Combating the Lies That Can Destroy Your Marriage (Part 1 of 2)

I was really struggling as we walked through the aftermath. It just felt like every day was a struggle. It was hard to breathe sometimes. It was hard to just function day to day. And it was so lonely. When Kari learned of her husband's affair, she felt betrayed by God. She lost hope until she heard a Focus on the Family podcast. The reason why I listened to it over and over again is because it felt like I was sitting down with a friend who was telling me, like, I've been there and it's okay. And you can do this and I promise in the end it's going to be worth it.

And it just broke me in a good way. I'm Jim Daly. Working together we can heal more broken marriages, like Kari's, and give families hope. Please call 800-A-FAMILY. That's 800-A-FAMILY.

Or donate at focusonthefamily.com-slash-hope. And your gift will be doubled. The worst question you can ever ask is, how do I have a better marriage?

Because it takes two. The best question is, God, how can I be a better husband? How can I be a better wife?

What is within my control? Dr. Greg Smalley on today's Best of 2020 Focus on the Family. And you'll hear more from him and his co-author, Dr. Bob Paul.

I'm John Fuller, along with your host, Focus President and author, Jim Daly. Marriage is at the forefront of the ministry here, Focus on the Family. And we place such emphasis on it because it's the foundation of the family structure.

It's also a picture of the gospel, reflecting Christ's love for his people. And while marriage can be filled with beautiful moments, there are also challenges. There's no denying that it takes a lot of work and intentionality to have a good marriage.

And when you're prepared to face those challenges, you'll be able to weather the storms and come out better on the other side. This episode with Dr. Greg Smalley and Dr. Bob Paul received outstanding response from you, our listeners, earning its place in our Best of 2020 programs. It's full of great insight, wisdom, and practical advice to strengthen marriage in all seasons. And Greg is Vice President of Marriage here at Focus on the Family and has been in the studio with us a number of times. Bob heads up our Hope Restored Marriage Intensives, and you'll hear more about those as we get into the discussion. Now together, they've written a book called Nine Lies That Will Destroy Your Marriage and The Truths That Will Save It and Set It Free. And we've got copies of that, of course.

The link is in the episode notes. Here now is how the conversation got started. Greg and Bob, welcome to Focus.

Hey, thank you. It's so good to be with you guys. You've been here a few times, Greg. Bob, this is your first time.

First time on the broadcast. Yeah, it's so good to have you. You're normally out in Missouri at Branson and helping couples every day, right? Absolutely.

Absolutely there and in Georgia and in Michigan. So I'm all over the place for Focus. Help us talk about Hope Restored. Just fill in what happens there. Couples arrive Sunday night, typically. Yeah, it's a program that we have, as you know, for couples that are struggling. And generally, in pretty severe crisis, they show up for our mainstay, which is our group program.

They show up Sunday night and then they're there through the day on Thursday and they come often looking for a miracle. Yeah, and it's so exciting. And for those couples who are really struggling, those that are in great difficulty, this is the kind of thing. If you're in that last knot in your marriage rope, give this a try.

So many couples get turned around in this environment. And this program has an 80% post-two-year success rate, meaning 80% of those couples are together and doing better. 97% satisfaction rating that couples come and that the experience exceeds their expectations. 97%. And the bottom line is you'll go away healthier regardless of what happens in your marriage. You'll be a healthier person.

But the best thing is that 80% factor. We are saving marriages each and every day. And my hat's off to both of you, Bob and Greg, for the great work that the team does there in Branson, up in Michigan, and also in Rome, Georgia. So well done.

We hope to be expanding into California. All right. Let me crack this open. You both come from counseling families. Your parents were in.

So man, how messed up are your families? Very. Yeah. I grew up in the home of a guy named Gary Smalley, so kind of one of the original gurus around marriage and family. He was so good. He was so fun and playful. I mean, I've heard him speak a million times and just he's one of the very, very best ones to be with the Lord about four years ago. You know what?

What I love is in where for me, the passion for marriage came from is as a young boy kind of going to watch him. And I was enamored with him up on the stage in front of a thousand people. I'm like, what is happening? Why is he up there? Why are they paying to hear him for what I have to do for free?

But anyway, it's very confusing. But people would come up and they would, you know, literally give me this big hug. Strangers would come up and hug me and say, thank you for sharing your daddy saved our marriage in that left such an impression. And as I got older, what really stood out in why I wanted to follow in his footsteps is because everything that my dad talked about on stage, he really did live out. He wasn't perfect. And we had issues. But I tell you, he really, really lived those things out. So it wasn't that, hey, this public persona of him up on stage is one person in it at home.

It's a train wreck, a disaster. Thus, I don't want to have anything to do with God, with ministry. But that wasn't the case. I was fortunate to have a dad who was consistent and real in who he was on stage is who he was at home. And that's so critical, especially for Christian leaders, for pastors, that what people see is what you are.

And I think anything other than that is hypocrisy, actually. So, Bob, how about your experience? You grew up in Southern California. Your mom and dad, I think, were in the counseling area. It's interesting the similarities as we got together and started working. How many years ago was that? That was 21 years ago.

It was interesting to see the similarities and the differences. Unlike Greg, my family was broken. My parents got divorced, I think, before I was a year old, which was a long time ago.

And divorce was not normal in those days, not like today. I was kind of an oddball because I went every other weekend to my dad and my stepmom's house because both my parents remarried. And I grew up with two families that were relatively intact, no believers, though, in the bunch.

I'm the only Christian in the whole bunch. And my dad and my stepmom along the way became therapists. And because of where we lived in West Los Angeles, they became therapists to the stars. I mean, they were authors also, which was really interesting.

It had bestselling books and did radio and television and so forth, but from a secular viewpoint. And what was really kind of interesting, and I see in hindsight how God kind of got hold of me and prepared me even before I knew him, in that I started having some normal teenage issues with my mother. And I would go to my father and my stepmother and I would complain about what was going on between me and my mom. And they decided to help. So they started giving me books at like 13 that were psychology books, like a book called Parent Effectiveness Training, which I devoured. And then if you could imagine how horrible this was.

That's bad news. I read the book and then I take it to my mom and I say, Mom, you really need to read this. How did that go down? She wasn't excited about that, but I kept reading those books and it started really infiltrating my psyche. And I started learning to think psychologically, no idea that God was preparing me for this work.

I really had no clue, but he was getting me to think differently. All right, let's turn to the book and talk about what you've discovered in your practices, et cetera. One is just marriage in general. When you look at the culture, there seems to be, because of the, I guess the divorce rate and people's disillusionment with marriage, the culture generally is pulling back. You have some of the culture saying we need to do away with the nuclear family.

I think it's crazy. I think it's the beginning of the problems in the culture that we don't have healthy intact families. But what's your read of why the culture is pulling back from the institution of family?

Where did the institution come from and why is it under attack? You know, God created marriage. So man did not, it was God's gift to us and thus it's a post. And so the evil one, Satan hates marriage, hates what it stands for. And I really believe a big part of what's going on in our culture right now is that Satan is so committed to destroy marriage because he fears what our marriage could be.

When you have a husband and wife together figuring out how can we use this gift that God's given us to serve others, to love others, that is one of the most powerful forces on earth. Satan knows that. And so he tries to create chaos. He wants couples to buy into lies that they start trying to live out that completely then destroys their marriage. And that's what Bob and I see when couples come in for an intensive, they've bought into lies. They want a great marriage. These lies though exist, these myths, and they don't get them there at all.

And I really believe it's because Satan is trying to create that chaos because he fears what we could be. Okay, let's get to the, we're going to try to cover the nine today and tomorrow. I don't know that we'll get to all nine, but if you miss any of the program, make sure you download it.

John will give those details in a minute. But let's get to the first one. In fact, you share the story of Zach and Katie who added to their wedding vows and they lived happily ever after at their ceremony. That fairytale idea, that's the first lie.

So take a whack at it. You know, it's interesting that that whole fairytale view of marriage has so infiltrated our western culture for sure. And the idea when you get married is you're hoping that, you know, it starts once upon a time.

And certainly the love that I have right now for my spouse has to be leading toward and they all lived happily ever after. And happiness isn't a bad thing. I mean, frankly, I'm kind of partial to happy and I prefer more than less that I'm convinced God wants us to be happy. But when you think that happiness is the key, that happiness is the goal, you are so set up because obviously God put us here on purpose with purpose. And there's a cosmic battle that's going on between good and evil. And happiness can't be the primary goal. There's a purpose bigger than happiness. Okay, but in that, where are we getting those signals?

The media? How come, A, it's not bad to have a bar to be reaching for? I want a happy, joyful marriage. I think that's okay. Where does that break down to where it becomes a lie, Greg? The lie is that my end in mind is to feel happy versus when I think about my marriage, I think about Aaron and I on this grand adventure. We're on a journey. My goal isn't to be happy. My goal is to journey in this life with Aaron.

Through all the valleys and the mountain tops. Because if my goal is happiness, then what happens when we're not happy? What happens when we're in pain and we're frustrated and something's going on? For me, the goal is growing, is growth, not happiness. I want to keep becoming more like Christ. I want to be a better husband. And so my outlook is not happiness, it's growth on this journey. Okay, but that reality is, that's your goal. Sometimes you've got to say, okay, I don't feel like being a better husband right now.

Yeah. And there are plenty of times I'm sure Aaron would say, yeah, I experience him that way. And I'm human, and there are going to be those moments. And I'm going to go through those seasons where it's about me, I'm selfish, I'm prideful. But at the end of the day, I want to keep growing as an individual and as a husband and having our marriage become a marriage that we are both thrilled with. That's the target. So you're looking at the trend line of your life.

I mean, that's the Christian walk. You want that trend line to be improving over the course of your life, that more of the fruit of the Spirit is who you are over time. Well, we want to help you grow in your marriage. And one great way for you to do that would be to get a copy of this book, Nine Lies That Will Destroy Your Marriage, written by Bob Paul and Greg Smalley. We've got it. Just click the episode notes for the link. All right, Bob, let me throw this one to you.

And Greg, you can add on. The second lie, kind of the equation of marriage and what does it mean? You mentioned that the typical wedding ceremony, which I'm laughing because Jean and I did this, which is the unity candle. It's beautiful. It makes sense.

It's right out of Scripture. I think that two shall become one. And we did it. We had two individually lit candles. We lit the one candle, blew the other candles out together. It was beautiful. I have a tear in my eye.

Yes, I'm glad. Why is that a lie, that the two shall become one? That's right out of Scripture.

Yeah, that part's not a lie. The understanding of what is meant by one is the problem. Okay, give it to me. Okay. So when you try and become one with Jean, I've known you guys for a while now. And as far as I can see, if oneness, becoming one, is your goal, you two are a failure.

Because every time I see you, I see still Jim and Jean. You're right. Two.

Attached at the hip. You're not the same. Yeah, and one of the biggest problems is that because in English, we use the word one to mean multiple things. In this case, to assume it means the number one, we're set up to fail. We can't become the same as one with our spouse. Oneness scripturally is meant to be unity. Oneness in spirit and purpose, not the same. And the other thing is that each of us were created by God on purpose with purpose. And each of us have a unique journey together. When you get married, there's me and there's, in my case, Jenny, and there's us. You add a third journey. And what the problem that I see with the unity candle is what you said happens at the end.

They blow out the individual candles. And when I'm in a wedding, everything in me wants to stand up and start shouting, which of course would be disruptive. They want to kick me out.

They won't invite you back. How many weddings do you strap into a chair when you're in a wedding? Because of that kind of stuff. I hate weddings. I feel at the end of a wedding, I want to go up and end on my card and say, you want to hold onto this because you might need this.

What's so bad about it? I mean, I hear you saying that blowing it out is signifying that now the old me is gone and we're just one. Because the marriage becomes the priority. The marriage becomes the focus.

The individuals then sort of fade away into the background. And all we're saying is that all three have to matter. You, your spouse, and your marriage equally all have to matter and have to be attended to. Well, I think, and I think the idea is you become selfless, more selfless. It's natural for human beings to be selfish. That's why the Lord said, be more like me. And he is selfless, right? He's giving.

And I think that's the construct of it. All right, Bob, you had an example with you and your wife where vacations were a, it sounded like a terrible thing, which is horrible that you're vacationing. I love this example. He hates vacations, weddings. Here's a practical way you could work through this. And it's because we are, John, fundamentally different. And after almost 40 years of marriage, we are still fundamentally different. So vacations were a common problem for us because my idea of the perfect vacation is hanging out on the beach, doing as close to nothing as I possibly can.

Jenny is a pedal to the metal kind of gal. See everything, do everything. Everything. Okay.

We, before we go on a trip, we have to go get the AAA guide and see where all the gems are between point a and point B because the more we can do in that amount of time, the better. So I had stewardship. Come on.

Yeah. I end up at a vacation at the end of a vacation feeling like I need a vacation from the vacation. I'm so exhausted and Jenny go stir crazy doing it my way. So we were trying to figure out a way to resolve this and we prayerfully found a solution. Let's try this and what we decided to do, and this is just one way to work through things, but it's where our differences became a blessing. We decided to try on a trip to Yellowstone and Grand Teton. We had a road trip for three weeks. It was day on, day off.

Day on, day off. The day on, we packed as much in as we possibly can. The day off, we just chilled. And what we found what was so fascinating is that both of us can overdo our part to an extreme and I can actually underdo to the point of boredom and she can overdo to the point of exhaustion. This turned out to be the best vacation we've ever had. And we both ended up refreshed and excited.

It was fabulous. That's great. That's the way it should work.

All right. A lot of these love lies seem to be laced with some truth. I think we're identifying that, which can make them kind of hard to distinguish. You know, what we're talking about with unity and becoming one seems like the right thing.

Hopefully people are understanding your definitions and what the concern is. The third love lies. All you need is love. I want to make sure I attribute that to the Beatles.

I think they coined that phrase, but what makes that a lie? It sounds so good. All you need is love.

Come on, Greg. All you need is love. I think the problem is, is that when it's how people think and define love. So for there's a big group of people that see love is all about that passion, that feeling that they experience, the emotional part of love. And you've got another group that when they think about love, it's that decision. I mean, my father wrote one of his best selling books was Love is a Decision. So there's going to be times you don't feel love and you've got to make that decision.

So you find it's kind of those two camps. It's either the focus is on the emotional feeling part of it or the commitment, the decision. And sadly, they completely miss the truth about love, which is God is love. We don't create love. God is love. And when we begin to understand that there's no part of love that I create and generate, it's not about a feeling. It's not just about a commitment.

It's understanding that, that my job is actually to keep my heart open so that God who is love flows through me. That's one of the best things that we see happen in an intensive is couples begin to really understand that, okay, so maybe part of the problem is that how I view love, like we get all the time, couples will come in and just say, well, I don't feel love anymore towards my spouse. And they think that's the end at that point. That's the end of their marriage because the love is gone. And I'll tell you, the truth is when I'm sitting in the therapist chair at that point, because I understand how love actually works, that's one of the least troubling things anybody can say to me. Because the only reason the love isn't there at that point, since God is love and it all comes from him, is that somehow the top door to their hearts closed and the love is not able to come through. Because honestly, if we want to experience the fullness of love for our spouse, all we have to do is ask the Lord to let us see through his eyes and feel with his heart and it will be there in abundance at that point.

That's the golden nugget right there. I mean, that's what it's all about. Greg, you have a story and sometimes these things can take on small steps. It doesn't have to be something gigantic, although that's good too, but you had a story about just making the bed. I mean, that seems so simple, but it really, it ministered to Aaron, your wife's heart. Yeah.

My wife and I have had this ongoing argument over 20 years of marriage, which is why do we make a bed? I love the comedian. I'm with Aaron. Yeah. I love the comedian Jim Gaffigan comparing making a bed to taking your shoes off and then tying them.

It's like, why? I want to get back into the bed, how I like, how I left it. And so we've just battled that. And I kind of finally went, you know, if you want the bed made, go for it. That that's your choice until she had a foot injury and was in a cast. And I walked into our bedroom and I watched my precious wife in a cast hop around the perimeter of our bed trying to make it. And I said, okay, this is like sick.

There's, okay, seriously, you're going to injure yourself. It's a bed. Let it go. And in the course of that discussion, really understanding why that was so important to her and how much that meant to have a bed made. I finally got it. Yeah.

And thus I realized, you know, that that could even be a part of a way that I sacrificed for her, that I invest in my wife, which is really the, the fourth lie that we see. Well, I was going to ask you about that. Exactly. Yes, and the misunderstanding of the definition of what it means. Yeah.

Go ahead and describe it. Yeah. I think how sacrifice becomes a lie is that we really misunderstand that God has created us with such value in my sacrifice is actually taking this value that's God's given me in using it as an asset, as an investment, as a way to invest in my wife. And so recognizing how important that, that bed was in having that bed made was for her. It gave me a choice.

I mean, I could either take this investment that God's given me me and actually use that as a way, use the time, use the effort, use the energy that it would take to make the bed every day. And so that day I told her, I said, okay, I get it watching you hop around this bed. I get how important this is. I said, from this day forward, I'm doing that.

Let me turn the table a little. We're four guys sitting at this table and I want to represent at least Jean, but maybe women listening as well, because I think women in this perspective, this is tough for them because they believe I have to sacrifice who I am for the sake of my marriage and my husband. So let's put it in that context from a woman's perspective, that sense of sacrifice.

I gave up my career for the family. I gave up this, speak to the need to kind of put that in perspective, how God sees that and what's healthy and unhealthy. Well, I think giving generously is what sacrifice is about, but it's imperative that we recognize who we are in Christ and that for the gift to be of great value, what's being given must be of great value. So to see yourself as less than in any way actually cheapens the gift. When you really get the fullness of who you are and how valuable you are, and then you take that and you invest sacrificially in somebody else, now you've given something of great value, your time, your energy, your gifts, who you are. And it's imperative that when we sacrifice, when we give sacrificially, it's coming from a place of value, not a place of valuelessness.

Let me press you a little bit. So at Hope Restored, you're saying literally hundreds, thousands of couples. How do you prevent that root of bitterness from springing up? Well, we want everybody that comes to really get who they are in Christ. And we work hard for them to see this is not about you being less than, this is about you being fully who you were created to be.

Spread your wings and soar. A great marriage is always one that has room for us to grow into the fullness of who we were created to be, and bring all of our gifts to the table. We're going to pause right there for this Best of 2020 conversation with Dr. Greg Smalley and Dr. Bob Paul on Focus on the Family, and there is a lot more to come to the great discussion.

I hope you'll join us for it next time. Well, John, I really love the heart these men have for hurting marriages. They're fighting every day to help couples restore their relationships, and they are doing a great job. Over the last year, Focus on the Family helped over 100,000 marriages through a crisis, and almost 600,000 marriages have been strengthened through the efforts here at Focus on the Family. And we want your marriage to thrive, and we're here for you. If you have a situation where you're not sure how to manage, get in touch with us, especially if you feel like there's no hope.

We have great, caring Christian counselors who can pray with you and help get you on a path toward healing. And then we have a number of wonderful resources, like the book we talked about today, Nine Lies That Will Destroy Your Marriage and The Truths That Will Save It and Set It Free. And for marriages that really need help, we have our Hope Restored Marriage Intensives that we talked about. We have three locations around the U.S., and they are doing such great work to help husbands and wives like you find hope for their marriages.

In fact, 97% of couples who attend say the experience was above their expectations. One intensive participant wrote to share this message with us. Coming to Hope Restored was tough because we felt little hope. Divorce was on the table.

Hate was in the air, and resentment was pushing us in bad directions. We learned the exact techniques but easy tools to use every day in many, if not every, situation. We felt extremely cared for, listened to, and loved on. We are forever grateful to have our marriage back. Man, I love hearing how God is working through Hope Restored. And for those that support the ministry, thank you. Thank you for reaching in and saving these marriages through Focus on the Family. And Jim, as you know, earlier this year, Dina and I had the privilege of going to Hope Restored in Branson. It was a phenomenal experience, and so much hope came out of that time for all the couples that we talked with.

Yeah. You know, after a challenging year like 2020, Jon, the Christmas season is more welcome than ever. And I'm sure those couples at Hope Restored feel the same way. From the pandemic to violent rioting to contentious election, we all need the hope and peace Jesus Christ came to give us. And this Christmas, with a special holiday gift, you can come alongside families who are struggling. You can give families hope through your support of Focus on the Family. And when you give a gift of any amount today to the ministry, we'll send you a copy of Greg and Bob's book as our way of saying thank you. Your support is critical so that we can finish the year strong and plan to reach even more families in the coming year. I can't wait to see how God is going to work through you and Focus on the Family to reach more families in 2021. Donate and get your copy of Nine Lies That Will Destroy Your Marriage.

Details are in the episode notes. Well, next time, we'll continue this Best of 2020 conversation with Dr. Greg Smalley and Dr. Bob Paul. And for now, on behalf of Jim Daly and the rest of the team, thanks for joining us. I'm John Fuller, inviting you back as we once more help you and your family thrive in Christ. Man, I knew my marriage was falling apart.

I just didn't know how to fix it. I felt like I would always be alone, even if I stayed married. At Focus on the Family's Hope Restored Marriage Intensive, we offer hope to couples in crisis so they can have the marriage they've always dreamed of. For the first time, I felt like my husband truly heard me. I've received some great tools from the counselors that have changed my life and my marriage. To begin the journey of finding health, go to HopeRestored.com today.