We didn't move here to be church planters. We moved here as missionaries.
And it's just a different mindset. Actually, this isn't our home. None of this is ours. We're just missionaries scattered. First Peter elect exiles.
We've been exiled, chosen by God to be right where we are. So everything we do is like, let's just be missionaries. Welcome to Family Life Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Shelby Abbott and your hosts are Dave and Ann Wilson.
You can find us at familylifetoday.com. This is Family Life Today. All right, so we got a couple of passionate people in the studio today. I wish they'd be more passionate. It's like they don't have any passion. We'll have to stir it up again. We've got so much passion that we overwhelm them. I felt like yesterday this wave was coming at us from Recav and Brittany Gray. They're back.
No, seriously, I've been told that many times. Man, when you preach, it's like, I didn't feel that yesterday. I felt like it was coming at us, which I love. I mean, somebody is passionate about Jesus and theology and his word yesterday talking about unity and diversity.
That's a magnet. And people are drawn to it. I'm guessing people, I hope, if they didn't listen yesterday, listen again and talk about it at dinner table with your family. So we want to say welcome back. Well, let's first say Recav is a pastor of preaching and spiritual formation at New Creation Fellowship.
You guys have been married 15 years and you have four kids. Okay, yesterday was sort of a foundational theology of diversity. And again, if you missed it, go back because I don't want to rehash everything. But man, if you understand who God is, then you understand what he wants us as his community to be. It's unity, even though we're different. But you have a passion for hospitality, which to me is part of it. Yeah, that's what I want to know. What's that look like? Yes, on the practical end of things, and you can speak more to this even as a mom and as a wife, our house has had to become that.
All the way back to Philly, A6-2, North Mall Street. So you can say we're all about diversity. We're all about community.
But you're saying, what does it look like in everyday life? So Brittany, this must be important to you as well. Yeah. Well, how could it not be living with this guy? Exactly.
I mean, was there something going on at whatever address there was in Philly? That's our house. I know.
That's where our marriage started when we had, what was it, 900 square foot townhouse. Not even. Not even. Less than. It was like eight. That's bigger than the one we started in.
In Lincoln, Nebraska. But did you open those doors? We did. We did. Specifically to our neighbors. I mean, we weren't even trying to invite church friends or anything. This was just our neighbors. Yeah, our neighbors.
And it was a joy. It was challenging because even, I mean, culturally, that's interesting to say. So culturally, our neighborhood was, everyone looked like this.
Everyone was black. But culturally, we all came from different backgrounds. Everyone grew up in different settings and had different expectations and different ideas of what it meant to visit someone's home. So even that, within our own community, we had to have an idea of, okay, how do we be hospitable within our people group, ironically.
What did that look like? Did you just go out into the neighborhood and say, hey, you want to come over for dinner? I was going to say, that's probably your approach more than anything.
You'll walk up to anyone and talk to them. I feel like a lot of it at that time was, it started with kids. It's the easiest avenue even, right? It is. And I think even an evangelist, we just got to not use our people. Take advantage of that time of your life. Absolutely.
Because there's so like this army, even with a wicked heart, you're going to be a lot less harsh with children. And so I think that was a big deal. Bragging on my wife, so I set up like an actual, it wasn't a 10 foot basketball court, but it was metal backboard. And this is like a 800 square foot spot. So we didn't have a lot of space in our crib at all. But she let us put an actual basketball court in the crib.
In our living room. We did this too. First year man, first thing we did. Her dad and I put it up the first day. Let's go. We had a loft, so I had a high ceiling.
That's awesome man. A little plastic glass. You got to get your priorities right. But that hoop brought the neighborhood. It did.
All the athletes in college. So yeah, a lot of kids just came through the crib. And again, this ain't nothing to write home about, but it was like, you know, say a little Walmart plastic job, but with the metal rim, like a real job. And yet it would just come through. And so it would be just loud and crazy and not clean. But orderly though. And so I think back to the hospitality God showed humanity in Genesis one of it was a lot. Trees everywhere. Think about a forest like a garden. It's a lot if you just walk into a garden, but it's still orderly though. It's a lot happening, but still orderly though. That's what it felt like in our crib where they were they a lot of kids had a lot more order there than they were used to. But there was still a lot going on. And somebody had to order the chaos. And when you have the beauty of just a lot plus order, there's something inherently hospitable about that.
That's just very inviting because on the allotness, nobody's walking on eggshells because you feel like everything got to be perfectly clean and put in this spot and all that. No, it don't. It don't got to be like that. But at the same time, here's what we're not going to do. This is the language going to use. We're not going to use this language. Here's when we're going to play. After this, we're going to pray like it was just so many things laid out that makes you feel like, man, this is a place of comfort and security and security that have none of that. Yes.
Yes. I'm telling you, this is my passion, too. For Dave and I, when we moved into one of our first homes, we had rented that apartment before with the plexiglass. But you know that joy and sports and fun is a magnet. And so we decided one of our values, too, was that our house would be the magnet and the light of the world, as scripture says, on our street.
What's a magnet? Joy, fun. It doesn't matter who you are, where you come from.
People want to laugh and they want to be able to be themselves. And so we decided, let's create a place where all the kids in the neighborhood want to come. And we had no money for starting a church.
We're poor. But we saved coins to buy our first trampoline. Remember that? And then some guy ripped down his deck and Dave used the wood to build this amazing treehouse. Which the bad thing is the treehouse was pretty close to the trampoline. So one day we came home and our sons were standing on the, not the deck of the treehouse, the roof of the treehouse, ready to launch onto the tramp probably 20 feet below. Anyway, that treehouse and that trampoline brought the neighborhood. And there were all kinds of kids and sometimes they bugged the heck out of you. Did you go home now? You know, but it's hospitality's messy. Yes, yes, yes it is.
And I think one of the things that even this conversation is dope. You had a treehouse, trampoline. We had a little 800 square foot house. It doesn't matter what you got. All that matters is you just using what you have. And it really is that simple. And kids don't care.
No. They don't care. How many times you bought your kids a toy and they end up playing with the box that the toy came in. They really don't care. It's really more about what they feel like when they're in that home. These people hear me, they listen to me, they see me. I remember these kids, like 10 year old boys are pouring out all their life to me. Like nobody sees me in my family. My dad's never home or my mom's me. Things that they're caring.
And I remember so often, you've probably done this too, Brittany. I put my hand on that little boy or girl and just pray over them like Jesus loves you. We're here. Jesus is always with you. You talk about the gospel and hospitality. They just go together hand in hand.
And obviously now I feel like she's more elite in that. Far more here than even in Philly with our neighbors here and just there to serve. How many times a week are the neighbors over our group? You're laughing because this number's pretty high? Yeah. Yes. For food? Or just to come over? Food. Just to check and see, hey, can someone come out to play?
No, just like two hours ago. Dan is like, we're going poor. We have to stop feeding these people. Basically, I've been trying to designate like, this is the box just for the neighbors. No one else can eat it. Just let the neighbors have this one. We don't give it to them all at once because, you know, their mom said that they eat snacks too quickly. So whenever they come, they get a little, a few bars every time. Yeah.
So what's your vision behind that? I mean, obviously you started right when you got married in Philly. Now you're in Florida. You're still doing it. There's a, there's a passion and a vision underneath that.
What is it? I think the simplest way to put it is we came here even to plant a church. We just kept saying we didn't move here to be church planters. We moved here as missionaries.
Oh, yeah. And when you start to think like missionaries, cause we've both been on missions and it's just a different mindset. You know your time and yours, you know what you do.
You're there for the business of the work. So I think us just coming in as like missionaries, it just, it's almost like if, if we can envision being a 20, 30 year missionary in our place where we live, um, that, that, that's where our kids will rehearse. Like that's what we've rehearsed. So everything we do is like, let's just be missionaries. So even when it gets annoying as a missionary, you're not even thinking like that, but it's only when it's like your home.
Do you start to get super annoyed by ministry? And if you, if we just stop thinking like that and like, actually this isn't our home, none of this is ours. We're just missionaries scattered. Uh, first Peter elect exiles. We've been exiled chosen by God to be right where we are. Uh, I feel like that has been like the, the major, major, major thing.
And then to be honest, and I'll just, again, I'll just keep bragging on Brit cause she'll never say this. It does take a non anxious wife and there's a lot of reasons to be anxious. We shared before with you guys, our kids have sickle cell disease. Uh, so everybody who comes in the house, if they're carrying something on them, if they're sick, you know, that's hard.
Just because, I mean, I'm around my grandkids in the winter, like that has a big effect on them. Possibly. So you're having to, is that something you just have to surrender? Um, yes. In, in a way, absolutely.
Yeah. But I'm, I'm still very honest with the kids. Sometimes I, I have to tell the kids, Hey, we, we can't, we can't hang out with you guys right now.
Cause Green's not running down your face. And they get, you know, they get sad, but they understand. And, uh, we'll talk through the fence. Yeah, honey, I see you baby.
I want you as my neighbor. I just want to say this. Here's what I thought. It isn't just kids.
I think recap says something that made me think, Oh yeah, this just happens. Sometimes I've found and isn't as much as me. I think when the kids are, the neighbors are coming over and it couldn't even be parents. There's part of me that's possessive about the house, the dry wall, the paint, uh, the trim, the carpet, the TV, my guitars. I mean, I sound so like a, like a possessive idiot, but materialistic materialistic. It's like, you know, you can't touch that. And I don't want them to break things. And that can be a discouragement to hospitality as much as, Hey, I'll go to their house. I don't want them all in my house because I like nice things. You're scratching my granite countertop. That's a good thing you married me. And let me tell you, I keep our house clean, but I'm telling you, we go into our basement.
I mean, there's a huge hole in the drywall. These guys are having a blast. Do you remember when they had the, um, airsoft guns?
Yeah. Just these little pellets and our boys put on these glasses and they go in the basement and, but then all the kids are in the basement. We had so many little pellet bullet like holes. And right now we're going to get emails from listeners like, the little kids shooting each other in the airsoft gun?
Hell yeah, we sort of did. That's what you were supposed to do with them. I know, but maybe it's dangerous. But anyway, have you ever experienced that? Cause it's like, I want to be hospitable.
I want to love my neighbor, but sometimes it's inconvenient. And I get to, I think they're going to put a stain on my new couch. Literally we have, you use the word surrender. I feel like that's just been day one that like every house we've had, we've just had to surrender because real rap though, it's happened so early in every house that it's just like, you know, like your first day in your car, first time scuffing up your sneaks. It's like, once it happens, it's almost like, aight, I'm cool now.
But until it happens, you're very, very, very, very, but once it happens, it's like, yeah, this is over. So I feel like every house, like we was in Philly, happened very quickly. We probably did it ourselves the first time. Even when we was married, we taped up a little... We taped up the little small nerf that's supposed to go over the door.
We didn't have any over the door, so we just duct taped it to the wall. Didn't realize... So that was over at that point. It was like, that is what it is. And I felt like our second house, our kids were at such an age where they were going to mess something up.
So it was like, and then now we got a three and a four year old. So when you got that, I mean, they've already written on my office already. But when you got that, it's almost like, there is something about the relief that it brings when it finally gets messed up.
That you're like, you're not as anxious anymore. And you know, it's a reminder, this is all Dolores anyway, and he just wants to use it. But I will say this, especially with our particular needs, like anybody listening, it ain't sweet though, especially for a mom and a wife. It ain't like this is easy to have your home open all the time.
How many kids have come over our crib, but also dudes who are always in the house, who I'm discipling. And this is going all the way back to Philly. Another dude she has to feed. That's money.
Another head to feed. And then it's also messes up the comfort of it's just us. There's all of those things that I feel like, particularly Brittany Carey's in a unique way. That all I can do is shout out to moms by celebrating my own wife that like, we would not be a hospitable home if it wasn't for her, her serenity. It's almost like the serenity came through surrender that a long time ago, she just resolved this ain't hers. And so God has just been faithful to use it. And I've seen so many people blessed by that. So thank you on air for being you and just not making it a stressful environment for people.
It's like a massive, massive blessing. Thank you. I mean, that's a that's a perspective and hospitality, eternal perspective.
Big picture. I remember I had I don't know if you know the name Patrick Morley wrote a book called Man in the Mirror. Eighties, 1980s. I'll never forget. They weren't born yet. Yeah, you guys were born. I know Michael Jackson's Man in the Mirror.
Still a men's ministry called Man in the Mirror. But I had him do chapel for us Detroit Lions when we came down to Tampa to play the Bucks because that's where he lived. And I'll never forget him sharing a story. He made a lot of money in business.
I can't remember exactly how, but millions. And they had a really nice house. And he tells this story about their little boy or girl, like three or four years old, scratching the coffee table, an expensive coffee table, and him sort of losing it. And his wife said, I am not going to allow us to to yell at a billion dollar kid over a five hundred dollar coffee table.
I'll never forget that story. It's like, get this in perspective. That kid right there is worth.
There's no number. It's our child. And that coffee table can be replaced, even though it's a really nice one.
And he just put a scratch on it. We are not going to protect this house like it's, you know, a tabernacle. We're going to let our kids be kids. And it's not that we don't try to take care of our stuff, but when it becomes an idol, that's when it's a different story.
Well, we're just discussion we're just having. I was thinking your neighbor's kids are that valuable. The whole idea of hospitality isn't because we want to be nice to our neighbors. It's like we have a dream that they would know our Jesus. And that's why we're having them in our house. And that's why we're allowing craziness to happen. Our vision's bigger. It's like God has planted us somewhere.
At Family Life we call it, make an impact on your corner of the world. Well, that's your corner. Your corner's right here. We've got a corner. It's like I can value a house that's going to be in a garbage dump someday.
Or I can value people and say, okay, he's put us here as a light. Everybody around us is sort of in darkness. And our house is a tool.
Let's create it like that. And I think too, I mean, I find this for Dave and I at this stage because kids, it was easy to open the door. Kids in there constantly, but now we're older. And so I find even here in Florida, people kind of stay to themselves. And in Michigan, you have these cold winters. When we're there, people pull into their garages and they shut the garage door.
You never see them until spring. So for us to have that vision, we have to be intentional and to pray. I think one of the greatest gifts you can give your family is to pray as a family for the people you're around, for your neighborhood. That your kids would know like, oh, we're praying for John. He doesn't know Jesus. We're praying that he will. Praying how we can love Ms. Janet because she doesn't have anyone.
How can we love her and be a light? And I remember Cody, our son, we were doing a series at church. What did he call it? He called it Color Your Dishes and actually presented this as a series to our teaching team. We're like, you're calling a series Color Your Dishes?
What is this series about? He goes, he looked at us like we're all just ancient and we are like 30 years older. He goes, discipleship?
Like, what do you mean? He goes, if you disciple somebody, they know the color of your dishes. In other words, they better be in your house to know the color of your dishes. That's what discipleship looks like.
That's a really good series. Let's do it. If you don't know the color of people's dishes, you haven't gotten that intimate. God wants us to get close. It's going to be messy. They're going to bug you and you're going to bug them. Guess what? That's the kingdom.
Let's talk about application. We've been talking about that the whole time. But let's give our listeners a little vision of maybe some things that they could do either as family with kids or family with maybe their kids are older and what that could look like. I'll say the big things both for Britt and myself is exactly what you said.
I never heard the color dishes. But bringing people into what you're already doing is discipleship. And this is so modeled by Jesus. I feel like discipleship gets so complicated because it's like I got to add a new thing to do to my already busy schedule. And when you think about it like that, one, it does feel overwhelming if you're a busy person.
It actually won't even make the impact you wanted to make because they're still not seeing you in your own element. Like so my thing is like, I'm not about to add something else to my schedule. You're going to come to the crib. You're going to see me doing dishes. Sometimes I'm gonna have to leave you at the table because I got to go put the kids to bed or I got to go pray over the kids. And it's just going to be what it is.
Twiddle your thumbs. Maybe read your Bible while that's happening. But even me leaving you is helping you to see something about what it looks like to be a father. That I need to my my kids are my priority right now. You might have to wait for me and Britt to get done with this conversation. That's okay. Even you seeing that you just coming through and you just gonna rock, especially for more discipling singles.
Oh, what a gift to bring them into a family that functions like that. So I say that's one thing. The second thing I will say is that the clock can be the greatest hindrance to deep discipleship. When you're on like a 30 minute, all right, wrap it up. We don't date like that.
So we shouldn't disciple like that. Could you imagine going on a date with somebody and every 15 minutes, it's telling you all the signs of like, you don't want to be here with me. So in the very same way, man, we should just allow for time to just be free. And if you need to just set aside a larger slot, maybe they're not going to be there for the full two hours. But you set aside two hours where they're just going to be there. They might only be there for 30 minutes, 45 minutes, but you're not confined by a 30 minute clock.
The reason why that's important is as a busy dude who travels a lot is because that really makes it intentional for me to make sure I'm not adding things because two hours can feel daunting if I got to entertain for two hours. But if I'm just being a husband and a father, it ain't doing nothing to me. And I get that from what I call a theology of reclining from Jesus. That in John 13, Jesus is reclining. Throughout all the meals in the New Testament, Jesus is reclining. And I'm glad New Testament translators did not translate that as simply sit because it matters that he's reclining. When you're reclining, you ain't going nowhere. It's like reclining on a couch.
You ain't going nowhere. It is the posture of rest. And most of the time, though, we have the exact opposite posture when it comes to these relationships.
Especially Americans in our culture. Yes. Yes. We're rushing. Yes. We're rushing to the next thing. Yeah.
Next appointment. And those things now cloud out the one thing he told us to do, which is make disciples. But when you have a theology of just reclining, relax. We got like a statement, yo, just calm down. But don't say that to your wife.
No, only the dudes. Just calm down. Don't say that to your wife. But just calm down. Let let let it be what it is.
And you'll see just what that does. And I love that our Lord Jesus, who should have been more busy than Christ, the son of God. I think he had a job to do that was kind of important. And yet he had the time to recline. That alone should make us question how busy we really are and how busy we really should be. Nobody had that much of an important job than him.
And he was able to sit and be with people, with strangers, just chilling out. Can you just imagine your Messiah like laying down? I just think about that. I'm like, wow.
And what that must have done for the people around him. You really see me. You want to be with me.
And so if we could just practice the same thing, a theology of reclining. Let's chill out. Let's talk. What's really going on in your life? Oh, yeah. Everything's chill out. What's really going on? Let's talk. Yeah.
You know, kids, man, they got a baseball game. I hear you. Now what's really going on?
And sometimes it takes like six of those questions for us to get underneath, underneath, underneath to the point where they like, all right. Honestly, I've been stressed out because this is the round the season that I lost my mother. And it's it's really scary around this time because I feel lonely again, even sitting here.
I'm anxious because she was the only one I could confide in like this. Now we get in somewhere. It's the theology of reclining and our Lord Jesus practice it beautifully. As recap was talking there just a second ago, I thought about how intentionality is so important as you have conversations with your family, your friends, your neighbors and anyone else in your life, really. Intentionality to keep asking the questions that get to the heart of what people are wrestling with. Go after the roots in your own heart.
Yes. And other people's hearts as well. And you'll start to practice the theology of reclining just the way we heard about. I'm Shelby Abbott and you've been listening to Dave and Ann Wilson with Recap and Brittany Gray on Family Life Today. It's been such a blessing to have them on this program and they're going to be back again tomorrow. I'm really excited about that. And after tomorrow, we get to hear from the Needhams.
Jimmy and Kelly Needham are going to be here. And Kelly has actually written a book called Purpose Fooled. Why chasing your dreams, finding your calling and reaching for greatness, get this, will never be enough. Wow.
Provocative. You know, if you're feeling disillusioned by the pressure to live this extraordinary life that people keep talking about and seeking a deeper sense of purpose in everyday moments, this book is going to be a guide for you and it will also be a balm for you. The insights that Kelly gives in it will really be helpful as we push against what the culture is telling you to do all the time.
Again, the book is called Purpose Fooled by Kelly Needham. And we believe in it so much that this book is going to be our gift to you when you give to the Ministry of Family Life. You can get your copy right now with any donation that you make. Just go online to familylifetoday.com and click on the donate now button at the top of the page to give your gift. Or you can give us a call with your donation at 800-358-6329. Again, that number is 800-F as in family, L as in life, and then the word today. Or feel free to drop us a donation in the mail if you'd like.
Our address is Family Life 100 Lakehart Drive, Orlando, Florida 32832. Now, coming up tomorrow, what's it look like to explore faith, marriage, and parenting through the element of crisis? Many of us go through crises that we experience all day, every day.
What's it like to explore marriage and parenting through that? Well, Rekab and Brittany Gray are going to be back as they navigate their daughter's illness through courage and prayer. That's coming up tomorrow. We hope you'll join us. On behalf of David and Wilson, I'm Shelby Abbott. We'll see you back next time for another edition of Family Life Today. Family Life Today is a donor-supported production of Family Life, a crew ministry helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.
