The Impact of a Good Man: David & Meg Robbins

Welcome to Family Life Today, and welcome. How do you feel when I say that? It's a special day.

It is a special day. We sort of feel welcomed. Good. You said it like four times. What do you want from me?

Like a new car or something like that? Yeah, that would be nice. Too bad. Welcome to Family Life Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at familylifetoday.com.

This is Family Life Today. So, Dave and Ann Wilson are here and special guests, David and Meg Robbins. Welcome to you.

Welcome to you as well. Today is a special day because we're talking about different clips that we've heard from the past year. No, it's special because you're here, Shelby.

That's right. You didn't tell our listeners who you are. You're Shelby Abbott. Yes, and you know, it's a good day to be talking about what God did over this past year. We went through, we combed through all the guests that we had, and we pulled out different clips, nuggets of wisdom that people shared with us over the last year in 2023, and today we're talking about the impact of a good man.

The memoir of David Robbins. We'll be talking about pride tomorrow. This is going to be a good day. We've got a day featuring, like I said, some of the best from Family Life Today, and the impact of a good man is what we decided for today. So, men in general have taken a lot of heat in recent years, and here at Family Life, we've been reminding listeners of the impact a good man can have on families and communities.

A good impact. So, we'll kick things off with a voice our listeners will definitely recognize. Brant Hansen has been a frequent guest, and for a good reason. He's a listener favorite. So here, Brant gives us a clear, compelling definition of what a good man is.

Check this out. Adam was given a job, and it's keeper of the garden. So, that wasn't something that was articulated to Eve.

She's given another incredible role, like an expansive role, this Azer rule, which is a word that's used for God as rescuer later on in the Old Testament many times. But for Adam, keeper of the garden is his thing, and so everything falls apart when he doesn't do his job. And that's what I'm trying to say, unpack that for guys to go, look, you don't have to be jacked. You don't have to have ripped abs.

You don't have to have incredible four by four. Those things are fine, but they're not the point. The point is providing security for the people around you, starting with the people in your home, but emanating out from there.

Being a keeper of the garden means you're somebody who creates the space around you with whatever influence you have, the vulnerable or secure there. And people get to thrive and bloom because of what you do. And it can be like, for me, I just traffic in words. That's my thing. But for other people, they have other abilities and skills, but that's what we're for.

And I make the point, I try to make this really vividly, and I'm telling guys, this isn't why you do this, but it should help you understand that it is what you're supposed to be doing. Women find it wildly attractive. It's true. It's true. Why do women find that attractive? I think when a man serves, when he lives out who God called him to be, when he's the protector, when he is the one that's there to provide justice, there's something that's so attractive about that man that we're drawn to that man.

Well, it's across cultures. And it's not this, I own you protection stuff. It's I'm there to be a fan of my wife. I want her to thrive and bloom.

Same thing with my kids. The people around, like I'm somebody who creates space for that. If you think about it too, a garden is somewhere where species that normally wouldn't thrive in the wild get to bloom and become everything like this incredibly beautiful species. That's my job. You don't have to be a great looking guy.

You don't have to have incredible abs. If you make her feel secure, your wife will find you attractive. And conversely, if you make her feel insecure, all the muscles or the motorcycles or the cool tats in the world will not help. Like if you don't make people feel secure to thrive around you, you're not being a keeper of the garden. You're being the opposite of, you're actually the, you're the invader of the garden. Man, Brent has a bit of an obsession with rip dabs, doesn't he? He talks about that a lot. Well, I mean, what is your response to this? You know, our executive producer Jim shared this with me about manhood specifically not being a firm grip, but a green thumb and him talking about cultivating that garden. How would you respond to that as a manhood thing? I want to hear Meg's opinion on this. Let's hear what you think, Meg. Like I'm just this, everything that he talked about too. I like the green thumb thing. How's David at this? He's great at this. That was not what I didn't ask there.

True. I think this is a really powerful word picture even because I was thinking about just what it takes. I don't have a green thumb in real life, but just what it takes, the patience, the waiting, like getting in the dirt and cultivating what needs to be there. And I mean, thinking of our home and just the patience it takes when our kids are not blooming into the beautiful thing that day that you want them to be. And you see like glimpses of those things. I mean, I feel like you, David, you do a great job of calling them up to God's vision for them and believing that God has written a story for each one of our kids or for our family and obviously beyond that. But trusting and believing that and moving us toward those things, whether that's, I mean, when you think of a gardener, you know, the watering, the digging, like all that happens there and those are, this can be painful and laborious, you know, but there's also got to be patience and tenderness that I don't think we always think of that as like manhood, you know, patience and tenderness.

But yet I feel like those are qualities that I do see in you. I mean, I'm just sitting here going, man, I was just getting totally convicted while I was listening. And so it's just as a reminder, it's really good to affirm and call out the things that you see in your spouse. Cause I was listening to those few minutes with my spouse sitting beside me going, oh no, you know, like we're about to respond to this together. And cause I know my tendency and he spoke to both to like, okay, we tend the things that God's asked to put our hand to and yeah, I get to be family life president. I can't believe God's called me to this. It's trusting him by faith every day.

I don't have everything it takes. He makes me empowered to do this, but I can end up getting consumed with that part of the garden more than the inner garden, the inner court, which is my family and my home and especially my bride. And I'm going, am I creating space to help her bloom and flourish? And that's the journey we the journey we continue to be on. And there are seasons in life where we're teaming and it's thriving.

There are seasons where, okay, let's talk this out. Let's process more. And am I making space for that? And that's what we get to keep doing. That's why we do family life today is to keep these relationships and for helping men, like myself, pursue those relationships that matter most to us well.

Yeah. Why is it so important? You talk about this a lot and I really get that sense from you, not just from the stage or behind a microphone, but personally, you believe that it's important to create and cultivate within family life.

Why do we stress that so much? You know, it's just a core belief that families are one of the most untapped resources on the planet to help bring good and flourishing to local communities and to help fulfill Jesus's Great Commission. The Great Commission, Matthew 28, that authority has been given to Jesus and He gives it to us to go make disciples and to fulfill God's plan on earth. Families in the homes that they are already placed in, to the people around them and to the communities they're in and to the spheres of influences we're in, can go expand God's kingdom in unique ways.

They're already an arm's reach to so many people. And so a godly home, living out that in their own home and pursuing grace and truth in their home, no home's perfect, but bringing the grace and truth of Jesus in their own home begins to overflow to the homes around them with intentionality. It really is a way that the world will be changed. It was Jesus's model. It was Jesus's plan. And that's why we're so passionate about helping homes continue to grow into godly homes is because we know that will help fulfill Jesus's plan of extending the kingdom to the people around them.

And that's why we unapologetically invite people to give to family life today and to contribute this important year and month that we're in where we have this matching challenge where every gift you give can be double dollar for dollar. It's because we really believe that families are such an important part of God's plan and God's kingdom growing on earth as it is in heaven today. That's the way it was in Acts. That's the way it was in the Old Testament.

And it's the way it is today. And so we invite you to give today a gift of any amount. Every gift matters because this is your end. So much of what's given this month fuels ministry in the year ahead. And so I'd invite you to give a gift today.

And you can do that at familylifetoday.com. As well said, David. You know, as I said earlier, men have gotten kind of a bad rap, sometimes, for good reason. Well, there was a series this year on family life today with researcher Nancy Piercy that was eye-opening and a little bit provocative.

So, it's good news for men and it's also a warning. The studies have found that evangelical family men, meaning husbands and fathers, who attend church regularly are the most loving husbands and the most engaged fathers. So, compared to the average American family man, evangelical men are the most loving to their wives and yes, they do interview the wives separately.

That's important because women wouldn't necessarily be honest. And the women report the highest levels of being happy with the way their husbands treat them with feeling loved and appreciated. They are the most engaged with their children, both in shared activities like sports and church youth group, and in discipline, like setting screen time or setting bedtime. They are the least likely to divorce of any group in America. And here's the real stunner.

They have the lowest rates of domestic violence of any major group in America. Wow. I had to read mostly academic sociological journals to pull this out. But it was there.

It was there. But what happened is the sociologists went back to the data then. It turns out truly committed Christian men who do attend church regularly, that's a fairly reliable correlate of whether they are truly committed Christians, authentic Christians, versus nominal. I mean, am I right in what I read you saying that the difference is if you're a practicing evangelical man, all the things you just said are true. If you're nominal, you're worse than a secular man.

Yes. First, their wives are the least happy. They're the least engaged with their children in terms of shared activities and discipline. They have the highest level of divorce, higher than secular men. And they have the highest level of domestic violence of any group in America, higher than secular men. And this is what the church is up against then, because they are claiming to be Christian. I thought, you and I probably hang out mostly with very committed Christian men. So we think, oh, those nominals, that's probably a small group, right?

No, they're about the same size. Some people ask me, well, why are they worse than secular men? It seems to be they hang around the Christian world enough to get the language of headship and submission. And then they insert secular meaning of dominance, control, entitlement, and so on. But they've picked up the language that makes them feel more justified in those kinds of attitudes. And so they end up actually being worse than secular men.

It's really sobering to hear. Now, some people might be going, what does nominal mean? It's basically in name only. So not in practice, that's what nominal means. So it really means it's kind of scary because two men can be sitting in a pew on a Sunday morning, and their lives in terms of behavior could look identical on the outside, but their hearts and the way that they act at home with their families and their wives can be on two entirely different planets.

So they can look the same in a church pew, but they can be in two totally different places in terms of how they live their lives. When I read Nancy's book, and then we had our own family life today, I just felt like, what a message to men. And again, it's all research-based.

So it's just like, here's the facts. I was like, you want a great marriage? You want to be a great dad? Go after Jesus.

That's what I heard. It's like, get serious about your faith because we think it's all these other things and they are important. Get to a weekend to remember.

It literally will change your life. But it was such an encouragement to say, man, if you really want to be the man you want to be, and I know every husband, we want to be good husbands. We want to be good men.

We want to be good dads. I think often we think the spiritual side, so it's, you know, it's a part of our life, but no, if it's not the most important, you're not going to do well. And it comes back to your walk with God. I felt like Nancy taught men this and I was inspired by it. I just want to say, thank you, Jesus men. Jesus men, Jesus and men, or Jesus men? Men that are totally committed to Jesus because they're making a difference. And it's really important that we as men surrender our lives because sometimes wives are scared.

They don't even know who they're going to wake up next to in the morning, depending on that guy's mood. But I think it's easy maybe to sit here at this table and go, those men are like this. It's really important to remember David, Dave, but for the grace of God going.

Yeah. I would just say this is that moment to go, am I going through the motions right now? To ask that question for ourselves, for every one of us men listening, going, how much am I just going through the motions, doing the mundane, checking off, going to church? Is my heart connecting and pursuing Jesus?

Because the ramifications of just going through the motions for too long really become pretty profound. But the ramifications of pursuing Jesus alive and well and with everything you got also is even more powerful. There's a position I think all of us need to just get on our knees and say, God, forgive us, oh Lord, and give us the power.

Have mercy on me, oh God, a sinner. Thinking about this theme today that we're talking about at Family Life Today, it's the impact of a good man. One quality you'd think would be welcome in our men is vulnerability. But according to Kelly Capik, that's just not always the case. Listen to this. You know, Brene Brown, and she did this TED Talk on vulnerability.

And last time I checked, I think it's like 60 million views. And one of her later, I don't think it's actually in a written form, it's an audio book. And it's like men, women, and vulnerability, something like that. And she tells this amazing story that I'd love for your listeners to hear, because she's signing books on vulnerability, you know, this kind of thing, and a huge line. And this woman and two daughters come and a husband come, and she starts to sign the books. And the husband says to her, I really love your book.

I love everything you have to say about vulnerability. And she says, thank you. And then the wife says, you know, let's go.

And he's like, no, I have something else to ask Brene Brown. And the wife's like super uncomfortable. And she's like, no, we got to go. And the husband's like, no, I'm going to ask her something. And she's like, all right, me and the girls will be in the back.

So it's just her and this line behind him. And he says, I noticed that when you write about vulnerability, you never write about men. And I love everything you have to say. But why don't you and she said, when she talks about it later, she said, Oh, I thought I had a great answer. She just said, because I never study men.

I just study women. And he said, Oh, isn't that convenient? And then he said, because guys, when we try and be vulnerable, we get the blank kicked out of us.

And then he said to her, before you start talking about those mean coaches and unfair dads and cruel dads and all that, he said, I'm just going to tell you that woman and those girls that just went by, they would rather see me die on my white horse than fall off. All right, guys. It's pretty powerful.

I forgot about that one. Anne, do you have a knee-jerk reaction to that? I think she does. I wonder, like, I'm going to look at you, Meg, and think, is that true for us? Like, I want Dave to be vulnerable. I long for his heart. But do I care for his heart? You know, when he does open up, I think we as women can be, I can be mean sometimes and defensive sometimes. And that makes me sad for our men to think that we'd rather have this image of who they think we want instead of, like, let me share the inner parts of my heart with you. I long for that, but am I good at receiving it? That's a good question.

What did you think? That's a great question. And I think it made me question, am I setting the table for David to enter into that? Exactly. You know, because, like you said, I long for him to crack open his heart more and continue to let me into what he's really feeling and thinking at some levels. But in other places, I'm like, am I being like this woman who actually has this certain idea or what she wants?

And she's, therefore, kind of putting up a fence and not allowing her husband to do that. I think we can say, our kids are needy. I don't need you to be needy, too. You know what I mean?

You don't need that extra kid. Yeah, pull it together and just be the man. Well, I mean, part of what I'm thinking, we started today with Brant Hansen saying a woman is attracted to a man who makes her feel safe and secure. And that means a man has to be strong. And so I know I want to be strong for you so that you feel safe and my kids feel safe. And so to let down my guard and say I'm weak and I'm scared and I'm afraid right now is not always easy to say, even to a woman that I know longs for it.

Ooh, this is conflicting. You know, though, the thing that I experience with you, Meg, and then I hear Dave and Ann, you know, talk and process all the time. When I'm complaining or just like kind of venting, well, I can see how that may be what cultivates. But when I am talking about the probably improper places, I'm going for emotional security or baseline connectedness or core identity and how I lunge after these things and I'm opening up about, I feel like I have to prove it today or tomorrow and I'm living under this pile of prove it-ness, you know, prove it, prove it.

You want that vulnerability. You are pointing me to Jesus. You're affirming me.

You're not placating me. You're letting me sit in the rawness of it, but you're pointing me to someone greater. And there's that difference of that is what women want, but yet as men, are we cracking open to that baseline security space? Because if we want being truly loved, then we've got to succumb to the mortifying ordeal of being truly known. Like that actually has to, we all have to offer ourselves up to that, both men and women. And the truth is that is real strength.

When I am weak, then I am strong. It's just a reminder of what we aspire to here at Family Life Today. Every day, we want to be a place where you find encouragement and practical hope, even when you fall short of pursuing the relationships that matter most.

We fall short of that. We all do. There really truly was only one perfectly good man. His name is Jesus Christ. And in this final clip, which was without a doubt, one of, if not my favorite moment on Family Life Today this year. So we hear from a gentle man named Paul Miller, who perfectly captured the heart of true manhood found in Jesus. This is compelling stuff here.

Listen to this. The very first resurrection appearance of Jesus, Mary Magdalene has come back the second time. She's weeping. There's a couple angels in the, in the tomb and she's talking with them.

They know where the body is. And then she turns around and there's Jesus standing there just looking at her. He's been watching her whole conversation. He, and he's not said anything. And he says to her, this is all in John 20. I'm not making any of this up. And then he says to her, you know, why are you weeping?

What are you seeking? I mean, he's just cracked the code that has held all of creation in death. And he's looking at one person. He's attentive to one person and he asks her questions. And then she ignores Jesus' question. She doesn't care what Jesus is thinking.

She didn't ignore the angels. I mean, she doesn't know it's Jesus, obviously. And she says, look, she's so focused on Jesus' body. She's so madly in love with Jesus. She's so offended that, that they've stolen his body.

I mean, what could you want with his body? And she thinks he's the gardener. And she says, you know where his body is. And that's when Jesus says, Mary, his announcement that death has been destroyed, that hell has been broken, and that billions of people are going to come to faith and there's going to be a new heavens and a new earth. And then he himself was the first piece of that resurrection is one word is her name.

It's the name of a person. Isn't that compelling? It's just so incredible. And do you have any thoughts on this kind of gentle, powerful, personal love expressed by Jesus here? I mean, when he says, he's cracked the code on death. And yet the first word he says is, Mary, I don't know how you all feel, but he calls each of us by name. He's the God of the universe who's created the heavens and the earth. And yet he calls us. He whispers our name. Sometimes he shouts it. That's how loving and personal he is. He died for us and then calls us and draws him to, I mean, we're all teary because like, that's who he is. That's the gospel.

And that's what I long for. That's why we do what we do. Yeah, it really is. And that's such an important part of what we're trying to do at Family Life today. You know, we deeply care about Christians, but we deeply care about the individual Christian. And David Ann, you do this so well.

You talk about this every single day. You have great conversations that take us to Jesus. They constantly remind us of what the truth is, that the answer is not in self-help. It's in the Savior of all mankind, who saved billions, as we just heard there from Paul, but he knows our name.

He knows me personally. We deeply care about that here at Family Life today. And this is what we do. We want you to also join us in helping to reach the masses and the one. And you can do that by giving and partnering with us here at Family Life today. You could do that in a unique way this month because every gift that is given is going to be matched dollar for dollar. We have some generous donors who are going to participate in a matching program, so everything that you give this month is going to be matched and doubled, essentially. So, that means if you give $50, it turns into $100. If you give $100, it turns into two. You can figure out the math from there. So, we appreciate you being a part of this ministry.

You can go online to familylifetoday.com with your donation, or you can give us a call at 800-358-6329. That's 800, F as in family, L as in life, and then the word today. Now, before we finish today with this whole concept of a good man, I'm thinking of that female listener who is feeling unseen by all this. Maybe she's married to a man who isn't there yet, or maybe she's single and not really in a close relationship with a man at all. Well, I have good news. We have not forgotten about you. Tomorrow will be a special edition of Family Life Today, featuring an absolute gem of a guest from 2023, Nana Dulce. In fact, we're just going to call tomorrow Nana Dulce Day.

It's just fun to say, because she was that good. We'll be featuring snippets where Nana drew our hearts to some of the women of the Bible, who, though they may have felt unseen at the time, lived a life of faith that draws our eyes toward the coming Savior. That's tomorrow. We hope you'll join us. On behalf of David Ann Wilson, I'm Shelby Abbott. We'll see you back next time for another edition of Family Life Today. Family Life Today is a donor-supported production of Family Life, a crew ministry helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.