it right after all the words about judging, don't be overly judgmental. And sometimes we think judgment is what changes it, and so we're quick to judge and quick to be angry and quick to be combative. And because we think kindness is too soft, it's what boy scouts and grandmothers do. We stop telling our children to be nice and start telling them to be kind, and then tell them the difference between the two.

No, I like that. In fact, that Romans 2, 4 verse is something I quote often. And it's not just for us, but it says God's kindness leads one to repentance. So the question that I always ask people that are struggling with that kindness idea is, why should we do something different from what God does with sinners, and us included? He doesn't just come at us simply with that judgment. I mean, being righteous is part of the package, and that's where we want to go with sanctification. But he starts the process by expressing his kindness toward us, and that's what leads us to repentance. So I'll often ask a crowd, who's been beaten into the kingdom of God?

I'd like to see your hand. Who has said here, those Christians were so tough on me and were so hateful toward me that I decided to become one of them. You never find anybody like that. It's always, these Christians showed me such love and such kindness, it compelled me to kind of open my heart up to the message of God. That's what happens, isn't it? That's what happens, and I think we often assume that the opposite of kindness is meanness.

And I don't think that's the case. I think the opposite of kindness is fear. We're afraid of the Supreme Court, we're afraid of the president, we're afraid of the immigrant, we're afraid of the Muslim, we're afraid of the gay person, whatever it might be. And so because of that fear, we put up barriers, and those barriers become obstacles for our building relationships with those who may not see eye to eye with us. And that's what Scripture calls us to do when it says love kindness. You reach out to those who, it's easy to be nice to the barista, right, when she gets your coffee right. It's easy to be kind when there's harmony in your family. But try kindness when there's dissension, try kindness when you have a strained relationship with your husband or your children, try kindness when you're not getting along with your neighbor. It's a lot more difficult than, and what's most offensive to us in our human side sometimes is when we're kind and we're not thanked, we're kind and we're not received. But kindness is not about being thanked, kindness is about being obedient. And sometimes you're going to get the cold shoulder or the fist or the finger or whatever it might be, and that doesn't matter. Or verbal attack.

Or verbal attack. Let me ask you this, you were a Rhodes Scholar, which congratulations. Fullbright.

Fullbright. And that is an achievement, I mean that is really something. While you're overseas, your dad, who was a pastor, he passed away not long ago I think, but he came to visit you and you had quite a discussion with him. Tell us about how he modeled kindness for you and what you saw in your own father. So when I was a child, my father, who had this profound love for Jesus and lived this life of unfiltered kindness, even when people rejected him, he would do the most, in my mind, the most awkward things. He would hug the Islamic gas station attendant. He would hold hands with a cobbler fixing his shoes at the little shoe place and pray with him. One time he had the audacity to hold the Jewish furniture merchant's face in his hand and say, Ruben, I love you, and I wanted to crawl under the desk of that furniture shop because I was so mortified that my father would actually do that.

But it was years later when I was this pony-tailed researcher living in Bangladesh for a year that he came through for a few days and we had this walk this one morning on these fetid streets of Dhaka, the nation's capital, just crowded with rickshaws and beggars and poverty and stench. And as we were walking these streets and I was trying to figure life out, he said, there's a verse in Matthew chapter 10. He said, I can't get out of my mind. He said, it's right after Jesus says to his disciples, if you want to be my follower, you pick up your cross and come with me. But then he says to his disciples, whoever receives you receives me, and whoever receives me receives the one who sent me, Matthew 10-40. He said, I don't fully get what Jesus meant, but this I do know that whoever God places in my path, unless I make myself receivable to them, how will they ever receive the grace of God?

How will they ever receive the love of Christ? And at that moment, all those memories began cascading down of the Islamic gas station attendant and the cobbler and the Jewish furniture merchant. And I understood, you know, my father wasn't being weird. He was being receivable.

And he was living that life of, you know what, whatever it takes, I'm going to make myself receivable. And to me, receivable looks like kindness. But you may not be accepted with your kindness. You may be rejected, but kindness is never forgotten. There's something powerful about kindness. And the seeds of kindness that you plant, you may not see the result of those seeds for years, or maybe even in eternity. Right.

But you've got to lean into kindness, even when it seems offensive to people, even when you're rejected. Well, and Barry, what strikes me is how it is God's tool. I mean, I think that's why he says love your neighbor. Right. Because it does something to that neighbor's heart, especially if they're at odds with you, for some reason. Right.

It's that soft edges you talked about. You talk also in the book about the pain caused by hypocrisy. And of course, we have that in our culture all the time. You're working as a college president at Biola. You have that rising generation with you every day as a vocational reality. What do they tell you about what they see in their parents' generation, their grandparents? What do they say, and what are they trying to fix with their idealism? Yeah.

I take 10 or so freshman guys every year up to Yosemite, right when they're on the front end of their time at Biola. And we talk about life and their challenges and their aspirations. And they are honest with me about the stuff in a very candid way about the stuff that they've been going through and are going through. And to a certain degree, I want to be honest and vulnerable to them. I like to say I don't want to be transparent, maybe translucent.

I'm letting the light shine through, but not everything. But I do think that there's something about authenticity that this generation is looking for in leaders. They don't want the buttoned-up life. They want the opened-up life. And when you have the buttoned-up life, that is, to them, that smells like hypocrisy. And hypocrisy is the poison of kindness.

Let's give this some context, because I totally agree. And the other thing is, I don't frown upon what the Holy Spirit is doing in a generation. I think generationally, God puts these things in the hearts of his people so that they express it. And I think the younger generation is they're looking for that authenticity.

I think it's put there by God to kind of right the ship, if you will. And I think the thing that we're observing here is that for a long time, I think for generational reasons, I think Christian leadership has been about projecting perfection, that buttoned-down metaphor that you talk about. And what's difficult with that is it's hard for people who are not living in that place to attach themselves to that. But I've often heard, you know, well, that guy's too perfect.

I could never be like him. Sometimes at Focus, we've taken some grief because, you know, we've had supporters who have gone through divorce. And we'll say, why didn't you contact us to help? And they said, well, I would be embarrassed because you guys, you know, you all seem so perfect.

That's not necessarily a good attribute, is it? When you're authentic, you're saying, okay, we're broken too. We're sinners too. Yet we're trying to follow that path that the Lord has set out to live in accountability, to live righteously, to live humbly. But why do we as human beings want to project something we're not and then give ourselves a badge of honor for it? Yeah, because we're broken, sinful people.

That's why. When I wrote this book, I talk a lot about authenticity in there and what hypocrisy looks like. And what I felt in my spirit was I had to be open about my own issues in this book. And I actually leaned into being more vulnerable than I probably would have been when I started off writing this book. I've got to press you a little, though. Just to make it understandable, what was it?

I mean, what are those Christian blind spots that we have? What did you have, if I could press you on that? And maybe I'll share a couple of mine. What did the Lord say to you when you saw something that wasn't lining up with His Word? For me, it was pride that I had been given the title of President of Biola University, one of America's largest universities. My very first day on the job, I was pulling into campus at 5.30 in the morning, and I noticed that there was a security vehicle, a campus safety car, following me. And I thought, this is great, you get escort service here at Biola. And then when I pulled into the spot, he came up and he said, stay in the car, roll down the windows, and I said, are you joking? And he said, no, I'm not joking.

We take California traffic laws very seriously here, and you've run a stop sign. And I said, oh, I'm sorry. He said, are you here for a conference or something? I said, no, sir, it's my first day on the job.

I must have missed that. I apologize. He said, well, here on out, you take the traffic laws at Biola University seriously. I said, can I go to the office now?

He said, you can go. So I went up to the office, and about an hour later, there's a knock on the door. And there's another campus safety officer, and he said, did you get pulled over this morning?

I said, yeah, I'm so sorry, I ran a stop sign. And he said, well, someone was filling out the report on you of the incident when I got in, and I asked this officer, well, who did you pull over? He said, I don't know, some guy first day on the job, but I told him what for. And so this shift supervisor opens up the website and says, does he look like him? The guy goes, yeah, he looks a lot like him. So that officer works at Home Depot now.

Oh, yeah, right. Hopefully he sent him a note saying, way to do your job, buddy. I mean, everything about Home Depot was true about that story, but that was God's reminder to me day one that I prayed that I would begin this job with a sense of humility and God answered that prayer. And I had taken a great deal of, in my own mind, look at this job that I have, and God's reminding me that you are here not because you're good but because you're called. And that was one of many areas in what I've written where my own fears, my insecurities, my pride, my lack of priorities, where I put it out there in this book because I thought, kindness means you open yourself up and you allow your imperfections to be exposed because that's how you make yourself receivable. It doesn't mean that people will receive you, but it's risky kindness. It's radical. It's hard.

It's countercultural. But you are, in Paul's words, you are the aroma of Christ. And to some you're the smell of life, to others you're the smell of death. But you've got to smell like Jesus, and it's not your job to be received. It's your job to make yourself receivable. And that's what's so hard about living this radically kind life because we want to be thanked and we want to be patted on the back and we want to be recognized and we want to have those prominent seats at the table.

And Jesus says, that's not what I've called you to be. You have to lean into that selfless, sacrificial, receivable kindness and live that way. Dr. Barry Corey is our guest today on Focus on the Family, and he's written a great book called Love Kindness. And the subtitle is Discover the Power of a Forgotten Christian Virtue. You can get that book from us.

We've got the link in the episode notes. Barry, in your book Love Kindness, you talk about a handful of things that are kind of the critical themes. In fact, you've touched on some of the soft edges and what that means, a firm center. You also mentioned some other attributes.

Can you touch on a couple of those that mean the most to you? Yeah, I think we have lost the gift of hospitality. It's easy to invite people into our homes, literally into our homes, who are like us. Same social, economic, family types, political party.

That is easy to do. But if the Kingdom of God ultimately will be every tongue and tribe and nation gathering around that great supper, then we have to reverse engineer that. What does that great supper look like around our supper table?

And how are we willing to bring people to eat with us who may have backgrounds that are very different, ethnically, culturally, politically, religiously? And I think this is the kind of community that God has called us to. What does kindness look like at your dining room table? The cross was the most profound, kind moment of history.

We think of it as bloody and rugged. But that's where God's grace took place for us, and it was flanked by two meals. The last supper, and then after that, Jesus cooking fish for his disciples at breakfast. We have lost, I think, the ability to think about what does it mean to invite someone to our home, to our table.

I've been invited to people who—I lived in Bangladesh for a year—who didn't have much money at all, but those meals were gracious because of the hospitality, not because of how fancy the meal was. It was interesting, back in 1995, when the Republicans took over Congress, one of the things that Newt Gingrich encouraged them to do, these new Republicans, was stay in your homes, back in your communities, live there, and then just commute to Washington. And there are many that say that when that happened, and the families didn't move to Washington, the engagement that those on both sides of the party had with each other at PTA meetings, in local churches, in neighborhoods, at cookouts, it stopped happening. We have stopped being in community with those who are different than we are, and I think that's a travesty. And I think that is one of the reasons why there's so much division in our world today.

Totally agree. In fact, in my friendships with those in Washington, D.C., they'll say that's one of the biggest changes since the Reagan administration, the way back then that Tip O'Neill and Reagan would get together and have a meal. Tom Coburn, former senator of Oklahoma, he was terrific, and he and I had many conversations about his desire to have dinner with then-President Obama. He would have a meal with them every couple of weeks just to touch base with them. And he said, I do that out of my Christian conviction, because if we're having a relationship and dialogue, I can get my points across, and I can hear his heart as well.

Those are great examples of how to do that. But I've got to ask you again, because I want to hear it more clearly, and maybe for conviction, for those that struggle with that, that really want to build the bunker and say, why would I ever interact with somebody like that, or somebody who supports abortion, or same-sex marriage, or just put the noun in there, whatever it is they support that I disagree with. I don't want to mix with them.

I'm uncomfortable. It drives me nuts. It just irritates me and agitates me. And we kind of live in a culture where media plays on that on both sides, on all sides. But what should we be as Christians discerning with respect to that, the brain chemistry of that, the way they're trying to drive ratings by irritating us.

How do we step back from that and say, okay, I'm not going to take the bait, because I have a higher calling before God? You know, I think there are some on the right and some on the left who have chosen to be deaf to conversations. And I think no matter how hard we try, we're not going to make much progress. But I think there are those on the right and those on the left who are actually willing to listen and willing to be engaged in conversation, receptive of our hospitality, because this is where learning takes place. And unless we're having these conversations, we are not making progress. We have given up dialogue for diatribe. We've been so interested in rattling our sabers that we haven't been good neighbors. And if you take God's word seriously, Jesus never had a problem with associating with those who had fundamentally different worldview than he did.

And he was entertaining at home, he was walking the road, he was sitting down on a side of a hill with those who disagreed deeply with the kingdom world that he was describing. And if we are not intentional about establishing these conversations, again, we may get rejected, we may get our feelings hurt, because someone might betray us. They may act like they're being hospitable and they might say something on a blog afterwards. But that shouldn't dissuade us from trying again. This is the antidote to so much that is wrong with our culture today. And it doesn't mean that kindness is timid and milquetoast and fluffy. It is powerful and it is radical and it can reconcile relationships and it can be the key to racial reconciliation. It can bring nations together.

We just underestimate it and we think it's soft when it is revolutionary. And so I believe we have no choice but to keep trying on these conversations. And we can do so in a way that we're not compromising our stand for justice and God's truth and the integrity that the scriptures call us to.

But for crying out loud, you can't love with a bullhorn. Well, some really great insights and timely reminders today on Focus on the Family from Dr. Barry Corey about how to show kindness to others in our culture, especially those who disagree with us. Yeah, John, especially regarding how we see things politically. It's hard to do, but I want to reiterate that our goal here at Focus on the Family is to equip you with the scripture as our guide, to live out the testimony that God has called us to as Christians. If anyone is offended by this or by us, let it be the gospel that offends you and not our behavior or our antagonistic words. Hopefully in doing so, people will see something so different in us that they're compelled to lean in instead of pulling away from the gospel. So maybe ask yourself today, what can I do differently?

Think about inviting someone to your home for dinner who doesn't think the way you think. Jean and I have tried to do that, and we have done it, frankly. And there are other great ideas in Dr. Corey's book to move you in that direction. So I'll make that a challenge to us all and encourage you to get this book, too. Well, I agree it is a good challenge, and you can get your copy of the book by Dr. Corey, Love, Kindness, as well as a CD of this conversation, which includes additional conversation we had with him.

Just stop by the episode notes for the details. And if you've been touched by our work here, let us know that, please, by making a financial contribution to the ministry of Focus on the Family. We want to continue to provide you with the kinds of conversations that we've had today, you can make that donation online, or when you call 800, the letter A in the word family.

800-232-6459. And today, when you make a generous donation of any amount to Support Focus, we'll send a copy of Love, Kindness as our way of saying thank you for joining the support team. Well, next time, a challenge to live out your pro-life beliefs.

The big issue is the girl doesn't actually feel like it's a safe place to go to. When she has an unexpected pregnancy, the church is not the first thing that crosses her mind of like, I need help, let me go to the church and ask if they'll help me. On behalf of Jim Daly and the entire team, thanks for joining us today for Focus on the Family. I'm John Fuller inviting you back as we once more help you and your family thrive in Christ. January is Sanctity of Human Life Month, and you can join Focus on the Family as we love every heartbeat. Make an impact in your family, neighborhood, and community. You'll find ways to participate at FocusOnTheFamily.com slash March for Life.