A Stronger MIL/DIL Relationship: Barbara & Stacy Reaoch

When you become a mother-in-law, your main goal at that stage of life is the success of this marriage, and you're not a coach. You're the cheering team.

You're saying you can do this. How can I help you? I'm Shelby Abbott, and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson. You can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com or on the Family Life app. This is Family Life Today.

I'm not sure a lot of our listeners know, but for 35 years, I led a Bible study for the Detroit Lions' wives and their girlfriends. Every year, I would hit one topic, and it was so explosive that I couldn't even contain the room because of the loudness, because they couldn't stop talking, because they were angry, because they needed to vent. And do you know what that topic was?

I know. I want to hear you say it out loud. It was how to deal with your mother-in-law, and it was explosive. I'd have to say, everyone, we need to just wait a minute, just stop, because they wanted to talk about it. And we're going to talk about this today, the mother-in-law and daughter-in-law topic. Yeah, we've actually got a mother-in-law and daughter-in-law in the studio.

Same last name, and you would think maybe it's mother-daughter, but no. We have Stacey, who's married to Barbara's son, so we have Barbara and Stacey Riach in the studio, so welcome to Family Life. Thank you so much. It's great to be here.

So excited to be here. And it's pretty brave of you guys, because there are not many books that are on this topic of a mother-in-law and a daughter-in-law, and you wrote this book together. Tell us a little bit about yourselves before you start, though. Barbara, you start, you've been married how many years? We've been married 50 years. And you have how many kids?

We have three grown children and seven grandchildren. Wow. And Stacey's married to number one? Yes. All right. Talk about that little thing. It was interesting as I read your book. By the way, we didn't mention it.

It's called Making Room for Her. Tell us a little bit about this journey, because it sounded like you were dating and you broke up. Yeah, we have quite a story, but Ben and I, so Ben is Barb's oldest son, met in high school. Barb, so here you are.

Your oldest is 17 years old, and he has a girlfriend. How did this come about, and what did you think about that? Well, Stacey is darling and wonderful. And so when Ben brought Stacey home for the first time, we just thought, boy, that's great. She's a gem.

He was a football player. She was a darling little pom-pom person. But one thing that I really did love about Stacey is that she liked to be with me. It wasn't that she was just all about Ben, although, truth be told, that was, you know, the main thing that brought her into our home. But it was so sweet that she and I could carry on a conversation, because honestly and truly, it's not common to find people from different generations who can actually sit down and enjoy being friends. So what was it like to meet the family? Was this your first boyfriend, or have you had a few boyfriends at this point?

She's smiling. I think she had a few. It was my first more serious boyfriend. Okay. But it didn't last?

Well, we dated for two years. Oh, wow. So during that time, the Lord was really working in my heart and drawing me to Himself. I thought I was a Christian.

Yeah. But I started to see differences, you know, in Ben's life and even in his family's life, in my life, of just, I said I was a Christian, but I never opened my Bible. You know, I didn't really have any concept of sin and the need for a Savior. All those things started to come together freshman year when I went away to Michigan State, and a staff member from CREW came and knocked on my door and invited me to coffee, shared their faith with me, and started to disciple me. And so I started to join Bible studies and grow in my faith. And Ben, at the same time, was at Wheaton, a Christian college. He had gone to be an engineer, but then felt God calling him to ministering. And I remember the phone call when he called and told me this and said, God's calling me to some kind of full-time ministry, and I don't know if it's going to be missions overseas or a pastor, but He's calling me. And my thought was, I don't want to raise my kids in a hut in Africa. That was my original, you know, I really had no idea what missions entailed.

All I could think of was like moving to Africa. So we were obviously at two very different places in our walks. So that summer, Ben broke up with me, which was devastating. Because you weren't on the plan with him and didn't seem to... We were just two different points spiritually, and he knew we needed time apart. I was thinking, wait, I'm finally a real Christian, and you're breaking up with me.

Like, this doesn't make sense. But of course, in hindsight, I see how the Lord—we were broken up for two years, and I see how God used that time to mature us and grow us. And Barb, you two, even after they broke up, you and Stacey stayed friends. How did that come about?

What happened, Stacey? Well, I did really love his family. I think because I was growing in my faith, and I knew they were interested in that, and they were super supportive. And so I went on a summer project and told them about it, and they supported me and wanted to hear about it. And of course, I didn't want to see Ben, because that was too hard. So I remember emailing Barb to see, can I step over and tell you guys about my trip when Ben's not home. So they were a brother and sister in Christ, in addition to my ex-boyfriend's parents.

And I was excited to share with them what I was learning and the ministries I was involved in, and knew that they would be really excited for me. That's super unusual, you know, to have a high school girl that's broken up. She and your son are broken up, but she's coming to your house. That's really special and sweet.

Our son started dating his wife at 17 years old, but they've known each other since 12. And I'll usually tell my friends, be very careful on what you say and how you treat your son or daughter's boyfriend or girlfriend, because they might end up being in your family. So to say things that are really harsh or mean, that could come back to hurt you.

Absolutely. So I'm guessing you didn't say anything harsh or mean. I'm sure I did, but Stacy chose to forget it. But the first impressions can be pretty lasting. Especially if they're dating someone that isn't at a place spiritually that you would be hoping your child would be dating someone. And it sounds like, Stacy, you weren't at the maturity level at that time.

Yeah, I think we're at two different points. And Ben knew that we each needed just time apart from each other to grow. So walk us through, you know, a couple years later, you decide to get married. Was that a quick decision now that you're back together? Was it six weeks? Was it a year? It was totally the Lord that brought us back our senior year of college. And so we started at that point writing snail mail, writing letters back and forth to each other. We got engaged that summer after graduation and married five months after that.

So I do feel like the Lord confirmed things pretty quickly. And you've been married how many years? Twenty-three. With four kids.

Yes. So let me ask you two, there aren't many books out on this topic of being a mother-in-law or having a mother-in-law. You're both writing it from your perspectives. Why do you think there aren't very many books?

Because I was searching for them frantically when our boys were getting married. Why do you think there aren't many books, Barb? Well, you referenced at the beginning, Anne, that this is just a hot topic. And so how do you even begin to approach it? We can interview all sorts of women and they'll all give us different stories.

But what is the solution to each one other than just advice that we can give? So, you know, I think what is unique about us is that, you know, it's a daughter-in-law and mother-in-law writing. Before writing this book, we could find books that were written by mothers-in-law.

Yeah. But I don't recall any books written by daughters-in-law. But yeah, mothers-in-law often find themselves in this, I can give the advice type of role.

And so perhaps that's why there are some of those. I mean, as you guys walked into this, was there, I mean, Anne mentioned at the beginning, tension. Every once in a while, I would go to that wives' Bible study with the lions. When Anne would be out of town, they'd say, Dave, will you come teach us?

So I'm the only guy in this room. And I can remember when the topic of mother-in-law was even mentioned, it was explosive. There was anger. There was tension.

And, you know, that happens a lot. So did you have any of that in your relationship? Well, in some ways, I think we had kind of a unique experience because when Ben and I got married, Barb and Ron moved to South Africa within like weeks after the wedding. And so the first seven years of our marriage, they were in Cape Town, South Africa, and we were starting our life together in Minnesota and then Kentucky and then Pittsburgh. Your husband's a pastor.

My husband's a pastor, yes. We were going through a lot of major life transitions. And this was the time before Zoom calls, before text messages. And so in a lot of ways, we were pretty disconnected. And I do look back and regret that I hadn't been more intentional to try to build a relationship with Barb.

I really was a new believer, and I think I naively thought, we're all Christians. It's going to be smooth sailing. Like, everything is going to be just fine. Everything will work out perfectly because we all love Jesus. And you've known Barb.

You've known your mother-in-law since high school. Yes, right. And I loved her and loved Ron, and we were happy for them to go to South Africa.

That was great. But it was kind of a disconnect of like, OK, well, then we'll start building our family traditions and doing our own thing. But then they would come back every couple of years for like a little chunk of time in the summer.

And sometimes stay with us. And I do remember that being stressful because, well, we hadn't seen each other for a long time. And then I kind of wanted to give the impression of like, I've got this Christian wife thing down. You know, and when we had kids, I wanted Barb to be impressed that I was a great mom and that I knew what I was doing. And so I remember feeling a little bit of pressure. Yeah, I was excited to see them, but also felt the pressure to have it all together and to not look like I need help, even though I really did need help.

But there is an aspect that separation, even geographically, was a good thing. I remember when we our first job was University of Nebraska as the chaplain of the sports teams there and her mom and dad drove us out there. And I didn't really have a dad.

So this is awesome. And I'll never forget standing on our little duplex step. I mean, literally four people couldn't stand on that step. It was like two people barely and 150 a month. How about that?

For a one bedroom little lot. But when they got in their car to drive back to Ohio, we wept. Yeah. And I remember thinking, we can't do this. We can't do this without them. They were so supportive in our first few months. In fact, first got married. We lived with them for about six or seven months as we raised financial support to become missionaries. And when they drove away, I thought in some sense, worst day of my life, how are we going to do this?

I look back and think, awesome. It forced us to leave and cleave. Now, a few years later, I felt like she didn't leave. But those first couple of years, they were 15 hours away. We didn't drive home for Christmas.

We only went home a little bit in the summer. And it forced us to figure out our life. So in some ways that was good, right?

Yeah, definitely. And I do think Ben and I reaped the benefits of that. I do think the Lord has given us a strong and sweet marriage. And I think part of that is we've never lived close to any of our family, really my family or his family.

So that has caused us to rely on each other and the Lord. But with the in-law relationship, I think it did. Things weren't as smooth sailing as I imagined they would be. I mean, what would you say, Barb, to the mother-in-law?

And Stacey, get ready. Because I want to know what you would say to the daughter-in-law, and then it'd be fun to flip it. But, you know, as you think you're a mother-in-law, what's the first thing that comes to your mind if you had a chance to speak to some mothers-in-laws who aren't mothers-in-laws yet?

They're on their journey. Say, hey, give us some wisdom. What would you say? Well, I think I'd start by saying, you know, you're a daughter of the Father who has designed the family relationship. You know your identity as God's child. But you have various roles throughout your life.

And they're all good. They're all assignments from God. But when you become a mother-in-law, you have a different role. And that's to support this wonderful new marriage that's starting.

Your main goal at that stage of life is the success of this marriage. You're going to support that in various ways. But one of the main ways is that you're the cheering team. If you think of the whole relationship as like running a marathon, let's say, you're not in the race. So people in the race are competing against each other.

They're comparing themselves to the others. You're not in the race and you're not a coach. You're not dictating what's supposed to happen next. You're the cheering team. You're saying, you can do this.

How can I help you? You're the hand in water. You're giving the towel. You're not saying, you're doing it wrong.

I love this illustration. You're just in the stands cheering. In the stands cheering.

It's so hard to only cheer. Because you think you're still a coach. You think they're their coach.

You think you're a coach and you think cheering them on is a loss. You're thinking of the change as a loss. And change is loss, but it's also growth and it's an opportunity to grow and support this new family that's starting. Because it's not like they're just going to be independent and go off forever together. Eventually, when they know and love each other, are confident in those seven years is sometimes what it takes. Your family unit is going to grow and it's going to become stronger. Do you agree with the statement, as a cheerleader in some ways, as a parent, stay out of giving advice unless they ask?

True or not true? Don't give advice unless they ask for it. I'm looking over at Stacy too to see what she thinks. Well, it's a good motto. It's very hard to do and we find ways to get around that. Let me tell you what I've done so that you don't fail like I've failed.

We can still think of ways to save things. Stacy, do you feel the same way when you hear that? You're like, yeah, I agree.

I'm the daughter-in-law. That's a good motto. Or no? Yeah, I think it is.

I do. I think that's a way to respect the new family. That's a way to respect that they might not choose to do things the same and to try not to take offense at that, but just realize it's their time. They're starting new traditions and maybe have a different way of raising the kids or educating the kids or whatever it is. And I think for especially a single mom who raised their kids by herself, and I know that if the women I was dealing with, their kids are now very successful.

Their sons are playing in the NFL. And so the mom has gotten this son there by her sacrifice. And now this new woman comes onto the scene where this mom has been giving everything.

So finally they're in a place where she can be celebrated. And the son's feeling like my mom paid the price for me and now I am going to give back to her. And now this new wife's like, wait, what about me? What about our kids? What about our family? Do you see how that it's really tricky? What would you say to that? Like as the daughter-in-law, Stacey, how would you manage that?

Yeah, it is tricky. And I mean, I think as the daughter-in-law, still looking for ways to honor the mother-in-law and to not just push her off to the side and be like, your time is done. But looking for ways to invest in her, just to even get to know her as a person, to find out what she likes and join her in an activity that she likes or spend time with her.

Try to, you know, talk with her whether that's, and of course it's different whether you live close or far away, but find times to talk with her on the phone or send a text that you're thinking about her. I think just showing ways that she's not forgotten. Oh, that's so good. That you can still honor her even if a new family's been formed.

Yeah. I know that when I started this ministry with the Detroit Lions Wives, I was super young. I was 25 years old. So when I ended my ministry, you know, I'd been doing it 35 years. So when I started, I was the age of the players' wives and I was like, my mother-in-law's crazy too.

That would be my mom if you were connecting the dots. But by the time I was done, now I'm relating to all the mother-in-laws and the difficulty that's in that role. I said to the wives, your mother-in-law, we feel insecure and we want you to like us. We want you to love us.

And we're not sure how to go about that sometimes. And when I say to them, really, there's a deep insecurity of will I be forgotten? Will I be noticed? Will my daughter-in-law even like me? Will my son still even talk to me? That deep insecurity is in there and I think it's good as a younger woman to know like, oh, she just needs to be noticed and seen.

It's exactly what you were saying. So now looking back, Barb, you have three kids, three grown kids. Stacey, you have four children. Your oldest is 20. So looking back, what are some tips that you would give to a daughter-in-law walking into a family? And like you've had a 20-year-old daughter, so that could be her in a few years. I know, and it does. I'm starting to think a little bit differently because I realize like, wow, I could be the mother-in-law in the near future. Like it's not really that far away. I think I would say, one, the relationship is worth investing in.

What's that mean? Get to know your mother-in-law. Spend time with her, talk with her, find out what she likes to do and try to join in when you can. I also think believe the best about her words and actions because I think a lot of times as daughter-in-laws in our own insecurity, we can feel like we're being judged or feel like she's disapproving when she hasn't necessarily said that. You know, like I think about those early years when Barb and Ron came back and were staying with us in Kentucky, and we had like one baby or two babies and Barb like sweeping my kitchen floor. You know, she's trying to help. But I remember thinking, oh, she must think I'm not good at housekeeping. I didn't clean my floor well enough. She had to pick up the broom and start sweeping. If I believe the best, she was just trying to help a tired, busy mom, right? And now I'm at a place where I'm like, please sweep my kitchen floor.

I'm so thankful for any help. But back in those early years, it was easy to take offense at things, easy to read into comments about, you know, maybe educating our kids and what we were doing that I felt like she was judging me when she was just sharing her own experience. So I think trying your best, asking the Lord to help you believe the best about her words and intentions. I remember sending our daughter-in-law and son, they were in college, they got married. He was going to Moody, so it was a senior year they were married. Periodically, I would just send them gift cards and I'd say, hey, guys, I know it can't be easy trying to do school, trying to work part time.

Here's a gift card for date night. And I thought, I'm amazing. Like, look what a great mother-in-law I am. Well, later our son came to me and said, hey, you need to not do that anymore. And I was like, what do you mean?

And he said, it just feels like you don't think we can do it on our own. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. Like if I would have gotten a gift card at that age, I would have loved it.

Assuming they would love it, too. But I was so offended, like, this is ridiculous. I am out of the goodness of my heart. I just feel like, oh, and put your pride away.

Remember, it's different for everybody. And so to ask, hey, I'm thinking about sending a gift card, would that be something helpful or good for you guys? And not even ask my son. Ask the daughter. Because my son would have said, yes, send it. But I don't know. And I would have said, no, don't send it.

Why are we sending them gift cards? And maybe that has to do with expectations. Let's talk about that a little bit. What did that look like for you, Stacey, of the expectations? Well, I mean, again, I go back to the beginning and thinking I kind of had a Pollyanna view, I think, as a new believer of, like, everything's going to be awesome. And actually, our first bump in the road was when we finally decided we wanted to be married, we wanted to be married soon. And so we wanted a short engagement, like five months. But I was supposed to student teach in Michigan for a full year. And he was supposed to go up to Minneapolis for a church internship for a year.

So we just couldn't fathom spending another year apart from each other. So, you know, I'm pursuing, like, okay, what do I need to do to student teach up in Minnesota? Well, my school, university, decides they can't let me do that.

That's setting a precedent. So they said, you either have to stay in Michigan to student teach for the whole year or give up your scholarship that I'd gotten. And it was really tough. And I remember Ben and I talking to Barb and Ron about it. And Ben and I were just kind of like, we're going to make a way. You know, we're going to jump through the hoops and figure out a way to get married in five months and make this work. And I remember Barb saying in this really sweet voice, Of course.

Of course it was sweet. If God provided Stacey a scholarship in Michigan and provided this church internship for Ben in Minneapolis, maybe you're supposed to wait one more year. That's a very reasonable suggestion. Now, as a mom of a 20-year-old, you're probably thinking, yeah, I could see that. I'm like, yeah, just wait. But in my mind, as a 22-year-old, I was like, oh, no, she's changing the plan.

And I remember just like my blood pressure rising, like, what's Ben going to do? Is he going to side with his mom? Or is he going to go back to our plan of like, no, we're going to make this work.

We're going to get married in five months. And so I remember there being tension and anxiety of really wondering even which way my husband was going to lean. Sort of that leave and cleave.

Yes. What happened? So thankfully, he was also on board with like, we need to get married as soon as possible. I like how you said thankfully. And Barb was super gracious, and they didn't. Barb and Ron didn't fight us on that. And we did. We did have to jump through 100 hoops to make that happen.

And I had to student teach up in Minnesota and take a few extra classes for a teaching license up there. But I just remember that was a pivotal moment because I naively thought we're all going to think the same about this. And that was the first realization. Well, what would you have done if Barb wasn't so gracious and Ron? I mean, what if they said, no, we're going to push this a little harder because a lot of mother-in-laws and fighting laws do. They would say, we're not going to put any money into a wedding or anything.

What do you do then? Because now you've got a conflict. That would be really, really hard and most likely I would not have handled it well.

I'm sure I would have been very upset. And now you've walked through, you know, how many decades you've been married? Twenty? Twenty-three years. Twenty-three years. So here you are 23 years later. What's the relationship like now?

How's it matured? I know you talked about some health issues. How has that brought you two together? Yeah, Barb is definitely a friend. She's not just my mother-in-law.

She's a friend. And I think suffering brings people together in so many ways. And even before Barb's cancer diagnosis, I mean, I think back to 2020 when our church was going through just a really difficult time. And Barb and I were writing this book. And Barb was someone that I called to just unload my heart of just the troubles we were facing. Because in ministry you can't necessarily do that with people in your church, even good friends. So she was really a support and a prayer warrior for me that I could share these things and know that she was faithfully praying.

To face a life-threatening situation every day becomes this tremendous gift. It's like every minute together is golden. And Stacy in particular, I really felt seized that moment because she was the woman in charge in my house. And she came in with grace and confidence and loving kindness, prepared all the meals, got everybody ready to go on the daily excursions that they had planned.

And then if that wasn't enough, she thought, okay, we have this chance to celebrate your 50th anniversary. And she said, we're going to have a dinner. And she started to set the table and she said, Barb, where's the good China? I said, oh, Stacy, because I can't get out of a chair.

That's where I am at this point. I said, Stacy, let's just skip the good China because we can't put that in the dishwasher. She said, Barb, that's why we have good China. We have it for good occasions.

We have it for memorable times. She wasn't afraid of the extra work. That didn't mean anything to her. She was honoring me in the most beautiful and humble and gracious way. Reminds me of Ruth and Naomi. Just that beautiful relationship of Ruth really honoring Naomi. Being with her, seeing her, being by her side when she was grieving and they were both grieving.

It's beautiful. And I think, too, if I have a regret, I have several regrets in my life, but one of them is that I didn't love Dave's mom the way I could have. She had a hard life and her husband left her. She lost a child. She had a drinking problem as a result. And I think instead of loving her well, I judged her and she went through some health issues. And I wish that I would have done what you had done, Stacy, of just being with her, seeing her, talking to her, loving her. But out of my own insecurity, I don't think I did. And I wasn't as mature spiritually at that time. And time is short.

It is short. And we can either love the people around us and especially our mother-in-laws and our daughter-in-laws. We can see the good in them or we can judge them and pull away. And there's always blessing from God. I believe that He's cheering us on as we love one another and see one another and cherish one another.

Amen. You know, there could be such great blessings in embracing the in-law relationships we're in. The stigma about in-laws is so thick within our culture, even within Christian culture. But why don't we love our in-laws the way Christ has called us to and then see the kind of transformation that can happen only through Jesus. Only He can do those kind of things.

And it's incredible to see when He does. I'm Shelby Abbott and you've been listening to David Ann Wilson with Barbara and Stacy Riak on Family Life Today. Barbara and Stacy have written a book called Making Room for Her. It'll give you biblical wisdom for a healthier relationship with your mother-in-law or daughter-in-law.

You can pick up a copy at familylifetoday.com or give us a call at 800-358-6329. You know, you could be the person God's put in your specific community to pull people closer to each other and to God. Maybe a small group is just what your community needs to connect with God and with each other while you press into your own faith at the same time. Well, good news because we're offering an unmissable 25% off all small group materials for a limited time.

Some of them are just perfect for those who haven't yet met God. You could preview all of our family life studies in today's show notes and check out what we've got lined up for small groups with 25% off through tomorrow. And you can always find out what's going on with us at familylifetoday.com or you can give us a call at 800-F as in Family, L as in Life, and then the word Today. Tomorrow David and Wilson are going to be with David Thomas talking about raising emotionally strong boys and the common mistakes that parents often make in doing so. That's tomorrow. We hope you'll join us. On behalf of David and Wilson, I'm Shelby Abbott. We'll see you back next time for another edition of Family Life Today. Family Life Today is a donor-supported production of Family Life, a crew ministry helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.