Welcome to Family Policy Matters, a weekly podcast and radio show produced by the North Carolina Family Policy Council. Hi, I'm John Rustin, president of NC Family. In each week on Family Policy Matters, we welcome experts and policy leaders to discuss topics that impact faith and family here in North Carolina. Our prayer is that this program will help encourage and equip you to be a voice of persuasion for family values in your community, state, and nation. In this day and age, it should come as no surprise that parents often find themselves shocked by the ideas and topics their children are unexpectedly exposed to.
In fact, recently in Wake County, North Carolina, elementary school students walked into a music class to be greeted by a transgender-identifying teacher, a biological male dressed and presenting as a female. Of course, for many parents, these experiences elicit emotions ranging from frustration to anger, even. Passive avoidance, where they try to just not acknowledge those challenges at all, but any response other than a measured and thoughtful one can send the wrong message to our children and leave them confused and vulnerable to a host of negative cultural influences. Today on Family Policy Matters, we're excited to welcome April Redlinger, Executive Director of Canavox, an educational resource that helps equip parents to effectively and appropriately navigate challenging conversations. With their children, April.
Thanks for joining us today. Hi, John. Thanks for having me.
So first, April, tell us about Canavox. What is your goal as an organization? Yeah, so we are an interfaith initiative, and we help people of all faiths come together to form reading groups where they can help get a deeper understanding about the truth about human sexuality, and then we help them, you know, get this vocabulary to be able to articulate the truth with compassion and clarity. Wow, that's very important. As I said.
Especially in this day and age, well, April here at NC Family, we have long advocated for the fundamental rights of parents to raise their children and to make decisions about their upbringing. Things like their education, healthcare, who they hang out with, all sorts of matters. Of course, this also includes conversations about sexuality and related topics. Where does Canivox fit within this realm of discussion, advocacy, and even action? Yeah, so we absolutely one hundred percent.
Agree with that, and it's actually even written into our seven Canabucks cheerpoints. It's actually our number six cheerpoint, and it says that parents have the right and responsibility to direct and guide the education of their children. And it's exactly what we're doing, like why we exist, right? To help parents learn about these issues and be able to form themselves so that they they can go in turn and form their children. They're the primary educators on all things, especially especially sexuality, and so we want to help them.
Become better for them, so they can talk to their kids.
Well, that's so true, and this education is not just in the education realm. In you know whether children go to public school or homeschooled, Christian school, private school, whatever, but kids are inundated these days through social media, through just all kinds of sources, through their friends. They're getting educated in lots of different ways, and it's so important to have these conversations, to have a welcoming environment where children feel comfortable discussing matters that may be confusing to them or offensive to them. With their parents, yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
Well, April, I know a lot of the resources and materials that Canavox provides focuses on natural law and the role it plays in the foundational concepts of sexuality. Tell us a little bit about that. Yeah, so great question.
So at Canavox, we rely on a natural law framework for talking about sexuality with our kids, and basically, this framework focuses on helping children appreciate their biological nature.
So whether they're male or female, it helps them in Pursuing sexual integrity, and then also helping them to navigate the romantic feelings they may have as they get older towards healthy marriages. And this framework really is in opposition; it's like opposed to the progressive liberalism framework that's out there that you see often in public schools. But then it's reinforced in the culture. You know that framework that is really primarily on harm reduction, promoting consent, and then safe sex.
So natural law—it's not a new or obscure idea. It's something that's really been around a long time. It goes, it goes back, you know, thousands of years with origins of in teachings like from Aristotle and Cicero, and then later developed by thinkers such as Thomas Aquinas, John Locke, Montesquieu, and also if you look back to the founding documents, right, you can see references to natural law in our founding documents in the United States, and then also the writings right of Thomas Jefferson, John Witherspoon, James Madison.
So it goes back quite a while. Natural law really affirmed. A few key ideas, right? That one, that there is this universal moral law, one that applies to all people, right, no matter their background, their religious affiliations. None of that.
It's just this universal moral law. Second, is that the moral law is knowable by human reason, so it doesn't depend on revelation, but it certainly is in line with the insights of most of the world's religions. Third, is that it's it's grounded in human nature, right? It reflects on what it means to. Be human and to flourish as a human, so we can begin to see goodness and justice.
It requires all of us, right? And then fourth, it really is a standard for our laws and society.
So it's not just something we invent, like a social construct. It's really something that we're meant to discover and then live up to. We're not just talking to our kids through this framework in order to avoid sexual disasters. You know, we do want to avoid all that. Those are all bad, but we aim for much higher goals, and the natural law helps us do that, right?
It helps us to pursue virtue.
Well, and the fact that.
So foundational, so fundamental, I think helps give parents confidence that, as you said, these are not just made up ideas. These are ideas that are based in truth, in fact, in the way that we were formed, and because of that, parents can take great confidence in relying on.
Well, and I would say, as the leader of a Christian organization, God's graciousness in providing you know the so-called playbook for us, He reveals all of this to us that His truth. And because of that, we can rely on it, and it just manifests itself throughout our culture and society, socially and otherwise, as we relate to each other and the world around us. Yeah, and I think when parents think of it that way, they realize that you know it's something that they have within them and that they can actually use to help their children have a better understanding of their sexuality. Right. Once they realize that, they're like, "Yeah, no, I understand this.
I think they inherently understand it." Right. I agree. I think that they do, but it's sometimes we just have to spell it out a little bit. And so I think once they understand. That they're like, oh yeah, I get this.
Sure.
So, at what point should these sometimes uncomfortable conversations begin, and if ever, when should they end?
Okay.
Well, I don't know if they ever end. I have a 21 year old, and I'm still having these conversations. Right? She's in college, and we still have these conversations. But good for you.
Yeah. Yeah. No, it's actually great. But I think they start, you know, really early. We say at Kinderbox, they really start early by laying a foundation for your kids.
So the answer is going to vary a bit from family to family because. It really depends on your child's personality, their maturity level, their degree of curiosity. Right, curious kids are going to ask questions at an earlier age, and it also depends on your own personality and the circumstances. Like, did something happen? Do you need to bring up this conversation because you're addressing an issue that happened?
But generally, we recommend starting early. In fact, we say you know better a year too early than five minutes too late, because in establishing yourself as an expert on these things and having your kids go talk to you repeatedly over the years about these topics, when you start early. You establish yourself as the expert, and you know, establish that confidence that your kid has in you.
So we say, start early. Have many layered conversations. You know, throughout their childhood, it's not just that one and done talk. I think, you know, from my parents' perspective, I think, you know, back in the day, they thought it was like, here's the talk, you get the talk, and it's done. Right.
You know, that's not the best way to approach it. It's really these several incremental conversations over the years. But you can start early in an appropriate way. Yeah, I like that laying a foundation. Then building on it as you go along, and as it's appropriate in as children age, but providing that kind of bottom layer, fundamental standard, and growing from there—that's great.
So, April, in your book, "Courageous Conversations: Tips for Talking to Your Kids About Sexual Identity and Attraction," you discuss seven essential parenting principles. We love to just hear just a brief explanation of what those are. Yeah, and we also we created this little tip sheet for parents too that comes along. With the book, there's a few more, but the seven basic parenting principles. These are things that I think a lot of parents are already doing, but we just lay them out as a reminder and give them some helpful ideas on how they can continue to do those things.
But the first one is prioritizing the parent-child bond.
So key, right? Just building that connection, that trust, that confidence. You can do this through lots of different ways, right? Playing games with your kids, just you know, talking to your kids in the car. You know, when you're having conversations driving down the road.
But just really Build that connection through shared time and affection, laughter, right humor. Kids, little ones especially, they love that, right? You know these one-on-one moments.
So you build that connection, and then number two, this is what I mentioned earlier, right? Being the expert, teach them first. Don't wait for the world to shape your child's idea and thinking about sexuality. You be the one, and like we say, it's a better one year too early than five minutes too late, because you know your kids are always going to come back to you, knowing that. You know the answers, right?
The third, tailor the truth to their age.
So speak honestly to young children and give more reasoning as they get older. And the tween years, right? They want to know more wise about things, but just adjust your explanations based on their ages, right?
So just always focus it and make it appropriate to their age. The fourth is engaging and frequent and calm dialogue. This is one that I always work on. The one big talk, like I said, is you know you have to have a talk, but you need to make the talks frequent and you have to be calm about them. Ask questions, right?
We say ask lots of questions. Try not to show shock or judgment, and do a lot of listening.
Okay, and you know always ask like where did you hear that from? Like where did that come up? How do you you know things like that, right? The fifth is what we talk. About a little bit earlier too, as well the appealing to natural law, but we also say natural law, science, and philosophy.
So when explaining these moral truths, you can look to these areas to be able to connect them to reason, right? Biology, universal human nature, and teens really, especially this is great for teens, right? Because it is very helpful to them to be able to explain something from science or biology. They love that, you know. They love to see these.
This is concrete evidence of like why we're talking about this way, right? Avoid extremes in parenting, right? We try to say go the middle ground. You don't want to be too harsh, but you don't want to be too lenient either, right?
So try to do the middle way with like courage, calmness, and clarity, and compassion too. Don't forget that. And then the last one, this is key. We say model integrity and consistency.
So when conflict arises, which inevitably will, try to stay rooted in the truth while remaining like loving and just. You know, sometimes teens. Especially like to test the boundaries, model the integrity with consistency, and it really will help in the long run.
So those are the seven. But like I said, this little sheet that we have that comes along with our book, we have a few more just to help parents be able to talk about all of these different things.
Well, that's super helpful because I know in the heat of the moment, at times it can be very difficult to maintain sanity and you know and even keel. And I think it's so important that, as you said, that when parents are communicating with their children, especially about these challenging cultural. Issues that they do it in a calm way and in a way that maintains consistency and confidence and those ideals that are going to really help the child understand and move through challenging circumstances with a good foundation. That's great. And these tips are reminders.
You know, we're parents. We're not perfect. Everybody, you have a lot of things coming our way.
So these are just like reminders, right? They're kind of just guides to just help you step back, think about them, and you. You know, even if some people are like, "Well, I messed that up. I did that wrong." You can always go back. You always have a second chance to try to change things or fix things.
And if you don't know an answer right away, you don't always have to answer right away. You can say, "You know, let me think about that a little bit. Let me ponder that." Because some parents, you know, in the heat of the moment, when they're posed with a question, they're like, "I don't know that answer." Let me think about that a little bit, and then you go and you do some research, and you bring it back up again. And it actually is a good opportunity to continue conversations, right?
So it's not always just like, "Here's a question. Here's an answer." You you know, you establish that relationship, right? You're still doing that. Relationship building, there. Yeah, that's great.
And on that note, I know April that Canavox provides an entire resource for parents that really mirrors real conversations that they can have with their kids.
So, I mean, you've you've already touched on this, but why are these models and conversational examples so important and particularly helpful for parents? Yeah, I mean, personally, I think. But also, you know, the Canavox way is the best way to learn is really by example, right?
So we give the foundation, we give the philosophy, we give the Biology and the social science in the first few chapters of our book, right? Just because you need that, right? You need that background information. But then the later chapters, and four, five, and six, this really where the rubber meets the road. We give parents specific examples of things that all of our leaders around the world.
We kind of pulled all of our thoughts together and came up with like scenarios that were frequently happening all around the country. And you know, being able to put those out there, lay it out there for parents helps them think about how they're going to engage. You know, with whatever question it is, or a situation that may happen in their schools, or with friends, family, all those things.
So it's helpful to see how other people handle things, so that you can kind of learn from that and see how you would react yourself. I mean, like again, these are just guidelines for people. You don't have to say these things specifically. You should always put it in your own language. How are you going to say these things?
But they just help seeing what other people do, learning by example. Yeah, that's great. So, how can parents get connected with Canavox groups? That exist near them, and even start one of their own. Yeah, so they can go to our website and click on the prompt.
The website is canavox dot com, and they can click on the prompt where they can start a group, or they can email us at info at canavox dot com. That's great. Lots of super resources. Great things for parents and for young folks as well. And let me provide that website again.
It's canavox, and that's c a n a v o x dot com, and we would. Just encourage our listeners to take advantage of all the helpful resources that exist there. Thank you for listening to Family Policy Matters. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to the show and leave us a review. To learn more about NC Family and the work we do to promote and preserve faith and family in North Carolina, visit our website at ncfamily.org.
That's ncfamily.org, and check us out on social media at ncfamilypolicy. Thanks, and may God bless you and your family.
